Is a catch can important on a modern turbo diesel? Good article

[spudfan]

I found this very interesting article. It seems to be an honest straight forward write up.
Is a catch can important on a modern turbo diesel? (https://www.4wdingaustralia.com/4x4/is-a-catch-can-important-on-a-modern-turbo-diesel/)
Why I’m removing my HPD Catch Can (https://www.4wdingaustralia.com/4x4/why-im-removing-my-hpd-catch-can/)
I found it a really good read.
Here are some comments from July 2019 at the end of the post

They are not necessary so, leave your 4×4 alone.
If they did anything worthwhile the factory would fit them from new. Your manifold is still going to gum up no matter what you do.
Your engine warranty can be made null & void by fitting a C/Can too. Some Manufacturers are stricter than others, but Mitsubishi will try it on if you have engine trouble & also have a C/Can fitted to a Triton. Hell, some of their workshops will try to void your warranty if you have an aftermarket bull bar fitted, even if they had it fitted for you as an aftermarket accessory from new.
The prices for a Provent 200 is an absolute rip-off and they are only worth about $50 bucks maximum which is the same amount as the non genuine versions. And in reality the filters for them should be worth about $5 bucks max.
Wait until the novelty wears off & the 4×4 fan-boys move onto their next best thing ever & you will pick one up for the cheap as chips.
I reckon your all brainwashed & have more money than sense. Bet most of you pay Top dollar for your Fully Synthetic oil as well. Never believe anything an oil company tells you about their products. Always go for the mid range stuff because the only difference between it and the $150 dollar stuff is in the package

Then the reply
Hey mate,
There are a lot of diesel motors with factory fitted catch cans (just not in the 4WD game), and Provent is the OEM for a lot of them. The OEM will always look unfavourably towards aftermarket modifications, whether they are a bull bar or catch can, as they are not supplied or certified by them. That doesn’t mean they are no good.
If you think you can engineer, prototype, build, test, re-engineer and make the Provents for $50 all the best to you. They are a market leader for a reason.
If you took a few minutes to look around you would see results of those running catch cans from new, and their manifolds are spotless even after 200,000km.
I’ve never run synthetic oil, but I assume you have a tribology degree to make such statements?
Either way, each to their own mate. If you don’t feel the need to fit one then don’t. In my opinion though, if you are keeping the vehicle for more than a couple of years they are a must
Aaron

[goingbush]

The Author is clearly clueless. Interestingly Iveco Daily is one example of a Diesel with built in catch can , The 2.3 L version has a Provent built into its rocker cover & the 3.0 has an improved version with centrifuge in its timing case , the filter spins and recovered oil from fumes are condensed to drip back into the sump .

I had a problem with the centrifuge filter media in mine blocking so removed it and fitted a remote Provent 200 in its place and I find it is a better solution for me .

Its not just the Catch Can , you also need to blank off the EGR to prevent inlet manifold filling with crud.

[Ninety]

My HPD catch works well. After multiple split hoses covered in oil and a split intercooler i thought i would replace them with BAS silicone hoses and a BAS intercooler.

At the same time i installed the catch can and the amount of crap it catches can only be a good thing.

The author ended up settling with a ProVent i believe.

[spudfan]

Well I e-mail Mann-Hummel and asked whether the Provent2 was suitable for fitment to my Puma 2.4. They replied and advised me AGAINST fitting it. Here is the e-mail....

Thank you very much for your interest in our products
ProVent² is basically feasible for Diesel engines but it needs to be adjusted to the specific requirements of each engine type. Different parameters influence the performance and could, if applied wrong and not validated correctly, severe damage to your engine. Therefore we only supply this filter type directly to OEM´s and go through several development loops together with them. I am sorry to give you this negative feedback but in your case we are not able to support your inquiry.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Best regards
Dominic Burgstahler
Product Management HD&I Liquid filters
So it is not just a matter of buying one, conjuring up the pipework and fixing it in place. Other factors need to be taken in to consideration. Seems to me that if factory fitted the ECU will be notified and the catch can integrated into the system.

[Robmacca]

Well I e-mail Mann-Hummel and asked whether the Provent2 was suitable for fitment to my Puma 2.4. They replied and advised me AGAINST fitting it. Here is the e-mail....

Thank you very much for your interest in our products
ProVent² is basically feasible for Diesel engines but it needs to be adjusted to the specific requirements of each engine type. Different parameters influence the performance and could, if applied wrong and not validated correctly, severe damage to your engine. Therefore we only supply this filter type directly to OEM´s and go through several development loops together with them. I am sorry to give you this negative feedback but in your case we are not able to support your inquiry.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Best regards
Dominic Burgstahler
Product Management HD&I Liquid filters
So it is not just a matter of buying one, conjuring up the pipework and fixing it in place. Other factors need to be taken in to consideration. Seems to me that if factory fitted the ECU will be notified and the catch can integrated into the system.

