Starting issue (battery or electrical)

[Lukeis]

This morning I drove my car to get a wheel alignment, it had been sitting for 12 hours without use.

started as normal, drove 10km to the mechanic, picked up an hour later and they told me the battery died while it was in the shop and wouldn’t start

got in the car, battery light was on the dash. drove two shops down to a battery shop and they tested the main and the alternator and he said both were good. battery came up as 89% health, alternator was charging at 13.86V

At the shop we turned car off after about 5-10 minutes so we could test the battery, while off the battery light stayed on the dash.

Turned the car back on and it restarted just fine, light disappeared.

drove 5 minutes to an auto elec (a fuse had blown between the main and dual battery) was with him and hour, started again ok then used a few more times around town all ok. Then got home and sat still for an hour, won’t start - main battery showing (11.2v) - dual battery is showing 12.2 - keep in mind it was coming off being completely flat due to the blown fuse between the two.

any ideas what is happening?

seems like either the main battery is dead - but passed the test at the battery shop and worked several times since then. Is that possible?

or something is draining the car while it’s locked - all my extra accessories ie CB, USB plugs and fridge are all turned off and are wired to the dual battery in any case so can’t see how. And that battery has more charge indicating the VSR isn’t stealing power from the main.

Or the alternator but it was showing as working when car was running (car is flat now so can’t check again)

Anything else? so confusing

[matti4556]

So the auto 'leccy told you why the fuse between starting and aux battery had gone open circuit?
What rating is that fuse?

My money is on the Aux battery being "dud".
Keen to find out how it goes.
Matti

[Tombie]

Light staying on is often a symptom of failed Diodes in the alternator.

Lift the bonnet, can you smell an electrical smell?
If you don’t sort it you could be up for an alternator and a battery.

[Bulletman]

Do you have a code reader ? , any alternator faults showing up..

Can only suggest disconnect or isolate the aux battery and put the main battery on charge. Once its charged back up see hows things go for a day without the aux connected.

I would have thought if it was a dud Aux battery the dual battery system would isolate it but strange things happen with batteries in these cars.

I had a similar issue where mine would start and the battery light would stay on for up to 2minutes then would go out. I have a in cab battery meter and the low voltage alarm would sound if I turned the ignition on. but the car would start . I plugged in hawkeye and had a alternator fault saying something like field wiring to ground. I checked my battery terminal connections and 1 was slightly loose , tightened it up and never had the issue again and never had the fault again.

Bulletman

[josh.huber]

This morning I drove my car to get a wheel alignment, it had been sitting for 12 hours without use.

started as normal, drove 10km to the mechanic, picked up an hour later and they told me the battery died while it was in the shop and wouldn’t start

got in the car, battery light was on the dash. drove two shops down to a battery shop and they tested the main and the alternator and he said both were good. battery came up as 89% health, alternator was charging at 13.86V

At the shop we turned car off after about 5-10 minutes so we could test the battery, while off the battery light stayed on the dash.

Turned the car back on and it restarted just fine, light disappeared.

drove 5 minutes to an auto elec (a fuse had blown between the main and dual battery) was with him and hour, started again ok then used a few more times around town all ok. Then got home and sat still for an hour, won’t start - main battery showing (11.2v) - dual battery is showing 12.2 - keep in mind it was coming off being completely flat due to the blown fuse between the two.

any ideas what is happening?

seems like either the main battery is dead - but passed the test at the battery shop and worked several times since then. Is that possible?

or something is draining the car while it’s locked - all my extra accessories ie CB, USB plugs and fridge are all turned off and are wired to the dual battery in any case so can’t see how. And that battery has more charge indicating the VSR isn’t stealing power from the main.

Or the alternator but it was showing as working when car was running (car is flat now so can’t check again)

Anything else? so confusing

If they didn't isolate the battery's when doing the initial test, then the reading is normal. Both battery's combined are 90% of 1 good battery.
The lower reading on the main suggests the main is dead and blew the fuse when cranking the engine. I'd pull the negative off the aux battery and get them to test then both separately.
Or if you have a multimeter. Isolate them yourself and see what's happening.
If it's charging I doubt its diodes. Especially if it's pouring in 13.86 v which presumably was at idle

[Tombie]

If they didn't isolate the battery's when doing the initial test, then the reading is normal. Both battery's combined are 90% of 1 good battery.
The lower reading on the main suggests the main is dead and blew the fuse when cranking the engine. I'd pull the negative off the aux battery and get them to test then both separately.
Or if you have a multimeter. Isolate them yourself and see what's happening.
If it's charging I doubt its diodes. Especially if it's pouring in 13.86 v which presumably was at idle

Bleed back through the charging light when off isn’t the result of a dud battery.

