Cancer. The awkward conversation.

[BradC]

I was just chatting to a 64 year old bloke with a new prostate cancer diagnosis, and thought I'd post my response here. Frankly because it's too important an issue not to pass on.

My grandfather was not quite 20 years older than you when he had his removed, and he's just clocked 101. It's my hope you do at least as well.


I find the biggest issue with men is talking about it. My neighbour (one of 7 brothers and 2 sisters) was diagnosed and treated about 4 years ago. When he put a broadcast out to his brothers about the diagnosis his older brother said "Oh yes, I had that 2 years ago". Had he actually spoken about it, my neighbour would have had the test earlier, got earlier intervention and required a much less severe treatment.


I'm 48. My father is 76 and has recently been treated for Stage 3B Lung cancer (half lung resection and lots of chemo/radio). Prior to my son being diagnosed in 2019 my father "Didn't know anyone really that cancer affected", even though several of our family friends had died over the years. He was like the proverbial emu with his head in the sand. Over the last couple of years he's talked about it a bit more, but it took the death of his Grandson to really "wake him the **** up" and suddenly notice all the people around him that have been affected. Then he was diagnosed.


Men don't talk, and they bloody need to. Stiff upper lip and stoic isn't a sign of strength, it's a potential death sentence.

Given our longevity these days, most men will either die of prostate cancer, or with it. It's manageable if caught early enough. If you leave it too late then it'll either kill you or potentially introduce you to Mr Floppy. Having said that, my favourite quote is from George Burns who said "sex at age 90 is like trying shooting pool with a rope".

If you haven't had the talk with your GP, do it sooner rather than later. Most of us over-maintain our Land Rovers. Apply the same philosophy to the body.

Oh, and if you can, donate whole blood and/or platelets. If you are healthy, Male and under 42 get on the bone marrow donor register. If you are Female, under 42, healthy and never been pregnant, do the same. There is a "gotcha" with the Females though. The test will clearly indicate if you have been pregnant (ever) and there have been a not-insignificant number of women who when delivered that news and had no idea, "haven't taken it well".

[Slunnie]

Men don't talk, and they bloody need to. Stiff upper lip and stoic isn't a sign of strength, it's a potential death sentence.

I totally agree with you, but just keep in mind that some don't talk about it purely because they just don't want to talk about it, and it has nothing to do with being stoic or having a stiff upper lip. People with cancer don't have to go out and have that conversation with everyone like they're some type of vegan and I think it is important to be respectful of that.

[RANDLOVER]

I spoke to my doctor about this, as I have already outlived my mother and it will only be a few years till I outlive my father, both died of cancer of one sort or another, so I asked if I should get an all over body scan and he said no, but gave me a script for a full blood test. I ended up having that and a urine sample tested when I had a bad reaction to the covid booster shot, and it is amazing all the info they can get from the tests, so I think I am going to get one every year. The blood test also includes the PSA test for prostate cancer.

[ramblingboy42]

I'm not so sure about men not wanting to talk.

I have just come out of an extended radiation treatment and during that time got to chat with a number of guys also getting treatment.

Firstly your day or part thereof is buggered because you have to travel to your treatment centre, park , and then attend your treatment. After your treatment, back home where fatigue sets in and you want to sleep after you have applied an antiseptic/ moisturising cream to your affected area.The post treatment fatigue is real every day. So most people around you dont see you.

At the clinic you do get a chance to chat but that gets interrupted by your appt and when you come out the person you were talking to is gone , and you may not cross paths for a week.

The volunteer organisations that care for patients are just fantastic and thats where the knitted caps and gloves and things come from that you see some of them wearing. Some of the volunteers just sit in the waiting area and talk to you, and I'm thinking of becoming one myself.

[WhiteD3]

I was diagnosed with prostate cancer a few months ago. I keep it quiet from my larger family (wife and sons know) to protect my mental health.

Some of us just prefer to go about these things with little fuss.

[ramblingboy42]

...man my thoughts are with you......have you started your treatment yet?

[WhiteD3]

...man my thoughts are with you......have you started your treatment yet?

Not as yet. There are two options being considered, being laser or rip it out. Not a fan of the latter. I know it can be an unpopular thing to say these days but I'm waiting on expert advice.

[scarry]

My youngest Brother, has had 2 recent PSA tests,both high,next step is biopsy,they are saying.

Not enlarged,so one professional said to him just leave it and see what happens.

He is still deciding what to do.

If its anything like these BCC and SCC's i get,i would be getting the biopsy,IMHO,the earlier they get onto it the better.

[TasD90]

Scarry, get him to have a biopsy done. Early diagnosis is everything.

My prostate cancer was detected a year ago, "elevated" PSA from blood test. Cancer was slightly advanced

but still contained, no metastasis.

Had 39 doses of radiation and am on anti testosterone implants for 18 months. Radiation is a bit of a drag

but PSA has now gone from 26 to 0.1 so treatment is working. Sore muscles and feeling a bit tired are my

only side effects from the implants.

A number of my friends have had prostate removed and are suffering from incontinence but maybe there was

no choice.

I talk to all men in their 60's (I am 70) and am not embarrassed in the slightest especially if it saves

someone's life. No place for shyness when prostate is involved.

Peter

[TonyC]

I've had high PSA as long as I've been having it tested, 10 years or so.
Both my father and uncle have had prostate cancer, but at an age where it was not unexpected.
A few years back I got to visit the urologist for a consultation and check of the prostate, a little undignified but that's all, at the time we, GP Urologist and I made the decision to continue monitoring.
Earlier this year, it was decided the further investigation was needed, due to Covid I only had phone consultation with the urologist, who sent me off for a CT scan. The scan showed up something that need investigation so off for a biopsy, because I had a CT scan the urologist knew exactly were to aim the biopsy, the result, what the CT picked up is benign.
Big result is I now know, I'm clear, and we keep up the monitoring.

