What you need to know about the coming flu season [Archive]

bob10

19th April 2019, 12:11 PM

goingbush

19th April 2019, 01:20 PM

Don't forget your jabs.

We can't predict how bad this year's flu season will be but here's what we know so far (https://theconversation.com/we-cant-predict-how-bad-this-years-flu-season-will-be-but-heres-what-we-know-so-far-115303?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Latest%20from%20The%20Conversation%20 for%20April%2018%202019%20-%201288011980&utm_content=Latest%20from%20The%20Conversation%20f or%20April%2018%202019%20-%201288011980+CID_2727995707489a2cb39411d02be8bef2&utm_source=campaign_monitor&utm_term=We%20cant%20predict%20how%20bad%20this%20 years%20flu%20season%20will%20be%20but%20heres%20w hat%20we%20know%20so%20far)

Ive only ever had one Flu immunisation about 30 yrs ago & I was a sick as a dog.

Never had one since & will continue to not have one.
I just avoid crowds & enclosed spaces with people, oh not because of the Flu, .... I just don't like people !

Apart from injuries / trauma etc I've never been sick since.

Eevo

19th April 2019, 01:24 PM

never get the flu vax.

DiscoMick

19th April 2019, 01:28 PM

Definitely getting mine as a defence against snotty kids.

Pedro_The_Swift

19th April 2019, 04:13 PM

You should get yours paid for Mick....[thumbsupbig]

Saitch

19th April 2019, 04:40 PM

You should get yours paid for Mick....[thumbsupbig]

I thought the same!

DiscoMick

19th April 2019, 07:31 PM

It has happened some years, since the $20 cost is nothing compared with the cost of a person been off sick, but I haven't heard if they are stumping up for it this year.
Problem is if you get it early say in April it starts to lose effectiveness after about three months, so you really need to go back for a second jab about August.
This year there were an unusually high number of flu cases in November -December when peoples' protection was waning.
I claim it back on tax anyway as a work related expense.

DiscoMick

19th April 2019, 07:33 PM

I will also need to get my rabies vaccine renewed later in the year.

Slunnie

19th April 2019, 07:57 PM

I'll definately be getting it.

DiscoClax

19th April 2019, 10:53 PM

Only time I've had the flu in the last 15 years is when I missed the jab one year. That was very unpleasant. The earlier formulations knocked you about a fair bit (like getting a reduced bout of flu, not nice), but the last few years I've barely noticed it at all. A mozzie bite is more annoying and painful... I'm signed up for mine this year :)

Homestar

20th April 2019, 05:40 AM

Eevo

20th April 2019, 06:32 AM

Doesn’t guarantee not getting it, but reduces greatly.

actually the chance of you getting the flu is the same. the number of flu virons around hasnt changed.

bob10

20th April 2019, 07:38 AM

I'll be getting it, do every year. Only had the flu once. Never want it again, especially at my age.Still, we have a choice.

DiscoMick

20th April 2019, 08:07 AM

actually the chance of you getting the flu is the same. the number of flu virons around hasnt changed.I find it's the difference between having the sniffles for a few days or being in bed with roaring temperatures for a week.
One year I had the vaccine, which covered four strains of the flu, but got sick with a different strain of flu and was miserable.

Red90

20th April 2019, 08:10 AM

Eevo

20th April 2019, 08:17 AM

I find it's the difference between having the sniffles for a few days or being in bed with roaring temperatures for a week.

correct, but thats differnt to what he said.

Eevo

20th April 2019, 08:23 AM

By getting vaccinated you are reducing the amount of spread of the disease.

negative on that statement. there is so many non human sources of the flu that getting shot is trivial in the big picture.
now if the flu was not zoonotic, (like polio), it would be a different story

Red90

20th April 2019, 10:10 AM

It does reduce the spread. You are making non factual statements. Most contact with the virus is human to human.

Slunnie

20th April 2019, 11:36 AM

Work pays for ours each year, already booked in for mine.

Most people have never had the flu - people who come to work with the sniffles and say ‘I’ve got the flu’ give me the ****s. Had the flu once, I was in bed for nearly 2 weeks, could barely move to go to the toilet. In agony whenever I was awake. Got taken to the Docs about a week and a bit in and they said I should have been in Hospital. Was off work for 3 weeks and took several more to fully recover. Wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy.

I don’t take any chances now and haven’t missed a shot since. Doesn’t guarantee not getting it, but reduces greatly.

Thats it, its free for me also, either from work because there is a return on their investment or because I'm an "at risk" person from a previous sickness.

One of the fellows at work died of it, and he as far as I know was otherwise healthy. With typically about 800 in NSW being killed by it each year, it does make you wonder how many might have been saved with vaccination - its not like its expensive or risky but no doubt the antivaxxers think it gives autism.

Good to read that 95% of people in NSW are vaccinated generally.

Slunnie

20th April 2019, 11:42 AM

By getting vaccinated you are reducing the amount of spread of the disease. This protects other people that are at risk of complications or death from the flu that are not able to be vaccinated. Not getting the shot is extremely selfish.

negative on that statement. there is so many non human sources of the flu that getting shot is trivial in the big picture.
now if the flu was not zoonotic, (like polio), it would be a different story

NSW Health agree with Red90

Flu is spread by viruses floating in tiny droplets from a sick person's cough or sneeze. It is also spread when those droplets from a sick person land on a surface or object which is then touched by someone else who picks up the virus on their hands. The flu is not spread through air conditioning or ventilation systems.

