Fault code P2263-22: Turbo System

[Ferret]

Above fault code 3 times recently when towing. 'Restricted Performance" lights up but MIL does not. Just cleared the fault and continued driving and after the 3rd clearance no further occurrence for the remainder of the trip, ~3 hours.

Gap tool says - "Turbo/supercharge boost system performance - General signal failure - signal amplitude>maximum". No other faults are logged.

That fault code is not documented in the D4 workshop manual but is refereed to in another document specific to the 3.0l engine on board diagnostics system where is says: "P2263-22 Unable to control to desired boost pressure - Boost pressure governor deviation"

My interpretation is something is putting out a signal that is impossible to be acted on. If so I would expect to see signal plausibility faults also but don't.

Looking at the live valves from both turbos (at home the day after the events without the camper in tow) the turbo actuators are moving to their commanded positions and corresponding MAF air flows appear to respond to changes in turbo actuator command locations indicating they are really moving.

Anybody got any ideas on where to start chasing this down.

[John_D4]

Could it be a dirty sensor plug?

[Ferret]

Could be. Problem with some fault codes is there does not seem to be much documentation I can find which outlines what logic triggers them so you can narrow it to the specific sensors involved in the fault condition.

The actual fault code seems to be generic to a number of different engines and manufacturers, not just Landrover.

[DiscoDB]

This is from the BAS website - may help.

P2263 – BAS Remaps, Powering the Landrover tuning world! (https://bellautoservices.co.uk/p2263/)

[Ferret]

Thanks had not specifically seen that reference. Have cleaned MAP and intake temp sensors and electrical connectors. I think judging by some oil / dust build up where the throttle body joins the air intake body there may be a leak at the junction of the 2 plastic housing also. Will need to have a closer look at that.

[BobD]

Could be a crack in the inlet manifold just starting or some other leak in the inlet system. The boost pressure doesn't get high enough due to the leak and triggers an error.

Mine started like yours but then got to the stage where every time the second turbo cut in the engine went to restricted performance. If that happens manually changing gears before 2500rpm will keep the engine out of restricted performance for a while longer.

[DiscoJeffster]

Thanks had not specifically seen that reference. Have cleaned MAP and intake temp sensors and electrical connectors. I think judging by some oil / dust build up where the throttle body joins the air intake body there may be a leak at the junction of the 2 plastic housing also. Will need to have a closer look at that.

My throttle body split at the join where the y piece is. Another place worth checking. Smoke test is the best bet to find the leak if there is one

[Ferret]

How is a smoke test done?

[DiscoJeffster]

How is a smoke test done?

You pressurise the intake system with a smoke machine and watch for where the smoke leaks from.

You can improvise your own smoke machine with the help of google.

I used an air compressor pushing air through a tin where I burnt a mosquito coil for my smoke. The outlet of the can went into the intake. I took off the intake pipe and improvised a blockage using the plastic lid from a can of degreaser.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191130/ccd13926ab2f612dbefef52191988f3e.jpg

[kenl]

Great smoke machine DiscoJeffster! Did you heat the mozzie coil from underneath or just light it and bang the lid on?

The best "on the fly" adapter to the intake I've seen is a latex glove with a finger cut off for the small hose and the wrist part taped around the Intake pipe, it shows the pressure well too.

[DiscoJeffster]

I used a blow torch to light a couple then put the lid on. Also put some doubled over fly screen material on the outlet as a filter of sorts to stop any particles entering the intake.

Worked a treat! It was my nine year old’s idea to use mozzy coils [emoji106]

[Eric SDV6SE]

Thanks for the post, had a similar issue recently, same DTC, interestingly not towing or under heavy load, just cruising steady at 100kmh. The code I received was P2263-22, restricted performance came up.

cleared code by itself after shutting the engine down. It reoccurred the following day. Took it into Southern Landrover for a check in case it was the turbo actuator. They could not determine where the code came from, turbo actuators both fine.

With the engine off I used a smoke machine kit (uses baby oil which creates a thick white smoke) and the required adaptors to seal the intake just after the MAFs. Even wedged the throttle wide open and ran the smoke for about 30 sec to fill the intake and throttle body, then checked all over for escaping smoke, I couldn’t see any. I even stuck the smoke maker up the exhaust pipes as sometimes a leak at the exhaust side can apparently cause this code. No smoke detected.

