some EGR thing

[Percival]

hi all

i was having a little random overheating problem and despite topping up the engine with coolant didn't realise you have to bleed the system. so when the little overheating problem became a big overheating problem i thought i had ruined my engine. after taking it in for service it turned out the EGR had cracked and this was the cause of the overheating. little consolation for having the top of the engine rebuilt (now i understand those engine guard ads). i dont know if i could have caught it in time if i knew but i hadnt heard of it. something to watch out for.
it was on a 2009 2.4 puma with around 150k on the clock

[DazzaTD5]

its actually the EGR heat exchange that cracks.
Its not so common on a 2.4 but very common on the later 2.2

[Percival]

now the turbo has died, going well

[MLD]

now the turbo has died, going well


don't buy one in a green box. they are common to a dozen cars and can be bought for 1k cheaper

Garrett GTA2052V - Garrett p/n 752610-5035S
suppliers

Car Toys $1400 + Gasket kit
Turbo Pros $1615 + gasket kit
Automotive Superstore $1656 + Gasket kit
CGC $1700 + gasket kit
Ford $1850 + gasket kit

do yourself a favour and get a gasket and stud kit also. Soak the bolts in a mix of 50/50 ATF/acetone or a like penetrant overnight.

If you are on a budget, the chinese knock offs do the job. i ran one for 18 months but went back to genuine garrett. you can have my chinese knock off for free. nothing wrong with it. the reason i pulled it off was the brand of silicone hose i was using would not clamp on the high pressure outlet and kept backing off under full noise. i pulled my 2.4 engine for an LS and have no use for the engine and all the spares i'll collected over the years. I'm selling the engine so won't pull the garrett from it. noting you are in Canberra, I can take it to Goulburn if you wanted to collect this weekend. I'm down that way to do some work. If not this weekend, i live in Stanwell Park NSW and can collect at your leisure. Or politely say No thanks.

[Percival]

no thanks i have gone the expensive route and am paying to have it done
i think i need to start a mechanic apprenticeship

[Percival]

i am appealing to the great store of knowledge out there

the mechanic couldnt find the cause of failure in the turbo
the oil was flowing from the pump so that was not the supposed cause
no damage from sucking something in
its thought the cat was a little obstructed (it was slightly down on power) which meant the turbo overheated

i am wondering if anyone has experience with a failed turbo (overheated and the shaft broke) that wasnt from lack of oil
i am feeling more than a little annoyed that i had the top of my engine rebuilt and then the turbo just happened to fail

[DazzaTD5]

i am appealing to the great store of knowledge out there

the mechanic couldnt find the cause of failure in the turbo
the oil was flowing from the pump so that was not the supposed cause
no damage from sucking something in
its thought the cat was a little obstructed (it was slightly down on power) which meant the turbo overheated

i am wondering if anyone has experience with a failed turbo (overheated and the shaft broke) that wasnt from lack of oil
i am feeling more than a little annoyed that i had the top of my engine rebuilt and then the turbo just happened to fail

failing turbos are very common on the Defender TDCi 2.2, poor build quality, the bearings collapse often jamming the spool against the housing shearing the centre shaft.
I have had them fail as in the customer drove it here but if felt under powered the centre shaft of the spool had sheared in half. Others turn up on a tilt tray where the housing has cracked open like an egg.

New gen or garret ones are of the same poor quality. Many a year ago both Ford (u.s) and Caterpillar i believe took legal action against them due to the high percentage of failure rates, garret went into receivership and was no doubt bought by a money management company, so build quality is likely to not be high on the agender. (i am paraphrasing)

I rebuild them (for my own use on customers defenders) using cores manufactured in the U.K from turbo rebuild Turbo Rebuild Ltd (https://www.turborebuild.co.uk/) and i ceramic coat both snails, i also ceramic coat the exhaust manifold. I also put on a free flowing first exhaust section which is also ceramic coated which i believe reduces the heat soak into the turbo and engine.

and yes the intercooler is a good catch all between the turbo and engine, but it may also need replacing due to damage with the turbo hoses. Both items are a common failure anyway

[HardCharger]

Is the turbo actuating arm moving OK or is it stuck? Sometimes, all you need to spray some lubricant onto the pivot points. You can add this to your maintenance schedule to ensure it doesn't get stuck.

DazzaTD5's answer and findings are concerning but they do make sense considering.

[Percival]

shaft snapped and made a nice rattlley sound. i think Dazza has it. i just didnt want to feel like i was being taken for a ride

[MLD]

on my MY11 2.4 i was on my 3rd (but could be said 4th) turbo in 200,000 kms.

First - the VV actuator seized up and despite lubricating all the parts, it never corrected itself. When we replaced it, the turbine blades were chipped and bent. must have dusted it pretty bad at some point.

Second - the cartridge shaft broke. never worked out the cause. made hell of a mess and left me stranded on a single lane mountain pass much to everyone's displeasure. the turbine blades on this one showed signs of dusting too (not as bad). for about 12 months leading to its death, car was going into a momentary limp mode when under load and full noise (ie getting up to speed on a hwy on ramp). reverse engineering with the benefit of scantool data of before and after MAP and load values, the turbo was overboosting, causing the ECU to defuel momentarily until i came off the gas.

Third - fitted a chinese copy that worked fine but as mentioned earlier, the high pressure hose kept backing off. I went with the copy because i was planning an LS conversion and didn't want to spend the money.

Fourth - current turbo

Long and short, you are not an anomaly.

[PhilipA]

I know it is only of peripheral relevance but a way to minimise hoses slipping off is to roughen the inner surface with coarse sandpaper before fitting the hose. maybe also roughen the nose of the turbo .
Regards PhilipA

[HardCharger]

failing turbos are very common on the Defender TDCi 2.2, poor build quality, the bearings collapse often jamming the spool against the housing shearing the centre shaft.
I have had them fail as in the customer drove it here but if felt under powered the centre shaft of the spool had sheared in half. Others turn up on a tilt tray where the housing has cracked open like an egg.

New gen or garret ones are of the same poor quality. Many a year ago both Ford (u.s) and Caterpillar i believe took legal action against them due to the high percentage of failure rates, garret went into receivership and was no doubt bought by a money management company, so build quality is likely to not be high on the agender. (i am paraphrasing)

I rebuild them (for my own use on customers defenders) using cores manufactured in the U.K from turbo rebuild Turbo Rebuild Ltd (https://www.turborebuild.co.uk/) and i ceramic coat both snails, i also ceramic coat the exhaust manifold. I also put on a free flowing first exhaust section which is also ceramic coated which i believe reduces the heat soak into the turbo and engine.

and yes the intercooler is a good catch all between the turbo and engine, but it may also need replacing due to damage with the turbo hoses. Both items are a common failure anyway

Hi Daz,

Sent you DM. [biggrin]