Brake shudder and bendix pads?(

[shanegtr]

Just wondering if anyone else gets brake shudder issues - in particular with bendix pads? I've been running bendix pads for a while now, but only since moving to Perth I've been getting shudder issues from the brakes on light brake applications. Any moderate brake pressure and the shuddering stops. I put new discs all round a few months ago and the issue is slowing returning and getting worse. I'm going to pull everything apart and check for any physical issues, but my current theory is the pads are laying down material onto the discs unevenly. The whole time we lived in the pilbara I never had this issue, but the brakes didn't get the work out they do now.

[josh.huber]

I just did fronts and my slides were not the best, one slide has a rubber on the end which over time had swelled. I have ordered replacements. The other thing is suspension bushes. Under light brakes they can oscillate, under heavy brakes they are forced back and no more shaking

[DiscoJeffster]

I just did fronts and my slides were not the best, one slide has a rubber on the end which over time had swelled. I have ordered replacements. The other thing is suspension bushes. Under light brakes they can oscillate, under heavy brakes they are forced back and no more shaking

Yes I recently read that when the bushes start to go, the indicator can be a vibration under braking that isn’t actually traditional brake disc issues.

[Milton477]

I have new OEM rotors & pads & am experiencing the same shudder under light braking. Lower controls arms are knocking. Vehicle has done 112k km. New tyres very recently too so not a balance problem.

[DiscoJeffster]

I have new OEM rotors & pads & am experiencing the same shudder under light braking. Lower controls arms are knocking. Vehicle has done 112k km. New tyres very recently too so not a balance problem.

You just said it yourself. It’ll be your arms slapping around under braking.

[cjc_td5]

I've run several sets of bendix pads and DBA rotors on the front and rear of my D4 with no issues.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Just wondering if anyone else gets brake shudder issues - in particular with bendix pads? I've been running bendix pads for a while now, but only since moving to Perth I've been getting shudder issues from the brakes on light brake applications. Any moderate brake pressure and the shuddering stops. I put new discs all round a few months ago and the issue is slowing returning and getting worse. I'm going to pull everything apart and check for any physical issues, but my current theory is the pads are laying down material onto the discs unevenly. The whole time we lived in the pilbara I never had this issue, but the brakes didn't get the work out they do now.

In my (not so good) experience with bendix pads (and im assuming you've gone for the hd 4wd type as these are the only ones bendix sell that fit the D4)
They are a high metal pad that dont wear evenly and chew out rotors faster than a box full of mice in a cheese factory. I went through a set of DBA rotors abd bendix 4wd pads in 60,000km when the oem rotors and ferodo pads did well over 140,000km and even then the pads were ok but the rotors were under min thickness. I'm now running RBA slotted and dimpled rotors with TRW ceramic pads and these are wearing very well.

I steer clear of bendix in this application.

[Eric SDV6SE]

I have new OEM rotors & pads & am experiencing the same shudder under light braking. Lower controls arms are knocking. Vehicle has done 112k km. New tyres very recently too so not a balance problem.

Replace the LCA's sooner rather than later as otherwise your new tyres will not be new for very long. Did your tyre fitters pick this up when fitting the new boots?

[INter674]

I had new rotors and Bendix pad on the D2 and they had a minor shudder under braking. It did seem to get better over time but then I sold the car otherwise I was going to change out the pads. New owner has not complained so maybe a bedding in issue?

[ytt105]

I recently bought a 2010 D4 3.0 and it came with a slight brake shudder. Inspections by the dealer, and an independent, advised that the brakes were all good and well within tolerance.

Further research came up with the idea that the pads were indeed depositing stuff onto the rotors, and the cure was as simple as several very hard stops from 80-100kph.

After trying to put my wife and I through the windscreen a few times, the brakes now have considerably less shudder and I think a few more heavy stops should completely cure the problem

Worth trying first as it is a cheap fix!

