More Electricity Questions

[gavinwibrow]

Just back from x 600 km trips - to Kalbarri and back a few days apart - no towing, cruising at speed limits.
Battery voltage next morning after returning was down to 12.4 for both - Bit low I thought?

I have Tim's Traxide twin battery system put in by the PO in July 2016 with a Yellow Top auxiliary (which lasted until Jul 19 or 3 years and an ABG-25 in the rear and an inside Anderson plug off that (and not checked but probably also hooked up the the trailer grey Anderson).

Auxiliary battery is a twelve months old big Varta AGM which takes up the whole second tray. The SSB starter battery as recommended on here was fitted in April just gone,

Car starts as soon as it has done its diagnostic check, but I'd better do a load test next? And then check the maintenance budget?

[drivesafe]

Hi Gavin, your trip drive times would be very good for your batteries but how much driving did you do before hand and did you measure the batteries before starting your trip.


At 12.4v, your batteries are around the 80% SoC mark, which is not bad at all, but as you had just done a couple of long drives, I too would have expected a little better, but again, this would all depend on the state of the condition of the batteries before your trip.

[gavinwibrow]

Hi Gavin, your trip drive times would be very good for your batteries but how much driving did you do before hand and did you measure the batteries before starting your trip.

At 12.4v, your batteries are around the 80% SoC mark, which is not bad at all, but as you had just done a couple of long drives, I too would have expected a little better, but again, this would all depend on the state of the condition of the batteries before your trip.

Thanks and good point Tim and the charge would have been a little low from a couple of weeks of short runs around the burbs, and even worse, starting the old girl momentarily to get to something behind in the garage.

I should note, I put a new alternator in during the trip to Qld last spring - when I could not get hold of you via email over a towing related electrical issue.

I think I'll bang on my little 7 stage charger for a bit more top up and include the 8th stage maintenance charge (no lithiums fitted!)

[josh.huber]

I find the best method is to leave the chargers on at least 24 hrs after they hit full charge.
I also isolate my battery's when doing this so I can see that they both respond well and monitor which took the longest etc.
You can drop a cell in either battery and pull the other down all the time..
hopefully gav they just need a little TLC.

[DiscoMick]

If it's a multi-stage charger with a float function then I think you can just leave it on indefinitely. It will just wake up, test the battery, charge if necessary and go back to sleep.

[scarry]

I find the best method is to leave the chargers on at least 24 hrs after they hit full charge.
I also isolate my battery's when doing this so I can see that they both respond well and monitor which took the longest etc.
You can drop a cell in either battery and pull the other down all the time..
hopefully gav they just need a little TLC.

That is exactly what i do with mine,but as Tim has advised,don't leave the charger on indefinitely.

The start battery on the D4 lasted almost 5yrs,the auxiliary 4.

[Odysseyman]

Not sure if this adds anything but Tim has advised me when connecting the charger to put the positive on the starter battery and the earth to the negative on the car, not on the battery.
cheers
David

[DiscoMick]

I could be wrong for sure, but I think I have read previously that is recommended charging practice in the D3/4 manual, is that right?

[drivesafe]

Hi Mick and it is actually a safely requirement when working on any vehicle’s cranking battery, not just Land Rovers.

The danger is that if the battery has been worked hard or is faulty, it can and will gas, and this applies to wet cell and AGMs.

If you connect both leads to the battery, as you connect the second lead, you may cause a spark and this is at the very time you are in close proximity to the battery.

Hydrogen, the gas being expelled by the battery, is both easily ignited and highly explosive.

So the safe way to connect to a battery is first make the positive connection onto the battery’s positive ( + ) terminal, but make the negative connection to a good earth some distance from the battery.

This practice both reduces the chance of an ignition, but if one does occur, you are not hanging over the battery if it does explode, thus reducing the injury potential.




On another point, some new battery chargers with CEC ( California Energy Commission ) rating, will first charge the battery, then go into float and will, as per CEC requirements, turn off and wait to the battery needs a maintenance charge before automatically turning on again.

This type of charge is good for a battery that is in top condition, but does little the rejuvenate a battery in poor condition.

Also, with standard types of battery chargers, where they charge the battery and then go into float mode INDEFINITELY, they too do not do much for rejuvenate a battery in poor condition, but can eventually DRY the battery out and this will damage the battery.

A simple solution is to buy a 240VAC time from say Bunning, ( around $20 ) and either set it to run 12 hours ON and 12 hours OFF, for rejuvenating a battery in poor condition. Or 4 hours ON and 20 hour OFF for batteries in good condition but are not going to be used for long periods of time.

Or you can just connect a solar panel and it works the same way.

[DiscoMick]

Hi Mick and it is actually a safely requirement when working on any vehicle’s cranking battery, not just Land Rovers.

The danger is that if the battery has been worked hard or is faulty, it can and will gas, and this applies to wet cell and AGMs.

If you connect both leads to the battery, as you connect the second lead, you may cause a spark and this is at the very time you are in close proximity to the battery.

Hydrogen, the gas being expelled by the battery, is both easily ignited and highly explosive.

So the safe way to connect to a battery is first make the positive connection onto the battery’s positive ( + ) terminal, but make the negative connection to a good earth some distance from the battery.

This practice both reduces the chance of an ignition, but if one does occur, you are not hanging over the battery if it does explode, thus reducing the injury potential.




On another point, some new battery chargers with CEC ( California Energy Commission ) rating, will first charge the battery, then go into float and will, as per CEC requirements, turn off and wait to the battery needs a maintenance charge before automatically turning on again.