So folks,
Go see your GP,
Have an annual check up, with bloods,
DON'T PUT IT OFF

Tony

[WhiteD3]

Not as yet. There are two options being considered, being laser or rip it out. Not a fan of the latter. I know it can be an unpopular thing to say these days but I'm waiting on expert advice.

Just to clarify in case someone out there thinks they can ignore these things; I've been having annual blood tests for years and have had PSA included for the last 10 years.

Since the prognosis I've had 3 blood tests to monitor PSA, a biopsy, a CT scan and a PET scan. The latter was a relief as it found nothing other than the prostate cancer.

[Redtail]

In brief, my story ...
Have been checked for cholesterol and PSA annually since I turned 50, some 8 years ago.
PSA went up a little bit one year, from about 3.8 to 4.0. Not much, still in the "safe" zone. No symptoms.
However, my 'free PSA' percentage moved markedly, from 25% down to 15%, somehting like that.
GP says go get an MRI just to check.
MRI inconclusive, off you go to a urologist.
Questionnaire, digital exam (which is the old-fashioned way!), nothing.
But, to be sure, let's do a biopsy given family history of prostate cancer. (Dad's got it, but he's in his 80's at this point, and therefore not really an issue.)
The biopsy - or at least the after effects - is not pleasant.
Result shows cancer, early stages and contained.
Lots of research and discussions with urologist and a nurse advocate, weighting up the pros and cons for different treatments.
In my case, I went the full robotically-assisted laparoscopic prostatectomy.
All cancer removed, all nerves still intact.
That was 5 years ago.
Cancer free, everything works just like it used to.
I got lucky.
Don't be to afraid ask your doc, and talk to your mates about screening.
You can't die from embarrassment, but you can from prostate cancer.

[Scozzzy]

Just thought i would give my 2 bob’s worth. I fell out of my prime mover 2 months ago. Slipped on top step, broke both my wrists and cracked my head, needless to say i was given a full body scan and they found a large tumour in my bladder. That was cut out 2 weeks ago and now i have a year of immunotherapy and chemo. I am on a trial for one of the hospitals. It is 10 weeks of treatment then 10 months of monthly treatment.

I am obviously very concerned but to be honest i am happy to talk to people about it if they ask. It makes me feel a bit stronger about fighting it. I would never have found the tumour if i had not had the accident.

My thoughts now are to get a yearly CT full body scan as it can pick up stuff you never knew. I am nearly 60 so i am suggesting it is an age thing also. I wish i had got a scan earlier and found the bloody tumour but there you go. All the best everyone.

[Scozzzy]

It just goes to show that with all the tests you done they came back negative but the Urologist decided let’s go for the biopsy and that is what saved you. Just goes to show if you still don’t feel right about it, keep pushing, your gut instinct saved you.

I am glad you are fully recovered. Good on ya.

[RANDLOVER]

Just thought i would give my 2 bob’s worth. I fell out of my prime mover 2 months ago. Slipped on top step, broke both my wrists and cracked my head, needless to say i was given a full body scan and they found a large tumour in my bladder. That was cut out 2 weeks ago and now i have a year of immunotherapy and chemo. I am on a trial for one of the hospitals. It is 10 weeks of treatment then 10 months of monthly treatment.

I am obviously very concerned but to be honest i am happy to talk to people about it if they ask. It makes me feel a bit stronger about fighting it. I would never have found the tumour if i had not had the accident.

My thoughts now are to get a yearly CT full body scan as it can pick up stuff you never knew. I am nearly 60 so i am suggesting it is an age thing also. I wish i had got a scan earlier and found the bloody tumour but there you go. All the best everyone.

I've heard two similar stories, my neighbour had a mild heart attack and was sent for a scan before they installed stent/valve and they saw a dark spot on his kidney, turned out to be cancer so had one kidney removed.

A friend hurt his back also sent for scan, spot noticed in colon, cancer removed via keyhole surgery.

[BradC]

My dads brain lesions were spotted accidentally during a CT of his sinus. Complications of the Lung Cancer he was already being treated for, but that was found after a "that cough is probably viral but I'll just send you for a CT". If that CT had been 3 weeks later we'd be looking at a different prognosis.

[JimN]

I agree with being open about it. I found out about my bowel cancer after a colleagues husband died of bowel cancer, and I decided to get checked out rather than ignore what we're mild symptoms. Turns out it was bowel cancer, and I was now on the treadmill.
In my case it later spread to my lung, then later to my ribs next to my lung. So now I am missing bits in al of those 3 areas.
It all started with a conversation to wake me up.

[BMKal]

I never knew I had any problem with cancer. I have had a few heart issues over the years, including a couple of heart attacks and most recently, atrial fibrillation.
It was during an ultrasound check-up after my last bout of AF that the young girl operating the ultrasound noticed "something unusual" in the left kidney area. She contacted my doctor and got a request for CT scan, which was conducted about an hour later (I live just around the corner from the Hospital in Kalgoorlie).

The CT Scan identified a lump / growth the size and shape of a football where my left kidney should have been. Arrangements were made for me to get into a hospital in Perth, and less than a week later I was operated on and the "lump" removed. I have photos of it - a pretty grotesque looking thing - which has apparently been preserved and is used in one of the teaching hospitals / universities in Perth now. The remains of my left kidney was in the centre of this "lump". Biopsy results indicated that they had got all of the cancer and that I was in the clear.

Two years later during follow-up checks and scan and consultation with urologist, he observed another growth, this time on my liver. More scans etc and again down to Perth in a matter of days, where almost half my liver was removed. This was in April this year. Biopsy results again indicated "all clear" - but subsequent scans done locally suggest possibly enlarged lymph nodes. So I'm off down to Perth again in a couple of weeks for a PET Scan (can only do CT and MRI in Kalgoorlie - not set up for PET Scan). Following that scan, I already have appointments booked with Oncologist and Urologist specialists. I guess I will know more next month.

