Heater core 1997 Disco.. DIY or Workshop ?

[DarrenW]

All,

just returned from a 5 week tour Melb to Broome and back via Alice towing a 20ft caravan.(1997 300Tdi Man) First trip away with my new son of 9 months.
Coming back last week the heater went in the Disco, wet carpet on both the front seat foot wells. Simple 30 min fix by the side of the road to bypass the heater but did make for a cold few days from Alice to Melb....especially when you have to put the air con on to clear the screen.

Enough of the dribble....

Question is has anybody on the forum attempted to replace the heater core themselves ? If so is it difficult , would you do it again ??

I've read the manual and from what I can make out it appears to be the first thing in the car....... take body shell, install heater , assemble rest of car :(

Darren

[Leo109]

Hi Darren,

Sorry, don't know about heater core replacement. But, before you attack it, are you sure it's the heater core and not just an overflowing air conditioner? We've had the 'wet carpet syndrome' many times, not just in humid summer conditions but also in wet, cold conditions, where we keep the air con running as well as heating, to keep the 'screen & windows clear.

For some reason, the D1 condensate drain nipples, either side of the gearbox main body, repeatedly glue themselves closed, in all weathers. All that's normally needed is to crawl underneath with a torch and flick them with your finger tip - at which point they'll usually gush half a cupful of dirty water down your arm. If they're badly blocked, you might need to ream them with a wooden satay skewer or similar.

Hope it's as simpe as this.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

welcome to Landrover Heater Cores 101:D

The very first thing Landrover do in the production of a Disco is suspend said heater matrix by several skyhooks to perfect alignment,,

then they build the rest of the bloody car around it!

you have to rip the entire dash out,

its slow but the photo of your cars interior demolished makes it all worthwhile:angel:,,

the whole thing takes takes about a day if you DIY,,
nothing too difficult;)

[DarrenW]

Leo109,

thanks for the response, unfortunately its definately from the heater as its green anti freeze I saw on the mats...... and it doesn't taste like water:eek:

Pedro,

so have you done it yourself and do you have any pics ?? Also did you happen to get a quote from a workshop for the job ??

Darren

[justinc]

Hi DarrenW
The heater core in a 94 onwards D1 is actually very easy, I do them in about 4 to 5 hours tops. You don't have to remove the dash, only in earlier D1's pre update headlamp models, which are the same as RRC's.
The heater core slides out to the rH side of the heater box, you first remove the console, undo the bolts(small) and remove the under steering column inspection flap, the stiffener bracket it is bolted to, along with the support brackets for the dash on the RH side and next to the clutch pedal area. Remove the slide control cable clip and move the cable for the RH heat select out of the way, undo the small clamps from the pipes and pull them out of the core and the retaining plate/clamp from the heater core itself and slide it out. It will be tight, but leverage will get it with a sizeable flat screwdriver blade.
That was the easy bit.
When the new heater is on the bench you will be able to see how the O rings fit into the core, and that is the worst part of the installation. (BTW,The new core will not have foam strips around it, and I would slide it in to the box first, then fit adhesive weather stripping around outside afterwards to seal it up)Fit core back in to heater box, then using rubber grease only on the Orings and sockets in the core, push the pipes into the core CAREFULLY but firmly. They must be flush with the outside edge to enable the clamps:mad:to be fitted tightly and seal it properly.
All this is to be done with minimal lighting and pain from a stupid contortinists position:mad:
After that is done:)You have almost finished, fit all the bits back in in reverse order and fill with coolant.

I hate doing them but I get quicker each time.:D

Hope this helps

JC

[up2nogood]

I have to do the one in my early Disco and was thinking of cutting out the firewall to access more easily (engine's out anyway).

Is this an option, or is the core too far inside the dash for access this way?

[justinc]

I have to do the one in my early Disco and was thinking of cutting out the firewall to access more easily (engine's out anyway).

Is this an option, or is the core too far inside the dash for access this way?