Next step is to check and clean MAFs and MAP. I’ve replaced throttle body y piece o-rings and the main plenum to throttle body seals last June.

Also planning to do an injector bleed off check, will report back how that goes.

[Ferret]

...cleared code by itself after shutting the engine down.

Interesting, mine did not although it was only on the 3rd such occurrence that I tested to see if it would self clear.

[Eric SDV6SE]

After the second occurence it also self cleared, but i still want to know whats going on. Smoke test so far indicates no leaks, I've also checked both manifolds and currently no oil tracks that would indicate a leak there either.

Error hasn't reoccurrred again since 2 weeks, hoping its just sensor related, will clean them again to be sure...

[Eric SDV6SE]

Had another look over the weekend, no visible leaks. Looking at the vacuum lines now, thinking that these may be either partially blocked or sucking in false air from somewhere. Looking at replacing as much vac line as possible with new hose given the age, plus new joiners and t pieces, preferably with brass fittings.

[Ferret]

Had another look over the weekend, no visible leaks. Looking at the vacuum lines now, thinking that these may be either partially blocked or sucking in false air from somewhere. Looking at replacing as much vac line as possible with new hose given the age, plus new joiners and t pieces, preferably with brass fittings.


I'm still getting the same error randomally while towing. Southern have been all over the thing and can't find any problems, at least while the vehicle is stationary and relatively cool within a workshop setting.

Did you ever replace your vacuum hoses? Any improvement? I'm also at the stage where i'm thinking of replacing vac hoses and solenoid valves.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Have replaced the soft rubber vacuum lines as far as i can reach. This includes from turbo air control valve to solenoid and from airbox, plus under manifold etc, and also under car from near starter motor. note that this does not include the hard plastic ones. Also replaced the t fittings etc as much as possible. Secondary solenoid is newish (replaced with new when turbo was done under warranty) , primary solenoid is new. Manifold o rings are all new.
No evidence of manifold splits, no oil mist or tracking of oil at top of engine. No evidence of oil leaks.
Cleaned MAF's and MAP.
Re-sealed EGR pipe flanges where they meet the egr valve, both were leaking. Checked EGR operation, both were smooth and i could feel the butterfly valve opening and closing with my pinky finger.
No airbox leaks or intercooler hose leaks that i have found, carried out smoke test, no sign of smoke anywhere, even with wide open throttle valve (engine off).

Fault code raised is P2263 when cruising along, low throttle input, low load.
Both turboes actuate properly under load.

Car is going into Dovers tomorrow for another check over.

[Ferret]

Fault code raised is P2263 when cruising along, low throttle input, low load. Both turboes actuate properly under load.

Describes what I experience exactly, fault occurs under low load conditions either cruising along flats or descending.

Smoke test show no cracks / leaks.
Vacuum system checked out.
exhaust system checked out
operation of turbos, actuators and valves checked out
operation of solenoid valves checked out
Applicable sensors checked out

Heat and time seems to be a factor. The fault never arises immediately. I have to have been towing for more than an hour before the fault triggers.

Please post up what Dover finds, even if it is nothing.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Found out today secondary turbo is the issue, actuator stuck or jammed. Getting pricing to replace tomorrow from Dovers.

Variable vane primary was replaced under warranty.

They reasoned they can spend 4-5 hours trying to free up the actuator and it may be ok for a while, or spend the same labour hours towards a new unit.

Considering its the original and done 196000km and countless millions of rpm, plus that i cant (or won't) sell the car without it being fixed, the only choice would be to replace. Rest of the car is still great and i have no intention to change just yet.

[DiscoJeffster]

Is it the turbine or the compressor side? Mine had the turbine side control changed at 160,000km. Both turbine (exhaust) and compressor (intake) side of the second turbo are actuated closed to completely isolate it when not in use (for those not aware).

[Eric SDV6SE]

They havent said, i will find out more tomorrow, plus i will ask to keep the old one for a bit of fault finding. Will be replacing the complete turbo in any case.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Full replacement of secondary turbo with genuine, including all gaskets and seals, new drain pipe, labour and 12months wty. Around 4K all up as quoted, finished next week.

[DiscoJeffster]

Full replacement of secondary turbo with genuine, including all gaskets and seals, new drain pipe, labour and 12months wty. Around 4K all up as quoted, finished next week.

