manual ACE bypass / poor mans fix?

[FNQLR]

Some months ago ACE died. Blew a hose and killed the pump. meh.

I would like to reinstate some sort of sway bays - but not at the expense of having the no sway bar option.


If I was to install a small pump or portapower type device to load up the rams manually when on road - would this reengage the sway bars?

Not 100% sure on how the ACE sytem works, but if this is a manual version of it, i;m ok with that.

[Slunnie]

A 2nd hand ACE pump?

[FNQLR]

A 2nd hand ACE pump?

Yeah, I think that ship has sailed. When it failed I was miles from anywhere - had a bypass pully and belt flown in and just cable tied the disconnected hoses to random stuff in the engine bay. That was about 6 months ago. I'm guessing a heap of stuff has made it's way into every internal tight tolerance orifice of the ace system by now. + the split hose somewhere.

It would be good to get it going again - I do miss it...

But in all honesty - she's not too bad without it either. A bit like a D1.
Swerving for wildlife / children is the only scary thing. If it wasn't for this I wouldn't give a rats.

[RRT]

The ACE pump is a very high pressure pump, unlikely a non ACE pump will able to generate the pressures required.

Unless the pipes are disconnected off the ACE block then replacing the pipes with new pipes (non OEM is fine as I got my pipes made by pirtek) should minimise the influx of contaminatants and compromises to the system. The ACE Block is where contaminants are problematic, the rams and ACE pump are not the issue in my opinion, they are simple hyrdaulic components.

Use of Transmax is a hell of a lot cheaper than ACE fluid and flushing what you can should give you a great chance of keeping the system.

Remember the Rams are actuated when required to contact the bar, they will not be drawing fluid in and out whilst not actuated.

[Tins]

But in all honesty - she's not too bad without it either. A bit like a D1.
Swerving for wildlife / children is the only scary thing. If it wasn't for this I wouldn't give a rats.

My non ACE D2 is fine, nothing like my D1. Admittedly the springs are not stock in either.

ACE pumps are not cheap.

[FNQLR]

The ACE pump is a very high pressure pump, unlikely a non ACE pump will able to generate the pressures required.

Unless the pipes are disconnected off the ACE block then replacing the pipes with new pipes (non OEM is fine as I got my pipes made by pirtek) should minimise the influx of contaminatants and compromises to the system. The ACE Block is where contaminants are problematic, the rams and ACE pump are not the issue in my opinion, they are simple hyrdaulic components.

Use of Transmax is a hell of a lot cheaper than ACE fluid and flushing what you can should give you a great chance of keeping the system.

Remember the Rams are actuated when required to contact the bar, they will not be drawing fluid in and out whilst not actuated.

The way I am thinking it works is that when the rams are extended the sway bar is in operation, with no pressure in the rams = no sway bar?

If this is so then the amount of pressure is not an issue when going to a manual system (selectable sway bars on or off)
as long as there's a small accumulator and a check valve / dump valve that can handle the pressure generated from body roll against the sway bar. it should be a simple thing to implement. Pressure required would be minimal. I can borrow all the parts from work :)


I might be assuming too much in how the ACE system works though.

[Werdenfelser]

To give maximum articulation and good behaviour onroad we did it a little different at a friends D2:

we connected the two outlets at the Ram´s with one hose but with an manual check valve in between.
Off Road: check valve open, free flow around the Ram, no resistance, like no ARB´s or open ACE
On Road: check valve closed, blocked Ram´s, like rigid ARB´s.

Closing the valves best on leveled ground but it works really good!
Not as reactive as a working ACE but pretty good. I have a D2 without ACE and it feels absolute identical.

Next time i would try to get electric operated check valves, to lock and unlock from the seat. :-)

But sadly this guy moved to Italy, so i can´t take pictures from this mod.

[Tins]

I can only add, whatever you choose to do, do it right. Our late friend Mario had an ACE hose blow, downhill left hand tightish corner. The recovery skid marks were nothing short of spectacular.

[TonyC]

I can only add, whatever you choose to do, do it right. Our late friend Mario had an ACE hose blow, downhill left hand tightish corner. The recovery skid marks were nothing short of spectacular.

I have a friend who had an ACE hose blow, sprayed a fine mist of oil over the turbo and burnt the car to the ground.

