Disco 1 days are numbered - which dual cab ute?

[edddo]

I think its time to seriously consider updating from my Disco 1 tdi to........what?
It will need to do what the tdi did..daily driver, reliable remote touring, good off road for hi country trips and tow the camper occassionally (any modern ute will tow better than the tdi).
Whatever I get it will be for the next 10 plus years.
I don't want too much tech, I really prefer to not have cart springs.
I think it will have to be a dual cab something..maybe a tray-back with a canopy or box on it... or with a tub and canopy with gull wings etc... for pure functionality and versatility.

If you were going to consider a DC ute for these things..which ones would you think are better than others and why?

[loanrangie]

Value for money the Triton cant be beat unless you go for the budget option of LDV/GWM.
If i was after a ute it would be either a Ranger or a D max.

[trout1105]

Hilux or D-Max [thumbsupbig]
Both are eminantly reliable and are also pretty good in traffic/parking as a daily driver and Both are very capable offroad[thumbsupbig]

[Saitch]

Hilux = premium $$$$$ for nothing special vehicle.

[Tote]

Budget utes - LDV/Great Wall etc I'd not consider unless you have a really specific cost goal to meet.
Triton - competent but a bit dated and plasticky
Dmax - Now has a diff lock which it sorely needed, maybe a consideration, the last one I drove a couple of years ago was a long way behind on articulation and traction control.
Ranger - I would have bought one of these as the alternative to my 130 in 2015 but I had my last chance to buy a Defender new and couldn't let it pass
78 series Toyota - the closest thing to a Defender in concept but it does have its shortcomings ie rear leaf springs and 5 speeds
If you are considering a Tojo the bottom end of the RAM1500 series is in the same financial ballpark


I haven't put any restrictions on new/secondhand and they are roughly in order of cost

Regards,
Tote

[trout1105]

Hilux = premium $$$$$ for nothing special vehicle.


It will need to do what the tdi did..daily driver, reliable remote touring, good off road for hi country trips and tow the camper occassionally (any modern ute will tow better than the tdi).
Whatever I get it will be for the next 10 plus years.

This is what the OP is looking for and the Hilux ticks ALL of his boxes.

Yes there IS a premium when you buy a Toyota product But unlike most of their competitors (JLR included) there is also a premium to be had when you trade/sell the Toyota product AND the Isuzu is also gaining a lot of respect in the second hand market.

[rick130]

Too many problems with the D4D Hilux DPF.
The current Triton is showing up quite well in use, (as long as you don't totally abuse it) and the deals are excellent atm. It's what were going to over our entire fleet. (And my drive for nearly two years, our branch was the test case)
Normally I'd say D-Max (and that includes the current Mazda BT50) but the Isuzu dealers can be less than sympathetic to their light vehicle buyers.

A mate works as an agronomist for Elders in rural Sth Oz and they will only buy Rangers nationwide now.
Less $ in overall costs/reliability than any other ute they've tried over their entire fleet.

[Homestar]

As a Hilux daily driver I would highly recommend looking for something else. The new Rangers don’t **** gearboxes like the early ones but they drink far more fuel. We run around 20 of each in Melbourne and we are going back to the Hiluxs based on overall cost.

If it was my money I’d be buying a Triton every time. Next door neighbour has one and has now completed 18 months of towing a 2000Kg van all around Aus and it still drives nicely.

Remember that any of these options will ride like crap compared to the D1 so be prepared to wear a kidney belt when you have nothing in the back - they are all truly aweful in this regard and if you’re looking at comfort then none of the dual cab 4x4’s should be on your list.

[reefmagnet]

The Triton is a quiet achiever. I've never owned one, but I've driven and worked around a few and they do what's written on the box and seem pretty reliable. They did have a susceptibility to bend the chassis a while back due to the long tray overhang past the rear axle, not sure if this is still something to be aware of. With the Ranger, if you're a DIY guy watch out for the 3.2 as it's possible to lose prime on the oil pump if you dally too long during an oil change and it's then an absolute PITA to get it re-primed.

[edddo]

Thanks everyone..all of the recommended trucks have cart springs so far.

Any views on the Navara?

[Saitch]

Thanks everyone..all of the recommended trucks have cart springs so far.

Any views on the Navara?

Yes![bighmmm]

[Homestar]

Thanks everyone..all of the recommended trucks have cart springs so far.

Any views on the Navara?

Yep - don’t go near it. Nissan overall have lost the plot in recent years. Only exception would be the Y62 in my opinion. This would also give you power and more comfort than any of the utes.

If you really need a dual cab and comfort then I’m really not sure what you’d go for.

[V8Ian]

Thanks everyone..all of the recommended trucks have cart springs so far.

Any views on the Navara?
Barge pole and wouldn't touch, immediately spring to mind.

[gromit]

The boss at work has just taken delivery of a Walkinshaw Amarok, not much more expensive than a Ranger Raptor.

Walkinshaw Station | Home of the Amarok W580 (https://www.walkinshawstation.com/)

Maybe not exactly what you're looking for though.......

Colin

[grey_ghost]

My FIL drives an Amarok and loves it. It’s manual with the twin turbo 4 diesel.

I don’t have enough knowledge to comment though.

I thought I read that the next Amarok is going to be a rebadged Ranger?

[ian4002000]

Ive got a new ranger base model, seems to do everything very well. Even though the rear springs are leaf is doesnt buck in the back. I have heard the Izuzu are really bad for bucking and unpleasant to drive.
I have 16 inch wheels which will give me a good choice of tyres and mine came rubber floor mats and a rear diff lock. it was priced under 50k which seems reasonable nowadays.
I certainly notice the difference in quality from my D3 that I just sold. I ordered mine before Land Rover increased the warranty to a proper 5 Years.
But Unfortunately LR doesnt sell Utes .......

Ian
Bittern

[edddo]

Barge pole and wouldn't touch, immediately spring to mind.

Based on...?

[edddo]

Ive got a new ranger base model, seems to do everything very well. Even though the rear springs are leaf is doesnt buck in the back. I have heard the Izuzu are really bad for bucking and unpleasant to drive.
I have 16 inch wheels which will give me a good choice of tyres and mine came rubber floor mats and a rear diff lock. it was priced under 50k which seems reasonable nowadays.
I certainly notice the difference in quality from my D3 that I just sold. I ordered mine before Land Rover increased the warranty to a proper 5 Years.
But Unfortunately LR doesnt sell Utes .......

Ian
Bittern

I have heard this about the Rangers ie the rear suspension is surprisingly un leaf like in ride-might test drive one.

[edddo]

Yes![bighmmm]



...drum roll.....and?

[trout1105]

Based on...?

For me I owned one for 8 months, POS so I got rid of it[bigwhistle]

[gusthedog]

Fix up the D1. Or get another one and go right over it. Way cheaper than a new ute and you can use your current one for spares [emoji12]

[Homestar]

Based on...?

We trialed them at work for a while. No one wanted to get in them after the first week, and they were truly horrible to drive with the load in the back around 1/2 it’s rated capacity. Damn near dangerous fully loaded like the Mechanics had them. Steer clear. A Ranger, Hilux or Triton would be far better if you really want a dual cab.

[Homestar]

Ive got a new ranger base model, seems to do everything very well. Even though the rear springs are leaf is doesnt buck in the back. I have heard the Izuzu are really bad for bucking and unpleasant to drive.
I have 16 inch wheels which will give me a good choice of tyres and mine came rubber floor mats and a rear diff lock. it was priced under 50k which seems reasonable nowadays.
I certainly notice the difference in quality from my D3 that I just sold. I ordered mine before Land Rover increased the warranty to a proper 5 Years.
But Unfortunately LR doesnt sell Utes .......

Ian
Bittern

I agree the Ranger is a better ride than others - better than the Hilux that’s for sure but that’s not saying much.

[edddo]

For me I owned one for 8 months, POS so I got rid of it[bigwhistle]

what didnt you like about it specifically?

[edddo]

We trialed them at work for a while. No one wanted to get in them after the first week, and they were truly horrible to drive with the load in the back around 1/2 it’s rated capacity. Damn near dangerous fully loaded like the Mechanics had them. Steer clear. A Ranger, Hilux or Triton would be far better if you really want a dual cab.

Was it purely the inability to carry a load that made them no good for your purpose?
Or other things as well? In a commercial setting that would be a killer of course.
Reliability issues?

[edddo]

Fix up the D1. Or get another one and go right over it. Way cheaper than a new ute and you can use your current one for spares [emoji12]

Hehe..well..it is going to get some love shortly.. We'll see.
Its a strange time to be thinking about spending $$ on a replacement truck..just when you cant guarantee that you can cross any state border for **** knows how long.

[Homestar]

Was it purely the inability to carry a load that made them no good for your purpose?
Or other things as well? In a commercial setting that would be a killer of course.
Reliability issues?

From mine and others experience with them they are noisy, uncomfortable & drive poorly compared to the opposition. Reliability was an issue but no worse than the 6 speed Rangers which **** gearboxes regularly. We rarely have a full fleet of Rangers on the road at any given time and all the Navaras were sold off after 12 months or so - we usually keep our vehicles for 5 years or 200,000KM - whichever occurs last so we have some 8 year old Hiluxs still in service for example, but we didn’t keep any Navaras and ditched them with minimal KM on them. Yes, commercial use is far more severe on things than personal use but you get to know what is good and bad as well.

My current vehicle is a Hilux - just over 6 years old and just clocked up 200,000KM so is due for replacement shortly. Apart from
DPF issues early on it hasn’t missed a beat mechanically and I flog the living **** out of it daily and tow all the time with it. Rides like a bag of **** though and has basically nothing other than a steering wheel and pedals but hey, it’s a free car - how bad can it be?

As I said before if you can put up with the harsh ride any dual cab will give, the Hilux, Ranger or Triton are the go - if I was handing over my own money it would be for a Triton as I think the Hiluxs are too expensive for what they are and the Rangers like to drink too much and although the new 10 speed seems to be ok on them so far, I trust Ford about as far as I could throw them to make or use a reliable gearbox - their track record in recent years is pretty bad. Go ask any Auto Trans specialist what makes boxes are cluttering up their workshops - they’ll tell you.

All the best, it’s not an easy decision - I struggled to find a vehicle I actually wanted to go out and buy (up to $60K) so haven’t done so yet. Not a single dual cab made my short list on a vehicle I’d put my own money down on.

[3toes]

Was in the market for a dual cab and ended up with a short list of the Ranger and Amarok. After driving them back to back the Amarok was a clear winner for me. While seeming a little spartan and boring in typical VW style was far better to drive and ride quality was well in advance of the Ranger.

[V8Ian]

Based on...?
Harsh ride, poor ergonomics and lack of economy. The kindest thing I could say about it, beats walking.

[AK83]

When I worked for SES, they gave me the option of the Hilux and Ranger, and I reckon the Ranger was nicer to drive and towed better too.

In terms of value for money, I don't think you can go past the Ssanyong Musso.

Brother got one last year, drive very nicely. But he optioned it right up there with the full lot, and that included the 20" wheel/tyre pack too.
Not good. go with 18's or 17's.
Tows OK, far better than a Tdi(but as said, anything would tow better than a Tdi!)

Get a lift for it, would probably do most stuff you throw at it(has an E locker as std for the top of the range).

Not many consider this vehicle, but once you drive it and you're the one that has to pay for it, you'll understand the value for money side of it.
His cost $42K with every option. Value for money is better than a Triton too.

Has coils and discs rear too.

can't beat the 7 year warranty too, so as a long termer it makes sense.

I've seen far too many new(mainly 2.8lt) Hiluxes, bonnet up on the side of the road, to consider them to be as 'unbreakable' as most make them out to be.

[Saitch]

...drum roll.....and?

I had the very dubious pleasure of being asked to accompany a newbie to sand driving, on Moreton Island recently.
He showed up in a new Nav and while it performed OK, after about 10 mins, I wanted to get out. I now know what a cat in a washing machine feels like.
p.s. ..and I happily drive to fishing spots on the island in my '92 'cruiser tilly, which is ergonomically challenged.[smilebigeye]

Honestly, there isn't a 'Really Good' dual cab to be had out there, in my opinion. Not like the 'Really Good Wagons'. Yes, there are some dual cabs that are better, in some way, then others, but being a bit better than mediocre, isn't too flash either.
My niece and her hubby have a current Ranger. It's OK, although it is his 2nd one, as Ford had to replace the original.
A friend, who tours a lot of the year, towing her small van, has an Isuzu, which she's happy with, but has had issues.
A Mt. Isa nephew had to leave his Hilux in Toowoomba last week, for unforeseen warranty work and borrow a vehicle to get the family back home, as no parts were available.
(And still not, at time of printing)

On another note, while a few here have mentioned the cheaper Chinese dual cabs, have you had a look at Mahindra?

I wish you luck in your quest.

Edit: Would pay to check delivery time, too.

[RANDLOVER]

I had the very dubious pleasure of being asked to accompany a newbie to sand driving, on Moreton Island recently.
He showed up in a new Nav and while it performed OK, after about 10 mins, I wanted to get out. I now know what a cat in a washing machine feels like.

p.s. ..and I happily drive to fishing spots on the island in my '92 'cruiser tilly, which is ergonomically challenged.[smilebigeye]

That's pro'ly because the tilly's leaf springs are nice and soft after 30 years. I noticed something similar when my mates and I took our Disco's to a 4wd park, and where the two D2's were getting cross axled with traction control having to kick in, the old D1 just walked diagonally across wheel ruts, without a wheel leaving the ground.

[edddo]

There are 2 coil rear DC utes:
The Ssangyong - may be good 'value' but cant see how that could ever be reasonable off road with that rear overhang..mod options limited?
The Navara - looks as good as any of them but no one here has had anything good to say about them. Plenty of suspension upgrades and mods available for them.
Surely with a decent suspension kit it could be made into something reasonable? The 'Tyler Thompson' off road vids ( the 2020-21 ones) on youtube show him using his without mercy. Seems well kitted and very good rear travel ( and the usual pathetic front IFS travel). With factory rear locker and 33s though, it seems like it has potential?
There are plenty of cart suspension variety utes about with all sorts of kit available..but I dont think I can tolerate a cart ride for long trips...it would bring me to tears and remind me of my FJ40 days :-(

It may be that I need to consider the MUX or similar coil rear trucks ( Everest/Prado/Pajero/Colarado etc) if none of the DC utes are tolerable.
What ever I get it needs to be a comfortable long distance tourer, be able to run 33s and be well set up for remote trips.