****

[LRD414]

I’m not understanding why the turbo is replaced if one of the valves is sticking or poorly, aren’t they separate items?

Scott

[DiscoJeffster]

I do have to concur. What are they thinking? I am not questioning their diag, but don’t have all the details. Seems a harsh diag.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Got the car back today, runs sweet as again. no issues.
Have the old turbo, i will strip and post up what i find.

Loss of boost pressure when actuated, plus oil leak into clean air side are signs the turbo is worn out. Everything else checked out fine, solenoids etc.
Also fitted modifed oil drain pipe which btw also eliminates oil getting into the intercooler.

Injector balance check - all good, rechecked all vacuum lines and road test.

Pretty happy with that.

[Ferret]

After having a talk with Rover Tech earlier this week mine's going into Autocode on Tuesday for further testing. Will know more (hopefully) then.

[Ferret]

Autocode found and fixed a vacuum leak but here is a twist. The vacuum leak was associated with where vacuum hoses are connected to the active engine mounts.

From the workshop manual


The PCM controls the vacuum operated engine mounts via an active engine mount solenoid. The mounts operate (active engine mount solenoid activated which makes the mounts soft) at idle speed, and are switched off when the engine speed goes above a predetermined threshold. The threshold is engine speed dependant; the active engine mounts are switched off when the engine speed increases to 1250 Revolutions Per Minute (RPM).

Loss of vacuum anywhere affects the effectiveness of the whole vacuum system including the operation of the vacuum operated components associated with the secondary turbo.

However, vacuum to the mounts is only applied at low engine speeds which possibly explains why I only seem to get the DTC on flat or down hill, ie after cresting a hill and backing off to descend maybe causing a transition between bi turbo to single turbo mode but now having less than normal vacuum to operate the secondary turbo isolation valves because the vacuum is leaking away as the engine mount vacuum leak comes into play due to low rpms.

Will hook up the camper tomorrow and take it for a test drive.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Interesting, I replaced all vaccuum lines including those to the engine mounts BEFORE i went to Dovers, so after their check, they deemed the vaccuum system fully ok.

Does this mean that if the engine mount solenoid fails, you will drop into restricted performances mode? I would seem to think so...

This means at least 3 solenoids that affect secondary turbo system operation.

Hope that was all it was for you.

Re vaccuum lines, just replaced same on my 18yo motorbike, at least two of the lines crumbled in my hands when taking them off. i have to reset both the primary and secondary throttle position sensors on the bike now. Can't stress enough how important it is to change these lines to avoid more serious issues.

[Ferret]

Does this mean that if the engine mount solenoid fails, you will drop into restricted performances mode? I would seem to think so...

This means at least 3 solenoids that affect secondary turbo system operation.

As long as there is no vacuum leak I don't think the failure of that solenoid as such is a problem. In fact Autocode capped the vacuum lines to the engine mounts. They reckon there is no noticeable difference between the engine mounts being active / inactive since they effectively become inactive at any speed above idle.

In all the reading I have done I can't recall a single instance of any body mentioning engine mount vacuum issues as being a source of turbo associated limp mode problems though Autocode said in their experience it is not that uncommon.

Most disappointing thing I guess is the dealer could not track it down despite saying they checked the vacuum system. Making you wonder, but then again ....

Hitched the camper and drove for about ~5 hours today. Longest I have driven without dropping into restricted mode with that P2263-22 error since ~Nov of last year so I think this one is behind me.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Most disappointing thing I guess is the dealer could not track it down despite saying they checked the vacuum systeme.

Same, dealer here didnt want to touch it because of my aftermarket tune, been driving it all week now with no issues since.

I may cap off the engine mount vacuum lines too, but then again, theyve got new lines on them.....

[josh.huber]

Revival,. Got this twice today on cruise control at 110ks.. wish me luck.. Advice welcomed

[Cambo_oldjaguar]

181004

There's the official list from Topix

[Anton]

Hey guys, I'm seeing the same issue as in this post. A lot has been said about vacuum lines for secondary turbo but I'm trying to understand how this will contribute? My symptoms are at cruising speed only, no load. DTC P2263-22 only. Freeze values always indicate RPM below 2500 meaning the secondary turbo is not in play. If there is a vacuum leak how will it cause this issue under 2500RPM then? Any advise welcome.
Thanks!

