Recommendations for a learner to Linux

[p38arover]

I want to learn Linux.

There's a damn lot about it on the 'Net but some suggestions of a good implementation for a beginner would be greatly appreciated.

I was looking at Knoppix and PCLinuxOS.

If I try Knoppix from a bootable CD, can I try it with my Win XP PC or do I need to use it on clean system?

Should I partition the HDD and put Linux on one partition?

I'm trying to think of questions.

Ron

[ladas]

I want to learn Linux.

There's a damn lot about it on the 'Net but some suggestions of a good implementation for a beginner would be greatly appreciated.

I was looking at Knoppix and PCLinuxOS.

If I try Knoppix from a bootable CD, can I try it with my Win XP PC or do I need to use it on clean system?

Should I partition the HDD and put Linux on one partition?

I'm trying to think of questions.

Ron

It will all end in tears :D

[Pedro_The_Swift]

They tell me Linux is pretty hard to break:p

[Bytemrk]

Ron,

A Knoppix live cd will boot on your XP system - as long as you have the bios set to boot from Harddrive.

If you are just testing the water and learning - you can run a few different linux Live environments straight from the CD ( Knoppix being one of them) Keep in mind though that if you are running from an OS on a CD... rather than the hard drive - each time you boot you will get the default configuration ( ie any system changes you want to make will not stay after reboot..)

Definitely go for it though..... no hurt in having a play.... and unless you try and install it on your XP machine you really can't do any real damage.... in fact it is not all that hard to get many newer Linux Distros dual booting with Linux if you have some unpartitioned space on your drive.. ( or a second blank drive.)

You might find this helpful...

http://apcmag.com/6101/dualboot_windows_xp_and_ubuntu

Cheers, Mark

[p38arover]

They tell me Linux is pretty hard to break:p


Wanna bet!

I bought a 2GHz video/audio transmitter recently. :)

I've been having problems with intermittent bursts of noise on the link. I've finally worked out the unit is faulty - it's not interference. :(

Ron

[p38arover]

Thanks Mark, I'll check the APC link out.

I've been thinking about Linux for years but I've never got my finger out to try it.

Ron

[p38arover]

It will all end in tears :D

I like an optimist! :eek:

Ron

[JDNSW]

Ron,

A Knoppix live cd will boot on your XP system - as long as you have the bios set to boot from Harddrive.

........

Your system needs to be set to boot from the CD BEFORE trying the hard drive, otherwise it will never boot from a CD - it will boot from the hadrd drive before looking at the CD. You may need to change the bios settings to do this.

Knoppix is a reasonable system to try, not so sure about PCLinuxOS. Apart from Knoppix, other live CD distributions you should try are Ubuntu (or Kubuntu), Mandriva and Suse. Running any of these from CD (or DVD) will do nothing permanent to your XP system unless you select the option to install it on the hard drive, or write to any of the files you have on the hard disc - the Linux systems will read/write to the XP files although it may take you a while to find where they appear and what the Windows drives are called (the file and directory names will stay the same) - look under "mount" or "media" for a start, and change the "view" to show hidden files if necessary. Depending on the installation you are using, you may need to note a username and password to do much, and you may or may not need to have a root password to mess with the OS.
If you do take the option of installing on your hard drive, all these distributions, I think, have the option of resizing and creating partitions from the live version, and in doing so and installing the bootloader run the risk of damaging your Windows installation, although a lot of people have done this without tears. But before doing this, make sure everything you really want is backed up and that the Windows installation is clean.
When looking at a system running from a CD, you have to remember as Bytemrk points out, that any system options you choose won't stay there next time you boot, but also, depending on how much memory and spare disc you have, you will find that the operating system is a lot slower than it would be running from the hard disc; when you load a program it has to be read off the CD, decompressed, and written to memory and/or hard disc before the program can run.
But, with these caveats in mind, this is an excellent way to assess how you would like running Linux. Note that all Linux distributions come with a large amount of software, varying from everything you normally would need (Ubuntu) to everything anyone could possibly need (Knoppix), but many do not have proprietary software included - this will usually be drivers for hardware manufactured by secretive companies and software for reading/writing music CDs and videos. In general the missing bits can be downloaded and installed later, but you need to look at http://www.linuxcompatible.org/compatibility.html or www.linux.org/hardware/ to see whether you can run your hardware without problems on Linux.

Hope this helps,
John

[kaa45]

What, the Apple Mac notebook wasn't enough? Your a brave man Ron :o

[Bytemrk]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bytemrk https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/08/768.jpg (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/showthread.php?p=563327#post563327)
Ron,

A Knoppix live cd will boot on your XP system - as long as you have the bios set to boot from Harddrive.

........

