Towing with Disco 4

[Ian McK]

Hi All you LRovers out there
We have a Disco 4 and it tows (3.5t) off-road van very poorly. Scary in fact. (Just a new (second hand). The previous owners say it was a dream to tow. I have been through weight distribution, wheel alignment and next on the list is tyre pressures. I see these things on the www. LED trailer module LAND ROVER DISCOVERY 4 / LR4 (L319) LED TOWING ADAPTOR MODULE
1. we don’t have an issue with led lights but I am not sure the disco “recognises” the trailer.
How can I tell?
2. we donÂ’t seem to have an issue with the trailer brakes but now have some doubt with possible wireing connections. What is the consequence of incorrect wireing connection?
3. Does anyone recommend a towing adaptor module?
4. The van has dexter sway control. It can be felt working but will not correct the big movements caused by overtaking trucks etc. Should a Dexter eliminate ALL sway?

thanks in advance
ian

[PerthDisco]

After watching the recent Cadogan videos on towing and vehicle capabilities I’m now now nervous to share the road and very dubious of any non Ram or F-truck style vehicle attempting to tow 3.5t considering the total loaded combined weight, tow ball weight factors and any situation where the tow vehicle is lighter than the the towed object.

[Ian McK]

Hi All you LRovers out there
We have a Disco 4 and it tows (3.5t) off-road van very poorly. Scary in fact. (Just a new (second hand). The previous owners say it was a dream to tow. I have been through weight distribution, wheel alignment and next on the list is tyre pressures. I see these things on the www. LED trailer module LAND ROVER DISCOVERY 4 / LR4 (L319) LED TOWING ADAPTOR MODULE
1. we don’t have an issue with led lights but I am not sure the disco “recognises” the trailer.
How can I tell?
2. we donÂ’t seem to have an issue with the trailer brakes but now have some doubt with possible wireing connections. What is the consequence of incorrect wireing connection?
3. Does anyone recommend a towing adaptor module?
4. The van has dexter sway control. It can be felt working but will not correct the big movements caused by overtaking trucks etc. Should a Dexter eliminate ALL sway?

thanks in advance
ian

[dirvine]

The way to see if your car recognises the van attached is to put your left and/or right indicator on. On the taco binical you should see a green trailer flashing. If not the car is not recognising anything is attached. The car anti sway etc will still work but gear changes etc will be as if nothing is connected.

Depending on what brake controller you have (I have a redarc) as you drive along push the control button and you should feel the van brakes being applied and pulling you up. Consequences of no van brakes is that you are relying on car to pull the total weight of van and car up. Not only lot more distance required to stop, but possible jack knifing and also illegal with anything more than 750kg attached to the car.

I made my own adapter from the car round plug to a 12 pin flat plug. Also to operate antisway, and fridge I installed Traxide with Anderson plug. Thgen did a piggy back with red anderson plug for anti sway and grey plug for fridge. Can use the correct pin on the plug but it can get hot because of the amps the fridge draws on 12V.

I have Al Ko anti sway. I have not felt it work except on extreme sways. Minor sway as you mention would probably not be enough to make it kick in. Not sure if any of them are adjustable.

[gavinwibrow]

After watching the recent Cadogan videos on towing and vehicle capabilities I’m now now nervous to share the road and very dubious of any non Ram or F-truck style vehicle attempting to tow 3.5t considering the total loaded combined weight, tow ball weight factors and any situation where the tow vehicle is lighter than the the towed object.

For my sins, I tow a high 3.5T van (see moniker pic) with my 2.7 D4, but am the first to admit some road surfaces keep me down to cruising at 80 kmph, and even on good roads I'm more comfortable long distance at 95. I'm an ex truck and bus driver from my considerably younger days with a HR licence for over 50 years, and farm driving before that. Don't consider myself an expert driver, but I do have a modicum of common sense and have never had a prang.

On our NE AU trip from WA and return over a year ago, the Queensland roads were generally woeful, unlike WA/most NT versions, so had plenty of variances ( and slower driving).

I've always been told D3/4 should never have any weight distribution hitching (its all built in), but anti sway control on the van is good for road trains and "variegated" road surfaces etc. I have it on mine and it gets used now and again. But yes it doesn't eliminate, just mitigate.

The experts should tune in soon with their comments.