Vaccination prevents people from becoming infected with diseases. This means there is less disease circulating in the community which not only protects you, but can help protect those around you who are not able to be vaccinated, such as infants under 6 months of age.

Every year a new seasonal flu vaccine is developed. It protects against the four types of flu that are expected to be the most common that flu season (winter). The seasonal flu vaccine is now available in Australia. It protects against the H1N1 pandemic strain, an H3N2 strain and two influenza B strains.

Red90

20th April 2019, 12:02 PM

Cross species movement of the flu is rare and when those occur, it is new strain and can't be managed by existing vaccines. The specific types of flu that animals have are different than humans. The immunization is for ones that are commonly being spread through people at the current time. Mass immunization reduces the spread and protects at risk people.

Zoonotic influenza (https://www.who.int/influenza/spotlight/zoonotic-influenza)

DiscoMick

20th April 2019, 02:48 PM

negative on that statement. there is so many non human sources of the flu that getting shot is trivial in the big picture.
now if the flu was not zoonotic, (like polio), it would be a different storyIf it reduces the spread from one snotty kid to me then it's worthwhile.
Besides, I'm 65 now so it's free.

bob10

20th April 2019, 03:14 PM

Well, the flu kills. Bottom line. And If I spread the flu to some children because I didn't get the jab, I would be devastated. The only iffy thing is when to get it. Too early you run the risk of late season flu, too late, well you take a risk. I'm lucky to have a wonderful Doctor, She will advise me.

vnx205

20th April 2019, 04:34 PM

I had resisted getting the jab for several years.

My argument was that I was fitter than most people my age, so I didn't need to worry. My doctor as well as news reports of young, fit athletes dying from the flu convinced me that I was fooling myself.

I was also persuaded by my doctor that getting the jab reduced the chances of my passing on the flu to people like my two toddler grandchildren.

Many people who claim to have had the flu actually only had a cold.

People who got sick after the jab didn't get the flu because of the jab. It can't give you the flu.

Even if the jab doesn't give you 100% protection, it can't make your situation worse.

Flu can kill. Get the jab.

NavyDiver

21st April 2019, 09:51 AM

Ive only ever had one Flu immunisation about 30 yrs ago & I was a sick as a dog.

Never had one since & will continue to not have one.
I just avoid crowds & enclosed spaces with people, oh not because of the Flu, .... I just don't like people !

Apart from injuries / trauma etc I've never been sick since.

I've only had one flu in the last 20 years. I passed out and fell through a plaster wall in a rental house. The ouch was two weeks in bed and $400 dollar repair bill [bighmmm]

Really good study on 2000 people with 1/2 given a flu jab and 1/2 given water. The 50% who did not get a flu jab reported 85% more side effects. The suspected reason was that when we are getting flu jabs colds and other virus are also active.. [biggrin] The 50% who did not get the vaccination also got the Flu at the same rate as the entire population. The 50% who did get the vaccination did not get the flu.

Your avoidance strategy works by the way. Just over 2 meters distance is usually enough distance from the sneezing people for airborne transmission. Sadly the door handles and every thing else you and others with a flu touch are a little more tricky to avoid. We give out well over 2000 vaccinations every flu season. Yet to see a issue which was not a cold. Influenza virus/vaccination is not the same as a common cold or its several thousand varieties. RE "Apart from injuries / trauma etc I've never been sick since" Sorry to tell you Statistics suggest your over due mate. The avoidable diseases are at times easy to avoid. I get my JAB every year. This year I felt it for two days. The reaction was apparently me responding more strongly to the new strains.

Eevo

21st April 2019, 11:08 AM

ive got the man flu today :(

Vern

21st April 2019, 11:52 AM

ive got the man flu today :(Karma hey!

Eevo

21st April 2019, 12:57 PM

Karma hey!

must be.

DiscoMick

21st April 2019, 01:16 PM

Better get vaccinated.

When to get the flu shot in Australia in 2019 | healthdirect (https://www.healthdirect.gov.au/blog/when-to-get-the-flu-shot-in-australia-in-2019)

DiscoMick

21st April 2019, 01:18 PM

Here are the details about the vaccines.

What are the 2019 flu vaccines? | AJP (https://ajp.com.au/news/what-are-the-2019-flu-vaccines/)

Eevo

21st April 2019, 01:27 PM

when i said man flu, i meant a cold.

NavyDiver

21st April 2019, 08:43 PM

Here are the details about the vaccines.

What are the 2019 flu vaccines? | AJP (https://ajp.com.au/news/what-are-the-2019-flu-vaccines/)

The over 65 last year was a super powered version only available as a private script this year. ( I paid for it for my mum and dad) It was free last year. The over 65 this year is ok rather than OK if you know what I mean. [bigwhistle]

Slunnie

21st April 2019, 09:08 PM

The over 65 last year was a super powered version only available as a private script this year. ( I paid for it for my mum and dad) It was free last year. The over 65 this year is ok rather than OK if you know what I mean. [bigwhistle]

It must have been last year that I was told to get the over 65 vaccination which was GP only - well that caused a lot of problems because I'm not even close to 65 but I got it. It must have been the year prior I had to have a regular flu vac early in the flu season and then one 2-3 months later. All regular this year, so I'm guessing its anticipated this will be a tame year.

