Nation of suck ups.

[abaddonxi]

I can barely believe that most of Sydney has been shut down and inconvenienced for the APEC thing.

Now the arrival of Bush is live on television.

I'm not a monarchist, but when was the last time we went to this kind of trouble for the Queen, or even Prince Charles?

Suck holes.

Cheers
Simon

[460cixy]

dead right mate soft as a pensioners turd

[hiline]

i'm glad you guys in Sydney got it and not us here in Melb :tease::tease:

and who cares about Bush :angel:not me

[100I]

who?

[sam_d]

i'm glad you guys in Sydney got it and not us here in Melb :tease::tease:

and who cares about Bush :angel:not me

Yeah, it's a real bitch having a public holiday forced on us. :p

Seriously though, I'm not looking forward to the next couple of days getting to and from work. If the trains screw up my usual option of walking home part of the way isn't available.

[tombraider]

and who cares about Bush :angel:not me


I do... I love Bush....

What? Whats that? He's talking about who?:eek:

OH ****......:(

Please disregard my last statement......

[cartm58]

with all the nuclear powered aircraft carriers floating around the world doing **** all, you think they would hold APEC on board somewhere in the middle of the Pacific where no one would be inconveinced and nobody could protest against them

[dobbo]

They should buy an island somewhere, hold it there then GW could sit in Dr No's chair with his hand on the trapdoor button.

[dobbo]

Yeah, it's a real bitch having a public holiday forced on us. :p

Seriously though, I'm not looking forward to the next couple of days getting to and from work. If the trains screw up my usual option of walking home part of the way isn't available.


Why is the Berlin wall, Razor wire, snipers or the Blackhawks in your usual throughfare?

[bushrover]

Yeah, I wish I could be in amongst the protesters to add my two cents worth (with a huge stick, and belt the crap out of the dole bludging low life ars....es) Bush my not be anyones favourite politician or be in the top one percentile of intelligencia but at least he had the gusts to take on the toughest job there is. There are millions of wheels out there going about their daily business and doing their job but its only the squeeky ones we hear and I doubt any of the squeeky ones would have the guts or ability to do the job any politician does.

Rick

[dobbo]

Yeah, I wish I could be in amongst the protesters to add my two cents worth (with a huge stick, and belt the crap out of the dole bludging low life ars....es) Bush my not be anyones favourite politician or be in the top one percentile of intelligencia but at least he had the gusts to take on the toughest job there is. There are millions of wheels out there going about their daily business and doing their job but its only the squeeky ones we hear and I doubt any of the squeeky ones would have the guts or ability to do the job any politician does.

Rick


So you think it's right to spend billions of tax payers dollars to secure and effectivally stop one of the worlds major cities when the meeting could be held someplace else, in a nice resort or something? Protests happen and not all protesters are dole bludgers. Perhaps you should sand some of that tarnish off your stick. For the record I have never been a protester.

[blitz]

ya gotta love politics, without the likes of Bush and the rest of em who would we take the p*&&s out of?






Toyota owners



ah hahahahahahahahahahahaha


Blitz

P.S. it is my democratic right to dislike the lot of them

[vnx205]

I'm not a monarchist, but when was the last time we went to this kind of trouble for the Queen, or even Prince Charles?

Cheers
Simon
It's not because the Queen deserves less attention; it's because she needs less protection.
In spite of what happened to Lord Louis Mountbatten, generally there are fewer people determined to get the Queen compared with the number of people who have it in for Bush. It's been a while since the queen sent troops into some foreign country.
While we are on that subject do you like the comment that if you believe the Gulf war was not about oil, do you really think the US would have invaded Iraq if it held 10% of the world's broccoli?

[Bushwanderer]

Yeah, I wish I could be in amongst the protesters to add my two cents worth (with a huge stick, and belt the crap out of the dole bludging low life ars....es) Bush my not be anyones favourite politician or be in the top one percentile of intelligencia but at least he had the gusts to take on the toughest job there is. There are millions of wheels out there going about their daily business and doing their job but its only the squeeky ones we hear and I doubt any of the squeeky ones would have the guts or ability to do the job any politician does.

