In the market for a 130 - Advice needed plz

[Ankaz]

Hi everyone

As the title says I'm in the market for a 130 Defender.
2007 - 2013 - was going to look at something a bit newer but looking in this age bracket leaves a bit for a few extra goodies.

I've never had any experience with the Defender so I just want some advice from those who have gone through it before.

I've been around to a few car yards and they've let me take them for a spin for an hour or so, which has a been good to be able to figure out if I wanted to start getting serious about finding one to suit.
As unique as they are with all the little quirks there's just something about driving them that's grabbed me.
A few I've test drove had been set up for touring with a fair few mods, but had done some work in the past judging by the condition of a few bits and pieces.

Just got some questions (probably a lot of questions by the time I finish this thread)

1 - There's one I've been eyeing off online for a while,
If after an inspection it ticks all the boxes do you think it's reasonable to ask to get it looked over by a LR specialist of my choice prior to purchase? at my cost of course
(it's in country Vic so it's not exactly round the corner for the fella)
I really don't want to miss something that will cost me plenty down the track.

2 - Can someone recommend a trustworthy LR mechanic that knows the in's & out's of anything to do with Defenders?
I'm in S/E Melb but will travel for a good mechanic.

3 - I do a lot of 4wding & camping in the Vic High Country so a lift is a must.
ARB suggested I go to a specialist because they don't like to do them.
What is the reason they're a bit tricky to do?
Anyone with experience with a 130 let me know how the long wheel base goes over the big washouts?

4 - Cons of running 35's full time - etc. handling - fuel - towing
Also do I have to look in to rim offset if I'm to change the rims?
I just cant get enough of 35's on Defenders.

5 - Best place to source parts & after market goodies - service & price
AUS - UK - SA

6 - I love a great sounding truck, whistling turbo & pounding intercooler when hitting the low range tracks.
What's the best way to achieve this?
Garret turbo - bigger intercooler - 3" exhaust??? I know it can be done because I've heard nasty sounding Defenders getting around.
Any other tricks?

7- If anyone comes across a good 130 or knows of one coming up for sale in the near future plz send me a personal message, It'd be greatly appreciated.

8 - Diff Lockers - I've had experience in the past with ARB Air lockers - what are some other options out there?

All & as many responses would be greatly appreciated

Thanks Everyone

[Summiitt]

Hey mate,
Im running several 130s for work in forestry Operations. We are in the Brindabellas, and Snowy Mountains, so all of our terrain is steep, with washouts and rock crawling.
One thing you must do with the 130s, is load them up. The suspension is designed to run at 3500kg all day, everyday. Im running 235/85/16 on 2 Utes, and 265/75 on another 3 Utes. The 130s run different standard springs to the 110 models. Id suggest to get your tyre/wheel choice sorted then run the vehicle loaded with the standard suspension and see what you think. Ive never had any dramas with clearance or a lack of traction, and don't run air lockers on any of the Utes..hope this helps.

[Tote]

I'm with Summitt, save the money on the 35s and the suspension lift and see if you can get it stuck. Pumas (allegedly)have issues with lifts but they are probably not necessary.
I've not had any issues with the ramp over angle on the 130
The UK is a reasonable source of parts, I brought in a set of ZU mags considerably cheaper than they can be had locally
I have a rear locker on my list but it's not desperate

Regards,

Tote

[Wicks89]

Ankaz,

Sounds like you're a man that knows what he wants. As others have said, defenders are pretty good from standard with the stock wheels and suspension.

I run 35s on my 130 and I think it just makes it! It was good on 33s, but it's even better on 35s.
Admittedly not regeared or locked yet, still very hard to get stuck.

I have a 2" lift with flexy coils, 5" shocks, superflex arms etc etc.

If I had my time again I would not lift it. Simply to keep the geometry standard and not have to worry about prop shafts etc.

I would instead put longer/better shocks in with non castor corrected superflex arms to just maximise the articulation.

As far as I know sound is all down to exhaust really, but its one of those things, like suspension:

If you're going to play with one part of the system, gotta deal with all of it.

I've learned this the hard way, what I mean is if you want a lift it's not just springs and shocks, all steering needs to be re-done to work properly.

