D3 or Jap 4x4

[theh33d]

Hello Folks

First off excellent forum with some fantastic posts/information

I will start off with a bit of back ground on my story and why I am here rambling on, I will try to keep this post as short as possible.
Im Scottish and lucky enough to now live in Australia (5 years) used to own a Mitsubishi Pajero (short wheel base) grey import. Loved the car and only sold to lack of space (baby + big dog)
I am now looking at owning a proper 4x4 as our Nissan x-trail does the wife proud but we need more space and ability as we are now camping again even though the wife swore she wouldn't as every creature in Australia just wants to poison you (her words) also we have talked about doing the big lap of Australia at some point.
So..... I had looked at the usual suspect Patrol, Prado & Pajero and we had decided on a Patrol due to budget (25k) and ability but during my daily commute on the train and searching through the small ads decided to look at the D3 and realised pretty quickly that there is some amount of vechicle for your buck against the Jap 4x4.
Now I have a love for land rovers as I have fond memories of my uncles Defender 110 on the farm as a young boy and since then I have admired land rovers from afar.
Sorry rambling on.

I will be viewing two D3 SE this weekend TDV6 and 4.0V6.
The TDV6 has covered 217,000k with full service history and a negotianal price of $19,000.
The V6 has covered 97,000k with full service history + an extended warranty? $22,000
Now my head says the V6 petrol is a no brainer with the lower kilometres covered and the type of use the D3 will see daily drive to the train station and weekend trips to my sons sports events with the as mentioned weekends and holidays away in Western Australia camping.
As I will hold onto the next 4x4 I purchase for many years to come I look at the TDV6 and think that the big ticket items have been addressed, bushes, compressor & gearbox service whereas the V6 petrol will have this to come. well so I'm lead to believe if you trust the fine people on the Google searches.
Fuel economy is not a major concern as I do not expect to be driving many kilometres in a year as the wife does this in her x-trail.

So after much rambling I am looking for some pointers
Do I follow my heart and own a D3 and the expected running costs or go with the Jap option.
I know it's a stupid question to ask on a Land Rover forum but where else will I get genuine owner experience of a D3 against the Google searches.

Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to respond.

[Disco-tastic]

Gday and welcome to the forum.

I have a petrol V6 and, though the bowser hurts my hip pocket sometimes, the actual running costs are pretty reasonable. You also don't have to worry about cracked oil pump casings, turbos and actuators, gunky EGR valves (it has one but it doesnt gunk up with soot), cracked manifolds, expensive injectors and high pressure fuels system etc. The petrols also don't mind the shorter school runs on a regular basis.

There are a couple here who have owned both so hopefully they will drop by and share their experience.

There are a number of threads on here about the same sort of dilemma - you can use the search function in the bottom left of the page or just type "aulro" before your query into google and it should work.

If i get a chance I'll find a thread i started for you to read though :)

[AK83]

I would!(follow heart and go with D3).

I think Patrols have to be one of the worst vehicles in therms of refinement and smoothness.
Brother had one(4.8 Ti), sold if after many overheating issues, and the inability to deal with the death wobbles successfully.
But, what he likes more about the D2(TD5) compared to the Patrol is how much smoother/more refined it is.

Same here.
Even my D2 300 Tdi feels nicer to drive than his Patrol did once up at freeway speeds. 300 Tdi is very rough down low and around city street speeds tho.

His Patrol was one of those Ti models with all the gizmos, like aircon in the rear, and electrically operated cigarette lighters and other trivial useless stuff.
All those faux luxury goodies couldn't hide the fact that it's based on a pretty crappy platform to begin with.

When set up with decent suspension they're very capable off road too, no question about that.
Funnily, my (personal) mechanic is a Patrol devotee and is always trying to convince me of getting a Patrol "coz their bullet proof reliability", but last time I visited he had his Ti apart doing head gasket too.

From what I've been told, 3.0 turbo diesel Patrol motor aren't considered bulletproof.

[p38arover]

Welcome aboard.


we are now camping again even though the wife swore she wouldn't as every creature in Australia just wants to poison you (her words)

Not true!

Some want to eat you!

[rangieman]

All i will say is stay away from the 3.0 ltr Diesel Pootrol .
A good mate of mine has had one that has done 270.000 k and is now on to his 3rd motor :bat:
So if you want one i know where there is a cheap well cared for 3.0 ltr pootrol with a good motor for now[bigrolf]
All seriousness the D3 is offering fantastic value for money , I hear the V8 is the pick out of the petrol`s and obviously the diesel is the pick of all but if serviced correctly will last for longer than you think .
Id go drive both and come back here with your idea,s before you make the leap into the unknown[wink11]

[theh33d]

Thanks folks

I had a chat with a mechanic at work the other day who loves the Patrol and mentioned that I was looking at a D3. He was amazed at what you can get for your dollar.
He then advised me that he loves Patrols but stated that the 3.0 TD was a throw away motor after 250,000k and should look for a decent 4.2TD as they will go for ever. The chance of finding a decent one is highly unlikely.
I will test drive both D3 this weekend and take it from there.
The more I look into the D3 the more it seems to be the way forward on my budget.

[Disco-tastic]

... I hear the V8 is the pick out of the petrol`s ...

It is the better petrol motor though has a timing belt instead of a chain in the V6, as well as a plastic thermostat housing which is prone to cracking. But it has more power and torque and a better sound.

Another thing to consider is that the 2005 to somewhere in the 2007 (i think) range had the original canbus system, which meant that if a brake globe blew the fault could cascade through the system causing a bunch of other errors. A new canbus system was installed somewhere in 2007 (i think) which solved this problem, and also added a couple of other little niceties (like auto windows for the passenger). Unfortunately i dont think the V8 was offered when the new canbus system came along.