Rick

Hi Rick,
You're sounding like a "redneck".

Why shouldn't people be allowed to protest?

[harro]

So you think it's right to spend billions of tax payers dollars to secure and effectivally stop one of the worlds major cities when the meeting could be held someplace else, in a nice resort or something? Protests happen and not all protesters are dole bludgers. Perhaps you should sand some of that tarnish off your stick. For the record I have never been a protester.


Then nobody would even know it was happening.
The posturing and grandstanding are all part of the game.
A resort on an Island would be a logical choice and relatively easy to secure.
The sydney lockdown and wall are really more for attracting attention to their self importance and to further enhance the current national security (fear campaign) that has become a major part of this Govt. pre-election manouvering.
I guess the real question is whether these exorbitantly expensive talk fests actually achieve anything.

As for protesters, the usual police Vs protesters media footage is always great fodder for all the conservative "law and order" zealots and "dole bluger" bashers that let their votes be influenced by this sort of crap.

In the end, more the calculated stunt with impeccable timing that we have all come to expect.

Cheers,
Paul. :twobeers::twobeers:

[incisor]

In the end, more the calculated stunt with impeccable timing that we have all come to expect.
you got it in one i think...

[JDNSW]

.........
In the end, more the calculated stunt with impeccable timing that we have all come to expect.
.......

But pretty much a moot point whether it will have a positive or negative impact on voting - my guess is that it will have very little impact at all - the positive effects will be counterbalanced by the negative effects, and the people who are enthusiastically either for or against were already committed to the government or opposition anyway.

John

PS My uneducated guess is that APEC is likely to be a net negative for the government, mainly because Bush is a negative with many more Australians than he is a positive. Of course, this has nothing to do with the real value of the meeting anyway.

[sam_d]

The thing that annoys me about protests is that it is nice and easy to say "Stop The War" or "End Climate Change" etc but they never seem to have an answer as to how these things can be achieved.

Sure, it's easy enough to say "Stop The Use Of Fossil Fuels" but what is the alternative? Wishful thinking isn't going to power my V8. Power stations can't run on rainbows and herbal tea.

I would have a lot more respect for protestors if they could propose reasonable solutions instead of just shouting about things they don't like.

[Quiggers]

I can barely believe that most of Sydney has been shut down and inconvenienced for the APEC thing.

Now the arrival of Bush is live on television.

I'm not a monarchist, but when was the last time we went to this kind of trouble for the Queen, or even Prince Charles?

Suck holes.

Cheers
Simon

The real reason why there's a huge fence running thru the Sydney CBD is not to keep others out.
It's to keep Bush and his mob in!:D:D:D

Simon, I have to go from the Central Coast to Silverwater early on monday morning - how bad is the traffic situation?

I'll give you a call too, when I'm in Syd...

Cheers, GQ

[cartm58]

I doubt any of the squeeky ones would have the guts or ability to do the job any politician does.

Remind what do politicians actually do for a job

[dobbo]

The real reason why there's a huge fence running thru the Sydney CBD is not to keep others out.
It's to keep Bush and his mob in!:D:D:D

Simon, I have to go from the Central Coast to Silverwater early on monday morning - how bad is the traffic situation?

I'll give you a call too, when I'm in Syd...

Cheers, GQ


Leave before 6am and you'll be right, after 6am the F3 is a moving gridlock

[waynep]

They should buy an island somewhere, hold it there then GW could sit in Dr No's chair with his hand on the trapdoor button.

Nauru perhaps ..or Christmas Island ..I hear our Govt, has built some excellent accomodation there ....with security fencing already installed.

[4bee]

Anyone know yet what the APEC uniform will be?

Akubras & RM Williams Longhorn togs & boots perchance?

Khaki shirts & shorts?:D

[Quiggers]

I'd like to see them all in blue singlets, stubbies and thongs... then again...probably only Putin has the physique....

