8 SPEED AUTO WON'T CHANGE UP

[Discodicky]

Its happened 4 times in 2 yrs and 46,000 klms; I put the rotary selector in "D" and drive off.
The auto won't change out of 1st gear.

If I immediately use the paddles it is fine and when stop using the paddles it reverts to normal shift as per design and everything is fine.

When it is stuck in 1st if I stop the car, switch engine off, restart and go to "D" it works fine.
Haven't tried stopping car and not switching off engine but simply going to "N" then back to "D". (Forgot to do that this morning)

All trans change points seem fine and no obvious problems.

No codes apparent.

Interestingly, it seems to only do it when the trans temp is around 35-45 deg C and I notice the voltage is at 15.0 when it usually is around 14.1 ish.
It stayed at 15.0 most of the trip (approx 30 klms) then finally went to 14.8 prior to arriving home.

I'll check battery terminals.

I'll do a reset on the adaptions (foot on accel, 15 secs etc) and see what transpires.

I'd be interested in your thoughts please.

[loanrangie]

Whats the total vehicle mileage ?

[Graeme]

Does changing to sport mode then back to drive fix it?

[Discodicky]

Whats the total vehicle mileage ?

just over 146,000, I bought it at just over 100,000

[Discodicky]

Does changing to sport mode then back to drive fix it?

Didn't think to check that this morning when it did it, however I think I may have done that on one of the other occasions, but if I did I can't recall the result.[bigwhistle]

It last did it around 6 weeks ago when the missus was driving it and she came home complaining........
Prior that it would have been around 12 months ago, definitely pre COVID.

This arvo following my post I just reset the adaptions with foot on accel for 15 secs etc and it now shifts even better than it did before, which was pretty good anyway!

I don't drive the car hard, the only time it sees over 2,000 rpm is when towing the 3.0T c/van and then only take it to 2,500 ish with Sport mode combined with the paddles.

95% of the time the engine wouldn't exceed 1700 rpm I think.

Maybe I need to drive it with more spirit!![bigsmile1]

The other weird thing that it did twice over a week last month in same circumstances when towing the c/van was, and this is somewhat difficult to describe:

Picture this.
In a country town, with c/van, starting from traffic lights and immediately going up a short steep rise after crossing the intersection, getting into 3rd gear via Sport mode/paddles, going about 50 metres up the rise and then turning tight left into and up another steep hill, as I accelerated around the slow left corner (doing roughly 10-15 kph) and up the steep hill I decided to paddle it back to 1st gear, but it seemed to find a neutral ie, no drive, and it would not rev above 1,000.
Or, maybe it seemed like neutral/no drive simply because revs went back to 1,000 and no drive at those revs with 3.0T on board??

Motionless for about 3-4 secs, definitely no longer, which seemed like an eternity, but no response from the accel pedal at all, then it picked up revs and took off and I changed gears via paddles up the steep hill no probs.
I'm wondering if I "confused" the tranny in some way??

Trans temp was 106 and engine coolant same. Ambient was about 26 deg.

Behaved itself perfectly after that including many steep hills on the West Coast Tassy and back to 2nd/3rd gear on many occasions.

[Graeme]

I just reset the adaptions with foot on accel for 15 secs etc and it now shifts even better than it did before, which was pretty good anyway!
I've not heard of this procedure before. What's the whole procedure?

Were the problems occurring before the throttle module was fitted? I'd be inclined to disconnect it anyway to see if the problems still occur.

Your driving sounds very similar to mine although without the shift problems.

[rocket rod]

This arvo following my post I just reset the adaptions with foot on accel for 15 secs etc and it now shifts even better than it did before, which was pretty good anyway!

I haven't heard of this method, can you explain please?

[Tombie]

I haven't heard of this method, can you explain please?

It’s not quite right, he’s missed the major bit.
This is 6 speed version of same.

Requires box adaptations to be reset.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210224/f57159ae3327c3fab0c978eaa1ca81d7.png

[Discodicky]

I've not heard of this procedure before. What's the whole procedure?

Were the problems occurring before the throttle module was fitted? I'd be inclined to disconnect it anyway to see if the problems still occur.

