D1 300TDI Timing Assistance

[gusthedog]

Hi all,

My new to me 300tdi D1 has the timing a little out as it blows some white smoke (diesel smelling, no fuel in the coolant and newish head, and timing belt isn't that old) on start up and is down on power a little. Anyone with a guage and the locking pins want to assist me in the Alexandra Vic area?

If not, I'll buy all the kit myself and have a crack. Just thought I'd ask first as I haven't done it before.

Cheers,

Pricey.

[gusthedog]

So a week with no answer. Near 70 views and not one reply? I might cry myself to sleep tonight.....

Maybe I'm used to the D2 area? But surely there are still fans of the mighty D1 on this site? C'mon 300 and 200 TDI owners, pull yourself together! Maybe you're all out doing timing belts? [emoji12]

So bugger it, I just went and bought my very own Bosch VE timing gauge. I went to fourby.uk first as they seem to have some awesome kit on their website. That is until you get to the postage bit. 75 UK pounds!!! For a small parcel from the UK? **** that!

So off to eBay I go. Now I won't tell you which kit I got incase it doesn't work. But if it do, I'll post the link. I paid $56. Let's see if it's any good.

Have my drill bit and a way of finding TDC. What could possibly go wrong? [emoji23]

[AK83]

[bigrolf]

I'm laughing only in that I had it in mind to answer ..

I got a dial gauge, but having trouble finding a reasonbly priced adapter to fit to the IP pump.

Found a couple of adapter kits on the bay too .. which say VW bosch kits but they say the adapter sets are for M10 and M12 fittings.
I'm sure(could be wrong) that the Tdi pump has M8 threads on the pump.

Then I'm thinking to self... am I over thinking it all.
Never done it myself, should have ages ago having now done two timing belts myself(I have the tools to to that easy enough).

have searched much info about timing the pump via lift, and found JC reckons that 1.6mm lift helps the Tdi a bit(and I'm always up for a bit of tinkering).

Main problem is time to do it all.
Alexandra is a nice drive (from my place) ... so would have been up for the trip to help .. etc.

But in the end .. I didn't reply(sorry) [biggrin]
If I had, it'd only have been a half-@$$ed reply in that I only have half the bits you need.

is yours auto or manual?

[Blknight.aus]

yeah, but where are you, first time I saw this thread... they're easy enough to miss.

[AK83]

yeah, but where are you, first time I saw this thread... they're easy enough to miss.

Alexandra(Vic) he said.

[gusthedog]

[bigrolf]

I'm laughing only in that I had it in mind to answer ..

I got a dial gauge, but having trouble finding a reasonbly priced adapter to fit to the IP pump.

Found a couple of adapter kits on the bay too .. which say VW bosch kits but they say the adapter sets are for M10 and M12 fittings.
I'm sure(could be wrong) that the Tdi pump has M8 threads on the pump.

Then I'm thinking to self... am I over thinking it all.
Never done it myself, should have ages ago having now done two timing belts myself(I have the tools to to that easy enough).

have searched much info about timing the pump via lift, and found JC reckons that 1.6mm lift helps the Tdi a bit(and I'm always up for a bit of tinkering).

Main problem is time to do it all.
Alexandra is a nice drive (from my place) ... so would have been up for the trip to help .. etc.

But in the end .. I didn't reply(sorry) [biggrin]
If I had, it'd only have been a half-@$$ed reply in that I only have half the bits you need.

is yours auto or manual?Manual

Yep, I saw JC recommends a 1.6mm lift. That's what I'll aim for.

The dial I bought says it does VE pumps so will give it a crack.

I was only having a dig - thanks for checking in though fellas, appreciate it.

I've watched a heap of vids, have a workshop manual and some pretty good tools. She'll be right!

When I totally stuff it up I'll reach out [emoji12]

[Blknight.aus]

ID love to come help, but, lockdown.

[AK83]

LOL! yep! [bighmmm]

[gusthedog]

Thanks guys. Appreciate it. I'll have a few days to play with it now anyway. Hopefully Australia Post will still get my gauge to me over the next few days.

That and the power steering pipe I'm waiting on from England. [emoji12]

[gusthedog]

So, finished off the powers steering no dramas.

But have a look at this ****! I have never in my 43 and a bit years had a 10mm bolt done up as tight as those on my VE pump guide plate. I've got two bolts out but the last one is not moving. Aaaaaaareergh!

Check out the stuffed threads on this bolt! What sort of knuckle dragger does a bolt up this tight? Never seen anything like it!

So if anyone has any ideas how to get it out, I'm all ears.

I noticed they were tight so took my tools off it straight away and went and bought a new 6 sided socket just to make sure I could get them out. Which didn't work.

There is also not enough room to hammer a socket on. Jesus Christ it's frustrating.

Even have my DTF gauge all hooked up and ready to go.

Have a look at that little ***** of a thing. I'm pretty sure it's laughing at me. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210721/80a5a162976bb965d8596ac3c2d5364a.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210721/f693aa5f2ebc1c2f90ffc57573c5ede1.jpg

[gusthedog]

Ok, so now I have calmed down a little Ive worked out what to do. I'm going to attempt taking the timing cover off and I might as well do the timing belt while I'm there! What could go wrong?

Hopefully when I take the timing cover off I can get to that evil bolt and remove it. I have sourced some replacement bolts.

So I have a new fan spanner, gasket and belt winging their way to me. I will do an inspection on the idler and tensioner - hopefully they're ok and I don't need to replace them. As I'm on a tight budget, I'm hoping that's the case.

Wish me luck!

[AK83]

...... I will do an inspection on the idler and tensioner - hopefully they're ok and I don't need to replace them. As I'm on a tight budget, I'm hoping that's the case.