What's the difference between a Provent-1 and a Provent-2?


A mate of mine has installed a normal Provent to his 2.4 Puma and to date hasn't had any issues but its probably hasn't been in long enough either to cause an issue (if it was to that is...)

[Tombie]

Well I e-mail Mann-Hummel and asked whether the Provent2 was suitable for fitment to my Puma 2.4. They replied and advised me AGAINST fitting it. Here is the e-mail....

Thank you very much for your interest in our products
ProVent² is basically feasible for Diesel engines but it needs to be adjusted to the specific requirements of each engine type. Different parameters influence the performance and could, if applied wrong and not validated correctly, severe damage to your engine. Therefore we only supply this filter type directly to OEM´s and go through several development loops together with them. I am sorry to give you this negative feedback but in your case we are not able to support your inquiry.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Best regards
Dominic Burgstahler
Product Management HD&I Liquid filters
So it is not just a matter of buying one, conjuring up the pipework and fixing it in place. Other factors need to be taken in to consideration. Seems to me that if factory fitted the ECU will be notified and the catch can integrated into the system.

Puma engines have a very good oil/air seperator built in. Not of as great a benefit as earlier diesels.

[Graekynn]

Puma engines have a very good oil/air seperator built in. Not of as great a benefit as earlier diesels.

Does the built in separator require any cleaning or maintenance? I'm assuming it just drains back to sump so wouldn't need emptying.

[spudfan]

I don't see it mentioned in the handbook or the service schedule.

[scarry]

mistake[bigsad]

[Tombie]

Built into the engine.

[roverrescue]

My understanding of the 2.4/2.2 tdci engine is it does have a baffle oil separator within the rocker cover BUT the more complete version including filter is found on some Ford variants
The filter goes where the beer holder in the rocker cover cap is on those variants

I’ve fitted a provent, it drains to a hose with a bung

I drain it each service and get less than 20mL of oil???

S

[Rolly]

I too have fitted a catchcan get the same amount(20ml per 10000km).

Mine was a kit provided by Provent, time will tell if I've done the right thing or not.

[Tombie]

I too have fitted a catchcan get the same amount(20ml per 10000km).

Mine was a kit provided by Provent, time will tell if I've done the right thing or not.

You won’t have done the wrong thing.

[isuzutoo-eh]

The HPD catch can isn't a good performer in actual comparison testing. In a shameless self-plug have a read of the linked article I wrote for Unsealed 4X4 using data from lab testing by Ben Mullins (Isuzurover on this forum) to see what catch cans do and how the cheap, expensive, plastic, metal, brand name and copycat catch cans perform against each other.

The great oil catch can comparison - Unsealed 4X4 (https://www.unsealed4x4.com.au/the-great-oil-catch-can-comparison/)

[inken_dave]

Hi All,

So I haven't fitted a catch-can.....My 2013 110 has done 145000km and has the same power as it always had. I doesn't do a lot of towing, but when it does it will do a 2000km single block(family holiday with boat) using wide throttle(EGR closed). Most of my travelling for daily driving is at 110km/h indicated(104km/h on the GPS), so maybe not a lot of exhaust gas being re-circulated?

So my question.......

Has anyone pulled a 2.2 Puma manifold off at similar km's without a catch can fitted and found a lot of soot buildup? I'd be really interested to see if the Puma separator is OK?

Pictures would be a bonus!

[roverrescue]

Dave
Not exactly your question but still relevant

2.4 tdci EGR / Inlet Manifold clean + VCV Replacement (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-130-defender-county/240182-2-4-tdci-egr-inlet-manifold-clean-vcv-replacement.html)

This was my 2.4 at 70,000km

My guess is your 2.2 at twice that distance your intake system will be even more clogged up?

Steve

[karlz]

Built into the engine.

You mean the oil leaks?

[Tombie]

You mean the oil leaks?

I don’t have any leaking LRs. The current two are faultless.

I refuse to accept even seeping oil and rectify immediately. My TD5s (2) and my V8 Comp spec D1 never had oil leaks for more than 2-3 days before being rectified.


Sorry, probably an overreaction but I’m annoyed by the constant stereotypes and the amazing level of acceptance amongst some owners of sub-standard QA/QC or R&M.

[DiscoMick]

Mine doesn't leak oil either. It's just poor maintenance.