D1 Airbags "What year"

[Disco300Tdi]

Could someone please tell me from which year were airbags introduced into D1s'

[DaveS3]

And further to this - has anyone converted an Airbag/SRS to normal/non- airbag??? Whats involved?

(PS Sorry to add a question, but similar topic)

Dave.

[101RRS]

Airbags were introduced with the D1 update (95MY) and first sold in April May 1994. There were an option at first, but standard on the ES.

Garry

[Disco300Tdi]

Airbags were introduced with the D1 update (95MY) and first sold in April May 1994. There were an option at first, but standard on the ES.

Garry

Oh dear...:eek:


And further to this - has anyone converted an Airbag/SRS to normal/non- airbag??? Whats involved?

(PS Sorry to add a question, but similar topic)

Dave.

Good question Dave, you must of read my mind

[101RRS]

Oh dear...:eek:



Why "Oh dear...:eek:"?

[Disco300Tdi]

Why "Oh dear...:eek:"?

I have a winchbar off an 84RR to put on a D1
It will fit but am a little concerned re the airbags

[101RRS]

I have a winchbar off an 84RR to put on a D1
It will fit but am a little concerned re the airbags

At the start, the airbags were a $3400 option so not a lot of the early D1 updates had airbags - so it depends what year D1 you are talking about. Certainly at the time the only bar that could go on these was the genuine bar but since then others have been designed to fit. I think it is important with the early airbag fitted D1s as I believe they were activated by sensors in the crush cans on the chassis (but not absolutely sure) unlike later airbags that are activated by a decelerator sensor rather than a pysical switch.

Garry

[duff]

My 94 had twin airbags.

They had contact switches within the engine bay on either side, But it also had a "G" switch(diagnosticcontrol unit) under the centre console. The manual described that you had to have one of the contact switches AND the "G" switch activated to deploy the airbags. If my memory serves me correctly the G swjtch was made at about 4 G.

Post 1997 models had no contact switch and only used the diagnostic control unit.



At the start, the airbags were a $3400 option so not a lot of the early D1 updates had airbags - so it depends what year D1 you are talking about. Certainly at the time the only bar that could go on these was the genuine bar but since then others have been designed to fit. I think it is important with the early airbag fitted D1s as I believe they were activated by sensors in the crush cans on the chassis (but not absolutely sure) unlike later airbags that are activated by a decelerator sensor rather than a pysical switch.

Garry

[camel_landy]

My 94 had twin airbags.

They had contact switches within the engine bay on either side, But it also had a "G" switch(diagnosticcontrol unit) under the centre console. The manual described that you had to have one of the contact switches AND the "G" switch activated to deploy the airbags. If my memory serves me correctly the G swjtch was made at about 4 G.

Post 1997 models had no contact switch and only used the diagnostic control unit.

Just imagine how many cars they had to crash test before they got that one right!!! :eek:

M

[Larry]

I have a winchbar off an 84RR to put on a D1
It will fit but am a little concerned re the airbags

Also depends on what trim level it is.

Mine is a '98 build 'S' model with no air bags & I have done the same, RR winch bar so I could fit in a warn high mount!:D

Larry.

[100I]

Mine is S spec (poverty pak:D) which I specifically sought out for this reason and it also has no ABS.

I BELIEVE that pillows have a use by date of 10yrs.

SWMBO is vertically challenged so this was another strike against SRS.

[mcrover]

Mine is S spec (poverty pak:D) which I specifically sought out for this reason and it also has no ABS.

I BELIEVE that pillows have a use by date of 10yrs.

SWMBO is vertically challenged so this was another strike against SRS.


When I went to trade school around 2000 it was in the Vicroads specs on air bags that all airbags must be checked every 10 years regardless of manufactures specifications.

I dont know if it has been changed but I remember when this came in when several euro car airbags were going off for no reason in around the mid 90's and that was when I first heard about it but didnt read it myself until in trade school.

Gav I would try to steer clear of an air bag D1 if possible as it is illegal to do a lot of things to an airbag fitted vehical and once it has been rego'd with air bags as far as I know is you cant remove them legally (without probably engineering it id assume you could do that).

[DaveS3]

Gav I would try to steer clear of an air bag D1 if possible as it is illegal to do a lot of things to an airbag fitted vehical and once it has been rego'd with air bags as far as I know is you cant remove them legally (without probably engineering it id assume you could do that).

And this is why I asked the question.
Its a very grey area, and the engineers I have spoken to do not have an answer and will be askink VicRoads.

Dave.

[duff]

You should be able to argue that these models have passed ADR's without airbags.

The airbags were an option not a legal requirement.

[mcrover]

You should be able to argue that these models have passed ADR's without airbags.

The airbags were an option not a legal requirement.

Yeah well it's deffinatly worth an ask and I would like to hear how you go with it as it is a really grey area at the moment as a lot of cars that werent optioned with out airbags are getting to that 10 year mark now and I dont even know where you would get them checked or are you just meant to get them replaced.

Even our 98 carolla will need the airbags checked next year by what I read back then so I will really be interested in what comes from it.