Regards
Trevor

[loanrangie]

I put bendix pads on the rear about 2-3 months ago and no issues, not the HD ones but a ceramic compound.

[Eric SDV6SE]

I put bendix pads on the rear about 2-3 months ago and no issues, not the HD ones but a ceramic compound.

I had the same with mine, the rear bendix pads were great, no dust and good bite. Its the fronts that didn't work for me.

[Tombie]

I recently bought a 2010 D4 3.0 and it came with a slight brake shudder. Inspections by the dealer, and an independent, advised that the brakes were all good and well within tolerance.

Further research came up with the idea that the pads were indeed depositing stuff onto the rotors, and the cure was as simple as several very hard stops from 80-100kph.

After trying to put my wife and I through the windscreen a few times, the brakes now have considerably less shudder and I think a few more heavy stops should completely cure the problem

Worth trying first as it is a cheap fix!

Regards
Trevor

A good way to do that is... take the D4 out somewhere quiet (traffic wise).

Speed up to whatever pace floats your boat.

Pull the hand brake switch up and hold.... you’ll see maximum braking (not lock up). Then just release before it stops.

[shanegtr]

You just said it yourself. It’ll be your arms slapping around under braking.
Thats a good point, I didnt really give the current condition of my lower arm bushes any consideration, and they are getting to the point where they need to be replaced (Im changing bushes in my spare arms to get prepared to change them out)

[scarry]

Replaced my front pads and rotors with OEM products,around 10 months ago.

Lower control arms are knocking and need replacing.

No brake shudder at all.

[DiscoJeffster]

Replaced my front pads and rotors with OEM products,around 10 months ago.

Lower control arms are knocking and need replacing.

No brake shudder at all.

I looked at arm symptoms and it said loose arms can produce vibrations. May not be related

[josh.huber]

I'm almost sick of playing with arms in mine. Ill press genuine bushes in again next. The arms I got the bushes are already making noise. What's the best brand of press tool?

[scarry]

Yes,anything else doesn't last long.
OEM is the ONLY way to go.

As for press i have no idea,Tombie has used one i think,maybe he will chime in.

[josh.huber]

I'm gunna put the word out for second hand arms so I can refurb them, then just bolt them in

[josh.huber]

Can't really complain to loudly it's not as young as it used to be, I only changed complete arms because I figured the front and ball joint wouldn't be far behind. I didn't keep my old arms. Gave them to someone on here. Tossing up whether to try these solid hd bushes, but being solid the centre can't turn therefore any suspension movement is trying to tear them to bits. Poly with a floating centre makes sense, but the density has to be lower to allow absorption. Any feedback on the orange ones that Atlantic British use in the you tube video they made? They look softer then other poly options?

[Tombie]

Do NOT fit poly in the lower arms.

As I commented years ago, they would result in metal fatigue, it is now becoming a reality.

[loanrangie]

Do NOT fit poly in the lower arms.

As I commented years ago, they would result in metal fatigue, it is now becoming a reality.Just need to look on the UK forms to see how they break, their corrosion issues don't help either.

[josh.huber]

Yeah I'll end up with genuine again. They lasted by far the longest in my car. Same as brakes and a few other parts. I guess the get it right sometimes

[LRD414]

Do NOT fit poly in the lower arms.
As I commented years ago, they would result in metal fatigue, it is now becoming a reality.
I have been wondering about this too. Where are the failures starting to show up? UK forums?
Perhaps worsened by corroding arm mounts over there?

Scott

[Tombie]

I have been wondering about this too. Where are the failures starting to show up? UK forums?
Perhaps worsened by corroding arm mounts over there?

Scott

UK forums, I shared some direct to Justin Cooper a month or two ago.

The failure is outright metal fatigue. The failure points are outright tearing through the steel housing.

The arms move through quite a range of motion, something firmer bushes can’t accommodate. If you’ve ever paid attention whilst someone lowers the vehicle you will see it move significantly(hint for players, to extend life, lower vehicle whilst rolling to a stop; don’t static lower as it tensions the bushes more).