NavyDiver

21st April 2019, 09:13 PM

It must have been last year that I was told to get the over 65 vaccination which was GP only - well that caused a lot of problems because I'm not even close to 65 but I got it. It must have been the year prior I had to have a regular flu vac early in the flu season and then one 2-3 months later. All regular this year, so I'm guessing its anticipated this will be a tame year.

The last year ubber version was $$$$ The reason is money not lives I assume. The current year vaccinations are 100% better than nothing [thumbsupbig] It has not been a tame year this year! Far from it.

Homestar

22nd April 2019, 07:49 AM

I find it interesting that in 2017 (latest figures I can find) 30 more people in Australia died of the Flu than were killed in Car accidents yet far more focus is put on vehicle safety and on curbing the road toll.

Eevo

22nd April 2019, 07:58 AM

I find it interesting that I'm 2017

i didnt know you were that old!

DiscoMick

22nd April 2019, 08:25 AM

It's been an extended flu season. I see there have already been 26,000 confirmed flu cases in 2019. It's predicted to be a bad season.
Flu vaccine program brought forward as surge in cases surprises health authorities - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-08/flu-vaccine-program-brought-forward-as-numbers-spike/10980370)

Homestar

22nd April 2019, 08:28 AM

i didnt know you were that old!

Now that would be something wouldn't it... Bloody auto correct! [emoji16]

Slunnie

22nd April 2019, 08:38 AM

Now that would be something wouldn't it... Bloody auto correct! [emoji16]
I just assumed the Oil of Olay worked really well. :lol2:

DiscoClax

23rd April 2019, 09:33 PM

I just assumed the Oil of Olay worked really well. [emoji38]2:If you called it Oil of Ulan you'd be showing your age... [emoji14]

NavyDiver

24th April 2019, 03:38 PM

when i said man flu, i meant a cold.

No way EEvo. Man flu is serious mate

150303

Eevo

24th April 2019, 04:19 PM

No way EEvo. Man flu is serious mate

150303

well i went to the doctor today and she believes it to be the flu. talk about karma!

NavyDiver

24th April 2019, 04:26 PM

well i went to the doctor today and she believes it to be the flu. talk about karma!

Not sure of these are self help yet or only via some doctors . You can find out on the spot with this test now. INFLUENZA A&B BINAXNOW RAPID TEST KIT BOX/10 - 23. Pregnancy and Influenza Tests, Influenza Tests - Product Detail - McFarlane Medical (https://www.mcfarlanemedical.com.au/23010AL/INFLUENZA-A_and_B-BINAXNOW-RAPID-TEST-KIT-BOX_or_10/pd.php)

Roverlord off road spares

25th April 2019, 04:06 PM

You can get it free if you are asthmatic as my son Brendon will be getting it soon before he moves to Japan. As he got the job with the Jet Program. Heather

DiscoMick

25th April 2019, 08:43 PM

Great news that he got the job.
Are the flu strains in Japan the same as here?

bblaze

26th April 2019, 01:45 PM

went for some blood test this morning, (sister)have you had a flue shot, (me) no never had one. well now I have
cheers
blaze

4bee

26th April 2019, 02:39 PM

people who come to work with the sniffles and say ‘I’ve got the flu’ give me the ****s. Had the flu once, I was in bed for nearly 2 weeks, could barely move to go to the

They give me the ****s as well. If they had the real flue they wouldn't even turn up for work. [bighmmm]

If they think they have the Flue, why do they turn up? Tre generous? "I think I'll give it to everybody I meet today" Arse!

DiscoMick

27th April 2019, 06:35 AM

Don't think having the ****s is a flu symptom, but I agree with you - stay home!
Scariest sight in my world is a classroom full of sniffling, snotty students exhaling their germs into the air-con for all to breathe. Go away!

Roverlord off road spares

27th April 2019, 11:14 PM

Great news that he got the job.
Are the flu strains in Japan the same as here?
I don't know if the strain is the same as Japan, Brendon will have to ask the Dr when he goes.

RANDLOVER

30th April 2019, 10:29 AM

Does anyone else think the flu shot makes them feel a bit sick? I know people had that theory about the old ones, which I used to discount, but I think the new 4 in 1 may be a bit strong.

DiscoMick

30th April 2019, 11:08 AM

I've never had any reaction from a flu shot. Even if I did, it would still be better than actually getting the flu, I think.

4bee

30th April 2019, 02:28 PM

Well not so far. I had mine yesterday but apart from having agro from a Frozen Shoulder but that was in evidence from about 4/5 weeks ago.

What really astounds me is the very light touch, if any, of the Fluvax needle or is the person administering it is more skillful than the local Boilermaker?[biggrin]

Needed a jab of Cortisone for my shoulder & 'er indoors said to them ask them for a Testosterone jab while they are at it?

That smarted a bit on top of the shoulder pain (the Cortisone needle not the suggestion of a Testosterone one) but it was supposed to have had a Local Anesthetic in it. [bawl]

Funny woman!

