Inverter and solar panels - anyone know much about these brands?

[Homestar]

So, does anyone have either of the following brands and can comment on reliability, etc? Also any solar installers - there used to be a couple on here. I've Googled them, and they seem to have decent overall reviews but really after first hand experience if anyone has any?

TIA.

Solar panel
315W JA Solar 60-Cell Mono PERC Module - JAM60S01-315/PR
Datasheet - https://observer.getpylon.com/proxy/s3/datasheets/panels/JASolar60CellMonoPERC_JAM60S01-300.320-PR.pdf



Inverter
Fronius 5.0-1 · 5000 W - 1 phase
Datasheet - https://observer.getpylon.com/proxy/s3/datasheets/inverters/FroniusPrimo_3.0-8.2-1.pdf

[Graeme]

My inverter is a Fronius Primo 8.2. Fronius software updates can be buggy and it can take a very long time for the bugs to be fixed.

Fronius is in the throws of releasing a replacement range of single-phase inverters that can be DC-coupled to a battery bank and can be configured to run stand-alone in grid outages. The older versions can't be upgraded to the new versions.

I insisted on being provided with the management and service passwords so that I can modify load management criteria.

[p38arover]

Ask here: Green tech - Whirlpool Forums (https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum/143)

[Slunnie]

JA solar are budget end but well supported and reliable. Fronius are top end - note they are fan cooled so can make a bit of noise, I've got an SMA going in which also top end but is quiet.

JA Solar review
JA Solar | Solar Panels Review (https://www.solarquotes.com.au/panels/ja-solar-review.html)

Fronius Review
Fronius | Solar Inverters Review (https://www.solarquotes.com.au/inverters/fronius-review.html)

Check this out, its the best resource.

Solar 101: A Beginner's Guide To Solar Power Systems


(https://www.solarquotes.com.au/solar101.html)

[DiscoMick]

This thread looks like the most suitable I could find in a quick search to share information about solar systems, to help people considering going solar.
We yesterday had our solar upgraded from 2.9 to 6.8 kW with a 5 kW inverter to replace the previous 3kW.
Does it work? It's too early to tell. All I can say is by 10am today our yield for today was 8.3 kW and we had earned $1.34 from our 16 c/kW hour feed in tariff.
Details of the installation.
The panels are REC Twin Peak 2 tier 1 panels. Each panel is actually 2 halves so if one half is shaded the other half still works. There are also diodes on the columns so if some columns are shaded the other columns still function. The warranty is 25 years with an accredited REC installer.
REC is from Norway but is now owned by the giant Chinese Blue star company. It manufactures in both Norway and Singapore. In 2017 it made 1.34 gigawatts of panels, which was more than the entire panels installed in Australia that year.
The inverter in by Sungrow and has a 10 year warranty.
Total cost, including 3.9kW of new panels, frames to elevate the new row over the ridge cap for less shading, the 5kW inverter and installation was $3277 to Megawatts Solar, run by Gary Phillips of Maleny'.
We did get other quotes which were dearer. Gary installed the original panels and wiring for the previous owner. The house has cathedral ceilings, which made the wiring more difficult than normal. Gary was able to use some of the original wiring, which saved time and money.
How long will it take to recoup the cost? That's a bit hard to calculate because our usage patterns are variable, but maybe three years.
So, what can other people share about their experiences?

REC | Solar Panels Review (https://www.solarquotes.com.au/panels/rec-review.html)

Sent from my A1601 using AULRO mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=78345)
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/c3c3f986ac05c51219b69562373556a2.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/393ef781ca1de8f287964c9bc0024f71.jpg

[Slunnie]

I've got the REC Twin Peak 380w panels also, my ones were made in Singapore. They all test up to 384.9w per panel and with 12270.8w installed as tested. I have seen the inverter putting out as close as you can get to 10kw max, normally peaking somewhere rought around 9kw and outputting between 70-75kwh per day but up to 83.5kw/h. You can calculate that to your system as a gauge of what to expect. Actually you should be a bit better than that because of your location, but production is better on a cooler clear day. I think these are a pretty good panel, and the actual production compared to tested production is exceptionally good from what I can see. I totally agree with over panelling the inverter. For me I think payback will be about 3.5 years and Origin are estimating my next bill will be a $655 credit despite giving the AC a flogging this summer. Great choice with the panels.