[Geedublya]

There are 2 coil rear DC utes:
The Ssangyong - may be good 'value' but cant see how that could ever be reasonable off road with that rear overhang..mod options limited?
The Navara - looks as good as any of them but no one here has had anything good to say about them. Plenty of suspension upgrades and mods available for them.
Surely with a decent suspension kit it could be made into something reasonable? The 'Tyler Thompson' off road vids ( the 2020-21 ones) on youtube show him using his without mercy. Seems well kitted and very good rear travel ( and the usual pathetic front IFS travel). With factory rear locker and 33s though, it seems like it has potential?
There are plenty of cart suspension variety utes about with all sorts of kit available..but I dont think I can tolerate a cart ride for long trips...it would bring me to tears and remind me of my FJ40 days :-(

It may be that I need to consider the MUX or similar coil rear trucks ( Everest/Prado/Pajero/Colarado etc) if none of the DC utes are tolerable.
What ever I get it needs to be a comfortable long distance tourer, be able to run 33s and be well set up for remote trips.

I would probably stay away from Ssangyong until their financial situation becomes clearly otherwise you may end up with an orphan.

I have a couple of mates that improved the ride on their DC utes by replacing springs and dampers. Elliptical springs are recommended on the rear for more compliance.

I've been looking at the utes as a replacement for my RRS in the future but I'm not impressed by the value or features. While the new Defender appeals the attitude of LRA does not and the warranty needs to improve. The payload of the wagons is pretty abysmal so it rules out most of them. This thread has just reminded me to check out the new Isuzu MUX specs. that are released today.

[RANDLOVER]

What about a.........flame suit on............... Jeep Gladiator. I know some people hate them but I think as L-R took over from Jeep, now things have gone full circle and back to Jeep if you don't want a SUV.

[cripesamighty]

Or maybe a Mahindra dual cab. A workmate has one a couple of years old and he swears by it. He compares it to an updated (basic interior and driving position) old school Defender. I think a couple of guys on AULRO have them too.

[Grumbles]

Lots of good opinions coming forward which is great. Before I comment too much the question of what your normal daily driving circumstances are arises. A couple of kays to work and back each day, mums taxi sort of thing? Why I ask this is because all the diesel utes have a DPF. The [costly] enemy of the DPF is short trips. Another consideration is that there are 3 different types of DPF aka closed, passive and hybrid. Then rather than a DPF there is the AdBlu type of anti pollution gear fitted. I'd suggest that you do your homework about the anti pollution gear on the diesels and their relevance to your driving routine.

Lots has been said here about harsh riding utes here but golly gee whiz there are some softies behind the wheel these days. [smilebigeye] Yeah this is an old fella reminiscing about the good old days in which I drove all over Victoria and southern NSW chasing fish and deer and all done in a Suzuki LJ 50 [3 cylinder 2 stroke] which was followed by an '89 2.8 diesel dual cab Hilux. Both cars were leaf sprung and neither had power steering. The thought of them being hard riding units just never came up. Ride is all about your perception of what they are like. I've driven a few of the newer utes including Chinese and to me they were all limos.

Wish you good luck. [biggrin]

[edddo]

Lots of good opinions coming forward which is great. Before I comment too much the question of what your normal daily driving circumstances are arises. A couple of kays to work and back each day, mums taxi sort of thing? Why I ask this is because all the diesel utes have a DPF. The [costly] enemy of the DPF is short trips. Another consideration is that there are 3 different types of DPF aka closed, passive and hybrid. Then rather than a DPF there is the AdBlu type of anti pollution gear fitted. I'd suggest that you do your homework about the anti pollution gear on the diesels and their relevance to your driving routine.

Lots has been said here about harsh riding utes here but golly gee whiz there are some softies behind the wheel these days. [smilebigeye] Yeah this is an old fella reminiscing about the good old days in which I drove all over Victoria and southern NSW chasing fish and deer and all done in a Suzuki LJ 50 [3 cylinder 2 stroke] which was followed by an '89 2.8 diesel dual cab Hilux. Both cars were leaf sprung and neither had power steering. The thought of them being hard riding units just never came up. Ride is all about your perception of what they are like. I've driven a few of the newer utes including Chinese and to me they were all limos.

Wish you good luck. [biggrin]

The drive to work is about 30km each way. Covid has meant less commuting but that will change at some point. There is the occasional trip to Melbourne for family reasons then there are recreational trips - of which I plan to do more than ever over the coming years. These include road trips with the camper, remote desert trips ( eg A Beadell/Centre type of thing) and high country weekends. That should give you an idea. My last leaf sprung car was an FJ40 - that thing hit bumps I couldn't even see - really was tempted to drive it into a tree at times. I went from that to a classic Rangie and never looked back.

[loanrangie]

I thought the NAV went back to cart springs as they couldn't get the coils right ?

[350RRC]

A mate of mine had a D2 td5 manual which he really liked, but needed a DC ute for work / fun.

Bought an amorok tray and kitted it out with a custom gull wing aly canopy for doing deliveries, going camping.

He came to the conclusion that it might be a bit fragile (a few have blown motors around here).

Bought an Isuzu and is generally loving it for work purposes.

Ranger and BT were out of the question (old BT, this was before the latest one which is really a re-badged Isuzu) because there were bad old BT blown motor / trans combos around here that took months to sort out under warranty, owned by mutual friends.

He is missing his D2 now because the rok and the Isuzu are nowhere near as enjoyable off road.

The point I'm making is that all the dc utes are really work vehicles and will never have the luxo off road ride of a RRC, D1 or D2 (whose chassis / suspensions are closely related).

Depends on your priorities. DL

[edddo]

I thought the NAV went back to cart springs as they couldn't get the coils right ?

No..they have changed/improved the coil set up.

[Homestar]

Sounds like you’ve got your heart set on a Navara and are trying to convince us? [emoji56]

At the end of the day, but a car you want to drive and suits YOU - not something others like.

It’s one of the reasons I haven’t jumped into buying anything yet - I haven’t found anything I’ve really loved - which I really think is something important (for me at least) when laying out $50K plus on a vehicle.

I still find it hard ti fathom that I have 2 x 35 to 40 year old vehicles that are smoother and quieter than anything on the market today under $60K. I know they were premium vehicles when new but the fact that no manufacturer can come close to replicate them all these years later for anything that would be considered a reasonable price. The tech is old and understood - maybe we just expect mediocrity these days.

It’s the main reason I’m thinking of dropping some big coin on them to bring them into the 21st century while still maintaining a sweet ride and some class.

[edddo]

haha well its the only coil ute in the market that might be an option....so I do want it to be an option...but it might not be.....

an XJ Jag and a classic eh..nice.

[Saitch]

Sounds like you’ve got your heart set on a Navara and are trying to convince us? [emoji56]

At the end of the day, but a car you want to drive and suits YOU - not something others like.

It’s one of the reasons I haven’t jumped into buying anything yet - I haven’t found anything I’ve really loved - which I really think is something important (for me at least) when laying out $50K plus on a vehicle.

I still find it hard ti fathom that I have 2 x 35 to 40 year old vehicles that are smoother and quieter than anything on the market today under $60K. I know they were premium vehicles when new but the fact that no manufacturer can come close to replicate them all these years later for anything that would be considered a reasonable price. The tech is old and understood - maybe we just expect mediocrity these days.

It’s the main reason I’m thinking of dropping some big coin on them to bring them into the 21st century while still maintaining a sweet ride and some class.

Yep! If I spent 10G on my tilly, I'd have a vehicle equivalent to or better, than a modern 4WD tilly.

Under $1000 to replace all the glow plugs. That's about per cylinder on modern vehicles.

[350RRC]

My personal experience of DC utes.......... 100's of days doing fish surveys in various Tritons and a Hilux.

Would never buy a lux. Was dealer serviced, had nearly no compression in one cylinder (petrol / lpg) and the dealer said that was normal.

No compression, no compassion.

Also the abs on gravel roads was like having no brakes coming up to an intersection. Later models might be different, dunno. Was scary.

Had no real issue with any of the Tritons. For me the seats are better than a rok.

Last one I drove was pretty much the latest model, 6 speed manual, towing a boat around up at Ned's corner doing a 'locum'.

I was surprised how solid it felt over the 1000 odd k's we did up there. Had a couple of programmed quirks to do with throttle response and lo range (didn't bother to read the manual).

Combination of fast dirt travel and 'off piste' boat launches and retrievals. Effortless. Did have a bit of turbo lag, a lot of car for the money.

For me it would be the Isuzu or the Triton. Really the difference between the two is $20k for a donk with a timing chain and a bit of snobbery.

DL

[Arapiles]

I still find it hard ti fathom that I have 2 x 35 to 40 year old vehicles that are smoother and quieter than anything on the market today under $60K. I know they were premium vehicles when new but the fact that no manufacturer can come close to replicate them all these years later for anything that would be considered a reasonable price. The tech is old and understood - maybe we just expect mediocrity these days.


Similarly, what replacements are there for a Peugeot 404 or 504?

[350RRC]

.......................
It’s the main reason I’m thinking of dropping some big coin on them to bring them into the 21st century while still maintaining a sweet ride and some class.

[biggrin][bigrolf]

6.6 for the Jag, LS for the RRC. DL

[Arapiles]

What about a D3? There's plenty around with under 200,000 kms.

Edit: well, some around ...

[Homestar]

[biggrin][bigrolf]

6.6 for the Jag, LS for the RRC. DL

LS for the Rangie yes but thinking a Turbo Barra straight 6 for the Jag. [emoji16][emoji106]

[Homestar]

Similarly, what replacements are there for a Peugeot 404 or 504?

None at all - those days are long gone. Won’t find a car that comes close. [emoji17]

[trout1105]

Have you thought of getting a D2a (these are cheap buys these days).
Rip out the rear seats and you have as much room (probably more room) as the small twin cabs have and you get the comfort/refinement at the same time[thumbsupbig][bigrolf]

[edddo]

No not going from a 23 yo car to an 18 yo car for remote trips.......

[350RRC]

What about a D3? There's plenty around with under 200,000 kms.

Edit: well, some around ...

...........with the replacement motor.

DL

[Arapiles]

...........with the replacement motor.

DL

Hmmm ....

Seems to be first engine

carsales.com.au (https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/details/2008-land-rover-discovery-3-se-auto-4x4-my08/OAG-AD-19973428/?Cr=0)

Ditto, for a D2

carsales.com.au (https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/details/2003-land-rover-discovery-td5-manual-4x4-my03/SSE-AD-7293701/?Cr=1)

[edddo]

What about a D3? There's plenty around with under 200,000 kms.

Edit: well, some around ...

No really I have decided my next car wont be a landy....:-( .
Don't want an old car with heaps of tech for what I do (and know how to fix) and the new offerings are just not of interest.

[chuck]

If you can wait the new Ranger will have V6 diesel & permanent all wheel drive as well as transfer case for dual range./

The V6 will be the Ford F150 diesel that has been modified to fix crank issues

Amarok will be same car different body.

We have VW to thank for insisting on V6 & AWD.

Should be a great car but will be expensive.

[Doodone49]

I think the new Navara is pretty good, Triton now has 10 year warranty, hard to beat, but you can bend the chassis I believe. Coils all round too.
Jon

[edddo]

I think the new Navara is pretty good, Triton now has 10 year warranty, hard to beat, but you can bend the chassis I believe. Coils all round too.
Jon

Coils on rear of Triton? Dont know about that?
Nice to see a vote for the Navara..that makes 1.

[Doodone49]

Sorry, meant the Navarra has coils all round.

[350RRC]

Coils on rear of Triton? Dont know about that?
Nice to see a vote for the Navara..that makes 1.

I can remember a thread on the now defunct Outer Limits about twisted Nissan chassis years ago, dunno which model it was.

There are heaps of pics of Navaras with bent chassis if you goog it.

Some of the bent Triton chassis were fitted with aftermarket camper units that had the water tank well behind the rear axle. Pics of them on here somewhere.

There are also a few pics of 130 Defs on here with ambitious camper add ons that bent.

Cadrogans views are informative:

How to bend your ute: The truth about Mistubishi Triton chassis snapping — Auto Expert by John Cadogan - save thousands on your next new car! (https://autoexpert.com.au/posts/how-to-bend-your-ute)

RRC's would bend at the chassis wall if seriously flogged in the bush..... LRA used to sell reinforcing plates.

DL

[loanrangie]

If you are really hung up on coils in the rear, I have seen a coil conversion on a ranger as well as a coyote 5 ltr swap [emoji41].

[Homestar]

How much do you love your D1? Is the body and interior in good condition? Enough to drop to serious coin on it to bring the driveline up to modern standards?

How about an LS3 and 6 speed auto? This is the conversion I’m toying with for my RRC. Depending on what you want done engine, box and engineering runs around $35K. Add the front and rear driveline and you’ll be in around $50K - same as a new Dual cab. Heaps better ride and brand new drive line.

Go the whole hog and double that for the rest of the vehicle to be bought up to better than new (now I’m dreaming) but I’m seriously considering the rest.

L76 and LS3 Engine Conversions3 (https://www.lrautomotive.com.au/contents/en-us/d728274_L76-and-LS3-Engine-Conversions.html)

[edddo]

I can remember a thread on the now defunct Outer Limits about twisted Nissan chassis years ago, dunno which model it was.

There are heaps of pics of Navaras with bent chassis if you goog it.

Some of the bent Triton chassis were fitted with aftermarket camper units that had the water tank well behind the rear axle. Pics of them on here somewhere.

There are also a few pics of 130 Defs on here with ambitious camper add ons that bent.

Cadrogans views are informative:

How to bend your ute: The truth about Mistubishi Triton chassis snapping — Auto Expert by John Cadogan - save thousands on your next new car! (https://autoexpert.com.au/posts/how-to-bend-your-ute)

RRC's would bend at the chassis wall if seriously flogged in the bush..... LRA used to sell reinforcing plates.

DL
This is definitely a thing with dc utes of all brands.
I think the moral of the story is know the cars history if second hand. If it has towed anything significant anywhere off road then skip it. And..be clever with how you load them and never go over gvm.

[rar110]

Ive been looking too.

Coil conversion ($26k [emoji15]) on a 79 series will give you a nice ride, with a lazy tdv8, disc brake rear, but with part time 4WD. That makes it an expensive Ute.

