Cooked my beloved Defender 130

[NovaRover]

Hi everyone, I reaching out for some advise for my beloved Defend 130 Puma 2.2 that I purchased new in 2016, yesterday I was heading to Newcastle when there was a strange smell in the cabin of musty water, thinking it might be an external smell I kept driving.. while unbeknown the heater hose had disconnected and was spewing water over the hot engine, then the engine power started to fluxuuta. So I pulled over in the pouring rain turned the engine off and restarted to reset the computer, thinking it may be a bit of moisture in the fuel. Temp gauge looked good walked around the vehical and kept driving, keeping a eye on the temp gauge. little did know my engine was running dry and the temp gauge was now measuring air temp inside the engine and showing normal. until the was a knocking sound and my engine stoped. Yes I had cooked my engine. was so gut renching when you have nursed the engine since new. after getting towed home and the engine having cooled l tried starting the the engine with more gut ranching sound like a sewing machine, yep. no comprehen and sounds like the head is stuffed. My question is where do I go from here?

[Tins]

Dunno anything about Pumas, but I'd recommend a low coolant alarm. Bloke not far from you ( member on here ) was fitting the 3.2 out of the Ranger into those, Looked factory. If you have the budget you might want to talk to him. Hang on...

Have a read here (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-130-defender-county/255980-3-2-up-running-9.html)


https://youtu.be/BJaiQ4WWx3c'si=b1x_vo0hu3XFgKyu

[spudfan]

I am sorry that this has happened, especially as you have treated the engine so well. There is something that puzzles me though. I thought that the Puma has a safety function whereby the engine will shut down if it reaches a certain temperature.
Some years ago my wife and two daughters were travelling home in the 2.4 Puma. It began to lose power and stopped. My wife noticed the temperature gauge was high and when she went outside to check she could see water dripping from the engine onto the ground. She topped up the coolant reservoir with water and waited for the engine to cool and started up the Puma. The same thing happened later but stopping before the car cut out let here stop in a safe place until she and my daughter topped up the reservoir again. This happened a number of times but they managed to nurse it home, it was night.
When I checked the engine bay next day I could see that a hose clip was not fully tightened and a hose had shifted allowing water to leak out. It was one of those circlip type hoses fitted by Land Rover. I changed it for a normal hose clip and topped up the coolant and ran the engine. Anyway these was no harm done to the engine as it shut down once it sensed the temperature going up. Have not had any issues with it since. So I am very surprised your engine did not shut down once it sensed the temperature rising. Maybe this feature was not included on the 2.2?
Once again commiserations on what happened to your engine.

[workingonit]

My question is where do I go from here?

'I was heading to Newcastle when there was a strange smell in the cabin of musty water, thinking it might be an external smell I kept driving' - Newcastle can be like that! Just joking.

Dealer repair or reliable independent. Independents generally considered less expensive and more experienced, but not always. Advice from aulro Newcastle people might help in choice. How handy are you with tools?

Question becomes is it just the head is a problem or has damage carried on to pistons/crank?

Reconditioned head or new? Reconditioned needs pressure testing to ensure water galleries don't leak, valves seated etc. A shop may or may not decide to test a new head. Preferable to get a second hand head that has not experienced over heating. Reconditioned warped heads may have needed straightening in which case there will be pressure marks from clamps inside the head. Head and block shave. Ensure correct head gasket as sometimes there is differences of opinion, and new technology crosses your path.

Assume the bores are not sleeved with a removable/replaceable liner. If a water gallery in the original head has cracked and opened over a piston while in extended operation you may see damage to the honing of the bore ie polishing of the bore - in which case you may be lucky with a re-hone or worse case all cylinders re-bored, oversized pistons and rings etc. Assuming your engine was not run long enough for potential of water into piston to be a problem, but something to be aware of and ask mechanic to check on. My little bit of experience comes from stuffing my petrol car engine - twice! Did the spanner work my self but let Repco machine shop deal with re-bore, head shave, lap of crank, and supply of head and replacement parts.