[DiscoMick]

Sounds good.
I'm still figuring out what the displays mean.
We have 2 strings, one each for the original and new panels.
Currently the real time power is 3.9kW, so far today our yield is 15.8 kW and the return is $2.57, so I think that's good.

[DiscoMick]

If we were doing it again, when our old hot water heater died last year, I wouldn't have put in solar hot water.
Instead I'd have just put in a normal hot water heater and spent the money saved on more solar panels.
The hot water heater would be set to heat during the middle of the day, when electricity from the sun is free.
Much smarter.
BTW now up to 21kW and $3.45. [emoji41]

[W&KO]

Had 6kw system installed yesterday.

Sunpower invertor, nearly went Fronius but couldn’t justify the extra dollars. Installer said Fronius are top of the pack and Sunpower is right up their.

KuPower300 panels.

I needed a switchboard upgrade

Just waiting on Energex/origin to upgrade the meter so we can switch it on......although had a play today watching the meter spin backwards.

[DiscoMick]

Can I ask the cost?

[Slunnie]

How did the new system go by the end of the day? Happy with the output?

[DiscoMick]

Yield of 35kW and revenue of $5.37, on a cloudy day with patches of sun. So it will do better on a sunny day.
So if we conservatively assume it will have revenue of about $5 a day or about $1500 a year, then it will pay for itself in about 2 years.
I was interested to see it started working about 5am and the shot up rapidly about 6.45am and stayed up.
It's cloudy now but still showing real time yield of 3.25kW, so that's good.

[Graeme]

So if we conservatively assume it will have revenue of about $5 a day or about $1500 a yearAll through winter too?

Edit: For the 2019 year my 8kW system earnt $1730 in feed-in and saved $920 of grid power charges so $2650 benefit, less opportunity earnings of the cost of the installation which was very little in this low interest rate climate. If this continues and no servicing charges then about 4.5 years to recoup the installation cost. However I'm not confident that the 20-21c FIT that I've had will continue for very long.

[Slunnie]

However I'm not confident that the 20-21c FIT that I've had will continue for very long.
Thats what I'm on also. I hope it does continue as I thought the solar rebate was going to start winding back from now??? Or did I just make that up?

[W&KO]

Can I ask the cost?

7200 including switchboard upgrade.

[Graeme]

Thats what I'm on also. I hope it does continue as I thought the solar rebate was going to start winding back from now??? Or did I just make that up?
Mine went up slightly recently from 20c with 3% disc on usage to 21c and no disc on usage. The 3% usage disc was about $3.50 for the previous quarter so insignificant compared with a 5% FIT increase. Maybe I'm unnecessarily pessimistic about the future of the current reasonably high FIT.

The solar installation rebates have been winding back each year for a number of years, as per the original formula to eventually discontinue them.

[DiscoMick]

Ours was processed before the reduction from January 1.
The $5 figure came from yesterday, which was a mixture of sunny and cloudy periods, so I thought it might be an average, but it's far too early to be sure.
A fully sunny day would give much higher numbers while today, which was actually a day with no sun, only had a yield of 18kW and revenue of $2.88.
It will be interesting to see how it works out over a year.
Our installation cost was only $3277, because the house already had 2.9 kW of solar when we bought it, so the lower cost of the upgrade to 6.8 makes it quicker to recoup.

[DiscoMick]

I'm feeling virtuous.
Since our upgrade on Tuesday we've saved 70.4 kg of CO2 and 3.8 trees, according to our solar ap. That was on overcast and rainy days, so imagine how much better we could do on sunny days.
[emoji41]
We've also earned enough to almost pay for 3 lattes, so that has to be good.
[emoji1]

[DiscoMick]

Now saved 10.8 trees and 184kg of CO2, so that's all good. [emoji41]
More importantly, lots of rain has meant lower yield and revenue (185kW and $29), but today looks like being a good day with lots of sunshine.
I still think long term we are likely to average about $5 a day in revenue.
The son, who has 6.5 kW of solar, got his latest quarterly power bill recently - it was a whole $2!
He's since changed plans and expects to be in credit next quarter.
It's amusing being able to monitor this online. When the solar goes right down, I know it's raining.
The wife laughs at me.