I stopped working in April this year (I had been working for a South Australian company developing an iron ore beneficiation plant and export facility at Port Augusta). They have recently asked me to do some more work for them - mainly home based but with occasional visits over there for meetings with design engineering companies etc. Will see what happens next month - I'm not really inclined to go back to work at the moment, partly because my health situation is likely to cause disruption to work activities - and I turn 66 a bit later this year anyway, so I reckon it's probably time to call it quits. For now, I have got stuck back into my woodwork hobby in my shed and I'm enjoying the time doing what I like to do most - though I do also like the challenges of what I have been doing for a living for years now.

[Saitch]

I never knew I had any problem with cancer. I have had a few heart issues over the years, including a couple of heart attacks and most recently, atrial fibrillation.
It was during an ultrasound check-up after my last bout of AF that the young girl operating the ultrasound noticed "something unusual" in the left kidney area. She contacted my doctor and got a request for CT scan, which was conducted about an hour later (I live just around the corner from the Hospital in Kalgoorlie).

The CT Scan identified a lump / growth the size and shape of a football where my left kidney should have been. Arrangements were made for me to get into a hospital in Perth, and less than a week later I was operated on and the "lump" removed. I have photos of it - a pretty grotesque looking thing - which has apparently been preserved and is used in one of the teaching hospitals / universities in Perth now. The remains of my left kidney was in the centre of this "lump". Biopsy results indicated that they had got all of the cancer and that I was in the clear.

Two years later during follow-up checks and scan and consultation with urologist, he observed another growth, this time on my liver. More scans etc and again down to Perth in a matter of days, where almost half my liver was removed. This was in April this year. Biopsy results again indicated "all clear" - but subsequent scans done locally suggest possibly enlarged lymph nodes. So I'm off down to Perth again in a couple of weeks for a PET Scan (can only do CT and MRI in Kalgoorlie - not set up for PET Scan). Following that scan, I already have appointments booked with Oncologist and Urologist specialists. I guess I will know more next month.

I stopped working in April this year (I had been working for a South Australian company developing an iron ore beneficiation plant and export facility at Port Augusta). They have recently asked me to do some more work for them - mainly home based but with occasional visits over there for meetings with design engineering companies etc. Will see what happens next month - I'm not really inclined to go back to work at the moment, partly because my health situation is likely to cause disruption to work activities - and I turn 66 a bit later this year anyway, so I reckon it's probably time to call it quits. For now, I have got stuck back into my woodwork hobby in my shed and I'm enjoying the time doing what I like to do most - though I do also like the challenges of what I have been doing for a living for years now.

Good luck with it all, mate! On a lighter note, there's not too many people who can claim that their kidney attends uni lectures. [thumbsupbig]

[JDNSW]

A few years ago I had a hernia operation - the surgeon wanted a scan so he knew in detail what he was dealing with. It covered most of the trunk. I mentioned it to my melanoma oncologist on the next checkup, and he was looking at it on his laptop within two minutes.

Fortunately, nothing was found.

[4bee]

A few years ago I had a hernia operation - the surgeon wanted a scan so he knew in detail what he was dealing with. It covered most of the trunk. I mentioned it to my melanoma oncologist on the next checkup, and he was looking at it on his laptop within two minutes.

Fortunately, nothing was found.



digital exam (which is the old-fashioned way!)



Not with a Laptop either. [bigrolf] By 'eck the urologist is as quick as Flash Gordon with his digit, ie. Bend> in out> job done, next, in my case.

Unfortunately I had the incontinence problem which drove me bonkers & still does, not to mention 'er indoors. It was suggested that I have a Urethral Sling fitted but that hasn't stopped the problem for now & I don't believe it will. In the meantime my man has quit his practice & now I am in the hands of a Specialist who seems to think that maybe surgery & complete removal may not have been the way to go. WOW! No Kid! It turns out my first bloke was the last in Adelaide to do it surgically (now he tells me [bigsad]) nowadays it is only done with the "TV Remote" Maybe the incontinence problem wouldn't have occurred. Anyway there is no going back now & I have to live with it.

The first Urologist claimed surgery would give him a chance to examine everything & he didn't recommend Remote at the time.
At the end of the day it was my decision & so I am stuck with it. Knowledge of the Pros & Cons didn't seem to be available.

PSA of late seems to be a tad erratic but I have another test come Feb 2023 & if still increasing I'm informed there are now non invasive treatments available so I'll see where that takes me. At 86 I may just say bugger it all. [bigrolf]

[scarry]

atrial fibrillation.

A bit off topic,but you gotta watch that AF,it put an end to my Mother.
I inherited it from her,but got it at an age,25yrs earlier than she did.

Had an Ablation 5 yrs ago,good so far.
Hoping its gone for good.

Anyway,good luck with it all.

[4bee]

A bit off topic,but you gotta watch that AF,it put an end to my Mother.
I inherited it from her,but got it at an age,25yrs earlier than she did.

Had an Ablation 5 yrs ago,good so far.
Hoping its gone for good.

Anyway,good luck with it all.


It really is a bit of a bastard Paul, innit?


We are doomed to deal with the cards that are dealt to us.

Not all bad here now, but 30 years ago I had Bowel Ca. "Oh ****, that's the end of me life" stuff which was the thinking back then but thank God diagnosis & treatment has improved since then, so still here after many Routine Colonoscopies. (SP?)

My old Dad of 49 died with Lymphoma & the treatment for that seemed horrendous especially from the "Ray" treatment (in it's infancy then) which burnt the poor bugger to buggery & he lost his voice to a whisper but that may have been the surgery I recall he had.