But with all the current dual cab chassis after bar work, 4 people, fuel & a few accessories, your lucky to find 3-400kgs left for tow ball weight and gear.

[3toes]

For the price of a new dual cab a slightly used Discovery 4. Probably the best touring vehicle in the last 10 years

[scarry]

For the price of a new dual cab a slightly used Discovery 4. Probably the best touring vehicle in the last 10 years

If they were available new i would have bought one in a heartbeat.

Instead i had to go to anoher brand,as LR had nothing that suited what we needed,same as others in this post.

There are rumours the 70 series is getting an upgrade for MY 2022.
New buyers may get another cup holder....[tonguewink][biggrin]

A mate has a 79 dual cab,with ARB BP51,and it rides so well,its rediculous,but its pretty heavy as its fully modded.

[Arapiles]

Ive been looking too.

Coil conversion ($26k [emoji15]) on a 79 series will give you a nice ride, with a lazy tdv8, disc brake rear, but with part time 4WD.


There are full-time 4WD conversions for the 79 series:

Gearless Centre Diff - Mining Land Cruiser :: Gearing Dynamics (http://www.gearingdynamics.com.au/Gearless-Centre-Differential)

[Arapiles]

If they were available new i would have bought one in a heartbeat.

RE the D4, there are plenty of 2015/2016 models around with under 50,000 kms - pretty much new.

[loanrangie]

Find a defender 110 pickup and drive it down to LRA for an LS and 6L80 swap.

[chuck]

They reckon Terrain Tamer Parabolics with their new remote res shocks are even better & half the price

[trout1105]

How much do you love your D1? Is the body and interior in good condition? Enough to drop to serious coin on it to bring the driveline up to modern standards?

How about an LS3 and 6 speed auto? This is the conversion I’m toying with for my RRC. Depending on what you want done engine, box and engineering runs around $35K. Add the front and rear driveline and you’ll be in around $50K - same as a new Dual cab. Heaps better ride and brand new drive line.

Go the whole hog and double that for the rest of the vehicle to be bought up to better than new (now I’m dreaming) but I’m seriously considering the rest.

L76 and LS3 Engine Conversions3 (https://www.lrautomotive.com.au/contents/en-us/d728274_L76-and-LS3-Engine-Conversions.html)

Over the last 6 years or so I have spent well in excess of 20k on repairs/upgrades on my D2a and now the Only original part of the vehicle now is the front diff/body/interior.

Yes it IS a 17 year old 4WD But Most of the bits that I need to rely on are a much younger vintage and I have absolutely No qualms in taking it to remote areas solo[biggrin][thumbsupbig]

[scarry]

RE the D4, there are plenty of 2015/2016 models around with under 50,000 kms - pretty much new.

Thats around the age and k's mine started to have issues,so thanks, but no thanks.

Sure they were silly issues,mainly EPB and EAS issues,but still frustrating and a PITA.

And yes the vehicle was serviced correctly,probably over serviced due to the low K's.

Anyway,each to their own.

[Discodicky]

This is what the OP is looking for and the Hilux ticks ALL of his boxes.

Yes there IS a premium when you buy a Toyota product But unlike most of their competitors (JLR included) there is also a premium to be had when you trade/sell the Toyota product AND the Isuzu is also gaining a lot of respect in the second hand market.

It kinda depends on which model you purchase.
My eldest son bought a new "poverty model" Hilux Dual Cab 4WD diesel in January 2020. About $45k from memory.
Jeez it rides badly, I couldn't put up with it. Bouncy bounce.
The addition of an (approx) 150kg fibreglass canopy didn't soften the ride much.

My other son has a Navara 4WD Dual Cab of similar age and spec. Rides far better and the tranny is nicer.
Resale probably not as good as the Hilux, but he didn't pay "Toyota Tax" in the first place.

If I were to buy one it'd be the V6 Amarok, the only one with rear disc brakes, and serious hp and grunt, plus the 8 speed ZF same as late Disco 4 and others.

Talking about re-sale, but slightly off subject, I worked out the other day that with the current 'asking' prices of Series 1,2, 2a and 3 L/rovers, they are asking anywhere between 5 and 45 TIMES their original prices!!....... try and beat THAT Toyota!! [bigrolf][bigrolf]

[3toes]

Amarok as above would be my pick of the dual cabs

[edddo]

Amarok as above would be my pick of the dual cabs

No low range is a problem.

[Saitch]

No low range is a problem.

"reliable remote touring, good off road for hi country trips and"

Don't see why, for this? From all reports, their 1st gear ratio is quite low and adequate.

A bloke I know has a 'Rok and I've accompanied/ played safety vehicle for him, while he towed his 20' van to Cathedrals and Dundubara camp grounds, on Fraser.
My recovery services have never been required.

[Homestar]

I’d be more worried about it being a VW or a Ford clone. [emoji56]

[Geedublya]

"reliable remote touring, good off road for hi country trips and"

Don't see why, for this? From all reports, their 1st gear ratio is quite low and adequate.

A bloke I know has a 'Rok and I've accompanied/ played safety vehicle for him, while he towed his 20' van to Cathedrals and Dundubara camp grounds, on Fraser.
My recovery services have never been required.

No low range is a pain in the ass if you have to reverse or do any sustained slow stuff. Very easy to overheat the transmission. You can get the V6 with a manual box and low range. This would be fine if you didn't want an auto. The Amarok has 5 star ANCAP but it is 2011 ANCAP and it would be 2 or 3 star ANCAP today.

[Saitch]

No low range is a pain in the ass if you have to reverse or do an sustained slow stuff. Very easy to overheat the transmission. You can get the V6 with a manual box and low range. This would be fine if you didn't want an auto. The Amarok has 5 star ANCAP but it is 2011 ANCAP and it would be 2 or 3 star ANCAP today.

Tranny cooler?
Can't say my mate has had any problems with heat and dragging a van up the beach for 70 odd km, isn't all beer and skittles.[biggrin]

[bob10]

Over the last 6 years or so I have spent well in excess of 20k on repairs/upgrades on my D2a and now the Only original part of the vehicle now is the front diff/body/interior.

Yes it IS a 17 year old 4WD But Most of the bits that I need to rely on are a much younger vintage and I have absolutely No qualms in taking it to remote areas solo[biggrin][thumbsupbig]

I have had a similar experience with my 1999 D2. It's like grand dads axe, still original, but the main bits have been replaced , some more than once. It has 435,000 KM's on it, the plastic bits inside are falling apart, and recently I had another gearbox issue. So, I decided to bite the bullet and investigate a replacement. The decision I made was either a Mazda BT50, or a Isuzu D-Max. The BT50 is just a rebadged D-Max, with the same drive train and engine and suspension. I spent the better part of a week going from the Isuzu dealer to the Mazda dealer, and found out dealers will tell you anything , in order to get a sale. Or , perhaps I should say they will tell you what you want to hear , not necessarily what you need to know, if that makes sense.

Having read Whiting's Outback Travel Australia critique of the Isuzu, where the vehicle could do with an aftermarket suspension upgrade, I mentioned this to the Isuzu dealer, only to be told to do that will void the warranty. He then went on to describe how other aftermarket additions have had the warranty voided in the past. Fair enough, good to know. I was told I couldn't get a Freestyle cab tray back from Isuzu , it had to be a styleside cab. I could get a Freestyle trayback from BT50, but no so called ' suicide " seats in the back, as it voids the ANCAP safety rating. Fair enough, good to know. Interestingly, the warranty for the Isuzu is 6 years with capped priced servicing, while the BT50 is 5 years and no capped price.

Long story short, I've decided to hang on to the old D2, keep up my 10,000KM servicing, get under and check more often, and upgrade my RACQ roadside assistance package.[biggrin] Oh, and cross my fingers. [bighmmm]

BTW, in case it helps some one I will leave the Link to Allan Whiting's 'Outback Travel Australia " buyers guide to Utes and cab chassis , medium, for their perusal. There are links to other vehicles in the article.

Utes & Cab Chassis - Medium - Outback Travel Australia (https://outbacktravelaustralia.com.au/buyers-guide/utes-and-cab-chassis/)

[loanrangie]

No low range is a problem.

The auto's overheat just looking at a hill then take an hour to cool down, i wouldn't touch one either.

[Discodicky]

Coils on rear of Triton? Dont know about that?
Nice to see a vote for the Navara..that makes 1.

Make it two votes for the Nav.
My sons 2020 has had no probs whatsoever and drives much nicer than my other sons new Hilux.
No comparison with NVH, and transmission.

Navs of 6-10 yrs ago were POS, but they have got them ok now apart from the stupid way they determine towing weights assoc with payload. Daft.

[Eevo]

The BT50 is just a rebadged D-Max, with the same drive train and engine and suspension. I spent the better part of a week going from the Isuzu dealer to the Mazda dealer, and found out dealers will tell you anything , in order to get a sale. Or , perhaps I should say they will tell you what you want to hear , not necessarily what you need to know, if that makes sense.

I thought th BT50 was based on the ford ranger, not the d-max?

[Saitch]

I thought th BT50 was based on the ford ranger, not the d-max?

I think you're correct. Isn't the Colorado the D-Max clone?

[DiscoMick]

I might have missed it, but did you say why you wanted a dual cab ute rather than a wagon?
Have you considered a Ford Everest? I've seen some very nice ones. Advantages of a Ranger plus a better rear suspension.
Or you could just get on car sales and buy a low kilometres Defender. Go on, you know you want too. Ha!

[Homestar]

Make it two votes for the Nav.
My sons 2020 has had no probs whatsoever and drives much nicer than my other sons new Hilux.
No comparison with NVH, and transmission.

Navs of 6-10 yrs ago were POS, but they have got them ok now apart from the stupid way they determine towing weights assoc with payload. Daft.

We couldn’t make any live very long doing heavy duty work from our Field Service Mechanics and their wasn’t a good thing to be said about them but maybe lighter duty kids taxi etc is ok for them?

[scarry]

Talking about re-sale, but slightly off subject, I worked out the other day that with the current 'asking' prices of Series 1,2, 2a and 3 L/rovers, they are asking anywhere between 5 and 45 TIMES their original prices!!....... try and beat THAT Toyota!! [bigrolf][bigrolf]

Your maths is not far off. but its all guesswork.5 to 45 is a huge variance.
The one in my sig was 734 pounds,including numerous 'extras',as per factory reciept dated 19/7/56.

The are quite a few Tojos same sort of vintage bringing same or more money,that is if you can find one that hasnt rusted away...[bighmmm],and is original.
There are quite a few around that have been fully refurbed.
But definitely less around Aus than LR's.
Many of the LR's are bits and pieces,and not restored correctly back to original.

[Arapiles]

No low range is a pain in the ass if you have to reverse or do any sustained slow stuff. Very easy to overheat the transmission. You can get the V6 with a manual box and low range. This would be fine if you didn't want an auto. The Amarok has 5 star ANCAP but it is 2011 ANCAP and it would be 2 or 3 star ANCAP today.

Notoriously, no airbags in the back.

[Discodicky]

We couldn’t make any live very long doing heavy duty work from our Field Service Mechanics and their wasn’t a good thing to be said about them but maybe lighter duty kids taxi etc is ok for them?

Yes, agree. Prior retirement I was associated with the earth moving industry and approx 15-20 yrs ago we were contracted to Nissan and used Navaras for Field Service duties. They were absolute rubbish. Grossly underpowered and couldn't keep suspension under them.
But these new ones appear to be vastly improved and the Renault engine appears to be ok as well.

I am very 'anti' the autos in the Hilux (same as Prado and Mux/D-Max) as it never knows which gear it wants to be in. Constantly up and down the range and drops from 6th at the slightest opportunity. My TDV6 with 8 speeder will cruise at 80 kph on the flat with light throttle opening in 8th at around 1100 rpm. My (bought new) MY17 Mux wouldn't get into 6th until 90 kph and then drop down like the Hilux.
Sold it after I did the maths with GVM/GCM which I shoulda done prior purchase. Duh! [bigwhistle]

Jap transmissions, or should I say, the part Toyota owned Aisin, in 4WD's, are nowhere near the best auto available.

Amarok V6 is the way to go if you don't have a GCM problem as at 6000 kg is not high enough.
Having said that, it is well documented fact that all 4WD Dual cabs have their GVM/GCM limitations if towing around 3.0 Tonnes.

[scarry]

Notoriously, no airbags in the back.

Yes,heap of other safety features missing,way behind others in the class.

No low range,not for me,thats for sure.

It hasnt been updated for years,which is the main issue.

I remember when it first appeared they all called it the Hilux killer,how wrong they were.....[bigsad][biggrin]

Inlaws have 11 of them as work utes,all sorts of issues,they wont be getting them again,slowly replacing them with the jap brand/Thia built they had before.

As a private vehicle they might be better,but as a company commercial vehicle,hauling loads around all day,every day,serviced corectly,but probably generally not looked after as well as a private vehicle,they didnt do well.
But they did get a great deal on them,they were pretty cheap,from memory.

[V8Ian]

Nobody's mentioned the Merc, is it available as a dc?

[Saitch]

Nobody's mentioned the Merc, is it available as a dc?

As a Navara.

[bob10]

I think you're correct. Isn't the Colorado the D-Max clone?

The 2021 BT 50 is based on the D-max. Here is the history of the D-max. The D-max was regarded as the true Rodeo successor, with a 3 litre engine.

Isuzu Ute D-Max (outbacktravelaustralia.com.au) (https://outbacktravelaustralia.com.au/buyers-guide-utes-and-cab-chassis/isuzu-ute-d-max/)

And the history of the BT50.

Mazda BT-50 (outbacktravelaustralia.com.au) (https://outbacktravelaustralia.com.au/buyers-guide-utes-and-cab-chassis/mazda-bt-50-updated-april-2018/)

Edit- Mazda's BT50 became a Ford re-skin in 2011, and the 2021 model did the same on Isuzu mechanicals.

[V8Ian]

As a Navara.
A chook's foot Dato? :eek2:

[Saitch]

Getting back to the original question, I don't think it would matter what you went with, for the intended purposes indicated.

If you've got your heart set on the Datsun, go for it!
If another brand, go for it!
After all, if you took notice of the advice on dual cabs offered here, you'd sell the camper, join a bowls club and buy a Camry![smilebigeye]

[edddo]

I might have missed it, but did you say why you wanted a dual cab ute rather than a wagon?
Have you considered a Ford Everest? I've seen some very nice ones. Advantages of a Ranger plus a better rear suspension.
Or you could just get on car sales and buy a low kilometres Defender. Go on, you know you want too. Ha!

