Driver Under Instruction

[NavyDiver]

'Driver under instruction' the sign said. While turning right from the right hand lane into the right hand lane I was a bit surprised to be braking to avoid hitting the car from the left hand lane who came over to the Right hand lane. No looking or indication. I am pretty sure he had no clue he did it. The look of fear from the instructor and a passenger from the back seat suggested I was not the only one a bit surprised. The guy in the back seat was looking at my bullbar at a very close range. A few hundred meters away I was beside the car and saw the instructors check list. A lot of X and only one or two ticks. The grey beard senior driving proved pigeon holing younger drivers as bad is a gross generalisation. I wonder if he passed or if pants in that car needed changing?



My pants remained fine. The other two might be questionable.

[Wraithe]

Probably both... Some people should not be driving and some who have driven before should never have been on the road...

My mothers Aunty got her license for the first time at 74yo... Mum's uncle was no longer able to walk, let alone drive thus Aunty Billy had to get her license....

The Police examiner thought she was doing the test to maintain her license, so she quite politely explained she had only been driving for 4 weeks and last time she drove was over 50 years before and that was a horse and sulky from Widgemiltha to Salmon gums(between kalgoorlie and Esperance)...

She said he dropped his pen and pad and hung onto the door and seat until the test was over, she passed...

She deserved her license unlike a lot that are on the road...

PS, she had to quit drinking beer to get her license, she had been drinking beer since she was a young child(Coolgardie born and raised, beer was cheaper than water) first middie was for breakfast and that continued til bedtime...

[travelrover]

In recent years i have noticed a vast increase in the number of drivers on our roads who have 'gained' their license through fair means or fowl in their country of origin who have zero comprehension of not only the road rules here but consequences of their actions. Having lived in south east asia for a number years i would think Singapore is probably the only country where you can not 'buy' a drivers license, and even there i have seen some absolutely dumb driving. Some reports i have seen say 99% of drivers on the road in india do not have a real licence. Though having a real license doesnt mean by any means you are a competent driver. I would not be suprised if the figures were the same in the Philippines, Thailand, Indonesia etc....

A friend of mine took their licence test in the Philippines and all they had to do was drive about 400 meter (in an auto) in traffic. It seems relatively easy for them to use whatever they have to get a license here without going through the whole L and P process.

Certainly makes driving in parts of Sydney more challenging than it needs to be and I feel for truckies that have to avoid them. Just keeping left would be a big start.

[tact]

In recent years i have noticed a vast increase in the number of drivers on our roads who have 'gained' their license through fair means or fowl in their country of origin who have zero comprehension of not only the road rules here but consequences of their actions. Having lived in south east asia for a number years i would think Singapore is probably the only country where you can not 'buy' a drivers license, and even there i have seen some absolutely dumb driving. Some reports i have seen say 99% of drivers on the road in india do not have a real licence. Though having a real license doesnt mean by any means you are a competent driver. I would not be suprised if the figures were the same in the Philippines, Thailand, Indonesia etc....

A friend of mine took their licence test in the Philippines and all they had to do was drive about 400 meter (in an auto) in traffic. It seems relatively easy for them to use whatever they have to get a license here without going through the whole L and P process.

Certainly makes driving in parts of Sydney more challenging than it needs to be and I feel for truckies that have to avoid them. Just keeping left would be a big start.

I recently wrote a longish boring post in another thread basically suggesting that in some other countries there are some basic concepts that are diametrically opposed to what is the reality in Australia (and similar countries). (my personal experiences come from 19yrs living and working, and driving, in SEA too...)

(The linky clicky thing is here for that thread if interested - https://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/255597-how-earth-does-happen-7.html#post2740530 )

In that post I am referring to examples like - in SEA typically pedestrians own their own safety wherever they may come in close proximity with vehicles - To the extent that even very good drivers operate their vehicles on the understanding that pedestrians look after themselves. It is like an unwritten social contract, so to speak, mutual expectation. Pedestrians thus are basically a non-issue in some places overseas.

I guess that idea (self preservation in SEA being different to what people in Oz understand it to mean) could extend further than behaviour on and around roads. In life generally there is little or no safety net, no nanny state, etc... but I digress.

Not so in Oz. Here there is no such unwritten "social contract" or expectation that pedestrians will look after themselves. Quite the contrary - so much is written down and mandated that pedestrians can feel much safer being careless on or around roads/carparks etc. This is not a bad thing! Just highlighting that some visitors/migrants to our shores may come from an environment where certain assumptions are vastly divergent to what is the norm here.

(another example would be - Here one expects lane discipline of all fellow road users. In other environments lane markings are assumed by all to be only for the guidance of fools. And where all practice under same assumptions/rules , whatever they are, things can work well)

Layer on top of that the issues you highlight above - about sham or meaningless licencing and enforcement. Fairly sure one could get a DL in parts of rural Malaysia for the price of a chicken (ref. your "fair or fowl" comment.) [biggrin]

[Mick_Marsh]

Certainly makes driving in parts of Sydney more challenging than it needs to be and I feel for truckies that have to avoid them. Just keeping left would be a big start.
Car drivers, truck drivers, caravaners, motor cyclists and cyclists knowing and understanding the current road rules would be the best start.

