How on earth does this happen?

[V8Ian]

Driver charged after two eight-year-old boys killed in Sydney classroom crash (https://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/11/07/10/19/greenacre-school-car-crash-children-injured)

Distraction has been attributed as the cause, but gross incompetence is more likely. How can anybody be so distracted that they are unaware that their speed has increased to such a velocity that they could smash through a building, whilst driving in a school car park?

RIP little blokes and condolences to the families and friends.

[LRT]

Drugs?

I see more and more incompetent drivers nowadays. I've had a car come at me on the wrong side of the road in a 100kph highway with the driver texting and never looking up when I flashed my lights. I'm seriously considering getting a dash cam now.

There was a strange accident near us last month with a car causing a pile up. Seems like it was attempted suicide or drugs.

Six-car crash investigation under way | The Standard (http://www.standard.net.au/story/4970661/six-car-crash-investigation-under-way/)

[bee utey]

Possibly a high heel caught on a fancy floor mat, then blind panic. Some people belong in self driving cars, or taxis.

[Eevo]

distracted = mobile phone usage

[scarry]

i saw an old lady driving around a round about the wrong way a few days ago.

Then yesterday i saw another oldish lady hit another car in a hospital car park and race off.

Luckily for the other vehicle,it was all caught on CCTV.

[weeds]

Possibly a high heel caught on a fancy floor mat,.

Slightly off topic, I picked up a worm car from Toyota Service the other week and they had removed the aftermarket floor mat (the ones with the raised edges) and placed it in the back foot well....the interesting part was they have a printed card that slips over the rear vision mirror highlighting the dangers of ill fitting floor mats.

[ATH]

"danger of ill fitting floor mats". Funny you should mention that as the people we had lunch with today have just had their Tojo floor mats replaced by them as they were catching the drivers heel when he went to brake. Obviously a known fault as they didn't make any complaint or mention the vehicle was out of warranty.
When you look at so many accidents and wonder "how did that happen"?, it can only put down as gross incompetence by drivers who are so bloody self centred and absorbed in other things like the phone etc.
Nearly all the shouting about extra overtaking lanes for the IOD in WA are misplaced as what they really need is some decent visible policing. Policing which doesn't just concentrate on speeding although I suspect that's asking a bit much.
Driving down from Carnarvon recently there was chatter from some young sounding blokes about the lack of overtaking lanes...I butted in and asked why when the road was mostly straight, you could see for about 10 kays easily and traffic was light to non existent most of the way to the Murchison River.
One of the turkeys said he didn't feel safe without one!!!! Another asked me if I was "bluesky" or someone and as they were calling each other by silly code names I reckoned they were Tojo drivers.
The chorus of relieved sounding chatter when they reached the first overtaking lane was amazing. [biggrin]
Bunch of incompetents.
AlanH.

[weeds]

"danger of ill fitting floor mats". Funny you should mention that as the people we had lunch with today have just had their Tojo floor mats replaced by them as they were catching the drivers heel when he went to brake.

Whoops, should have mention they were after market ones with big lips around the outside and slide under the pedals.

My hi-lux still has OEM mats which are retain by two catches....Toyota blurb suggest fitting OEM mats.

[cuppabillytea]

Shutting the gate loudly, after the horse has bolted. There are now calls for defibrillators in all NSW Public Schools.

[V8Ian]

This incident occurred in a school car park, an area that a prudent and competent driver would be maneuvering at 5-10 kph. Anyone with a modicum of competence, distracted or otherwise, would have noticed the speed increase that must have occurred to cause the damage that it did. I would imagine that to smash through the building and end up with the entire car within the class room, it was a high speed impact under heavy acceleration. Gross incompetence in my book.

[POD]

Shutting the gate loudly, after the horse has bolted. There are now calls for defibrillators in all NSW Public Schools.

Whilst having defibrillators in public spaces is a good thing, defibrillation is a totally irrelevant therapy in this context.