No, and yes.:(:(:(You'll have to go in the hard way and remove the heater box, as to get the core out of these you have to dismantle the box itself, on a bench....:mad::mad:

I'm not available to do this job at any price.:p


JC

[up2nogood]

Man, that sucks.....

[DarrenW]

Justin,

thanks for the response, looks like a job pver a couple of weekends. I'll give it a go on Saturday and hopefully get the mongrel out for a start.
Just curious, have you ever done one where it is not the heater core its the connection to it ??

I might take some pics for other poor suckers.....

Used to working as a contortinist I also work on mini's

Thanks

Darren

[justinc]

Justin,

thanks for the response, looks like a job pver a couple of weekends. I'll give it a go on Saturday and hopefully get the mongrel out for a start.
Just curious, have you ever done one where it is not the heater core its the connection to it ??

I might take some pics for other poor suckers.....

Used to working as a contortinist I also work on mini's

Thanks

Darren

MINIS??? You are a braver man than me gungadin!

Yes is the short answer. I have found a few leaking O rings in my time, bu they usually leak from age, and the heater core originally is aluminium, and acts like an anode eventually ...So I would be turfing the core also because by replacing the O rings you have done the worst part of the job anyway IMO. The core is about $300 or even less I think. Depends where you get it from.

JC

[awabbit6]

Justin is spot-on with his instructions, but he does make sound easier than what it is.
I have done mine. You have to be very careful not to damage the mating faces where the o-rings fit on the side pipes. The core isn't designed to be removed with these pipes in place. The alternative is to remove the entire heater unit to get to one screw which is against the firewall. This adds to the expense as the air-con has to be re-gassed then :mad:.

I made a simple pressure tester when I did mine so that I didn't have to find the leaks when coolant landed on the floor again. It is simply a pressure guage fitted to a t-piece and a car valve fitting. Pump it up with a bike pump to 13psi and leave it for and hour or so. Check for and drop in pressure. When I fitted the new heater core, I had a leak at one of the joins and was pleased that I went to the trouble of testing before re-filling.;)

Good luck.

BTW - I was able to get a good core from a wrecker for $50 in a complete heater assembly. Might be worth a try.

[justinc]

Justin is spot-on with his instructions, but he does make sound easier than what it is.


:oI was just trying to be reassuring and encouraging so as not to induce too many tears!:(:(

:D:D:p:p

JC

[p38arover]

What about Bar's Leaks?

My P38A heater core was leaking quite badly - as a temporary fix I've added Bar's Leaks. That stopped the leak.

Ron

[953]

What about Bar's Leaks?

My P38A heater core was leaking quite badly - as a temporary fix I've added Bar's Leaks. That stopped the leak.

Ron

Have u fixed it since?
Cheers Dean.

[dullbird]

You don't have to remove the dash, only in earlier D1's pre update headlamp models, which are the same as RRC's.

how is this so my dash had to be ripped out to do my'n and i got a 96 model was only done a couple of months ago.....???

we were told there is another way of doing it by cutting some support strut things near where the air con controls are and them re welding something back in or modifying it or something like that, but we were also told if your going to keep the car you might as well do it properly and not bodge it......

[discowhite]

hey you! update your location! your not in east hills!!!

cheers phil

[dullbird]

is that better

[justinc]

how is this so my dash had to be ripped out to do my'n and i got a 96 model was only done a couple of months ago.....???

we were told there is another way of doing it by cutting some support strut things near where the air con controls are and them re welding something back in or modifying it or something like that, but we were also told if your going to keep the car you might as well do it properly and not bodge it......

...I see. Me thinks they are masochists as there is no need to remove the whole dash, and any one in their right mind wouldn't put themselves through it:eek: Especially me. I might also add that 4 hours labour is a bit less than the time it takes to remove all the dash etc.
And just to clarify, NO CUTTING is required. everything on a D1 unbolts. The only cutting I have heard of is with a P38 heater. They ARE a dash removal job if you don't cut the Driver side support bracket .(20 hours labour as versus about 6 if you cut and weld the bracket;))

Sorry Dullbird, but there was no need to remove the dash, and no cutting and welding is required at all on a D1, as DarrenW is about to find out....