Wish me luck!

I think false economy.
Last things you want to go wrong are those two.

I dunno how much you paid for the belt alone, but when I last looked, they were in the $100 range(give or take a tenner or so), but the timing belt kits were in the high $100's. IIRC I paid $180 for my last one(or maybe my first one) .. either way you can get them quite cheap instead of going individual parts route.

There are 'recommendations' for when changing tdi timing belts.
One of those things that you may find is regularly recommended is the front main seal. Not the dust cover seal, the front main seal behind the belts' crank pulley. There is also an O-ring behind it that should probably be replaced too.

Another thing I would recommend to change are both the woodruff keys too. They're only a couple of bucks, so don't break the bank.

Did you get the timing cover seal? Almost certainly it will break when you try to remove the cover, or the seal. It's not vital, and I guess you could use an RTV if you had too .. but again seal is cheap.
Watch for the washer behind the standoff for the centre bolt in the cover too.

Do you have a torque wrench to do the tensioner for the belt?
Clickety types are no good, and torque value is very low. I use a deflecting beam type on it.

Biggest issue I had was first time around trying to get the 80Nm and then 90° turn on the harmonic balancer bolt. Mine is auto so can't lock trans/engine to get a solid lock on the crank to do it. I bought a crank holding tool for it. Holy crap! ... that 90° turn was a mongrel to do .. properly.
First time around I made up a garbage flat bar tool with only 3 bolts holding onto the harmonic balancer and it snapped whilst I was doing the 90° turn, so I lost my 'bearings' and stuff it in the end. No biggie in the long run, but annoying to have to redo stuff.

I assume that with a manual, if you lock the CDL, in 1st or reverse, park brake on, wheels chocked .. it may hold the crank hard enough to do the final tighten .. if you ain't done it before just be aware of some of the tips out there.

blacknight has a tute somewhere on here.

[gusthedog]

Cheers for the reply AK83.

The full kits are now $220 odd. At this stage I just ordered the belt, gasket and fan removal spanner. I have a nice heavy duty torque wrench and a good breaker bar so should be ok there.

I agree that I probably should do all the maintenance and will reassess. Unfortunately though I'm currently skint and have to get this car on the road ASAP as my partner uses the other car for work and I have to drive the sprogs around.

I didn't know there would be this much work getting it on the road to be honest. I'm also a bit worried about the amount of oil coming from the transfer case. Which will need a seal kit sooner rather than later.

You expect this type of thing with a 24 year old car so it's all understandable. Especially as the car hadn't been driven much in the past year or two.

I spoke with a mate last night who has a new Nissan patrol v8. He is paying $4k to get his timing chain done! At least the Landy all up should come to less than $500 for this job including the purchase of the timing gauge I got. Landy parts are a steal compared to Toyota or Nissan parts. Which is lucky! Got to keep things in perspective.

[gusthedog]

I took the fan out today and that gave me heaps more room. I then could hammer a 3/8 socket on. First time failed. Second times a charm. Got the bastard off!

Yay!

Next, time the pump up. Got it to 1.6 of lift but the pin wouldn't drop in. Backed it off to 1.4 and the pin went in. Sweet. So I try and put the plate and bolts back in loosely at 1.4 and then I will raise to 1.6 via the gauge as planned. But guess what? The new bolts I got must be a different thread. They are m8 bolts and they look identical to the originals except for the 12mm instead of 10mm heads.

So I then retried one of the old bolts and couldn't get any of the 3 to even start. So I stopped and ordered the correct bolts. BUT, I think the gorilla who did up the bolts last may have actually stuffed the threads in the pump pulley. FFS.

So I will try and install the new bolts when they get here and hope to hell the thread isn't stuffed.

I was so happy when I got the bolt out - thinking I didn't have to take the timing cover off and go through all that hooplah. But I may have to do that and more If the threads in the pulley are stuffed.

I only have an m8x1 and m8x1.25 tap on my set. No one would know off hand the thread type of those 3 bolts that hold the pulley to the guide would they? Because if I could run a tap through the pulley (if I have to take it off if the thread is stuffed) I might be able to get away with fixing the one I have, rather than ordering a new one.

So now I wait with trepidation and hope to hell the new bolts go in ok.

Really happy with the little gauge I got to measure the pump lift though. Works great.

[Blknight.aus]

do not run a tap through the pully with it mounted or the pump on the engine unless you are a top shot with the tap

if you skew it even slightly you are fingered for getting a bolt to go in and hold.

use a thread chaser or make one from the correct size bolt by cutting it with a hack saw.

This is one of those lessons I learnt from having to fix someone else's butchery, you can now learn it without any of the pain.

good luck

[gusthedog]

do not run a tap through the pully.....

if you skew it even slightly you are fingered for getting a bolt to go in and hold.

use a thread chaser or make one from the correct size bolt by cutting it with a hack saw.

This is one of those lessons I learnt from having to fix someone else's butchery, you can now learn it without any of the pain.

good luckAwesome Blknight. Appreciate the heads up. [emoji12][emoji106]

[gusthedog]

So today's adventures. The reason I couldn't get the bolts of the timing pump in is that it's +/- one tooth on the timing belt. I realised this when I hold the pump in at 1.6mm lift, I can't get the bolts in because they are hidden behind the pulley which means the timing belt is out.

So just pulled out the radiator and drained it and am going to call it a day and have a beer. Will have to order a full timing kit now. Very frustrated. I think I've got it with this car, and then it throws another curve ball at me.

So bloody annoying. I have only driven the bastard thing once, and now I've missed my window of getting it on the road for this week and will have to walk my kids around town in the bloody rain.

