6HP26 transmission service - saturday fun

[PeterOZ]

finally got all the gear together to do the transmission service on my D3.


20L of LG6
ZF mechtronic sleeve
gasket
ZF filter
ZF mechatronic valvy body seals(4)
ZF oil pump seal


Doing a double flush.

Should keep me out of mischief.
cheers
P143239

[PeterOZ]

Well first snag, had expected the steel pan sump plug to be 10mm torx or hex like OME pan.

Anybody know what the size is for BMW steel pan plug? What I can tell it appears to be ID 18mm Hex.

Be good to have an idea before I pop up to repco in the AM.

thanks

[justinc]

Peter why did you want to undo it??? Its for quick fill only.

[DiscoJeffster]

Agree. Fill from the gearbox side filler

[justinc]

Ah, so it has a non genuine steel pan on it already? No drain plug in those..☹. That large plug will only allow a small amount of oil out, it is not designed as a drain.

[justinc]

And have you replaced the data sleeve in these before? A little tricky sometimes..

[101RRS]

My sump has two drain plugs the big one and a little one - the little one works fine and can be undone with an allen key.

[justinc]

Thats right Garry, genuine has a small drain, and a large filler to enable filling with factory filling tool. Predetermined volume etc from factory fill.

[PeterOZ]

Mine has the BMW steel pan, has two plugs, one is supposed to be a filler and the small one is the actual drain.
Bought a complete set of Hex driver sockets including the 17mm Hex for the large fillwer which in the end I did not need as I filled via the side fill opening on side of the case.

4 x new mechatronic seals fitted
1 x new oil pump to mechatroinc bridge seal fitted
1 x meachatronic electrical connector sleeve/seal fitted

1 x new ZF filter fitted.

Did 3 drains and flushes with 5 sec of engine run to pump out a bit more old fluid each time. Could have done a couple more as the fluid still not as clean as I would like but only had 20L to play with and at $600 its not cheap!

Was still shuddering a bit so added 2 tubes of Dr Tranny.
Majority of the shuddering is gone but has only done 150km so far so not a real test.
The shifts are smoother however I am feeling slippage whcih could be torque convertor clutch or could be one of the main transmission clutch packs.

Fuel economy has gotten worse, I'm sitting at 13.4 for the short trips so far, normally around town its low 12s or high 11s. Wil be driving about 100km on highways over Sunday so will see how that goes.

Worth doing yes as it was not drivable before an now it is.

I suspect though that I will be up for an overhauled transmission and a new TC in due course with probably an overhauled mechatronic as well/ Ouch $$$

Normal vehicle Servicing this Sat, engine oil, filters etc.



ZF Lifeguard transmission fluid 1 L - AA00 604 149

AA00 604 149

749626-1



ZF Lifeguard transmission fluid 20L 749626

S671 090 253

749626



ZF Transmission filter

ZF626010

Motospec



Transmission gasket - aftermarket

ZPG626006

Motospec




143785143786

[PerthDisco]

How many kms?

[PeterOZ]

How many kms?


237,000 km

steel pan done by LR at around 80,000km, they did it under warranty and did the mechatroinc sleeve as well.

I had paid for double flush, new filter by a certain indie at redcliffe qld at around 199,000km but when I pulled the pan off there is no way it was done then, old gasket was locked solid and had to be scraped off with a razor blade. I suspect they only dropped old fluid and refilled. Can't prove it of course.

[Eric SDV6SE]

"Was still shuddering a bit so added 2 tubes of Dr Tranny.
Majority of the shuddering is gone but has only done 150km so far so not a real test.
The shifts are smoother however I am feeling slippage whcih could be torque convertor clutch or could be one of the main transmission clutch packs."


Have you considered servicing the valve block - this, apart from the TC, can be a major source of shudder and poor shifting.

Plus its easier to remove the valve block than the TC....

Cheers

Eric

[PeterOZ]

its not the valve block and is is shifting ok.

Putting another 2 tubes of Dr tranny in on sat. Majority of the shuddering has settled down but there is a bit of slippage, could be clutch packs or it could be TC LU clutch, who knows?

I'll nurse it till it gets bad then will have a full rebuild done of the box, mechatronic valve body and a new TC.

[Eric SDV6SE]

its not the valve block and is is shifting ok.

Putting another 2 tubes of Dr tranny in on sat. Majority of the shuddering has settled down but there is a bit of slippage, could be clutch packs or it could be TC LU clutch, who knows?

I'll nurse it till it gets bad then will have a full rebuild done of the box, mechatronic valve body and a new TC.



Spent the weekend rebuilding the valve block - Sonnax ZIP kit went in no probs, new valve block separator plate, new solenoids as well as new mechatronic seal, main pump to TC seal and 4 off body seals.