JC

[dullbird]

...I see. Me thinks they are masochists as there is no need to remove the whole dash, and any one in their right mind wouldn't put themselves through it:eek: Especially me. I might also add that 4 hours labour is a bit less than the time it takes to remove all the dash etc.
And just to clarify, NO CUTTING is required. everything on a D1 unbolts. The only cutting I have heard of is with a P38 heater. They ARE a dash removal job if you don't cut the Driver side support bracket .(20 hours labour as versus about 6 if you cut and weld the bracket;))

Sorry Dullbird, but there was no need to remove the dash, and no cutting and welding is required at all on a D1, as DarrenW is about to find out....

JC

no justin the cutting i was talking about was a mod that we were told that could be done so you dont have to take the dash out completly....

[justinc]

no justin the cutting i was talking about was a mod that we were told that could be done so you dont have to take the dash out completly....

Interesting, I have no idea what they are talking about, as I have never removed any part of the dash to do these. Only early D1's. I must admit it is very difficult to fit the o rings and tubes back in, but only hard, not impossible, and this is how I do all of them.
And yes, I believe LR say pull out the heater box assembly, but they also say to remove the ENGINE to replace the timing belt and fuel pump belt on an early freeloader diesel too!!:o:o

JC

[DEFENDERZOOK]

now that thats all sorted......i want to hear more about the minis......


where do you work....which mini do you got......

[p38arover]

Have u fixed it since?
Cheers Dean.

No, it's still leak free with Bars Leaks

Ron

[p38arover]

...I see. Me thinks they are masochists as there is no need to remove the whole dash, and any one in their right mind wouldn't put themselves through it:eek: Especially me. I might also add that 4 hours labour is a bit less than the time it takes to remove all the dash etc.
And just to clarify, NO CUTTING is required. everything on a D1 unbolts. The only cutting I have heard of is with a P38 heater. They ARE a dash removal job if you don't cut the Driver side support bracket .(20 hours labour as versus about 6 if you cut and weld the bracket;))

I wish I'd known this before I took the Disco to my daughter in Derby.

I looked at replacing the heater but decided against it as the LR method was too time-consuming.

Now I'd like to know about the P38A method.....

Ron

[justinc]

I wish I'd known this before I took the Disco to my daughter in Derby.

I looked at replacing the heater but decided against it as the LR method was too time-consuming.

Now I'd like to know about the P38A method.....

Ron

Well, you need to be really friendly with a small die grinder, a 4" angle grinder and a MIG welder. I found out about this AFTER I had done one the hard way,:mad:, so unfortunately I cant tell you from experience. I can remember the bracket you need to cut though, it is on the drivers side and it is the one you look at and think " Why did they put it THERE???I need to take the heater out that way!!!:mad:"

IF I EVER do another one, I will be doing it this way.:D:D


JC

[p38arover]

I'll have a look the next time I have the cover off from under the steering column.

BTW, have a look here: http://rangerovers.net/forum/viewtopic.php't=9019

Ron

[DarrenW]

All,

part one of the exercise is done. I have the heater out. I agree its just a big mechano kit and its just removing the minimum amount of parts to allow you to slide the heater out.
I've just realised that the heater is continually "hot" and it just be the volume of air that controls how hot each side is...... as apposed to stopping the water going through the heater in older cars.

Anyway next week I'll ring around for a price..

Can anybody give me an idea of how much a new heater core is? Do they come with the rubber "O" rings or is that an additional part.

I'm sure like most things the pulling apart is the easy bit...
Time spent so far approx 2 hrs.:)

Darren

[awabbit6]

I'm sure like most things the pulling apart is the easy bit...


Yes it is! Just be careful with the clamps on the pipes when you put it back together. If they don't close up completely, the pipe isn't in all the way and you will have a leak. A bit of rubber grease on the o-rings helps to make sure the pipes slide in all the way.

