Geelong plant closure

[mcrover]

I know this is probably going to open a can of worms but this Ford closing down their engine plant is starting to get on my nerves.

More because of the repetative TV coverage of the same few negative veiws of the situation.

I know the shock of it is going to get people upset but it sounds like it is going to be wound down over 3 years (but thats only going on what was said on the news), I think most of the workers in the plant and a lot of their suppliers should be able to find work to replace what they are doing at some time in the next 3 years.

No body has total security at work, my last job I was at for 8 1/2 years until we lost some contracts and one of the onsite guys had to go and I found a job first.

There is no doubt that these new IR laws are having an impact on the way we have been working and I know that unionists dont like them but I dont think this would be the reason behind what ford are doing.

Ford is struggling all over the world as we all know with LR looking like it will be up for sale again and this will be all part of that.

I think it is enough of the attitude that we should just expect that our job will be there forever, it has never been like that in reality unless you work for your self and I think the IR laws will sort them selves out, dodgy bosses will go out of business due to not being able to get Good staff for no money and the good employers will stand out and will end up with the best staff.

I dont believe this has anything to do with politics, and im sick of seeing the very upset women on TV blaming the government for the closure and the snipits of guys saying they have no future when that isnt the case, but thats the editors again making things sound worse than they are.

There are other jobs out there, some people will move away from Geelong to get work and others will get jobs with the other manufacturers in the city and some will work in Melbourne but there will definately be 600 jobs in Geelong and the surrounding areas.

Yes we all feel for you lot that are going to have to change your lives but thats all it is, it's a change and sometimes change is good and you have 3 years to get used to it.

Ok now time for you to agree or disagree Im not having a go at anyone inperticular, I know there are people from Geelong on here and I hope you wont be affected by this or you will be back in secure employment asap.

Edit
Maybe I should have put it in Rants and yarns. Inc if you read this, you might consider moving it if you think it would belong there.

[Disco300Tdi]

There will be around 1200 jobs going in relation to Fords 600 employees

All the component suppliers, o/s maintenance companies even the lunch truck girl.....it keeps going and going

[hiline]

adds up to alot of people looking for jobs :o

[tombraider]

Better than running at a loss and closing the entire lot down costing 3500+ jobs though isn't it....

The 'million dollar question'... How many employees there are driving a less than 5 year old Ford?

I know at Mitsubishi they had less than 5% of workers driving Mitsubishi products... If people purchased what they make it all helps....

Lets face it, with tarrifs as they are local car manufacturers are going to have to tighten belts....

[kaa45]

I worked for Ford 25 years ago in Geelong. They kept threatening to close the plant and move operations to the Philippines every time we asked for a pay rise.

The Australian market is too small to support international industry. We will never compete with Asia on cost.

When I was at Ford we had 7000 workers, they have been shedding staff ever since the "Button Car Plan" of the 80's.

And the discount to employees who buy a car was about $200.00 then. You could get a better deal at any New Car place.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Australians think Ford and Holden exist to be great Aussie icons looking after the country. They forget that they are just the arms of large American business that are only in Australia to make a profit. If they can't make a profit they will alter what they are doing to try and do so. If that doesn't work they will take their bat and ball and go home. Whitness Nissan "Australia"

[incisor]

The 'million dollar question'... How many employees there are driving a less than 5 year old Ford?
you got it in one..
cant have your cake and eat it too..

[JDNSW]

The engine plant closure is stated to be because Australians are buying smaller cars - not Falcons and similar. Considering they have been being told to buy smaller cars for years, it should hardly come as a surprise to find it is finally happening, possibly helped by high fuel prices.

Considering that there is said to be a major and increasing shortage of labour at present, it does not appear to be a particularly bad time to have a plant shut down. I note the federal government is providing assistance to the area - there was none of that when the state government shut down the timber industry round here in the middle of a record drought (to get the green votes); the numbers may have been much smaller, but the proportion of people affected was probably larger, causing several towns to turn into pretty much ghost towns.

John

[mcrover]

Australians think Ford and Holden exist to be great Aussie icons looking after the country. They forget that they are just the arms of large American business that are only in Australia to make a profit. If they can't make a profit they will alter what they are doing to try and do so. If that doesn't work they will take their bat and ball and go home. Whitness Nissan "Australia"

And VW, Even GMH has had to move operations from Fishermans bend to Elizibeth in SA as running 2 engine plants in OZ was just too exy for GM to justify.

I know it's a lot of people looking for work Ray but they have 3 years to do so.

Natural attrition will make up about a third of that anyway and the other 2/3's are getting a push into doing something else.

Dont forget, in places like that, someone retires about once a month and there is always a turn over of staff, they just wont put any new full time staff on in the next 3 years and use casuals and then move some of what they have left through to the chassis and testing facility and some will get shifted to Broadmedows if they want to move up to Melbourne.