[Tins]

Car drivers, truck drivers, caravaners, motor cyclists and cyclists knowing and understanding the current road rules would be the best start.

Knowing and understanding the rules is fine, but actually obeying them would be even better.

[Mick_Marsh]

Knowing and understanding the rules is fine, but actually obeying them would be even better.
Problem solved.

[travelrover]

I recently wrote a longish boring post in another thread basically suggesting that in some other countries there are some basic concepts that are diametrically opposed to what is the reality in Australia (and similar countries). (my personal experiences come from 19yrs living and working, and driving, in SEA too...)

(The linky clicky thing is here for that thread if interested - https://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/255597-how-earth-does-happen-7.html#post2740530 )

In that post I am referring to examples like - in SEA typically pedestrians own their own safety wherever they may come in close proximity with vehicles - To the extent that even very good drivers operate their vehicles on the understanding that pedestrians look after themselves. It is like an unwritten social contract, so to speak, mutual expectation. Pedestrians thus are basically a non-issue in some places overseas.

I guess that idea (self preservation in SEA being different to what people in Oz understand it to mean) could extend further than behaviour on and around roads. In life generally there is little or no safety net, no nanny state, etc... but I digress.

Not so in Oz. Here there is no such unwritten "social contract" or expectation that pedestrians will look after themselves. Quite the contrary - so much is written down and mandated that pedestrians can feel much safer being careless on or around roads/carparks etc. This is not a bad thing! Just highlighting that some visitors/migrants to our shores may come from an environment where certain assumptions are vastly divergent to what is the norm here.

(another example would be - Here one expects lane discipline of all fellow road users. In other environments lane markings are assumed by all to be only for the guidance of fools. And where all practice under same assumptions/rules , whatever they are, things can work well)

Layer on top of that the issues you highlight above - about sham or meaningless licencing and enforcement. Fairly sure one could get a DL in parts of rural Malaysia for the price of a chicken (ref. your "fair or fowl" comment.) [biggrin]Hi tact

Yup all true!! Another 'observation' is the perpencity to pretend they don't see other vehicles or pedestrians. The 'if i dont see you then you are not there' approach but amazingly seems to work most of the time, and the way traffic signals (stop signs and traffic lights, etc) are completely ignored, as is driving on the correct side of the road.

I was in Medan, Sumatra a few years ago being driven along a 6 lane road, three lanes each way, then all of a sudden i noticed all the traffic was going one way, fortunately the same way we were.

Another time driving from Mumbai to Pune my driver was overtaking busses and trucks on the wrong side of the road on a blind right hand bend at 100kph!

You do see plenty of road carnage, just hope they keep it there.......

[AndyG]

Recently we had the licensing people visit us, its an annual thing, renewals only and they do a few 100. One chap obtained licenses for his 4 and 6 year old, so may question the integrity of the system

[Tombie]

Spot on Tact!!!
I enjoy driving in Thailand - it’s easy! Just follow the guidelines [emoji41]
(Heading back in 2 weeks time)

It’s not aggressive, nobody wants to jump out and punch you, people yield... for what looks to be chaos there is actually a very good philosophy.

[NavyDiver]

In recent years i have noticed a vast increase in the number of drivers on our roads who have 'gained' their license through fair means or fowl in their country of origin who have zero comprehension of not only the road rules here but consequences of their actions.

I had a military licences at 16, cars, Trucks and Busses, NSW motor bike at the same time. I drove a car to Five DocK or Burwood licensing place when I was about 20 and upset the instructor who failed my driving test. He was even unhappier when I drove away ( legally) He failed me again before the driving test when I went back. I rode to Vic and got my full drivers licence. Being a smarty pants with a driving assessor is not a great way of getting a civilian licence. [biggrin]
132281
I am a person who " 'gained' their (my) license(s) through (both) fair means or (&) fowl" [biggrin][biggrin][biggrin]

[Tombie]

Same!!!

[BMKal]

132281
I am a person who " 'gained' their (my) license(s) through (both) fair means or (&) fowl" [biggrin][biggrin][biggrin]

So .............. at least one of your licences was won in a chook raffle ????? :woot:

[travelrover]

So .............. at least one of your licences was won in a chook raffle ????? :woot:

I think that was more the stupid autocorrection than use of an incorrect word :-)

[jx2mad]

I was driving south on the M7 a few days ago. The traffic was heavy and the speed reduced to 80k/h. There was a bank up of semi's in the left lane and I was in a line of vehicles in the right lane, slowly overtaking the semi's. Behind me a fire engine was trying to get throught the mess under lights and siren. Unable to pull into the left lane because of the traffic I pulled off to the right and proceeded slowly along on the grass with left wheels on the edge of the tar outside of the lane marking. The fire engine passed with a crocodile of vehicles glued to its tail. It took nearly a minuite before some nice 4wd driver allowed me to pull back into the lane, even though I had had my blinkers on all the time. I just managed to get back before a steel drainage grate appeared. This would have stopped me completely.