DiscoMick

7th May 2019, 06:29 PM

Flu experts predict 4,000 Australians will die from influenza this year

Flu experts predict 4,000 Australians will die from influenza this year | Australia news | The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/may/07/flu-experts-predict-4000-australians-will-die-from-influenza-this-year?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard)

NavyDiver

8th May 2019, 08:53 AM

10000+ in SA with 10 deaths already. We know for a fact that the actual detected cases are only a % of the actual cases. That means a lot more people than 10,000 have it or have had it this year in South Oz.

The numbers have just started going nuts here in VIC. So easy to avoid for about $15 for people who are not eligible for a free on.

'Healthy' teenager among 10 people dead from influenza outbreak in SA this year - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-07/teenager-among-ten-influenza-deaths-reported-in-sa/11088168)

DiscoMick

8th May 2019, 12:01 PM

Yep, I'm getting mine this week. Better jabbed than dead.

DoubleChevron

8th May 2019, 01:46 PM

We get free flue vaccinations through work .................... I must try it some day [bighmmm]

JDNSW

8th May 2019, 02:07 PM

Went to the doctor for it yesterday - out of stock. Phone ahead next time to make sure they have some.

NavyDiver

9th May 2019, 02:13 PM

Its 40+ dead in Australia so far this year. I heard Ballarat is a hot spot DoubleChevron. We are jabbing 40 PS school teachers as I type this [biggrin]

DiscoMick

9th May 2019, 03:16 PM

Just got my 65+ three strain free government one.
The nurse said they have had a number of serious cases already this year. She said the peak is expected to be September -October. She recommended I come back in October and get a four strain booster to carry through the rest of the year. I

Homestar

10th May 2019, 04:26 PM

Had mine yesterday at work. 👍

Rolled up to the Branch where they were doing it and got a free drug and alcohol test too, as the random testers just happened to be there at the same time - amazing coincidence considering they knew the entire Sales team were dropping by that branch that very morning. 😁.

Didn’t bother me and I passed with flying colours, but makes you wonder how ‘Random’ it really is.

4bee

10th May 2019, 04:40 PM

Free? No way, there has to be a catch in it somewhere. Did they check your Urine & solids?[smilebigeye]

NavyDiver

10th May 2019, 05:45 PM

Free? No way, there has to be a catch in it somewhere. Did they check your Urine & solids?[smilebigeye]

Off topic

Often wonder when I donate blood if they will ever call me as say what the heck! [biggrin]

Random is questionable at the airport explosive test. I think I have been checked every single time I fly. My beautiful head must do it [bigrolf]

DiscoMick

10th May 2019, 06:31 PM

Had mine yesterday at work. [emoji106]

Rolled up to the Branch where they were doing it and got a free drug and alcohol test too, as the random testers just happened to be there at the same time - amazing coincidence considering they knew the entire Sales team were dropping by that branch that very morning. [emoji16].

Didn’t bother me and I passed with flying colours, but makes you wonder how ‘Random’ it really is.Our youngest son is drug and alcohol tested every single day when he arrives at work, and he works in an office in the city!

4bee

10th May 2019, 07:17 PM

Well Mick, they can't take chances with budding Supermen. They could get themselves in all sorts of troubles like trying to leap tall buildings in one leap, & imagine going faster than a speeding bullet in the city. It doesn't bear thinking about, all the chaos he could cause getting up to those antics & as for being more powerful than a speeding locomotive., the cops would have a field day with your lad knocking over Fruit Barrows & Newstands & gettting in the way of the Fire Services & Ambos.[smilebigeye]

4bee

10th May 2019, 07:28 PM

Off topic

Often wonder when I donate blood if they will ever call me as say what the heck! [biggrin]

Random is questionable at the airport explosive test. I think I have been checked every single time I fly. My beautiful head must do it [bigrolf]

Redhead are you diver?[biggrin]

NavyDiver

10th May 2019, 07:32 PM

Redhead are you diver?[biggrin]

Nope [biggrin][biggrin][biggrin]

150804

4bee

10th May 2019, 07:38 PM

Well pink-ish then?

A brave man displaying his follicles like that. I did say follicles.:Rolling::Thump:

DiscoMick

11th May 2019, 06:55 AM

4bee

11th May 2019, 11:07 AM

A Doctor responds.

A tricky one this.

Hhhhmmmmmmmmm, then it sounds like he really really really needs some help from Capt.Marvel, Superwoman & Superman as mentioned, Barney Flintstone & even Felix the Cat & probably his Dad.

I also would take his I-Pad & booze supplies away from his bedroom for a couple of weeks just to be on the safe side.[bighmmm]

Hope this helps.[smilebigeye]

DoubleChevron

20th May 2019, 01:53 PM

Its 40+ dead in Australia so far this year. I heard Ballarat is a hot spot DoubleChevron. We are jabbing 40 PS school teachers as I type this [biggrin]

"She'll be right mate". The flu has always been around. The media is just jumping on the gloom and doom band wagon. I work for one of the largest pathology companies in Australia. I had someone jumping up and down telling me how this is the worst flu season ever. The flus are worse than ever .... We have been instructed to never cough into our hands... or touch door handles ... make sure you cough into your elbow etc.... If your sick make sure you stay at home ( I offered to stay at home every day if it helped them feel safe .... I was ignored [bighmmm] )

My rolling of eyes and groaning didn't go down well as they handed out bottles of anti-bacterial hand sanitizers to everyone. I promptly chucked mine in the bin. "Yeah, I"m not using that ****.... My hands will be a mess of contact dermatitis within a week if I start rubbing those chemicals into them... This isn't a hospital we work in you know".