There will probably in the end be 150 to 200 people that will be getting jobs outside ford from this in reality.

What peaves me more than anything is the TV and union beat up and no rational thinking goes into it just scare campain...."This could happen to you" sort of thing.:angry:

[incisor]

And the discount to employees who buy a car was about $200.00 then. You could get a better deal at any New Car place.

big deal, why would they invest in your future when the workers wouldnt...?

somethings would be worth the extra bucks i would have thought...

i watched the eagle farm plant slowly die and often spoke to a lot of the guys from there, always amused me they wanted ford to give them security but they wouldnt buy something they built cause they were crap..

got what they deserved i thought but as always they took the good guys with them.....

[amtravic1]

The Ford engine is unique to Australia. No other company has an engine that is only made and sold in Australia. It is a pity people will loose jobs but the reality is that the Ford engine plant was always going to close sooner or later.
So the workers will need to find new jobs, so what. Us self employed tradespeople have to find new jobs very regularly.
The most annoying thing is the garbage the journalists come up with and somehow try to blame governments for the closures.
Ford is in financial trouble and is even selling (profitable) Land Rover.
The company has to make money or many more workers will lose jobs.
By the way, I have only ever owned one Ford, a new at the time XF ute and I would never buy another Ford. Most of my freinds that have owned late model Fords would never buy another one either.

Ian

[HSVRangie]

FORWARD PLANNING AT BOTH H AND F IS NEXT TO USELESS.

Fords six was always going to go along with production of large cars.

Ford should have put a diesel in the terrirtry but NO lets put a gas guzzling six in there.

Australians have been into the small car for years.

Hello hate to say it but look at toyota.

Holden did the same many years ago no engine.

Michael

[barryj]

The Ford engine is unique to Australia. No other company has an engine that is only made and sold in Australia. It is a pity people will loose jobs but the reality is that the Ford engine plant was always going to close sooner or later.
So the workers will need to find new jobs, so what. Us self employed tradespeople have to find new jobs very regularly.
The most annoying thing is the garbage the journalists come up with and somehow try to blame governments for the closures.
Ford is in financial trouble and is even selling (profitable) Land Rover.
The company has to make money or many more workers will lose jobs.
By the way, I have only ever owned one Ford, a new at the time XF ute and I would never buy another Ford. Most of my freinds that have owned late model Fords would never buy another one either.

Ian


On the news last night they said (and we all believe the news, don't we?) that the current engines made at the plant will not comply with new emission rules.

I wonder how many workers gained any qualifications during their time at Ford. I took every opportunity to progress myself while I was in the workforce. I did many courses outside of work so I could gain the magic pieces of paper. Foreman at 5 places, production manager at another and finally a TAFE teacher. I lived on $15,000 to $28,000 per year while raising 3 kids while I studied and I only went to grade 10 at high school. Finally I hit a great wage at TAFE, $65,000 per year, 9 weeks leave, 4 day week, and a 36.25 hr week.

Some of the Ford workers will find it hard to get other work as they can only assemble engines and nothing more. Sad but true.

Just like Land Rover did many years ago Ford will pull out of Australia as we are only a small market and have high manufacturing costs. Sad to see the plant go but that is progress.

[CraigE]

I do not see why Ford could not have a smaller engine factory in Australia. They have known the big six was going to be phased out for years. I do believe this plant was actually turning a profit (ford corporate losing money worldwide). It is a shame Ford do not have the commitment to build a small engine plant here, instead it will go overseas to a cheaper economy and then they will come back into Australia.
Others are right Ford workers should support their employer and drive a Ford, but saying they should be driving a Ford less than 5 years old is just stupid. Most of these factory workers are not high paid and probablly would not be able to afford a new car once or twice in their lives let alone every 5 years. I know I cant and I am not on bad money.
The sad think is it is not just the 600 odd Ford jobs but roughly for every job Ford axes 2-3 more follow in support industries.
At least at the Holden plant in Adelaide a fair proportion of people drive late model Holdens or at least appear too.
My brother worked at the Mitsubishi plant in Adelaide for a while and the discount was a bit better than 5% from memory but also came with an interest free loan to purchase. He probablly would have taken advantage of it had he been their long enough. But same thing 6 months after starting work for them massive cutbacks.

[kaa45]

Ford had an engine plant for 4cyl motors for the Laser and Telstar...shut down several years ago. Still sitting empty...was one of the most advanced alloy engine facilities in the world.