[NavyDiver]

This is a cool link and site where long term testing of many panels (http://dkasolarcentre.com.au/) is easy to check on

I use a lot if not all of my work solar. Wish I could at home but batteries are still a bit pricing to time shift day to night [biggrin]

[W&KO]

Not sure how solar directly saves trees.....

[NavyDiver]

Not sure how solar directly saves trees.....
Doubt is much to do with trees[biggrin] 24.175 MWh in total from my home over the last two years. I use a fair bit of my as I do not give a second thought to the few cents FIT.

Work is a lot more own use. Only 11% gets out to the grid while I am closed. Some Brown coal might not be burnt and I do save money

[DiscoMick]

Not sure how solar directly saves trees.....An explanation is here. Saving carbon emissions is equivalent to planting trees.

How Solar Energy Saves the Environment - Save A Lot Solar (https://www.savealotsolar.com/blog/how-solar-energy-saves-the-environment/)

[W&KO]

An explanation is here. Saving carbon emissions is equivalent to planting trees.

How Solar Energy Saves the Environment - Save A Lot Solar (https://www.savealotsolar.com/blog/how-solar-energy-saves-the-environment/)

Are trees being planted at a quick enough rate to match the one getting ripped out, I suggest not......

Some bits of the article are a bit stretched but happy with the general view.

[DiscoMick]

I read the bushfires might have released the equivalent of almost half a year of emissions, but it's too early to be sure.

[manic]

Now saved 10.8 trees and 184kg of CO2, so that's all good. .

But have you?

The embedded C02 in the production of panels and associated hardware, plus transport to install = ?

Some estimates put a new install at 2-3 years before you can start counting how many kg of co2 or 'units of tree' saved.

It will take you a while to start counting savings too.

Thankfully a solar install can serve the house for decades. I think solar should be mandatory for all new build homes, with few exceptions.

[W&KO]

But have you?

The embedded C02 in the production of panels and associated hardware, plus transport to install = ?

Some estimates put a new install at 2-3 years before you can start counting how many kg of co2 or 'units of tree' saved.

It will take you a while to start counting savings too.

Thankfully a solar install can serve the house for decades. I think solar should be mandatory for all new build homes, with few exceptions.

Yes was going to mention you cannot start counting trees until you offset the install.

Dr Karl says it less than two years on an average household installation

[Tombie]

Just waiting on Energex/origin to upgrade the meter so we can switch it on......although had a play today watching the meter spin backwards.

You’re not allowed to turn it on until the meter swap?
Wow...

We had ours on the moment it was commissioned and left it running spinning the meter backwards.
By the time the new meter went in it was wound back lower than the reading of the previous bill cycle.

[W&KO]

You’re not allowed to turn it on until the meter swap?
Wow...

We had ours on the moment it was commissioned and left it running spinning the meter backwards.
By the time the new meter went in it was wound back lower than the reading of the previous bill cycle.

I’m tempted to turn it back in......just not sure if the fine print from the retail supplier.

[Tombie]

My last power bill was -$1397 [emoji41]
Only a 5kw array, 4° off North on an SMA inverter.

Haven’t actually paid a power bill for about 7 years.

[Slunnie]

My last power bill was -$1397 [emoji41]
Only a 5kw array, 4° off North on an SMA inverter.

Haven’t actually paid a power bill for about 7 years.

Over what period was that? Thats bloody stunning if its quarterly!

[Slunnie]

Now saved 10.8 trees and 184kg of CO2, so that's all good. [emoji41]
More importantly, lots of rain has meant lower yield and revenue (185kW and $29), but today looks like being a good day with lots of sunshine.
I still think long term we are likely to average about $5 a day in revenue.
The son, who has 6.5 kW of solar, got his latest quarterly power bill recently - it was a whole $2!
He's since changed plans and expects to be in credit next quarter.
It's amusing being able to monitor this online. When the solar goes right down, I know it's raining.
The wife laughs at me.