[Eric SDV6SE]

Hey guys, I'm seeing the same issue as in this post. A lot has been said about vacuum lines for secondary turbo but I'm trying to understand how this will contribute? My symptoms are at cruising speed only, no load. DTC P2263-22 only. Freeze values always indicate RPM below 2500 meaning the secondary turbo is not in play. If there is a vacuum leak how will it cause this issue under 2500RPM then? Any advise welcome.
Thanks!

Because the primary turbo is also controlled by a vacuum assisted solenoid. On the SDV6 there are two solenoids, one per turbo.

[Ferret]

A lot has been said about vacuum lines for secondary turbo but I'm trying to understand how this will contribute?....

No! This was not about vacuum lines to the secondary turbo. It was about vacuum lines to the engine mounts (though every thing is interconnected) and all I can say is the issue has not arisen again after the engine mount vacuum lines were capped. This is after 50,000k of travel with and without towing.

The vacuum leak was directly at the engine mounts, not associated with the vacuum hose lines as such. The hose receiver fittings on the engine mount had deteriorated to the point where they would no longer seal when a vacuum hose was pressed into it.

You could temporarily disconnect the engine mount vacuum hoses yourself, seal the vacuum hoses and test what happens. Easily done and if those vacuum hoses are well sealed it has no effect on turbo or engine performance.

If that is the problem you can change the engine mounts or just continue to run with the engine mount vac lines sealed. Very little difference that I can detect.

[Eric SDV6SE]

No! This was not about vacuum lines to the secondary turbo. It was about vacuum lines to the engine mounts (though every thing is interconnected) and all I can say is the issue has not arisen again after the engine mount vacuum lines were capped. This is after 50,000k of travel with and without towing.

The vacuum leak was directly at the engine mounts, not associated with the vacuum hose lines as such. The hose receiver fittings on the engine mount had deteriorated to the point where they would no longer seal when a vacuum hose was pressed into it.

You could temporarily disconnect the engine mount vacuum hoses yourself, seal the vacuum hoses and test what happens. Easily done and if those vacuum hoses are well sealed it has no effect on turbo or engine performance.

If that is the problem you can change the engine mounts or just continue to run with the engine mount vac lines sealed. Very little difference that I can detect.
Right, was not clear from revival post. If engine mounts, then you can csp off, but most likely the mounts are shagged and you risk more NVH and misalignment of engine and transmission assembly putting more stress on transfer case, prop shaft uni joints and the like. I had both mounts replaced at 220000km, made a difference as far as I could tell and piece of mind, and no error codes.

[Ferret]

... but most likely the mounts are shagged and you risk more NVH and misalignment of engine and transmission assembly putting more stress on transfer case, prop shaft uni joints and the like. I had both mounts replaced at 220000km, made a difference as far as I could tell and piece of mind, and no error codes.

If the mounts are shagged then I agree but neither AutoCode or Dover have said the mounts need changing despite asking them to check them during service inspections, one of which was only 2 days ago. The problem first arose at only 120,000k. Now have 175,000k. Probably would be shagged at 220,000k. It's something I will change in the future, nothing lasts forever.

[SeanC]

I don’t know if it relevant to the D4 but I got a similar error message on my D3 due to the vanes within the turbo sticking. Moving the boost pressure actuator back and forth with a piece of wire frees up the vanes. Originally happened at the beginning of 2019. I periodically free the vanes and still going strong.
183036

[PerthDisco]

Are D3 engine mounts in similar need of replacement? Did they change for the 3.0?

[Anton]

Because the primary turbo is also controlled by a vacuum assisted solenoid. On the SDV6 there are two solenoids, one per turbo.
Hi Eric, unfortunately this is not the case. The primary turbo is a VNT turbo controlled with electronic stepper motor, no vacuum solenoid involved. The secondary turbo is vacuum operated. Hence why I'm failing to understand how the vacuum lines affect any turbo function under 2500RPM as the secondary turbo only blends in at this RPM and above. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the vacuum system can't be the cause of P2263-22, I'm just trying to understand how if my DTC's indicate under 2500RPM and almost no load every time.
Regards,

[Lusby]

I had the same code with intermittant Restricted Performance events, usually on a slight incline with CC set at highway speed. The turbo bypass valve appeared to be working fine, but monitoring the signal from the valve on the bench showed occasional bad output to the ECU. In the end a new valve fixed the problem ($$$$$). I was also getting the code P004C(77)B.