[rangieman]

I do not see why Ford could not have a smaller engine factory in Australia. They have known the big six was going to be phased out for years. I do believe this plant was actually turning a profit (ford corporate losing money worldwide). It is a shame Ford do not have the commitment to build a small engine plant here, instead it will go overseas to a cheaper economy and then they will come back into Australia.
Others are right Ford workers should support their employer and drive a Ford, but saying they should be driving a Ford less than 5 years old is just stupid. Most of these factory workers are not high paid and probablly would not be able to afford a new car once or twice in their lives let alone every 5 years. I know I cant and I am not on bad money.
The sad think is it is not just the 600 odd Ford jobs but roughly for every job Ford axes 2-3 more follow in support industries.
At least at the Holden plant in Adelaide a fair proportion of people drive late model Holdens or at least appear too.
My brother worked at the Mitsubishi plant in Adelaide for a while and the discount was a bit better than 5% from memory but also came with an interest free loan to purchase. He probablly would have taken advantage of it had he been their long enough. But same thing 6 months after starting work for them massive cutbacks.
Well i work for holden and yes most of the cars in the car park are late model holdens ill tell you that most of the people dont own them cause they are lease cars thru the company
Now my wife who doesnt work because of reasons wants a lease car which i can get through work but i wont its only because there is no security in any job and if i got a lease car she would sell her car the money would disapear on something else and if i lost my job you loose the car so you have no job no money and no car
My wife owns a falcon reason being is she and i prefer the ford over a H
They age old saying if you work in a lolly factory you soon get sick of lolly,s
Sorry to say if everyone that worked at ford bought and updated a new ford every 5 years that would not save their jobs
So am i bad that i work for holden and i dont own one
Id hate to be the same as mr joe average im a indervidual and im staying that way

[incisor]

Id hate to be the same as mr joe average im a indervidual and im staying that way
you just proved my point :P

[tombraider]

Reminds me of the saying..

I'm an individual.... Just like everyone else.....






Job security be damned..!!!!!!
The company is in business to make money. All businesses generally are.

We complain when the economy turns to sh:pit but do nothing about it.
Cheap fruit from overseas vs local stuff we often just buy the shops offerings (usually USA for oranges etc...)
Cars? Cheap Hyundai or Daewoo please....
Parts for vehicles... I'll buy direct from OS to save a few dollars here and there...

All of these remove the ability for local businesses to sustain themselves...


As a general rule... The company you work for (leave,Long service etc withstanding) owe YOU, the worker... NOTHING.

They pay you to do a job... You do it right they may make a profit (lets you keep job) so you work more, they pay you.... Simple...

No sales = No product = No work to be done = No work.... Simple....

[barryj]

Reminds me of the saying..

I'm an individual.... Just like everyone else.....






Job security be damned..!!!!!!
The company is in business to make money. All businesses generally are.

We complain when the economy turns to sh:pit but do nothing about it.
Cheap fruit from overseas vs local stuff we often just buy the shops offerings (usually USA for oranges etc...)
Cars? Cheap Hyundai or Daewoo please....
Parts for vehicles... I'll buy direct from OS to save a few dollars here and there...

All of these remove the ability for local businesses to sustain themselves...


As a general rule... The company you work for (leave,Long service etc withstanding) owe YOU, the worker... NOTHING.

They pay you to do a job... You do it right they may make a profit (lets you keep job) so you work more, they pay you.... Simple...

No sales = No product = No work to be done = No work.... Simple....


Sad but true.

I'll get shot but we Land Rover owners are doing the same, although we don't have an alternative choice that is made in Australia. Check out where your Rover is made .... see what I mean. We would be the first to grizzle if the government banned imports of Rovers, or put high levies on them just to save local jobs.

At least in Australia we have the choice to buy what we like no matter where it is made.

Freedom of choice is what we want so we pay the consequences of it.

[cookiesa]

Sorry, I also own a Daihatsu and of Course a Landrover so how hypocrytical is it for any of us on here to criticise others for not supporting their employer when in reality we don't even support Australian made.

There is a diesel coming for Territory, always has been but not until Australian's got over the "you need a big 6 or 8 in a family car". Simple marketing. To Target Territory is a bit of a joke as it is one of the biggest success stories in recent Australian Car Manufacturing so they obviously got it right. The AU Falcon was a great example of how fuel efficient a 6 could be... no one cared because they didn't like the styling.

Ford have a reasonably good plan for those who work for them it varies from vehicle to vehicle but would average around the 4-5% better on promotions.

Why reopen the old 4cyl plant when you can import engines you already produce at lower cost? (I believe they are replacing the straight 6 with a V6)

I feel sorry for those loosing their jobs but at least they have been given warning of what is happening. Wasn't that long ago they would have just rocked up to locked gates one day and no job.

As others have said there is no such thing as a "safe job anymore

With you "BarryJ" we must have been typing at the same time!