Wonder what "the Chaser' boys are planning?

Has Kevin Rudd been invited? Given he's looking good to take over in a few months?

GQ

[incisor]

Wonder what "the Chaser' boys are planning?
heard on the abc this morning "they" got a special visit from nsw police & security saying do not attempt anything, enter the area and you will be arrested :P

sounds like a nice big juicy carrot :P

[loanrangie]

Nauru perhaps ..or Christmas Island ..I hear our Govt, has built some excellent accomodation there ....with security fencing already installed.

Perfect location, send them all to bird ***** island !

[JamesH]

Since when is hosting leaders from other nations sucking up? It's easy for me to say over here Perth but some people need to get over themselves. It's for a week and they are important decision makers discussing important topics.

There would not be the need for the fence or half the security if the protesters weren't such idiots. Resistance, Socialist Alliance with nothing better in their heads than a desire to smash the windows of McDonalds plus a few menopausal old biddies whining about whales and rock art who wouldn't have a clue what's going on. Give me a break. Water cannon is too good for them in time of drought.

If you have to say it in the main street of Sydney with a giant Bush puppet, then it's not worth saying. Certainly not worth listening to.

If you find yourself wanting to walk down the street with a dreadlocked feral smelling of patchouli and BO and a face like they fell into a tackle box then it's time to hop in your Landie and go out into the countyside for a camp and some serious solitary introspection.

[Bigbjorn]

Remind what do politicians actually do for a job

They scheme to get re-elected. The public service runs the country.

[D3Jon]

If you find yourself wanting to walk down the street with a dreadlocked feral smelling of patchouli and BO and a face like they fell into a tackle box then it's time to hop in your Landie and go out into the countyside for a camp and some serious solitary introspection.

ROFL :D:D:D:D Love it.... classic stuff..

[mudmouse]

It's amazing what you get used to. This thing only runs for a couple of days, yet look at the crap transport, roads, hospitals, water and fuel services you get on a daily basis in Sydney...let alone a roof over your head.

There is no other viable location for a meeting of this size - 4000 delgates and hangers on? I don't think they'd appreciate 'head to toe' boarding house bed sharing in...

[4bee]

Who wants to have a bet on how many of the freed 500 low security prisoners will rock up & ask to be locked up again come Monday?

"Smith W. Present
Wilson H? Wilson H? Wilson H?

Peterson V? No reply,

James, Jesse.? No reply


How many unsolved weekend breaking & enterings, car thefts etc will be down to this bunch?

Who will take responsibility. Govt.? Coppers? No-one?

[disco2hse]

GW could sit in Dr No's chair with his hand on the trapdoor button.

Dr Evil more like, with your PM as mini-me :wasntme::angel:

We got it when APEC was in Auckland. Total pain in the neck and very little to show for it for us in the street.

For myself though, I like Bush-whacking :twisted: in the Rover of course :D:D

[100I]

I thought they were periodic detainees, or whatever they're called. Rob Hay?
Anyway, they're people who haven't paid fines or such and basically go to jail for the weekend but live per normal during the week. They lose their free time.

[mittadisco]

Anyone know yet what the APEC uniform will be?

Akubras & RM Williams Longhorn togs & boots perchance?

Khaki shirts & shorts?:D

Steve Irwin look alikes.

My gripe is why the public holiday didn't extend to whole of NSW.....

Caption for this photo please?
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

the problem is they were driving a humvee and not a Land Rover:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

[disco2hse]

Caption for this photo please?
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

Is yours riding too?

[Fourgearsticks]

Caption for this photo please?
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/


lil Johnny to lil Georgie............
Just say there'll never ever be an invasion of Afganistan, they'll believe you. I said something similar a few years ago and whenever I think of how gullible our voters are I wet myself laughing.




http://www.nicholsoncartoons.com.au/cartoons/new/2005-10-22%20Iraq%20quagmire%20Howard%20Bush%20450.jpg



Is that an illegal refugee ship I see on the horizon lil Georgie? Maybe I can get a free ride through the next election.