[scarry]

This incident occurred in a school car park, an area that a prudent and competent driver would be maneuvering at 5-10 kph. Anyone with a modicum of competence, distracted or otherwise, would have noticed the speed increase that must have occurred to cause the damage that it did. I would imagine that to smash through the building and end up with the entire car within the class room, it was a high speed impact under heavy acceleration. Gross incompetence in my book.

Or a medical incident,but then again, nothing like that was reported.

One of my brothers fainted in a car park many years ago,luckily, someone came over and turned off the ignition,as the car was reving very high.The poor D1 V8 was valve bouncing......,luckily not in gear.

[Eevo]

news said the distraction was water bottle that she had dropped

[trout1105]

The words "Absolute Moron" come to mind here [bigwhistle]

[tact]

Driver charged after two eight-year-old boys killed in Sydney classroom crash (https://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/11/07/10/19/greenacre-school-car-crash-children-injured)

Distraction has been attributed as the cause, but gross incompetence is more likely. How can anybody be so distracted that they are unaware that their speed has increased to such a velocity that they could smash through a building, whilst driving in a school car park?

RIP little blokes and condolences to the families and friends.

Not shy to say that tears welled up in my eyes as this story unfolded in the media. Just tragic. Thought of my own lad, 9yo, in a similar demountable classroom in another school in another part of Sydney - hope he never faces such a thing.

Regards being unaware of speed increase: Is it so? Was she unaware? Haven't seen that in the reports so far. Did see mention of a dropped flask perhaps distracting.

Am wondering if the result of the distraction was a panicked stamp on the brakes but unfortunately the inept driver got the wrong pedal. Wondering...
(A colleague was in an underground car park on a ramp down to the next basement level and she had a horrific crash. Turned out she had gone for the brake, got the throttle instead, shocked/paralysed because her her speed was soaring despite pressing harder and harder on the "brakes".)

[trout1105]

Seriously people if someone cannot even control a vehicle in a car park then they have No business driving on the road at all.
This idiot shold do some serious jail time for this episode But unfortunatly i doubt that will happen.

[Homestar]

The driver has been charged with multiple serious offences, I think she will be going to prison no matter what the circumstances.

[Eevo]

The driver has been charged with multiple serious offences, I think she will be going to prison no matter what the circumstances.


2 lives have already ended. do we need to ruin another?

[weeds]

Bloody kangaroo courts or what ever they are called.......

Accidents can happen and unfortunately death can be a result......while there is humans involved it always possible.

I highly doubt she woke up in the morning and decided to kill two kids.....as I’m assuming she was dropping a child off at the school.

I prefer to wait until the judge makes a call......

[Neavesie]

The question I always ask myself is how competent were the drivers in the first place.. I see to many drivers who can't read the traffic conditions or get confused in general congestion or can't park/guage distance/ or have sufficient spacial abilities.
It's too easy to get a licence and then there is no retesting. How many drivers know all the road rules, I know I was supprised after reviewing them after 20 years of driving.

I hope the government will enforce compulsory retesting to keep our roads safer. This may have kept this driver from having a licence if they were not competent of course if this were the case.

Driving is a privilege not necessarily a right. But we all have the right to only have competent drivers on our roads. I'm not judging though and maybe I'm wrong to think what I do.

I'm sure the family and friends would agree to safer drivers in the vacinity of their children.

[bob10]

Seriously people if someone cannot even control a vehicle in a car park then they have No business driving on the road at all.
This idiot shold do some serious jail time for this episode But unfortunatly i doubt that will happen.

Not in the car park, the driver drove into the staff only area to drop a child off. And before we jump to whatever, the driver was working with children, so perhaps was entitled to be there. So sad on so many levels. Calm heads must prevail.

[Homestar]

2 lives have already ended. do we need to ruin another?

It's already ruined no matter what anyway - she'll never get over what's happened. 😔

I wasn't saying it was right or wrong, but if they've charged her with that man you offences, they don't think it was an accident or they believe there were contributing factors.

Inncent until proven guilty though, but this will be trial by media, so she will be stuffed before it's even started.

[trout1105]

Even though it was an accident the sheer stupidity and lack off attention by this driver that resulted in the death of two children then she deserves to be charged for what she has done
How would you feel if it was your child had been killed by this drivers recklessness and she got away with a fine and a slap on the wrist.