[tombraider]

Cookie...

I agree, but we own LR because no-one manufactures a vehicle of comparison in Australia...

Our locals make Big passenger cars(sedans etc) and nothing that suits our uses is made here.

My vehicle required luxury tax! Its a defender!

So I paid a penalty to have "my choice" and I see no issue there....

Now if a local made a vehicle as capable etc.... I'd look at it....

I, through choice, only buy local where there is a product that suits my use.

Just like, in Whyalla, I support local business where I can..... Keeps the jobs there!

[landrovermick]

Better than running at a loss and closing the entire lot down costing 3500+ jobs though isn't it....

The 'million dollar question'... How many employees there are driving a less than 5 year old Ford?

I know at Mitsubishi they had less than 5% of workers driving Mitsubishi products... If people purchased what they make it all helps....

Lets face it, with tarrifs as they are local car manufacturers are going to have to tighten belts....

i like that idea. i think they should get a discount.....

[Quiggers]

A question: What else does the plant at Geelong do? Or is it engines only?

GQ

[cookiesa]

Cookie...

I agree, but we own LR because no-one manufactures a vehicle of comparison in Australia...

Our locals make Big passenger cars(sedans etc) and nothing that suits our uses is made here.

My vehicle required luxury tax! Its a defender!

So I paid a penalty to have "my choice" and I see no issue there....

Now if a local made a vehicle as capable etc.... I'd look at it....

I, through choice, only buy local where there is a product that suits my use.

Just like, in Whyalla, I support local business where I can..... Keeps the jobs there!

Hey I'm with you (We have a business in Whyalla!) I just thought it is a bit pot calling kettle when we have guys telling others they should buy what their employer sells and condeming them! After all those that buy Japanese etc vehicles help Whyalla! (Steel exports)

[incisor]

Sad but true.

I'll get shot but we Land Rover owners are doing the same, although we don't have an alternative choice that is made in Australia.

you got it in one...

my wife has a daihatsu, we tried to get an AU vehicle but there were none that stayed together, so we got one that employed a heap of aussies, toyota.

[rangieman]

So if holden close down where i work should i blame my self for loosing my job because i dont own a holden
It will take more than this little black duck to cause the company to fold
Ive worked in several other companys not motor trade related like plaster industries i never bought plaster from the company because i was,nt building a house , Should one just buy a truck load of plaster even tho they dont need it just to support the company :eek: i dont think so:p

[cookiesa]

No you blame the American's for not buying enough of your exports! (So you can take it out on Jeep Owners!)

[rangieman]

No you blame the American's for not buying enough of your exports! (So you can take it out on Jeep Owners!)
Well i can tell you a certain locally made new released car has over 50% of imported parts from china so much for australian made , more like australian assembled :twisted:

[PAT303]

In a nutshell Ford and GM are not moving with the market.The japanese outsell them everywhere because they make cars people want.As Henry Ford said "You can have any colour you want as long as it's black".If Ford put the TV6 out off the D3 into the Falcon range it would sell.It is easy to see how lost they are when they sell LR the only part of the company making money. Pat

[incisor]

So if holden close down where i work should i blame my self for loosing my job because i dont own a holden
It will take more than this little black duck to cause the company to fold
Ive worked in several other companys not motor trade related like plaster industries i never bought plaster from the company because i was,nt building a house , Should one just buy a truck load of plaster even tho they dont need it just to support the company :eek: i dont think so:p

pretty simple really..

you arent supporting your employer in a way that you can then you cant cry crap when they dont support you when things arent rosy.. just because you dont like it doesnt mean it doesnt or wont happen...

[kaa45]

A question: What else does the plant at Geelong do? Or is it engines only?

GQ

Geelong is the Manufacturing facility. Engine Plant, Casting Plant, Stamping Plant, Sub-assembly and Product Engineering.

Broadmeadows is the Assembly Plant, Plastics Plant, Truck Plant, National parts distribution centre and Head Office.

At least it was when I worked there, probably changed a lot. So yes the Engine plant is only a small part of what goes on in Geelong, but you know the media, anything for a story...the worse it sounds, the better they like it.

Geelong people aren't surprised, we've been going through this for years. Historically we were a Wool town. Then an industrial centre. We'll adjust.

And we're not the ones crying about it.

[rangieman]

pretty simple really..

you arent supporting your employer in a way that you can then you cant cry crap when they dont support you when things arent rosy.. just because you dont like it doesnt mean it doesnt or wont happen...
No different to people that say and preach about a certain brand of computer and operating systerms
But sell other brands of computers and operating systerms;)
Bye the way if i ever lost my job i will not be upset or worry ill tell you now if they fold or offer a package ill jump after 13 years im ready for a change and life goes on
People think cause you have had a job for so long its the end of the world when the company moves on the company does not care for their workers they are made to show some effort of concern by:angel: the unions and goverment its more profit that is a concern to these multi national companys and there share holders

If it ever happens to me and it will at some stage i can have another job the next day if wanted its called multi skilled with tickets

[incisor]

No different to people that say and preach about a certain brand of computer and operating systerms
But sell other brands of computers and operating systerms;)
i sell em all :P

based on peoples needs and expectations...