I still miss him even to day & that was nearly 60 years ago. Dads can have that effect.

And now my youngest Bruv is being treated for months for something "they" have not quite put their finger on it but each month it does seem more positive so fingers crossed for him.

They have had a shufti at his brain (but I told him that was a pointless exercise :Rolling:) but they did find summat, so who knows??

Maybe all this **** is simply hereditary?

[BradC]

My neighbour (one of 7 brothers and 2 sisters) was diagnosed and treated about 4 years ago. When he put a broadcast out to his brothers about the diagnosis his older brother said "Oh yes, I had that 2 years ago". Had he actually spoken about it, my neighbour would have had the test earlier, got earlier intervention and required a much less severe treatment.


Sorry to bring it up again (actually not sorry, get tested!). So my now aforementioned ex-neighbour is currently in Tamworth. One of his other brothers just died after a terrible decline. He had un-detected prostate cancer that was eventually found and treated, but unbeknownst to the powers that be (because he didn't ask to get tested for it) it had already spread to a kidney. From there it spread like wild fire and by the time they found it he was ****ed.

Get tested! Every year my GP says "Brad we should do some tests, what do you want to do?" My response is always "Do all of them! If you're taking any blood you may as well take as much as you need to do all the tests".

I know nobody gets out alive, but we in Australia have a socialist medical system that in general manages to treat the bad stuff (if you find it in time). Take advantage of it. Get tested! Please.

[Tins]

Get tested? Indeed. My late wife and I avoided the doctor, unless we needed a cert. Had she been tested, earlier, they would have found that she had Hep C. There are no symptoms, until it's too late and the liver gives up. It was not a good time. Since then I have regular blood tests etc.

But, it still slips through. I have mentioned here (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/300389-men-dont-get-told.html) how I discovered my illness, but the short version is I fell and fractured my T6 vertebrae, which hurt btw, and had many subsequent scans. I had a follow up twelve months later, and a shadow was noticed, lung area. So, of for another scan. No shadow, but a suspicious lump was found. Sure enough, I could feel it when I became aware of it. But I highly doubt I would have discovered it on my own, at least not in time. Very aggressive tumour, and my feet didn't touch the ground.

You make a very good point about talking, Brad. It's why I started my thread in the first place, and the previous one about my wife. Men aren't good at it, unless, as Ramblingboy said, they meet others in the same boat. In my case that doesn't happen, because 99% of people with breast cancer are women. But I have had a fair amount of time with a psychologist, which began as grief counselling, and continues today to deal with other stuff, too, such as ADHD. In counselling, the whole thing revolves around talking, bringing whatever into the open, exposing it to the light. I have taken this into the rest of my life, and have become an open book. I'll talk about anything. It is so healing it's brilliant. And, I should add, my wife would not recognise me now, because the only time I used to talk was with a glass in my hand, and even then I probably didn't make sense.

With PC, one of the treatments they use is hormone blockers. Same for my form of BC. Speaking of Mister Floppy. In my case they used quite a lot. I post this bit as a warning. It's not too common, but these drugs are known to cause depression. Coupled with the radiotherapy fatigue, they caused in me "passive suicidal ideation". Bloody nearly died, and was being monitored in case it became active. If you find yourself on drugs like Letrozole and/or Zoladex it's vital that you and those around you are vigilant. I don't have anyone here, but I do have brilliant health care pros. I now do not take any anti cancer drugs. I prefer to take my chances with the cancer returning. I do not advocate that others do this, but I do say that each person has the choice. I was on a fast moving treadmill of treatments until I became ill with depression. after this I decided to chart my own course, and found that the oncologists actually supported my decision. I'd rather five years of normality than ten. on those drugs. Some folk tolerate them. I do not. And talking also means asking questions.

So far I'm clean of any of the other usual suspects, but trust me, they won't slip by me like the BC nearly did. Because men don't talk, I had no idea that we could get BC. These days I tell everyone I meet. So what if they're bored? It might sink in. Mastectomies suck. I imagine prostate removal would also suck.

I'm glad this thread resurfaced. I have been sort of invited to apply to be an ambassador for the Men's Breast Cancer Global Alliance. I wasn't sure, but I think I am now. First thing to change that. It isn't men's breast cancer, it is simply breast cancer, just the same as the girls get, and just as lethal.

[BradC]

Hey John,

I kinda figured you'd weigh in and I'm glad you did. I also re-read the thread from end to end before I posted.

This thread was started based on a preventable death that was prevented. A couple of years later resurrected based on a preventable death that wasn't prevented because "real men don't talk about that stuff".

I think I'd rather be a girly and survive thanks.

[Tins]

Hey John,

I kinda figured you'd weigh in and I'm glad you did. I also re-read the thread from end to end before I posted.

This thread was started based on a preventable death that was prevented. A couple of years later resurrected based on a preventable death that wasn't prevented because "real men don't talk about that stuff".

I think I'd rather be a girly and survive thanks.

As would I. I came to believe that it is stronger to actually talk, that stoicism is for mugs. What I find amazing is how, once the topic is broached, that a lot of men open up, albeit briefly. But it took me a while to find anyone I could talk to about my cancer. Obviously most of those with it are women, and I find that it's them who won't talk to me. It's a woman's disease, after all. I began to wonder if I was the only bloke to get it, and nobody could point me to a group. I found one though. On FB of course. I detest FB, but I need it. The group is mostly US based, and there's only a couple of hundred of us, but hey. Guys turn up, and like me, are really pleased to find it. But, there is still a lot of stigma attached, mostly due to, you guessed it, men not wanting to talk about it, and women trying to claim it. I need to stress, many women I speak to are happy to talk about it, especially if I start the conversation by telling them to tell their partner, brother, dad etc that it happens.