[DiscoJeffster]

stated that the 3.0 TD was a throw away motor after 250,000k.

Shucks. I guess with my D4 at 240,000km I'd best throw it away now. Shame as it's been a great car and seems to run perfectly? I'm so confused. Thank god for such qualified mechanics, I was about to service it again but now I'll save my money.

[weeds]

Shucks. I guess with my D4 at 240,000km I'd best throw it away now. Shame as it's been a great car and seems to run perfectly? I'm so confused. Thank god for such qualified mechanics, I was about to service it again but now I'll save my money.

I think the OP was referring to the patrol not the disco

[DiscoJeffster]

I think the OP was referring to the patrol not the disco

Ah yes, rereading you're right. I always thought Patrols were throw away from the day they left the lot, lol.
On another note, I wonder what the highest km TDV6 is running around?

[cripesamighty]

At least 500,000kms from I have seen for sale on gumtree...

[loanrangie]

At least 500,000kms from I have seen for sale on gumtree...
Yeah I saw that one. 8k with a rebuilt trans but 500k on the clock.

[cripesamighty]

It does make you wonder about car values though. I have a D1 with half those Km's that I could probably sell for a similar amount, given the condition it is in. I wonder what would constitute the better deal in the long run, capabilities vs $$ repair/maintaining-wise? If anything happens to my current ride I will have to make that decision. Personally, I am leaning towards a well looked after D3/4 or an early L322 diesel. Cannot see myself buying an Asian brand!

[loanrangie]

It does make you wonder about car values though. I have a D1 with half those Km's that I could probably sell for a similar amount, given the condition it is in. I wonder what would constitute the better deal in the long run, capabilities vs $$ repair/maintaining-wise? If anything happens to my current ride I will have to make that decision. Personally, I am leaning towards a well looked after D3/4 or an early L322 diesel. Cannot see myself buying an Asian brand!
Having just made the jump from d1 to d3, i also considered a Pajero but couldn't do it. I was lucky and found a low k 1 owner 08 tdv6 se d3 for not much more than a late d2a.

[lyonsy]

are you getting a loan to buy? if so you are better off looking at 2011 or newer to get much better interest rates

have you ridden in a pootrol if you do you probably wont want it as they are rough as guts to ride in.

the 3L in the pootrols its self is not bad but the vvt turbo is a pos they jam up then over boost and kill the engine, if you put a std wastegate turbo off a d22 3L navara they have no more issues then any other common rail diesel.

but yeah i am basically looking at the same thing and for anything older then 2011 i am only thinking a d2a td5 but i also all ready have one so it just means easy to keep spares and service stuff for since i do it all my self

if you go a tdv6 they need the cambelt done at 150'000km so high km could be better as its all ready been done

also are you going to be mostly touring or doing hard tracks ?

here is my 2011 or later list of 4x4 you should be able to get these for around 30k with under a 150'000km
pajero = misses hates them so nope for me
fj cruiser (its pardo underneth and simerlar size to a d2)
pardo
d4 2.7 (so at least i can fit 17in wheels)

btw dont go near a early l322 td6 with the 5 speed its a very weak box with the converter lockup burning out from the valve body wearing and bleeding pressure of the lock up clutch that then fries the trans (stupid bloody crap gm rubbish gearbox thats not even rated for the torque of the engine they put in front of it)

[Ean Austral]

are you getting a loan to buy? if so you are better off looking at 2011 or newer to get much better interest rates

have you ridden in a pootrol if you do you probably wont want it as they are rough as guts to ride in.

the 3L in the pootrols its self is not bad but the vvt turbo is a pos they jam up then over boost and kill the engine, if you put a std wastegate turbo off a d22 3L navara they have no more issues then any other common rail diesel.

but yeah i am basically looking at the same thing and for anything older then 2011 i am only thinking a d2a td5 but i also all ready have one so it just means easy to keep spares and service stuff for since i do it all my self

if you go a tdv6 they need the cambelt done at 150'000km so high km could be better as its all ready been done

also are you going to be mostly touring or doing hard tracks ?

here is my 2011 or later list of 4x4 you should be able to get these for around 30k with under a 150'000km
pajero = misses hates them so nope for me
fj cruiser (its pardo underneth and simerlar size to a d2)
pardo
d4 2.7 (so at least i can fit 17in wheels)

btw dont go near a early l322 td6 with the 5 speed its a very weak box with the converter lockup burning out from the valve body wearing and bleeding pressure of the lock up clutch that then fries the trans (stupid bloody crap gm rubbish gearbox thats not even rated for the torque of the engine they put in front of it)

Double edged sword - yes they have been done, but the common failure on the timing belt is because the older style oil pump housing wasn't beefed up enough in the corner where the bolt for the tensioner screws into. Several have been caught where the belts were done and down the track they have a seized engine because the oil pump wasn't changed and the housing failing causing the tensioner to snap off, so buying a car where the belts were done may see you needing to at the very least remove the timing belt cover to check if the pump was changed or if you are lucky enough to have the beefed up housing. A bit like the oil pump bolt in the TD5 - best not to be left to chance.

Cheers Ean

[theh33d]

Well folks

I had a drive in the V6 petrol and I have to say I am well impressed. The car drove superb with no issues to report. Previous owner was a doctor and looks as though it has never seen a track.
Now the had part is convincing the wife that this the 4x4 for us.

I will keep you posted when/if we go ahead with the purchase.