[CraigE]

I think we are missing a bit of the point. I dont buy nickel because we produce it. But do buy items produced downstrea.
600 people out of work in one hit especially if they are not skilled enough to enter another industry is not nice. Yes it does happen in every industry but is still not nice and often not really neccessary.
Our car industry get huge breaks from the government, so if taking stuff off shore should lose these.
Just watch a similar engine will come in from overseas shortly.
Mitsubishi have done it, now Ford, next probablly Holden.
Like I said with Mitsubishi if these conglomerates take their production off shore they should be taxed into oblivion unless there is genuinely no alternative.
If Holden or Ford made a decent locally produced 4x4, I would buy one, not the garbage they have on the market at the moment which are imports any way. I am generally talking about family car production such as Commodores, Falcons and Magnas.
Try and find another 600 positions for these people in any industry in the Geelong area, let alone the flow on job losses.
Yes Ford is a business and has the expectation to make money not lose it, but also has some community responsability.
Having said that I would not buy a Ford because they are a POS:o

Love our Statesman and Fender better.

[Lucas]

A question: What else does the plant at Geelong do? Or is it engines only?

GQ

Stamping and casting.
I read on ealier posts that the knock on effect will be 1200 its likely to be higher than that with a lot of small local firms supplying components and services into Ford.

Coming from Geelong and being passionate about manufacturing, it saddens me to see another part of local manufacturing closing down.

[rangieman]

i sell em all :P

based on peoples needs and expectations...
So your loyalty is to the man on the street with a pocket full of cash not to a certain manufactuer :cool:
No different to anyone else in buisness small or big:angel:
Or that person with a hole burning in their pocket that wants the best deal on a reliable product (in their opinion)
Everyone has their own thoughts and opinions on reliability with certain makes and brands and thats where their loyalty should be not a company that they work for and feel obligated to do so
Ive never had a new car in my life and are not in the market for one either

All the people i work with i could count on one hand in 13 years how many have bought new cars from holden not that they dont like them it also comes down to afordability for the people
If the company wanted workers to buy their product it would offer them a decent discount to encourage them to buy the product and then their car park would be full of their make maybe not new every year who could aford a new car every year on blue collar wages:angel:

[incisor]

So your loyalty is to the man on the street with a pocket full of cash not to a certain manufactuer :cool:
No different to anyone else in buisness small or big:angel:
Or that person with a hole burning in their pocket that wants the best deal on a reliable product (in their opinion)

yawn.....

stick your cynical notions where they belong..

i don't have your fixation on all things money, nothing i do is driven by money unfortunately for your argument...

i must be odd...

[scrambler]

When I was at Uni I read the detail on the Button car plan. I can't recall it all now (20 years later!) but the essence was that they would lose something like 3/4 of the Australian car industry jobs to reduce the cost of cars by 20%. All tarrifs would reduce to essentially 0 (I think we are about to hit this level?) to make imports equal to locally produced cars.

In the 70's ALL the major players had Australian-built cars, with Holden and Ford having large, medium and small cars all locally manufactored. Then local assembly began to creep in and eventually (under the Button plan) rebadged imports.

We could have Australian-made cars if we raised import tarrifs, but that would offend someone's flat-earth principles.

As for whether AULROians drive Australian or imported cars, my Land Rovers are all Australian-made (well, at least assembled :angel:) and the military ones had to meet Australian component quotas. :angel::cool::angel:

[rangieman]

yawn.....

stick your cynical notions where they belong..

i don't have your fixation on all things money, nothing i do is driven by money unfortunately for your argument...

i must be odd...:eek2::censored: :tease:
In your opinion only if i did have such a fixation with money as you state i would,nt be doing the job i do and i would,nt be married with children and all else that goes with life that costs a precious penny
Back to the thread:cool:

[mcrover]

I think we are missing a bit of the point. I dont buy nickel because we produce it. But do buy items produced downstrea.
600 people out of work in one hit especially if they are not skilled enough to enter another industry is not nice. Yes it does happen in every industry but is still not nice and often not really neccessary.
Our car industry get huge breaks from the government, so if taking stuff off shore should lose these.
Just watch a similar engine will come in from overseas shortly.
Mitsubishi have done it, now Ford, next probablly Holden.
Like I said with Mitsubishi if these conglomerates take their production off shore they should be taxed into oblivion unless there is genuinely no alternative.
If Holden or Ford made a decent locally produced 4x4, I would buy one, not the garbage they have on the market at the moment which are imports any way. I am generally talking about family car production such as Commodores, Falcons and Magnas.
Try and find another 600 positions for these people in any industry in the Geelong area, let alone the flow on job losses.
Yes Ford is a business and has the expectation to make money not lose it, but also has some community responsability.
Having said that I would not buy a Ford because they are a POS:o

Love our Statesman and Fender better.

