Clunk in front - suspecting a wheel bearing

[Bananas]

Hello
I'm planning to replace the front wheel bearing hub assemblies on my 2011 D4 on Saturday and I'm hoping someone can check my diagnosis.

I have a clunk coming from the front end and as far as I can tell, from the drivers side.

The clunk happens when driving foreword or backward. It happens when turning the wheel either way or when going over uneven ground and driving straight ahead. But it only when there is some side to side body roll involved in the turn or when going over the bumps.

It does not happen when turning left or right nice and smoothly on an even surface (so your coffee won't spill) nor does it happen when hitting a speed bump for example square on. It does not happen turning the wheel from lock to lock with the vehicle stationary.

It can be a single clunk or it could be 2 or 3 clunks and this seems to be linked to the nature of the body roll. If the coffee is sloshing out left and right because the car is bouncing all over the place, there will be multiple clunks. If the coffee just spills out of one side of the cup, there will be 1 clunk followed by another when the coffee returns to the centre of the cup.

I have checked the usual suspects and I initially imagined to be a tie rod end or ends. But I do not feel anything through the steering, nor can I move any of the ball joints. Same goes for the anti roll bar and links or lower control arm. Bushes and ball joints all seem to be solid.

The only thing I can find that seems abnormal when pushing and pulling on things with the car stationary and all 4 wheels on the ground is that I have some slight play in the RHS wheel when I grip it at the top and pull and push and get the car to sway. Once it moving enough I feel the clunks though my thumbs on the rim and I hear it as well.

Twisting the wheel with hands at 3 and 9 o'clock also reveals a very small amount of play. But this takes some curry to move it enough to feel the slightest clunk.

With the wheel off the ground and hands at 12 and 6 o'clock, it would be easy not to notice the clunking but it's there if you pay attention.

Without the wheel on the hub feels solid and even using the rotor for purchase it's not possible to get the cluck happening by hand.

The LHS is solid in all of these tests. No play as all.

So I'm fairly convinced I need a new bearing in the RHS at very least. It doesn't appear as bad or as obvious as I have seen in a view YouTubes, but since everything else seems OK it's my leading suspect.


Do you think I'm on the right track?

Thanks!

[PerthDisco]

Hello
I'm planning to replace the front wheel bearing hub assemblies on my 2011 D4 on Saturday and I'm hoping someone can check my diagnosis.

I have a clunk coming from the front end and as far as I can tell, from the drivers side.

The clunk happens when driving foreword or backward. It happens when turning the wheel either way or when going over uneven ground and driving straight ahead. But it only when there is some side to side body roll involved in the turn or when going over the bumps.

It does not happen when turning left or right nice and smoothly on an even surface (so your coffee won't spill) nor does it happen when hitting a speed bump for example square on. It does not happen turning the wheel from lock to lock with the vehicle stationary.

It can be a single clunk or it could be 2 or 3 clunks and this seems to be linked to the nature of the body roll. If the coffee is sloshing out left and right because the car is bouncing all over the place, there will be multiple clunks. If the coffee just spills out of one side of the cup, there will be 1 clunk followed by another when the coffee returns to the centre of the cup.

I have checked the usual suspects and I initially imagined to be a tie rod end or ends. But I do not feel anything through the steering, nor can I move any of the ball joints. Same goes for the anti roll bar and links or lower control arm. Bushes and ball joints all seem to be solid.

The only thing I can find that seems abnormal when pushing and pulling on things with the car stationary and all 4 wheels on the ground is that I have some slight play in the RHS wheel when I grip it at the top and pull and push and get the car to sway. Once it moving enough I feel the clunks though my thumbs on the rim and I hear it as well.

Twisting the wheel with hands at 3 and 9 o'clock also reveals a very small amount of play. But this takes some curry to move it enough to feel the slightest clunk.

With the wheel off the ground and hands at 12 and 6 o'clock, it would be easy not to notice the clunking but it's there if you pay attention.

Without the wheel on the hub feels solid and even using the rotor for purchase it's not possible to get the cluck happening by hand.

The LHS is solid in all of these tests. No play as all.

So I'm fairly convinced I need a new bearing in the RHS at very least. It doesn't appear as bad or as obvious as I have seen in a view YouTubes, but since everything else seems OK it's my leading suspect.


Do you think I'm on the right track?

Thanks!

Lower Control Arms are 100% guaranteed to wear out every 80-100k kms. You have described that problem perfectly.

A dud wheel bearing presents as a grinding noise.

[Bananas]

That's awesome thanks very much!
It would have been disappointing to change the bearings and not to solve the issue.

Back to YouTube...

[Bananas]

Replacing the lower control arms looks like a bit more of a commitment for a one-day-must-be-back-on-the-road type job. Plus there's the need for a wheel alignment. [bigwhistle]

This video makes it look easy enough: Land Rover LR4 Front Lower Control Arm Replacement - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POr4mwSveIY)
This video makes it look like it might not be so easy afterall: 2016 Land Rover LR4 - Replace Lower Front Control Arms and Calibrate Ride Height - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBPYF1R2Se0)

My local-ish LR spares (TR Spares) has genuine and non genuine ones in stock. I'll do some more rocking tomorrow to see if I can pinpoint the clunking for sure.