I just like the pure functionality of a dc, tray and custom box. But yes, as mentioned in an earlier post, i cant tolerate cart springs and that only really leaves the Navara or Merc. If they end up genuinely being a bad idea ( dcs generally and Navaras specifically for what I want it for) then I will probably look at Everest type wagons to get the coil rear and all round versatility that I want.

[350RRC]

I just like the pure functionality of a dc, tray and custom box. But yes, as mentioned in an earlier post, i cant tolerate cart springs and that only really leaves the Navara or Merc. If they end up genuinely being a bad idea ( dcs generally and Navaras specifically for what I want it for) then I will probably look at Everest type wagons to get the coil rear and all round versatility that I want.

The only one that fits the bill is a Def 130 and they're no longer in production.

ALL the modern crop of DC utes / tray backs are commercial vehicles, built to carry loads with stiff rear springs.

None have a beam axle at the front and springs at the rear to get full soft articulation.

Not one will come close to your D1 off road. Just the way it is.

DL

[rar110]

I thought th BT50 was based on the ford ranger, not the d-max?

The previous BT50 was a Ford Ranger or visa versa. The new BT50 is a Dmax with a nicer interior.

The Colorado is a GM, fitted with 2.8 diesel motor by VM. I drove a Trailblazer for a couple of weeks, the 2.8 diesel and 6 speed auto was a nice combination.

[rar110]

The only one that fits the bill is a Def 130 and they're no longer in production.

ALL the modern crop of DC utes / tray backs are commercial vehicles, built to carry loads with stiff rear springs.

None have a beam axle at the front and springs at the rear to get full soft articulation.

Not one will come close to your D1 off road. Just the way it is.

DL

The 130 dual cab, with full time 4WD, coils all round and rear disc brakes was years ahead. A 2005 td5 130 is probably the pick.

[Homestar]

Looks like the new Triton will be a Navara underneath - there's a reason to go buy a Triton now and not wait until the next model. There's another one you can cross off your list if you don't want a **** box.

[loanrangie]

Nobody's mentioned the Merc, is it available as a dc?

Ive only ever seen them in a dual cab and don't think they made a single cab version, no one wanted them either way.

[DiscoMick]

Interesting that using a dual cab to tow anything heavier than about 2500kg is considered a bad idea by various motoring experts including Robert Pepper, John Cadogan and ASPW, even if they are rated to up to 3500kg.
They seem happier about using wagons such as the Land cruiser, Patrol, Discovery, Defender etc to tow closer to 3500kg, I assume because a wagon has more of the weight ahead of the rear wheels than a ute does.
So if you're planning to tow anything over about 2500kg a wagon seems the way to go.
A Defender 130 would be an exception to that, as they are excellent for towing heavy trailers.

[edddo]

Only towing little camper from time to time.
Its about 700kg think.
Agree towing anything of any size especially off road seems a very bad idea.

[Homestar]

Yep, my Hilux is rated to tow 3500kg and I have done this - we have some trailer mounted gensets that top out at this - but only short distances (From drop off the back of a tilt tray and moving them into position) and it is horrible, even at slow speeds. It can tow 2000kg with ease which is where I’d call it’s safe and sensible limit - 2500 tops for any distance IMO.

[scarry]

Interesting that using a dual cab to tow anything heavier than about 2500kg is considered a bad idea by various motoring experts including Robert Pepper, John Cadogan and ASPW, even if they are rated to up to 3500kg.
They seem happier about using wagons such as the Land cruiser, Patrol, Discovery, Defender etc to tow closer to 3500kg, I assume because a wagon has more of the weight ahead of the rear wheels than a ute does.
So if you're planning to tow anything over about 2500kg a wagon seems the way to go.
A Defender 130 would be an exception to that, as they are excellent for towing heavy trailers.

It also has a lot to do with the weight of the towing vehicle,the Golden rule is try not to tow anything heavier than the tow vehicle.

My D4 was the best towing vehicle i have ever owned,towed the big weights so well and effortlessly,it was rediculous.

[cripesamighty]

One of the big problem with most of those utes, is that although they are rated to tow 3,500kg, they legally can only do so if the vehicle carries the driver and perhaps a cup of coffee as payload.

[DiscoMick]

Just watched the 2020 4WD Action comparison of 8 utes on YouTube.
It seemed quite a reasonable comparison, although everyone has their own opinion of course, depending on their needs.
They scored the Triton first, followed by the Hilux.
You might find it helpful.

[trout1105]

Yep, my Hilux is rated to tow 3500kg and I have done this - we have some trailer mounted gensets that top out at this - but only short distances (From drop off the back of a tilt tray and moving them into position) and it is horrible, even at slow speeds. It can tow 2000kg with ease which is where I’d call it’s safe and sensible limit - 2500 tops for any distance IMO.

I traded my hilux twincab in for the V8 79 series that I have now for the very same reason.
I hooked up the 20ft expanda to the hilux and it was downright scary , I do miss that little hilux though it was a great little ute.

[RANDLOVER]

The previous BT50 was a Ford Ranger or visa versa. The new BT50 is a Dmax with a nicer interior.........

VM Motori diesel engines were fitted to the Range Rovers in the 1980's, not sure if any made it out here though, might've been a UK or Euro only option.

[rar110]

VM Motori diesel engines were fitted to the Range Rovers in the 1980's, not sure if any made it out here though, might've been a UK or Euro only option.

Yes, a few were brought in. But they weren’t very common or that popular as generally regarded as under powered. I wish I had one now.

[Saitch]

Yes, a few were brought in. But they weren’t very common or that popular as generally regarded as under powered. I wish I had one now.

There was a forum member who had a VM powered Rangie, who I did a trip, or two around the Glass House Mountains, quite a few years ago.

[Homestar]

VM Motori diesel engines were fitted to the Range Rovers in the 1980's, not sure if any made it out here though, might've been a UK or Euro only option.

There were a few here but all soon found a better use as a boat anchor, as did most of the Euro versions. I don’t think there are too many left with that engine in them any longer. Pretty much the lowest point of engine selection in all of LR’s history - and that’s saying something.

[Discodicky]

Yes, a few were brought in. But they weren’t very common or that popular as generally regarded as under powered. I wish I had one now.

If my memory serves me correctly they were only 2.4 litres and grossly under powered for the car's weight.
I worked on a few, had individual cyl heads from memory, and blew head gaskets although I never got to do that particular repair.

[scarry]

I traded my hilux twincab in for the V8 79 series that I have now for the very same reason.
I hooked up the 20ft expanda to the hilux and it was downright scary , I do miss that little hilux though it was a great little ute.

Thats a huge issue with these saller DC utes,although they are rated to tow 3.5T,they cant tow anything like that sort of weight safely.
I am guesssing, a 20ft expander probably weighs around 3T?

[350RRC]

There were a few here but all soon found a better use as a boat anchor, as did most of the Euro versions. I don’t think there are too many left with that engine in them any longer. Pretty much the lowest point of engine selection in all of LR’s history - and that’s saying something.


Had some weird engine configuration like 2 pairs of cylinders or the head was split into 2 parts, each looking after 2 cylinders.

There was a fix in the end, after they were all 'toast' from memory.

DL

[trout1105]

Thats a huge issue with these saller DC utes,although they are rated to tow 3.5T,they cant tow anything like that sort of weight safely.
I am guesssing, a 20ft expander probably weighs around 3T?

Fully loaded and all 3 water tanks full it runs at 3100kg, The 79 series pulls it like there isn't anything behind it [biggrin][thumbsupbig]

[bob10]

Thats a huge issue with these saller DC utes,although they are rated to tow 3.5T,they cant tow anything like that sort of weight safely.
I am guesssing, a 20ft expander probably weighs around 3T?

After I bought our van, I found this. It helped me better understand the ins and outs of towing a van. There are a number of tutorials in the series. Courtesy of RV Daily.

(https://rvdaily.com.au/understanding-the-dynamics-of-towing-twin-axle-trailers/?utm_source=ActiveCampaign&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Why+are+disc+brakes+not+usually+fitted +to+caravans%3F&utm_campaign=RV+Daily+EDM+-+22nd+June+2020)RV DAILY | Understanding the dynamics of towing, part one (https://rvdaily.com.au/understanding-the-dynamics-of-towing-part-one/)

RV DAILY | Understanding the dynamics of towing: Twin-axle trailers (https://rvdaily.com.au/understanding-the-dynamics-of-towing-twin-axle-trailers/)

[scarry]

Fully loaded and all 3 water tanks full it runs at 3100kg, The 79 series pulls it like there isn't anything behind it [biggrin][thumbsupbig]

People say this and that about the 79,look at figures on paper,and usually have never driven one,but if you look at the torque curve of the engine,its easy to work out why they pull so well.

The son has a 76,replaced the Puma,there is just no comparison between them.

[edddo]

Maybe I could join the local mens shed and turn my D1 into this Overland Canopy Build - The Final Push - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38b9KrfGpko) :-)
Go to about the 15 minute mark for a look at the finished product.

[loanrangie]

Had some weird engine configuration like 2 pairs of cylinders or the head was split into 2 parts, each looking after 2 cylinders.

There was a fix in the end, after they were all 'toast' from memory.

DL

Individual heads, they fixed the design later on before they went into the heep cherokee but still not a great motor.
Most were replaced by 200/300 TDI's in the rangie.

[bob10]

Maybe I could join the local mens shed and turn my D1 into this Overland Canopy Build - The Final Push - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38b9KrfGpko) :-)
Go to about the 15 minute mark for a look at the finished product.

Good Job! You'd need deep pockets though I reckon.

[3toes]

The VM engine was used as it fitted UK and European tax bands not because it was a great engine but better than anything Land Rover had at the time

They were an engine builder who sold on to manufactures. GM picked up their technology for their Diesel engines. Think they were bought out by FIAT

[DoubleChevron]

Interesting that using a dual cab to tow anything heavier than about 2500kg is considered a bad idea by various motoring experts including Robert Pepper, John Cadogan and ASPW, even if they are rated to up to 3500kg.
They seem happier about using wagons such as the Land cruiser, Patrol, Discovery, Defender etc to tow closer to 3500kg, I assume because a wagon has more of the weight ahead of the rear wheels than a ute does.
So if you're planning to tow anything over about 2500kg a wagon seems the way to go.
A Defender 130 would be an exception to that, as they are excellent for towing heavy trailers.

Its a no brainer ... if you want to tow over 3tons .... you want a light truck. something heavier than a 4wd for sure. The Dodge rams and for Fseries fit the bill perfectly. Its gonna suck backing into a park at a caravan park with something that is 15meters long and has the turning circle of a cruise ship though [bigrolf] Those american utes are amazing what they can tow as 5th wheelers.

[scarry]

Its a no brainer ... if you want to tow over 3tons .... you want a light truck. something heavier than a 4wd for sure. The Dodge rams and for Fseries fit the bill perfectly. Its gonna suck backing into a park at a caravan park with something that is 15meters long and has the turning circle of a cruise ship though [bigrolf] Those american utes are amazing what they can tow as 5th wheelers.

The 1500 RAm isnt much better than a slightly modded LC200,its the 2500 that is the go for the big loads.

But those that have them are having quite a few issues,including difficulty getting parts.And fitting into normal sized parking lots.[tonguewink]
They definitely dont have the quality and reliability of the Jap/Thia/Korean vehicles(that wont do the job of the 2500 anyway)[wink11]

Does the above make sense,propabaly not,anyway, back to this nice and cold Rum 'n Coke.[bighmmm]

[DoubleChevron]

The 1500 RAm isnt much better than a slightly modded LC200,its the 2500 that is the go for the big loads.

But those that have them are having quite a few issues,including difficulty getting parts.And fitting into normal sized parking lots.[tonguewink]
They definitely dont have the quality and reliability of the Jap/Thia/Korean vehicles(that wont do the job of the 2500 anyway)[wink11]

Does the above make sense,propabaly not,anyway, back to this nice and cold Rum 'n Coke.[bighmmm]

Its weird how things change. I'd have an american car anytime these days ... even a jeep. You see... ebay ..... anything and everything is cheap. The issue is we can only buy new and very expensive Rams and Fseries. There is no 15year old utes out there for us tinkerers.

https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/2021-ram-3500-hd-snatches-gooseneck-towing-and-diesel-torque-record-ratings-152426_1.jpg

they are basically a medium rigid truck when it comes to tow capacity in 5th wheel.

[edddo]

We may have veered slightly from the thread gist😁

[350RRC]

We may have veered slightly from the thread gist😁

I thought it morphed into 'I'm buying a Navara' pages ago.

Truly hope it goes well, DL

[350RRC]

Its weird how things change. I'd have an american car anytime these days ... even a jeep. You see... ebay ..... anything and everything is cheap. The issue is we can only buy new and very expensive Rams and Fseries. There is no 15year old utes out there for us tinkerers.

https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/2021-ram-3500-hd-snatches-gooseneck-towing-and-diesel-torque-record-ratings-152426_1.jpg

they are basically a medium rigid truck when it comes to tow capacity in 5th wheel.

I'll bet it's not running 10% ball weight. The magic figure with no science.

DL

[bob10]

We may have veered slightly from the thread gist😁

Gotta love AULRO, it's a magical mystery tour sometimes.[smilebigeye]

[DoubleChevron]

I'll bet it's not running 10% ball weight. The magic figure with no science.

DL

its a 5th wheeler so should tow like a semi. The hitch should be slightlyl forward of the rear axle. Bugger 10% ... you could have a couple of tons on that hitch quite safely (if its a two ton rated ute). 5th wheelers are what every heavy towed vehicle should be!

[edddo]

I thought it morphed into 'I'm buying a Navara' pages ago.

Truly hope it goes well, DL

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?

[trout1105]

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?

All that I do is lower the tyre pressures down to 32 to 35 psi on my 79 series single cab when I haven't got much of a load on and it improves the ride heaps[thumbsupbig]
Fully loaded at 40 to 43 psi it rides pretty good as well.

[Vern]

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?Fine on road, providing you're not over 6' tall, quite a cramped seating position (i'm 6'5"). Horribly uncomfortable off road i found compared to anything else i have been in. Not a quick car, doesn't pull up well at all when loaded, and once you start to do a few mods, expect to do a few more as its a snowball affect, ie, chip it, then the clutch needs doing.
I honestly looked at one, the package ticks a lot of boxes, but to me, left a lot to be desired.