[crawal]

Well after having a 4.8 Pootrol hammered out the vales as the previous owner never got checked ($4 k) , having 4 teenage kids 2 sitting with knees under their chin , it drank better than the teenages 20 lt/100 , yup it went like the clappers , towed at 100 kph drank then at 24-26 lt/100 .
We got the 2008 disco with all the fruit and love it , the TDV6 get 8-12 lt/100 tows great , all the kids fit (now bigger ) no complaints on who is in the back .
better lights , ride , safety ... Why did we get one earlier ........

[ATH]

I had a 3ltr Prado a few years back. Reliable and not bad at all to ride in and went every where we wanted it to go but it certainly liked to drink the juice towing or not.
Had the worse cruise control/gearbox function ever and used to change down at the slightest slope. When it dropped down a gear all we got was more noise.....
Changed that for a 110 Puma Defender and what a difference. OK a smaller engine but with the 6 speed box it made all the difference to cruising and towing and climbing hills. Consumption dropped dramatically as well.
You could feel the power when dropping down a gear.
Now we have a D4 and the difference is just so so so marvellous, quiet and wonderful with leather seats and a sound system you can really hear and...... pity the Cook would rather have the Defender. :-((
Go with a good D3 and I'm sure you'll love it.
AlanH.

[rar110]

Buy as new as you can afford. If doing low km then buy a petrol. Diesel is much better for torque and fuel economy, but maintenance over its life is more expensive.

[DiscoMick]

Definitely a D3. Patrols are crude dinosaurs.
BTW not everything wants to poison or bite you. Roos want to kick you and koalas want to piddle on you.

[trout1105]

Do I follow my heart and own a D3 and the expected running costs or go with the Jap option.

It all depends on what you are looking for.
I have a 2004 D2 and the misses has a 2006 twin cab Hilux, both of which have about 240K's on the clock.
My D2 is a far more comfortable and refined truck to drive and it runs rings around the Hilux off and on road But my maintenance and repair bills for the D2 is much higher than the Hilux.
My D2 also has more creature comforts than the Hilux But the little 4 cyl Toyota diesel is far more economical at the fuel bowser than my V8.

So if you want something that is an absolute pleasure to drive and is something that puts that smug gin or your Mug while driving But it will cost you more at the fuel bowser and the workshop Go for the D3.
If you want something that is pretty "Ordinary" to drive and is the same as all the others on the road that don't have a "Soul" then Go for the Jap option.

[bsperka]

Definitely a D3. Patrols are crude dinosaurs.
BTW not everything wants to poison or bite you. Roos want to kick you and koalas want to piddle on you.And if a Koala piddles on you, you may get Chamidia.

[ozscott]

The petrol is the pick of the 2 particular vehicles you were looking at. I would immediately change to a serviceable pan on the auto if it hasn't already been done and change the auto trans fluid.

The Nissan Patrols that did not have the grenade motor was a very reliable and honest truck with (less be realists) lower maintenance costs (an average Patrol v average Disco) than any D3 or D4 over say a 10 year 200k stretch...but the D3 is much nicer to drive.

Cheers

[DiscoMick]

And if a Koala piddles on you, you may get Chamidia.
Ants also want to bite you.
It's not all bad though. Sugar gliders just want to curl up in your jacket pocket. Bats have big cute eyes, are smarter than dogs and just want to eat your fruit. Snakes control rodents. Spiders want to run across your windscreen.

[Plane Fixer]

Had a grenade Patrol 3.0. One day driving back home from Sydney it went bang.145000km. Put a reco motor in it and sold it, then bought a new D4. Will have to say it was the best decision I made.
After 160000km is a pleasure to drive and does not get the shakes at cruising speed. The maintenance costs are certainly higher than the Nissan, but I have a capable and comfortable 4x4 I can jump in and do long distances in superb comfort and have the power to safely get past road trains. The fuel economy is better than the Nissan as well and I do not drive for economy.

[Chilly]

Hi,

Interesting question you have asked.

I had a D3 and enjoyed driving it. Off road the car is extremely comfortable.

I had a D2 too. Whilst out with friends. A couple of games us were car hopping as they did not have an off road vehicle. My D2 came out as best car to ride in and not feel the bumps etc.

I now have a RRS TDV8. Awesome car, eats long distances and a pleasure to drive off road. However it does have a space issue compared to the D3. It is smaller inside.

I see your budget is $25,0000 bit thought you might be tempered by a 2012 D4 HSE 3.0. Currently for sale on Pickles T $30,000 as fixed price item.
2012 Land Rover Discovery 4 - Pickles Auctions Australia (https://www.pickles.com.au/cars/item/-/details/CP-02-12--Built-12-11--Land-Rover--Discovery-4--Series-4-L319-MY13-SDV6-HSE--Wagon--7-Seats--5-Doors/802066600)
I have looked at it a few times...but dstill not really want to sell my RRS and Defender and have the one car. Would advise getting someone with D4 knowledge look at if interested.


Carsales show a D4 at $24995. In budget!
We've taken a wrong turn (https://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Land-Rover-Discovery-4-2010/SSE-AD-4903695)

There is a huge variety of D3's as n carsales within your budget. I would be trying to get one with as much after market accessories as possible. Bullbar...saves a few thousand dollars.and then abc possibly long range tank..depend on touring or not. Things which capos a lot to add but may not be much more expensive on a used car!