So I was shown how "Horific and world ending" the stats are for the increase in flu found ( We are a pathology lab, we can prove this 100% accurately ). Obviously my answer to this was "Has the number of people being tested for the poor old flu increased by a similar percentage to the "increase in flu" ............. At which point no-one really wanted to talk to me.

Yes the flu is bad. I'm pretty sure it always has been and no media hype and bull**** statisics are going to convince me the world is ending [bigsmile1] [biggrin]

Look at it this way. 5years ago they probably never even bothered to test for the flu. However lets say we test double the amount of people tested for flu each year. GUESS WHAT !!! WE WILL PROBABLY FIND THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE WITH THE FLU IS DOUBLING EVERY YEAR ...... Wow ..... Who would have thought that [bigrolf] [bigwhistle] if you test twice as many people, you will probably find twice as many that actually do have the flu [bigrolf]

seeya
Shane L.

trout1105

20th May 2019, 03:56 PM

We had our flue jabs today and at our age why would we want to chance Not getting the shots[thumbsupbig]

speleomike

20th May 2019, 04:37 PM

Hi all

Same here. Just got mine last week. As I'm in my 60's and get oublic transport and work in a place with thousands of students it's prudent to get it. Everyone (unless they have prior known problems with the modern vaccine) should get one as the effectivness increases once most of the population is immunised.

Mike

DiscoMick

20th May 2019, 06:31 PM

People are only tested for the flu if they are already sick when they front the doctor, so if more people are tested it means more people are already sick.

DiscoMick

20th May 2019, 06:33 PM

Immunisation Coalition |
2019 Influenza Statistics - Immunisation Coalition (https://www.immunisationcoalition.org.au/news-media/2019-influenza-statistics/)

speleomike

20th May 2019, 07:21 PM

Hi

Immunisation Coalition | 2019 Influenza Statistics - Immunisation Coalition (https://www.immunisationcoalition.org.au/news-media/2019-influenza-statistics/)

Great link. I followed through to see who the Board of Directors are and what they do;
"We create awareness and provide evidence-based information.
We provide educational resources. All our materials are provided free of intellectual property.
We hold scientific meetings and educational forums on Influenza and adult vaccination."

Mike

NavyDiver

21st May 2019, 08:43 AM

"She'll be right mate". The flu has always been around. .. if you test twice as many people, you will probably find twice as many that actually do have the flu [bigrolf]

seeya
Shane L.

Your right of course on several facts Shane. Its well known that the most people with the flu are not tested meaning the cases reported are well under the cases reported.

About 16 million were slaughtered by WW1, Just after that, 50 to 100 million people died from Flu http://1918 influenza pandemic (January 1918 – December 1920 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu)"life expectancy in the United States dropped by about 12 years" for that two year period due to the numbers killed. When the 50 to 100 million people died from Flu many times that number got very sick from the flu but survived.

This morning a very high level Virologist suggested unusual very high number of summer flu cases suggest their is a rather alarming Change to the virus(s) On the brighter side a new joint pneumovax/flu vax has been developed by some very bright Australian scientist. ABC Am link (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/adelaide/programs/am/april-flu-cases-six-times-higher-than-worst-april-on-record/11132584)Associate Professor Ian McKay might be worth listening to?

It is entirely possible virus are a lot more able to adapt than many give them credit for.

DoubleChevron

21st May 2019, 08:57 AM

Your right of course on several facts Shane. Its well known that the most people with the flu are not tested meaning the cases reported are well under the cases reported.

About 16 million were slaughtered by WW1, Just after that, 50 to 100 million people died from Flu http://1918 influenza pandemic (January 1918 – December 1920 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu)"life expectancy in the United States dropped by about 12 years" for that two year period due to the numbers killed. When the 50 to 100 million people died from Flu many times that number got very sick from the flu but survived.

This morning a very high level Virologist suggested unusual very high number of summer flu cases suggest their is a rather alarming Change to the virus(s) On the brighter side a new joint pneumovax/flu vax has been developed by some very bright Australian scientist. ABC Am link (https://www.abc.net.au/radio/adelaide/programs/am/april-flu-cases-six-times-higher-than-worst-april-on-record/11132584)Associate Professor Ian McKay might be worth listening to?

It is entirely possible virus are a lot more able to adapt than many give them credit for.

We must be due for another "super bug" at some point. ie: a new virus there is almost no herd immunity too. It will spread around the world within a few short weeks given airline travel if it has any sort of decent incubation period.

There is some extraordinarily intelligent people out there ... that should be listened to. They are often hard to discern from the vocal majority that have business interests.

There isn't much doubt in my mind the flu jab IS a good idea. The only issue with it is trying to figure out which strains of which known viruses to include in it. We simply leave that to people that are far smarter than me to work out (I'm just someone that tinkers on computers for a living).

I will have a listen to Ian Mckay when I get a chance. I must be getting old. Never in my life have I listened to "boring academic stuff". However recently I have found anything Jordan Peterson talks about absolutely fascinating (regardless of the topic. He even believes in religion which I find quite amazing for someone that is obviously far smarter than 1000 of me combined would be).

seeya,
Shane L.