Still to fit to car. I was amazed at how simple it was to change / clean out the valve body and also amazed by how much crud was trapped in the valve body itself.

IMHO still worth doing the valvebody rebuild. Mines done 182,000kms now.

Will post the results once back in the car and running.

[PeterOZ]

I considered doing it though I feel I will be getting a full box rebuild which will include the valve body and a new torque convertor at some point did not feel it was justified at the time.

I'll keep monitoring it see how it drives.

Where did you get the parts from and the price?

Fact of the matter doing new sleeves and clutch packs would not be overly difficult but getting the box off and back on on my own is beyond me.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Where did you get the parts from and the price? Fact of the matter doing new sleeves and clutch packs would not be overly difficult but getting the box off and back on on my own is beyond me.

I've only rebuilt the valve block - the transmission stays in the car and I have not touched the clutch packs or TC

I ordered most parts from E-bay:
- Sonnax Gen2 ZIP kit came from the UK
- Mechatronic seal and valve body seals from the UK
- Solenoids for the 6HP28 (as fitted to the D4) came from the USA, complete with foam seal strip
- filter and pan gasket from Melbourne
- separator plate - local pick up from ZF distributor here in Perth
- I'm using Penrite BMV ATF, this is a direct replacement for the LF6 fluid

All up total cost is about A$1250 including 20 L of transmission fluid and 2L of transfer case oil (I will be doing this at the same time as the car is on the axle stands anyway and the bash plates are all off).

All delivered within a week of ordering.

If you were considering a full transmission rebuild that requires the whole box to be removed, I would definitely take this to a specialist.

I decided to do the valve block as I thought this was within my capabilities. I personally would not attempt a complete transmission removal by myself.

Cheers

Eric

[loanrangie]

Eric, have you used the BMV before or just using it after this service ?

[Eric SDV6SE]

Eric, have you used the BMV before or just using it after this service ?

Hi loanrangie,

No, first time.

I was speaking to a BMW mechanic (ZF6HP series are used in the 3,5 and 7 series), and they have successfully used this in vehicles fitted with the ZF6HP series, with no issues.

I also spoke to Penrite and according to them it has the similar additives package as the LF6, and on their site it lists it as an acceptable equivalent where LF6 is specified:

from Penrite Oil | (https://www.penriteoil.com.au/products/atf-bmv-full-syn:)

ATF BMV may be used in ZF (https://www.penriteoil.com.au/knowledge-centre/oem-manufacturers-specifications-list/257) 6, 8 and 9 speed automatic transmissions where Lifeguard 6, 8 & 9 is recommended in vehicles such as

Alfa Romeo
Aston Martin
Audi
Bentley
BMW
Chrysler


Citroen
Dodge
Fiat
Ford
Honda
Hyundai


Iveco
Jaguar
Jeep
Kia
Land Rover
Maserati


Ram
Rolls Royce (https://www.penriteoil.com.au/knowledge-centre/rolls-royce-brake-fluid/393)
Volkswagen
and many others


ATF BMV can also be used in Mercedes Benz and Chrysler vehicles where MB 236.10, MB 236.11, MB 236.12, MB 236.13, and MB 236.14 are specified in Mercedes Benz 5 speed W5A 580 / NAG1, NAG2V Sport Transmissions and 7 G-Tronic models W7A 700 / NAG2.


Also I bought 20L of Penrite BMV via SCA on line for $220 delivered to my front door. 20L of LF6 is about $720 plus freight. I know that a new transmission is more expensive, but if listed as a suitable equivalent by Penrite, that's good enough for me, as I doubt that a reputable company like Penrite would promote this as a suitable alternative without some real-world testing.

I'm now running Penrite products in the Engine, differentials and soon in the transmission.

Cheers,

Eric,

[PeterOZ]

I paid $595 for 20L of LF6 delivered to my address from Vic.

Eric, have you refitted the valve body yet? Keen to know if there was any improvement?

cheers
P

[Eric SDV6SE]

I paid $595 for 20L of LF6 delivered to my address from Vic.

Eric, have you refitted the valve body yet? Keen to know if there was any improvement?

cheers
P

Thats a good price for LF6 !

I've refitted it, just still need to fill and flush this weekend. Did the TC oil drain as well last night while it was up on the stands.

Hopefully by this Sat. afternoon we should be all systems go.

The refit was dead easy, as was the valve body rebuild.

Watch this space...

Eric

[PeterOZ]

How did you drain the TC without pulling the box out? Must be a cunning method I suspect. [bigwhistle]

[loanrangie]

How did you drain the TC without pulling the box out? Must be a cunning method I suspect. [bigwhistle]

I suspect he means transfer case and not torque converter.

[Eric SDV6SE]

I suspect he means transfer case and not torque converter.