Chilly

[duderduderini]

Ive had a 2.7 tdv6 2006 rrs since march. I had a few issues with the suspension but after changing the front and rear control valves the problem went away. I changed the oil pan for a steel one and I regularly get around 10 litres/100 k's in it. Whilst the least horsepowered of the variants, it is quick enough for me and cruises effortlessly. At 100 k's an hour you will get almost 1000 k's range. Yes I do worry about the cam belt.. it was changed prior to me buying car (at around 125 k kilometers) and now it has 160 k on it so i might do an oil pump change in it at 200 k mark. I like the rrs a lot but after seeing Dons d4, it had a lot more room in it with a split tailgate and storage bins in back.. essentially same vehicle mechanically.
If you can do a bit of your own work and buy parts from the uk sellers (rimmer, island 4x4 to name 2), ownership costs can be reduced. They are an eminently capable highway car and state of the art off road. This forum is also extremely helpful.
Whilst hey have the potential to be quirky they do seem to be capable of high mileage. The diesel gets better fuel economy but has more achilles heels by way of egr's cam belt high pressure fuel pump et al so consider engine choice carefully. If its a city car go petrol, if you do a lot of Highway k's the diesel wont clog up as quick.
Good luck

[Jobby]

Now the hard part is convincing the wife that this the 4x4 for us.

.

Would recommend getting her to take a D3 for a test drive. One drive should convince her it's the right 4x4! If not is clear that you have made a mistake and I am sure that someone on this forum can assist with the appropriate divorce paper work
[bigsmile]

[Nomad9]

Hi There,
So, I have recently returned from a trip up North, I HAD a RRS TDV8, as mentioned in so many of the other posts these are a beautiful vehicle, yes a bit smaller inside than a TDV6 D3 which I have also had, again a very comfortable vehicle, economical etc etc. I did an EGR valve whilst driving around at home, this was open heart surgery replacing this to put it lightly, then my top thermostat housing cracked unbeknown to me after leaking slightly for several months into the V valley, no harm don't I replaced the housing.
Getting back to the TDV8 last year on the way back from Broome in Denham the alternator crapped itself, the mechanic in Denham opened the bonnet promptly told me "he was going in there" and shut it again. I had to get the vehicle and the camper trailer trucked back to Perth, thank you RAC, I will remain a member for the rest of my life. My wife and I had to catch the Grey hound bus back to Perth, I will NVER put my wife or myself through an experience like that again, it was horrendous, we laugh about it now however at the time it was quite disturbing. Being verbally abused and putting up with some of the smells released from various orifices by other indigenous travellers who I suspect had been drinking since Port Headand was not pleasant.
This year on the way to Marble Bar going up the coastal road when I stopped at Karratha I noticed soot on the back window, various members from AULRO talked me through various things to check and do, we completed the holiday with no further incidents apart from using between 3 to 4 more litres / 100, the vehicle seemed to return to normal after a week being home. However this was to close to turning into another nightmare trip home.

On my return to home I / we decided to sell the TDV8 and I now have a 2014 3.0 Hilux dual cab, it is not a patch on the comfort of the RRS, it doesn't have any of the refinements of luxury travel, fuel economy is great, I have access to a plethora of accessories and if I need them I can get spare parts from Repco or Super Cheap. There is no forum, there is no LR wave and all the other stuff that goes with owning an iconic brand.

Saying that my primary vehicle, my daily drive is my beautiful Rimini Red RRS N/A 4.4 V8, it is a pleasure to drive in all aspects of driving, goes like a stabbed rat, sounds awesome, pretty damn economical, relatively simple to maintain and it doesn't break. Being a petrol I got this one pretty cheap, easily justifiable in the petrol V diesel argument, personally wouldn't have another LR diesel, would have a go at a 3.0 diesel they seem to have a good rap. However I have to try a 4.2 supercharged RRS yet, might give one of them a go in the next couple of years, yes they like a drink, bit more complex however would like t think it would be fun.

I've done the Patrol thing, done the Land Cruiser thing, just love my Land Rovers, the Hilux has been bought for a specific reason for a trip next year to Kununurra up the GRR, could well need a few chiropractor appointments on my return, plus a couple of teeth but at least I'll get there and back, and if anything does go wrong a mechanic won't look at me like I landed from the planet Zod when I rock up at the workshop. some times you just have to do what you have to do.

Cheers Marty

[garethbrown2670@gmail.com]

I've owned a D3 V6 Petrol (5 years) and a D4 2.7V6 Diesel (5 years).

The petrol is a relatively "agricultural" engine (i.e. a bit noisy, harsh), but otherwise pretty reliable.

Both vehicles have common issues with the front end bushes (essentially need replacing every 70-100,000 k's - simple wear issue) and a non-robust Air Compressor. The Air Compressors have a l...o...n...g history but LR seems to have FINALLY gotten on top of the issue with the current part. We've had our current compressor (from the new Manufacturer - Japanese I think???) for 3 years without any issue at all.

Aside from the Air Compressor, the Air Suspension itself is rock solid, and a massive improvement over any kind of spring solution. We've drove our D4 at 80 kph, in complete comfort, to and from Mitchell Falls in the NT when every vehicle around us was destroying their (pick any brand) shock absorbers doing 20-30k's and hating every mile of travel.

The Patrol is actually NOT as reliable as what their owners will tell you. There's some pretty nasty (and very expensive) weaknesses in the Gearboxes (look up "Patrol 5th gear towing issues") and the 3.0L engines (plenty of people with engine rebuilds). The vehicles also tend to overheat pretty easily. When in the RRCV in Vic (mostly Patrols, LandCruisers, Discos) we often saw Patrols overheat in the High Country valleys - any long uphills with a tailwind (i.e. low forced airflow through the radiator). And the standard suspension is truly ****e. There's a good reason why all the owners replace the suspension.

AND you'll feel like you're driving something not-too-far-removed from a Massey Ferguson tractor. Try one and see!!!