It must be said, that car was cursed, Land Rover's entire reputation could have come from that car alone.

Tony

[FNQLR]

To give maximum articulation and good behaviour onroad we did it a little different at a friends D2:

we connected the two outlets at the Ram´s with one hose but with an manual check valve in between.
Off Road: check valve open, free flow around the Ram, no resistance, like no ARB´s or open ACE
On Road: check valve closed, blocked Ram´s, like rigid ARB´s.

Closing the valves best on leveled ground but it works really good!
Not as reactive as a working ACE but pretty good. I have a D2 without ACE and it feels absolute identical.

Next time i would try to get electric operated check valves, to lock and unlock from the seat. :-)

But sadly this guy moved to Italy, so i can´t take pictures from this mod.

Thanks for that, a nice simple solution.

[sierrafery]

There are two quite simple and not expensive ways to emulate the "locked bars" condition which is the default to make it behave like on conventional anti roll bars:
1. to fabricate two solid brackets as to lock the actuators something shaped ike in the attachment(a friend of mine who is in the metal confection business used 4mm steel plate and it's OK)
2. if you still have the pipes connected to the actuators and the leak was not there cut the pipes close to the banjos, fill both sides with thick oil(it's a piston inside so you can't fill it all from one side) and improvise the best way you can to clog those ports well(e.g weld screws into them or something)... or buy proper dimension banjos and work with those, any solution is good as long as it doesnt leak there

[TonyC]

Does the ACE just disconnect the sway bars?
I thought it it did "stuff" actively as in Active Cornering Enhancement.

Asking as all this hi tech D2 stuff is confusing to a Defender driver 🤪

Tony

[Werdenfelser]

ACE is primarily a hydraulic Ram as a kind of a ARB Link. At the road it pushes against the rollin and rockin of the bus, offroad it acts a little
bit like a disconnected ARB Link.
Basically a really good system!

[FNQLR]

Does the ACE just disconnect the sway bars?
I thought it it did "stuff" actively as in Active Cornering Enhancement.

Asking as all this hi tech D2 stuff is confusing to a Defender driver 🤪

Tony

As far as I know it does do active cornering enhancement - but in my case it's too much work to get the system going again (i'm just lazy)

So i'm going the second best option of turning it into just a manual sway bar disconnect setup.

[sierrafery]

As far as I know it does do active cornering enhancement - but in my case it's too much work to get the system going again (i'm just lazy)

So i'm going the second best option of turning it into just a manual sway bar disconnect setup.
Your second statement contradicts the first as to do that "manual sway bar disconnect setup" properly you'll have to work more than fixing the system as it is and maybe more expensive too... unless i misunderstood what you really want cos if you want just to have a vehicle which acts like a non-ACE one you should lock the actuators somehow but to release the bars like the ACE does off road for better articulation the DCVs in the valve block must be open as to let the fluid to circulate between the rams and the pistons in the actuators to be able to move free if you see what i mean

[FNQLR]

Your second statement contradicts the first as to do that "manual sway bar disconnect setup" properly you'll have to work more than fixing the system as it is and maybe more expensive too... unless i misunderstood what you really want cos if you want just to have a vehicle which acts like a non-ACE one you should lock the actuators somehow but to release the bars like the ACE does off road for better articulation the DCVs in the valve block must be open as to let the fluid to circulate between the rams and the pistons in the actuators to be able to move free if you see what i mean

Hi mate, I think we're both on the same page.

I want a vehicle that acts like the non ACE option aka - sway bars connected (rams extended and fluid restricted)
and also...
The option of releasing the pressure in the rams (or enabling fluid flow) to essentially disconnect the sway bars.

[sierrafery]

Hi mate, I think we're both on the same page.

I want a vehicle that acts like the non ACE option aka - sway bars connected (rams extended and fluid restricted)
and also...
The option of releasing the pressure in the rams (or enabling fluid flow) to essentially disconnect the sway bars.
Got it... just that IMO to achieve this in a decent manner involves more work and money than fixing the system as it is so not a "poor man fix" at all[smilebigeye]

[FNQLR]

Got it... just that IMO to achieve this in a decent manner involves more work and money than fixing the system as it is so not a "poor man fix" at all[smilebigeye]


I'm literally always doing random stupid **** that makes no sense - literally all the time.

Anyone who bought a LR is guilty of this.
Even you. :)