[Arapiles]

We may have veered slightly from the thread gist😁

Agreed, OP doesn't need a 5th wheeler, he just needs something sensible with a tray and some room for passengers.

Like this:

https://www.uteguide.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/2014-Deni-Ute-muster-show-and-shine-F650.jpg

2014 Deni Ute muster show and shine F650 - Ute Guide (https://www.uteguide.com.au/5-days-to-2014-deni-ute-muster/2014-deni-ute-muster-show-and-shine-f650/)

[scarry]

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?

The youngest son has had one for a year or so,replaced a Puma Defender.

As Vern said,the ride is pretty bad,but a good suspension place will be able to half sort it,but it will never be as good as coils all round,unless its modded and fitted with coils.
The short wheelbase doesnt help either.

Not much wrong with the rest of it,although the quality of the paint isnt as good as the Puma.
Even stock they pull well,heaps of off idle torque.

A standard tune upgrade wont need a clutch in the later models.
There are rumours of an upgrade for MY22,maybe another cup holder...[biggrin]

There is also every accessory under the sun for them,so no issues there.

[Saitch]

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?

As stated previously, I'm a generous bloke and you can have my 75 series, turbo 4.2, looking after a forum mate for, let's see? $150,000. I'll even throw in the awning. Never been on the beach, either.

172650

[rar110]

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?

I’m seriously considering a 76 or 79 dual cab. Yes you have to fix the rear track (for beach wk esp), and prob upgrade the GVM and interior. But it would prob then be a long term keeper. You can get parabolic springs for the rear whic apparently help the ride. Upgrades can be a bit of a rabbit hole, you can just keep going deeper and deeper.

[scarry]

As stated previously, I'm a generous bloke and you can have my 75 series, turbo 4.2, looking after a forum mate for, let's see? $150,000. I'll even throw in the awning. Never been on the beach, either.

172650

I will have the Alveys,and the rods if you want to part with them...:Rolling:

You can keep the tojo[tonguewink]

[Saitch]

I will have the Alveys,and the rods if you want to part with them...:Rolling:

You can keep the tojo[tonguewink]

Scarry, both those rods were built by Mal Ferguson, in the 90s. No one gets them.
The reels are a perfect match.

[Arapiles]

I’m seriously considering a 76 or 79 dual cab. Yes you have to fix the rear track (for beach wk esp), and prob upgrade the GVM and interior. But it would prob then be a long term keeper. You can get parabolic springs for the rear whic apparently help the ride. Upgrades can be a bit of a rabbit hole, you can just keep going deeper and deeper.

It would just need portal hubs, an automatic gearbox and a centre diff. Should be doable for $60k.

[Homestar]

Well youve convinced me to get a RAM. Hehe.

Tbqh I dont know what to do now..the Nav gets no raps anywhere really so as I want to be evidence based it is off the list and Im not keen on the other dc utes.
Recently I have been thinking 79 or 76 series Toje.
Cart springs yes... but solid trucks that will do anything I want to do and more likely to last.
The worry is getting a decent highway ride? Can you do a 10 hour day in these things when long hauling?
Going to test drive some if when Covid restrictions permit.
Anyone here with experience of 76 wagons.?

Yeah, you’d do long days easy in a 76 wagon - with some load in them they have good on road manners. Would be a better option than the dual cabs IMO. [emoji106]

[cripesamighty]

Look up Rotodama on the interwebs. This would make a fun project if it could be registered! Comes as a dual cab also... 😁


4 friends retrofit cabs to revitalise old Land Rover Discoverys - Farmers Weekly (https://www.fwi.co.uk/machinery/4x4s/retrofit-cabs-revitalise-old-land-rover-discoverys)

[edddo]

Look up Rotodama on the interwebs. This would make a fun project if it could be registered! Comes as a dual cab also... 😁


4 friends retrofit cabs to revitalise old Land Rover Discoverys - Farmers Weekly (https://www.fwi.co.uk/machinery/4x4s/retrofit-cabs-revitalise-old-land-rover-discoverys)

That would be a great thing to do on the old D1 and use it as my farm ute. Is it available in Australia?

[cripesamighty]

I've no idea if it's available in Australia yet, but their website is below. It also has pics of the dual cab. From the looks it might be UK only, but you would have to contact them to be sure. Would I love one - absolutely!

Range - Rotodama - Recycle your Discovery (http://www.rotodama.co.uk/cab-configs/).

[rar110]

It would just need portal hubs, an automatic gearbox and a centre diff. Should be doable for $60k.

Portals by Marks 4WD $31k (you get lots more than just portals for this price), auto (several do this) $30k, centre diff by Gearing Dynamics prob $3k.

[Arapiles]

Portals by Marks 4WD $31k (you get lots more than just portals for this price), auto (several do this) $30k, centre diff by Gearing Dynamics prob $3k.

Yes, the auto conversion all seem to be about $30K.

Of course, you could simply import one with a factory auto:

TOYOTA LAND CRUISER PRADO SX | 1992 |
BROWN II | 51357 km | details.- Japanese used cars.Goo-net Exchange (https://www.goo-net-exchange.com/usedcars/TOYOTA/LAND_CRUISER_PRADO/700090362830210704001/index.html)

That's about AUD35,000 (but that's at the upper end because it's only done 51,000 km) and it'd be fair to allow another $10k for import costs.

This one's only 33,525 km and correspondingly more expensive:

TOYOTA LAND CRUISER PRADO SX WIDE | 1993 |
D GREEN M | 33525 km | details.- Japanese used cars.Goo-net Exchange (https://www.goo-net-exchange.com/usedcars/TOYOTA/LAND_CRUISER_PRADO/988021040109030180002/index.html)

Still, way less than even a high mileage local 70 series plus the auto conversion cost.

FYI, since these are over 25 years old they can be imported.

[bob10]

After much deliberation, I have placed a deposit on an Isuzu D-Max 2021 4x4 SX crew cab Auto., cab/chassis. This came after much toing and froing between Isuzu and Mazda dealerships, until I found a deal I liked. Incredibly there was $ 10,000 difference between the highest quote , and the quote I agreed to, the same vehicle, the same accessories. Only problem, the vehicle will not be here until November. COVID willing. But, I get my deposit back if it isn't. A young mechanic at MR Auto wants to buy my D2, I'll have to see how deep his pockets are .[biggrin] This is the first new car I will have had, starting a new chapter in my driving life. Already researching mods to be made to the tray.

[chuck]

Congratulations

[OldGuy]

Yeah, you’d do long days easy in a 76 wagon - with some load in them they have good on road manners. Would be a better option than the dual cabs IMO. [emoji106]

I had a 76, great touring vehicle but on rough roads it was not fun at all, very harsh even with a load on the back would thump and bang an bad corrugations and the different wheel track made it a bit twitchy on these roads. Even though I sound proofed the floor, sides and roof it was still quite noisy. The other downside was that you cant get parabolic springs for the rear as the spring length is shorter than the 79. BUT l did love the V8, solid as a rock.

Having said all that, my D4 is fantastic and love it. Mind you have not had much chance to go touring in the past 18 months..😥

Geoff

[ramblingboy42]

After much deliberation, I have placed a deposit on an Isuzu D-Max 2021 4x4 SX crew cab Auto., cab/chassis....quote

Bob I think you will do well.

When I sold my D2 and bought the Ranger I thought I might have made a wrong decision , but it was actually a good one.

You will miss everything about the D2 for a while , except from now on , nothing will break ever again and require busted fingernails and contortionism and swearing to assist repair. You wont have to do anything but wash it.

.....and like me , you'll be able to tell others that yes , the Isuzu can tackle just about anything the D2 could....in a little less comfort perhaps.

Bob , see if they will fit all terrain tyres instead of the crappy ones they sell it with.

I still have a partly worn set of original tyres and rims that no one wants to buy.

btw my inlaws just ordered a new Subaru XV and won't get it until Oct/Nov. Seems the norm now.

Now we wait for your photos , hahahaha

[Homestar]

I had a 76, great touring vehicle but on rough roads it was not fun at all, very harsh even with a load on the back would thump and bang an bad corrugations and the different wheel track made it a bit twitchy on these roads. Even though I sound proofed the floor, sides and roof it was still quite noisy. The other downside was that you cant get parabolic springs for the rear as the spring length is shorter than the 79. BUT l did love the V8, solid as a rock.

Having said all that, my D4 is fantastic and love it. Mind you have not had much chance to go touring in the past 18 months..[emoji26]

Geoff

Well yes, it’s hardly in D4 territory. [emoji16]

My comments were around overall road manners compared to a dual cab. Drove one for some time - I’d prefer that over long distances to my Hilux for example.

[bob10]

After much deliberation, I have placed a deposit on an Isuzu D-Max 2021 4x4 SX crew cab Auto., cab/chassis....quote

Bob I think you will do well.

When I sold my D2 and bought the Ranger I thought I might have made a wrong decision , but it was actually a good one.

You will miss everything about the D2 for a while , except from now on , nothing will break ever again and require busted fingernails and contortionism and swearing to assist repair. You wont have to do anything but wash it.

.....and like me , you'll be able to tell others that yes , the Isuzu can tackle just about anything the D2 could....in a little less comfort perhaps.

Bob , see if they will fit all terrain tyres instead of the crappy ones they sell it with.

I still have a partly worn set of original tyres and rims that no one wants to buy.

btw my inlaws just ordered a new Subaru XV and won't get it until Oct/Nov. Seems the norm now.
sides of the tray roof I'm building.
Now we wait for your photos , hahahaha

I have to follow up with A/T tyres with the dealership I chose , but they have been bending over backwards to meet my wishes so far. One dealership refused to fit A/T tyres, so I flicked them. I wanted steel rims, which the Isuzu cab chassis has, but Bob Jane has better ones, coloured. I'm going to talk to Bob Jane Redcliffe to see if I can get a rim /tyre deal,[Trade in the Dunlops ], Get them to match the rims to the colour of the canvas of the side of the tray roof I'm building, to put over the fridge / battery box the steel mob at Brendale have in their shop. Yeah, I'll miss the D2, the 'command driving' position , but I'll actually be able to hear the radio, and the locker at the back of the Isuzu will come in handy. I'm over ' adventure' 4x4 driving, this will get me any where I want to go, in comfort, and safety. Did I tell you about the electric towing mirrors? Mickey Mouse. You know if Land Rover had built a Defender for the average joe, pricewise as well as function wise, they would have had me. And I'm not buying some one else's problems in a 2nd hand over priced defender. [wink11]Even if this falls thru because of COVID, I've gained valuable experience in buying a new car, which will put me in good stead if I have to try again. [smilebigeye]

[bob10]

This news about the chip industry for new cars is a worry. Toyota has slashed its North American production, and Thailand has shut down its facilities temporarily. And its not all about COVID.

Toyota Finally Slashes North American Production (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-au/money/companies/toyota-finally-slashes-north-american-production/ar-AANDKjB?ocid=msedgntp)

[Homestar]

This news about the chip industry for new cars is a worry. Toyota has slashed its North American production, and Thailand has shut down its facilities temporarily. And its not all about COVID.

Toyota Finally Slashes North American Production (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-au/money/companies/toyota-finally-slashes-north-american-production/ar-AANDKjB?ocid=msedgntp)

It’s only a worry if you need a new car I suppose and even then is just means longer wait times not that you can’t get one. It isn’t a worry at all to me for any reason.

[bob10]

It’s only a worry if you need a new car I suppose and even then is just means longer wait times not that you can’t get one. It isn’t a worry at all to me for any reason.

Yeah, I suppose worry often gives small things a big shadow.

[edddo]

I had a 76, great touring vehicle but on rough roads it was not fun at all, very harsh even with a load on the back would thump and bang an bad corrugations and the different wheel track made it a bit twitchy on these roads. Even though I sound proofed the floor, sides and roof it was still quite noisy. The other downside was that you cant get parabolic springs for the rear as the spring length is shorter than the 79. BUT l did love the V8, solid as a rock.

Having said all that, my D4 is fantastic and love it. Mind you have not had much chance to go touring in the past 18 months..😥

Geoff

None of that sounds too good to me.
But you can get parabolic springs for 76’s at Terrain Tamer according to cuurent catalog and based on what I have read they do seem to offer a very significant improvement to standard leaf packs.

[edddo]

Re the wheel track issue on the 76.
I see that one way to deal with that is to have a suitable offset wheel (-50?) on the rear.
Seems a reasonable and easy fix.
Issues with wheel bearings or wheel studs maybe?

[AK83]

Re the wheel track issue on the 76.
I see that one way to deal with that is to have a suitable offset wheel (-50?) on the rear.
....


I'm fairly sure that this would be illegal without engineering.
Can't remember, but maybe 25mm max offset is allowable from manufactured specs .. otherwise requires engineered axles mods like they do for the 70 series chassis.

Also, what spare wheel would you carry if rears were offest by so much, and if the front wheel was carried as the spare, how would that affect a heavily loaded vehicle(in a remote area) if this was used for the rear?

[rar110]

From what Ive read, lots of people run them with different offset wheels to correct the track difference. I would just spend the money and fix it.

Toyota widened the front track to accomodate the TDV8 4.5, but still make/sell the 70 series with the 1HZ 4.2 straight six diesel, for other countries. That’s probably why they don’t produce a rear axle for our country.

Google HZJR/R-RKMRS and you find a Toyota dealer in Africa or Asia selling them new.

[V8Ian]

I'm fairly sure that this would be illegal without engineering.
Can't remember, but maybe 25mm max offset is allowable from manufactured specs .. otherwise requires engineered axles mods like they do for the 70 series chassis.

Also, what spare wheel would you carry if rears were offest by so much, and if the front wheel was carried as the spare, how would that affect a heavily loaded vehicle(in a remote area) if this was used for the rear?
I wondered about that too, Arthur, but figured a front wheel would suffice, in an emergency.

[cjc_td5]

I'm fairly sure that this would be illegal without engineering.
Can't remember, but maybe 25mm max offset is allowable from manufactured specs .. otherwise requires engineered axles mods like they do for the 70 series chassis.