Discos certainly aren't perfect, and in general the older the more failures you'll see (beyond 200,000-250,000k's). But the alternatives aren't necessarily all they're cracked up to be.

Good luck!











Hello Folks

First off excellent forum with some fantastic posts/information

I will start off with a bit of back ground on my story and why I am here rambling on, I will try to keep this post as short as possible.
Im Scottish and lucky enough to now live in Australia (5 years) used to own a Mitsubishi Pajero (short wheel base) grey import. Loved the car and only sold to lack of space (baby + big dog)
I am now looking at owning a proper 4x4 as our Nissan x-trail does the wife proud but we need more space and ability as we are now camping again even though the wife swore she wouldn't as every creature in Australia just wants to poison you (her words) also we have talked about doing the big lap of Australia at some point.
So..... I had looked at the usual suspect Patrol, Prado & Pajero and we had decided on a Patrol due to budget (25k) and ability but during my daily commute on the train and searching through the small ads decided to look at the D3 and realised pretty quickly that there is some amount of vechicle for your buck against the Jap 4x4.
Now I have a love for land rovers as I have fond memories of my uncles Defender 110 on the farm as a young boy and since then I have admired land rovers from afar.
Sorry rambling on.

I will be viewing two D3 SE this weekend TDV6 and 4.0V6.
The TDV6 has covered 217,000k with full service history and a negotianal price of $19,000.
The V6 has covered 97,000k with full service history + an extended warranty? $22,000
Now my head says the V6 petrol is a no brainer with the lower kilometres covered and the type of use the D3 will see daily drive to the train station and weekend trips to my sons sports events with the as mentioned weekends and holidays away in Western Australia camping.
As I will hold onto the next 4x4 I purchase for many years to come I look at the TDV6 and think that the big ticket items have been addressed, bushes, compressor & gearbox service whereas the V6 petrol will have this to come. well so I'm lead to believe if you trust the fine people on the Google searches.
Fuel economy is not a major concern as I do not expect to be driving many kilometres in a year as the wife does this in her x-trail.

So after much rambling I am looking for some pointers
Do I follow my heart and own a D3 and the expected running costs or go with the Jap option.
I know it's a stupid question to ask on a Land Rover forum but where else will I get genuine owner experience of a D3 against the Google searches.

Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to respond.

[alpercival]

Hello Folks

First off excellent forum with some fantastic posts/information

I will start off with a bit of back ground on my story and why I am here rambling on, I will try to keep this post as short as possible.
Im Scottish and lucky enough to now live in Australia (5 years) used to own a Mitsubishi Pajero (short wheel base) grey import. Loved the car and only sold to lack of space (baby + big dog)
I am now looking at owning a proper 4x4 as our Nissan x-trail does the wife proud but we need more space and ability as we are now camping again even though the wife swore she wouldn't as every creature in Australia just wants to poison you (her words) also we have talked about doing the big lap of Australia at some point. [SNIP]

So after much rambling I am looking for some pointers
Do I follow my heart and own a D3 and the expected running costs or go with the Jap option.
I know it's a stupid question to ask on a Land Rover forum but where else will I get genuine owner experience of a D3 against the Google searches.

Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to respond.


Not sure if you've gone ahead and purchased the D3. - if you are interested we've just returned from a 12 month / 65,000 km tour of the country in a 2007 D3 - it had 130,000 when we bought it and is now about to hit 200K.

There are many many tales I can tell about the scrapes we got into (and mostly out of!) but in summary - if I was doing it again, I would be taking a Landcruiser. Not because I don't love the Landy but just because support is so hard to get once you leave the main centres. We got dumped by the side of the road twice by the vehicle. Once in the Flinders Ranges when a wheel bearing went, which needed a tow to Adelaide and then 100km south of Alice - which ended up also requiring having the car put on a truck and carted back to Adelaide for a new motor (ouch!) after the seal on the oil pump failed catastrophically and dumped all the oil on the road.

So - if you ar just going a few 100km out of town camping, then the D3 will do anything and get you anywhere. But if you are serious about doing the big lap, then sorry, but I'd go Toyota.

[Clip]

Work colleague had a D2. Went everywhere in it. Sold it and bought a 100 series Landcruiser. First trip away flogged out all the suspension. Bought a Prado (57,000k's only). Got to Mt Isa and had to replace injectors (over $7000!). Got home sold it and bought a Hi Lux. Now selling that and going back to LR, a D4 this time. He can't wait to get rid of the HiLux and get back in a Disco.

Other friend had Prado 2010 from new that had got to just over 300,000ks'. Driving home from Brisbane on the Bruce Highway, big bang and oil everywhere. Got it towed back to dealer where he bought it from and their response was 'how long did you want it to last for? That's good millage these days, can't complain about that". Needless to say he didn't buy another one (but he did buy a Pajero!).

Brother in-law bought brand new 3L Patrol. Around 40,000ks later started having sensor problems, and of course, the dreaded 5th gear problem. Sold that quickly! Bought a Jeep Grand Cherokee. All going well until 1 month out of warrantee. Went to start it one morning, no go. Couldn't even unlock it and had to use the key. Then it wouldn't start. Turned out to be the body computer - $5000 later, then he sold it.

Best mate bought a 2015 Navara. Absolute HOS, reckons it's the worst car he's every owned. He's had ongoing gearbox issue where it locks into third gear. Had it repaired / part replaced THREE times! Then wife ran into a car in front. Low speed impact, no air bag triggered. Was told that needed airbag sensors replaced in front bar. They have been without the car for over 3 months waiting for this one part (allegedly none in existence and can't take them off another vehicle). Car is perfectly driveable, but they won't release it until this is fixed!

