New to group and P38 advice wanted as am considering a purchase.. PLEASE 😁

[Rlaundy]

Hi Folks,
My name is Robert and I am from Sheffield Tasmania, and have just joined this group.
I was wondering if anyone can offer any advice on the HSE p38s? Hope I am allowed to ask?
Having read about 50+ posts on here about them, I am uming and aring about getting one.

I only drive V8s FORD'S mostly, so I like the HSE as it's a 4.6Lt, are these a bad motor, as I have read lot’s of horror stories on here?
Should I worry about 1 that has under 200k on it, and for some reason has had the oil pump, radiator and coolant replaced recently? I have read the sleeves in the cylinders give way, and are thin?
Wonder why the oil pump?

Electrics seem to be another gremlin with them from what I read......thoughts?

What else are there week points....... Especially in the drivline?
Front and rear Diffs, trans, transfer ect.
Wanting it for camping ⛺ trips and get into some serious 4wing at times.

Currently have a GU nissan patrol, 5 speed manual with a 5.7Lt Chevy Ramjet American crate motor in it, with a 3" lift, so used to just pointing her in the right direction, and it just does it......and not braking things........ As I have a fairly HEAVY right boot.... Lol 😁

Airbag have been replaced, so they should be good for a while.

I read they are constant 4wd, is that an issue with ware and are, reliability ect?

What about cvs etc......strong?

Also heading bush for a month now and then, say Vic High Country, reliable and is there common parts to carry for spares.

Oops SORRY for ALL the questions, REALLY would APPRECIATE your thoughts 💭 and honest opinions.

TIA Cheers Rob

PS off to bed now, but will be here in the morning.... THANKS HEAPS 👍

[Grumbles]

Hi Folks,
......under 200k on it, and for some reason has had the oil pump, radiator and coolant replaced recently?

Hello Robert and welcome to the forum. It is a friendly place with some really knowledgeable people on board.

No matter what brand the car is if a used car seller tells me their car just had a new radiator fitted I would be very suspicious that the engine has been over heated and may be selling it before costly engine problems surface. Don't ask me how I know this.............

P38s - regardless of their faults they are a magnificent car. Good luck with your search.

[bblaze]

look for member p38keith I think is his member name, done a couple of nice ones, mine is standard fit up but a pleasure to drive, Mine has about 250k;s on it and just done the head gasket. Same as all cars, you need to maintain them. Love my p38
cheers
blaze

[justinc]

Keep the patrol RL.


JC

[Keithy P38]

Hey mate, welcome to the forum!

Big decision to jump out of what sounds like a beast and into a P38! If it’s comfort you’re after then the P38 is a giant leap forward! You’ll spend a solid year learning about its quirks and what not, and provided it’s been maintained well, it’ll keep coming back for more!

I guess comparing the GU to a P38, you probably had more power and torque with the Chev, and with your suspension mods you probably had a bit more wheel travel too. A good set of tyres will get you 99% of places in a P38, with a rear locker as backup for the harder stuff (or momentum - but that’s when you break things when you start bouncing them around). P38’s all have rear traction control (up to the ‘thor’ update in ‘99) or 4 wheel traction control from the mid ‘99 update, and it works well when you know how the get the most out of it.

Unlike the Nissan, P38’s don’t have truck diffs, so punish it and it’ll break, but that said they are pretty strong. I’ve been in a P38 for about 10yrs and never broken a CV or diff and I’m in Low Range most weekends, have been to Cape York a number of times and pretty much all around QLD’s great 4wding spots. I’ve always driven home, even towed another vehicle home from Cape York! The big thing is that you can’t bounce a P38 around like the jap’s, you drive them.

P38’s don’t like deep water, but it’s not the engine that hates it, it’s the electrics under the seats! Get a snorkel and don’t fill the cab with water and you’ll be right. They are well sealed and don’t let water in easy, so water crossings are ok as long as you’re not sitting in it for a few minutes.

The engines are strong. Just like any alloy motor, if the cooling system has an issue, get onto it straight away or you’ll do a head gasket (or worse), and this overheating generally leads to slipped liners. Normal maintenance will see well over 300,000km without touching it.