Trees saved is a good one! Mine reports with the CO2 saved.

I like monitoring it too, I like seeing what it has paid me for the day. Also what the production curve through the day is. Cloud hammers the solar!

https://www.sunnyportal.com/Tools/images/pixel.png

[Graeme]

My last power bill was -$1397 [emoji41]
Only a 5kw array, 4° off North on an SMA inverter.

Haven’t actually paid a power bill for about 7 years.
IIRC you're on an early very high FIT that hasn't been available for new installations for several years.

[Tombie]

IIRC you're on an early very high FIT that hasn't been available for new installations for several years.

On a very nice FIT - $0.54/kWh. [emoji41]
If I was on less I’d throw a heap of extra panels on.

[Tombie]

Trees saved is a good one! Mine reports with the CO2 saved.

I like monitoring it too, I like seeing what it has paid me for the day. Also what the production curve through the day is. Cloud hammers the solar!

https://www.sunnyportal.com/Tools/images/pixel.png

Cloud edge effect does good things though [emoji41] punches output right up

[Tombie]

Over what period was that? Thats bloody stunning if its quarterly!

That was spring into summer...

We have a 2’ stone walled Bungalow circa 1940. Takes forever to heat up or cool down. Use small AC splits in each room so selectively cool/heat and predominantly use ceiling fans when suitable.

No kids anymore, gas Instant HWS, double insulation in the roof cavity. All lighting is LED, centrally controlled systems that turn off lighting after rooms are vacated as well as online controls that shut down Circuits with voice command [emoji6] a simple voice instruction given turns off much of the house completely.

Our household power consumption is less than that of 1 adult living alone.

[DiscoMick]

That was spring into summer...

We have a 2’ stone walled Bungalow circa 1940. Takes forever to heat up or cool down. Use small AC splits in each room so selectively cool/heat and predominantly use ceiling fans when suitable.

No kids anymore, gas Instant HWS, double insulation in the roof cavity. All lighting is LED, centrally controlled systems that turn off lighting after rooms are vacated as well as online controls that shut down Circuits with voice command [emoji6] a simple voice instruction given turns off much of the house completely.

Our household power consumption is less than that of 1 adult living alone.That's very good.

Our CO2 saving in a week since the upgrade is 210kg, equivalent to 11 trees over their lifetime.
Our SO2 (sodium dioxide) saving is 6.7kg. SO2 makes the atmosphere more acidic, which is certainly a bad thing. We don't want to end up like Mars.

I understand the point about recouping the energy used in the manufacture of the panels, but it doesn't change the result for us.
Also, it is possible the electricity for manufacturing the panels came from renewable sources, as REC panels made in Norway are accepted by the EU as coming from renewable energy.
Anyway, it's all good.

[DiscoMick]

This thread looks like the most suitable I could find in a quick search to share information about solar systems, to help people considering going solar.
We yesterday had our solar upgraded from 2.9 to 6.8 kW with a 5 kW inverter to replace the previous 3kW.
Does it work? It's too early to tell. All I can say is by 10am today our yield for today was 8.3 kW and we had earned $1.34 from our 16 c/kW hour feed in tariff.
Details of the installation.
The panels are REC Twin Peak 2 tier 1 panels. Each panel is actually 2 halves so if one half is shaded the other half still works. There are also diodes on the columns so if some columns are shaded the other columns still function. The warranty is 25 years with an accredited REC installer.
REC is from Norway but is now owned by the giant Chinese Blue star company. It manufactures in both Norway and Singapore. In 2017 it made 1.34 gigawatts of panels, which was more than the entire panels installed in Australia that year.
The inverter in by Sungrow and has a 10 year warranty.
Total cost, including 3.9kW of new panels, frames to elevate the new row over the ridge cap for less shading, the 5kW inverter and installation was $3277 to Megawatts Solar, run by Gary Phillips of Maleny'.
We did get other quotes which were dearer. Gary installed the original panels and wiring for the previous owner. The house has cathedral ceilings, which made the wiring more difficult than normal. Gary was able to use some of the original wiring, which saved time and money.
How long will it take to recoup the cost? That's a bit hard to calculate because our usage patterns are variable, but maybe three years.
So, what can other people share about their experiences?