[Lukeis]

The dual battery was isolated when they tested it as the fuse was still blown at the time (the fuse between main battery and the VSR)

since I have roadside assistance I called them tonight and they came and tested the main battery again and it is showing a cell has gone and suggested a new battery.

Just to be certain before I buy one I’ll follow the tip above to completely detach the second battery, jump it again, run the car for 40 mins and see if the main gets and holds a charge. It came back to life this morning before the sparkie visit, but then this afternoon (after being re- fused to the VSR) for a few hours didn’t work so I want to rule this being related before I drop money on a battery

on a side note, the auto elec put his blow torch down on my bullbar while working and has melted my headlight - like I needed that extra drama.

[josh.huber]

The dual battery was isolated when they tested it as the fuse was still blown at the time (the fuse between main battery and the VSR)

since I have roadside assistance I called them tonight and they came and tested the main battery again and it is showing a cell has gone and suggested a new battery.

Just to be certain before I buy one I’ll follow the tip above to completely detach the second battery, jump it again, run the car for 40 mins and see if the main gets and holds a charge. It came back to life this morning before the sparkie visit, but then this afternoon (after being re- fused to the VSR) for a few hours didn’t work so I want to rule this being related before I drop money on a battery

on a side note, the auto elec put his blow torch down on my bullbar while working and has melted my headlight - like I needed that extra drama.

That's the auto elecs problem not yours. Give him the part number!
Remove the battery and bench charge it. It'll need two days to fully recover if it does recover. If not replace it. I know it's not the news you want. But the longer you wait the closer you get to a dead aux battery aswell. I would have it bench charged aswell.

[josh.huber]

Bleed back through the charging light when off isn’t the result of a dud battery.

I'll have to pull a wire diagram but I'm 99% sure the light isn't in the circuit. So it can't bleed back thru it. It's all ECM controlled on Luke's. Plus the dash is led, take ten years to kill a battery through that light. 1/4w at best.

A dud battery is seen by the ECM and is shown to the driver with a light.

My guess is the light went off the alternator got it high enough to pair with the aux.

[Lukeis]

The confusing part is that the fuse was still blown when the car was turned off at the battery shop and started again (allowing me to drive 1km to the auto elec). meaning it couldn’t have been leveraging the aux battery

so car died at mechanics
presumably jump started
left running max 20 mins (during hand over and time to drive to the battery shop
Noticed fuse blown - tested alternator
car turned off - momentarily
started again ok

drove to auto elec - fixed fuse
One more drive - stop for two hours - starts ok
one more drive - stop for two hours at home - doesn’t start - fuse still ok


so how would it start if the battery was dead from the get go?

[Bulletman]

The confusing part is that the fuse was still blown when the car was turned off at the battery shop and started again (allowing me to drive 1km to the auto elec). meaning it couldn’t have been leveraging the aux battery

so car died at mechanics
presumably jump started
left running max 20 mins (during hand over and time to drive to the battery shop
Noticed fuse blown - tested alternator
car turned off - momentarily
started again ok

drove to auto elec - fixed fuse
One more drive - stop for two hours - starts ok
one more drive - stop for two hours at home - doesn’t start - fuse still ok


so how would it start if the battery was dead from the get go?

At a guess the Alternator is getting enough charge in it to kick it but maybe the 2nd drive it didn't get quiet enough .

Do you have a 240v battery charger ? I am happy to lend you 1 if you need , its a 25amp charger but can be set as low as 2amp if you want to just let it trickle. Let me know and I can drop if off .

Bulletman

[Lukeis]

Hm.

I disconnected the aux battery, jumped the car from it. left it disconnected

Ran the car for half an hour, and has now sat turned off for two hours and the main battery is holding 12.56V

[Bulletman]

Not sure what sort of dual battery set up you have but maybe it's faulty. Could explain the blown fuse .

Bulletman

[Tombie]

Hm.