[100I]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/



Psst, Johnny, those guys are calling you Mudguard, shiny on top and **** underneath.

[Chenz]

ROFL :D:D:D:D Love it.... classic stuff..

Bring out the water cannon and give all a good scrub.

In the fair dinkum dept. If these idiots - like the ones in Melbourne for the econoamic forum a couple of years ago that smashed up cop trucks, threw bottles at police and generally wrecked the joint, got their message across peacefully then we wouldn't have to turn Sydney into Stalag 13.

If that is acceptable behaviour then god help our country.

I hope they think of the cops families when they try and put a few cops in hospital.

It is easy to blame the pollies but they are not the ones throwing the molotovs.

[mudmouse]

I can barely believe that most of Sydney has been shut down and inconvenienced for the APEC thing.

Now the arrival of Bush is live on television.

I'm not a monarchist, but when was the last time we went to this kind of trouble for the Queen, or even Prince Charles?

Suck holes.

Cheers
Simon


I see your point but who spends 10, 20 or 30 grand on equipment for a car they might need a few times a year, let alone use.............we do. Diff locks, muddies, roof racks, spotties, winches - because we want it there just in case the sh*t hits the fan.

[Bigbjorn]

Both Bushes stuffed up their respective invasions of Iraq. They should have finished the job, not just defeated the Iraqi armed forces. They should have invaded, defeated, subdued, disarmed, & occupied the whole damn country. As for having whole towns in armed insurrection against the occupying forces, can you imagine Sepp. Dietrich, Panzer Meier, or Klim Voroshilov tolerating that sort of behaviour from a captive populace? Their reprisals don't bear thinking about

[mittadisco]

Bush says he's sorry.....
Sorry for the inconvenience, says Bush (http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/09/05/2024714.htm'section=justin)

what you didn't see on the ABC website:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

[mittadisco]

Maybe some more of these could be produced:

http://larko.planet.ee/larkoorg/wanted.gif

Well someone has the decency to apologise:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

A prior meeting:

http://www.joemande.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/pot-kettle.jpg

[disco2hse]

Well someone has the decency to apologise:

http://markpincus.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/ct_bush.JPG

Photoshopped.

The bullet holes tell a better story anyway.

[4bee]

Then nobody would even know it was happening.
The posturing and grandstanding are all part of the game.
A resort on an Island would be a logical choice and relatively easy to secure.
The sydney lockdown and wall are really more for attracting attention to their self importance and to further enhance the current national security (fear campaign) that has become a major part of this Govt. pre-election manouvering.
I guess the real question is whether these exorbitantly expensive talk fests actually achieve anything.


Why does Harro's opinion sound very reasonable?

[abaddonxi]

It's not because the Queen deserves less attention; it's because she needs less protection.
In spite of what happened to Lord Louis Mountbatten, generally there are fewer people determined to get the Queen compared with the number of people who have it in for Bush. It's been a while since the queen sent troops into some foreign country.
While we are on that subject do you like the comment that if you believe the Gulf war was not about oil, do you really think the US would have invaded Iraq if it held 10% of the world's broccoli?

Umm, not to stir the pot too much, but didn't the UK send their troops into Iraq at the same time as the rest of us?


Since when is hosting leaders from other nations sucking up? It's easy for me to say over here Perth but some people need to get over themselves. It's for a week and they are important decision makers discussing important topics.

There would not be the need for the fence or half the security if the protesters weren't such idiots. Resistance, Socialist Alliance with nothing better in their heads than a desire to smash the windows of McDonalds plus a few menopausal old biddies whining about whales and rock art who wouldn't have a clue what's going on. Give me a break. Water cannon is too good for them in time of drought.

If you have to say it in the main street of Sydney with a giant Bush puppet, then it's not worth saying. Certainly not worth listening to.

If you find yourself wanting to walk down the street with a dreadlocked feral smelling of patchouli and BO and a face like they fell into a tackle box then it's time to hop in your Landie and go out into the countyside for a camp and some serious solitary introspection.