[Bigbjorn]

Go drive in Saudi Arabia for a fright. If you say the travel prayer you can race the train to the level crossing and no need to wear the seat belts. In'sh Allah. You only get hurt or killed if it is God's will. They drive both directions in one way streets and if wide enough another lane or two in the middle. Park anywhere even if you block the road. No such thing as a full bus or truck in rural areas. Always room for more.

[tact]

Go drive in Saudi Arabia for a fright. If you say the travel prayer you can race the train to the level crossing and no need to wear the seat belts. In'sh Allah. You only get hurt or killed if it is God's will. They drive both directions in one way streets and if wide enough another lane or two in the middle. Park anywhere even if you block the road. No such thing as a full bus or truck in rural areas. Always room for more.

Heh was in a taxi once between Dubai and Abu Dhabi. Thought the taxi driver was mad enough cruising along between 170-180 in his late model Chevy V8. Then a 200 series LC sporting huge tyres looking all the world like aircraft landing tyres overtook us rather briskly!

[NavyDiver]

I think that was more the stupid autocorrection than use of an incorrect word :-)
Nope I fouled up my fowls but thanks for the support [biggrin]
Regards Typo King AKA Navy Diver

[p38arover]

A friend of mine took their licence test in the Philippines and all they had to do was drive about 400 meter (in an auto) in traffic.

That's further than I had to ride a motorcycle at the old Dept of Motor Transport office at Rosebery, Sydney, when I went for my bike licence in about 1966. Yes, I got the licence.

[austastar]

Hi,
In the late 60s a friend living in one of the higher suburbs of Hobart arrived for his motorcycle test one snowy winters morning at the traffic desk.
The army great coat he was wearing had collected a fair load of snow on the ride in.
The usual test was a couple of figure 8s in the parking lot and a run up the road, around the roundabout and if you returned - well you could ride.
The testing officer glanced up at this snowy apparition in the window of his cosy office and asked "Where have you come from?"
"Ferntree"
Well you can obviously ride a bike, no need for a test, take this to the cashier and pay for your licence"


Cheers

[jx2mad]

My father worked in Alice Springs during the war. He drove large trucks carrying material to extend the length of the airstrip. On his arrival back in Parramatta he thought that he should get a driving licence so he went to the police station. He was asked if he had driven any vehicles and said that he had driven trucks in the N.T. They gave him a class 3 licence without even testing him.

[p38arover]

Go drive in Saudi Arabia for a fright.

In Riyadh, I used to blast off from the traffic lights to get in front of the locals! [bigsmile]

[Wraithe]

Bit like my Tank license, then a truck license...

Started tank course, told Sgt he was wrong about some info he was saying about tank... Raeme Cpl rocked up and told Sgt that I was right and that I had borrowed the Engine Manual while waiting for driver course... Then I made a stupid mistake, told the other 2 on course with me tthat I had worked on stations and home farm, tank was just faster and easier to drive than our dozers... I got to drive less than 4 hours on the course, but as the requirement was 12 or something, all my times had a 1 put in front...
As for the truck, officer asked if I could drive, I laughed(piece of cake), so he suggested I drive to drop off some stuff, on way back I asked if I could take a short cut, he crapped himself when I drove straight off the road over a drop, then across a creek and back up onto the road, saved about a half hour to get back to base... He was the transport officer, gave me a license next day, reconned if I could drive like that without supervision I was well and trully capable of handling the trucks... Never drove another truck in the service, but I didnt tell him I had a truck license already and was legal for roadtrains...

What gets me tho, the 2 on my driver course got there licenses yet couldnt drive a car and scared the crap out of you when they drove, no judgement of distance, no concept of stopping distance and no feel for the controls... Basicly slam the pedals each time... I would never have got back into a vehicle with them if I had a choice, after the course, thankfully, I never had to get into a vehicle with them...

Army licenses can be issued once the examiner has accepted you completed the course and drove to the minimum standard... But the instructor has to able to teach you the bits that are not part of the instructors book and give you those little bits of information that makes you be observant and smooth, if you dont have those skills then your just another wally driving a green vehicle and for th Army, thats all they need to operate, the good drivers are recognised sometines and that can make a difference...

Good typists, well thats impossible..

[Tins]

Spot on Tact!!!
I enjoy driving in Thailand - it’s easy! Just follow the guidelines [emoji41]
(Heading back in 2 weeks time)

It’s not aggressive, nobody wants to jump out and punch you, people yield... for what looks to be chaos there is actually a very good philosophy.

Could not agree more. It looks completely chaotic, but it works very well. I always believed that the high road toll came from having the whole family, two pigs and a dog on a postie bike, or 14 people in the back of a Rodeo ute, so that any accident will have bigger consequences.

As for the pedestrian thing, I've walked for miles around Bangkok. If I had behaved the way I would here then my travel insurance would have taken a beating. I just did what the locals do. No problem.