That and now the missus car has a flat tyre. That's the 4th in those Goodyear tyres. Will have to get some new ones tomorrow. At least we have one working car.

Did I mention I also had to get my dog put down this week and my son jammed a pen grip up his nose and got a nice ride to emergency in Melbourne?

So if anyone wants to buy a disco, hit me up. It's in pieces in my shed [emoji12]

[Blknight.aus]

So today's adventures. The reason I couldn't get the bolts of the timing pump in is that it's +/- one tooth on the timing belt. I realised this when I hold the pump in at 1.6mm lift, I can't get the bolts in because they are hidden behind the pulley which means the timing belt is out.

So just pulled out the radiator and drained it and am going to call it a day and have a beer. Will have to order a full timing kit now. Very frustrated. I think I've got it with this car, and then it throws another curve ball at me.

So bloody annoying. I have only driven the bastard thing once, and now I've missed my window of getting it on the road for this week and will have to walk my kids around town in the bloody rain.

That and now the missus car has a flat tyre. That's the 4th in those Goodyear tyres. Will have to get some new ones tomorrow. At least we have one working car.

Did I mention I also had to get my dog put down this week and my son jammed a pen grip up his nose and got a nice ride to emergency in Melbourne?

So if anyone wants to buy a disco, hit me up. It's in pieces in my shed [emoji12]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/projects-and-tutorials/133800-tdi300-timing-belt.html?133800=#post1527174

have at it.

specifically

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/projects-and-tutorials/133800-tdi300-timing-belt.html#post1528836

[Blknight.aus]

Oh, in printable .pdf format Curtesy of Tins, its got the pics that photobucket blanked out.

tdi300 timing belt. (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/projects-and-tutorials/133800-tdi300-timing-belt-post2510881.html#post2510881)

its a ttached in that post.

[gusthedog]

Oh, in printable .pdf format Curtesy of Tins, its got the pics that photobucket blanked out.

tdi300 timing belt. (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/projects-and-tutorials/133800-tdi300-timing-belt-post2510881.html#post2510881)

its a ttached in that post.Thanks mate. Legend.

I went back at it this arvo and managed to undo the 27mm crank bolt. But my pulley is not budging. I'm making a puller up on one end of a lump of thick angle. On the other end I'm making a crank holding tool for doing up the crank. Coming along nicely.

Again, after I settled down, it was quite fun making something.

But it's been a tough week. Lost one of the best dogs Ive ever had. Check out the lanky bugger pretending she's small. That's the last photo I have of her.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210725/81a43087d47f8f64ad18c3a2e3b19625.jpg

[gusthedog]

Does no one service their own vehicle anymore? I'm chasing a harmonic balancer puller. The auto parts store in Seymour doesn't have one, the Bunnings is out of stock, all of the service centres locally won't lend tools (fair enough really) and the local hardware clerk looked at me like I'd ask to sleep with his sister, then led me to the rope and pulley section of the store and asked me "is this what you're after?" [emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787]

I was chasing a puller because I can't source a long M10 bolt to use my home made puller. An M10 bolt? Jesus Christ! What is the world coming to?

Surely the balancer puller is not a rare tool? Or am I missing something. A mate has one locally so will pop over later and check. Otherwise it's off to Melbourne or Kilmore for the closest one.

They seem just as rare as long M10 bolts [emoji1787]

Wish me luck! [emoji12]

[AK83]

damned lockdown!

I have the bits you need, but lockdown makes it hard to get them to you.
And lockdown is only half the issue ... work makes it hard to do stuff too.

You said you got the crank bolt off.
What I'd do for the balancer is use the crank bolt as the base for the centre bolt on the puller. This way you don't need such a long bolt and you don't risk damaging the cranks threads in any way too.
Basically, thread the crank bolt in a short distance to allow a few mil of slack for the balancer to slide off only. I found once you break the grip between the balancer and crank it then comes out easier.
Then once loose, remove crank bolt again .. etc.

IIRC for the harmonic's holding/anchoring screws, they need to be M8 and approx 55-60mm in shank/thread length. They don't screw up all the way through the balancer when the balancer is fitted coz the dust shield bottoms them out .. maybe 10mm depth.

[gusthedog]

Thanks AK83. I have managed to get a puller from a mate who's a mechanic. And your advice on the bolt was the same as his. I only have it for the night so I'd better get a crack on this evening [emoji12]

And I need to re-undo the crank bolt because I put it back in just to double check I was on TDC. And I am. And the pump is indeed a tooth or so out.

Hopefully with Blknight's tute and some blind luck, I can get it back on the road again soon!

My mechanic mate was amazed it ran on a tooth out. But when I told him about the white smoke etc but good head and compression etc he thought I was on to the right cause.

[Blknight.aus]

Does no one service their own vehicle anymore? I'm chasing a harmonic balancer puller. The auto parts store in Seymour doesn't have one, the Bunnings is out of stock, all of the service centres locally won't lend tools (fair enough really) and the local hardware clerk looked at me like I'd ask to sleep with his sister, then led me to the rope and pulley section of the store and asked me "is this what you're after?" [emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787]

I was chasing a puller because I can't source a long M10 bolt to use my home made puller. An M10 bolt? Jesus Christ! What is the world coming to?

Surely the balancer puller is not a rare tool? Or am I missing something. A mate has one locally so will pop over later and check. Otherwise it's off to Melbourne or Kilmore for the closest one.