Big exhaust or a tune really needs it all, (intercooler, egt etc etc).

Best thing would be to plan and budget accordingly!

[Zeros]

There's a very nice looking red 2007 130 in VIC on carsales right now: We've taken a wrong turn (https://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Land-Rover-Defender-2007/SSE-AD-5051414/?Cr=17) ...I'd buy it.

[POD]

When I bought my 130 I was coming from nearly 20 years of Range Rover ownership and a variety of 4wds before that; I was very concerned about what the extra 30 inches of wheelbase would do to offroad ability, we mostly get out into the VHC but also do some remote outback travel, have broken diffs etc over the years and I wanted this vehicle to be bulletproof. I upgraded all the driveline with ashcroft axles, CVs etc, also fitted their locker in the front- original owner had put an arb locker in the rear. With standard suspension and 7.50 /16 tyres I got it stuck once, sat hard on the l/r tank under the back. I fitted 255/85 tyres (33") and got the suspension lifted a little by Les Richmond automotive, they are not a defender fan but have the experience and stock to get it right. The tyres and lift made a big difference. I lead a group of blokes on a high-country trip each year about April, I scout and plan the trip to be as challenging as possible as that's what the boys want; I get a kick out of not using my diff locks and still managing everything that they all struggle with. One or two other vehicles (and drivers) are equally capable but the 130 always impresses me.
The big downfall of the 130 on high-country tracks is the turning circle; despite maximising the adjustment on the stops, it can take a 5-point turn to get around switchbacks where others get around in one go. I reckon rear-steer or fiddle brakes would be a fantastic addition.
With a suspension lift, a double-cardan front shaft is essential; I did mine at the same time as the lift, a mate with a 110 resisted but had to bite the bullet in the end after all manner of trouble. Just budget it in. The 33" tyres made a noticeable difference in braking, I expect 35" would result in unacceptable brake performance without brake mods.

BTW I think it's quite reasonable to get a vehicle inspected by an expert of your choice; you're not talking about buying an old Hyundai for $100 after all. Get it done by someone who understands they're working for YOU, not the seller.

Stay away from the ARB stuff, they are there to separate asian 4wd owners from their money. There are specialist LR outfitters such as Ashcrofts who will serve you far better.

[Ankaz]

Thx for all the info guys, exactly what I was after,

Summiitt it's nice to know they handle that sort of rough terrain under working conditions mate, I wont come close putting that sort of weight in the tub though,

Wicks I'm looking to build a very capable mean looking rig, but at the end of the day I'll be using it a lot so everything has to be practical for day to day use and very good off road, it's the reason I've gone down the 130 path.
As I said I just fkn luv a Defender on 35's but if it's not practical and come with to many down sides I guess i'll have to rethink.
How do you find them compared to 33's? on & off road.

Pod, thanks for the info buddy, has the Ashcroft gear handled to your expectations mate?
I'm not mechanically minded enough to be replacing things out in the bush and I often head out just me and the dog who's not the best with a spanner either.
My aim for this truck is to get it as bullet proof & capable as I can afford.
It also has to look and sound mean,
The turning circle will take some getting used to I think,

Zeros, I've had an eye on that one, you don't happen to know the fella who owns it?
Looks alright doesn't it.


All other opinions more than welcome and appreciated

[Mark130]

Good luck with the shopping Ankaz.
Hope I'm not railroading your thread but
Does anyone know is 4 wheel steering in the 130 is an option (not that I'm ready to go that far)
I thought I remember Maxidrive were advertising something about 15 years ago.
And I have a ARB locker in the back of my 130, that hasn't been used for a least 10 years.
Back in the day ARB were highly regarded. The only mention of them these days seems to be on the UK sites. Anything in particular that put them on the nose or has better options just come on the market?
Cheers
Mark

[Ankaz]

No worries Mark, the more I know the better.

Why haven't you used your rear locker for so long?

[Tins]

Back in the day ARB were highly regarded. The only mention of them these days seems to be on the UK sites. Anything in particular that put them on the nose or has better options just come on the market?
Cheers
Mark

Seems to me that ARB has gone to where the customer base is: people buying Asian built trucks that they will keep for the length of the lease and then buy another. It's hard to blame them really. However, now they are just another voice in the ever increasing cacophony of voices that are flooding that same market. Pretty soon Bunnings or someone will take it all over, and we will all be poorer for it. Seriously though, LR folk like us are in a backwater these days. Even Land Rover have abandoned us.