The disturbing part, at least to me, is how many people, men and women, just get on the medical treadmill and don't think their journey is a personal one, and they have choices. I was due to begin chemo on 23/12/2024. I got on to a trial where they want to see if chemo should be the default. I was randomly selected out of the control group. They then told me that I did not have to have chemo. YAY! But, when the drugs nearly caused me to take my own life I thought, once they agreed that I should pause them, I found myself thinking "what else don't i have to do?" Quite liberating really. Of course, this should be judged on a case by case basis. But I am glad I could realise that it's me, and my life, and I don't have to jump through hoops I don't want to. This is NOT something that is clear on first diagnosis.

Even though I have had two siblings die of cancer, one who was 9yo, first born, I cannot imagine the cost to you and your wife. I do know that my folks, Dad especially, were terribly affected by it. And Dad was as stoic as they come, and we all paid. Not blaming him, although god knows I used to, but he didn't know any different because he was born in Victorian times, stiff upper lip, old chap. He wouldn't talk, and therefore Mum couldn't.

I really appreciate this thread. I hadn't seen it before. And I am especially grateful to Dave ( Inc ) and all of Aulro for allowing threads like these. After all, at a guess I'd say that over 90% of us are blokes.

[Tins]

The title of this thread.... The conversation should not be awkward. It should be natural. But some inhibitions are difficult to break through. But we must.

[Saitch]

Some people are different. I know a woman who had triple x rated cancer and she was quite happy to just have the people who needed to know, be in the know. No support groups, faecesbook, head scarf or car stickers for her. I had a mate of 52 years, who I would meet, every three weeks at an Oncology unit. He too, was quite prepared to accept his fate, in a quiet and gentlemanly manner. We buried him this year. The woman is going well, after twelve months of hell.

Discussion and social interaction is obviously a great assistance for many, but it's not for everyone.

[RANDLOVER]

Get tested? Indeed. My late wife and I avoided the doctor, unless we needed a cert. Had she been tested, earlier, they would have found that she had Hep C. There are no symptoms, until it's too late and the liver gives up. It was not a good time. Since then I have regular blood tests etc.

But, it still slips through. I have mentioned here (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/300389-men-dont-get-told.html) how I discovered my illness, but the short version is I fell and fractured my T6 vertebrae, which hurt btw, and had many subsequent scans. I had a follow up twelve months later, and a shadow was noticed, lung area. So, of for another scan. No shadow, but a suspicious lump was found. Sure enough, I could feel it when I became aware of it. But I highly doubt I would have discovered it on my own, at least not in time. Very aggressive tumour, and my feet didn't touch the ground.......

You never know what is ticking away inside, my neighbour had a mild heart attack and while doing the scan for the stent they found a shadow on his kidney, so that had to come out. I suppose a blood or kidney function test would've found it beforehand, so worth doing blood and urine tests if you're going to the pathologist anyway.

[Tins]

Some people are different. I know a woman who had triple x rated cancer and she was quite happy to just have the people who needed to know, be in the know. No support groups, faecesbook, head scarf or car stickers for her. I had a mate of 52 years, who I would meet, every three weeks at an Oncology unit. He too, was quite prepared to accept his fate, in a quiet and gentlemanly manner. We buried him this year. The woman is going well, after twelve months of hell.

Discussion and social interaction is obviously a great assistance for many, but it's not for everyone.

Which is why I call it a personal journey, Steve. When it comes to decision time, only I can make mine. It can be a difficult place. I love talking about it, but I get that I only speak for me. I think what I'm trying to say is that it doesn't hurt to talk about it, because people may learn from that, but I totally respect that what I want isn't for everybody.

As for accepting fate, well Jan showed me the way there, and I have already accepted mine, whatever it turns out to be.

[BradC]

Discussion and social interaction is obviously a great assistance for many, but it's not for everyone.

No. I've accepted that. On the other hand, if even the discussion in the background is enough for someone to ask their GP for that other blood panel and it saves a life (or makes their eventual death less painful and drawn out). Well, maybe I think it's worth it.

So I'll keep bringing it up.

[Tins]

No. I've accepted that. On the other hand, if even the discussion in the background is enough for someone to ask their GP for that other blood panel and it saves a life (or makes their eventual death less painful and drawn out). Well, maybe I think it's worth it.

So I'll keep bringing it up.

As will I. I will try not to be boorish about it, and if people aren't comfortable with it, subject closed. The group I joined was for me a support through the unusual diagnosis I got. Now I am connected with another group who see their role as raising awareness. After all, how many blokes do you know who self examine their breasts? We have exactly the same tissue and glands etc as the girls do, although I'm the first to admit that mine aren't as attractive as Jan's were. If I hadn't gone out into the Bellthorpe bush with Ian and Rob, and got me pumpkin hung up on a rock ( in my defence, I am used to driving Discos, where the front and rear are in a line. OKA isn't like that ) and had to get in the back and fallen on my way out then there's a fair chance I would not be here now, typing this. I had simply no idea, and I have been told that if my BC hadn't been detected for another few months then my treatment would have been palliative.

Like Brad, I'll keep bringing it up, and I'll keep updating my own thread. I won't try to force people to read it, but I hope they do, at least once.

Tom ( grey_ghost ) has a sign on his 101, if he still has it. It reads "One life. Live it." I always thought it was trite. I no longer do. I work daily to combat my ADHD so I can implement it in whatever time I have left. Jan taught me not to fear death, but I still think it's to be avoided for as long as possible. Well, as long as it's worth it. I looked after Mum for around five years when she was bedridden. She nearly made 103, but she didn't want to, every day stuck in bed with people wiping her bum. I don't want that either.