Okay, number one, I don't have a problem with international diplomacy and the rest of it, I have a problem with shutting down an entire city to provide security which as I understand it is mostly for the benefit of G. Bush. It seems arrogant and high handed on the part of the government to inconvenience hundreds of thousands of people so that they can hang out at the Opera House and the Icebergs restaurant in Bondi. To me it shows an enormous lack of respect for the citizenry on the part of the government.

Number two, I seriously doubt that the security is to stop protesters. Hell, I hope it isn't to stop protesters, I think it's to stop terrorists killing all of these terribly important people.

Number three. The point is not what you look like, but your right to free speech and express your opinion just like any other citizen. Just because you don't like the way they look or smell, or what they say doesn't negate their right to free speech.

EDIT: Sorry, looks like I was wrong they are allowed to protest, just not where they want to.
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/full-scale-riot-alert/2007/09/05/1188783287291.html


Cheers
Simon

[harro]

Steve Irwin look alikes.

My gripe is why the public holiday didn't extend to whole of NSW.....

Caption for this photo please?
http://www.theamericanmag.com/images/issues/0412/tacco_dec.jpg
"Don't worry about the polls pal, I'll give you a Tampa they will never forget,
North Korea or Iran?"
"Oh hell lets just toss for it.":rocket::rocket::rocket::rocket:


:angel:

[Rovernaut]

I hope if if I go to America that the Amercian tax payers see it in their hearts to contribute a few of their tax dollars towards my visit, Since my taxes were wasted on the Bush junket when he visited Sydney with his ridiculous 600 plus enterage. Even had his own chefs, Isn't the humble Aussie Maggot bag with a bit of dead horse good enough for him.
And to inconvenience a whole city the size of Sydney, it would have caused less fuss ansd disruption if it was held in Canberra our nations capital. ( oh not in our backyard)
Then I suppose Lake Burley Griffin has nothing on Sydney harbour if you want to show off,
Yankee go home I say and take your hanga on-ers with you:D

[Rovernaut]

Bush says he's sorry.....
Sorry for the inconvenience, says Bush (http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/09/05/2024714.htm'section=justin)

what you didn't see on the ABC website:

http://stevenberg.net/wp-content/uploads/2007/01/bush-finger.jpg
I don't think it is the finger, - more a 'come here little Johny Howard' pose

[LandyAndy]

Hey Simon.
The monarchy only look after a bit of the world.
GEORGE W rules the universe and Johnny is his lap dog wanting to be Mini Me:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
Andrew

[JDNSW]

.......
And to inconvenience a whole city the size of Sydney, it would have caused less fuss ansd disruption if it was held in Canberra our nations capital......

You can't land a 747 in Canberra - so I guess that settles it!

John

[harro]

You can't land a 747 in Canberra - so I guess that settles it!

John

He can't what ????????????
The leader of the 'free world' can do whatever he likes!:D

[bushrover]

So you think it's right to spend billions of tax payers dollars to secure and effectivally stop one of the worlds major cities when the meeting could be held someplace else, in a nice resort or something? Protests happen and not all protesters are dole bludgers. Perhaps you should sand some of that tarnish off your stick. For the record I have never been a protester.

$170 million according to the news man. Cheap when you consider the potential benefits from trade between Australia and the other APEC countries.

And I can hear the whingers now "Bastiges waisting my taxes on a 5 star resort". Negativity has never solved a single problem. Having the guts to do something about it should be applauded whether you agree with the man or not. And for the record I have protested, peacefully and with dialogue.

[George130]

You can't land a 747 in Canberra - so I guess that settles it!

John
Sorry but yes you can. It has been done a few times and they have enlarged the runway now also.

[bushrover]

Hi Rick,
You're sounding like a "redneck".


Why shouldn't people be allowed to protest?