I think my plan will be to find the best Defender I can afford, get the accessories I want while I still can, and drive it until I no longer can.

Yet another thread going off topic. Sorry, Ankaz.

[MLD]

For what it’s worth. I run 35” rubber, 4.11 C&P, dual lockers, 11.5” travel suspension with superior engineering radius arms and cranked trailing arms, wide angle A frame joint and the list goes on and on. Having spent as much on mods as the initial purchase price i have come to this conclusion:

1) the 130 is an extremely competent 4wd, it rides ruts and wash outs better than the 110 i owed

2) save for the most extreme of rock climbing and technical driving the 130 will get you there and home in stock configuration

3) the 130 consumes camping equip with room to spare.

Having done the hard yards multiple times i strongly recommend this set up for all but the type of driving in item 2: i would fit 255/85 (33”) MT rubber on stock suspension with dual lockers and upgraded axles/CV’s. Upgrade the steering arm rods, the trailing arm rods, replace worn bushes with superpro bushes.

This set up in a Puma will avoid a ratio change to the C&P, the double carden front prop shaft for the lift, flogging out trailing arm bushes from the long travel suspension, the diff pegging of the C&P to handle 35” rubber. It will give you diff clearance, traction when crossed up and civility of km’s on the hwy. if you are concerned about Summit’s comments you can remove the inner rear coil and run an Alu tray. With a load of usual camping equip on the tray it will articulate nice and not try to kill you on the hwy. keep in mind a 130 has coils that give a 1” lift front and rear compared to a 110. Aftermarket lifts usually assume the shock length remains the same with factory mount, so they use a firmer coil with a similar to factory free length to avoid dislocation. Unless you do the research on coils you could end up with a coil suited to a 110 with no actual lift.

Congrats on choosing the 130

[Tins]

Ankaz, checkout Weeds' thread on air springs for the Deefer. Down on the left, at the bottom of the page, search AULRO only, enter air suspension defender or similar. I reckon it's going to be a 'must have' on any Deefer I get. There are a few systems about, something that amazed me, being a Disco man so far.

Airbag Man - Home (https://www.airbagman.com.au)

We now offer VB Air Suspension Systems for Defender 90, 110 and 130 - (http://www.neneoverland.co.uk/nene-news/we-now-offer-vb-air-suspension-systems-for-land-rover-defender/)

[Zeros]

Thx for all the info guys, exactly what I was after,

Summiitt it's nice to know they handle that sort of rough terrain under working conditions mate, I wont come close putting that sort of weight in the tub though,

Wicks I'm looking to build a very capable mean looking rig, but at the end of the day I'll be using it a lot so everything has to be practical for day to day use and very good off road, it's the reason I've gone down the 130 path.
As I said I just fkn luv a Defender on 35's but if it's not practical and come with to many down sides I guess i'll have to rethink.
How do you find them compared to 33's? on & off road.

Pod, thanks for the info buddy, has the Ashcroft gear handled to your expectations mate?
I'm not mechanically minded enough to be replacing things out in the bush and I often head out just me and the dog who's not the best with a spanner either.
My aim for this truck is to get it as bullet proof & capable as I can afford.
It also has to look and sound mean,
The turning circle will take some getting used to I think,

Zeros, I've had an eye on that one, you don't happen to know the fella who owns it?
Looks alright doesn't it.


All other opinions more than welcome and appreciated

Hey Anzak, no I dont know the owner, I just like the look of it and the price looks reasonable.

When you get a Defender IMO standard height and wheels are perfect. You dont need anything like a lift or bigger wheels on a Defender. Better to spend your cash on some Ashcroft driveline gear like axle flanges and maybe an ATB centre difflock. Plus it's aleady got most other accessories.

[strangy]

Hi and welcome.
I’ve only recently finished my 130 project and AULRO information has been invaluable.
The folk who have taken the time to document their work and pass it on know their stuff.
The suspension suggestions for keeping stock or small lift and 33 tyres is going to save you big $ and keep a smile on your face in nearly all cases.
As mentioned unless extreme rock crawling. But then a 130 isn’t the right choice for that sort of thing.