By the way, if you do ask Vicroads, ask about 3 people to get the 3 different answers and then makesure you get it in writting or get them to underline where they got it from and then pick the answer that suits you, they used to be prone to that sort of thing as there are a lot of guidelines within the laws that get people confused.

[duff]

Got me thinkimg so I surfed the ADR's and the SA state legislation covering this. It seems that ADR 69/00, 72, and 73 cover this area. There are still no laws that stipulate that a car must have airbags. What is required is that a vehicle wll pass crash test to within a given standard. (basically)

So I rang the engineers/inspectors at the goverment inspection station here in Adelaide and put this to them. They confirmed that if the discovery was sold without airbgs within the chassis range that the discovery would have had to pass the crash tests without airbags. Therefore you can have them removed. :cool:

So if they were optional you do not have to have them fitted. If they are standard fit accross a range of vehicles then you would be hard pressed to have them removed. the vehicle manufacturer would have to show that the vehicle had met the standard without them fitted.

So that is the gospel in South Australia today.



Yeah well it's deffinatly worth an ask and I would like to hear how you go with it as it is a really grey area at the moment as a lot of cars that werent optioned with out airbags are getting to that 10 year mark now and I dont even know where you would get them checked or are you just meant to get them replaced.

Even our 98 carolla will need the airbags checked next year by what I read back then so I will really be interested in what comes from it.

By the way, if you do ask Vicroads, ask about 3 people to get the 3 different answers and then makesure you get it in writting or get them to underline where they got it from and then pick the answer that suits you, they used to be prone to that sort of thing as there are a lot of guidelines within the laws that get people confused.

[Quiggers]

I bought a 95 Rossignol new (in 95) which didn't have airbags...

GQ

[DaveS3]

Thats right - but I haven't come across the VSI from vicroads which says you are allowed to do it.
I tried ringing Vicroads through the customer service line, but to no avail. I will ring a direct line through work and try and get transfered :)

Anyway, my make is a 4/95 and ADR60/00 was implemented at 6/95 - so there is another case for it.
And as it was an ADDED factory option it is a supplementary safety system and hence could be removed.
I just want to be able to get the car engineered/approval in writing that it is possible to take them out.

Cheers
Dave.

[River]

Dave, have you checked with SClarke, as i think he had this issue with his disco;)

PS hurry up and swap those springs discos nearly home :D

[dullbird]

ask langy

as he sent me a load of impfromation on this as i have a 96 disco and apparetly my'n at that age was still an option for airbags not compulsory..

which ment that i could fit a bar with out crush cans the info was all goverment info i'm in the uk so cant axcess it but if you talk to langy i'm sure he will be more than hppy to help you out......

[Utemad]

When I was buying my Disco1 I rang the Qld Transport inspectors and they told me that I could indeed remove the airbag system if my vehicle had a model without airbags.
They also said I could bodylift an SRS airbag vehicle.

I was lucky enough to find one without airbags though.

[mcrover]

Well mine is a 97 s D1 300tdi auto with no airbags so if Vicroads has as much common sense as SA and QLD (that they often dont) then you should be fine removing air bags on any D1.

[DaveS3]

Well mine is a 97 s D1 300tdi auto with no airbags so if Vicroads has as much common sense as SA and QLD (that they often dont) then you should be fine removing air bags on any D1.

That's exactly right - they "should" but I need it in writing.
In contact with another person now so I should have it sorted out soon enough.

Its just so frustrating that the VSI's are inadequate in so many way and do not nearly cover all issues faced by people.
There is a document buy it is just not able to be accessed by the public nor they willing or have any capacity to answer your questions definitively.

Cheers.

[DaveS3]

Well I now have the Technical Info sheet from vicroads (TI/12 Issues 28 march 1998) Only took 3 weeks for a response.

There are a couple of clauses which are vehicle dependant (regarding ADR69) but basically if you remove all SRS components on a veheicle that it is a factory option on, and replace them with the non SRS vehicle variants, than it is all legal.

You still maybe required to engineer the body lift, but if you remove the SRS it is all good.

Remember that this is just for vehicles which had SRS as an ADDED option, not factory equipment (ie D2's)

I will be contacting an auto eng to confirm this but as its in writing I can't see a problem with it.

Im now very happy! The body lifts comingout of the shed.

[loanrangie]

Well I now have the Technical Info sheet from vicroads (TI/12 Issues 28 march 1998) Only took 3 weeks for a response.

There are a couple of clauses which are vehicle dependant (regarding ADR69) but basically if you remove all SRS components on a veheicle that it is a factory option on, and replace them with the non SRS vehicle variants, than it is all legal.

You still maybe required to engineer the body lift, but if you remove the SRS it is all good.

Remember that this is just for vehicles which had SRS as an ADDED option, not factory equipment (ie D2's)

I will be contacting an auto eng to confirm this but as its in writing I can't see a problem with it.

Im now very happy! The body lifts comingout of the shed.

Thats good to know, theres no way i'm replacing my windbag when its time to be replaced. I actually prefer my ab wheel than a non ab wheel and it means there will space in it for some goodies.

[DaveS3]

Im just going to replace it with a sports wheel of the same size.