[Eevo]

Even though it was an accident the sheer stupidity and lack off attention by this driver that resulted in the death of two children then she deserves to be charged for what she has done
How would you feel if it was your child had been killed by this drivers recklessness and she got away with a fine and a slap on the wrist.


nothing will bring the kids back.

how does the driver going to jail help anyone?

[trout1105]

Not in the car park, the driver drove into the staff only area to drop a child off. And before we jump to whatever, the driver was working with children, so perhaps was entitled to be there. So sad on so many levels. Calm heads must prevail.

I am Not saying the driver had No right to be where she was, What I am saying is that this driver acted stupidly and recklessly and deserves to be jailed for this insane bit of driving that resulted in the death of two innocent children that has destroyed two families.
The actions of this driver are unforgiveable.

[trout1105]

nothing will bring the kids back.

how does the driver going to jail help anyone?

It will keep the useless bastard off the road for one thing and it will give the families some sort of Closure as I imagine that if this driver gets off with a bit of suspension and a fine they would be bitterly disappointed in that sort of decision by the courts.
Besides all that by going to jail it should enforce a lot more care and attention from this driver when she next gets behind the wheel.

[pop058]

nothing will bring the kids back.

how does the driver going to jail help anyone?

Might stop another incident from occurring.

[bob10]

I am Not saying the driver had No right to be where she was, What I am saying is that this driver acted stupidly and recklessly and deserves to be jailed for this insane bit of driving that resulted in the death of two innocent children that has destroyed two families.
The actions of this driver are unforgiveable.

Don't you think the police should determine that, and not some random angry human on a key board?

[bob10]

Might stop another incident from occurring.
The second time you have made little sense.

[trout1105]

Don't you think the police should determine that, and not some random angry human on a key board?

The Police don't determine the punishment and nether do I, The Police just lay the charges and the courts decide what happens.
Yes I do get angry when an act of stupidity or inattention results in the death of innocents, Don't you?

[bob10]

The Police don't determine the punishment and nether do I, The Police just lay the charges and the courts decide what happens.
Yes I do get angry when an act of stupidity or inattention results in the death of innocents, Don't you?

Cheap shot, mate. And, time you looked in the mirror.

School tragedy boy's family forgive driver on day of funeral (https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/school-tragedy-boys-family-forgive-driver-on-day-of-funeral/ar-BBEKESN?ocid=spartandhp)

[trout1105]

Cheap shot, mate. And, time you looked in the mirror.

School tragedy boy's family forgive driver on day of funeral (https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/school-tragedy-boys-family-forgive-driver-on-day-of-funeral/ar-BBEKESN?ocid=spartandhp)

Not a cheap shot at all Mate, If I did something as stupid as this I would expect to wear the consequences of my actions.
WTF is "time you looked in the mirror" supposed to mean?
It is So easy to be magnanimous about something that doesn't directly affect me or you But lets face reality this woman did a reckless act and should be held accountable for that action it's as simple as that.
Taking personal digs at me is childish and I find it to be offensive simply because I have a different opinion about this incident than you do.

[Bearman]

Please keep it civil fellas. As you all know personal attacks will not be tolerated. The whole thing is very sad and not a nice subject to be making assumptions on.

[Eevo]

It will keep the useless bastard off the road for one thing and it will give the families some sort of Closure as I imagine that if this driver gets off with a bit of suspension and a fine they would be bitterly disappointed in that sort of decision by the courts.
Besides all that by going to jail it should enforce a lot more care and attention from this driver when she next gets behind the wheel.

can keep her off the road by taking away her licence.


if i was the magistrate, loss of licence for 10 years and 5 years jail suspended sentence.