I'll see how I feel tomorrow. It might end up being better to be the xmas holiday job in a couple of weeks.

What are your thoughts on just replacing the bushes instead of the whole arm? I have a press at work.

Thanks again PerthDisco for the tip.

[loanrangie]

Replacing the lower control arms looks like a bit more of a commitment for a one-day-must-be-back-on-the-road type job. Plus there's the need for a wheel alignment. [bigwhistle]

This video makes it look easy enough: Land Rover LR4 Front Lower Control Arm Replacement - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POr4mwSveIY)
This video makes it look like it might not be so easy afterall: 2016 Land Rover LR4 - Replace Lower Front Control Arms and Calibrate Ride Height - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBPYF1R2Se0)

My local-ish LR spares (TR Spares) has genuine and non genuine ones in stock. I'll do some more rocking tomorrow to see if I can pinpoint the clunking for sure.

I'll see how I feel tomorrow. It might end up being better to be the xmas holiday job in a couple of weeks.

What are your thoughts on just replacing the bushes instead of the whole arm? I have a press at work.

Thanks again PerthDisco for the tip.

Ive done just the bushes without using a press so its doable, i marked the camber washer locations and didn't even need an alignment afterwards.
Generally the rear bush wears first as they are fluid filled so split, leak then de laminate from the metal, if left too long the fronts take the brunt and follow suit.

[Bananas]

Thanks loanrangie

I'm thinking that since the bushes appear to be a semi consumable part it might be good to learn how to do it now so I know what I'm in for again in a few years. Replacing the whole arm sounds like it's not really required if there is no other damage. And $500 for a new arm vs about $170 for new bushes and a ball joint if it's on the nose too is a fairly compelling reason to give it a go. Add a reciprocating saw and blade in the budget and I'd still be ahead.

[loanrangie]

Thanks loanrangie

I'm thinking that since the bushes appear to be a semi consumable part it might be good to learn how to do it now so I know what I'm in for again in a few years. Replacing the whole arm sounds like it's not really required if there is no other damage. And $500 for a new arm vs about $170 for new bushes and a ball joint if it's on the nose too is a fairly compelling reason to give it a go. Add a reciprocating saw and blade in the budget and I'd still be ahead.

I bought a press kit so i could replace all or any bushes myself, need a few other items to make it work but it does the job.
My arms had been replaced before so i just undid the bolts and dropped the arm down and replaced the bushes without removing them from the ball joint end.

[Porker]

Can I ask where you purchased your press kit from please? Thanks.

[loanrangie]

Can I ask where you purchased your press kit from please? Thanks.Same kit is sold on various sites like eBay and Amazon, I can't remember off the top of my head which site I got it from but a search on the forum should bring up my original post.

[Bananas]

With the stone guard plates off I've isolated where the noise is coming from. It's behind the LHS bracket that attaches the sway bar to the crossmember of the frame. The bush has partly extruded out. Could the sway bar be actually broken behind this bracket?

I only have weaklings to help this morning which actually lead to an interesting discovery. They could not push and pull on the tyre enough to get body swaying to the clunk to happen so I rigged up a lever under the frame at about the front jack point. I got the weaklings to bounce on this to get the car to jump around. Interestingly, no noise. Even though the lever is bouncing the car from the side and inducing some body roll, the roll component was not enough to make the clunk. Most of the bounce was up and down.

The only way I could get the clunk was to open both driver doors and get my helpers to sway the car by pushing up into the door frames until they complained too much. The body really needed to get rolling a good few degrees this way and that before the clunk would happen.

I have a stronger helper arriving after lunch [thumbsupbig]

[PerthDisco]

If you really want to investigate mount a go pro underneath and drive around over various bumps and applying brakes sharply. Focus on area around the rear mount of the LCA is probably moving excessively under load.

[Bananas]

Thanks PerthDisco
You saved me quite a bit of money and frustration. I would have had nice new front wheel bearings but I would have still had the clunk. [biggrin]

I got the go pro out and was able to see what I needed to see with it on the ground and rolling the body. Clunk, clunk, clunk!

I took the offending sway bar bush out and end for ended it and took it for a spin on uneven road, off road and doing all the things I know would make it clunk for sure. No clunks. Silence. Not even a hint of a clunk. What a beautiful sound!

There is an aluminium ring pressed on to the sway bar just inboard of the bush and clamp. There is about 3 mm clearance between this ring and the crossmember. The deformed bush allowed this amount of movement fore and aft causing the ring to hit the crossmember.

I'll get a new set of bushes this week and do the job properly.

[Eric SDV6SE]

Just make sure you get oem rubber, nolathane are just too hard. Have fun doing the passenger side bushing mount top bolt done up again.