They seem just as rare as long M10 bolts [emoji1787]

Wish me luck! [emoji12]

in t he pics of the pdf thats linked in a previous post it shows you which 2 bolts you can pry off of using a pair of tyre levers or pry bars..

remove the bolt from the center of the puller and use a gentle heat source to heat the balancer near the center (about 140 deg c works) and then cool the nose of the crank with some WD40

wedge the pry bars/tyre leavers in and give em a tap

[gusthedog]

in t he pics of the pdf thats linked in a previous post it shows you which 2 bolts you can pry off of using a pair of tyre levers or pry bars..

remove the bolt from the center of the puller and use a gentle heat source to heat the balancer near the center (about 140 deg c works) and then cool the nose of the crank with some WD40

wedge the pry bars/tyre leavers in and give em a tapWell there was so much rust on that harmonic.balancer that I'm glad I borrowed a puller. No way it was coming off with even my massive tyre lever or Jimmy bar. Bastard of a thing. But it came off! Yoooot! Tomorrow night begins the timing belt proper.

Have a gander at my pulley holding tool. Worked great guns on the pulley as by hand cranking the engine, I'd actually done up the bolt pretty tight. The motor has good compression anyway!

And the final picture of the pulley off! And sorry to all you purists, I have done a little scratching up of the timing cover when my levers slipped off wood/bolts trying to wedge that ***** out.

So I highly suggest getting a proper pulley puller. Worth its weight in gold if your pulley is stuck. Even had a choice of two tools in the end. Thank science (I'm a practising atheist) for mates that are mechanics when you own a Landrover [emoji1787]. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210726/91bf669096e8f816ea66e6aa98fb4767.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210726/5ec12e5f1cbe9f58f07cd494d27f776a.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210726/888d3e945edfc075efec31c3a2a20d2c.jpg

[Blknight.aus]

you're not getting the timing cover off with the fan pully still mounted.

[gusthedog]

I know. I just havent got there yet.

[gusthedog]

you're not getting the timing cover off with the fan pully still mounted.Is this when you roll your eyes at me as I haven't read that far yet - I got stopped by the drive pulley [emoji1787]

There is probably a technique for getting the fan pulley off too. I should look into that [emoji12]

[gusthedog]

Right so had a quick brake from the office grind - I have taken the 14 bolts out of the timing cover (made a cardboard template for the purpose).

My issue is that the timing cover isn't coming off. It seems to be glued on with blue silastic. Can I pry it off the back or should a go around it with a small screwdriver and try and break the seal all the way around?

Sorry for all the dumb questions but I wanted to ask before I **** it up!

Also the gorillas have been at it again. The four 10mm bolts that held the fan pulley on were done up with a rattle gun as well. Took my time - stuffed the bolt heads but got them out. I had to use my breaker bar on them!https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210727/b530252543f9fd3d57bfc5a86bc4a637.jpg

[gusthedog]

I got the cover off. Yes, it was just glued in place with the sealant. And I have some nice oil leaks from the crank and camshaft seals as well - of course I do! This car has it in for me. My friend Phil named her Dolores but I’m thinking I might rename her after my mum because she’s a bit of a pain in the arse [emoji1787]

Anyway I will disappear from this thread for a few days until the pay check comes in and I can afford the “full kit” of seals, pulleys etc.

So thanks again for your advice Blknight and Ak83, you were spot on with me needing the full kit.

I just wanted to see what sort of condition it was in before I spent the $. Since a gorilla with bad hygiene did the timing last time, nothing looks like it has been changed in that case in a very long time. I suppose it was to be expected given how tight the bolts were and that silastic was used instead of a proper seal.

Onwards and upwards.

[AK83]

Don't go too fast! .. you only just started!! [biggrin]

ps. those 4 fan pulley bolts can self tighten if the pulley hasn't been off for along time.
Same issue on mine. I know I don't use gorilla force on my nuts(ah!.. you know what I mean [smilebigeye]) but trying to get them off one time .. turned into the same head turning drama you dealt with.
I got some shinier 12mm M8 flanged bolts with larger heads on them(I think 12mm instead of 10mm or 10mm instead of 8mm .. whatever they are std) .. anyhow, one spanner size up.

FWIW: I later found that Kingchromes' 'LockOn' sockets are really good on damaged fixings too! [thumbsupbig]

The full kit for the timing belt includes a fair bit of stuff, but not 'everything'.
From memory: crank seal and dust seal(they look similar so be aware of which is which). O ring behind crank gear, tensioner, idler, belt (of course) gasket, small copper like washer(for central bolt on cover) new bolts for tensioner and idler.
Didn't have the half moon woodruff keys, one for harmonic and one for crank gear. I reckon they should be replaced as they can get a teeny ... half mil of chattery damage to them. No cam seal tho.

Did you get any rubbery dust flung around the inside of the cover?
My first one had a fair bit of it. I dunno how many klms the belt had done before I bought the D1, previous owner said he'd only done about 30K klms in four years. Belt looked OK(compared to the new one in the kit) tho.

My second one was done prematurely, at 70K klms as I had to deal with the leaking front crank seal. I lived with the oil leak as long as possible hoping it will hold out for a few more thousand klms, but got too bad for my liking .. so was all done again at 70K klms. zero rubbery dust, but a fair bit of oil tho as to be expected.

Do you know the history of your Tdi? when was the last belt done .. etc.

[gusthedog]

Don't go too fast! .. you only just started!! [biggrin]

ps. those 4 fan pulley bolts can self tighten if the pulley hasn't been off for along time.
Same issue on mine. I know I don't use gorilla force on my nuts(ah!.. you know what I mean [smilebigeye]) but trying to get them off one time .. turned into the same head turning drama you dealt with.
I got some shinier 12mm M8 flanged bolts with larger heads on them(I think 12mm instead of 10mm or 10mm instead of 8mm .. whatever they are std) .. anyhow, one spanner size up.