Looking mean- a set of the right offset wheels and 33 has these things look fantastic.
I love how the 130 has a natural imposing presence and when in the car park amongst others, mine makes even the toughest looking offerings from others look a little prissy.

I’m running an auto open front diff std transfer case (about to change to 1.2) Detroit locker in the rear.
I have Ashcroft axles, drive flanges etc.
It is good gear.
I have an ARB bullbar and diff cover in the rear and their steering damper.
That’s it, all other accessories and mods are from LR nuts like Ashcroft,QT, APT and Gwyn Lewis.
As others mentioned ARB suspension offerings for LR products have not been well considered.

My mods and the 130’s ability are probably way better than my capability/willingness.

[uninformed]

No more rear steer from Maxidrive. The original owner/designer/manufacture/fabricator and top bloke, retired years ago and sold some maxidrive products to M R Automotive that they still make.

There would be custom engineering shops in Australia that would be capable of the work involved but youd need very deep pockets and a really good understanding of what was needed before approaching them.

[Ankaz]

Bloody great input fellas,
MLD I’ve screen shotted that set up, hopefully soon I know what it all means lol thx mate

I like the sound of toughening up the driveline, Ashcroft seems to be the go to when it comes to that, is it easily sourced in Aus and rough price for the lot

Perhaps I got a little over excited jumping into 35’s and a lift, but hey that’s why I joined this forum.

As pointed out by a few already I think I’ll find one that suits and give it a few trips and see how it goes before I look into lifts and big rubber.

Whats the ATB center diff lock?
How does it work compared to front and rear differential locks?

[Tins]

I like the sound of toughening up the driveline, Ashcroft seems to be the go to when it comes to that, is it easily sourced in Aus and rough price for the lot


Whats the ATB center diff lock?
How does it work compared to front and rear differential locks?

Ashcroft stuff is absolutely first class. Talk to them about the ATB thing as well. Better folk than me can explain ATB, but Ashcroft's are the go to people IMV.

[Ankaz]

Hey Anzak, no I dont know the owner, I just like the look of it and the price looks reasonable.

When you get a Defender IMO standard height and wheels are perfect. You dont need anything like a lift or bigger wheels on a Defender. Better to spend your cash on some Ashcroft driveline gear like axle flanges and maybe an ATB centre difflock. Plus it's aleady got most other accessories.

I really like the look of it, nice and neat with some nice added goodies, my concern is I don’t know enough about All the stuff I should know to look for, like anyone I’d hate to make a expensive error that could cost me a packet.

[filcar]

I really like the look of it, nice and neat with some nice added goodies, my concern is I don’t know enough about All the stuff I should know to look for, like anyone I’d hate to make a expensive error that could cost me a packet.
Heaps of info on their site .. Ashcroft Transmissions (http://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/limited-slip-differentials/ashcroft-atb.html)

I have ATB front and rear in my 90 and soon getting an ATB for the centre diff as well. Les Richmond automotive are Ashcroft suppliers and installers or you can buy direct yourself.

[FV1601]

ATB replaces the centre diff lock, with a stronger LSD unit that is still lockable for off road work:
Ashcroft Transmissions (http://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/diy-rebuild-kits/lt230-rebuild-kits/ashcroft-lt230-atb-diff.html)
Good bit of gear.

I have a 2010 130 on standard springs, but upgraded Shocks. The diffs are still rover, but rebuilt by someone who knows what they are doing, with Pro Locker's front and rear.
Climbing ability, articulation, traction is really good. I mean, REALLY good. In my opinion you will need to spend a lot of money to gain small improvement's.
Brakes and turning circle are bad, engine braking......depends who you talk to!
If fitting after market shocks, be aware that they may be too long and the springs will dislocate.
Cheapest/Biggest improvement if you are taller than a jockey are extension rails for the seats.

I suggest that you buy and drive, then consider your options vs requirements. I would rather some modicum of reliability than a lifted Landy that the navigator can't climb into...... Hmmmmm may have to reconsider some of that.....

Good Luck
Rich

[uninformed]

ATB does not replace the diff lock.