Good luck.

[Utemad]

I've just realised that the heater is continually "hot" and it just be the volume of air that controls how hot each side is...... as apposed to stopping the water going through the heater in older cars.


If this is true then I guess you don't have to turn the heater on when changing coolant to get the air bubbles out and flowing.

[awabbit6]

If this is true then I guess you don't have to turn the heater on when changing coolant to get the air bubbles out and flowing.

No you don't. There is no 'tap' in the heater system.

[Utemad]

No you don't. There is no 'tap' in the heater system.

Was just out playing with my engine bay and remembered the vacuum operated tap that has heater hoses connected to it. It sits on top of the driver's side tappet cover on the 3.9 V8.

Just looked it up on the RAVE CD and it is called a 'water valve'. Operated whenever one of the temp knobs is turned to heat (progressively?).
Under Discovery1 Workshop Manual section 80 (Heating and Ventilation) - Repair - Water valve.

Are the Tdi's different? Shouldn't be as that section is common to all engines I thought.

[justinc]

So DarrenW,

Is it in yet, or is the colourful language concerning the fitment of 2 small Orings getting too blue to post here?

JC

[DarrenW]

Justin,

I don't have the new heater core as yet. As I posted, I will be ringing around for a price next week, hopefully pick it up Sat morning and have it all back together by Sat evening (at least thats the plan)

Do you have any idea how much the heater cores are ??
Also do they come with the O rings or are they a seperate bit I should get.

Darren

[awabbit6]

Was just out playing with my engine bay and remembered the vacuum operated tap that has heater hoses connected to it. It sits on top of the driver's side tappet cover on the 3.9 V8.

Just looked it up on the RAVE CD and it is called a 'water valve'. Operated whenever one of the temp knobs is turned to heat (progressively?).
Under Discovery1 Workshop Manual section 80 (Heating and Ventilation) - Repair - Water valve.

Are the Tdi's different? Shouldn't be as that section is common to all engines I thought.

The Tdi doesn't have the 'water valve'. The heater core is hot all the time. The vent flaps control where the air comes from - either the heater core or the A/C evaporator.

I didn't know the V8s had a tap. It is metioned on the RAVE CD on page 4 of the 'Description and Operation' part of section 80 that the V8's had this.

[Utemad]

The Tdi doesn't have the 'water valve'. The heater core is hot all the time. The vent flaps control where the air comes from - either the heater core or the A/C evaporator.

I didn't know the V8s had a tap. It is metioned on the RAVE CD on page 4 of the 'Description and Operation' part of section 80 that the V8's had this.

Just looked at page 4 and it does say it is tap for V8 and flaps for Tdi.

I saw another current thread here where someone posted pics of their Defender engine bay heater pipes showing that there was no water valve. I assume the heater box is the same on the V8s and Tdis so the water tap must be something the engine needs rather than the heater needs :confused:

[DarrenW]

Rang a dealer today, heater core $330. Rang a reputable after market place and they quoted $320 (forgot to ask if it was genuine). Biggest shock was the "O" rings are supposedly $20 each.

Anybody know where I might get cheaper parts in Melbourne ?

Darren

[DarrenW]

Managed to get a second hand heater core for $130. It still had the pipes connected which came in handy a bit later.

All started off well and the new heater slid into place and I liberally coated the "O" rings with rubber grease. The next 2 hrs were spent trying to line the pipes up and put the special clamps back on. The bottom pipe went on, but no matter how much pushing, pulling, levering and swearing I couldn't get the top pipe to line up. I can only assume I must of bent the pipe slightly when I pulled it out. This is where plan B and the pipes from the second hand unit came in. I cut the top pipe about 10cm back from the end (difficult under the dash) Next I cut the corresponding spare pipe about 5cm from the end. I was able to line the 5cm bit of pipe up easily and put on the special clamp on the heater. I then joined the 2 bits of pipe with a piece of heater hose and a couple of clamps. ..... hope that makes sense.
Reconnected the hoses under the bonnet filled up with water , started her up and waited for leaks... It worked.