Another mate in his HiLux went up to Fraser last Christmas and came home with the top of his rear canopy 4 inches further away from the bottom of it. Bent both chassis rails half way through the bend over the wheel arches. He had to replace the entire chassis with a new one. That was over 2 months off the road. I also believe there is a class action out in the USA at the moment against Nissan because the Navara's are doing the same thing!

I guess my point is, nothing is bullet-proof. Everything has it's problems and they can all potentially end up costing you a small fortune and letting you down. For my money, I go with what I love and what will give me the most enjoyment. So I guess, look after whatever it is, shower it with kindness and maintenance and maybe, just maybe, it will love you back - at least for a little while!

[DiscoMick]

Hi There,
So, I have recently returned from a trip up North, I HAD a RRS TDV8, as mentioned in so many of the other posts these are a beautiful vehicle, yes a bit smaller inside than a TDV6 D3 which I have also had, again a very comfortable vehicle, economical etc etc. I did an EGR valve whilst driving around at home, this was open heart surgery replacing this to put it lightly, then my top thermostat housing cracked unbeknown to me after leaking slightly for several months into the V valley, no harm don't I replaced the housing.
Getting back to the TDV8 last year on the way back from Broome in Denham the alternator crapped itself, the mechanic in Denham opened the bonnet promptly told me "he was going in there" and shut it again. I had to get the vehicle and the camper trailer trucked back to Perth, thank you RAC, I will remain a member for the rest of my life. My wife and I had to catch the Grey hound bus back to Perth, I will NVER put my wife or myself through an experience like that again, it was horrendous, we laugh about it now however at the time it was quite disturbing. Being verbally abused and putting up with some of the smells released from various orifices by other indigenous travellers who I suspect had been drinking since Port Headand was not pleasant.
This year on the way to Marble Bar going up the coastal road when I stopped at Karratha I noticed soot on the back window, various members from AULRO talked me through various things to check and do, we completed the holiday with no further incidents apart from using between 3 to 4 more litres / 100, the vehicle seemed to return to normal after a week being home. However this was to close to turning into another nightmare trip home.

On my return to home I / we decided to sell the TDV8 and I now have a 2014 3.0 Hilux dual cab, it is not a patch on the comfort of the RRS, it doesn't have any of the refinements of luxury travel, fuel economy is great, I have access to a plethora of accessories and if I need them I can get spare parts from Repco or Super Cheap. There is no forum, there is no LR wave and all the other stuff that goes with owning an iconic brand.

Saying that my primary vehicle, my daily drive is my beautiful Rimini Red RRS N/A 4.4 V8, it is a pleasure to drive in all aspects of driving, goes like a stabbed rat, sounds awesome, pretty damn economical, relatively simple to maintain and it doesn't break. Being a petrol I got this one pretty cheap, easily justifiable in the petrol V diesel argument, personally wouldn't have another LR diesel, would have a go at a 3.0 diesel they seem to have a good rap. However I have to try a 4.2 supercharged RRS yet, might give one of them a go in the next couple of years, yes they like a drink, bit more complex however would like t think it would be fun.

I've done the Patrol thing, done the Land Cruiser thing, just love my Land Rovers, the Hilux has been bought for a specific reason for a trip next year to Kununurra up the GRR, could well need a few chiropractor appointments on my return, plus a couple of teeth but at least I'll get there and back, and if anything does go wrong a mechanic won't look at me like I landed from the planet Zod when I rock up at the workshop. some times you just have to do what you have to do.

Cheers Marty
Can I ask why the mechanic couldn't simply unbolt one alternator and bolt on another? Was there a reason he couldn't do what is often a relatively simple job?

[Nomad9]

Hi DiscoMick,

I changed the alternator myself when I got home, have you ever done the alternator on a TDV8 RRS? If only the job was just a case of undoing the bolts and installing a new one. After I had changed the alternator I understood why the mechanic chose to fix the Land Cruisers and Patrols he had in his garage, two of each both waiting for parts, he was actually working on a Prado replacing the engine when he towed my vehicle into his garage.

For one he didn't have the parts they had to be ordered in, the alternator was $750 from Adelaide via express postage, mine broke on a Friday so it would be at least the following Tuesday before he was able to start my vehicle. He had never done one before and he just didn't want the headache of trying to figure it out I suppose, Oh and add at to that the battery was fried, couldn't even get the doors open at one point. No battery of the right size and power available. I think I have attached a picture of the location of the alternator, see if you think this is still a simple job, and this is after I have removed the wheel and the innr arch protector, and the earth straps.

128507

Cheers Marty

[slug_burner]

To the original post,

D3/D4 is the way if you want a vehicle you can live with every day. Many of the others are tractors in comparison of ride quality. The jap 4x4s all hold their price higher than the LRs, that is simply a supply and demand issue. Not many people are likely to buy into an LR second hand unless they have some prior knowledge, most non LR people think that LR parts are much more expensive and less available than the jap parts. I am sure you will find a few stories of jap parts, that are expensive and have to wait for them to come in from o/s.

Out in the outback people tend to stick to what they know, mechanics don't like to experiment on a new brand. A lot of working 4x4are jap and mechanics like to stick to what they know. On a trip when at Kununurra a local mechanic had trouble repairing a tyre on a disco2 alloy rim, he swore he would never work on an LR again. He had never encountered a rim setup for a tubeless tyre where the inside lip is higher everywhere except near the valve. (I am sure that feature has a name, something like a safety lip).

As for the RR alternator, some of those are a body off job to get access to the alternator. But this is just a consequence of new design practices where maintenance is not high on the agenda and they stick a lot into a small space.

I'd go with the low mileage petrol D3 if you don't do many miles.