[ytt105]

What do you have on the rear of the van? One spare wheel, or two plus jerry cans.
What did you tow the van with previously, and how big was the van that the previous owners towed.
All valid questions, but I agree. None of the vehicles with a 3.5 ton towing limit are really well suited to towing 3.5 ton!

[Ian McK]

What do you have on the rear of the van? One spare wheel, or two plus jerry cans.

There is only one spare on the rear. BUT just inside is a full Redarc Battery management system with a 3000w inverter and 2 big batteries.
And two diesel tanks probably 14litres total.

the van weighs 2.5 tonne bare (at the factory). We are light campers so we generally weigh 3t in travel mode with 210kg on the hitch.

What did you tow the van with previously,
We have only just purchased this van so no previous vehicle and no van experience.

and how big was the van that the previous owners towed.

The van is 18.5 feet with everything that opens and shuts
They towed with a Ranger and then a cruiser. They report no towing issues with either vehicle

We only seem to have the following options

1. Load positions
2. Tow ball weight
3. Tow ball height
4. Tyre pressure
5. Air bag pressure in van
6. And if a resistor will help the disco computer change ride hts and gear changing (not just lights


All valid questions, but I agree. None of the vehicles with a 3.5 ton towing limit are really well suited to towing 3.5 ton!

I think the disco is here to stay. The van is expendable

Thanks
Ian

[ytt105]

Personally, I'd up the towbar weight a bit myself.

[ian4002000]

It sounds like something is wrong with the balance of the van. More info on the van would help. Next time ..... i get the van out for a trip i am going to get a professional to come over and do a weight test of all axles etc just to ensure i am legal and cant be blamed for any overloading.

A full weight test may highlight is the van is over weight at the rear and has poor weight distribution

A D4 should to reasonably well with a reasonable sized van. But caravans have been getting very large of late and also some have very high centre of gravity which wont help.
One freind nearly rolled his van and cruiser down a steep slope, after this he moved the generator from the back to in front of the axle and all was good there after.

Ian
Bittern

[Hogarthde]

Ian, we have a D4 and Trakmaster Nullabor ; Total weight was 5800kg years ago ,and I never toss anything out ,so would be heavier now.

NO weight distribution or anti sway equipment.

And to use a stupid expression, “ don’t know the van is there “when on the road

i concur with ytt , shift a bit of weight forward , perhaps have a bit more pressure in rear tyres of van , ours at 36 psi all round

Now Ian , I don’t know if you believe in fairies, but if we haven’t travelled for a few months, the first half hour on the road can be a bit underwhelming. I think the D4 takes a while to realise it is in a heavy towing mode ,and also of course me.

Then after the fairies and various systems are all synchronised ... “ don’t know it’s there”

so get on a quiet road, and try a few things and hope you get sorted and enjoy

[V8Ian]

After watching the recent Cadogan videos on towing and vehicle capabilities I’m now now nervous to share the road and very dubious of any non Ram or F-truck style vehicle attempting to tow 3.5t considering the total loaded combined weight, tow ball weight factors and any situation where the tow vehicle is lighter than the the towed object.
Don't put too much credence in that potty-mouthed, self proclaimed expert.

[Arapiles]

Hi All you LRovers out there
We have a Disco 4 and it tows (3.5t) off-road van very poorly. Scary in fact. (Just a new (second hand). The previous owners say it was a dream to tow. I have been through weight distribution, wheel alignment and next on the list is tyre pressures. I see these things on the www. LED trailer module LAND ROVER DISCOVERY 4 / LR4 (L319) LED TOWING ADAPTOR MODULE


1. we don’t have an issue with led lights but I am not sure the disco “recognises” the trailer.
How can I tell?
2. we donÂ’t seem to have an issue with the trailer brakes but now have some doubt with possible wireing connections. What is the consequence of incorrect wireing connection?
3. Does anyone recommend a towing adaptor module?
4. The van has dexter sway control. It can be felt working but will not correct the big movements caused by overtaking trucks etc. Should a Dexter eliminate ALL sway?

thanks in advance
ian

Out of curiosity, what is the D4 doing that’s scary? At what speeds? What van is it?

[Numb Thumbs]

You can cheaply and easily fit a pair of ballast resistors so the car recognises the trailer. I wrote up fitting some to my D5, but the principal is the same:

Wiring up a pair of ballast resistors for towing a trailer with LED lights (aulro.com) (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/l462-discovery-5-a/280169-wiring-up-pair-ballast-resistors-towing-trailer-led-lights.html)

You can wire them up on the caravan, but by doing it on the car, they will work with any trailer with LED lights. Much cheaper than the modules - I think my setup cost around $40 for the resistors and the switch.