ATB and LSD are 2 different types of differentials that do similar things. The ATB retains the ABILITY of the centre diff lock. IE, unlocked centre ATB on road, Locked centre ATB off road.

[Ankaz]

I’ve defiantly got a lot to learn, googles getting a belting.

[MLD]

Many will disagree with this, with 1 caveat, i would put the transfer case ATB mod way way down the list. The caveat: if you do lots of high speed dirt driving that transitions from firm to loose surface. Most of the time for most of us we have the time to stop to engage centre diff lock for loose surfaces and disengage when the road firms up. If you burn out your centre diff so be it and replace it with the Ashcroft unit.

There are better things to spend your money on. An Ashcroft MT82 output shaft mod comes to mind. It replaces the greasable output shaft with one oil fed from the gearbox. Much better for servicability.

If the VHC is your play ground you will want for nothing more than what i said is a balanced set up. I concur with those that recommended owning and driving a 130 in various situations to work out what works for you, what doesn’t. Only then get your cheque book out.

[Ankaz]

Yep that's what I've decided to do,

I'm going to have a look at the Red one on carsales on the weekend, spoke to the fella and he sounds a genuine sort of bloke,
Had a good chat about it and sound like a nice well looked after truck.

Have a look and let me know what you all think?
& if there's anything I should be looking for. I'm going to get the vehicle inspected for a bit of peace of mind.

Who's Defender Guru in Melbourne?

[POD]

Pod, thanks for the info buddy, has the Ashcroft gear handled to your expectations mate?
I'm not mechanically minded enough to be replacing things out in the bush and I often head out just me and the dog who's not the best with a spanner either.
My aim for this truck is to get it as bullet proof & capable as I can afford.
It also has to look and sound mean,
The turning circle will take some getting used to I think,



The ashcroft driveline components have been perfect, no regrets at all with choosing their gear. I'm plenty mechanically minded but that's no reason to want broken axles or CVs in a remote area. The ARB rear locker gave me a lot of trouble early on, if it fails again it'll go on eBay and be replaced with an ashcroft locker in the rear as well.

As for the rear-steer, maxidrive had a setup using a 101 front axle in the rear end and a hydraulic steering setup that was locked out in high range. Was well over $10k back in the day. Would cost more than the vehicle to do it now.

[Ankaz]

Is there a complete kit available for upgrading Axles, CV's, Uni Joints, and whatever else could do with some strengthen up under there?

I do a heap of solo trips and don't have the knowledge to be fking around trying to fix bit & pieces out on the tracks.
I feel it would be money well spent.

What would you recommend?

[uninformed]

Ashcroft can supply you with all your axle shaft, cvs, crown wheel and pinion , diff needs.

The is also Hi-Tough Engineering here in Aus (Gold Coast) that still makes the old Maxidrive axle shafts. These are every bit as good as the Ashcroft axle shafts.

[uninformed]

Regarding the Maxidrive rear steer, the only 101 FC components used where the CVs. If their portal'd rear steer RRCcvs used. The housing was rear Sals or rear rover depending on application. These where shortened and modified. The swivel balls where completely made in house by Maxidrive. AS the rams, Tie rod, axle shafts etc.

[rick130]

One point to fitting an ATB in Tdci's t/case is it eliminates the absolutely crap and cheap two pin centre diff later ones are fitted with.
The ATB eliminates that stupid weak point and takes out a lot of backlash.

I agree with the revised/greased spud shaft first though.

[POD]

Is there a complete kit available for upgrading Axles, CV's, Uni Joints, and whatever else could do with some strengthen up under there?

I do a heap of solo trips and don't have the knowledge to be fking around trying to fix bit & pieces out on the tracks.
I feel it would be money well spent.

What would you recommend?

I don't know of a complete 'kit' as such but you can certainly get all you need from the same place; I highly recommend Ashcrofts and they supply uprated axle shafts, CVs, drive flanges, TC compnents as mentioned above, locking diffs. I purchased my components from Ashcrofts in stages to keep each shipment under $1000 and avoid import duty. There was talk of customs changing the $1000 threshold as the govt is weeping over all the tax they are missing out on with the rise of internet shopping, I'm not up to date with where this is currently at. They were also talking about watching for consecutive shipments to the same person (such as exactly what I did) and adding the values together so they can bite you for the total. If you got 3 mates to all buy bits for you at once and ship to their addresses, you'd have everything in 5 days.

