Initial setting dimensions for track rod and ball joints.

[ozeraser]

Gday all,

Long story short, I got a new heavy duty stainless steering and track rod kit from the UK, it was listed as S2 and S3, but it appears the track rod length(between ball joint centers) is different between S3 and S2a.

Does anyone have/know the official initial setting dimension between ball joint centers?

I found the following image in the S3 Manual, but at that length of the track rod creates serious toe out on a 2a;

135830

But I know my old 2A center to center is 1125. I only ask as the sumobar maker is having a hard time finding the actual dimensions as well.

Anyone able to help?

P.S sorry if this is in the wrong section not sure where it should go, feel free to move it.

[ozeraser]

Further reading I see a difference of 1" listed under SERIES I, II, IIA, III SPECIFICATION (http://www.cleveland.co.jp/specs/old.html) between 88 and 109

I also see a difference of 1" listed between 2 and 3. Here;


Land Rover Series 2 and 2A models and specs (https://www.landyonline.co.za/specs/series2.htm)



Land Rover Series 3 models and specs (https://www.landyonline.co.za/specs/series3.htm)

And in Series IIA front axle WMS to WMS width not what I expected, hmm... - Series Forum - LR4x4 - The Land Rover Forum (https://forums.lr4x4.com/topic/101544-series-iia-front-axle-wms-to-wms-width-not-what-i-expected-hmm/) someone made mention of finding a section in the S3 workshop manual stating 109 has 1" wider track.

Anyone noticed this?

[JDNSW]

The difference in track between Series 2/2a and Series 3 is entirely due to different offset on the wheels - which varied anyway depending on date and place of manufacture.

I don't know of anywhere that lists the length of the track rod, but as far as I know they did not change between 2a and 3, although it is possible that there was a change by changing the angle of the steering arms, which may have happened either with the change to fully threaded TREs (I don't think so), or more likely, the Stage 1 is different. Maybe someone with readily accessible 2a and 3 can make some measurements. I'll see if I can later in the day.

[B.S.F.]

Shouldered /un-shouldered TRE ? Wouldn't the length of the rod be different?
.W.

[JDNSW]

I don't think so, but come to think of it, I wonder if the issue is the OP has shouldered TREs screwed into a track rod designed for fully threaded TREs - that could certainly lead to not being able to screw the TREs in far enough.

If this is the case, simply changing to fully threaded TREs is the easy fix - they are easier to find anyway!

[ozeraser]

Gday thanks for the comments guys, I have no idea what is right and wrong here.

So here is my left;
135836

and right;
135837

So the story goes the initial Sumobars were 1045 long, but people complained about too much thread was showing on the TRE, so the manufacturer remeasured on a S3 and made the bars 1060 long.

The S3 workshop manual shows 1157 >1160mm between ball joint centers, however my S2a track rod is 1125mm center to center. Is anyone else with a SWB S2a able to confirm?

[Busted Syncro]

G'day

My daily driver is a 1966 series 2a SWB with 7.50 x 16 tyres.
Measured track rod ball joint centre to ball joint centre as 1160mm with "arms from the BOTTOM of the swivel housings". (That maybe is where the difference is with your 2a track rod.)

Hope this helps

Chris

[JDNSW]

Aha! - maybe there is a difference when when they went from steering arms at the top to steering arms at the bottom. And yes, a check of the parts manual shows a different part number for the track rod, so I'm guessing that is it. Unfortunately, I don't have an early one to measure. My 2a with swivel arms on the bottom is 1160 approx.

It is possible to change the swivel arms from top to bottom, but you will need a few new parts.

[AJF]

Hi

Hopefully I will be finishing changing the TREs on my 1960 series 2 this weekend if you would like me to measure.

Also I notice the TRE on the drivers side is has a much bigger cone and thread than the passenger side. The new TREs I am fitting are all the same size so will see how the set up goes. I have damaged the old TRE trying to get it off.

also I kept the set up at the top of the housing rather than change to the bottom (Fingers crises that with John's advice I won't get wheel shimmy).

Cheers
Angus

[JDNSW]

You need to be aware that for either top or bottom arms, one of the studs is fitted, and must be in the correct place. Also, I seem to remember that during S2 production the threads changed from BSF to UNF.

[ozeraser]

Thanks for all the replies,

I looked at getting a new shorter length bar sent from UK but it was just silly shipping. I ended up getting a local joint to cut the bar down 20mm (10 each side), my calculations said it should have enough thread, but i reckon i didn't take into account how far they would over thread a hole(As in if the hole had to be 60mm for the tie rod end, then you make the hole 80mm but it appears you just thread 75ish mm). So i might still need to cut down one or both tie rod ends by~5mm, but right now its on the car just for test fitting and they look good.. but their heavy :P. Now i need to find a place close by that can to the steering centering and alignment.