[bob10]

Not a cheap shot at all Mate, If I did something as stupid as this I would expect to wear the consequences of my actions.
WTF is "time you looked in the mirror" supposed to mean?
It is So easy to be magnanimous about something that doesn't directly affect me or you But lets face reality this woman did a reckless act and should be held accountable for that action it's as simple as that.
Taking personal digs at me is childish and I find it to be offensive simply because I have a different opinion about this incident than you do.
A

t this point in time, no one knows how this actually happened. The point I make is key board warriors should hold off being judge jury and executioner , and leave that to the professionals. We live under the rule of law, not rule of the keyboard. Have some thought for how this poor woman must feel. It is not as though she did it on purpose. As for look in the mirror, you were set to hang this women, while the family of one boy were set to forgive. And why? their religion. The much maligned Muslim religion , that mainstream Australia vilifies, teaches them to forgive. I'm sure the woman will be treated equally as any other under the law of the Nation. But no punishment man can dish out, will equal the horror this poor women must feel. All I ask is, hold off on your keyboard kangaroo courts, until the facts are known. Not having a go at you, BTW, just the internet warriors who jump all over incidents like this, before the facts are known.

Father of boy killed in Sydney school smash forgives driver (http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/state/nsw/2017/11/09/banksia-greenacre-sydney-school-crash-father-forgives/)

[trout1105]

I imagine that this woman IS feeling pretty awful at the moment But unless there has been some sort of catastrophic mechanical failure/incident then this woman IS responsible for her actions and should be dealt with accordingly.
When driving around Any school Extreme caution Must be used at all times and it appears that this wasn't the case in this instance and for someone with 19 grandkids that are at school or will be going there shortly I find this to be inexcusable and thoughtless.
BTW I personally do Not hold Any religious beliefs and yet I forgave the idiot woman that drove on the wrong side of the road that caused the death of a good Mate and put me in hospital with a ruined arm/hand So religion has Nothing to do with forgiveness as far as I am concerned.
In this instance the woman Did spend some time incarcerated But at the end of the day she was deported and will never be able to make the same mistake again in Australia.

[Pickles2]

With respect to floor mats etc, I've found that driving in thongs has caused an issue with me from time to time,..catching on the mats, slipping around on my foot etc, so I don't drive in thongs any more.
Pickles.

[trout1105]

With respect to floor mats etc, I've found that driving in thongs has caused an issue with me from time to time,..catching on the mats, slipping around on my foot etc, so I don't drive in thongs any more.
Pickles.

I have never worn thongs as I think that they would be rather uncomfortable and creep up my bum [bigwhistle][bigrolf]

[PAT303]

I'd like to add my 2c,I have been dropping my kids off at school for a while now,I have to drive past their school to get to uni,all I will say is I'm not supprised this happened.The level of driving skill I see is appalling,dumb bimbo's in active wear talking to each other through open windows,racing at speed through car parks to catch up to some other active wear wearing bimbo to talk about pointless ****,not being able to simply drive in and out of the car park without jumping gutters/gardens/each other,having no situational awareness at any point of the drop off and my personal favourate,talking on the phone during the whole process.My son Declan has almost been hit twice while on the crossing by stupid bimbo's in a 10km/hr zone,the second time the stupid bitch gave him a mouth full for almost hitting her car,lucky dad wasn't there,or her car would have been damaged.If we are going to ban people for stupid driving it's going to get busy real quick. Pat

[Wraithe]

Pat303, you would have laughed at this stupid woman that made a complaint about me picking up my little brother and niece from there local primary school...

She complained about me using the prime mover to get the kids on my way to my mothers place.. Her complaint was she had to slow right down to go past the truck...This was right out the front of the school...
Principle was laughing so much she had trouble telling me about the complaint... The stupid woman drove a 4wd and would roar off once her kids where on board, so the principle asked if I could drop by more often as it was safer when the truck was there...

I suppose if it was in a suburb in the city I would be in trouble tho...Luckily it was rural... But then, it was over 20 years ago, so i presume nothing has got better...

The side line to this, is my niece and brother got to ride in the Kenworth every month or so and could tell stories to all the other kids, next day...

[V8Ian]

Anyone who can lose control of a vehicle, within a school ground, to the extent that the vehicle smashes through a building, is totally incompetent, regardless of their religion, gender, nationality, age, sexual orientation or anything else! They deserve a severe punishment.