Your system needs to be set to boot from the CD BEFORE trying the hard drive, otherwise it will never boot from a CD - it will boot from the hadrd drive before looking at the CD


Jeesuz... I must have been tired last night....like John says:angel:


It should have read cd/dvd drive... NOT hard drive... Amazing how much difference 1 word makes....

Just your first little test Ron:p

Cheers
Mark

[Rovernaut]

Good on you for trying Linux...... when windoze users migrate over to linux they finally realise the earth is not FLAT after all.
Some Windoze users still believe in Father Christmas, the earth is Flat, they are the centre of the universe, and Professionional Wrestling is real. LOL:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[Mick-Kelly]

I got sick of the instability and horrendous slowness of winblows so i went out and bought a basic system of fleabay for all up about $100. Its an ex government dell. I am running the latest version of Ubuntu on it and using it for all my computing needs without a single problem. I think it outshines windows by a large margin and if a nonce like me can work around in it anyone can. Give it a shot you will be impressed.

[shorty943]

Try out Mandriva Free, Ron.
There are several editions, my recommendation, for what it is worth, is to download the ISO of "Mandriva 2007-1 free". It is a Live CD, that will boot and run entirely from CD, or can also be installed to a hard disk if you like the system.
They also have a 4 Gb DVD ISO, that is the one I downloaded to install on my machine.

I use it myself, (Mandriva Spring-the latest updates are coming in as I type.) installed to the same machine XP is, just a different disk set.
I'm speaking through the penguin right now.:D

Web site is www.mandriva.com or maybe you are lucky like me, and your ISP provides a free mirror server. That way the massive download doesn't count in my monthly download limit.:cool:

Also check out www.distrowatch.com www.freshmeat.org www.slashdot.org

or just google the word "linux" and see the several million results come up.:eek:

It really is a LOT bigger than the Microsoft publicity machine is trying to pretend.

Good luck with the penguin mate.


Shorty.

[p38arover]

I've downloaded Knoppix and Ubuntu.

Knoppix won't support my video card very well nor does it support my WiFi card but Ubuntu works a treat on both. The biggest problem I've dound so far on Ubuntu is that the mouse is quite hard to use. I've played with the preferences but can't get a satisfactory resolution to the difficulties in control.

Mandriva was to be my next port of call.

I really need a bigger hard drive in my laptop so I can run a dual boot system. :(

I still need Windows for some apps.

Ron

[Captain_Rightfoot]

I'm told ubuntu is really good. It's a fascinating story about how it has come about too. Check it on Wiki.

I know I'm a mac person now, and I'd never go back, but if I had to jump to another OS I'd go straight to Ubuntu. I'm toying with the idea of doing a media centre PC. I will use Ubuntu if I do.

For the pedantic, Mac OSX is not Linux, it is a distribution of UNIX with it's nearest ancestor being BSD.

[LoveMyV8County]

Ubuntu is easy to install and manage. Does a great job of bringing over My Documents and your bookmarks from Windows if you install as dual boot. My 69 y.o. mother in law now uses it and I sleep better now (she's the kind of person who clicks on every pop up window to see if she really did win a $1m!!!).

Personally I like SuSE which seems to be one of the better distros out of the box at reading Windows file systems. Used it for years and loved it.

Linux is invaluable for giving older Intel / AMD hardware a new lease of life once its Windows installation has slowed to a crawl.

[HangOver]

I tried Ubuntu <-- spelling? ONCE ;)

easy to install, but you dont really want my opinion of it as an OS

[HangOver]

invaluable for giving older Intel / AMD hardware a new lease of life once its Windows installation has slowed to a crawl.

thats one of my biggest gripes people always want to run the latest version of XP/Vista on a PC that's so old there's no fan on the CPU.
People should match the OS to the specs. Old PC, Old OS.

[p38arover]

I tried Ubuntu <-- spelling? ONCE ;)

easy to install, but you dont really want my opinion of it as an OS

Yes. Why not.

Ron

[shorty943]

Hangover must have tried the same Ubuntu I did. It was rotten through and through.

There have been "issues" with drivers for proprietry graphics cards in the past, this is now almost a thing of the past.
I have tended to stay away from any Debian version, maybe I'm not quite geeky enough to get them working. And any, (r) any Ubuntu is Debian based.
I don't seem to get along too well with RedHat or Fedora, yet Mandriva was initially based on RH and its RPM installation system.
If you have nvidea graphics systems, then Mandriva detects and installs the nvidea drivers correctly, even the live CD.
Hell, I'm beginning to sound like some evangelist or something.
But, the truth is, for a windows user the only other Linux system that is easier to understand and use is "Linspire", it is not entirely free of cost however, although there is its poor cousin "Freespire", which can hook up to the subscribed to "CNR" or "click'n'run" software data base.