Also, what spare wheel would you carry if rears were offest by so much, and if the front wheel was carried as the spare, how would that affect a heavily loaded vehicle(in a remote area) if this was used for the rear?I'd carry an offset wheel as your spare, so would be fine on the rear, and just stick out a bit if used on the front. For remote stuff most carry two spares, so just carry one of each..

My father has an engineered lengthened rear axle on his 79 dual cab. From somewhere in Melbourne I understand.

[scarry]

There are also spacers available,for the rear axle,but not legal in some states.
Extended hubs are also available.
I would go the new axle,there are a few that do it,Google is your friend.

Talking about wheel bearings,they need regular maintenance on the 70’s,which is a PITA.
Service intervals for re pack is around 20 000km from memory,as per Tojo service intervals.
Some leave them for 40 000 if no off road work.

But if the vehicle is under warranty one may have to stay with the manufacturers service intervals.

[I Love My Landy!]

Talking about wheel bearings,they need regular maintenance on the 70’s,which is a PITA.
Service intervals for re pack is around 20 000km from memory,as per Tojo service intervals.


What is so difficult about the servicing of the wheel bearings on the 70's?

I had to fix a wheel bearing issue on the Binn's Track once. No dramas in an old 110. People can knock the old County's as much as they like but mine has never left me stranded.

[edddo]

I'm fairly sure that this would be illegal without engineering.
Can't remember, but maybe 25mm max offset is allowable from manufactured specs .. otherwise requires engineered axles mods like they do for the 70 series chassis.

Also, what spare wheel would you carry if rears were offest by so much, and if the front wheel was carried as the spare, how would that affect a heavily loaded vehicle(in a remote area) if this was used for the rear?

How about go 25 front , -25 rears.
Or 20 front , -20 rears......close enough.
Then one of each for the 2 spares

[scarry]

What is so difficult about the servicing of the wheel bearings on the 70's?

I had to fix a wheel bearing issue on the Binn's Track once. No dramas in an old 110. People can knock the old County's as much as they like but mine has never left me stranded.

Its more the frequency and service intervals that are a pain.
Pretty old school.

[AK83]

How about go 25 front , -25 rears.
Or 20 front , -20 rears......close enough.
Then one of each for the 2 spares

Remember that the real issue is legality.
The plus/minus 25 or 20 idea either way is at least legal, so won't affect insurance.

The track widening will cost approx $6K or so, and if done, uprated axles done at the same time would make sense as well.
79's are notorious for breaking rear axles(in some situations). And from what I understand of the issue is that it usually breaks close to the diff, so if not removed will subsequently destroy the diff too.

My mechanic has spoken about it(axle breakages), and then having found Ronny Dahl and his love for the 79 series was funny to watch him talk about the same issue.
The other thing RD mentions about a 'faulty' design on the engine side is the bad location of the alternator, being very low down.

If you have the knowhow, the track widening can be done as a DIY kit which would save a bundle in labour at least.

By the time you factor in a set of wheels, (what, maybe $2k nowadays .. unless you go for steelies) .. I reckon the 'shed load more' that it will cost for the axle widening would be the better option.
Of course the major factor here would be the total budget you have in mind.

Personally, if you only intend to tow say up to 2t one of the 'regular' dual cabs would be a bit more ideal. Lower fuel use, easier to drive as a daily(or more accurately around shopping areas) .. etc.

[RANDLOVER]

After much deliberation, I have placed a deposit on an Isuzu D-Max 2021 4x4 SX crew cab Auto., cab/chassis....quote

Bob I think you will do well.

When I sold my D2 and bought the Ranger I thought I might have made a wrong decision , but it was actually a good one.

You will miss everything about the D2 for a while , except from now on , nothing will break ever again and require busted fingernails and contortionism and swearing to assist repair. You wont have to do anything but wash it...........

Yes but a new car is not going to make you philosophical, feel rewarded by overcoming challenges, expand the neighbour's kids vocabularies. [biggrin]

[windsock]

Yes but a new car is not going to make you philosophical, feel rewarded by overcoming challenges, expand the neighbour's kids vocabularies. [biggrin]

That last bit needs acknowledging... [thumbsupbig][bighmmm]

[Saitch]

Have a look at injector prices for modern vehicles. :eek2:

[AK83]

Have a look at injector prices for modern vehicles. :eek2:

Relatively cheap when compared to a DPF tho.

[ramblingboy42]

according to one of the latest multi dual cab ute torture test comparos I sat though on you tube last night , the final analyisis came down to the new Isuzu D-Max and its more expensive twin the BT-50 as being the best utes , with everything factored in , which included things like potential for future suspension modification , which surprisingly a few of them dont lend themselves to .....and transmission cooling and longevity.

[350RRC]

How about go 25 front , -25 rears.
Or 20 front , -20 rears......close enough.
Then one of each for the 2 spares

A guy I was working for has a 100 series and put slightly wider wheels on it before leaving Perth towing a boat to do a job in Vic.

Had issues snapping wheel studs before he'd got 200 k's into the trip. Turned back and got them all replaced with aftermarket from memory.

DL

[edddo]

Ive been looking around at 76’s the last few weeks.
**** me dead...cant get a GXL with under 300000 on it for under 50g and I wont be spending that much on anything with as many ks as the car Im replacing as I plan for this car to be a long termer.
If i want a low km one , say 150000, with some add ons, then goodbye to 70 to 90g or more in some cases.
Could get a workmate for a bit less but I do want some basic creature comforts..at least match the 23yo disco.
The value is just not there for me for these things.
Its a process.

[Tote]

Ive been looking around at 76’s the last few weeks.
**** me dead...cant get a GXL with under 300000 on it for under 50g and I wont be spending that much on anything with as many ks as the car Im replacing as I plan for this car to be a long termer.
If i want a low km one , say 150000, with some add ons, then goodbye to 70 to 90g or more in some cases.
Could get a workmate for a bit less but I do want some basic creature comforts..at least match the 23yo disco.
The value is just not there for me for these things.
Its a process.

SWMBO's brother just sold his 3-4 year old GXL for $95K, not sure of KM but he lives out past Dubbo and works in Cobar so there would be a few. He has a new one on order which wont be here for 7 months.....

Regards,
Tote

[pop058]

Ive been looking around at 76’s the last few weeks.
**** me dead...cant get a GXL with under 300000 on it for under 50g and I wont be spending that much on anything with as many ks as the car Im replacing as I plan for this car to be a long termer.
If i want a low km one , say 150000, with some add ons, then goodbye to 70 to 90g or more in some cases.
Could get a workmate for a bit less but I do want some basic creature comforts..at least match the 23yo disco.
The value is just not there for me for these things.
Its a process.

Does the $90K 76 wagon still have wind up windows ??

[scarry]

Does the $90K 76 wagon still have wind up windows ??

$90K,that would be fully modded i would think?


One of my sons picked up a new one for $67K,18 months ago,after having a Puma for 12 yrs.

After paying just under 9k for top of the range aftermarket suspension,it rides almost as well as the Puma it replaced.....

And unlike the Puma,hasnt had an issue,so far,touch wood.[bighmmm][biggrin]

Nicer to drive as well,off idle torque is great,pulls like a train.

But i recon the Puma Traction Control was better,than the 76 TC,although the 76 has dual diff locks.
Puma body paint is definitely better quality,but not the chassis paint.

[Arapiles]

$90K,that would be fully modded i would think?


One of my sons picked up a new one for $67K,18 months ago,after having a Puma for 12 yrs.


I noticed some pretty plain ones for sale the other day for over $90,000. I suspect that people are asking silly money for them because they're the last of the V8s - although I'd understood that it was only the LC that was losing the V8, but maybe not.

[pop058]

Does the $90K 76 wagon still have wind up windows ??


$90K,that would be fully modded i would think?


One of my sons picked up a new one for $67K,18 months ago,after having a Puma for 12 yrs.

After paying just under 9k for top of the range aftermarket suspension,it rides almost as well as the Puma it replaced.....

And unlike the Puma,hasnt had an issue,so far,touch wood.[bighmmm][biggrin]

Nicer to drive as well,off idle torque is great,pulls like a train.

But i recon the Puma Traction Control was better,than the 76 TC,although the 76 has dual diff locks.
Puma body paint is definitely better quality,but not the chassis paint.

BUT does it have wind up windows ??

[Saitch]

$90K,that would be fully modded i would think?


One of my sons picked up a new one for $67K,18 months ago,after having a Puma for 12 yrs.

After paying just under 9k for top of the range aftermarket suspension,it rides almost as well as the Puma it replaced.....

And unlike the Puma,hasnt had an issue,so far,touch wood.[bighmmm][biggrin]

Nicer to drive as well,off idle torque is great,pulls like a train.

But i recon the Puma Traction Control was better,than the 76 TC,although the 76 has dual diff locks.
Puma body paint is definitely better quality,but not the chassis paint.

Sorry, Scarry, but I can't believe people today! If I spent 67k on a vehicle and then had to fork out another 9k to make it fit for purpose, I'd be pretty ****ed off!

Yes, Yes. I know, there's no option, but it's people buying these vehicles, (which a lot probably don't really need) that is aiding and abetting the vicious circle.

[scarry]

Sorry, Scarry, but I can't believe people today! If I spent 67k on a vehicle and then had to fork out another 9k to make it fit for purpose, I'd be pretty ****ed off!

Yes, Yes. I know, there's no option, but it's people buying these vehicles, (which a lot probably don't really need) that is aiding and abetting the vicious circle.

Its fit for purpose stock,no question.

It is just better modded,doesnt HAVE to be modded,as with any mod on any vehicle.

There are many around buying vehicles twice that price and spending twice or three times that money on mods.

And they are not all Jap,Thi vehicles,have a look at the options,you could call them Mods,list, for the New Defender,as an example,Its huge.

[scarry]

BUT does it have wind up windows ??

No

[edddo]

I noticed some pretty plain ones for sale the other day for over $90,000. I suspect that people are asking silly money for them because they're the last of the V8s - although I'd understood that it was only the LC that was losing the V8, but maybe not.

Yes that and the 'covid tax' effect. Even the Navara's I was looking at 2 months ago - the avg asking price is now up at least 5g.
Everything second hand is up in price due to reduced supply (long waits) of new cars and a lot of people are cashed up as they havent been able to buy new or have their annual O/S holidays for a while.
IMO it is also an inflationary effect coming from the gov't printing money like there is no tomorrow. Houses/cars - obvious inflation there at least.

[scarry]

IMO it is also an inflationary effect coming from the gov't printing money like there is no tomorrow. Houses/cars - obvious inflation there at least.

That is the issue and its huge,many are saying inflation will also be very high next couple of years.

The CPI is just a fudge figure,real inflation in Aus,many are saying is running above 10%,some are saying 14%.

They probably are not far off the mark.

My Mothers house(part of her estate) went for auction two weeks ago,we auctioned it on the advice of the agent.We had a couple offers that we thought were great and would take.
At the auction it went for 20% more than the highest offer,a record for the suburb.

Bloody rediculous.

[edddo]

Drove a 2010 GXL 76 yesterday. Asking 62g
Very nice condition.
Responsive and pulls really well, liked the driving position , visibilty etc.
But compared to my D1:
Poor leg room ( im 190cm)
Vague steering..would be terrible on a b grade bitumen road, forever correcting at straight ahead.
Under geared (abt 2500 at 100!, disco is 2200)
Doors feel like they are made of cardboard


I would not be happy at all long hauling in that car.
I would be reaching for another gear all the time.
Felt cramped.
Seems very poor top gear ratio for such a torquey engine that could easily pull 110 at 2000rpm
Must ruin the fuel economy
Of course it would be great for towing something heavy.

Was a pleasure to drive the disco home.

[rar110]

Drove a 2010 GXL 76 yesterday. Asking 62g
Very nice condition.
Responsive and pulls really well, liked the driving position , visibilty etc.
But compared to my D1:
Poor leg room ( im 190cm)
Vague steering..would be terrible on a b grade bitumen road, forever correcting at straight ahead.
Under geared (abt 2500 at 100!, disco is 2200)
Doors feel like they are made of cardboard


I would not be happy at all long hauling in that car.
I would be reaching for another gear all the time.
Felt cramped.
Seems very poor top gear ratio for such a torquey engine that could easily pull 110 at 2000rpm
Must ruin the fuel economy
Of course it would be great for towing something heavy.

Was a pleasure to drive the disco home.

Thanks for that. Used prices are interesting, when a new 76 is $72.5k with 5 year warranty and 12mths rego. But realistically they need about $15k spent on them to make them a reasonable tourer. And that $15k is pretty much invisible as it will look exactly the same, just drive better and be quieter inside. I really like the idea of a 76, but hate to say it but am considering a GX Prado new for under $60k, plus another $6k for GVM upgrade. It has better fuel economy, coils all round, permanent 4WD, lots of safety gear, and most importantly a better stereo. I’ll prob pick up a set of leather seats from written off VX. Boring as bat ****e, but great bang for buck. I saw this pic which puts capability needs into perspective for me.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211021/35205894d099f4472610cbb281c23f99.jpg

[I Love My Landy!]

I really like the idea of a 76, but hate to say it but am considering a GX Prado new for under $60k, plus another $6k for GVM upgrade.

What will be the new load carrying capacity with the GVM upgrade?

[edddo]

Thanks for that. Used prices are interesting, when a new 76 is $72.5k with 5 year warranty and 12mths rego. But realistically they need about $15k spent on them to make them a reasonable tourer. And that $15k is pretty much invisible as it will look exactly the same, just drive better and be quieter inside. I really like the idea of a 76, but hate to say it but am considering a GX Prado new for under $60k, plus another $6k for GVM upgrade. It has better fuel economy, coils all round, permanent 4WD, lots of safety gear, and most importantly a better stereo. I’ll prob pick up a set of leather seats from written off VX. Boring as bat ****e, but great bang for buck. I saw this pic which puts capability needs into perspective for me.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211021/35205894d099f4472610cbb281c23f99.jpg

yes wow! that puts the ridiculous second hand prices into some perspective. Didn't realise what the new prices are. GX Prado with 5yrs warranty seems like a good deal.

[loanrangie]

Just go buy a Ranger already [bighmmm].

[edddo]

Fine on road, providing you're not over 6' tall, quite a cramped seating position (i'm 6'5"). Horribly uncomfortable off road i found compared to anything else i have been in. Not a quick car, doesn't pull up well at all when loaded, and once you start to do a few mods, expect to do a few more as its a snowball affect, ie, chip it, then the clutch needs doing.
I honestly looked at one, the package ticks a lot of boxes, but to me, left a lot to be desired.