[ozscott]

I've owned a D3 V6 Petrol (5 years) and a D4 2.7V6 Diesel (5 years).

The petrol is a relatively "agricultural" engine (i.e. a bit noisy, harsh), but otherwise pretty reliable.

Both vehicles have common issues with the front end bushes (essentially need replacing every 70-100,000 k's - simple wear issue) and a non-robust Air Compressor. The Air Compressors have a l...o...n...g history but LR seems to have FINALLY gotten on top of the issue with the current part. We've had our current compressor (from the new Manufacturer - Japanese I think???) for 3 years without any issue at all.

Aside from the Air Compressor, the Air Suspension itself is rock solid, and a massive improvement over any kind of spring solution. We've drove our D4 at 80 kph, in complete comfort, to and from Mitchell Falls in the NT when every vehicle around us was destroying their (pick any brand) shock absorbers doing 20-30k's and hating every mile of travel.

The Patrol is actually NOT as reliable as what their owners will tell you. There's some pretty nasty (and very expensive) weaknesses in the Gearboxes (look up "Patrol 5th gear towing issues") and the 3.0L engines (plenty of people with engine rebuilds). The vehicles also tend to overheat pretty easily. When in the RRCV in Vic (mostly Patrols, LandCruisers, Discos) we often saw Patrols overheat in the High Country valleys - any long uphills with a tailwind (i.e. low forced airflow through the radiator). And the standard suspension is truly ****e. There's a good reason why all the owners replace the suspension.

AND you'll feel like you're driving something not-too-far-removed from a Massey Ferguson tractor. Try one and see!!!

Discos certainly aren't perfect, and in general the older the more failures you'll see (beyond 200,000-250,000k's). But the alternatives aren't necessarily all they're cracked up to be.

Good luck!Having just coming back from Cape York on hundreds of miles of horrendous corregations at GVM I can tell you that Bilsteins provide excellent ride and no fade in my D2. With us was a D4 and D3. They both rode as well as the D2 although the D3 kept squatting at night on one corner (turned out to be a connection). Unfortunately the D3 came back from the top end via boat then car transporter largely because the mechanics in remote places don't know them and don't have the expertise and gear to fix them. It didn't like water crossings and developed a CDL fault. Unfortunaty in remote areas having a Jap 4wd can still be an advantage if you break down and that wont change. Cheers

[DiscoMick]

Hi DiscoMick,

I changed the alternator myself when I got home, have you ever done the alternator on a TDV8 RRS? If only the job was just a case of undoing the bolts and installing a new one. After I had changed the alternator I understood why the mechanic chose to fix the Land Cruisers and Patrols he had in his garage, two of each both waiting for parts, he was actually working on a Prado replacing the engine when he towed my vehicle into his garage.

For one he didn't have the parts they had to be ordered in, the alternator was $750 from Adelaide via express postage, mine broke on a Friday so it would be at least the following Tuesday before he was able to start my vehicle. He had never done one before and he just didn't want the headache of trying to figure it out I suppose, Oh and add at to that the battery was fried, couldn't even get the doors open at one point. No battery of the right size and power available. I think I have attached a picture of the location of the alternator, see if you think this is still a simple job, and this is after I have removed the wheel and the innr arch protector, and the earth straps.

128507

Cheers Marty
Ah yes, I wondered if that might be the reason. Thanks.

[theh33d]

After going over my options time and again I have decided to go with a D3 petrol V6.
I made an offer on the D3 I test drove last week and I collect the car tomorrow.
Really looking forward to getting to grips with the D3 and putting some K's on it. Wife is already planning our next road trip.
We plan to do a quarter lap of Oz next year so I will be going through the threads looking for ideas for the D3 before the trip.
I will upload a photo or twenty once I have the D3 home.

Thanks again for the advise and as mentioned before great forum guys keep it up.

[theh33d]

Hello folks

Enjoying the life of a D3 owner so far.
Driving home from work today sitting at 110 km/h and I was amazed at the refinement of the car, turned the stereo off and there is basically no wind noise to report which is amazing for such a large vehicle.

So can someone advise on using 91 octane fuel over the advised 95 octane?
Being Scottish always looking to save a buck or two whenever possible.

Has anyone experienced performance issues with using the lower grade fuel?

[letherm]

So can someone advise on using 91 octane fuel over the advised 95 octane?
Being Scottish always looking to save a buck or two whenever possible.


My previous car was a Pajero V6 petrol. I did a test over about 9 months comparing E10, 95 and 98. I found that the extra cost of the higher octane fuels was more than offset by better fuel economy plus better performance as a bonus. I would not personally go below the recommended octane rating though. FWIW, our mechanic (very well respected around this area) said never to use E10 due to water issues. He had seen a number of petrol tank rusted and the only common factor was E10 fuel. Bottom line is you may save more by going for a higher rating. I ended up using 98 octane afterwards. My experience may not be the same as yours, and I know it's not the same car, but it's worth keeping a record to see whether you get the same result and act accordingly.

Martin

[bsperka]

Hello folks

Enjoying the life of a D3 owner so far.
Driving home from work today sitting at 110 km/h and I was amazed at the refinement of the car, turned the stereo off and there is basically no wind noise to report which is amazing for such a large vehicle.

So can someone advise on using 91 octane fuel over the advised 95 octane?
Being Scottish always looking to save a buck or two whenever possible.

Has anyone experienced performance issues with using the lower grade fuel?To save money follow the manufacturer's recommendation - PULP. Anything else is a false economy.