Assuming just the head, the question arises is this an opportunity to refresh other things like crank bearings, oil pressure sensor, new hoses, seals, timing belt kits, engine mounts etc. And as suggested a water low indicator - I have one, but its still on the shelf, lazy. Allowing 30,000km a year over 8 years then your engine/vehicle is still quite fresh.
As suggested an engine upgrade to something still Land Roverish. Now might be the time for a 4BD1T conversion [biggrin] or Classic Conversion to electric.

[NovaRover]

Dunno anything about Pumas, but I'd recommend a low coolant alarm. Bloke not far from you ( member on here ) was fitting the 3.2 out of the Ranger into those, Looked factory. If you have the budget you might want to talk to him. Hang on...

Have a read here (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-130-defender-county/255980-3-2-up-running-9.html)


https://youtu.be/BJaiQ4WWx3c'si=b1x_vo0hu3XFgKyu
Thanks champ l'll look into it, he always ththought of getting one of those alarms kicking myself now

[NovaRover]

'I was heading to Newcastle when there was a strange smell in the cabin of musty water, thinking it might be an external smell I kept driving' - Newcastle can be like that! Just joking.

Dealer repair or reliable independent. Independents generally considered less expensive and more experienced, but not always. Advice from aulro Newcastle people might help in choice. How handy are you with tools?

Question becomes is it just the head is a problem or has damage carried on to pistons/crank?

Reconditioned head or new? Reconditioned needs pressure testing to ensure water galleries don't leak, valves seated etc. A shop may or may not decide to test a new head. Preferable to get a second hand head that has not experienced over heating. Reconditioned warped heads may have needed straightening in which case there will be pressure marks from clamps inside the head. Head and block shave. Ensure correct head gasket as sometimes there is differences of opinion, and new technology crosses your path.

Assume the bores are not sleeved with a removable/replaceable liner. If a water gallery in the original head has cracked and opened over a piston while in extended operation you may see damage to the honing of the bore ie polishing of the bore - in which case you may be lucky with a re-hone or worse case all cylinders re-bored, oversized pistons and rings etc. Assuming your engine was not run long enough for potential of water into piston to be a problem, but something to be aware of and ask mechanic to check on. My little bit of experience comes from stuffing my petrol car engine - twice! Did the spanner work my self but let Repco machine shop deal with re-bore, head shave, lap of crank, and supply of head and replacement parts.

Assuming just the head, the question arises is this an opportunity to refresh other things like crank bearings, oil pressure sensor, new hoses, seals, timing belt kits, engine mounts etc. And as suggested a water low indicator - I have one, but its still on the shelf, lazy. Allowing 30,000km a year over 8 years then your engine/vehicle is still quite fresh.
As suggested an engine upgrade to something still Land Roverish. Now might be the time for a 4BD1T conversion [biggrin] or Classic Conversion to electric.

Only had 100,000 km, funny you mentioned the electric conversion I was just thinking of that today, I always thought when the engine got to tired I would convert to electric, thanks for all your advice.

[ramblingboy42]

The Ford Puma 2.2 diesel may well be the most popular light 4cyl diesel in the world , to which reason wrecking yard availability would possibly be quite good.

British Offroad would also have plenty available to choose from. They also do EV conversions as well. Maybe worth talking to. They have an extremely good reputation.

[DazzaTD5]

IMHO...

*if its cooked, then bye bye cylinder head, I wouldn't bother.
*i dont really see a 3.2 as a good alternative, its still prone to eating injectors etc.
*a new stripped engine ready to go is round $7K plus freight to you.
*you will need a Defender sump.

*I've got a new contact for engines,
Ford Transit Specialist WA - Homepage - Ford Transit WA (https://www.fordtransitspecialistswa.com.au/)

engine are from Ford's engine plant in south africa.
Had a good chat with the boss man of all the things that go wrong on a transit compared to a defender.
*they had a rack full of failed 2.2 engines

[NovaRover]

IMHO...