They have 3 years to work it out.

Like I said before, some will retire, some will go elsewhere in the company and some will go to other industries and it will be the minority that will sit back and complain that they couldnt find a job outside Ford.

As far as the knockon affect that will double the job losses, that is what you get if you put all your eggs in one basket.

Geelong is a growing city, it isnt there just to build Ford cars. There are many other industries that the employee's will find they can go to and Ford are only closing the Engine plant, not the stamping, Chassis and Disign/Testing plant as far as I know so it is 1 out of I think 4 factories that Ford have in Geelong that will be closing.

There's also Pilkington Glass (I think it's thm but a glass manufacturer), Shell oil co., fishing and tourism along with all the supermarkets and shops that employ low trained workers.

There's a lot of building and construction jobs including the new bypass when ever it goes through and I know there will be a new Golf course being constructed soon and a housing estate near the sale yards so there will be plenty of jobs for anyone who wants to work as there always is.

I think they have recieved plenty of notice, the rest of us could be given 2 weeks notice at anytime and all they have to do is to call it a restructure and then they dont need an excuse if you work for a big company and if it is a small one then they can tell you to leave at any time without notice and you cant do much about it other than barter over a pay out figure.

In my case, all that needs to happen is a new commity be voted in that decides they dont need a mechanic and Im gone, I dont get a say in that and sure, It bothers me but I dont get angry about it as thats the way it works, a lot of people are on yearly contracts now so why should anyone be complaining about getting 3 years notice.

By the way Chris and Dave, this thread isnt about computers lol or buying Holdens, no one wants to buy a Chinese Bombodore, people are made to drive them by their bosses and wives.lol

If only Ford would drop the TDV6 into a BF and terratory body and maybe the supercharged RRS motor into a GT then they would have good reliable cars that were also economical.

AU was economical on fuel but not parts (especialy transmissions) and the BA was shocking on fuel but good for reliability, work that out.

So why have they not been able to market aussie built Falcon over seas, mainly because in the states, it would be taxed out of the range of their target buyer and their factories over there get subsities and tax breaks from the government if they are struggling unlike in AU.

No wonder we cant compete, in Korea, the government build the factory (building) and basically give it to the company to use while they are in business, so companies like Kioti tractors, also sole as Daedong and Branson in oz can expand their company for as little as thier tooling costs which is normally bought at auction from Kubota, Yanmar and the like.

Hyundai is similar in their car and machinary manufacturing, their materials are not nessesarilly cheaper but their labour and manufacturing systems are.

I dont think a lot of people realise that each time the unions push for a pay rise accross the board, CPI goes up accordingly so we are constantly in this never ending circle that things are just going to keep getting more expensive.

This cant be stopped as it is intrenched into our society and now that you cant buy a 2 bedroom house in Melbourne for less than $200000 I dont see it ever going backward but this is what causes multi national companies to look elsewhere as business is there to make money not freinds.

[FenianEel]

At the current rate, Australia will soon be a Gross Importer of Food, believe it or not.
Manufacturing industry, (as well as many others) in Aust. is struggling as a whole to compete on the world market, against cheaper imports and cheaper labour....unless you're part of the resource boom, or in cahoots with the Chinese.

It is sad that the Geelong plant is closing, but you've got a Yank in charge of Ford Aus, running it as part of Fords global money losing empire.
No diff. to GMH or any of the others.
Ford & GMH have done enough damage to the local industry by themselves in times past too.

Unfortunately, it's always the folks on the end of the chain that cop the pain but.

If we want to really get the Australian motoring industry back on it's feet, we should bring back the last truely Australian Car, pay 70's wages and sell em at 2007's prices..:2up::D

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/07/249.jpg

[barryj]

If we want to really get the Australian motoring industry back on it's feet, we should bring back the last truely Australian Car, pay 70's wages and sell em at 2007's prices..:2up::D

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/07/249.jpg


And you could put a 44 in the boot as well. Perfectly suited for LPG conversion :angel:.

[FenianEel]

And you could put a 44 in the boot as well. Perfectly suited for LPG conversion :angel:.

or 3 people at the drive through:D

[mcrover]

At the current rate, Australia will soon be a Gross Importer of Food, believe it or not.
Manufacturing industry, (as well as many others) in Aust. is struggling as a whole to compete on the world market, against cheaper imports and cheaper labour....unless you're part of the resource boom, or in cahoots with the Chinese.