[clive22]

Hi

I've upgraded my 130 with all the Ashcroft gear. Front and rear lockers, pegged diffs, upgraded axles front and rear, and upgraded driveflanges. Did centre diff ATB last.

You can order component by component if you wish - locker, front axles, rear axles, etc etc. And you should. I forgot to do this for one lot and paid all nearly for $400 in fees and duties for one package.

With the centre diff on paper, yeh, it should be last. My truck though (2012 130) had so much free play in the centre diff and when replaced by the ATB it dramatically improved this so much. I would have no problem suggesting it should be done first if your truck is blessed with excess backlash like mine was.

I wouldn't bother ordering their pre-packaged diff (you can order a complete assembled pegged diff) better to get them set up local if you have issues.


Clive

[Highway Star]

Hey all

I've also been contemplating later model 130's, though for purchase about 12 months from now (I plan ahead a bit). Regarding comments about replacing the centre differential; would a Puma Defender accept an entire LT230t from a Discovery 1 as a replacement? (I happen to keep a spare in the shed). Rebuilding one of them, and throwing it in seems a bit simpler and cheaper than buying a fancy centre diff to me.

Cheers
Aaron

[rick130]

Hey all

I've also been contemplating later model 130's, though for purchase about 12 months from now (I plan ahead a bit). Regarding comments about replacing the centre differential; would a Puma Defender accept an entire LT230t from a Discovery 1 as a replacement? (I happen to keep a spare in the shed). Rebuilding one of them, and throwing it in seems a bit simpler and cheaper than buying a fancy centre diff to me.

Cheers
Aaron

Your high range ratio is 1.2:1 rather than 1.4:1.
A number of people run the Disco high range to cut highway revs, but it's too tall for 32"+ tyres IMO.

Unless you run a 4BD1T, then you need a 1.0:1!

The ATB does reduce driveline slop a lot, and takes out the problem of thrust washer wear in the centre diff side gears.
It's a lot stronger than the old centre diff, (no comparison to the cheap arse two gear one) and helps dirt road and slippery bitumen driving immensely.

One of the best mods I did for the driveability of my old Deefer.

[Highway Star]

Thanks Rick.

For some reason I had it in my head later model Defenders wen't to 1.2 High Range, and only Tdi and TD5 ones had the 1.4 High Range; but I cannot verify where I got that idea from. I re-geared my tdi Discovery to 3.9 diffs for the 32" tyres, so I'm hearing you on the choosing to go to higher gearing being somewhat unsatisfactory.

I've just never found the driveline slop in my discovery too bad, so thought I would ask the question :) .

Cheers
Aaron

[Wicks89]

Thx for all the info guys, exactly what I was after,

Summiitt it's nice to know they handle that sort of rough terrain under working conditions mate, I wont come close putting that sort of weight in the tub though,

Wicks I'm looking to build a very capable mean looking rig, but at the end of the day I'll be using it a lot so everything has to be practical for day to day use and very good off road, it's the reason I've gone down the 130 path.
As I said I just fkn luv a Defender on 35's but if it's not practical and come with to many down sides I guess i'll have to rethink.
How do you find them compared to 33's? on & off road.

Pod, thanks for the info buddy, has the Ashcroft gear handled to your expectations mate?
I'm not mechanically minded enough to be replacing things out in the bush and I often head out just me and the dog who's not the best with a spanner either.
My aim for this truck is to get it as bullet proof & capable as I can afford.
It also has to look and sound mean,
The turning circle will take some getting used to I think,

Zeros, I've had an eye on that one, you don't happen to know the fella who owns it?
Looks alright doesn't it.


All other opinions more than welcome and appreciated

135168135168

Mate, rest assured I daily my 130!

Everything mentioned here is correct. But what I would say is I would totally go with 35"s again. Do they help off-road? Yes.
Are they OK on road? I think they're fine. Brakes and take off both fine.

If I was towing a big trailer daily would be an issue but I'm not.

YOLO