[cuppabillytea]

Anyone who can lose control of a vehicle, within a school ground, to the extent that the vehicle smashes through a building, is totally incompetent, regardless of their religion, gender, nationality, age, sexual orientation or anything else! They deserve a severe punishment.

I'd prefer neglegent to incompetent.
If the authorities charge someone with incompetence their defence can be: You declared me competent when you issued my licence. Therefor I will sue you for letting me loose on the road before I was competent.
This might have a positive effect over all in the long term but the driver will get off in this intense, scot free.

[trout1105]

I'd prefer neglegent to incompetent.
If the authorities charge someone with incompetence their defence can be: You declared me competent when you issued my licence. Therefor I will sue you for letting me loose on the road before I was competent.
This might have a positive effect over all in the long term but the driver will get off in this intense, scot free.

I would think that dangerous and irrisponsible would describe the drivers actions more accurately

[V8Ian]

Fair point Billy, I wonder how many people have had overseas qualifications RPLed, or are still driving with a foreign licence though.

[cuppabillytea]

I would think that dangerous and irrisponsible would describe the drivers actions more accurately
Yes. That as well.


Fair point Billy, I wonder how many people have had overseas qualifications RPLed, or are still driving with a foreign licence though.

Quite a lot. I'd say. There seems to be a lot of confusion in greater Sydney, as to what exactly are the rules and this confusion seems to escalate in bad weather.

[scarry]

Yes. That as well.



Quite a lot. I'd say. There seems to be a lot of confusion in greater Sydney, as to what exactly are the rules and this confusion seems to escalate in bad weather.


We are on the road most of the day,and i recon 50% the road users have absolutely no idea of the road rules,and the other 48% seem to be in dream world,not paying attention.

FWIW,and i know it would be an inconvenience to many,but i recon mandatory exams on road rules,say every 5 yrs,should be implemented.
Fail and license cancelled.

[V8Ian]

Paul, suspend their licence until the written test has been passed, with only one shot every seven days. With a 100% for a pass, that would encourage people to study and know the rules before the test.
I still believe attitude is a greater problem than not knowing haw far to park from a letter box. Too many drivers consider themselves privileged.

[scarry]

I am sure some attitude type questions could be in the test.

Correct,suspension would be fairer than cancellation.

Could be done on line.

Our electrical test we have to do every 5 yrs(or it could be 3,i will have to check),has to have 100% pass rate,we do it on line.

Something needs to be done,a test would probably reduce more accidents than a copper hiding behind a bush at the bottom of a hill,with a speed gun.

[V8Ian]

As with any test done on line, anyone can do it for anyone else.

[trog]

Fair point Billy, I wonder how many people have had overseas qualifications RPLed, or are still driving with a foreign licence though.

I drove for a long while on my Ontario licence. A transfer to nsw cost a lot of cash due to the fact I had to get papers sent over proving it was legit and the truck licence was valid as the date on the licence only had the renewal date , not when I actually qualified.
Now that the roadworks are done opposite my place , there is no stop or give way sign marked pedestrian crossing , just a yellow no parking.
My guess this is more of a danger than my initial driving on overseas papers.

[trout1105]

Letting people drive in Australia using overseas licences/qualifications is a seriously flawed idea.
I have had first hand experience of their ineptitude and I also carry the scars to prove it.

[Pinelli]

Not a reflection on this particular incident. But the things you see parents do in car parks when they want to get away quickly.

I work at a school, and one the most worst parents I came across was on the phone (phone in hand, not hands free), while reversing in the school car park, in his brand new BMW, when a kid ran out behind him. Luckily he noticed in time and slammed the brakes on, but before I was able to gently suggest he stay off his phone in the school car park, he had a serious go at me and suggested we needed to do a better job of keeping the kids off the road in the car park. I mean, there's only 1500 of them.

I had to go and let the Principal know that he might be getting a parental complain after I had finished letting this bastard know what I thought of his suggestion.

[trog]

Letting people drive in Australia using overseas licences/qualifications is a seriously flawed idea.
I have had first hand experience of their ineptitude and I also carry the scars to prove it.

From memory my over seas licence was more stringent to obtain than a nsw one the truck licence testing was a joke. No circle check , air brake knowledge or much more than go that way and don't hit anything.