FWIW: I later found that Kingchromes' 'LockOn' sockets are really good on damaged fixings too! [thumbsupbig]

The full kit for the timing belt includes a fair bit of stuff, but not 'everything'.
From memory: crank seal and dust seal(they look similar so be aware of which is which). O ring behind crank gear, tensioner, idler, belt (of course) gasket, small copper like washer(for central bolt on cover) new bolts for tensioner and idler.
Didn't have the half moon woodruff keys, one for harmonic and one for crank gear. I reckon they should be replaced as they can get a teeny ... half mil of chattery damage to them. No cam seal tho.

Did you get any rubbery dust flung around the inside of the cover?
My first one had a fair bit of it. I dunno how many klms the belt had done before I bought the D1, previous owner said he'd only done about 30K klms in four years. Belt looked OK(compared to the new one in the kit) tho.

My second one was done prematurely, at 70K klms as I had to deal with the leaking front crank seal. I lived with the oil leak as long as possible hoping it will hold out for a few more thousand klms, but got too bad for my liking .. so was all done again at 70K klms. zero rubbery dust, but a fair bit of oil tho as to be expected.

Do you know the history of your Tdi? when was the last belt done .. etc.

Yep, I know those bolts tighten up - but they were so tight they had starting to fold the threads back. Like the IP bolts which I assume were also done up with a rattle gun.

There is a bit of black dust in the cover but nothing too excessive.

With the oil leaks I'd assume that they didn't change the seals last time it was done (about 30k ago).

The car came with the stamped service book and receiptd for the past few years. It's got a fairly new head, good injectors and some other new parts throughout.

The old owner is on AULRO and is a good egg. He didn't know about any of the issues I'm going through and has been in contact since I bought the car from him. I really appreciate that.

I like the sound of those kingchrome sockets. Will have to have a look for them.

I ordered the parts for the timing kit through Mario and Heather. As I hadn't been on the forum much these last 4 non-landy years I didn't know about his health issues. Just gutted for him. He was always so nice to me over the past few decades and my previous 4 landys (a 94 single cab defer, another 97 tdi300 D1 like this one, a 2007 defender that I took around Australia and my D2 td5 that I had for over 10 years). Really glad that I could support him and spend the cash with them.

Just goes to show you need to value life and get the most out of things while you can. You never know what health concerns or issues are round the corner.

[gusthedog]

So just had a look across components in the shed and cleaning up some surfaces, inspecting the timing cover etc getting ready to install the full kit on its way from Mario. And see the harmonic balancer has some cracks in the rubber on the front face. Back looks fine but I will need to replace it.

So my on the cheap timing belt change has blown out to be not so cheap [emoji12]

Noticed a heap of black dust on the front cover opposite where it runs around the gear on the crank. So glad I'm putting a fresh gear and new belt in too.

Wonder what else will go wrong? [emoji1787]

Still have to do rear a frame rubber thingy, rear wheel bearings and rear pads. Then there's the front end rubbers and suspension bushes. Keeping me busy, that's for sure!

[gusthedog]

So to replace the seal I'm holding, which I assume is the front crank oil seal - not the dust seal, I know about that one, I have to take the sump, aircon, fuel pump and pulley etc off then the timing cover back plate to fit it don't I?

Because I am close to giving up!

The seal is leaking so it needs to be done.

Before I unbolt everything, do I need a special tool to put the seal in?

And please tell me I don't have to unbolt everything! [emoji24]
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210807/ef983842b8a11b2174ca1cad96699cf3.jpg

[gusthedog]

Worked it out myself. That is the later type front dust cover seal. PHEWWW!

Mine had the earlier style seal so that’s what I replaced it with.

So glad I didn’t start taking extra things off!

At least when I do this next time, I will know what I’m doing!
[emoji1787]

[gusthedog]

It's nearly back together! God dam that crank nut is hard to do up the 80nm then plus 90 degrees! Bent my new home made tool doing it but got there in the end. Now just have to replumb in the fuel pump lines and the radiator

Tool the chance to clean the intercooler out well while the front was open.

Hopefully that's it. Should have it back to driveable by tomorrow night. Unless I stuff up something else [emoji1787]

[gusthedog]

Timing cover back on. Yaaaay!https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210808/53c60ca2eefb8402bf103496babd1f1e.jpg

[gusthedog]

Like a phoenix rising from the ashes, the mighty 300tdi roars to life!

the 300tdi lives again! - YouTube (https://youtube.com/shorts/jHqNze-d-58?feature=share)

So yeah, the timing worked. Idles really well now. No smoke at all on start up.

No power steering leaks either!

Test drive tomorrow!

Thanks AK83 and Blknight. Appreciate your help.

Also found some really useful videos by Britannia restorations. Mike is easy to understand and his videos are peppered with interesting facts. Two thumbs up from me.

Preventing overheating on the 200/300Tdi - YouTube (https://youtu.be/HvZXsH_06lw)

[gusthedog]

And she goes awesome. Kids loved being dropped to school in it [emoji12]

Struggled to get out my steep driveway though so played with the smoke screw and wound it in a turn to fix. Now idles up the drive without any problems. No additional smoke under load either so reckon it is just perfect now [emoji106]

Thanks again to everyone that's helped out so far.

And now onto the next bit - wheels (rear wheel bearings and new pads) and lt230 (leaking from both the input and output - double whammy!)

After the next two, it shouldnt even be leaking much oil. Pretty stoked about that [emoji1787]

[AK83]

Good to hear it's all coming good.

With respect to the wheel bearings: suspect that the stub axles may have some wear in them. Either where the bearings sit on the spindle, or the collar end where the seal lip seats.
Not uncommon for a vehicle of this age(or klms) to have worn stub axles.