I hate those steering wheels :)

[DaveS3]

Well I rang the engineer this arvo, it's not as simple as it seems.

It is still possible but for him to sign off I require proof of -
1) That the vehicle Airbags where in fact an option, so something like LR tech sheets, brochures
2) Need to provide proof that the Instrument cluster, steering column are the same between the Airbag/Nonairbag models - This requires part numbers from a LR Parts source, so computer or hardcopy catalougue

3) Steering wheel needs to be changed (easy)
4) All items with SRS need to be removed (all sensors, wiring, airbags and possibly sunvisors as they have SRS on them) not to sure about that one.

Anyway,
Can anyone help with 1 or 2??? Anyone got access to a part number catalouge from LR?

Might try and visit a LR dealer and see what they can come up with.

Cheers
Dave.

[Utemad]

Thats good to know, theres no way i'm replacing my windbag when its time to be replaced. I actually prefer my ab wheel than a non ab wheel and it means there will space in it for some goodies.

I preferred the airbag steering wheel too and planned to gut an airbag wheel and fit it to my non airbag Disco. Have never got around to it though. Maybe when this one falls apart although it is in pretty good nick still.

[mcrover]

Well done Dave, you have made much more progress than I have, I asked a person I know who works at VR's and he hit a brick wall as soon as he said body lift and removing airbags.

You can remove just the bag from the wheel and I think it would probably be sufficient as there isnt that much different other than the horn button as I am having a bit of trouble finding a non airbag wheel that hasnt started falling apart like mine.

I'd love to know how you go in the end.

[DaveS3]

My car will be engineered with out airbags, its just a matter of time.
Will be getting seats, 2.5'' body lift, 2'' springs and 285/75/16 on 16x8's.

The engineer has no problem with this - it is just on my back to get the proof to show him.

Cheers Dave.

[101RRS]

On the basis of your earlier posts if you follow the legal requirements, such as airbags had to be an option, remove all the bits then why to you need the airbag removal to be engineered.

Surely the vehicle is back as built as a standard non optioned vehicle and meets all ADRs. If there is anything in the vehicle documents or tags such as compliance plates then I could understand the engineering requirement.

Good luck with it.

Garry

[mcrover]

On the basis of your earlier posts if you follow the legal requirements, such as airbags had to be an option, remove all the bits then why to you need the airbag removal to be engineered.

Surely the vehicle is back as built as a standard non optioned vehicle and meets all ADRs. If there is anything in the vehicle documents or tags such as compliance plates then I could understand the engineering requirement.

Good luck with it.

Garry

You live in Canberra Gary, you dont have to deal with Vic roads:(

Vic Roads are a pain in the but when you want to get anything done that is not just registering a standard vehical with nothing changes from when it rolled off the line.

I have heard of them knocking back a Hilux for having BFG Mud terrains that were only 32" and no other mods not even suspention.

Also on an all wheel drive Jeep they ok'd a RWC with different brand, tread and measured size tyres on it when I complained that it wasnt a legal RWC so I went through head office and got it over the pits where they found a lot more stuff the dodgy RW mech didnt do, by the way, if they had just left the 4 Nankang tyres that were on it when I signed for it I wouldnt have been such a mongrel about it.

There are good and bad people that work at VR's but if you get a bad one they will not do a thing for you.

It is easier sometimes and even in some cases cheaper to just go to an engineer as if you roll up with an engineers cert they rarely know where to check if it is legal or not either.

[Ivan]

Quite interested in this thread as I am coming back to Aus next year. I will be bringing back my 1991 Discovery as it's not worth anything over here and it's still in good nick. However my problem is as follows.
Car was a 1991 3 Door (200 series) first registered in SA. After living in Aus for 3 years it was shipped back to England. But, about 4 years ago someone side swiped me with a trailer and drove off. To cut a long story short we fitted a 1996 300 Series ES bodyshell. This came with all the ES goodies and Airbags. The Airbags appear to be operated by a pair of sensors fitted to the end of the chassis rails. I have also fitted my winch bar which also came from Aus but was not designed for an vehicle fitetd with Airbags. I was just wondering if I am going to have problems registering it when I bring it into Aus. Will be registering it in Brisbane.
If it sounds like it's going to be a load of trouble I'll just take the airbags out and fit non-airbag bits.

Rgds

Ivan

[DaveS3]

On the basis of your earlier posts if you follow the legal requirements, such as airbags had to be an option, remove all the bits then why to you need the airbag removal to be engineered.

Surely the vehicle is back as built as a standard non optioned vehicle and meets all ADRs. If there is anything in the vehicle documents or tags such as compliance plates then I could understand the engineering requirement.

Good luck with it.

Garry

The problem is Garry that we are assuming that the parts are identical between the two model variants.
He want solid proof, not assumptions.
While I believe it is getting a bit ridiculous, he is correct.
He engineering cert is also his career / livleyhood / liability

The removal of the airbags is still abit of grey area when it comes to body lifts. Everyone shys away from it.

He wants to make sure that the car is still at the same spec as it was when it was crash tested as a model variant without airbags.

Anyway, im not whinging, just got to doing then get the cert.
At the end of the day, its only time and money :)

Cheers.