Old spanners

[gromit]

Picked up a few old spanners at the Trash & Treasure last weekend.
Three Austin spanners.
A Ford - Made in Canada
An Enfo (English Ford ??). Same part number comes up with Ford logo when you search the interweb.
A Cyclone spanner that operates on the flats rather than the corners of a bolt/nut.

The question is.....the Ford - made in Canada, is it from a Model T ? I know that Ford here were set up & run by Ford Canada.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2018/03/200.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/23LPLGx)DSCN4678 (https://flic.kr/p/23LPLGx) by Colin Radley (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152321353@N07/), on Flickr

Colin

[Hogarthde]

G' day Colin, During the War , the 1939 ,45 that is ,a lot of military vehicles where made in Canada, ....Canadian Military Pattern I believe.
Ford and Kaiser and G M and possibly others.
perhaps your spanners are from that era .
I also enjoy car boot ,jumble sales!

dave

[UncleHo]

Yup! All and every CMP vehicle came with a set of spanners so drivers could do roadside repairs,as often workshops were only in rear areas,drivers were trained in vehicle repair and all CMP vehicles both Ford and Chevrolet had standardised parts this made repairs quick and easy,all bolts and nuts were SAE(standard American engineering or unified national fine) unlike British vehicles with BSF,BSW,& Whitworth.

cheers

[trout1105]

I have heaps of old spanners like that somewhere in the shed.

[Hogarthde]

If I can pinch Gromit's thread for a minute .......thanks Uncle Ho, now those Blitze's would have to be the most versatile machine ever made ,! even more than a series Landrover
dave

[gromit]

Just remembered this picture of some I got a while ago.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2018/03/229.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/22rm3ho)Spanners 1 (https://flic.kr/p/22rm3ho) by Colin Radley (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152321353@N07/), on Flickr

The BSA & Rudge ones are probably worth keeping, not sure about the Minerve and another of those EnFo spanners.

Same guy at the market as the others came from. He visits lots of garage sales and buys up all the tools then runs a stall every Sunday.

I also have on my desk a very small King Dick adjustable, a copy of a Lucas Girder adjustable and a few others. I must stop collecting stuff !


Colin

[Aaron IIA]

Yup! All and every CMP vehicle came with a set of spanners so drivers could do roadside repairs,as often workshops were only in rear areas,drivers were trained in vehicle repair and all CMP vehicles both Ford and Chevrolet had standardised parts this made repairs quick and easy,all bolts and nuts were SAE(standard American engineering or unified national fine) unlike British vehicles with BSF,BSW,& Whitworth.

cheersMy F60-L (Ford CMP blitz) has from the factory original BSW bolts on it, the ones with their heads a size bigger than the equivalent BSF bolt. They are 5/16 BSW thread with a 5/16 BSW head, whereas most post war 5/16 BSW threads will have a 1/4 BSW / 5/16 BSF head.

Aaron

[JDNSW]

I think the change in size of BSW heads/nuts was actually a wartime measure to save steel, but only really implemented in the UK - which means, of course that they would be rare in Canadian vehicles.

[gromit]

It's suggested that the head size was reduced to save material during WWII then didn't get changed back.
British Standard Whitworth - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Standard_Whitworth)

Colin

[Aaron IIA]

My truck was assembled in Australia, using a Canadian chassis and powertrain, with a locally produced cab and tray. The chassis and powertrain use SAE threads, while the cab uses large head BSW threads.

Aaron

[1950landy]

These are the old set o LR tools in my 80 tool roll. It took a long time to find them all.:BigThumb:

137676137677137678 Most of them are the correct tools . The jack handle is a copy of a genuine one , I used a early RR handle to make it & the Tyre pump is not correct but will do until I can find the correct one. The spark plugs are correct & are Lodge brand. The hardest thing to find was the correct Dunlop Tyre leavers.

[gromit]

A few more adjustable spanners from the Trash & Treasure......

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2018/05/6.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/JA4hvY)DSCN4784 (https://flic.kr/p/JA4hvY) by Colin Radley (https://www.flickr.com/photos/152321353@N07/), on Flickr

The Jaguar one I found a while back, apparently from an E-Type tool kit.
The miniature pipe wrench is by Webmore.
The 3" adjustable is an Abingdon King Dick
The larger one is a 'no-name' but looks like a Lucas Girder adjustable spanner.