Have a go at a few Live CD's, that way you don't have to screw with your current running software.


Edit
You have the added bonus of access to your fat32 or NTFS partitions. So you can see how Linux will interact with Winslows. NTFS write is disabled in live mode, but fat32 is enabled, so if you installed Windows to fat32 you can edit and save back to your \My Documents folder. Shutdown Linux, fire up Windows and check the results of your test editing.


Shorty.

[HangOver]

I’ve worked with computers for about 17-ish years. My view of computers and technology has changed a bit in that time. I used to like a messing around now I like to turn it on and have it work. If it doesn’t work reinstall a driver or re-install a bit of software then it works, (usually).
So basically I want to install an OS then drivers and it work.

I tried several flavors of Linux and the best of the bunch was Ubuntu. Even that didn’t install the video and network card drivers. I downloaded the drivers and installed them, still didn’t work. I tried various drivers and reinstalls over a couple of days.

Gave up installed XP - setup and working within an hour or so.
Linux, for me you can keep it until it works out of the box.

Computers for me are more or less another appliance who would want a TV that won’t work out the box then after two days of messing around still won’t work with your DVD player.
OR
Open the box plug it in and it works, which would you choose?
I have better things to do than fight with computers, especially when I’m not getting paid to do so.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Computers for me are more or less another appliance who would want a TV that won’t work out the box then after two days of messing around still won’t work with your DVD player.

Exactly. In that case though you should be using a mac with OS X on it. Far far more capable than windoze out of the box. It will do virtually everything you need without having to buy stuff, and it's security and stability is in another realm.

Unlike windows you don't need to re-build it every 12 months. As far as I can tell the one installation of the OS is good for the life of the machine :o

[shorty943]

Maybe it is because I use AMD and nVidea equipment only.
Almost any Debian distro has been a headache, but on all my AMD machines, Mandriva is that "out of the box" system.
Last week, I migrated my laptop entirely to Mandriva. After downloading and burning the ISO to DVD. (That was an over night download, even on my 512K broadband.) The installation, including complete repartitioning, post installation setup, and hooked back up to broadband in under 30 mins.

Odd thing, in my main machine, I have a Silicon Image IDE RAID card and 4X40Gb disks attached, which even after installing the windows drivers for the card, windows can't see.
The Linux installer just said "oh, you have some more IDE ports, want me to use them?"

The only thing windows does better than Linux, is to play windows games.
Even then, it just crashed my damned game. Now I have to trace what, where, how, and fix it.:mad:
Can't wait to get my new puter, it will be my first Intel based machine in about ten years. Not as powerful as the one I use right now, will keep it on Windows XP SP2. Shift a hard disk or 2 across boxes, then the big Iron AMD will become my 64 bit server, of virtual servers.:twisted:

Running Linux. Of course.

Sorry Ron, am I going to fast forward for you now?
I'll back track. Just try Mandriva Free, the "live" CD, it may surprise you.
http://www.mandriva.com/en or check to see if your ISP has a mirror server that you can download the ISO from.

Shorty.

Edit.
And now, just for the hell of it. This edit has been typed and sent using Ubuntu Linux in a virtual PC, under VMWare Server,
Hosted by WinXP SP2.:cool:

[Rovernaut]

With me Kubuntu worked out of the box. Firewire, USB, printer, keyboard,mouse, display, internet etcetc. The only thing that won't work out of the boxz is my plustek scanner, but that is a backend issue I need to resolve. But I use AMD and nVidea equipment

[shorty943]

With me Kubuntu worked out of the box. Firewire, USB, printer, keyboard,mouse, display, internet etcetc. The only thing that won't work out of the boxz is my plustek scanner, but that is a backend issue I need to resolve. But I use AMD and nVidea equipment

Kubuntu. I do like KDE.



Shorty.

[Rovernaut]

Kubuntu. I do like KDE.



Shorty.
Me too, more 'ex windows user friendly' , the Gnome deskop I think belongs with
Walt Disney's Snow white:D ( snow white and the 7 Gnomes)

[JDNSW]

Yesterday I picked up "Linux Format" July issue - it includes a DVD with four different distributions - Ubuntu (plus Kubuntu), Mandriva, Debian and SimplyMepis. There is also an article comparing the eight most popular distributions, explaing what the differences are and and what this means. They also have an overall ranking, but whether this means anything depends on what things you rate as important.

This would make this issue very useful for anyone involved in or contemplating, or just interested in Linux.

John

[Mick-Kelly]

I guess at the end of the day LINUX is the land rover of the operating system world. Its a bit quirky and far more reliable but it does have its needs. Its harder to get accessories for as well :p:p:p:p:p

[shorty943]

Accessories for Linux.