In the last 14 months I have been sliced, diced, poked and prodded and had more scans than I can remember. I've also been on IV antibiotics, been irradiated 30 times, and had about a hundred blood tests. It's tapering down now, and I'm grateful for that. But I'm even more grateful that I had it all in the first place. I lost about a year of mobility, and still have issues, but none of the tests or scans hurt, and cost little ( nothing, in my case ), and they can save your life. How long for? Nobody knows, which is why the choice to stop taking the anti cancer drugs was an easy one for me. Quality before quantity.

I hope someone gains something from what I say, but nobody has to listen, I absolutely respect that.

[Meccles]

I was diagnosed with metatastic prostate cancer in June with a tumor on prostate. Symptom free. Get medicals every year for work really thorough covers everything - except psa.
Mine had gone from ok ( a few years ago) to off the charts. Was told that without treatment - 12-18 months and shes over red rover.
Got a gun urologist and same wrt to oncologist at Mater Cancer Care centre. On hormone therapy/chemo- done 5 out of 6 sessions. And oral inhibitors will be for life.
PSA has gone from off the charts 350 to 0.1.
I consider it a bit of a nuisance. The chemo has had an impact but am listening to my body if tired I stop. Back at the gym when able. The volunteers at the hospitals do amazing work!

[Tins]

Symptom free is the killer. Jan showed none until it was far, far too late. I had none either, and it was only an unrelated injury that allowed it to be detected. I was having regular blood tests because I decided to, after watching what happened to Jan. But either they weren’t specific enough or my cancer was not detectable that way. But, in my case , a simple self examination would have found it way earlier than I actually did. I might have avoided the three surgeries and ensuing difficulties. And, like others, my projected life expectancy undetected, well it probably would have expired by now.

[Tins]

Hope the censors pass this one....[biggrin]

195194

[Tins]

I might have mentioned that one of the things I have done with regards to my health, bot physical and mental, is to join a local choir. No big productions or anything, and the Symphony Chorus has little to worry about, but it's fun. I'm no Robert Plant, either, but I could always sing when younger. I blocked it for som reason, but now I've started again I actually think I've found something I'm meant to be doing. When I first went I hid up the back, just like school. But, after I went through that ****ing awful drug related depression I have climbed out of the hole, and now I'm up front, and occasionally solo. Wow. I would not have soloed at gunpoint before.

Point of this is last weekend we sang at a local market. One of our members, who we haven't seen for months, turned up. Bloke is a nut, so he fits right in. Well, we're lucky to have him, because he's been in hospital for ages, fighting myocarditis ( not speculating on that one, not here ). He lost nearly 20 kgs. But what he found was a purpose He and I have had similar journeys to get to here, and now he understands what I mean, about how joining the choir went some way towards saving my life. I wanted to get back to it, when I didn't want to even wake up most days.

Never really had a purpose before, ADHD saw to that. But as the cliché goes, it's never too late.

Illness can be a great leveller. Or any crisis, really. You never know who you really are until you face one. Well, I sure didn't. For those reading this who have or are facing a crisis of some type, look hard, because you will find something to take away from it. Grief began my journey to here. I wish I hadn't had it, but I didn't get a choice. I'm glad I survived it and the alcohol that followed. I never thought I would have a pretty choir leader introduce me as "wonderful". She's dumb, of course, and she's also married[bigsad]. Oh well.

It's good to be alive, finally.

[Tins]

Speaking of singing, I posted a video on the Interesting and funny thread, John Farnham. He has gone through his own dramas, oral cancer probably from smoking, especially cigars. Just shows that you can use it and still lose it. And eventually we lose everything.

Get tested. It hurts far less than the alternative.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

I spoke to my doctor about this, as I have already outlived my mother and it will only be a few years till I outlive my father, both died of cancer of one sort or another, so I asked if I should get an all over body scan and he said no, but gave me a script for a full blood test. I ended up having that and a urine sample tested when I had a bad reaction to the covid booster shot, and it is amazing all the info they can get from the tests, so I think I am going to get one every year. The blood test also includes the PSA test for prostate cancer.
I remember hearing about this somewhere.. can't remember where. Basically every test has a false positive rate. If they just tested everyone for everything there would be a lot of false positives.

I beleive some of the wealthy in the US are known to have all the checks every year. The downside is you might be treated for something you don't have.

[Tins]

The downside is you might be treated for something you don't have.

I agree. But the upside is you can make an informed decision, and get multiple opinions.

It was easy for me. They discovered a suspicious mass, which I could then feel. 16mm, so not tiny, but I had never felt it before.

But our medical system is light years ahead of the US. They have same amazing people, but their system is to take your money, if you have any that is, or better still insurance. I have spoken with guys over there who have had double mastectomies just because. I wasn't even given the option. "Nothing wrong with the other one, we'll leave it alone".

My position on something a few years back which I won't mention would show what I think of being treated for something I didn't have and didn't get. And my choice more recently is to have no further treatment, which shows that it IS my choice. And it will remain mine, until a test shows the cancer has returned, and then I'll make another one. I gang on about this because when I was diagnosed I didn't think I had one. There were hoops, and I jumped.But I didn't have to. Sure, I would have been stupid to refuse the surgery, but I could have.

[scarry]

Get tested. It hurts far less than the alternative.

Once a year for me full test for everything,whatever that is.Been having them for the last decade.

Due to go now,just been super busy,but it will happen next week,wish me luck.

Over the years they have found things which had to be sorted,last thing a year ago,was something that was not quite right in my blood.They monitored that with monthly tests,and now it seems to have settled down thankfully,but needs another special test every 6 months.

Calcium score is also another test that should be done,depending.

[Tins]

Got my results today.Nothing to report except vitamin B12 deficiency, and high cholesterol, which is genetic and I don't give a stuff about, no matter how much the pretty doctor begs me to take statins.

Oncology tests wait until the new year. I will definitely have those, be a mug if I didn't. I'll cross that bridge....