Just reviewing comments..and noted this...dead right. No good for the over 6 footers.

[rar110]

What will be the new load carrying capacity with the GVM upgrade?

GX 5 seater kerb weight is 2240, GVM upgrade to 3560 from 2990kg GVM. So carrying capacity of 1.3tonne, not that I would carry that much. But its not hard to get to 900-1000kg.

Superior Outback Venturer 2.0 Australia Wide Legal 2 Inch Lift, 32 Inch Tyres, 3.56t Gvm Suitable For Toyota Prado 150 Series | Superior Engineering (https://www.superiorengineering.com.au/4x4-suspension/gvm-upgrades/superior-outback-venturer-20-australia-wide-legal-2-inch-lift-32-inch-tyres-356t-gvm-suitable-for-toyota-prado-150-series-2021-on-41131/ProductFilter/Toyota/Prado/1502021on-2021-current-/WagonAllAll)

[I Love My Landy!]

Thank you rar110. So the kit costs $6,700ish, but do you also need to pay the $3,700ish fitting & engineering fee too?

[Tombie]

Drove a 2010 GXL 76 yesterday. Asking 62g
Very nice condition.
Responsive and pulls really well, liked the driving position , visibilty etc.
But compared to my D1:
Poor leg room ( im 190cm)
Vague steering..would be terrible on a b grade bitumen road, forever correcting at straight ahead.
Under geared (abt 2500 at 100!, disco is 2200)
Doors feel like they are made of cardboard


I would not be happy at all long hauling in that car.
I would be reaching for another gear all the time.
Felt cramped.
Seems very poor top gear ratio for such a torquey engine that could easily pull 110 at 2000rpm
Must ruin the fuel economy
Of course it would be great for towing something heavy.

Was a pleasure to drive the disco home.

Not really - You cannot tow in top gear as the box wont take it... so imagine the rpm then!

Hence why so many with van hitched doddle at 75km/h

[Geedublya]

Not really - You cannot tow in top gear as the box wont take it... so imagine the rpm then!

Hence why so many with van hitched doddle at 75km/h

They kill clutches relatively easily as well. My mate has 2 dual cabs for his business and has installed 200 series autos. He reports they are much nicer to drive now.

[rar110]

Thank you rar110. So the kit costs $6,700ish, but do you also need to pay the $3,700ish fitting & engineering fee too?

That’s the specced up kit with control arms, extended brake lines & RR shocks. I need to clarify with them or another workshop the whole cost. There is also a base Lovells kit which is $4k plus fitting.

[scarry]

Under geared (abt 2500 at 100!, disco is 2200)


FWIW,From 2017,gear ratio in 5th was changed.

[scarry]

Not really - You cannot tow in top gear as the box wont take it... so imagine the rpm then!

Hence why so many with van hitched doddle at 75km/h

This from a mate of mine that specialises in gearbox repairs on all types of vehicles and trucks,tractors,etc...

"Unlike most other gearboxes that have 5th gear at the end of the gear set or even sit outside the main box like a fairy overdrive they engineered 5th gear in the VDJ to be stronger than other boxes for towing ,it sits in the middle of the of the gear set inside the main gearbox area so stays cooler and has bigger bearings for strength. It is able to be used for towing. In saying that 4th is 1:1 ratio and is better suited to lugging and hilly situations. Use common sense, use 4th in hills and when lugging but 5th gear is fine for flat 100kph towing.

They sit on 75Km/hr,as do many others to be a PITA,but saves a few $$ in fuel.[bigsad]
And make the roads more dangerous.[bigsad]

[Tombie]

Toyota themselves only recommend towing in 5th downhill. Go figure!

[scarry]

Toyota themselves only recommend towing in 5th downhill. Go figure!

Probably to save fuel[thumbsupbig]

I will have a look in the handbook and report back.[wink11]

Definitely for the big weights,that is 3.0t and over,S5 in the 200,but thats off topic[bighmmm][biggrin]

[RANDLOVER]

What about Product Page (GWM) (gwmhaval.com.au) (https://www.gwmhaval.com.au/gwm?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIhOzhxMzk8wIVBXRoCh1KTQSAEAEY ASAAEgK0FfD_BwE) it even looks like a Toyota Hilux?

[edddo]

Just go buy a Ranger already [bighmmm].

yes, looks like this is the way to go.
Best leg room option and so many on the second hand market to choose from.
A set of parabolic rear leafs if required.......
If I get one I will go from driving one of the least common 4wds to the most common.

[Tombie]

Having Rangers on our LV fleet and my primary work vehicle:

Reliability - they’re ok, no better or worse than others.

Noisy - bloody hell do they make a noise, so much intrusive engine noise under throttle

Ride and handling- far better than a Hilux. Not that that is saying much!

Fit and finish - average at best, very plastic.

Size - turn worse than a 130 Defender, horrible in tight areas. High country would be horrible. Was bad enough in a 110, this would be beyond that.

Electrics - huge amount of exposed electrics just behind LHS of cab. We have lots of issues with them.


Would I own one? NO. I’d go a Triton any day.

[Homestar]

My 101 rides nearly as well (or badly depending on how you look at it) as my Hilux. [emoji56]. I’m exaggerating but they are bloody awful day to day when unloaded.

While I think the newer Rangers aren’t ****ting gearboxes like the older ones, we have just finished exiting the last of them out of the fleet due to reliability issues. Out of the 10 field service units we had in Melbourne, 4 of them have required a new gearbox before 150KKM.

They seem ok when used in lighter duty conditions but heavily loaded or towing seems to **** them pretty quickly.

[scarry]

Having Rangers on our LV fleet and my primary work vehicle:

Reliability - they’re ok, no better or worse than others.

Noisy - bloody hell do they make a noise, so much intrusive engine noise under throttle

Ride and handling- far better than a Hilux. Not that that is saying much!

Fit and finish - average at best, very plastic.

Size - turn worse than a 130 Defender, horrible in tight areas. High country would be horrible. Was bad enough in a 110, this would be beyond that.

Electrics - huge amount of exposed electrics just behind LHS of cab. We have lots of issues with them.


Would I own one? NO. I’d go a Triton any day.

We have a BT50 in our fleet,I get what you are saying.

Compared to our Hi Ace vans,just no comparison in fit and finish,general quality control and reliability.

As for drivability,we have no other utes to compare it to,atm.

Probably get a Ranger soon,Hilux doesn’t have the variant we want,and I don’t know if the Triton will handle the weight we carry with the rear wheel so far forward from the end of the tray.We will need the longest tray available,on a space cab,which can only be fitted to the Ford.

[edddo]

Having Rangers on our LV fleet and my primary work vehicle:

Reliability - they’re ok, no better or worse than others.

Noisy - bloody hell do they make a noise, so much intrusive engine noise under throttle

Ride and handling- far better than a Hilux. Not that that is saying much!

Fit and finish - average at best, very plastic.

Size - turn worse than a 130 Defender, horrible in tight areas. High country would be horrible. Was bad enough in a 110, this would be beyond that.

Electrics - huge amount of exposed electrics just behind LHS of cab. We have lots of issues with them.


Would I own one? NO. I’d go a Triton any day.

How tall are you?

[Tombie]

How tall are you?

6’1”

[DieselDan]

Having Rangers on our LV fleet and my primary work vehicle:

Reliability - they’re ok, no better or worse than others.

Noisy - bloody hell do they make a noise, so much intrusive engine noise under throttle

Ride and handling- far better than a Hilux. Not that that is saying much!

Fit and finish - average at best, very plastic.

Size - turn worse than a 130 Defender, horrible in tight areas. High country would be horrible. Was bad enough in a 110, this would be beyond that.

Electrics - huge amount of exposed electrics just behind LHS of cab. We have lots of issues with them.


Would I own one? NO. I’d go a Triton any day.PM sent.

[edddo]

6’1”

Thks for the recommendation.
My concerns re the Triton are ride comfort and rear overhang/departure angle.
Although the latter is not really an issue as I will run a shortened tray and a bit of lift ultimately.
It is the one ute I have yet to drive to check leg room/driver comfort.
In most utes, so far, Im finding that the seats are too low relative to the floor, leaving my knees up in the sky or bent to the sides..other than the Ranger and I guess Older BT50’s. Colorado wasnt too bad either.

[350RRC]

Thks for the recommendation.
My concerns re the Triton are ride comfort and rear overhang/departure angle.
Although the latter is not really an issue as I will run a shortened tray and a bit of lift ultimately.
It is the one ute I have yet to drive to check leg room/driver comfort.
In most utes, so far, Im finding that the seats are too low relative to the floor, leaving my knees up in the sky or bent to the sides..other than the Ranger and I guess Older BT50’s. Colorado wasnt too bad either.

Ride comfort is a personal thing. I have long arms and legs and find the seats in a triton suit me far better than a lux or a rok after playing with adjustments on all.

You need to drive any of them for a couple of hours at least to really find out.

Tne last couple of tritons have a vastly improved turning circle compared with earlier ones where it was an issue.

Drove a late model one towing a boat doing a job up at Ned's corner for a week 18 months ago and didn't have any issues with rear overhang crossing narrow gullies maybe 4-5 metres deep or launching off banks.

cheers, DL

[bob10]

according to one of the latest multi dual cab ute torture test comparos I sat though on you tube last night , the final analyisis came down to the new Isuzu D-Max and its more expensive twin the BT-50 as being the best utes , with everything factored in , which included things like potential for future suspension modification , which surprisingly a few of them dont lend themselves to .....and transmission cooling and longevity.

Yes, after much consideration, I am the owner of a 2021 D-max Isuzu tray back ute. It was the Isuzu engine, and little things like the transmission cooling, and potential GVM upgrade [ if needed ] that clinched it A tad over $ 55,000 for the base model, with most of the fruit . A hard top vinyl canopy fitted was a bit hard to get used to, vision wise, but with the clear view mirrors set up properly, all good. She drives really well, plenty of power when needed for towing, a bit bouncy on dirt roads unloaded but I found a sort of solution with the fitting of a 70 litre water tank under the tray, even half full makes a difference.

No idea how these would go in a fleet carrying heavy loads, but for a touring vehicle, loaded sensibly, she goes ok. Will definitely consider a suspension upgrade at some stage, with a 40mm lift. Yet to load it up fully and take it over the scales. I considered a long range fuel tank , carrying jerries and lifting them in & out wasn't an option, but found a poly 40 litre fuel tank with hose & nozzle , gravity feed with a 12 V pump option, just the ticket. I'll buy two, and mix & match according to the trip, & fuel & load weight calculations. Early days yet, but happy as with the vehicle, and the dealer .

The most difficult thing is making a decision to get rid of the Disco. Can't bring myself to do it, and keep making excuses not to. Like losing a member of the family, but SWMBO loves the ride in the new vehicle. As long as the disco doesn't throw a fetlock, requiring emptying the wallet, the old D2 looks like being the vehicle of choice for beach trips [ occassionly]

[V8Ian]

:ttiwwp:

[loanrangie]

All dual cab utes suffer from rear over hang, nothing you can do about that. They are only marginal as an off-road vehicle at best, crap turning circle, firm leaf springs etc.

[edddo]

So I had a look at a Ranger the other day. The rear suspension confused me.See pic below.
The leafs have small ( maybe 2mm) spacers between them, but there are too many leafs to call them parabolic.
The owner said they are OME.
The pack sits quite flat.
Any ideas on what these are and are they any good?
The truck rides quite firm but that is not surprising as owner reckoned the rears are 400kg constant load.
Otherwise it drove and presented ok.

175065

[loanrangie]

O =old,M =man, E =emu unless you meant OEM.

[edddo]

indeed.. I said OME meaning Old Man Emu.......
Your reply not that helpful....
I cant find any info/images on OME leafs with this kind of spacing or info on why it is a good idea.

[Aaron IIA]

Are the spacers in the springs something like these?

Amazon.com: Dorman 924-070 Leaf Spring Bumper Spacer for Select Models, 4 Pack : Automotive (https://www.amazon.com/Dorman-924-070-Leaf-Spring-Spacer/dp/B00C1CECGS)

They help to lower the friction between the spring leaves, increasing the axle articulation and decreasing the spring wear rate.

Aaron

[Homestar]

indeed.. I said OME meaning Old Man Emu.......
Your reply not that helpful....
I cant find any info/images on OME leafs with this kind of spacing or info on why it is a good idea.

I would have said the whole Ranger thing isn’t that helpful to anyone that wants a decent vehicle myself, but each to their own. What year is it and what gearbox? The auto exploding one?

[loanrangie]

Just buy a vehicle ffs and stop procrastinating, that more helpful for you ?

[edddo]

Just buy a vehicle ffs and stop procrastinating, that more helpful for you ?

Yes immensely helpful. ffs indeed.

[edddo]

Are the spacers in the springs something like these?

Amazon.com: Dorman 924-070 Leaf Spring Bumper Spacer for Select Models, 4 Pack : Automotive (https://www.amazon.com/Dorman-924-070-Leaf-Spring-Spacer/dp/B00C1CECGS)

They help to lower the friction between the spring leaves, increasing the axle articulation and decreasing the spring wear rate.

Aaron
Thks Aaron, yes something like that. I have since been informed that OME did do a product like that and yeh I assume that that would be the rationale of the design.

[edddo]

I would have said the whole Ranger thing isn’t that helpful to anyone that wants a decent vehicle myself, but each to their own. What year is it and what gearbox? The auto exploding one?

No - a manual exploding one, 2014.

[3toes]

At least you have the choice. With the end of the Defender as a commercial vehicle the dual cab has taken over

In Europe as part of the market sharing arrangements with Renault and Nissan Mitsubishi has withdrawn. Now Nissan is no longer to sell theirs. Between them they had about 40% of the market

The Nissan factory in Spain that makes them for the EU market was never able to make enough and their last hope was the rebadged Mercedes version that was a flop. Factory is now to be closed

So that leaves Ford with the Ranger and Toyota with the Hilux. While the VW is still in the market it will soon be a rebadged Ford

The Chinese brands are in the market but not shifting in numbers. The withdrawal of Mitsubishi and Nissan may be their opportunity

[bob10]

:ttiwwp:


When I finish fitting it out, I'll attempt some pics. Next effort is fitting the 120 A solar panel on the roof of the canopy. Son in law organises the fitting of electrics to fuel tankers, and gave me the industry standard way of doing it. [ didn't offer to do it, said it would be good experience for me. Glad we gave the grandson a real noisy toy for his birthday, now [smilebigeye]] Basic, really. Fitted the REDARC plastic corners to the panel with Sikaflex 525 and tech screws, now to drill the 20 mm holes to fit the grommet? thingy to pass the wires & conduit thru, and make a waterproof seal. Had to snip the plugs off the end of the panel wires , never mind, get to practice my soldering.