Then a month later I got Restricted Performance due to a sticky actuator on the secondary turbo with code P004C(77)A, 'exercising' the valve and an Italian tune up with Nulon Diesel turbo cleaner fuel additive appears to have fixed the issue, for now......

It appears the previous owner drove quite sedately [bigsmile1]

[josh.huber]

Hi Eric, unfortunately this is not the case. The primary turbo is a VNT turbo controlled with electronic stepper motor, no vacuum solenoid involved. The secondary turbo is vacuum operated. Hence why I'm failing to understand how the vacuum lines affect any turbo function under 2500RPM as the secondary turbo only blends in at this RPM and above. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the vacuum system can't be the cause of P2263-22, I'm just trying to understand how if my DTC's indicate under 2500RPM and almost no load every time.
Regards,

The turbo itself isn't vac controlled, but the rest of the system relies on it. I think the isolation valve or something.

I had the same issue not long ago.. Can't remember what I did now.. But it wasn't much.. no money spent

[Anton]

The turbo itself isn't vac controlled, but the rest of the system relies on it. I think the isolation valve or something.

I had the same issue not long ago.. Can't remember what I did now.. But it wasn't much.. no money spent

I'm also of the opinion that the route cause isn't anything major like secondary turbo etc, doesn't add up. The isolation valve is indeed controlled by vacuum but from my understanding (and I could be wrong) the valve opens the passage for air flow from the secondary turbo at 2500RPM thus blending in with the primary. This means under 2500RPM the spring tension of the isolation valve keep it closed, not vacuum. My thoughts, if there was a vacuum leak this should only trigger a DTC associated with the secondary turbo in play (over 2500RPM), low boost, leaking boost, MAF - Boost sensor correlation etc. I'm getting none of these.
Back to the drawing board.[bighmmm]

[josh.huber]

I think they start blending earlier to start the turbo spooling, if I think hard enough I think I free'd up all the linkages that I could see and I think it was the EGR in the end.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Hi Eric, unfortunately this is not the case. The primary turbo is a VNT turbo controlled with electronic stepper motor, no vacuum solenoid involved. The secondary turbo is vacuum operated. Hence why I'm failing to understand how the vacuum lines affect any turbo function under 2500RPM as the secondary turbo only blends in at this RPM and above. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the vacuum system can't be the cause of P2263-22, I'm just trying to understand how if my DTC's indicate under 2500RPM and almost no load every time.
Regards,

Correct, it's the air valve I meant that actuates the secondary turbocharger. The ait bslve can get stuck or not close properly.i took mine out and stripped it and cleaned it out once, then ended up having it replaced under warranty.

[Cambo_oldjaguar]

Okay so here is an answer, perhaps not the one size fits all answer, but maybe it helps someone.

2010MY D4 3.0L, has had this issue for quite a long time, that nobody could pin down...

P2263-22, in conjunction with a momentary loss of power, and restricted performance up on the dash.

Had a long list of parts thrown at it; turbo, sensors, throttle body, etc, smoke tested, nobody found anything.

Until the car went to Dave down in the Gong, and after going over literally everything in the car he recognised that the throttle plate was closing at the exact same time as the fault code being flagged and the loss of power.

This made no sense at all but a resistor jammed in the unplugged throttle plate confirmed the theory, it was the throttle plate closing, at low load, kinda randomly, with the throttle plate bypassed, no faults.

But why is it doing this? after ruling out everything else, it was decided that it must be a fault in the PCM somehow. That's when I got a call. After consulting with some very experienced LR techs & tuners, yes a corrupt EEPROM in the PCM has been known to cause such random things.

So the car came to me, we pulled the PCM out, wiped it (virginised the EEPROM) and programmed it as a brand new module, but guess what? Still doing it...

I took a virginised 2nd hand PCM off the shelf, programmed it to the car as a new module, and it hasn't faulted since... the original PCM went in the bin.

Much relief from the owner of the D4, hats off to Dave for figuring out the problem, and to Nick for coming up with a way of virginising these PCMs so they can be programmed as new modules.

It's fixed!

Smiles all round from all those involved believe me!