Good luck sorting it out.

Cheers
Numb Thumbs ;)

[p38brickus]

Hi guys. I have a 2008 RRS TDV8 towing 3.5 tonne 25 foot van. I suppose I can talk to this thread as I believe the RRS has the same chassis as D4. If I'm wrong, shoot me down.
I towed our vans (25 foot Jayco Heritage and 25 foot Jayco Sterling) without issue UNTIL I changed tyres on the RRS. I was using Cooper Zeon LTZ's until they lost the will to live and I wasn't able to get more so I fitted Cooper Discoverer H/T's and the dynamic changed immediately. It was like chalk and cheese. Perhaps check what tyres you are running. I was thinking because the Zeons were a semi off road tyre that they were stronger in the sidewalls than the Discoverers and didn't squelch around as much but apart from that I don't know. I was running 20" rims. I have a set of 22" rims with Pirelli tyres so I put them on and they have improved the stability. I'd prefer not to run 22's with their lower profile on some of the shmitty roads we have in Australia but they are better than the Discoverers.
Just my thoughts.

[Ian McK]

Don't put too much credence in that potty-mouthed, self proclaimed expert.

Hi again

Been v busy in the last few days.
Anyone who thinks retirement is restful needs to think again.


I have had the van weighed. Unfortunately it was not to our touring weight but I will attempt to describe.

Front Lhs 703kg Rhs 683kg
Rear. Lhs 671kg. Rhs 632kg
Tow ball. 196kg

The water tanks were 1/2 full.
they are above the axles so you could add 25kg
to each wheel. The van was missing food.
The fridge and pantry are above the rear axle (one each side)
I suppose you could add 20kgs each side to the rear axle

Plus clothes

this would be about
Front. Lhs. 730. Rhs. 710
rear. Lhs. 720. Rhs. 710
Tow ball 210 (clothes)
ATM 3080

The only things not on the floor are plates cutlery and hanging clothes

The spare tyre is mounted very high on the rear Lhs.
I think I can have it relocated to the front draw bar.
(reducing the centre of gravity, reducing weight on rear Lhs wheel
and increasing the tow ball weight.

Before I commit to a full time change. I will shift the tyre and strap it to the front gas bottle frame for a test drive

Is this a feasible test?

I am running 42psi all routine the van.
Is that too much? Should I run more/less in the rear

Thanks for everyoneÂ’s suggestions so far

Ian McK

[Barraman]

"It sounds like something is wrong with the balance of the van".

I agree!

I tow a 2.5 T boat/trailer 10,000+ km each year. My 2015 TDV6 tows it effortlessly at the speed limit where safe (ie up to 130 kph). All this stuff about the Disco recognising the trailer is news to me - I don't think my Disco knows that its towing a boat. My electric brakes are set up so that they come on just before the Disco brakes - the result is that I think the Disco/boat combo stops at least as well or even better than the Disco alone.

I don't tow a van, and 3500 kg would pull it up a bit, but I would think it should still be stable if the van is set up properly.

OK, given the post above - I am running Pirelli Scorpian AT Plus tyres on 19" wheels: placarded pressures on the Disco and 35 psi on the boat trailer.

[DiscoChris]

I don't think I have seen anyone ask if the caravan is level.

I had terrible problems with my D4 when towing my Evernew 900i (3.5t fully loaded) using the hitch as supplied by LR. Having already been through all the other weight distribution protocols, my problem was that the van was not parallel to the ground. It was low at the front putting all the load on the front wheels of the Van with rear wheels unable to take their share of the load. As soon I changed the hitch to an adjustable hitch my problem was solved with the van now level.

I am grateful to this forum that put me in the right direction.
Details of my query and the responses from the more educated than me can be found under the following topic.

D4 sway when towing heavy caravans (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/l319-discovery-3-and-4-a/259408-d4-sway-when-towing-heavy-caravans.html)
Sorry I don't know how to attach a link in this application.

Cheers
Chris

[DiscoChris]

I forgot to mention; I put Dexter on our van.

It is something you hope you never need - my understanding is that it is supposed to kick-in when you are building up serious sway.