I had a groaning passenger front bearing on mine, got the bearings and seal to do it, but found that the stub had that mil or so of play where the bearing seats itself.
Instead of doing it then, I waited and ordered the bearing and stub rebuild kits from the UK for all four corners.
This was pre covid, so freight wasn't horrendously prohibitive tho.
All four corners cost me less than a single kit from here in Oz(with Timken bearings). The stub axle may have been lesser quality or whatever, but (I reckoned that) el cheapo new stubs are still a lot better than genuine worn stubs!

I found that 3 of the four stubs were worn to some degree, so felt satisfaction in having chosen that way forward.

Also, nothing wrong with driving on a worn bearing for a few klms too. By the time the parts came and I then had the time to do at least the fronts .. I reckon I'd done at least 2-3K klms on that worn front. Just drive accordingly(gently).

Other tip(just makes the job a lot easier) .. if you do the bearing as a kit, order yourself another retaining nut too. Helps so much in getting torque right on ... There's a very high probability that someone else had been into it and have hacked at the nuts with a chisel .. so the nuts will be half chewed up. They're something like a couple of dollars. If you do decide to order a stub kit, it will only come with one new nut and the locking washer .. so only one other nut is needed as a extra expense.

Hopefully you find the bearings (and stubs) are fine and it's just a leaking seal ... [thumbsupbig]

[gusthedog]

Well according to the old mechanic of the car there's some play in the rear wheel bearings. I'll take one apart I suppose and see how I go from there.

Appreciate the heads up though AK83. Seems it's only you, me and Blknight in the D1 forum now [emoji16]

[rar110]

Well done Chris. I’ve been watching with interest as have the D1’s motor out for a rebuild. I’m fairly new to these motors.

[gusthedog]

Well done Chris. I’ve been watching with interest as have the D1’s motor out for a rebuild. I’m fairly new to these motors.Cheers rar110. Hopefully I make the stupid mistakes so others don't have to [emoji23]

Also have to do suspension bushes. I assume that means Radius Arm? Will find out. Surely I can press those out with nothing more than some shed tools? [emoji1787]

Whilst this is a Toyota arm, the same should apply to a LR one....

Change Suspension Bushes without a Hydraulic Press? - YouTube (https://youtu.be/OM2KVBNpeZQ)

[AK83]

....

Also have to do suspension bushes. I assume that means Radius Arm? Will find out. Surely I can press those out with nothing more than some shed tools? [emoji1787]

.....

Haha! Good luck with it.

Perfectly good large bench vices have known to break under the strain.

You may find yourself in the situation where 3 of the four fronts come out relatively easy .. and then for no reason, and without warning .. that 4th is the bugger that breaks the shed tool.

I rushed it to a local bike mechanic and he pressed it out with no charge.
I fitted the new bushes in an old spare vice tho .. the new ones should go in a lot easier than randomly recalcitrant old ones coming out.

I hate the smell of burning rubber, but some folks burn them out till the shell is left and then hack the shell out a little.

After a few goes at replacing bushes in my RRC, I found that the split design polys are the best way to replace them.
A lifetime ago, info wasn't so readily available, and the RRC would chew out bushes like they were a regular service item.

So once polys were discovered, partly to test them out, more so for the ease of replacing them if they ever failed .. but the failure never eventuated with half of the klms that old RRC had done on the polys.

I've seen advice that the soft type SuperPro polys seem to work well.
Back in the day(90's) I got yellow coloured Nolathanes for my RRC. Apart from tightening up the loose chassis feeling(to be expected with clapped out rubber bushes) they didn't make the ride any harsher as many people claim they do.

20 ton press is one of those shed tools I've always had in mind to get myself(now that I have a shed!) .. just keeps slipping the memory capacity available in my bonce!

Anyhow .. something I want to do to my D1 one day soon too.

[rar110]

Would using some grease on the new bushes help for next time, if using rubber/OEM rather than poly bushes?

[gusthedog]

Would using some grease on the new bushes help for next time, if using rubber/OEM rather than poly bushes?That's the plan rar110 - although I have spied a nice 20 ton press for $250 delivered. Might save up some bikkies.

Thanks for the advice on the bushes AK83. I won't be burning them out either. I'll try the high tensile bolt way with some sockets and what not, nearly kill myself and then buy a press anyway [emoji1787]

My mechanic mate in town has offered to press them out if I need.

Another order in with Mario for the next round of bits and bobs.

Caught up with a mate today who has just got his new Hilux. It was very pretty. SR5 wheels, bullbar, side steps etc etc He spent twice my vehicle purchase price on accessories! [emoji15] He is a builder though so can write it off on tax.

I think poor old Dolores felt a bit old when he parked next to me [emoji12]

He didn't have a name for his car on it though. I won that one!https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210811/f2ff5b404dfed69fa6a36d3aa5767817.jpg

[AK83]

Would using some grease on the new bushes help for next time, if using rubber/OEM rather than poly bushes?

If you mean between outer shell and the radius arm .. most likely not.

If you use grease on the outer shell, it'll just get squidged out when pressing in the new bush(which should go in relatively easy .. from experience).
They are an interference fit.

Note that the vid you linked too shows the panhard rod bush, which is quite small compared to a radium arm bush.
Also in the vid, note that he only pulled out the rubber using the long thread and ratchet method. Had he tried doing that on the entire bush, he'd have needed the breaker bar. Note how he had to tap out the shell that remained in the panhard rod.

So, the small effort used using the high tensile all thread method is a fraction of a percent needed for a really stuck radius bush.
Note that they may all pop out quite easily, or they could all be near impossible to remove. Condition of radius arm will matter .. how long they've been in .. etc.

I did my panhard rod bushes(D1) a few years ago now, got a nice sturdy vice .. not a branded version, just a cheapo Chineseium thingie from an ebay type seller warehouse.
Panhard bushes nearly jumped out of their slots.