DiscoMick

21st May 2019, 10:34 AM

Measles is making a comeback because people are refusing to be vaccinated. I read that if the measles vaccination rate false below about 75% a major measles epidemic becomes quite likely because of the large numbers of infected carriers going around spreading it to everyone they meet. Hope that's wrong. Meanwhile maybe we should avoid visiting Byron Bay.

JDNSW

21st May 2019, 01:07 PM

I don't think that there is a magic number, but epidemiologists talk about 95% being what we should aim for, and that below 90% they start to get worried. quite a few communities in Australia are in the low 80s. Measles is one of the most infectious known diseases, so once the rate drops below a critical figure, probably in the 80s, an epidemic becomes almost certain.

DiscoMick

21st May 2019, 01:22 PM

Yes, this WHO site says they are aiming for 90% first round vaccination and 80% second round. Its a horrible disease and there is no antivirus treatment, so if you get it there isn't much can be done. Most die from complications.
Personally, and this is admittedly a strong view, I think parents who refuse to have their children vaccinated against these diseases are guilty of child neglect.

Measles (https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/measles)

JDNSW

21st May 2019, 08:40 PM

There is a tendency to consider measles as a minor childhood disease. This used to have some justification in Western Europe when there was a high child mortality rate, and measles had a high survival rate compared to other childhood diseases such as diphtheria and whooping cough, and the number of deaths from measles was small compared to deaths from gastroenteritis (which remained a major killer of infants into the 1950s). But as other diseases were almost eliminated (mainly by vaccination), and we learnt how to effectively and cheaply treat gastroenteritis, measles became much more important, especially because it is so infectious.

And measles has always showed greater virulence in non-western populations; for example, I remember reading somewhere that it was a major factor in the massive reduction in the population of the Pacific islands after European contact, and this probably also was the case in the Americas and Australia, although in these last two smallpox may have been more significant.

NavyDiver

24th May 2019, 05:32 PM

If you want a flu vaxs be quick. I cannot buy any more Private and Government stocks are about to get rationed [bighmmm]At a guess we have a few weeks supplies left. My Doctors have under a weeks worth left.

superquag

24th May 2019, 09:05 PM

Hi

Great link. I followed through to see who the Board of Directors are and what they do;
"We create awareness and provide evidence-based information.
We provide educational resources. All our materials are provided free of intellectual property.
We hold scientific meetings and educational forums on Influenza and adult vaccination."

Mike

Yes, "interesting" link. At first reading they sound so.... harmless and Well Intentioned, you know, lots of Warm Fuzzy and Seeking YOUR Greater Good...
- Till you click on the non-displaying logos for the sponsors... and notice that 5 of them are all the usual suspects, GSK, MSD, pfizer, Roche and one I hadn't heard of, 'Seqirus' (CSL owned)

Gosh, who'd a thunk ?

superquag

24th May 2019, 09:38 PM

If you want a flu vaxs be quick. I cannot buy any more Private and Government stocks are about to get rationed At a guess we have a few weeks supplies left. My Doctors have under a weeks worth left.

Until then, keep away from disease-ridden snotty noses (usually kids on my school buses...)

Or, [B]until the vaccine is back in stock... you can make sure your immune system is working at it's best, which means ensuring sufficient/appropriate nutrients in your diet.... but as our soils are so depleted, taking them via pills is not to be sneezed at...
Sorry, couldn't resist that ![bigsmile1]

Seriously, vitamin C is the first to spring to mind, as the modern diet barely supplies enough. Zinc is another that is reputed as beneficial.

Zoos will balance the greenery feeds of great apes to supply around 5,000mg per day.
Vets say Guinea Pigs need about 30mg per day (for a 1kg furrball),

- so a 100kg human is going to need substantially more than the (USA) RDA 90mg per day. More if a smoker, or highly stressed...

https://www.nal.usda.gov/sites/default/files/fnic_uploads//RDA_AI_vitamins_elements.pdf
"
But VIC Health informs us that humans only need "...45mg per day, and excess to that is excreted..." That's the same as a morbidly obese, stressed Guinea Pig...

My minimum daily dose is half a dozen 500mg orange flavoured lollies, spread over the day. Over all my school-bus-driving time, No disease-ridden kid has succeeded in infecting me !

Oh, if/when you finally DO get 'vaccinated', keep away from the very young and vulnerable, as YOU may be shedding virus particles and can possibly infect them for a short time afterwards...

Breaking News ! (just heard on the News) - "someone" in Oz is working on a new flu vaccine that is going to give you 'lifetime' protection ! . [bigwhistle]

Slunnie

24th May 2019, 10:12 PM

Breaking News ! (just heard on the News) - "someone" in Oz is working on a new flu vaccine that is going to give you 'lifetime' protection ! . [bigwhistle]

This is really cool. My Haemetolgist was saying they have a new one needle treatment for CLL Leukaemia also. They induce an immune response that remains active for life. Its also a $1m needle.

JDNSW

25th May 2019, 06:29 AM

DiscoMick

25th May 2019, 02:42 PM

I'm off to a four-day Year 8 camp next week, do I'm glad I've had my flu shot for protection from snotty nosed kids.

NavyDiver

25th May 2019, 06:25 PM

Until then, keep away from disease-ridden snotty noses (usually kids on my school buses...)