REC | Solar Panels Review (https://www.solarquotes.com.au/panels/rec-review.html)

Sent from my A1601 using AULRO mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=78345)
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/c3c3f986ac05c51219b69562373556a2.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/393ef781ca1de8f287964c9bc0024f71.jpgSo, here's a progress report after 22 days since our solar upgrade.
After running the house during the day we have:

Total yield 562 kW
Total revenue $89.66
SO2 reduction 16.87 kg
CO2 reduction 560.9 kg
4892km equivalent

And it's been raining for most of that time, so I'm pretty happy with that.
It's rained most of today, but still made yield of 16.3 kW and revenue of $2.62 so far.

[Tombie]

When you say revenue, are you referring to export actual or to calculated from the inverter?

I’m guessing it’s the latter.

[RANDLOVER]

That's very good.

Our CO2 saving in a week since the upgrade is 210kg, equivalent to 11 trees over their lifetime.
Our SO2 (sodium dioxide) saving is 6.7kg. SO2 makes the atmosphere more acidic, which is certainly a bad thing. We don't want to end up like Mars.

I understand the point about recouping the energy used in the manufacture of the panels, but it doesn't change the result for us.
Also, it is possible the electricity for manufacturing the panels came from renewable sources, as REC panels made in Norway are accepted by the EU as coming from renewable energy.
Anyway, it's all good.

I also have 5kW of the REC panels and haven't had any problems in the not sure how many years that I've had them, could be nearly 10 yrs as I was an early adopter and got the high FIT. My panels were made in Singapore. I have a SMA inverter, also no problems with that. The inverter has made approx. 63 MW and put about 25 MW into the grid. Technically I haven't paid a power bill since install, although I actually did have to pay one or two, when my solar hot water outlet nearly blocked up totally, so I was having to heat the tank up every day to get any useable hot water.

[Ferret]

Our SO2 (sodium dioxide) saving is 6.7kg. SO2 makes the atmosphere more acidic, which is certainly a bad thing. We don't want to end up like Mars.
I really don't think you have saved 6.7 kg of Sodium Dioxide in your efforts to save the plant. [bigwhistle]

[DiscoMick]

I really don't think you have saved 6.7 kg of Sodium Dioxide in your efforts to save the plant. [bigwhistle]There are formulas for calculating the amounts saved by exporting solar to the grid. I don't have the details.

[DiscoMick]

When you say revenue, are you referring to export actual or to calculated from the inverter?

I’m guessing it’s the latter.Yes, calculated from the inverter.

[DiscoMick]

I also have 5kW of the REC panels and haven't had any problems in the not sure how many years that I've had them, could be nearly 10 yrs as I was an early adopter and got the high FIT. My panels were made in Singapore. I have a SMA inverter, also no problems with that. The inverter has made approx. 63 MW and put about 25 MW into the grid. Technically I haven't paid a power bill since install, although I actually did have to pay one or two, when my solar hot water outlet nearly blocked up totally, so I was having to heat the tank up every day to get any useable hot water.That's good to hear about the REC panels, as it confirms my research.
Our original REC panels, installed by the previous owner, were tested and working well. The new REC panels are divided into halves, so half can operate if the other half is shaded, which is good. They have a 25 year warranty. So far it's going well.

[Tombie]

Yes, calculated from the inverter.

It’s not correct then. Without the incoming measured.

[Ferret]

...Our SO2 (sodium dioxide) saving is 6.7kg.


I really don't think you have saved 6.7 kg of Sodium Dioxide in your efforts to save the plant. [bigwhistle]


There are formulas for calculating the amounts saved by exporting solar to the grid. I don't have the details.

You might have to have a think about what the difference is between Sodium Dioxide (NaO2) and Sulphur Dioxide (SO2)[wink11]

[DiscoMick]

Yes, true, I meant sulphur. I'll blame auto-correct.