I use anti-sieze on the bolts tho. The bolts can wear out by fractions of a mil, so a bit of lube can help. In Aus, they don't usually rust up badly like you see in overseas videos on youtube .. but if you do a lot of coastal/beach trips .. maybe they will.

Do you have a super extensive selection of sockets. May sound like the obvious item to use as an implement, but note that radius arm bushes are about 50mm diameter .. which means a 45mm-ish socket.

If you're looking to spend $s on some tools of useful value, I can recommend a set of bush removing cups .. or press sleeve set.
I got mine from the same ebay-ish seller warehouse I got my latest vice. Huge selection of sleeves/cups in this kit.
I see them on ebay for more than $100, but I got mine for about $80. The kits come with high tensile threaded rod in various sizes and up to M16, but more importantly bearing washers. You don't want the friction of pushing and twisting against washers and stuff.

I was contemplating trying my kit on the radius bushes one day, but using the impact gun on it instead of 'hard labour'.

If these random cycles of lockdown ever stops, I have no problem coming up with some useful tools for you to have a play with.

I didn't read that you're planning to do the chassis end of the bushes .. and it'd seem a waste to do just the circular bushes and not do the chassis end as well too. And I always replace the bolts as well as the nuts.
Doesn't seem obvious to do so, but with my RRC, I found that I'd get a slight shimmy in the steering, which was always easily fixable with new bolts for the radius arm bushes and or panhard rod. Repacing the nuts should be standard procedure as they are nyloc types(which shouldn't be re used) and you don't want them coming off on 'ya down the road!
Std nut/bolt heads are 24mm I think(I can get back on this if you need confirmation), and the design was such that you NEED a ring spanner for some of the heads. Socket will not fit. Can't recall which, but in the end, I think two ring spanners were needed to get some of the bolts off.

[gusthedog]

If you mean between outer shell and the radius arm .. most likely not.

If you use grease on the outer shell, it'll just get squidged out when pressing in the new bush(which should go in relatively easy .. from experience).
They are an interference fit.

Note that the vid you linked too shows the panhard rod bush, which is quite small compared to a radium arm bush.
Also in the vid, note that he only pulled out the rubber using the long thread and ratchet method. Had he tried doing that on the entire bush, he'd have needed the breaker bar. Note how he had to tap out the shell that remained in the panhard rod.

So, the small effort used using the high tensile all thread method is a fraction of a percent needed for a really stuck radius bush.
Note that they may all pop out quite easily, or they could all be near impossible to remove. Condition of radius arm will matter .. how long they've been in .. etc.

I did my panhard rod bushes(D1) a few years ago now, got a nice sturdy vice .. not a branded version, just a cheapo Chineseium thingie from an ebay type seller warehouse.
Panhard bushes nearly jumped out of their slots.

I use anti-sieze on the bolts tho. The bolts can wear out by fractions of a mil, so a bit of lube can help. In Aus, they don't usually rust up badly like you see in overseas videos on youtube .. but if you do a lot of coastal/beach trips .. maybe they will.

Do you have a super extensive selection of sockets. May sound like the obvious item to use as an implement, but note that radius arm bushes are about 50mm diameter .. which means a 45mm-ish socket.

If you're looking to spend $s on some tools of useful value, I can recommend a set of bush removing cups .. or press sleeve set.
I got mine from the same ebay-ish seller warehouse I got my latest vice. Huge selection of sleeves/cups in this kit.
I see them on ebay for more than $100, but I got mine for about $80. The kits come with high tensile threaded rod in various sizes and up to M16, but more importantly bearing washers. You don't want the friction of pushing and twisting against washers and stuff.

I was contemplating trying my kit on the radius bushes one day, but using the impact gun on it instead of 'hard labour'.

If these random cycles of lockdown ever stops, I have no problem coming up with some useful tools for you to have a play with.

I didn't read that you're planning to do the chassis end of the bushes .. and it'd seem a waste to do just the circular bushes and not do the chassis end as well too. And I always replace the bolts as well as the nuts.
Doesn't seem obvious to do so, but with my RRC, I found that I'd get a slight shimmy in the steering, which was always easily fixable with new bolts for the radius arm bushes and or panhard rod. Repacing the nuts should be standard procedure as they are nyloc types(which shouldn't be re used) and you don't want them coming off on 'ya down the road!
Std nut/bolt heads are 24mm I think(I can get back on this if you need confirmation), and the design was such that you NEED a ring spanner for some of the heads. Socket will not fit. Can't recall which, but in the end, I think two ring spanners were needed to get some of the bolts off.Thanks for all that useful info AK83. I am planning on replacing all of the worn bushes as I go. Was thinking of getting one of those full rubber sets for around $300 and taking my time.

Have you got a link to the cups etc for the bushes? I do have a variety of pretty good quality tools but want to get a shop press and a good half inch or 3/4 rattle gun. Have a good air compressor in the shed.

You're right though, not sure if I have 45mm sockets around. Not much call for anything that big on my Landy or my Royal Enfield Himalayan [emoji12]

Just got in from the shed. Spent some time fixing door handle action on the rear doors so the kids can open them easily. They open really well now.

Also made sure the power steering box was properly bled as the pump was making some groaning noise and may have had some air in it. I had a similar problem on my D2 when I did the power steering pump. Bled well and no more sound. Win.

Would love to catch up post lockdown AK83 and have a chat about tools and landies.

Glad we are pretty free to move around up here - going to take the kids up Mt Margaret on Sunday in the Landy. A nice drive and great scenery.

[Bmachining]

If you go for the rubber bushes, DO Not tighten the bolts unless the vehicle is sitting on the wheels. That way the rubber will not be stressed and twisted in its natural location.