It is sad that the Geelong plant is closing, but you've got a Yank in charge of Ford Aus, running it as part of Fords global money losing empire.
No diff. to GMH or any of the others.
Ford & GMH have done enough damage to the local industry by themselves in times past too.

Unfortunately, it's always the folks on the end of the chain that cop the pain but.

If we want to really get the Australian motoring industry back on it's feet, we should bring back the last truely Australian Car, pay 70's wages and sell em at 2007's prices..:2up::D

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/07/249.jpg

It's 2 P38s :o

I had one for a tow car for a little while and it was great, I would love to still have it as even on petrol it wasnt that expensive to run and you could fit a 44 of methanol +a huge snapon toolbox and spares in the boot, tow the car and trailer and me and my mate could cofortable sleep in it, 1 in the front bench seat and one on the back.

Yoou could fit about 250ltr gas tank like on a truck in the boot and still have more room than a new falcon or commodore.

Great car.:D

[Lucas]

[QUOTE=mcrover;569498]They have 3 years to work it out.

Like I said before, some will retire, some will go elsewhere in the company and some will go to other industries and it will be the minority that will sit back and complain that they couldnt find a job outside Ford.

As far as the knockon affect that will double the job losses, that is what you get if you put all your eggs in one basket.

Geelong is a growing city, it isnt there just to build Ford cars. There are many other industries that the employee's will find they can go to and Ford are only closing the Engine plant, not the stamping, Chassis and Disign/Testing plant as far as I know so it is 1 out of I think 4 factories that Ford have in Geelong that will be closing.

There's also Pilkington Glass (I think it's thm but a glass manufacturer), Shell oil co., fishing and tourism along with all the supermarkets and shops that employ low trained workers.

There's a lot of building and construction jobs including the new bypass when ever it goes through and I know there will be a new Golf course being constructed soon and a housing estate near the sale yards so there will be plenty of jobs for anyone who wants to work as there always is.

Mcrover
You are correct in saying Geelong is a growing city.
Pilkos has greatly reduced its production, I may be wrong but I belive to single shift, a lot of local business have already closed down due to competition with low cost manufacturing countries.
Ford shed 300 jobs down here at the end of last year.
Shell is very hard to get into, the majority of workers there are sub contractors, place booms during shut downs.

Bypass is in progress.

? fishing jobs, we wish :).

I am wondering where you are getting your information.

[Utemad]

I support my employer every fortnight when I pay my taxes :p

[mcrover]

[QUOTE=mcrover;569498]They have 3 years to work it out.

Like I said before, some will retire, some will go elsewhere in the company and some will go to other industries and it will be the minority that will sit back and complain that they couldnt find a job outside Ford.

As far as the knockon affect that will double the job losses, that is what you get if you put all your eggs in one basket.

Geelong is a growing city, it isnt there just to build Ford cars. There are many other industries that the employee's will find they can go to and Ford are only closing the Engine plant, not the stamping, Chassis and Disign/Testing plant as far as I know so it is 1 out of I think 4 factories that Ford have in Geelong that will be closing.

There's also Pilkington Glass (I think it's thm but a glass manufacturer), Shell oil co., fishing and tourism along with all the supermarkets and shops that employ low trained workers.

There's a lot of building and construction jobs including the new bypass when ever it goes through and I know there will be a new Golf course being constructed soon and a housing estate near the sale yards so there will be plenty of jobs for anyone who wants to work as there always is.

Mcrover
You are correct in saying Geelong is a growing city.
Pilkos has greatly reduced its production, I may be wrong but I belive to single shift, a lot of local business have already closed down due to competition with low cost manufacturing countries.
Ford shed 300 jobs down here at the end of last year.
Shell is very hard to get into, the majority of workers there are sub contractors, place booms during shut downs.

Bypass is in progress.

? fishing jobs, we wish :).

I am wondering where you are getting your information.

I used to work at the old Geelong golf club, I still keep in touch with some of the old staff so thats where I get my info from.

I know for a fact that come spring, some of the fishing charter boats strugle to find staff, I didnt know the bypass had started but I do know that some serious construction will be going on where the golf club was so that is something.

Your making out like there is no work down there but it is the same in the rest of country Vic, the work is there but you just have to look a bit harder than you do in melbourne.

I dont know whats happening in the rest of the manufacturing companies as I dont have anything to do with them but there is that much redevelopment going on down that way that construction companies are getting labourers from Melbourne to work down there.