Or, until the vaccine is back in stock... you can make sure your immune system is working at it's best, which means ensuring sufficient/appropriate nutrients in your diet.... but as our soils are so depleted, taking them via pills is not to be sneezed at...
Sorry, couldn't resist that ![bigsmile1]

Seriously, vitamin C is the first to spring to mind, as the modern diet barely supplies enough. Zinc is another that is reputed as beneficial.

Zoos will balance the greenery feeds of great apes to supply around 5,000mg per day.
Vets say Guinea Pigs need about 30mg per day (for a 1kg furrball),

- so a 100kg human is going to need substantially more than the (USA) RDA 90mg per day. More if a smoker, or highly stressed...

https://www.nal.usda.gov/sites/default/files/fnic_uploads//RDA_AI_vitamins_elements.pdf
"
But VIC Health informs us that humans only need "...45mg per day, and excess to that is excreted..." That's the same as a morbidly obese, stressed Guinea Pig...

My minimum daily dose is half a dozen 500mg orange flavoured lollies, spread over the day. Over all my school-bus-driving time, No disease-ridden kid has succeeded in infecting me !

Oh, if/when you finally DO get 'vaccinated', keep away from the very young and vulnerable, as YOU may be shedding virus particles and can possibly infect them for a short time afterwards...

Breaking News ! (just heard on the News) - "someone" in Oz is working on a new flu vaccine that is going to give you 'lifetime' protection ! . [bigwhistle]

There will be no more stock in 2019 saddly

Roverlord off road spares

25th May 2019, 06:59 PM

Mario and I got ours yesterday, it didn't cost us anything, going through our Dr. I couldn't stand him going back in to hospital, with his health problems that he has. And I can not get sick as I am his carer.

superquag

25th May 2019, 07:45 PM

No flu vaccines used in this contry contain live virus, so there is no possibility of their leading to infection in either the person vaccinated or anyone in contact with them.

Most Australians certainly have a vitamin C deficit - because we do not eat enough fresh fruit. And correcting this diet is easy, and probably cheaper than artificial supplements.

My grandfather used to tell of a (West Australian wheatbelt) disease locally known as Barcoo Rot.
-- Slow healing sores, gum bleeding/tooth loss, skin bruising, debilitation and even skin breaks & bleeding... sounds much like good old fashioned Scurvy as enjoyed by HM's sailors or yore.
So, change the name to disguise the disease... [bigwhistle]
Bottom line, ANY supplementation from a pill, extra capsicum or kiwi-Fruit is better than none.

RANDLOVER

25th May 2019, 08:13 PM

My grandfather used to tell of a (West Australian wheatbelt) disease locally known as Barcoo Rot.
-- Slow healing sores, gum bleeding/tooth loss, skin bruising, debilitation and even skin breaks & bleeding... sounds much like good old fashioned Scurvy as enjoyed by HM's sailors or yore.
So, change the name to disguise the disease... [bigwhistle]
Bottom line, ANY supplementation from a pill, extra capsicum or kiwi-Fruit is better than none.

You actually don't need much Vit-C to avoid Scurvy (Barcoo Rot?), as the only reason Capt. Cook didn't suffer from this was not because he was eating barrels of vegetables, but because everyday he had toast with quince jam, IIRC.

superquag

25th May 2019, 08:34 PM

True to a point... as it doesn't take much to lift scurvy from 'frank', up into 'sub-clinical'.

Partially, because we humans can sort-of re-cycle some of our oxidised 'C', an advantage envied by Guinea Pigs and Great Apes. - Fruit Bats don't care about us as their native diet normally supplies them adequately.

Goats which can almost weigh as much as a skinny human or Dirty Harry in his movie, produce around 185mg/kg of body weight, or 13 GRAMS per day as normal, and you wouldn't believe how high it goes when stressed.
(If you go here, around 9:00 minutes, you'll find out ! YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0LLX0sgwAU) )

The history of Vitamin C, Scurvy, Dr Lind and the British Admiralty will leave you wondering at the stupidity of the Ruling Class

And Yes, getting your Vit. C via food is always preferable, and we have a fantastic source in Oz
Australian Native Fruit Kakadu Plum Rich In Vitamin C | Asian Scientist Magazine | Science, technology and medical news updates from Asia (https://www.asianscientist.com/2013/12/in-the-lab/australian-native-fruit-kakadu-plum-rich-vitamin-2013/)

JDNSW

26th May 2019, 06:05 AM

James Cook is celebrted for his conquest of scurvy at sea. This was not so much the result of his belief in fruit and vegetables as several other factors.

Firstly, he was supplied with large quantities of, and ordered to test, a variety of antiscorbutics (anti-scurvy remedies) and was sufficiently intelligent, well motivated and disciplined to do so, and having a scientific mind, did so properly.

Secondly, The RN had been reformed by the recently deceased First Lord of the Admiralty, George Anson, who lost 90% of his crew to scurvy during his voyage round the world in 1740-44, and had been determined to find a solution. Cook's voyage was seen as an ideal test for this, as it would be a long voyage with long legs out of communication with regular ports, in other words, something similar in this respect to Anson's voyage.

In this, Cook was successful beyond all expectation, with none lost to disease before they stopped at Batavia (Jakarta) on the way home, and none lost to scurvy in the entire voyage.