[trout1105]

From memory my over seas licence was more stringent to obtain than a nsw one the truck licence testing was a joke. No circle check , air brake knowledge or much more than go that way and don't hit anything.

Hmmm, I will defer to our truckie brethren here to answer that particular one.[bigwhistle]
However would you consider that a drivers licence from Lebanon, Jakarta, India, and Many other countries to be as stringent especially when in many countries licences and educational qualifications can be obtained with someone else doing the tests and exams, This Was (and maybe still is) a problem with new Australians getting others to obtain their drivers licences for them.

[trog]

I Guess if i could have had a lookalike do my test I would have been better off financially and time wise but I only look like me , not someone else. Though quite often fit asked at the Coogee bay if I was some local singer.

[trout1105]

I Guess if i could have had a lookalike do my test I would have been better off financially and time wise but I only look like me , not someone else. Though quite often fit asked at the Coogee bay if I was some local singer.

Norman Gunston? [bigrolf][bigrolf]

[trog]

Nah my hair was much longer and darker then. If I had liked his tunes I would have named names .
Still some of the young fellows I work with now seem to have not much understanding of road rules , reading of traffic or even a nap are sent out as professional drivers. And the employers seem happy. No different than anything else that gets the job done or the red tape eliminated.

[cuppabillytea]

Little Patty?

[V8Ian]

Wrong accent, must've been Anne Murray. [wink11]

[trog]

Getting close 🎸

[ATH]

From personal observation it appears that many drivers are deemed competent to pass the test but that's where their competence ends and they never improve. I go past a high school and primary every day and always slow down for the 40 limit and in one spot get passed by others who then swerve left across the front of me to go in to the high school to drop their kids off!
What is the big rush to save just a few seconds? One problem in this instance is that you can see down the road to where the cops stand with their radar and if there isn't one visible that seems to be the signal for many drivers to ignore the speed limit.
Haven't seen a cop there for ages so obviously they must think it's a safe zone and drivers are all obeying the rules.
AlanH.

[tact]

Fair point Billy, I wonder how many people have had overseas qualifications RPLed, or are still driving with a foreign licence though.

[...]Quite a lot. I'd say. There seems to be a lot of confusion in greater Sydney, as to what exactly are the rules and this confusion seems to escalate in bad weather.


I got my licence at 17yo in QLD and never lost it, never been cancelled or suspended. That was over 40yrs ago and I have never been forced to retest. So far no different to a lot of people my age I am sure. About 30yrs ago I moved to Canberra and at some point my QLD licence was converted to ACT licence.

Some of you will know I lived much of the last 20yrs overseas (Malaysia) and recently moved back home to OZ bringing some imports (Wife, son, and Defender all made in Malaysia). ("recently" - its now just over a year! Seems like just weeks.)

In due course I got a Malaysian driving licence (all motor cars and all motorbikes) simply issued on the strength of my Australian ACT licence. Then I let my Australian licence expire. It ran on and then expired about 13yrs ago.

It looked like my wife and I would face the same requirements to get our Malaysian licences converted to Australian licences (NSW): Not the full learner process - Just do the driver knowledge test, then a practical driving test. Passing meant getting full open NSW licences.

I did the driver knowledge test. Passed 100% as one ought. Then fronted up at the appointed time for my driving test - the tester noted my answer to the "have you ever held an Australian licence before" question - and suggested it is very likely I don't need to do ANY tests..... a quick phone call to the ACT equivalent to RMS to validate, then I am sent away with a shiny new NSW licence.

(Wife not so lucky - she had to do the tests. She passed her knowledge test and has failed (just by a whisker) her first road test)

Sorry for the long lead up describing the current system as actually implemented for some foreign countries. Note: Malaysia falls outside of the shorter list of countries that qualify for direct conversion - no testing at all.

A couple of low hanging fruit in that long tale:
1. its been 40+ yrs since I got my licence and never had to do any further testing
Comments: Not sure this is a bad thing. 40yrs experience on the road delivers far more than studying and practicing for some ****ant number of hours to pass a couple of tests.

However....(!)