This type of charge is good for a battery that is in top condition, but does little the rejuvenate a battery in poor condition.

Also, with standard types of battery chargers, where they charge the battery and then go into float mode INDEFINITELY, they too do not do much for rejuvenate a battery in poor condition, but can eventually DRY the battery out and this will damage the battery.

A simple solution is to buy a 240VAC time from say Bunning, ( around $20 ) and either set it to run 12 hours ON and 12 hours OFF, for rejuvenating a battery in poor condition. Or 4 hours ON and 20 hour OFF for batteries in good condition but are not going to be used for long periods of time.

Or you can just connect a solar panel and it works the same way.Thanks for that clarification. Very helpful.

[Nicky]

Hi Tim, what do you think of the CTEC chargers?

[josh.huber]

While I'm keen on tims opinion on how well they charge. I've got 3 here that won't change modes. The buttons dead. I had to open them up and repair it.
And I've had 2 25amp models just die. One took my boat batteries with it.
The 25 that is still alive has an Anderson plug on it and goes straight into the rear of my car for maintenance charging. I would hope they have improved. The button issue is well documented.

[rocket rod]

Hi Tim, what do you think of the CTEC chargers? I've used a 10amp CTEK to keep a maintenance charge on two 120A AGMs for years now and haven't had any issues. Use it from time to time to car up the car as well. All good so far.

[INter674]

I've had a 6v C tek charger on a dozer battery more or less constantly for 3 maybe 4 years...and it still works fine.

Maybe China got that one right😚

[DiscoJeffster]

I've had a 6v C tek charger on a dozer battery more or less constantly for 3 maybe 4 years...and it still works fine.

Maybe China got that one right[emoji9]

CTEK are great and can be left on quite happily. After 24 hours their charging profile changes into one suitable for long term storage. Have had cars connected permanently to them for years without issue. Well worth their money.

[drivesafe]

Hi Tim, what do you think of the CTEC chargers?
Hi Nichy, I am not a fan. They are just a basic charger with an over priced cost, based on nothing more than their name.

There are cheaper charges that do just as well and are usually more reliable.

There have been plenty of reports here on AULRO, of them failing, in different ways, and some have taken batteries with them.

[PhilipA]

I had a NOCO fail when charging a Lithium golf buggy battery on the Lithium setting.
So no joy there either.
Regards PhilipA

[GIL]

Hi Gavin,
Have a look at the Projecta Intellicharge range of battery chargers.
Comes in a few current versions eg 7,10 and 15 amps.

The IC1500 model (15 amp):
Has MODE button for battery type selection.
Has CHARGE RATE button for current setting.
They are 7-stage switchmode units which seem to work well.

I used mine to recondition my batteries recently with good results.

Regards
GIL

[gavinwibrow]

Hi Gavin,
Have a look at the Projecta Intellicharge range of battery chargers.
Comes in a few current versions eg 7,10 and 15 amps.

The IC1500 model (15 amp):
Has MODE button for battery type selection.
Has CHARGE RATE button for current setting.
They are 7-stage switchmode units which seem to work well.

I used mine to recondition my batteries recently with good results.

Regards
GIL

G'day Gil.
From post #3 - I think I'll bang on my little 7 stage charger for a bit more top up and include the 8th stage maintenance charge (no lithiums fitted!)
Mine is a CTEK 5 , but works for me.
Cheers

[GIL]

Hi Gavin,

Oops! that slipped past me.

The point is that a multi-stage "smart" charger is what is needed to recondition then maintain a modern battery, given the demands that our modern vehicles impose on them.

Hope your efforts result in a rejuvenated / revived battery.
Regards
GIL

[gavinwibrow]

Hi Gavin,

Oops! that slipped past me.

The point is that a multi-stage "smart" charger is what is needed to recondition then maintain a modern battery, given the demands that our modern vehicles impose on them.

Hope your efforts result in a rejuvenated / revived battery.
Regards
GIL

Nup, too far gone - effect of 2 years in the garage (in part looking for a 0.1V per day leakage) and the sparkie not keeping up the charge levels.
Got 2 new Bosch from Goodchilds as recommended on here (the people, not the batteries, and yes their service and prices are brilliant).

[GIL]

Hi Gavin,

At least you now have new batteries.
With good maintenance the maximum life will be achieved.

I now connect my (unused and locked down) D4 to the caravan to use its solar system to maintain the vehicles batteries.
Others have mentioned that using solar charging is a good practice, and I know from the van that I have achieved 9 years from its batteries.

Regards
GIL

[josh.huber]

Just because I'm angry.. I took my boat to the water the other day. New trailer.. Started. Only just. But just the same.. came home plugged the ctek 25 in. On normal mode. That was less then a week ago.. Today I came to dad's to have a beer and spend the night. Happy father's Day all. Walked into the boat shed to get ready for some pre summer maintenance. Smell of battery. On the way up. Charger has the fan on. Both battery's are steaming. The damage has been done.. Grab the multimeter. 16v.. There is no reason for any charger to be there.. I'm now needing 2 more battery's. A good wash.. Possible acid damage unknown yet. And my face is itchy. Need another shower

[ATH]

Mines just a 5 stage but it seems to work well. When ever I get the "Low battery" message up I drive frontwards into the carport, hook it up and then leave it. Plus I use it every month or so to give the battery a good charge if I'm not going out.
AlanH.

PS. Battery in our van lasted 7 tears or so as it gets charged by the C-Tek installed by the makers and I plug into the mains as soon as we return home after a trip.