in summary
About 6 hours labour
$130 second hand heater.
$10 rubber grease
cuts and bruises all over my hands..
would I do it again.........I'd have to think of it.:confused:

Thanks to Justin for help on where to start

Darren

[justinc]

Well done DarrenW, Be careful or others will send their D1's to you...I suggest you charge at least 100$ an hour to discourage them!!!!:D:D


Having a go is what its all about:cool:

JC

[RRV80]

I have to change mine in a 94 softdash rangie, and i have a 95 disco1 with a good one in it, however, for piece of mind at $264 i think i should just go for a new one? then i wont have to pull it out twice either. Or if its not leaking now, what r the chance of it leaking not to far down the track.

[4bee]

Darren W. You said you were going to get some pics. of this job. Did you?

Btw, what seems different about the O rings to the std ones?

[DarrenW]

I did take some pictures whilst pulling it out. However I was caught up in the moment putting it back in....

Will try and post them tomorrow

Darren :D

[justinc]

I did take some pictures whilst pulling it out. However I was caught up in the moment putting it back in....

Will try and post them tomorrow

Darren :D

It wasn't THAT much fun was it?????:D:D

JC

[DarrenW]

Here's some pics for those who are interested.

First pic just shows door under steering wheel and the black trim under the dash removed. The heater is bottom left behind the black bracket.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89392&stc=1&d=1421215620

Second Pic shows the bracket next to the transmission tunnel that needs to come out

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89398&stc=1&d=1421215585

Third pic shows the 2 aluminium pipes going into the heater core.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89399&stc=1&d=1421215770

Fourth pic shows same view with centre console out

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89400&stc=1&d=1421215925

Fifth pic shows the bracket to which the bottom of the dash is bolted to

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89401&stc=1&d=1421216012


More in the next post

Darren

[DarrenW]

More pics:

Sixth pic shows the heater core with the top and bottom special clamps undone.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89407&stc=1&d=1421216379

Seventh pic shows bottom pipe removed, you can see the "O" ring on the pipe

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89408&stc=1&d=1421216519

Final pic just shows a strap holding the dash back which makes it easier to remove

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=89409&stc=1&d=1421216628


Fitting as the always say is in the reverse order..:D

Darren

[WildOne]

Thanks for the pics mate, glad everything worked out. I'm a firm believer in having a go at fixing what goes wrong. It's the best way to learn how your truck works:D, and wht jobs you never want to do again:eek:

[Discobunny]

Thanks for the Pics Darren, that almost looks easy:o:wasntme:
Does the new heater core come with the pipes that lead out to the engine bay, I need to replace mine as they are corroded through also:mad:

[DarrenW]

Ross,

if you buy a new heater core (around $300) you dont get the pipes.
I bought a second hand one and whilst I didn't ask for it they gave me it complete with the pipes ($130). Basically they had removed a complete heating unit from a wreck once the dash was removed and rather than disconnect the pipes they had just pulled the pipes and the rubber grommet out of the firewall.

good luck ...

Darren

[4bee]

Thanks Darren. I think the '95 S1 is very similar from your images.

:)

[dirtdawg]

cheers guys im halfway through mine and this helped, wish you had a workshop in this side of the water jc

[sclarke]

cheers guys im halfway through mine and this helped, wish you had a workshop in this side of the water jc

Ive got your heater core waiting... its still in the car thou....
think you might need to make a tutorial on it...

[dirtdawg]

well since here is the first half all i need to do is on the re fit ;)

[dirtdawg]

i wonder if i could cut the pipes a lil further up from where they calmp on and join them with some high temp hose and clamps?????