One of the key features of these vehicles is NVH attenuation. The bushes do this very well and allow the correct range of movement. Removing this serviceable component defies the benefit and design.

After replacing my set (first set lasted 70k of serious work) it was stunning how much difference and how much smoother the ride became.

[LRD414]

..... failure is outright metal fatigue.
The failure points are outright tearing through the steel housing.
The arms move through quite a range of motion, something firmer bushes can’t accommodate.
If you’ve ever paid attention whilst someone lowers the vehicle you will see it move significantly .....
Yeah I think it's a sleeper issue. People get poly bushes fitted and then claim "no issues" but they've only been on for a few weeks or months .....

Scott

[Eric SDV6SE]

Poly is deginitely a no go, even in the sway bars. I put a set of superpro poly in the front and rear sway bars, thought it was all good, but ended swapping them back to oem rubber middle of this year.

I guess its the same with the LCAs. First set was done at 120k, with OEM arms and bushes, been all good since.

[PeterJ]

In my (not so good) experience with bendix pads (and im assuming you've gone for the hd 4wd type as these are the only ones bendix sell that fit the D4)
They are a high metal pad that dont wear evenly and chew out rotors faster than a box full of mice in a cheese factory. I went through a set of DBA rotors abd bendix 4wd pads in 60,000km when the oem rotors and ferodo pads did well over 140,000km and even then the pads were ok but the rotors were under min thickness. I'm now running RBA slotted and dimpled rotors with TRW ceramic pads and these are wearing very well.

I steer clear of bendix in this application.

Hi Eric, saw your post re Bendix pads and the disc wear. I have a set of Bendix HD pads, (not the 4WD pads) and decided not to use them when I fitted the new front rotors (Delios) so bought some Delphi pads instead. The Delphi pads are a real disappointment, so much so I am taking them out, the dust makes the OE standard pads look dust free, they are truly appalling, which I could actually live with if the braking performance was good, but this also is a problem. I find there is very poor feel and cold effectiveness and much higher brake pedal pressure required to get it to respond than the OE pads. So, I was wondering about your thoughts on the TRW ceramic pads as far as feel and effectiveness and as an aside, how much dust. How long have they been in the car (km)

Thanks

Peter

[Eric SDV6SE]

Hi Peter,

No issues so far, about 5000km on the current setup. TRW a bit dusty but great for towing good bite and feel front and rear. Im happy with them - way better than the Bendix pads.

Pm sent as well

[INter674]

TRW pads were the dustiest pads I've seen and not very good when cold. Okay if you like cleaning wheels. There are much better ones our there. ..more expensive tho eg QFMs.

[loanrangie]

My TRW fronts are very dusty but the Bendix ceramic rears aren't.

[josh.huber]

Agreed, I'm trying the TRW aswell at the moment and very happy, yes they are dusty, but I use it as a guage to wash the rest of the car. The White does hide a bit of grime

[Eric SDV6SE]

Agreed, I'm trying the TRW aswell at the moment and very happy, yes they are dusty, but I use it as a guage to wash the rest of the car. The White does hide a bit of grime
Hi Josh, did you go with the Dtec TRW pads or the standard Cotec? For me the Dtec formula is relatively dust free, however I’m comparing to the last set of Bendix. The oem Ferodo s are by far the least dusty.

[shanegtr]

Just a follow up to my original post. Changed out the pads to akebono and also replaced the front lower control Ramsay the same time. Shudder from the brakes has reduced dramatically. There's still a small amount left, but the more the brakes are used the better it's getting

[josh.huber]

Hi Josh, did you go with the Dtec TRW pads or the standard Cotec? For me the Dtec formula is relatively dust free, however I’m comparing to the last set of Bendix. The oem Ferodo s are by far the least dusty.

Wouldn't have a clue, thought they were all the same, can't remember what the packet said. GDB1898 was the part number. Just got them on eBay