I disconnected the aux battery, jumped the car from it. left it disconnected

Ran the car for half an hour, and has now sat turned off for two hours and the main battery is holding 12.56V

Go out and turn your lights on for 15 minutes and then check.

[Lukeis]

I get what you are saying Tombie

Most roads seem to be pointing to the main battery dying but not quite dead, to shortcut to a possible outcome I’ve just replaced the battery with a new one.

If no issues after a day or two we have our answer, otherwise expect another cry for help lol

[Narangga]

Where did you get the battery from?

[ADMIRAL]

This morning I drove my car to get a wheel alignment, it had been sitting for 12 hours without use.

started as normal, drove 10km to the mechanic, picked up an hour later and they told me the battery died while it was in the shop and wouldn’t start

got in the car, battery light was on the dash. drove two shops down to a battery shop and they tested the main and the alternator and he said both were good. battery came up as 89% health, alternator was charging at 13.86V

At the shop we turned car off after about 5-10 minutes so we could test the battery, while off the battery light stayed on the dash.

Turned the car back on and it restarted just fine, light disappeared.

drove 5 minutes to an auto elec (a fuse had blown between the main and dual battery) was with him and hour, started again ok then used a few more times around town all ok. Then got home and sat still for an hour, won’t start - main battery showing (11.2v) - dual battery is showing 12.2 - keep in mind it was coming off being completely flat due to the blown fuse between the two.

any ideas what is happening?

seems like either the main battery is dead - but passed the test at the battery shop and worked several times since then. Is that possible?

or something is draining the car while it’s locked - all my extra accessories ie CB, USB plugs and fridge are all turned off and are wired to the dual battery in any case so can’t see how. And that battery has more charge indicating the VSR isn’t stealing power from the main.

Or the alternator but it was showing as working when car was running (car is flat now so can’t check again)

Anything else? so confusing

The battery would have been low when you took it to get the alignment. The wheel alignment process includes ( for most machines ) locking the brake pedal in the down position with a rachet lever set up from the front of the seat. This means your brake lights are on for the duration of the alignment process. If the alignment specialist is not a Landrover dealer, he may also leave a door open to stop the suspension from adjusting while he is completing the alignment. This is the most common fix for non dealers who are aware the suspension could move and upset their readings. Once you have driven the vehicle for any time since restarting you have enough charge to carry on as normal. I think your battery was just down a bit, and the circumstances came together to give you a momentary issue at the time. Does point to the battery not being at optimum though. Load checks etc are notorious for not showing up issues with D3-4 batteries. They don't have to be down much to give you issues.

[Tombie]

For the record (and for those who come across this thread later):

-Leaving the door open doesn’t prevent the suspension moving.

-Unless it’s in TTM the difference in height side to side can be up to 20mm

-Brake lights don’t work with ignition in off position/vehicle not running

[Lukeis]

Where did you get the battery from?


I feel like this is not going to be received well, but battery world. It’s close to where Iam staying and there is another store near my house in Sydney + 30 months warranty

they tested the battery as well and said possible dropped cell - but the old adage ‘you don’t ask a barber if you need a hair cut’ possibly applies

so far so good

[Narangga]

I feel like this is not going to be received well, but battery world. It’s close to where Iam staying and there is another store near my house in Sydney + 30 months warranty

they tested the battery as well and said possible dropped cell - but the old adage ‘you don’t ask a barber if you need a hair cut’ possibly applies

so far so good

Its up to you where you get it - I was just curious. They have been worth going to for the last few years after a change of franchisee. Always helpful when I'm in there. However I bought my starter battery from Outback Batteries.

I certainly hope that it's fixed your issue.

[Bulletman]

I feel like this is not going to be received well, but battery world. It’s close to where Iam staying and there is another store near my house in Sydney + 30 months warranty

they tested the battery as well and said possible dropped cell - but the old adage ‘you don’t ask a barber if you need a hair cut’ possibly applies

so far so good

If they put it on the load tester they should be pretty confident. The only time I had weird and wonderful electrical gremlins in my car was when it had a newish supercharger battery which had a dropped cell that charged to 13v no worries, in the end I took it back to the agent and told him to remove it and properly load test it that it finally showed up as faulty after a couple of tests . Installed new battery and all my gremlins disappeared for 5 yrs , funnily I started getting things like the battery light on the dash randomly appear so changed the battery and back to normal.

Bulletman