[bsperka]

My previous car was a Pajero V6 petrol. I did a test over about 9 months comparing E10, 95 and 98. I found that the extra cost of the higher octane fuels was more than offset by better fuel economy plus better performance as a bonus. I would not personally go below the recommended octane rating though. FWIW, our mechanic (very well respected around this area) said never to use E10 due to water issues. He had seen a number of petrol tank rusted and the only common factor was E10 fuel. Bottom line is you may save more by going for a higher rating. I ended up using 98 octane afterwards. My experience may not be the same as yours, and I know it's not the same car, but it's worth keeping a record to see whether you get the same result and act accordingly.

MartinE10 also has about 3% less energy than 91 RON petrol, so you will use more.

[Chilly]

Hi DiscoMick,

I changed the alternator myself when I got home, have you ever done the alternator on a TDV8 RRS? If only the job was just a case of undoing the bolts and installing a new one. After I had changed the alternator I understood why the mechanic chose to fix the Land Cruisers and Patrols he had in his garage, two of each both waiting for parts, he was actually working on a Prado replacing the engine when he towed my vehicle into his garage.

For one he didn't have the parts they had to be ordered in, the alternator was $750 from Adelaide via express postage, mine broke on a Friday so it would be at least the following Tuesday before he was able to start my vehicle. He had never done one before and he just didn't want the headache of trying to figure it out I suppose, Oh and add at to that the battery was fried, couldn't even get the doors open at one point. No battery of the right size and power available. I think I have attached a picture of the location of the alternator, see if you think this is still a simple job, and this is after I have removed the wheel and the innr arch protector, and the earth straps.

128507

Cheers Marty

Well that's a bit surprising to read. I found mine quite easy to change!

[Nomad9]

I found it easier when I had googled it see it done on YouTube and got some advice from people like yourself, when I first looked at the job before seeking any advice the job looked pretty daunting. Cheers Marty

[Melbourne Park]

E10 is nasty stuff, it leaves bad deposits, engines don't like it.

Years ago I read a comparison of petrol fuels, on an SUV that could handle 91 Ron. It still got better fuel economy with 95, and better again with premium. It turned out the cheapest fuel was the 95, but the premium was hardly different in cost. But the premium has detergents which clean things so it was the better thing to buy.

With my 1997 Prado 3.4 litre V6 ( a caste iron block truck engine), I tried high octane fuels and found no difference in economy. Then I found that it takes 4,000km for the Toyota computer to take advantage of higher octane. So I waited and eventually the fuel economy radically improved. It now gets about the same fuel economy as my D4 does. That is, when my D4 is towing a 2.4 tonne van. Before the D4, I had a Kakadu Prado diesel 150 with all the radar cruise and stuff. Gutless and noisy, it was quiet compared to the 1997 90 series Prado, but not nearly as nice to drive. It felt very heavy and ponderous. The Disco is heavier again, but it handles and feels great, and the engine and gearbox are glorious. I envied the 120 Prados but after the 150 series, I realised that perhaps Prados have been getting progressively worse.

Whoops - ran off topic

[veebs]

So can someone advise on using 91 octane fuel over the advised 95 octane?
Being Scottish always looking to save a buck or two whenever possible.

Has anyone experienced performance issues with using the lower grade fuel?

Firstly congrats on using a LR forum to justify the purchase of your Disco - smart move :-)

Years ago I experimented with PULP vs ULP in a 1989 VN Commodore (P-plater back then, it was my pride and joy). The car would idle rough when running ULP, steering wheel shaking, brake pedal pulsing, that kind of thing.
When I switched to PULP, it was smooth as silk. Changing back to ULP and the rough idle returned. Like others, I noticed a significant improvement in fuel economy when running PULP, though always felt that could easily be influenced by more/less, er, spirited driving as a young bloke.

I figure the higher tech engines in these cars are better suited to dealing with different octane levels, but still probably worthwhile running PULP or better.

[DiscoMick]

I have seen E10 rated at 90, 92 and 94. Naturally I usually seek out the 94. Our Mazda 2 seems to run just fine on it.

[theh33d]

Thanks again for the feed back. My D3 will be using 95 octane.

[Discofever]

Good luck. Once LR gets into your heart its over pretty much and it sounds like its halfway there. Drive a D3 and it is all you will want to buy.

[ozscott]

Sometimes economics, simplicity, reliability and practicality win out (head over heart...). My mate who has had 2 D3's over time has given up on them. Last one let him down badly in the far north with the centre diff randomly locking when it shouldn't and gearbox problems (110k on the clock...) and a few expensive repairs over time and on the cards for the future...he is about to get a new Triton (he and I have driven them before).

I'm keeping my D2.

Cheers

[Melbourne Park]

Thanks again for the feed back. My D3 will be using 95 octane.

Take note too that I think Caltex sell a premium 95, that has detergents in it, compared to some other 95s that are not "premium". The economy would be the same, but injectors and build ups would benefit IMO from the extra detergents.

[theh33d]

Thought I would just add some info on my ownership over the past few weeks.
i have to say that I am loving the D3 with its looks, comfort and ease of chewing up the K's.
The only negative thing I would mention is a low down whine I hear only at low speeds, once I am up at 70+ I can't hear a thing. Not sure what it is but I will get the drive train checked over at the next service along with a transmission flush.
fuel economy isn't as bad as I thought it would be as I am seeing 13ltr/100k with mixed driving.
No I am hunting for roof bars and racks in readiness for the next camping trip.

[loanrangie]

Been 6 weeks of ownership for me and loving it , was 11.5/100 but that has dropped to 10.8.

[rar110]

Whine can be tyres rather than drive train. I had a whine on the L322 that sounded like a bearing, which wasn't a surprise at 260,000km. I swapped tyres over as I have a 2nd set and noise gone.