Correct - Transfer Case was drained and filled with new oil - sorry should have been more specific.

The Torque Converter and the cooler in the transmission (unfortunately) retains some of the old fluid, you can never drain it all out.

Full refill takes 9.5 litres, so far I have been able to drain about 6-7 litres out (basically left the drain pan underneath it for a week while i was at work and while the valve block was out). So this is why i bought 20L to allow me to flush until im reasonably sure that Ive got 100% new fluid in the unit.

My understanding of the fill process is that the engine has to be running, the thermostat has to open to allow fluid to flow through the Torque Converter and cooler, this opens at between 30 and 50 deg C. Then flush through the cooler hoses into a drain pan until new fluid appears, then reconnect cooler hose and fill transmission to fill plug.

[SeanC]

So I asked Dr. Google what this mechatronic sleeve thingy was. I ended up at YouTube with a transmission service and mechatronic sleeve replacement on a Territory. For something with mechatronic in it’s name the sleeve was a bit underwhelming. But I digress. The mechanic used Dexron 6 with Ludeguard Platinum additive to refill the transmission.

[loanrangie]

So I asked Dr. Google what this mechatronic sleeve thingy was. I ended up at YouTube with a transmission service and mechatronic sleeve replacement on a Territory. For something with mechatronic in it’s name the sleeve was a bit underwhelming. But I digress. The mechanic used Dexron 6 with Ludeguard Platinum additive to refill the transmission.

Terri's use the ford ZF copy so a slightly different box, no idea how much they differ.

[SeanC]

Terri's use the ford ZF copy so a slightly different box, no idea how much they differ.

Lifeguard was the recommended oil but in the mechanics words, “lifeguard oil is very expensive”.

[justinc]

Lifeguard was the recommended oil but in the mechanics words, “lifeguard oil is very expensive”.

Then youd best be prepared to invoice him for a trans rebuild... he is NOT doing himself or more importantly the customer any favours by ignoring industry and manufacturers advice...

[PeterOZ]

Then youd best be prepared to invoice him for a trans rebuild... he is NOT doing himself or more importantly the customer any favours by ignoring industry and manufacturers advice...

by then the statutory warranty period for a repair will be over and he won't give a rats [bigwhistle]

[TDV6Robvdw]

Spent the weekend rebuilding the valve block - Sonnax ZIP kit went in no probs, new valve block separator plate, new solenoids as well as new mechatronic seal, main pump to TC seal and 4 off body seals.

Will post the results once back in the car and running.

Hi Eric, couldn’t find a post where you communicated how the gearbox functioned after performing your maintenance.

I am considering pricing up the parts to do the same style of work.

I have owned my TDV6 LR3 for around 18 months and dropped the transmission pan, changed the oil and performed a steel pan conversion.

The shudder I had at around 90k/hr disappeared altogether but the first to second gear change has left a lot to be desired after changing the oil.

My car has 273k on the clock (30k by me).

Thanks 👍

[Eric SDV6SE]

Hi Eric, couldn’t find a post where you communicated how the gearbox functioned after performing your maintenance.

I am considering pricing up the parts to do the same style of work.

I have owned my TDV6 LR3 for around 18 months and dropped the transmission pan, changed the oil and performed a steel pan conversion.

The shudder I had at around 90k/hr disappeared altogether but the first to second gear change has left a lot to be desired after changing the oil.

My car has 273k on the clock (30k by me).

Thanks 👍

Ah ok, i thought i did. Anyways, only positive things to say, makes a big difference. Well worth doing. Perhaps i was lucky and caught mine early emough, i had no shudder, just harsh shifts. Definitely an improvement. Im now at 208600km, trans shifts absolutely perfectly.
You will be pleased, just follow the sonnax zip kit steps and read up on the zf boxes, some good tips there, plus also here on AULRO from others who have done the same.

[josh.huber]

Send the valve body to a professional and have it vac tested at the same time, as well as new solenoids.

When I bought my zip kit I found a shop that could vac test it. They end up finding that a lube valve was also worn and replaced it at the same time. Very cost effective too.

[TDV6Robvdw]

Ah ok, i thought i did. Anyways, only positive things to say, makes a big difference. Well worth doing. Perhaps i was lucky and caught mine early emough, i had no shudder, just harsh shifts. Definitely an improvement. Im now at 208600km, trans shifts absolutely perfectly.
You will be pleased, just follow the sonnax zip kit steps and read up on the zf boxes, some good tips there, plus also here on AULRO from others who have done the same.

Great - thanks!!

[TDV6Robvdw]

Send the valve body to a professional and have it vac tested at the same time, as well as new solenoids.

When I bought my zip kit I found a shop that could vac test it. They end up finding that a lube valve was also worn and replaced it at the same time. Very cost effective too.

👍👍