2. In my case - of the 40yrs since I first got an Australian driving licence, I spent almost 20 of those years driving near enough exclusively in SEA. The different driving skills/habits learned in my last 20 years of driving experience could be considered incompatible with the skills/habits needed in Australia!


Conclusions:
I think this is the real problem that needs to be addressed regarding foreign drivers getting on to Australian roads
- the skills/habits/mindset needed for success on the road (no accidents, loss of life) in some foreign countries are VASTLY different to the skills/habits/mindset needed for success/survival on Australian roads. (....or other similar western countries)

Here is just one example of a fundamental difference between driving in Malaysia (...and many other asian nations) as compared to driving in Australia (...and many other similar nations):
- In Malaysia pedestrians look after themselves. They know that even on pedestrian crossings, even with traffic lights, they cannot be guaranteed it is safe to cross a road. Getting run over in your own driveway, adults or infants, is unheard of. Pedestrians take responsibility for their own survival, and parents responsibility to inculcate these skills into their kids.
- In Australia it is vastly different. Pedestrians step out onto roads and driveways with almost reckless abandon confident in what they may falsely think is a shared understanding with car drivers - that drivers look out for and avoid pedestrians.

One of the stark, even scary, aspects of my assimilation back into Australian driving has been the need to constantly remind myself to look out for pedestrians as they do not look out for themselves. After a year back, mostly remembering - I frightened myself and a pedestrian just a few days ago as I forgot to stop BEFORE crossing the footpath when coming up a basement carpark ramp.

There are many other examples and some can be written up quiet hilariously (road markings and signage all being largely ignored....etc).

My point is that one can study and practice for a test - Whether its once in a lifetime, or every 5yrs makes no difference, it takes just hours of effort. But it takes 5yrs to get 5yrs worth of driving experience. But what kind of experience has an experienced driver gotten in his last 5yrs?:
- If a person's driving experience is relevant to the Australian road safety mindset then simply granting equivalent licence is perhaps good enough.
- If a person's driving experience is relevant to completely dissimilar assumptions then rigorous and focussed testing would be needed and still does not guarantee a good outcome.
- I think the current process recognises this to a degree (some countries don't need to do any tests, some do).


In my case, honestly: 20yrs driving in a region where assumptions are not compatible with the Australian road safety mindset (e.g. pedestrians look out for themselves so much as to be a non-problem). I should not have been granted an Australian licence just because I had one decades before.

[Saitch]

:arms::arms::arms::twobeers::twobeers:

[RANDLOVER]

".......In my case, honestly: 20yrs driving in a region where assumptions are not compatible with the Australian road safety mindset (e.g. pedestrians look out for themselves so much as to be a non-problem). I should not have been granted an Australian licence just because I had one decades before.[/QUOTE]

Pedestrians are really becoming a problem, a lot more are listening to Ipods (or similar) or looking at their mobile phones, while walking out in front of traffic.

[Homestar]

".......In my case, honestly: 20yrs driving in a region where assumptions are not compatible with the Australian road safety mindset (e.g. pedestrians look out for themselves so much as to be a non-problem). I should not have been granted an Australian licence just because I had one decades before.

Pedestrians are really becoming a problem, a lot more are listening to Ipods (or similar) or looking at their mobile phones, while walking out in front of traffic.[/QUOTE]

Happened to me yesterday - exactly that. Guy was wearing earphones and doing something on his phone, walked out onto the road as I was turning into the street he was about to cross. I saw it coming and stopped, he was half way across the road before he looked - then nearly **** himself as my bullbar was a foot from him. Had he done done this in front of distracted driver (like someone on their phone) he would be in hospital now or dead.

[trog]

As I have said before , if footpaths weren't used as parking spaces , there would be less time spent walking on the road. I look out my window now and see about 3 cars on and across the only footpath on the road . On is a council ute . Council and police don't seem to think it is worth ticketing .