[parafas]

Dears LR Doctors,

following these steps as showed in the photos posted.
Is it possible to replace the O-rings between the firewall and the heater pipes?
avoiding dashboard removal.


cheers
Rafael

[DCPAus]

More pics:

Sixth pic shows the heater core with the top and bottom special clamps undone.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

Seventh pic shows bottom pipe removed, you can see the "O" ring on the pipe

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

Final pic just shows a strap holding the dash back which makes it easier to remove

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/


Fitting as the always say is in the reverse order..:D

Darren


Hi Darren

I am doing exactly this on a D2, and it looks practically identical, I have 2 questions, and bearing in mind the D2 may be diferent I understand you may not be able to help.

The 2 heater pipes are attached to the firewall by a bracket that appears to be screwed on from the engine bay side is the D1 the same and if yes, did you remove this bracket and how?

2nd question if you did not remove this bracket how did you actually pull the pipes out enough, is it just a case of be brave and use brute force?

[drewin]

I have a leaky heater core in my D1... these pics seem to show that its located on the drivers side but im leaking coolant on the passenger side floor. :/ is this normal? lol

[d@rk51d3]

I have a leaky heater core in my D1... these pics seem to show that its located on the drivers side but im leaking coolant on the passenger side floor. :/ is this normal? lol

Could be a leak in the tank/cores on the passenger side, as the unit rides over the trans tunnel. It's only the feed/return lines on the driver side.

[superquag]

I don't even want to look at mine ('95 Classic) as its not the core thats leaking, but the two pipes as they come through the firewall - Engine side. Well, what is left of them.... both corroded to nothingness inside the hoses and now bypassed.
So far this winter there's enough heat permeating through the firewall to keep me from freezing!
Those two little pipes co$t almost as much as a core....

[Judo]

I have a leaky heater core in my D1... these pics seem to show that its located on the drivers side but im leaking coolant on the passenger side floor. :/ is this normal? lol
My D1 core was leaking coolant onto the floor on both sides of the console!

[HPLP]

Hi,

Is this procedure the same if the disco has or has not got aircon? I have a 1995 D1.

Thanks,
Hugh

[p38arover]

A Disco without aircon?

Mine was a '95 an I used this method.

[HPLP]

A Disco without aircon?

Mine was a '95 an I used this method.


Did she have aircon? Sorry, misunderstood the '?'

H

[p38arover]

I was surprised by the the fact that your Disco has no air con. I've never seen one without air con .

[3lud13]

Thanks heaps for all the advice in here doesn't sound like to much of a pain and much better than having the missus constantly complain the heater doesn't work and it's cold. Will have to get to fixing it soon with all these 10 degree days, our the other option is invest in ear muffs so I don't have to listen to her could be cheaper I guess lol

[p38arover]

I am doing exactly this on a D2, and it looks practically identical, I have 2 questions, and bearing in mind the D2 may be diferent I understand you may not be able to help.

The 2 heater pipes are attached to the firewall by a bracket that appears to be screwed on from the engine bay side is the D1 the same and if yes, did you remove this bracket and how?

2nd question if you did not remove this bracket how did you actually pull the pipes out enough, is it just a case of be brave and use brute force?

I had the same problem on my D1.

I had to replace the pipes as some heavy handed individual had cut them off. I hate cutting anything so I usually don't. To replace the pipes I had to remove the clamp plate where the head of the screw was on the firewall side and therefore inaccessible.

I drilled that screw out with a long series drill and, before reassembly, brazed a nut onto the other side. Anyone who ever has to replace it again (Hi, Laurie) can remove it easily.

[Young Angus]

I was surprised by the the fact that your Disco has no air con. I've never seen one without air con .

I had an XF falcon ones that I thought didn't have air con (my second car ever, back when they were worth not much more than the rego on them) and then one day I realized it had the air con button but it just never worked...that was a funny car looking back on it, complete radiator leak had to fill up the water every day and I thought the temp gauge was busted because it was always on max until one day I completely cooked the engine on the freeway and the car just stopped and smoke was spewing out from all around the top of the engine block hahaha I can't believe I treated that car that way god that's funny to look back on

Old thread, completely unrelated story, sorry about that :)