99% of electrical issues come down to earths, or having a strong battery and working alternator. Keep the battery good, monitor how the battery is charging and you will be ok. They don’t like low voltage. The first alarm you’ll see if your battery or alternator is shagged is the ‘Gearbox Fault’. It’s the last ECU in line so it’ll see low voltage well before the others.

If you want to point and shoot, I recommend good tyres and a rear locker, it’ll do everything at idle and not make a fuss.

Buyer advice - if it’s got issues, walk away or you’ll spend a few thousand on it in repairs. The door locks may ‘chatter’, every P38 on the planet has done this at some stage, it’s a microswitch in the drivers door lock and is nothing to worry about, just leave a window down if you’re hopping out while the car is running or the key is inside it. They don’t burn oil, they leak it! But a drip here and there is ok, a puddle is not. Rear main seals are a pain to replace, but necessary if it starts leaking heaps.

The suspension should get to the height you ask immediately if you’ve been driving for a bit. It may take a few minutes if you’ve made a few height changes as the compressor has to refill the air tank, this takes time.

I did a vid not long ago of my P38, take a look, and on my YouTube there’s heaps of vids (including when I was very young and into my Torana, just ignore those ones haha).

Cheers
Keithy

[prelude]

Hi there and welcome :)

Keithy has, as always, touched on nearly all the subjects so I'll just go into the modification bit of the P38.

Since your GU has been heavily modified I guess you'll want to, at some point, get into that on the P38 as well. When I bought mine in 2015 there was not alot available it seemed but during the course of a year I found more and more stuff available for our beloved beasts. Though I have never broken anything on the car myself yet, I have replaced a lot of things before they get a chance to go wrong.

Available are:


HD half shafts front and back (front with CV's) diff lockers front and back (ashcroft)
front and rear bars with bash plates (terrafirma)
diff protectors (terrafirma)
HD steering bars (gwynn lewis)
lift kit (former HRA now made by dave on this forum)
longer shocks (a few brand, mostly seen I think terrafirma's also available as adjustables)
wheels (disco 2 wheels fit, terrafirma has beadlockers)
snorkel (also terrafirma)


As you can see, most of the gear one would want is available these days but not from as many manufacturers as say for a defender :)

In terms of condition of a pre-owned vehicle; the general consensus is that a P38 without a good service history is one you should walk away from. I myself have spent 20K (euro's) last year to get mine up to snuff and I started out with a fairly good condition autobiography. Of course many of the upgrades were not in need of replacing, I just wanted them haha. Anyway, my point is: if you ARE going to work on the vehicle anyway, if you know what you are doing buying one with issues might not be a big problem?

The pain points are indeed the slipping liner issue this (https://robisonservice.blogspot.com/2010/04/last-word-on-land-rover-liner-failures.html)might be some good reading on the subject, heater O rings that start leaking and the air suspension that starts to fail. The o-rings are an easy fix and some even installed an audi A6 heater core to circumvent the O rings. The air suspension can be the cause of quite a few headaches. Replacing it with springs though defeats the purpose of a P38. Repairs, when done yourself, are actually fairly cheap. A rebuld kit for the valve block will cost you less than 100,- and so does a compressor rebuild kit.

As far as electronic gremlins go: everything on a P38 is controlled by computer and mainly the BECM which sits underneath the righthand seat (the drivers seat in .au) Pressing the horn does not allow a current to flow from a 12v source to the horns, no, it only sends a signal to the BECM which in turn sounds the horn. I really mean, everything goes through that bloody thing. So far I have had little to no problems with it and there are a few companies that can really fix nearly any BECM and even reprogram a spare that'll just slide in on the road if you need it.

All in all, I personally think the P38 is the last real comfortable 4x4. Solid axles and lots of charisma and creature comfort. If you are up to it, go for it!

Cheers,

-P

[Rlaundy]

Hi Guys,

THANKS HEAPS for the replies... and SORRY for the delay in replying.
Might be missing something as I am very new to this site, but I didn't get NOTIFIED of any replies, last I heard it was going to someone for approval..... then when i went looking for the post on my tablet yesterday, I say these replies, but the site is no good on a tablet, as it cuts of the right hand side of the screen, so couldn't reply with out using my laptop....except that's set out differently, so took half an hour to find the post............after all that I think I need a Jim Beam....Lol

So all that info was GREAT, and I actually watched Keiths video the day before I put up the post......GREAT detailed video by the way..... dont suppose you want to sell your bus do you Keith?