Your driving sounds very similar to mine although without the shift problems.


Yes, definitely did it twice prior fitting the I-drive, and when the missus pinched it the other day to nip up from our shack to visit a girlfriend I put the I-drive back to "zero" as she doesn't like the action. She stays out of trouble re accidents but is not much of a driver re techniques and won't listen when I try to explain how to use the paddles if it ever does it again..............

Re the tranny re-set, you can Google (from memory) "Disco 4 re-set", but here is what you do.
(BMW also say same with the ZF in their cars.)

PROCEDURE FOR MEMORY RESET ON ZF TRANS: In this order.

Press start button to switch ignition on but DON'T start engine.
Press accelerator to floor and hold it there.
After approx 15 seconds, switch off ignition.
Lift your foot off accelerator.
Wait 2 minutes before starting the engine.


It made a noticeable difference to the smoothness of shifts and it was pretty good before, anyway.
There are others much more knowledgeable than me on this Forum who work on these cars every day and who may like to add comment.

[Milton477]

Trans temp was 106 and engine coolant same. Ambient was about 26 deg.



That seems a bit high for a 26 deg day, way too high actually. Is that read from from a GAP tool?

[Graeme]

It’s not quite right, he’s missed the major bit.
This is 6 speed version of same.

Requires box adaptations to be reset.
Thanks - I was aware of the process for the 6-speed to re-learn adaptions but I might try the 15-second reset to see if it will hang onto 1st gear longer.

[Tombie]

Yes, definitely did it twice prior fitting the I-drive, and when the missus pinched it the other day to nip up from our shack to visit a girlfriend I put the I-drive back to "zero" as she doesn't like the action. She stays out of trouble re accidents but is not much of a driver re techniques and won't listen when I try to explain how to use the paddles if it ever does it again..............

Re the tranny re-set, you can Google (from memory) "Disco 4 re-set", but here is what you do.
(BMW also say same with the ZF in their cars.)

PROCEDURE FOR MEMORY RESET ON ZF TRANS: In this order.

Press start button to switch ignition on but DON'T start engine.
Press accelerator to floor and hold it there.
After approx 15 seconds, switch off ignition.
Lift your foot off accelerator.
Wait 2 minutes before starting the engine.


It made a noticeable difference to the smoothness of shifts and it was pretty good before, anyway.
There are others much more knowledgeable than me on this Forum who work on these cars every day and who may like to add comment.

That’s driver adaptations - used to reset for hire cars as different drivers train the transmission differently.


Stop nannying the engine though - you aren’t doing it any favours. Soot etc

[DiscoDB]

Pretty sure the two resets (the base adaption reset as Tombie described and the pedal reset as Discodicky described) do different things.

Tombie’s process will recalibrated the clutch packs to account for wear and is the full adaption reset process, whilst the simpler pedal reset just reverts the shift points to being more aggressive (sporty) but the gearbox will relearn your driving style pretty quickly.

Edit: I see Tombie confirmed same in the time I was typing my post [emoji106]

[Graeme]

Engine(?) driver adaptions vs gbox clutchpack adaptions...
I'll still try it.

[DiscoDB]

Engine(?) driver adaptions vs gbox clutchpack adaptions...
I'll still try it.

Graeme - be very wary of doing a full base adaptions reset. It should only be done under certain conditions, and if not done properly will make the the gearbox shift much worse than it was.

The driver adaptions (pedal) reset is the only one I would do unless the ZF maintenance procedure calls for a base adaptions reset after doing specific work.

[Discodicky]

That’s driver adaptations - used to reset for hire cars as different drivers train the transmission differently.


Stop nannying the engine though - you aren’t doing it any favours. Soot etc

Fair comment but can't see much point in driving an engine out of its torque range.

[Discodicky]

That seems a bit high for a 26 deg day, way too high actually. Is that read from from a GAP tool?


From my Scanguage which fits in the OBD2 port.