*if its cooked, then bye bye cylinder head, I wouldn't bother.
*i dont really see a 3.2 as a good alternative, its still prone to eating injectors etc.
*a new stripped engine ready to go is round $7K plus freight to you.
*you will need a Defender sump.

*I've got a new contact for engines,
Ford Transit Specialist WA - Homepage - Ford Transit WA (https://www.fordtransitspecialistswa.com.au/)

engine are from Ford's engine plant in south africa.
Had a good chat with the boss man of all the things that go wrong on a transit compared to a defender.
*they had a rack full of failed 2.2 engines


Thanks Dazza i apreciate sharing your knowledge, when I pull the heard off and see the verdict, may give you a call

[NovaRover]

The Ford Puma 2.2 diesel may well be the most popular light 4cyl diesel in the world , to which reason wrecking yard availability would possibly be quite good.

British Offroad would also have plenty available to choose from. They also do EV conversions as well. Maybe worth talking to. They have an extremely good reputation.

Thank you ,apreciate your thoughts , I'll give give them a call

[Tote]

*i dont really see a 3.2 as a good alternative, its still prone to eating injectors etc.

What about a 4.4 ? [smilebigeye][smilebigeye]

Been thinking about what happens if /when my Puma dies. I can't find another vehicle short of a RAM 2500 that can tow 3.5 tonne with another tonne on the tray. And a Ram 2500 won't do the off-road stuff that a Defender can.

Regards,
Tote

[DazzaTD5]

*i dont really see a 3.2 as a good alternative, its still prone to eating injectors etc.

What about a 4.4 ? [smilebigeye][smilebigeye]

Been thinking about what happens if /when my Puma dies. I can't find another vehicle short of a RAM 2500 that can tow 3.5 tonne with another tonne on the tray. And a Ram 2500 won't do the off-road stuff that a Defender can.

Regards,
Tote

IMHO. i dont see a Defender as an awesome tow vehicle, I put it on par with a 76 series cruiser. To me potato partarto.
putting a V8 in the worst handling, worst aerodynamic, worst braking, worst safety to me makes no sense at all.

throw another 2.2 into it and be done with it

[NT5224]

Hi Nova,

sadly I did this very same thing to my 2012 puma four years ago. I feel your pain mate! In my case a plug blew out of the water pump, venting my water. Quite coincidentally I was driving through a major bushfire, so didn’t smell the engine until too late. Of, course temp guage only measures coolant temp.

End of story I went to a complete engine replacement, using the 2.2 Transit motor. And had a CHT gauge fitted which I watch like a hawk now. Worked a dream.

Heres the painful part. From memory the engine replacement and engine combined (I left the task to my excellent mechanic) came in at about $16000. But well worth it mate, especially if you had nursed the engine and love your 130.

Good luck

Alan

[loanrangie]

M57 with ZF6HP26 [thumbsupbig].

[Tins]

M57 with ZF6HP26 [thumbsupbig].

RRT has already done most of the prep (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/discovery-2-a/296003-bmw-n57-8hp-td5-auto-adapter-kit.html), although he went 8 Speed.

[Tins]

Think I'd include a brake upgrade...


https://youtu.be/1ku91t6n0tI'si=nn_mbu8IgRw1JgXK

[POD]

I went through all the decision process last year and replaced my 2.4 with another 2.4. Transit Automotive did the replacement, $15k drive in / drive out, crate motor, injectors, turbo, sundries. None of the mobs putting bigger motors in Defenders have the R&D capability of a car manufacturer. I'm also with Dazza on the ridiculousness of putting big horsepower V8s etc into these vehicles. If that's what you want, better to get another vehicle that is made to go fast, handle and stop.

[M57N_Pete]

Another vote for M57.

Hoping to have more finished on the next 4-6 weeks.

[oka374]

Having not long finished putting an M57 and 6 speed in my sons 3 litre GU Patrol Grenader it totally transforms the vehicle and as the engineer doing the certification said "its how they should have come from the factory".
The BM engine trans combo removed 100kg from the vehicle to start with so would probably be similar to the existing setup weight wise.