[Saitch]

Got my results today.Nothing to report except vitamin B12 deficiency, and high cholesterol, which is genetic and I don't give a stuff about, no matter how much the pretty doctor begs me to take statins.


The goal posts keep moving on this. I'm more than a little bit cynical about it as, the lower the 'Bad Level', the more lucrative the market for 'Pharmaceutical Treatments'.
Good to see the 'Nothing' in your report, JT.

[RANDLOVER]

Never fear, I won't be rushing into anything, I'll be getting a 2nd and maybe 3rd opinion.

[Tins]

The goal posts keep moving on this. I'm more than a little bit cynical about it as, the lower the 'Bad Level', the more lucrative the market for 'Pharmaceutical Treatments'.
Good to see the 'Nothing' in your report, JT.

I agree. Those statins ain't cheap... well, they are for me but I did pay taxes same as most people. Doc knows when to pick her battles, and she ain't going to die on that particular hill.

Steve, I'm feeling better than I have in years. I meant what I said about crises. You have to learn from them or they keep on coming, bigger every time. Not saying I've learnt enough to stop them, but I know a bit more about how to cope.

[101RRS]

Got my results today.Nothing to report except vitamin B12 deficiency, and high cholesterol, which is genetic and I don't give a stuff about, no matter how much the pretty doctor begs me to take statins.

You quite rightly bang on about getting your titties checked, yet you ignore high cholesterol and taking statins - you have rocks in your head.

This time last year I was laying on an operating table with my chest open wide, my heart stopped with the surgeon pulling my heart out of my body as far as he could so he could gain access the rear of the heart to make a major incision through to the interior. As well as the internal operation he did a a double bypass on the widow maker artery on the left side.

My cholesterol was always normal but the mix was bad - not enough good cholesterol (HDL) and too much bad cholesterol (LDL) and triglycerides too high. I paid the price - no physical symptoms but issues - most likely would have died by now.

All cholesterols are now within normal range thanks to STATINs - don't believe the nonsense you see and hear - I have discussed with my GP, my cardiologist and my cardio surgeon - they all agree take the statins.

Garry

[Tins]

You quite rightly bang on about getting your titties checked, yet you ignore high cholesterol and taking statins - you have rocks in your head.

This time last year I was laying on an operating table with my chest open wide, my heart stopped with the surgeon pulling my heart out of my body as far as he could so he could gain access the rear of the heart to make a major incision through to the interior. As well as the internal operation he did a a double bypass on the widow maker artery on the left side.


Garry

Friend of mine was in that same position a few years back. Triple. He had a bit of history, with a series of blockages of his carotid, causing mini strokes. His situation now is that one of the repairs is failing and they want him to go back in. He has flatly refused. Reckons he's had a good life. Take his chances going forward.

I understand his decision, just as I understand what you say. My decision is that I will take my chances. I am in no way clear of the BC, and that is my focus. I'm taking 60mg of Fluoxetine daily to prevent another depression event I would likely not survive. I am taking 50mg of Vyvanse daily to help cope with ADHD. Last year they told me I had blood sugar levels that put me in the high risk category for pre diabetes. I may have, as you say, rocks in my head. Certainly been told that before. But I too have to pick my battles. I have beaten the blood sugar thing. Levels are now normal. I will get off the Vyvanse at some point. ADHD never goes, but with strategies I am working on I will be able to live with it. Prozac ( Fluoxetine ) I may take for a long time, and certainly won't stop unless supervised. Passive suicidal ideation is no joke, and I NEVER want to go back there. Whether I would or not is not a debate I'm prepared to have right now.

My BP is on the low side of average, always has been. There is no history of hypertension in my family, even though the cholesterol thing is genetic, not dietary. I was taking statins before but I caught bigger fish I needed to fry. In the last nine months I have taken Letrozole, had Zoladex implants, taken Tamoxifem, Abemaciclib ( a form of chemo ), any number of pain killers. Vyvanse is an amphetamine. I will revisit the statin thing later.

I hope you are recovering well, Garry. I didn't see my friend for maybe two years, as he retreated for a while. Don't blame him. I wish you a long life. I'm 72, and of course have zero idea of what the future may hold, or how long I will be in it. If they told me I needed open heart surgery I could possibly say no. I can't predict. It's a thin line we walk. I need my system to heal from what has happened to it. Statins may play a role in that later, if there is a later.

[101RRS]

Well, John I agree that you have to fight the battles at hand and you do seem to be coping well with that, but I would encourage you to take the one statin tab a day to lower your cholesterol. For concession holders is just over $7 for a month's worth.

You mentioned diabetes - well I have had that for 42 years and is probably that, as well as the sausages and pastries that has caused me to have vascular disease. So make sure you keep your sugars in check.

You are the same age as me and have given great advice with respect to checking for male breast cancer. Apply that great advice for other health conditions you may have.[thumbsupbig]

Good luck - and thanks for raising these very important issues.

Garry

[Tins]

I miss sausages and pastries. And a bunch of other things as well, except alcohol. But I wanted to give my liver a present when I gave up my alcohol addiction. I have taken this further now and simply don’t eat anything that I have to read the labels on. Makes eating out difficult. But I reckon that the crap they put in “food “ and advertise the bejeesus out of is killing us softly with obesity and cancer. Seed oils, starches etc all cause insulin resistance.
I have lost 25kg, which has the added benefit of freeing me of lower back and knee pain. Obviously my diet must be lacking B12, but I can adjust for that.
Lovely doctor doesn’t mention cholesterol anymore. If I suggested going back on statins she would probably throw a party.

[Tins]

https://youtu.be/oEl1YABvfx0?si=6ad2yBVbLnhtgwg0

[Slunnie]

https://youtu.be/oEl1YABvfx0?si=6ad2yBVbLnhtgwg0


This is bang on right! Well, I have thought for a long time it is .