No one mentioned the autos in them....what do you fellows think they are like...... STRONG and pretty good, or troublesome?
Do they have a dipstick to check the trans or fully sealed like some land cruisers?

Also having trouble getting info on the constant 4x4 side of things.....how does that work & what are the good and bad points of that system?

Yes the patrol goes nearly anyware, but far from comfortable, so looking for a bit more comfort, as well as a good reliable capable 4x4 to go away in on weekend trips, and month long trips like Vic high Country etc. Haven't broken a diff, cv or anything else through my enthusiastic driving style in my current GU, and previous GQ. or POS 100 series Land Cruiser, but as mentioned like to give things a bit now and then.

Have a hoist, pretty mechanically and electricly minded, and do ALL my own repairs and maintainence on all our cars and 4bys.

So over heating and head gasket problems are an issue by the sound of it, electrical and airbag problems ......many others?

Are parts easy to get, spares etc?

THANKS again for your help.

Cheers,

Rob

[prelude]

Hi there :)

Up to MY 99 there is a dipstick, not sure if it survived after that... Anyway, these are known as the GEMS engines due to the ECU type etc. Those after are know as the BOSCH type (again, ecu etc.) Generally speaking the GEMS are slightly easier to work on, have all the major components like alternator and aircon compressor mounted way up as high as they can be which is very benefitial on an offroader and can be tuned and tweaked just that bit easier. The autobox is a ZF (german) unit that also came in the 750 and 850 in the 90's and is generally considered to be pretty good, just make sure you change the oil and filter regularly.

The constant 4x4 is due to the fact that these cars do not have a locking central diff. A Viscous Coupling unit is used in the centre diff which allows for only a very small bit slippage, just enough to offset the difference in rotation when cornering. They can be a weak point, that is to say, they do not like shock loading which can damage them (lock them up) which in turn can cause windup. I've had one lock up on me but it does not seem to be too common and at any rate, just like most things on a car, they are an item that wears and potentially needs replacing every 100 to 200k's. They are no longer available new and no aftermarket units exist however ashcroft refurbish them so no worries there. The good thing about them is that you actually have permanent 4 wheel drive or AWD which in general is consider to be much safer driving. Also, you'll see me note that more often in this post, change your oil's on time! The VC is cooled by the ATF-III that is in the transferbox. Neglecting that oil not only is bad for the transfer box chain etc. but also impacts the VC.

Overheating should not be a problem under normal circumstances. The bad rap these cars (and other landrovers) get is simply due to lack of maintenance. The air suspension is great! but landrover sorta neglected to mention that it IS a maintenance item. The rubber seals in the valve block perish eventually, just like any other O-ring in any other equipment would. The airbags, just like those on trucks or trailers do wear out but that is normal since the rubber folds hundreds of thousands of times while driving. Minor leaks can start that way which make the system loose just a tiny bit of air but makes the compressor run more often, wearing that out etc. It is problems like these that you are likely to find on an older P38. It seems that down here at least people bought the cars when new for a fortune and the cars got their regular maintenance. After that people who want to show of that they can actually afford a range rover bought them but... more often than not actually could NOT afford to run them and maintenance get's cut on. Ignoring tell tale signs like sagging suspension in the morning (a leak somewhere) and doing oil changes way to late compounds the problems. (un)fortunatly the V8 is a very forgiving engine which will keep running till it is actually past dead. By that time a complete rebuild is your only option.

The only major thing is the V8 slipping liner issue. Other that that; proper maintenance will get you a long long way. Some argue that since this is 1960's technology one should use a much thicker oil from those days and you should definatly throw the oil change interval from the manual in the bin, just change every 5k.

Electrical problems are less then I expected to be honest but it is a bit of a complex system with many inter dependencies. the HEVAC issues are mostly mechanical in nature and not electrical. (servo's wear out, teath breaking, that kinda stuff). A weak point is the under hood relay box. The V8 get's very hot under the bonnet and the relay box tends to break down. They are fairly cheap and reasonably easy to replace though.

