Them's the brakes

[Dark61]

I thought it would be nice to have some working brakes on the s1, rather than rely on my clutch control. I just use it on the property so I'll have a go at it myself. Having taken a first look at the rear wheels , I notice the passenger side appears to have a different fitting to the drivers side and possibly on the drivers side something may have sheared off at the point the brake line enters the rear wheel? The lines appear connected to the wheels ok - but the rear lines at least are shot. I have taken a look at the workshop book/google etc , but it looks nothing like what I can see. Does anyone know what that fitting is on the rear left and why its not on the other wheel?
As usual all comments gratefully received.
cheers,

d

[Dinty]

I have seen that type of fitting before, but never on brakes, I would suspect a previous owner bodge, cheers dennis ps happy to be proved otherwise,,.

[Blknight.aus]

that is a banjo to flare adaptor.

Ive seen them on brakes before but never a series rover.

I suspect you will have the wrong slave cylinder in the wheel OR it been bored out to take a banjo thread due to the cylinder stripping.

[B.S.F.]

It probably belongs to a 80" front wheel cylinder.
.W.

[Dark61]

Thanks Gents.

so are we saying, fit the correct wheel brake cylinder and you can do away with the banjo adaptor?

cheers,

d

[B.S.F.]

Impossible to say by just looking at a picture. But yes, if that is a 86" with 3/16" brake pipes then there is good chance that it would be a straight swap. Keep in mind that previous owners could have done anything just to keep the car going.
.W.

[Dark61]

Understood.
its a 57 88. I’ll take a squint and see if any of it makes sense to me.
thanks for replying.
cheers,

d

[B.S.F.]

Instead of 86" I should have said 54-58 with 10" brakes.
.W.

[4bee]

It appears to me that something damaged the brake pipe resulting in a shorter pipe. That adapter simply extends it so it can be used.

Just sayin'.

[5380]

I thought it would be nice to have some working brakes on the s1, rather than rely on my clutch control. I just use it on the property so I'll have a go at it myself. Having taken a first look at the rear wheels , I notice the passenger side appears to have a different fitting to the drivers side and possibly on the drivers side something may have sheared off at the point the brake line enters the rear wheel? The lines appear connected to the wheels ok - but the rear lines at least are shot. I have taken a look at the workshop book/google etc , but it looks nothing like what I can see. Does anyone know what that fitting is on the rear left and why its not on the other wheel?
As usual all comments gratefully received.
cheers,

d
It appears that someone has bodged an 80" wheel cylinder and front banjo fitting to your 10" rear brake. From memory the 80" has 1/4" pipes and 7/16" UNF banjo bolt and brake pipe threads and the 86" onwards had 3/16" pipes and 3/8" UNF wheel cylinder threads. Lucky for you, the 86" & 88" wheel cylinders are cheap and easy to find. The 86/88 brakes don't use a banjo fitting on the front cyliders, the flexible hoses screw directly into the wheel cylinders. I have modified 86" onwards wheel cylinders to fit my 80" by tapping the thread out to 7/16" UNF to suit the larger 80" pipes. Wheel cylinders for 80" brakes are very expensive and hard to find. Looks like you need a complete brake rebuild, so go the whole hog and start out fresh using silicone brake fluid. It has transformed the brakes on my 80". Penrite seems to be the best value and is readily available. The main advantages are reduced internal friction in the master and wheel cylinders and it does not absorb water or need flushing every two years. Make sure you replace the brake shoe return springs. You will enjoy bleeding them. Lucky for you, the 3/13' pipes are easier to bleed tham the 1/4" pipes! all the best. 5380

[JDNSW]

Doesn't the 80" have BSF threads on the wheel cylinders?

[Aaron IIA]

80" has BSF threads for the bleed nipples. I am not certain about the threads for the flare nuts or flexibles. I do remember that the flexibles were easy to get at the brake shop, whereas the bleed nipples had to be ordered from a Land Rover specialist, who I assume had them made.

Aaron

[numpty]

Doesn't the 80" have BSF threads on the wheel cylinders?

I think you're correct John and I think this applies to all Series 1's and these need to be changed if fitting later wheel cylinders.

[JDNSW]

That would be right - the change to unified threads did not really start until the Series 2. But of course, what is on the vehicle today may well not be what it left the factory with!

[5380]

Doesn't the 80" have BSF threads on the wheel cylinders?
JD, you are correct -sort of.
The mounting stud/bolt threads are BSF at least on the early 80" cast iron wheel cylinders, but all the 80" brake pipe flare nuts and hose fittings I have seen are UNF as on most post war Girling and other common brands fitted to British cars etc. The 80" (1/4 pipes) use 7/16UNF and 86/107 , 88/109 (3/16" pipes) use 3/8" UNF. Lots of different threads! Some (most?) of the later aluminium wheel clinders have Whitworth mounting threads. Land Rover used BSF, BA for small threads and Whitworth where anything screwed into aluminium castings. Fascinating things threads! Series 1's do have some metric threads in the Solex 32PBI carb, but the linkages all all BSF.
5380.

[JDNSW]

........ Fascinating things threads! Series 1's do have some metric threads in the Solex 32PBI carb, but the linkages all all BSF.
5380.

Ah! But are they ISO metric? Solex started building carburettors in the 1920s, ISO metric was not formalised until the 1940s. Did they change their threads to conform by the 1950s (or ever)?

[5380]

Ah! But are they ISO metric? Solex started building carburettors in the 1920s, ISO metric was not formalised until the 1940s. Did they change their threads to conform by the 1950s (or ever)?<br><br> JD, I Think Solex used whatever the engineers and designers came up with. From memory, the 32-PBI-2carbie has a 6mm x 1.0 pitch ISO thread in the distributor advance vaccuum port, but I haven't got a clue what the rest are! 5380.

[JDNSW]

<br><br> JD, I Think Solex used whatever the engineers and designers came up with. From memory, the 32-PBI-2carbie has a 6mm x 1.0 pitch ISO thread in the distributor advance vaccuum port, but I haven't got a clue what the rest are! 5380.

Neither have I! And I would also raise the possibility that the vacuum port is not necessarily ISO, but simply a thread that you can screw ISO into - BA 0, for example is 6mm x !.0, but is definitely not ISO. I doubt they used BA for this application, but as you suggest it is likely to be whatever their designers came up with, which may well have been (by coincidence) very close to what later became ISO, but may be a slightly different thread form.

[5380]

Neither have I! And I would also raise the possibility that the vacuum port is not necessarily ISO, but simply a thread that you can screw ISO into - BA 0, for example is 6mm x !.0, but is definitely not ISO. I doubt they used BA for this application, but as you suggest it is likely to be whatever their designers came up with, which may well have been (by coincidence) very close to what later became ISO, but may be a slightly different thread form.


JD, I can't say this for all 32 PBI-2 Solex threads, but the ones that I have checked are metric sizes. I suppose it makes sense for a French company to use metric. I also assume that when the Poms made them (under licence?) they would not go to the trouble of changing over to imperial thread forms. 5380.

[JDNSW]

Just to put this sort of thing into perspective, in the early 1920s Morris started buying engines from Hotchkiss' Coventry factory (relocated from France in 1915), buying the company and renaming it Morris Motors in 1925. As a result, Morris car engines used metric threads with Whitworth sized hexagons from then on until new machinery was purchased in the late 1940s. And I doubt those threads were ISO either, although I don't know for sure.