Was working very hard towing a 3.0 Tonne (3.1 actually) 21ft caravan shaped like a brick.
Some headwind on occasions.
The temps dropped very quickly as soon as I either went down the hill or just took the load off the engine on a level road.
Engine rpm circa 2200-2600 occasionally higher depending on situation.

At 90-100 kph on hwy the temps were middle 90's

Long downhill no load they'd drop to 85 ish engine and 90 trans.

[Tombie]

Fair comment but can't see much point in driving an engine out of its torque range.

Here’s the point - doing it occasionally yet regularly blows the crap out!

And when towing, rpm will help keep it cooler not labouring.

[josh.huber]

They have a relativity flat torque curve due to variable turbos and common rail fuel injection, let it sing.. The non change up is weird, have you tried throwing a brake light switch at it? Mine does similar behaviour occasionally on the way home from work. Lazy driving with a size 12 work boot. Engages the brake pedal enough to cause trouble. Doesn't usually trigger a fault. I'm aware of it now and it doesn't happen.

[josh.huber]

Also, get your battery load tested, that voltage is usually only because the car is trying to save the battery. Or a dead battery has been changed but the battery system hasn't been reset.

[Graeme]

Graeme - be very wary of doing a full base adaptions reset. It should only be done under certain conditions, and if not done properly will make the the gearbox shift much worse than it was.

The driver adaptions (pedal) reset is the only one I would do unless the ZF maintenance procedure calls for a base adaptions reset after doing specific work.I did a clutch-pack re-calibration of the 6-speed in my D4 trying to overcome a fault but which required a rebuild due to stator bush failure. I often reset adaptions with a diagnostic tool to get rid of the sluggish gear changes as most of the time I used the engine's torque which eventually resulted in the sluggish take-offs.

[LRD414]

Here’s the point - doing it occasionally yet regularly blows the crap out!

And when towing, rpm will help keep it cooler not labouring.

And regular use of the secondary turbo requires regular use of its shutoff valves which are known to get stuck ..... it’s a case of use it or lose it. We make an effort to get the engine over 3000 at least once every drive, especially if it’s doing lots of short drives. I don’t think this is relevant for your trans issue but worth noting anyway.

Cheers,
Scott

[Graeme]

The shut-off valve sticking was a design issue, overcome with a re-design of the linkages for both the 3.0 and the 4.4. However the occasional clearing of any oil residue in the secondary turbo inlet tract is worthwhile.

[Discodicky]

The shut-off valve sticking was a design issue, overcome with a re-design of the linkages for both the 3.0 and the 4.4. However the occasional clearing of any oil residue in the secondary turbo inlet tract is worthwhile.

Many thankyou's to everyone who has offered their opinion and thoughts re this problem. It is very much appreciated and if it happens again I'll try to note a few things and report back.

It is an interesting 'problem' however I am not too fussed about it, only more so if it happens on the very odd occasion my wife drives it. If it happens with her the engine will most certainly get the soot cleaned out.....[bigrolf] [bigsad]

I have taken on board your interesting & knowledgeable comments re mothering the engine too much and in the interest of making the 2nd turbo work and reducing soot etc I promise to give it a bit more stick.
When you think about it, 3000 rpm is not a lot!

I replaced the brake light switch 26,000 klms ago early last year as a precautionary measure.

Invoices provided with the car show the battery was replaced in October 2017 which was roughly 78,000 klms ago, but I will get it checked. Thankyou for mentioning that.

Looking at the odometer yesterday I see its done 149,000; that last 3,000 crept up fast over past coupla months!

I am thinking the alternator may be getting close to needing replacement?
If we get away to the mainland this winter I'll replace it before leaving Tassy if you think it would be a good idea as it will have around 155,000 by June.

PS: Last week I once again (have driven it a few times) drove a friend's 24 month old LC200.
They are not a patch on a Disco. Just a glorified luxurious light truck in comparison!

[Tombie]

Good process [emoji41]

Mine regularly sees the red end of the tacho.
The car won’t let you kill it, even in manual it will force a shift.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Good process [emoji41]
The car won’t let you kill it, even in manual it will force a shift.

No, but some tend to commit suicide by letting their crank go....

Do agree with letting it rev though, they still hustle along quite nicely