[Homestar]

They're red hot on it down here - easy money. About once every 3 months the council will do a drive through every street with a camera car. Any vehicle on a nature strip, on a footpath or parked across the footpath get a fine in the mail - it's easy to see when this has been done as everyone all of a sudden parks legally through the whole town for a few weeks until they go back to doing what they used to do. [emoji16]

[Tins]

Slightly off topic, I picked up a worm car from Toyota Service the other week and they had removed the aftermarket floor mat (the ones with the raised edges) and placed it in the back foot well....the interesting part was they have a printed card that slips over the rear vision mirror highlighting the dangers of ill fitting floor mats.

Common practice these days, I believe. My daughter had the same thing happen. Also a Toyota, so maybe it's a Toyota thing.

[cuppabillytea]

Pedestrians are really becoming a problem, a lot more are listening to Ipods (or similar) or looking at their mobile phones, while walking out in front of traffic.

Happened to me yesterday - exactly that. Guy was wearing earphones and doing something on his phone, walked out onto the road as I was turning into the street he was about to cross. I saw it coming and stopped, he was half way across the road before he looked - then nearly **** himself as my bullbar was a foot from him. Had he done done this in front of distracted driver (like someone on their phone) he would be in hospital now or dead.[/QUOTE]

Exactly the same thing happened to me. When my bloke caught me in the corner of his eye, he nearly jumped high enough to clear my car but had I been distracted he'd me red mush on the road.

[trog]

Curious to learn , what exactly are the laws re pedestrians and crossing the road. Perhaps ignorance or defaulting to what I was originally taught , it seems I am out of step . A few that I would like clarification on , unless different in each state ;
If walking along the footpath , vehicles wishing to cross must give way ?
If no marked crossing corner to corner is fine , and if already crossing vehicles must give way ?
It seems from what I see daily from my window is a mixture of different procedures of who yields to who. Though most often it seems to be vehicles exerting physical dominance over pedestrians . Thanks

[Wraithe]

Curious to learn , what exactly are the laws re pedestrians and crossing the road. Perhaps ignorance or defaulting to what I was originally taught , it seems I am out of step . A few that I would like clarification on , unless different in each state ;
If walking along the footpath , vehicles wishing to cross must give way ?
If no marked crossing corner to corner is fine , and if already crossing vehicles must give way ?
It seems from what I see daily from my window is a mixture of different procedures of who yields to who. Though most often it seems to be vehicles exerting physical dominance over pedestrians . Thanks

Road Safety Commission - Pedestrians (https://www.rsc.wa.gov.au/Road-Rules/Browse/Pedestrians)

That is the road safety council brief about pedestrian rules and fines...

Only thing I know for sure is, if your at a pedestrian crossing that has an island, you can move on once all pedestrians clear your side of the road... Beyond that, I just give way... Bad habit from driving all the time, too easy for them to get hurt and I dont wish that, even if they are idiots at the time...

[tact]

Road Safety Commission - Pedestrians (https://www.rsc.wa.gov.au/Road-Rules/Browse/Pedestrians)

That is the road safety council brief about pedestrian rules and fines...

Only thing I know for sure is, if your at a pedestrian crossing that has an island, you can move on once all pedestrians clear your side of the road... Beyond that, I just give way... Bad habit from driving all the time, too easy for them to get hurt and I dont wish that, even if they are idiots at the time...

The NSW equivalent. Pedestrian crossings - Road rules - Safety & rules - Roads - Roads and Maritime Services (http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roads/safety-rules/road-rules/pedestrians.html)

[trog]

Road Safety Commission - Pedestrians (https://www.rsc.wa.gov.au/Road-Rules/Browse/Pedestrians)

That is the road safety council brief about pedestrian rules and fines...

Only thing I know for sure is, if your at a pedestrian crossing that has an island, you can move on once all pedestrians clear your side of the road... Beyond that, I just give way... Bad habit from driving all the time, too easy for them to get hurt and I dont wish that, even if they are idiots at the time...

Thanks for that , it is much as I had thought it to be, therefore from what I see then in most cases it is the driver at fault. In the past few minutes alone I have just seen a few people nearly run down while crossing the street opposite from cars failing to slow down to turn or notice that someone was already crossing.
Likewise I prefer to give way , saves hassles , guilt and the sum total of time added to the journey isn't that great.