Availability of parts seems to be excellent so far. There is some after market support and most parts can be had new from landrover or third party. the VC and HEVAC servo's mentioned above are no longer available new and original but VC's can be refurbished and the servo's are available from a 3rd party. For some (expensive) parts workarounds have been thoguht up by people. For instance the valve block; according to landrover one should simply replace that (expensive!) unit whilst a handfull of o-rings and a rainy afternoon can do the trick. Same goes for wheel bearings. In stead or replacing complete hub's you can just replace the bearing if you have a hydraulic press available and some spare time. Since I live across the pond from the UK I can get most if not all parts easy, a local to .au can probably tell you more about local sourcing of parts but from what I read a lot of you source from the UK as well.

Cheers,

-P

[Rlaundy]

GREAT information, Thankyou heaps for that .......very very usefull info.

Again SORRY for the late reply, have to pull the laptop out to answer, as there site is not tablet or phone friendly sadly......maybe something admin can fix, as less and less people use desktop and laptops these days.

Bloody EXCELLENT site though ....... and SOOOOOO much info.

Good to know about the o ring kits for the valve blocks, and that you can replace the front wheel bearings, if you have a press, as i saw a front hub on Ebay, and it was $780.00AU ......and i nearly fell to the floor ....Lol

Am good with electrics ..( on normal cars) not so sure with the computer doing everything, and mechanics I have been doing for 35years, so not to bad on the spanners.... not that i want to be on them every weekend.

Always change engine oils at 5k have done forever, as well as other oils on a regular basis.

I think i am getting very close to getting one, never had one before, but want to find one to have a drive of first.

THANKS AGAIN HEAPS for your input.

Cheers,

Rob

[bblaze]

where in Tassie are you, I'm in smithton
cheers
blaze

[gavinwibrow]

GREAT information, Thankyou heaps for that .......very very usefull info.

Again SORRY for the late reply, have to pull the laptop out to answer, as there site is not tablet or phone friendly sadly......maybe something admin can fix, as less and less people use desktop and laptops these days.

Bloody EXCELLENT site though ....... and SOOOOOO much info.

Good to know about the o ring kits for the valve blocks, and that you can replace the front wheel bearings, if you have a press, as i saw a front hub on Ebay, and it was $780.00AU ......and i nearly fell to the floor ....Lol

Am good with electrics ..( on normal cars) not so sure with the computer doing everything, and mechanics I have been doing for 35years, so not to bad on the spanners.... not that i want to be on them every weekend.

Always change engine oils at 5k have done forever, as well as other oils on a regular basis.

I think i am getting very close to getting one, never had one before, but want to find one to have a drive of first.

THANKS AGAIN HEAPS for your input.

Cheers,

Rob

If you are anywhere near Hobart, and even if you are not, you have an absolute guru in Justin Cooper on this site for anything LR. Best advice - talk with him if you are determined to get the LR disease. Enjoy the ride!

[Rlaundy]

I'm in Sheffield TAS
You got a p38 have you Bblaze?

[bblaze]

Yes, mine is stock though
cheers
blaze

[Rlaundy]

Yes, mine is stock though
cheers
blaze
Happy with it, and do much 4wdriving with it?

[bblaze]

Not much off road ATM but tow 24 van and if I am around where I need to head up a track or two to go fishing or what ever I just go. Not interested in bashin up muddy tracks ect, done enouth of that when I was younger. Love the deserts and tracks on the mainland, like gunbarrel highway, out around the simpson etc. Heading up the cape next year I hope but happy to take the chicken tracks these days as my trips are normally solo.
cheers
blaze

[Rlaundy]

Nice one 👍 sounds like your happy with it then.

[rar110]

If you like power and good traction, and don’t mind spending on fuel, then consider a 2008 RRV L322 4.2SC v8 with a 6 speed ZF auto and rear diff lock as standard. You will find a few in Victoria. The 2006 and later jag 4.4 are even better value.

I like the idea of owning a P38, but am a bit over spending lots of time and money. I admire blokes like Keith for persisting with them.

And the L322 is a vehicle produced when Ford owned JLR and began to influence production of the V8 and TDV8. (Ford bought JLR in 2000).

If you like tinkering, a P38 will give you lots of joy.