If your down there then you know what im talking about, I worked in a country town throughout the recession and even though I didnt do what I wanted to do I still worked and got paid for it and seems most people live in the country for the lifestyle, then it doesnt really matter what you do, as long as you can get paid for it.

I think that Geelong engine plant workers have 3 years to sort out what they are going to do and thats a fairly long time, Im sure anyone could find an adaquate job if they wanted to in 3 years, even in Geelong.

[cartm58]

what do people forget the 1980's restructuring of BHP Newcastle Port Kembla and the loss of 15000 jobs when BHP modernised its steel making opertions

People forget the downsizing of SEC in Victoria from 30,000 plus to less than 8,000 under kennett

What about the SEQB in Qld under Joh

Where do you think the Redundancy provisions came from other than a reaction to the 1980's workplace changes and reduction of tariffs

Media makes every story as news as never happened before

Howard laws didnt cause Ford to close it plant or lay off its workers the cost of introducing new machinery to make new generation engines just too expensive and unit costs to make in australia too high

Your not going to cost compete against CHina when we are paing ourselves 5 times the monthly salary

[mcrover]

Your not going to cost compete against CHina when we are paing ourselves 5 times the monthly salary per week

How can we compete...

[barryj]

How can we compete...

When goods manufactured oversees arrive in Australia they still need storage, distribution, re-storing, selling, fitting, ongoing servicing, and eventually recycling or dumping.

Many of Australia's workers are employed just digging raw materials up and shipping overseas as we already know.

That's where we are headed in Australia.

They call it the service industry.

We all know about poor service so some people in Australia need to brush up on their people skills.

I hope Land Rover management are viewing this :soapbox:!

[cookiesa]

Didn't they and their dealer network write the book on how not to.....

[mcrover]

Didn't they and their dealer network write the book on how not to.....

I recon......:angry:

[CraigE]

Just read they will be bringing in an American V6 as the replacement engine.:(

[mcrover]

there goes the hope that it would be more fuel efficient and reliable...

[PAT303]

I think that alot of it is just the big guys screwing the little guys.How many fruit growers are going under because it is cheaper to import juice from oversea's.That is a load of s#@t.Woolies coles import the juice so there profit margins are bigger.How do you think they make half a billion dollars profit a year.They could buy local but they would only make four hundred million.That is why they go oversea's. Pat

[MrsMcRover]

Although they should also think about the people who are representing them also. Bad publicity travels further than good. Our local Ford Dealer is an A@#$%^&*. The whole town knows this also, leaves a bad taste in your mouth. Customer Service these days is severly lacking in alot of Industry these Days.

As for thier Winding down over three years. I guess i would take as a blessing at least it isnt sudden and if i wanted to jump ship now or in three years time its my choice to do so. I feel sorry the Geelong loosing and Icon after all this time.

Somthing tells me though with the way things are with the car companies these days. Ford isnt the last to fall, Here is hoping somone comes to LR rescue.

[CraigE]

Just think if you buy the new V6 powered Falcon when it comes out in the future you will be supporting the American economy. A good enough reason not to buy one on its own. I know GM and Ford both take profits, but at least GMH still makes local engines.:(

[barryj]

Just think if you buy the new V6 powered Falcon when it comes out in the future you will be supporting the American economy. A good enough reason not to buy one on its own. I know GM and Ford both take profits, but at least GMH still makes local engines.:(

If this is what you worry about we should all sell our Land Rovers and never buy another one.

[mcrover]

It is a hard one when it comes to profit share, as if people who have share portfolios that they have their superanuation tied up in dont make a profit then in the future they wont have enough money to retire.

Same with people who have investment portfolios tied up with shares in compnies like these, as they need to make a profit on their investment or else it isnt worth investing.

Whos to blame then, I wonder how many For employees have share portfolios and expect dividends each finacial year off them, and want them to increase each year until what the company has to do is cut as many corners as possible to provide a larger profit than the year before.

It is one thing to make extra money this way but you end up paying for it in another or someone does.

Im not saying any of this is wrong but im asking if your going to blame the BIG companies, blame the people who own it and expect a return on their investment.

Any one can buy shares in Ford, GMH, CBA, NAB, ANZ, Telsra, Optus etc etc but each time that CBA increase their fee's, do the people who have their money invested in shares complain about it, as they are the ones calling for the banks, car co.s and the like to make a profit, so blame them.

They are not nessesarilly australian but they including my self (with my super)are to blame in the end.

[CraigE]

Not questioning buying an import, but the Falcon & Commodore and previously the Magna were supposed to be locally made to a certain % to retain to retain tax relief and keep Aussies employed.
Basically we will be now supporting the American government to do just this in America.
Ford will continue to sell the cars just with lower Aussie input and more money going OS.

If this is what you worry about we should all sell our Land Rovers and never buy another one.