This was the result of forcing all crew members to eat things they did not want to, the effective one that was mostly used was sauerkraut, something totally unfamiliar to eighteenth century English seamen. Officers generally suffered less from scurvy than did other ranks, because they had their private supplies of luxury food, which typically included preserved fruit.

Anson had observed that his crew had recovered rapidly from scurvy when any sort of vegetables were available to supplement their diet of salted meat and biscuit, especially after their arrival at Juan Fernandez Id - when they arrived there had been only eight seamen in addition to the officers and their servants able to stand, and they had lost over 600 out of a crew of nearly a thousand.

superquag

26th May 2019, 12:23 PM

And the sad thing is.... Anson would have lost NONE, if he'd read the book as published by Mrs Ebot Mitchell, thirty years previously. (1707).

But she was a mere woman, so we had to wait for Dr James Lind to come up with the goods - FORTY six years after her, - and then they didn't take him seriously enough anyway...

Science advances "One funeral at a time", but with the inertia of the British Admiralty it took thousands to make this cheap, non-patentable step.

With due respect to the good Dr Lind, there's evidence that the Ancients many have done it first...

James Lind and Scurvy: The First Clinical Trial in History? - OpenMind (https://www.bbvaopenmind.com/en/science/leading-figures/james-lind-and-scurvy-the-first-clinical-trial-in-history/)
The whole saga is a study in 'Human Nature'

Pickles2

26th May 2019, 02:52 PM

JDNSW

26th May 2019, 03:00 PM

Yes. And the Spanish navy may have actually come up with it at the beginning of the 17th century, but lacked the discipline and organisation to make seamen eat things they did not want to - and probably neither did the RN, until Anson's reforms - which notably included funding for sailors' health. The effects of citrus fruit were known much earlier, published, for example, by Admiral Richard Hawkins in 1593, and also shown by the Portuguese in the early 17th century.

But even after Cook, it took another thirty years, and it was not until the late 1790s that the scurvy prevention was actually implemented in RN ships. And exactly what worked (and what didn't) was not fully established until well into the 20th century. Vitamin C (also known as ascorbic acid) was not isolated until 1927.

Interestingly, if you read some of hakluyt's accounts of the early long distance voyages in the 15th and 16th centuries, it becomes clear that in the early days of long voyages, starvation was as much, if not more, risk as was scurvy. Navies and ships owners and captains learned how to preserve food in ways that enabled it to last only in the early part of the seventeenth century. Salted meat and hardtack might not be a particularly attractive diet - but it beats starving.

DiscoMick

27th May 2019, 10:59 AM

Yes, scurvy is an interesting topic. Cook did well. Mind you, the Chinese had citrus gardens in greenhouses on their ships about 300 years earlier.

JDNSW

27th May 2019, 12:36 PM

Yes, but available records do not suggest they did voyages with very long legs between port calls.

DiscoMick

27th May 2019, 12:55 PM

Reading 'Burke and Wills' by Peter Fitzsimmons, they found the large amount of citric juice they were told to carry to be completely useless and it did nothing to stop scurvy. The theory was the process used to distill the citric juice actually removed the beneficial qualities from it, so they gained no benefits.
They did better when they copied the tribes along the Cooper Creek and collected the plant known as nardoo, but it had to be prepared in the correct method, to create a kind of biscuit, or it too lost its benefits.
Of course, if they had copied the tribes and fished in the river they would have caught numerous fresh fish and benefited from cooking them fresh, but that's another story.

DiscoMick

27th May 2019, 12:58 PM

Yes, but available records do not suggest they did voyages with very long legs between port calls.
Its true they tended to hop between coastal ports rather than head straight out to sea, but they still covered long distances, I believe.

4bee

27th May 2019, 02:17 PM

Yes, scurvy is an interesting topic. Cook did well. Mind you, the Chinese had citrus gardens in greenhouses on their ships about 300 years earlier.

Lithographs of those early ships appear to have them as large as a Citrus Orchard anyway & pontoon/barge like. Haven't noticed Grey Fergies or Cultivators though, but I bet they were hiding amongst the trees somewhere.

JDNSW

27th May 2019, 02:35 PM

Its true they tended to hop between coastal ports rather than head straight out to sea, but they still covered long distances, I believe.

Yes, but not long hops. Makes the supply situation a lot easier - especially for naval ships with large crews. There are, as far as I know, no records of Chinese ships crossing either the Pacific or Atlantic oceans. Certainly they crossed the Indian Ocean, but with a number of stops.

DiscoMick

27th May 2019, 05:41 PM

I've seen claims about Chinese ships reaching South America but I assume they probably stayed close to the coast.

superquag

27th May 2019, 06:37 PM

I reckon I've ducked a bullet this year... the advancing of 'flu-like symptoms has paused, some of the voice is returning... Here's hoping I've nipped it in the bud. - Can't take flu shots 'cos the last one made me very sick, and since then I get a serious then a mild dose every season ! My GP can't explain, but he believes in adequate sleep, isolation, hygiene and luck.[wink11]
Besides, he's nursing a dwindling stock for folk who REALLY need it / Demand it.

I'm a card-carrying needle-phobic and risking "bowel tolerance" with handfuls of Vitamin C & capsicums.. is preferable to being stabbed with a blunt water pipe. ![bigwhistle]