Names like ,
HP, for the usual printers, scanners, etc. 1210 PSC 3325 IJ
Logitech, USB cameras, joysticks, etc.
Rock, for keyboards, mice, etc. Rock make a < $20.00 fully sealed waterproof flexible keyboard. Very good for dusty regions.
Laser, USB card reader works for me.
Legend 512 Mb SD card for digital camera.
Generic "Easy Disk" USB key.

That is the lot that I use inter changeably with windows.
There is a Linux Hardware Compatibility List, on the web.
The only file system proviso at the moment is reliable NTFS write.
The work around is simple. Use a Fat 32 formated intermediate disk, that both OS's can read and write.
Other than that.
Firefox looks and works exactly alike in both OS's.
Gimp for graphics, Open Office, all just the same under both OS's. Network IP addressing is identical. To serve files to a windows machine from a Linux box, use Samba, just click on the resource (drive or directory or,,,) to share and click apply. Look in Windows Network Places, there is "Samba server V3".
WMV format multi-media files just plain suck under Linux. Just won't work, end of story. Flash and Shockwave web files need the plug ins to play, big deal, they are mostly only web adds anyway.

Once you do settle on a Linux system. The upgrades are just about seamless.
How about that for timing. The little green up to date tick, in the lower right corner of my screen, just changed to a red exclamation mark. Some part of my system has an update available.

Must click link.
Must click link.

Edited at 1030.
All done, no reboots, just a message box saying no more updates to perform.
All done in the background while yacking to a rocket scientist in Texas, a nice lady in New York, and a really interesting young bloke from Kuwait. On an Acer Aspire 3000 laptop.


Shorty.

[Rovernaut]

And there is also DSL: (Damn Small Linux) it will work from a USB stick. The pocket size linux, plug your stick in and operate your operating system from the USB

[shorty943]

And there is also DSL: (Damn Small Linux) it will work from a USB stick. The pocket size linux, plug your stick in and operate your operating system from the USB

Mate, DSL is a great little tool kit.
I have mine as a bootable CD, little mini CD. The entire system, applications, games, everything, loads into about 135 Mb of memory and is blindingly fast. The bootable CD can then be removed and you still have access to the CD or DVD drive.

PuppyLinux is another neat little system.

Matter of fact, Mandriva actually sell a 2 Gb USB drive. Loaded with the latest system, branded with logo the lot. Just plug it in and boot up.
Probably not the only one either.

Now, Dell and Lenovo (IBM) are selling machines with Linux pre-installed rather than MS Windows.

Novell sell big iron, all Linux pre-installed. And not just Intel, IBM clone, X86 boxes either. Sun Blade servers, Sparc machines, PPC Macs, IBM Cell processors all run on Linux.

My MTV digital set top box runs an embedded Linux system.

The Billion router for my broadband, is embedded Linux.

The bloody LG fridge with the internet capability is run on Linux.
Try getting MS Windows to run your fridge for you. Good luck.

You can get a Windows Virtual Machine to run under VMWare in Linux if you really want, or need that. I do, just for fun.
Just to see what it does. How it works, what it does, or can and can't do.


Shorty.

[p38arover]

and poor old Linus has probably not made a quid out of it.

Ron

[incisor]

mainstream linux distributions are just so passée these days...

half the fun of linux was getting the dam thing to boot on your hardware...

be a hacker not a pleb....

buy vista and run it on your 486!

:wasntme: :D:D:D

[shorty943]

mainstream linux distributions are just so passée these days...

half the fun of linux was getting the dam thing to boot on your hardware...

be a hacker not a pleb....

buy vista and run it on your 486!

:wasntme: :D:D:D


:D:p:twisted:

You are a very sick man.


Shorty.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

and poor old Linus has probably not made a quid out of it.

Ron
Nope, I think he's doing all right.

Probably not as well as Bill Gates or Steve Jobs, but definitely better than me, and I presume better than you (but that is really a bit poor form on my behalf IMHO).

:)

Linus on WIKI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linus_Torvalds)

[p38arover]

and I presume better than you (but that is really a bit poor form on my behalf IMHO).

Everyone is doing better than me.

Ron

[shorty943]

Everyone is doing better than me.

Ron

Not quite Ron.

My 100% service disability pension is 25% of the weekly average. By DVA laws, that is. Not the Veterans Entitlement Act. No.
Article 41 of the Veterans Entitlement Act.
The DVA enterpretation of the act. A different book.

Oops, here I'd better stop. Might get myself in trouble.
Article 41 again. It is illegal for us to take this to court to fight for better treatment.
Bugger. I did it again didn't I. I told the bloody truth again.

No wonder they hate me.:twisted:


By the way. How is the Linux adventure going?