If there tightened with the suspension hanging down, when the car is lowered to its normal height the rubber will be twisted, causing it to tear and fail early in life.

Poly bushes not so bad as they can move in the arm.

[gusthedog]

If you go for the rubber bushes, DO Not tighten the bolts unless the vehicle is sitting on the wheels. That way the rubber will not be stressed and twisted in its natural location.

If there tightened with the suspension hanging down, when the car is lowered to its normal height the rubber will be twisted, causing it to tear and fail early in life.

Poly bushes not so bad as they can move in the arm.Good advice Bmachining. Makes sense and not something I would immediately think of. [emoji106]

I like rubber bushes because I like to keep the car comfortable and mostly stock. I reckon LR know more about what bushes to put on their car than I do [emoji12]

[AK83]

....

Have you got a link to the cups etc for the bushes? ....

Press/Pull sleeve tools (https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/142611093873?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=705-139619-5960-0&mkcid=2&itemid=142611093873&targetid=1278990506786&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9071448&poi=&campaignid=10101784946&mkgroupid=125571292951&rlsatarget=pla-1278990506786&abcId=9300367&merchantid=107660035&gclid=CjwKCAjwjdOIBhA_EiwAHz8xm8xH-pDHiZe-Zg7uDQvazzz3wKf13MSaw2qc8mLzI-8zOEso9eogZhoCVCUQAvD_BwE)

Can't vouch for the seller, just showing what my kit basically is. Mine could be exactly the same. Search around for the cheapest price for them tho .. they are generically made from the same factory in the peoples republic .. so spend more $s won't necessarily translate into better quality versions.

I also found that total tools have a Daytona brand kit, kind'a sort'a similar .. a few differences in terms of the hardware in that kit, obviously from the likes of Sydney Tools .. more $s too tho.
I don't particularly like the Daytona(Sydney Tools) design type for the sleeves tho. You can find similar types on ebay too, a bit cheaper.

What I don't like.... never used, just hypothesizing!! ... the two piece sleeve what the sleeve is just that(not a cup), and is made to fit onto an end plate.
Could be annoying in some situations to balance and hang and grip the two pieces .. etc, where the one piece cup type maybe easier to balance precariously .... which we all know is what we sometimes have to do to get a job done.
This is why we don't care about insignificant side issues like ... loss of blood when working on our landies.

FWIW: the cups were dead on the perfect piece for bashing in the bearing races into the hubs! [thumbsupbig]

LOL! funny how things sneak up on you and then wham! I hear the term covid tax get bandied about .. prices of used cars and all sorts of stuff.
My kit is either same or very similar, and maybe 3 and a bit years ago I got mine. I remember it coz it was just after I built my shed .. 3 1/2 years ago.
I got mine for under $90. The link to the one on ebay was the cheapest one I could find at $137. I can't imagine it's due to iron ore price increases .. almost certainly a combination of shipping costs and a bit of demand(or lack of supply).

Damn! I wish I could charge 50% more for my time in only 3 years.

Not sure on how urgent you are on doing these jobs, but the offer if we get out of lockdown is genuine. Can bring up tools and stuff .. maybe even lend a hand .. if you have the strength to lift my 200kg off the ground [biggrin]
But I'll also see if I can pop around to that chinese tool ebay like mob. I just found them again. They used to be close to me in Tullamarine, but moved(didn't know where). Found them no in Laverton(derrimut .. whatever)

This mob is called Radum, it's just a warehouse that sells ebay looking junk. I got a few tools from them, and strangely none of it has broke! .... and I got to say I do try(mostly out of partial incompetence too tho).
One tool I thought I'd never have a need for is a piston spreader too. I was about $10, so pretty cheap. I used to do the old way with screwdrivers or levers and what not .. and of course the obligatory loss of blood ensued(without fail).
At $10 it does look a little flimsy, but hasn't failed yet. So some of these Chinesium quality tools can be at least usable.
The other mob I can have a quick search for is known as Nightingales. Another el cheapo tool warehouse type place.

[gusthedog]

Awesome advice on the tokls AK83 thanks. I need to get a Vic RWC in the next month or so. Have to get the Lt230 oil tight as a priority and the suspension bushes need doing. That last one was a general statement from the last mechanic on the car. I'll inspect them all on the weekend and see which ones are on the way out.

I think I've lost my fair share of blood and skin on this D1 too! The worst was trying to change the diesel breather pipe on the long range tank. It let go when I was applying mucho force and there was much bleeding and swearing involved [emoji1787]

It always pays to check bolts and pipe fittings on a new to you car. I was under the bonnet last night quickly measring the pipe for the boost gauge fittings (have the gauge and pipe but fittings gone). Noticed the bung in the plenum was only held in by one or two threads. Might have a bit more power now it's not escaping out the back of the intake plenum!

So I'm up to 12 fittings damaged because they were done up too tight (all replaced) and 7 fittings loose. Of the loose we had oil cooler pipes (also with no O ring), timing cover bolts, fan belt tensioner bolt and now the plenum bung. Good to be across them [emoji12]

[Roverlord off road spares]

So to replace the seal I'm holding, which I assume is the front crank oil seal - not the dust seal, I know about that one, I have to take the sump, aircon, fuel pump and pulley etc off then the timing cover back plate to fit it don't I?

Because I am close to giving up!

The seal is leaking so it needs to be done.

Before I unbolt everything, do I need a special tool to put the seal in?

And please tell me I don't have to unbolt everything! [emoji24]
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210807/ef983842b8a11b2174ca1cad96699cf3.jpg
Sorry I should have told you the kit included the extra dust cover seal for the odd Timing cover that uses that type.