Sadly, [bigsad] contrary to advice, my Dexter kicks-in every k or so on dirt roads applying the van brakes when not needed. I have to remove the fuse to stop it working when we travel on the dirt.

More sadly [bawl][bawl][bawl] SWMBO has said we are not travelling on dirt roads again (after GRR and Cape York) so my dexter won't be a problem.

Cheers
Chris

[gavinwibrow]

The spare tyre is mounted very high on the rear Lhs.
I think I can have it relocated to the front draw bar.
(reducing the centre of gravity, reducing weight on rear Lhs wheel
and increasing the tow ball weight.

Before I commit to a full time change. I will shift the tyre and strap it to the front gas bottle frame for a test drive

Is this a feasible test?

I am running 42psi all routine the van.
Is that too much? Should I run more/less in the rear

Thanks for everyoneÂ’s suggestions so far

Ian McK

Using the 4psi rule, I started at 45, but have to pump my 265 75 R16 ATs to 50 then they operate at 54 or thereabouts. I've checked my Safety Dave TPMS and the values are just about spot on. I'm usually about 3.3T but licenced for 3.5.

For the record, I work on about 6% of gross van weight (210 kg for 3,500) for my towball weight, and carry one of those tube scales to check every now and again - we have a few items that can be relocated to balance the load. Works for my little D4.

[ADMIRAL]

Hi again

Been v busy in the last few days.
Anyone who thinks retirement is restful needs to think again.


I have had the van weighed. Unfortunately it was not to our touring weight but I will attempt to describe.

Front Lhs 703kg Rhs 683kg
Rear. Lhs 671kg. Rhs 632kg
Tow ball. 196kg

The water tanks were 1/2 full.
they are above the axles so you could add 25kg
to each wheel. The van was missing food.
The fridge and pantry are above the rear axle (one each side)
I suppose you could add 20kgs each side to the rear axle

Plus clothes

this would be about
Front. Lhs. 730. Rhs. 710
rear. Lhs. 720. Rhs. 710
Tow ball 210 (clothes)
ATM 3080

The only things not on the floor are plates cutlery and hanging clothes

The spare tyre is mounted very high on the rear Lhs.
I think I can have it relocated to the front draw bar.
(reducing the centre of gravity, reducing weight on rear Lhs wheel
and increasing the tow ball weight.

Before I commit to a full time change. I will shift the tyre and strap it to the front gas bottle frame for a test drive

Is this a feasible test?

I am running 42psi all routine the van.
Is that too much? Should I run more/less in the rear

Thanks for everyoneÂ’s suggestions so far

Ian McK

I will throw in my two bob's worth. I have a 2010 2.7 and tow a 2600 - 2700T loaded van, with no Dexter or trailer assist fitted to the van. My ball weight is high at 230+ odd loaded. This does mean higher tyre pressures are required in the rear tyres, and for that you need LT rated tyres. AT rated rubber generally taps out at 45psi maximum. I generally run just under or over 50 psi. Based on the minimal temperature and tyre pressure variation I have when towing, this seems to be about right. The van has never felt dangerous, and the Disco has bailed me out of a few tricky situations on dirt roads, with the LR trailer assist. I have fitted a resistor ( Narva - about $28 at Repco or similar ) to the RH indicator wire on the caravan chassis, and the D4 recognizes the trailer as soon as it is plugged in. My van has a natural bias to the front, as the axles/wheels are to the rear of centre, rather than being in the middle of the van. I see a lot of bigger vans with their axles pretty much centre, and I imagine they would not be much fun if overtaking at speed in a crosswind. I have had a few nasty events over the years towing, and all have been with trailers with too much rear weight bias. Notably furniture removal trailers, where I suspect they are biased to the rear to reduce the ball weight.

I have noted of late, that my D4 moves around more towing or without, and I suspect the shocks are pretty much at the end of their life. Now on the list to replace.

As with several of the other contributors, I don't believe any of the current available vehicles rated at 3.5T towing , should be towing a 3.5T weight van. ( and I note that there is at least one large van manufacturer who agrees ) If I were to go up in van size, I would consider one of the american pickups.

[Ian McK]

We took heed of all the comments given and followed the advice.

van weight reduced to 3000kg
reviewed tyre pressures van and disco
redistribution of weight in the van
more on the ball 250kg

and happy days
thanks all for the help

Ian from Imbil