Just thought, if the OP wants some info on the Isuzu, like the mods to the IFS front end to improve the 2021 model over earlier ones, or the upgrades to the engine turbo set up to enhance the towing torque at certain revs, or the upgrade to the front disc brakes, an explanation of the IDAS system, and the engine. I'm wrapped in the engine. A refined version of the Isuzu 3 L , now the 4JJ3TCX, a new turbo, [ no noticeable lag and plenty of low down torque] a different intake and different injection system, said to give a better refined and more powerful 3 litre engine. I find nothing to dispute that. And guess what NO OIL LEAKS ! at all. The only negative is the new air intake is at the front of the engine bay, and would take a gut full of water at a deep water crossing. A snorkel is mandatory in the new D-Max. There are more subtle differences between the old & the new, but as suggested I can sent all the details if wanted.

[Vern]

I would have said the whole Ranger thing isn’t that helpful to anyone that wants a decent vehicle myself, but each to their own. What year is it and what gearbox? The auto exploding one?So whats this about the exploding 6r80? Have seen this comment on here before but no one could elaborate on it. Its a very strong auto, the new goto box in the US, they say good for 1000hp with the correct tune, but i hear about them dying in rangers, why and whats the cause? I want to use one behind my 4bd1t

[Fattima]

So whats this about the exploding 6r80? Have seen this comment on here before but no one could elaborate on it. Its a very strong auto, the new goto box in the US, they say good for 1000hp with the correct tune, but i hear about them dying in rangers, why and whats the cause? I want to use one behind my 4bd1t
Friend of mine went through 3 autos under warranty. Wasn't until it broke down away from a main dealer and he was towed to an independent workshop that the fault was found. Issue was not the auto but an alignment issue from the factory, from memory something to do with the dowels on the back of the block. He has had no issues since.

[LRJim]

He has had no issues since.


Probably because he sold the ranger [emoji1787]

Sorry had to do it
Cheers

[Homestar]

So whats this about the exploding 6r80? Have seen this comment on here before but no one could elaborate on it. Its a very strong auto, the new goto box in the US, they say good for 1000hp with the correct tune, but i hear about them dying in rangers, why and whats the cause? I want to use one behind my 4bd1t

Work bought 12 new rangers with that gearbox - 4 of them suffered catastrophic failures of that box within a couple of years. I note they’ve gone to a different box in the newer models, so just taking about the 6 speed. Not sure why, but the Ranger experiment is over and they back to buying Hilux’s.

Also chatting to a friend on the weekend - he had to take his truck to rescue his Dad and camper trailer stuck up near Alice Springs with same gearbox failure. 5 YO vehicle with 110,000KM on it - full factory service history. The RACV couldn’t guarantee the car and camper could be transported together and said they would leave the camper for a few days on the side of the road, so my mate just took one of his trucks up to grab the lot.

While I’m not sure what the exact issue is, it’s well known and the failures I’ve seen/heard of aren’t just a ‘mate of a mate’ - been talking to the guys that drove the work vehicles - fine one minute, loud bang and no drive the next - no warning, no fix - boxes are destroyed in the process.

I wouldn’t touch one with someone elses 10 foot barge pole based on all of this.

[Tombie]

Watch this:

Let Me Google That (https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.arb.com.au%2Fold-man-emu-4x4-suspension%2Fsprings%2F)

And then go to leaf springs…

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211122/1b9f7922c03801f888164ca298eba21c.jpg

[Tombie]

I would still recommend a new Triton as the pick of the bunch.. 10 years, no mucking around, warranty.

[Vern]

Work bought 12 new rangers with that gearbox - 4 of them suffered catastrophic failures of that box within a couple of years. I note they’ve gone to a different box in the newer models, so just taking about the 6 speed. Not sure why, but the Ranger experiment is over and they back to buying Hilux’s.

Also chatting to a friend on the weekend - he had to take his truck to rescue his Dad and camper trailer stuck up near Alice Springs with same gearbox failure. 5 YO vehicle with 110,000KM on it - full factory service history. The RACV couldn’t guarantee the car and camper could be transported together and said they would leave the camper for a few days on the side of the road, so my mate just took one of his trucks up to grab the lot.

While I’m not sure what the exact issue is, it’s well known and the failures I’ve seen/heard of aren’t just a ‘mate of a mate’ - been talking to the guys that drove the work vehicles - fine one minute, loud bang and no drive the next - no warning, no fix - boxes are destroyed in the process.

I wouldn’t touch one with someone elses 10 foot barge pole based on all of this.But whats the well known issue? Maybe be it is the misalignment from the engine dowels? I know from 2014 there was some minor upgrades, and that in the US its pretty bulletproof behind their vehicles, and box internals are the same as our ranger. Could be an ECU thing, controlling the pressure perhaps. Very interested to know the real issue.

[Homestar]

The well known issue is that they explode [bigrolf] If you Google "Ranger gearbox" the first thing to show is "Issues".

I've never bothered to find out the root cause because I'd never buy a Ford - this issue notwithstanding, they have about the worst after sales service of any of the OEM's and that's saying something when you look at the likes of VW or Land Rover.

Yes - could be a good box with something that Ford have done in this application to cause issues.

[gromit]

The well known issue is that they explode [bigrolf] If you Google "Ranger gearbox" the first thing to show is "Issues".

I've never bothered to find out the root cause because I'd never buy a Ford - this issue notwithstanding, they have about the worst after sales service of any of the OEM's and that's saying something when you look at the likes of VW or Land Rover.

Yes - could be a good box with something that Ford have done in this application to cause issues.

Isn't it the same box in the diesel Territory ? As far as I know there are no problems (although I don't frequent the Ford forums nowadays).

Makes you wonder what they did to have so many problems with the Ranger.

Colin

[Vern]

Isn't it the same box in the diesel Territory ? As far as I know there are no problems (although I don't frequent the Ford forums nowadays).

Makes you wonder what they did to have so many problems with the Ranger.

Colin2 boxes in the ranger, 6r80 and 10r80, 10r80 had recalls for pump issues on selected vins, 6r80 early ones occasionally had valve solenoid issues and speed sensor, later ones (2014), not sure what issies they had yet

[350RRC]

2 boxes in the ranger, 6r80 and 10r80, 10r80 had recalls for pump issues on selected vins, 6r80 early ones occasionally had valve solenoid issues and speed sensor, later ones (2014), not sure what issies they had yet

Some had engine issues in tandem.

Couple of guys I know had engines and trans replaced at the same time, one of them was on his third motor when he got rid of it.

[Vern]

Some had engine issues in tandem.

Couple of guys I know had engines and trans replaced at the same time, one of them was on his third motor when he got rid of it.Only interested in the 6r80 for a conversion, i'd never own a ranger.

[gusthedog]

I would still recommend a new Triton as the pick of the bunch.. 10 years, no mucking around, warranty.My mate with a new triton that spent 4 weeks of a 14 week trip in Canarvon waiting on a new DPF might disagree. Kinda made their trip a bit ****.

[Tombie]

My mate with a new triton that spent 4 weeks of a 14 week trip in Canarvon waiting on a new DPF might disagree. Kinda made their trip a bit ****.

I’m sure it did, however where n=1 they are still the pick of the bunch.

Out of curiosity- let me take a stab at it, most of the time it’s an urban/short run vehicle and the DPF just was too full to regenerate properly?

I see Toyota now has a DPF exchange for life on their Hilux due to the ongoing issues there.

[Tombie]

My mate with a new triton that spent 4 weeks of a 14 week trip in Canarvon waiting on a new DPF might disagree. Kinda made their trip a bit ****.

I’m sure it did, however where n=1 they are still the pick of the bunch.

Out of curiosity- let me take a stab at it, most of the time it’s an urban/short run vehicle and the DPF just was too full to regenerate properly?

I see Toyota now has a DPF exchange for life on their Hilux due to the ongoing issues there.

[350RRC]

I’m sure it did, however where n=1 they are still the pick of the bunch.

Out of curiosity- let me take a stab at it, most of the time it’s an urban/short run vehicle and the DPF just was too full to regenerate properly?

I see Toyota now has a DPF exchange for life on their Hilux due to the ongoing issues there.

Do you need a library card?

AFAIK the Triton and Isuzu DPF's are the most reliable.

DL

[Homestar]

I’m sure it did, however where n=1 they are still the pick of the bunch.

Out of curiosity- let me take a stab at it, most of the time it’s an urban/short run vehicle and the DPF just was too full to regenerate properly?

I see Toyota now has a DPF exchange for life on their Hilux due to the ongoing issues there.

Yota tried to blame me for the DPF dying in my work Hilux by saying I don’t do enough long runs to get it hot enough. When I replied “What? 1000KM a week of Country driving isn’t enough? I think there’s an issue your end if I need to do more than this”. He hadn’t even looked at the odometer reading showing 110,000KM on a vehicle not much more than 2 years old. He shut up then. Since that time and the class action against them they’ve had to offer the DPF deal as part of the settlement.

[Vern]

Yota tried to blame me for the DPF dying in my work Hilux by saying I don’t do enough long runs to get it hot enough. When I replied “What? 1000KM a week of Country driving isn’t enough? I think there’s an issue your end if I need to do more than this”. He hadn’t even looked at the odometer reading showing 110,000KM on a vehicle not much more than 2 years old. He shut up then. Since that time and the class action against them they’ve had to offer the DPF deal as part of the settlement.I wonder when they are going to offer an Aircleaner deal for all the dusted landcruisers[emoji1]

[gusthedog]

I’m sure it did, however where n=1 they are still the pick of the bunch.

Out of curiosity- let me take a stab at it, most of the time it’s an urban/short run vehicle and the DPF just was too full to regenerate properly?

I see Toyota now has a DPF exchange for life on their Hilux due to the ongoing issues there.Nope. We live in rural Victoria and it hardly ever does short runs aside from school drop of a few times a week. They do some kms in it.

Mitsubishi Australia got into an argument with them saying the vehicle had been chipped when it never had. So over a week of that time was taken up with arguing with Mitsubishi whether it was a warranty issue.

They also had an issue with their triton where the loom wore through or there was a broken wire in the loom while in remote WA. Mitsubishi said it would take 6-12 weeks to get a loom in from Japan as there weren't any in the country.

After the DPF palava, my mate cracked it with them. Took two blokes over 2 days to manually find the break in the wire and repair it.

He still likes the car but that sure left him with a sour taste. Particularly the attitude of Mitsubishi Australia.

[Homestar]

All OEM’s are the same - all arseholes - it’s part of owning a new car in Australia. We need some stronger anti lemon laws here.

[scarry]

This is interesting.


Ford Admits It Made Mistakes With The Current Ranger | CarBuzz (https://carbuzz.com/news/ford-admits-it-made-mistakes-with-the-current-ranger?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=carbuzz-facebook&utm_content=post)

[bob10]

Do you need a library card?

AFAIK the Triton and Isuzu DPF's are the most reliable.

DL

I'm new to this DPF business, so I have to defer to the Manual. Isuzu call theirs a Diesel Particulate Defuser.[ DPD] " removes particulate matter from diesel exhaust gases. The DPD automatically regenerates when a certain amount of PM accumulates." "If conditions are such automatic regeneration may not be completed, operator regeneration should be carried out when the DPD operator regeneration light flashes. "

Operator regeneration procedure;

Drive at a constant speed of more than 50 KPH

When vehicle speed, engine coolant temperatures and other factors [?] are met, The DPD operator regeneration engine light switches from flashing to continuous illumination and DPD regeneration begins.

Drive at a constant speed as possible,[ over 50 KPH] operator regeneration of DPD is complete once the DPD light goes off.

I'm thinking anyone who can understand the TD5 coolant set up, should be able to handle that.[smilebigeye]

[Tins]

I'm thinking anyone who can understand the TD5 coolant set up, should be able to handle that.[smilebigeye]

So, in other words, nobody?

[Tins]

This is interesting.


Ford Admits It Made Mistakes With The Current Ranger | CarBuzz (https://carbuzz.com/news/ford-admits-it-made-mistakes-with-the-current-ranger?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=carbuzz-facebook&utm_content=post)

The all-new Ford Ranger adds even more brains and brawn to the beloved SUV (https://apple.news/Alpqkd_2ER56v0iumBcOQYA)

[scarry]

The all-new Ford Ranger adds even more brains and brawn to the beloved SUV (https://apple.news/Alpqkd_2ER56v0iumBcOQYA)


They need it to sell very well.

In fact if it wasnt for the Ranger,Ford may not be here in Aus.

[scarry]

I'm new to this DPF business, so I have to defer to the Manual. Isuzu call theirs a Diesel Particulate Defuser.[ DPD] " removes particulate matter from diesel exhaust gases. The DPD automatically regenerates when a certain amount of PM accumulates." "If conditions are such automatic regeneration may not be completed, operator regeneration should be carried out when the DPD operator regeneration light flashes. "

Operator regeneration procedure;

Drive at a constant speed of more than 50 KPH

When vehicle speed, engine coolant temperatures and other factors [?] are met, The DPD operator regeneration engine light switches from flashing to continuous illumination and DPD regeneration begins.

Drive at a constant speed as possible,[ over 50 KPH] operator regeneration of DPD is complete once the DPD light goes off.

I'm thinking anyone who can understand the TD5 coolant set up, should be able to handle that.[smilebigeye]

We have a few vehicles here that have DPF's,some over 5 yrs old.

They get driven normally,and we have never had to press a regen button or have had an issue.

Just drive it normally,and all will be good.

[ozscott]

Coming up to 50,000klm in my GLSP MR Triton. I really like the vehicle. It has been excellent. It is very confidence inspiring to drive in awful weather. I run it in AWD constantly. I wouldn't trade it for the new Ranger or anything else as a straight swap (I would consider an Isuzu if mine was totalled if they got serious and offered heated seats [emoji23] but would very likely go MR again). Cheers

[3toes]

DPF normally only a problem if only driven in slow stop start city traffic and short hops