My philosopohy has always been to not count calories (Calories in/out) or anything like, just eat real food, and similarly that Protein and vegies is the ticket over carbs.

I've had 2 things that have really struck me:

1. Dr Tim Noakes and his research on high fat low carb diets
2. Seeing the difference between people in developing countries who live on only fresh real food, compared to their neighbours in developed countries. I was really stuck and the contrast between the Burmese/Myanmar people and the Thai people.

As an athlete, it is also an effort to get in the amount of protein that your body ideally needs, and that 1.6 end is where you want to be. Its a real protein diet focus.

The nutritionist that I've seen said, the most perfect meal you can have is the good old meat and 3 Veg.

[Redback]

There is no cure for cancer, be it diet, or life style!!!

[Tins]

There is no cure for cancer, be it diet, or life style!!!

Death is the only cure. But it can be mitigated or sent into remission. And it can probably be prevented with a proper diet. Like everything, there are exceptions, but for me it's worth the effort to try. I'm healthier now at 72 than I was at 62. Cancer may kill me, but I'm feeling a whole lot better while I wait.

[Tins]

This is bang on right! Well, I have thought for a long time it is

As have I, although I haven't always practiced it. Certainly not in the drinking days. But I chose to look at it. And now I'm almost forced to pay attention.




The nutritionist that I've seen said, the most perfect meal you can have is the good old meat and 3 Veg

Yep. And I allow myself a spud or two. Carbs, sure, but I can't give up everything[bigsad]. Sadly, I also have to give up chicken and pork. The growth hormones are a killer for me now, and I sure can't afford organic... All red meat must be grass fed, because the grain they feed them are worse than seed oil. And If I have to read the fine print I won't eat it, whatever it is.

But this new thing is going to upset a lot of Yanks..... The obese ones, probably.

[Slunnie]

As have I, although I haven't always practiced it. Certainly not in the drinking days. But I chose to look at it. And now I'm almost forced to pay attention.





Yep. And I allow myself a spud or two. Carbs, sure, but I can't give up everything[bigsad]. Sadly, I also have to give up chicken and pork. The growth hormones are a killer for me now, and I sure can't afford organic... All red meat must be grass fed, because the grain they feed them are worse than seed oil. And If I have to read the fine print I won't eat it, whatever it is.

But this new thing is going to upset a lot of Yanks..... The obese ones, probably.

For those without contributing factors, spuds are fine when you eat what is actually a spud and are sensible about it.

That was the other thing she said, spuds etc are carbs, pumpkin is a "quasi" carb so treat it as a half carb, and other veggies you've got a free ticket on and can eat until the cows come home.

Yeah, the average yank couldn't be further from being a point of reference.

[Slunnie]

Death is the only cure. But it can be mitigated or sent into remission. And it can probably be prevented with a proper diet. Like everything, there are exceptions, but for me it's worth the effort to try. I'm healthier now at 72 than I was at 62. Cancer may kill me, but I'm feeling a whole lot better while I wait.

The medical community seem to agree that there are environmental factors that can contribute to risk of cancer in many cases, and so from that perspective it's probably good practice to live the healthiest life that we know how.

[Tins]

The medical community seem to agree that there are environmental factors that can contribute to risk of cancer in many cases, and so from that perspective it's probably good practice to live the healthiest life that we know how.

I have no evidence, and no way of getting it, but I am pretty sure my alcoholism, and stress, were a major contributor for me. There is no history of BC in my family, well at least until now, and I have no genetic markers. But alcohol, and a blotting paper diet, will raise sugar levels no problem, And cancer feeds on sugar.

[Tins]

I do NOT miss fast "food", that's for sure.

[scarry]

The medical community seem to agree that there are environmental factors that can contribute to risk of cancer in many cases, and so from that perspective it's probably good practice to live the healthiest life that we know how.

Yes that is correct,but exercise is also very important,one must stay active.

I do at least 10,000 steps a day,some days close to 15,000,including some jogging.

Whatever suits,everyone is different,but staying active is certainly very important,particularly as one ages.

[shack]

As have I, although I haven't always practiced it. Certainly not in the drinking days. But I chose to look at it. And now I'm almost forced to pay attention.





Yep. And I allow myself a spud or two. Carbs, sure, but I can't give up everything[bigsad]. Sadly, I also have to give up chicken and pork. The growth hormones are a killer for me now, and I sure can't afford organic... All red meat must be grass fed, because the grain they feed them are worse than seed oil. And If I have to read the fine print I won't eat it, whatever it is.

But this new thing is going to upset a lot of Yanks..... The obese ones, probably.

I'm a farmer and I'm unaware of there being growth hormones in chicken and pork, but I don't produce them, I'm not saying there isn't any, I'm just unaware of it.

There's none in anything we produce.

I actually thought they were banned many years ago, certainly on some things anyway.

I strongly doubt that many genuinely obese people take much notice of the recommended diet.

A number of the ones I've known certainly don't, but maybe my sample size is too small...?

[Tins]

I'm a farmer and I'm unaware of there being growth hormones in chicken and pork, but I don't produce them, I'm not saying there isn't any, I'm just unaware of it.

There's none in anything we produce.

I actually thought they were banned many years ago, certainly on some things anyway.

I strongly doubt that many genuinely obese people take much notice of the recommended diet.

A number of the ones I've known certainly don't, but maybe my sample size is too small...?

Thanks, James. I'm never sure about the info, so I prefer not to risk it. Although I do eat eggs. But supermarket chooks sure look bigger than the ones we had in the back, years ago. I still avoid anything grain fed, which doesn't help when choosing. But I like lamb and beef so that's ok. I'm 72, and I'm back down to the weight I was at 30, 84kg from 115. Although a fair amount of that is probably from all the blood they take and me right boob[bigrolf]