I need to finish a few Land Rovers and stop collecting tools......!

Colin

[Bigbjorn]

SAE stands for Society of Automotive Engineers. They wrote the standards to be used by the motor industry. SAE is not and never was a thread system but the SAE set fastener standards for automotive use. The thread systems are NC, NF, NEF, NS, NP and so on. Yanks generally do not use the "U" prefix. A Machinery's Handbook and/or Sidders Guide to World Screw Threads will set you on the path to identifying screw threads. You should have a vernier caliper that reads in both fractions of an inch and millimetres, and sets of screw pitch gauges.

[Bigbjorn]

Yup! All and every CMP vehicle came with a set of spanners so drivers could do roadside repairs,as often workshops were only in rear areas,drivers were trained in vehicle repair and all CMP vehicles both Ford and Chevrolet had standardised parts this made repairs quick and easy,all bolts and nuts were SAE(standard American engineering or unified national fine) unlike British vehicles with BSF,BSW,& Whitworth.

cheers

Way back in the 1960's when I was doing some work on Merlins and Allisons for three point hydroplanes there were still plenty of WW2 aircraft fitters above ground and breathing. From conversations I understood one of the reasons they liked the US production Merlins (Packard and Continental) was that each engine came with a high quality American tool kit. The generous Poms, of course, issued bugger all tools with their engines.

[JDNSW]

From memory the "Unified" means that the thread has the crests (or is it the bottom) may be rounded instead of flat as in the US threads, so the question is, are the US threads labelled without the "Unified" actually made to UTS or US standards?

[Bigbjorn]

From memory the "Unified" means that the thread has the crests (or is it the bottom) may be rounded instead of flat as in the US threads, so the question is, are the US threads labelled without the "Unified" actually made to UTS or US standards?

Unified means post-unification. In 1950 the UK and Canada agreed to phase out British thread systems and use the US systems. They were said to have unified their systems. In reality the Brits agreed to use American systems and the yanks did not unify with anybody so mostly ignored use of the U. British thread systems were supposed to fade into history but many years later were still in use as manufacturers did not wish (or could not afford) to alter their drawings and tooling. BA & BSC were still in use more than 20 years after they were supposed to disappear. Low grade fasteners are still being sold with BSW threads.

[1950landy]

A few old spanners I have in a box of old tools .

139818139819139820139821 These are just the ones I have at home up at the workshop i have half an ammo box of them. Most of them are BSF & some of the smaller are BA & all are British made.

[vnx205]

I still have the same three Austin spanners that came with my first car, an Austin A40.

[Bigbjorn]

From memory the "Unified" means that the thread has the crests (or is it the bottom) may be rounded instead of flat as in the US threads, so the question is, are the US threads labelled without the "Unified" actually made to UTS or US standards?

John. PM me your e-mail address and I will send my thread charts and tapping drill charts. The charts have the thread profiles and proportions.

Anyone else want them? PM me your e-mail address.

[gromit]

A few old spanners I have in a box of old tools .

These are just the ones I have at home up at the workshop i have half an ammo box of them. Most of them are BSF & some of the smaller are BA & all are British made.

When I'm having a tidy up I'll have to take some photos of the spanners & tools I've picked up at Boot Sales, Trash & Treasure Markets etc. I shifted 3 toolboxes full from the UK to Australia 20 years ago and have been adding more since I arrived. Some of the UK ones are from King Dick, Bedford Vanadium, Williams Superslim and lots of other companies that have now closed or been taken over.

I found an 'obstruction' spanner the other day in my collection stamped 'War Finish'. Googled it and there seem to be a couple of different ideas as to why spanners were produced in War Finish. Any suggestions ??

I have a brand new King Dick adjustable with additional jaws attached. Came from a military disposals store about 40 years ago so guessing it was specially made for something military......must dig it out & Google the part number engraved on it.

I found this book when looking up an Australian made adjustable spanner I missed out on The Adjustable Spanner: History, Origins and Development to 1970: Ron Geesin: 9781785000355: Amazon.com: Books (https://www.amazon.com/Adjustable-Spanner-History-Origins-Development/dp/1785000357) would be an interesting read.
Just found the authors website Ron Geesin - THE ADJUSTABLE SPANNER (https://www.rongeesin.com/all-the-latest-news/71-the-adjustable-spanner) 3,000 adjustable spanners.....and I thought I was sad !




Colin