Redneck??? Redneck??? Who me??? No way!. Arrogant, ignorant, obnoxious, pig headed, uninformed? Maybe just a little bit. My Uncle's are rednecks. My cousin Earl's a redneck. My old man's a redneck, (dont tell him that because he might thump you) but I wasn't influenced by any of them in any way.

I dont have a problem with protesters, they have a problem with me!

[Lotz-A-Landies]

You can't land a 747 in Canberra - so I guess that settles it!

John

John

I think you are sort of mistaken on this occasion, when the former President Clinton visited Sydney in the late 1990's they brought SAM 27000 a B707 to fly the Sydney - Canberra leg as Air Force One.

Unfortunately SAM 27000 had engine trouble while being pre-flighted for the mission to Canberra and without an alternative aircraft being available, the trip was done in SAM 28000 one of the two B747's we usually associate as being Air Force One.

The landing of B747's at Canberra however remains below the specified safe minimums certified by Boeing.

C ya
Diana

[Bushie]

So what went wrong ????



Last Update: Monday, February 27, 2006. 12:48pm (AEDT) Upgrade to pave way for more 747 flights

The Canberra International Airport will soon be open to frequent 747 flights with the Federal Government announcing a multi-million dollar upgrade of its main runway.
The airport has a limit on the number of large flights it can accommodate because of the strength of its main runway.
Federal Transport Minister Warren Truss says the Government will spend $28 million to enable the runway to take heavier aircraft.
"There will be quite a number of these aircraft coming into Australia, they're required here for operational purposes, with visiting dignitaries and their entourages or for military purposes," he said.
The airport's Stephen Byron says the upgrade also coincides with a plan to lengthen the runway.
"We believe that will assist us in terms of the development of new routes into and out of Canberra," he said.
The work will be carried out at night and is expected to be ready in time for the 2007 APEC meeting.




Martyn

[4bee]

Didn't the Chinese leader fly from Canberra to Sydney today in his 747? I saw it on the box so it must be true.

[LandyAndy]

Was it Perth to Sidanee???
He was in Perth last nite.
Andrew

[blitz]

I don't think it is the finger, - more a 'come here little Johny Howard' pose

The little black thing in bush's lap is our own little johnny and you know what bush is saying "do as I say or you know where this is going"

blythe

[Disco300Tdi]

I heard a comment on radio talk back today..

"I hope the protesters turn up as it could be a waste of money otherwise"...:eek:

[Disco300Tdi]

Both Bushes stuffed up their respective invasions of Iraq. They should have finished the job, not just defeated the Iraqi armed forces. They should have invaded, defeated, subdued, disarmed, & occupied the whole damn country. As for having whole towns in armed insurrection against the occupying forces, can you imagine Sepp. Dietrich, Panzer Meier, or Klim Voroshilov tolerating that sort of behaviour from a captive populace? Their reprisals don't bear thinking about

Go back another generation Brian
Grandaddy supplied scrap metal to the Germans for weapons....

[LandyAndy]

There was a dog breeder on the wireless in WA baying for blood thismorning.
Airforce1,Caddilac1 and Snifferdogs1!!!!!
This bloke was most upset that the dogs are allowed in with no quarrantine,JUST BECAUSE HE RULES THE UNIVERSE!!!!
Andrew

[blitz]

bugger the photo of bush flipping the bird didnt copy with the quote

blythe

[DiscoStew]

And to inconvenience a whole city the size of Sydney, it would have caused less fuss ansd disruption if it was held in Canberra our nations capital.

I heard an interview with the guy in charge of security. Also did security for the 2000 Olympics. He was peeved they chose Sydney as it is a nightmare with so many unused underground tunnels to secure and so many people to disrupt.

He really wanted them to use Cairns. Much easier to secure and a lot less disruption. He obviously lost that argument.

[4bee]

Was it Perth to Sidanee???
He was in Perth last nite.

No, Andrew. It was Perth, Canberra & up to Sinny. Was on SKY.

He must have flown at roof top level as no sooner he was up & he would be down again.:D

[harro]

He really wanted them to use Cairns. Much easier to secure and a lot less disruption. He obviously lost that argument.

Nooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not Cairns, anywhere but Cairns.

Brisbane would have been much better.:p

[Quiggers]

Hamilton Island, got everything anyone would need for an APEC chat fest, including a moat:D:D:D

GQ

[numpty]

Hamilton Island, got everything anyone would need for an APEC chat fest, including a moat:D:D:D

GQ

Why pick on me?:o I'd have to be on standby all the time:o

[Quiggers]

Sorry Numpty, nothing personal.

But, fortunately, it wont happen again here anytime soon...

...should be another 20 years, if all countries involved do their bit....:D:D:D

GQ

[Bigbjorn]

Go back another generation Brian
Grandaddy supplied scrap metal to the Germans for weapons....

We had an Australian politician do that. In fact he is The Runt's hero.

[Quiggers]

Good old 'Pig Iron Bob',
I thought he was flogging it (iron) to Japan....
but I may be wrong....

Hey, Brian, wasn't Ford complicit in keeping (some) industry going in Germany, in the earlier days of WWII?

GQ

[mittadisco]

"I'm not a great fan of President Bush and his policies," Mr Garrett said.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/09/433.jpg

[Bigbjorn]

Ford and GM had German branches and so did a lot of others across a wide range of industries. I wonder what happened to ownership and dividends when the US declared war? I suppose they had no option but to do war work given the totalitarian government in the Third Reich. Put a few CEO's in Dachau and the others would soon co-operate.

[Quiggers]

Thanks Brian, one of those stories of WWII which has never been overly dicussed...

The pic of Peter Garrett is superb, he's about my age, and makes me look so much younger...:D:D:D

He looks like my (once upon a long time ago) 70yo (exWWI/Gallipoli/Somme/Egypt/etc) grandfather,

as I knew him when I as a kid...remarkable...

GQ

[harro]

"I'm not a great fan of President Bush and his policies," Mr Garrett said.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/09/433.jpg

Unfortunately the quote of an Idealist learning to be a politician.:wallbash:

[Lotz-A-Landies]

...
... Hey, Brian, wasn't Ford complicit in keeping (some) industry going in Germany, in the earlier days of WWII?

GQ
Don't know about Ford however GM was the big winner - during the war GM got subsidised to build new factories to produce: trucks; tanks; aircraft; and munitions and were paid for each item that came off the production line.

In Germany during the war Opel got subsidised by the NAZI's to build new factories and produced: trucks; tanks; aircraft and munitions and were paid for each item that came off the production line. Opel even had slave labour supplied from NAZI concentration camps.

Some GM built airoplanes flew over Germany and dropped GM manufactured bombs onto Opel factories, which during the war were re-build by the NAZI's so that Opel could continue production.

After the War under the Marshall Plan, GM went to the US Government and received reparations for the damage the US war machine had done to it's Opel factories.

Who ever said War was a bad thing. :wasntme: Haliburton surely hasn't suffered this time around, neither has Don Rumsfeld it's former CEO. :nazilock:

Diana

[JamesH]

.

After the War under the Marshall Plan, GM went to the US Government and received reparations for the damage the US war machine had done to it's Opel factories.



Yes, the Marshall Plan. That is where the US after making a major, perhaps the major, contibution in liberating Europe from fascism then went and spent billions rebuilding those countries so they could remain free. And to quote Condoleeza Rice, what did they ask in return? Just enough land to bury their dead. And the same happened in Japan.

That is what the US really is and long may Australia do what it can to support them in the ongoing battle for simple human decency. The less like the US your country is, the more likely you are to be cold, wet, hungry and repressed.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

...
... That is what the US really is and long may Australia do what it can to support them in the ongoing battle for simple human decency. The less like the US your country is, the more likely you are to be cold, wet, hungry and repressed.

Hmmm - ?????

Not sure that I would like to be in a country like a G Dubilya Bush America. Would much prefer a W "don't talk about my interns" Clinton style America, we sure wouldn't be in Iraq if the 2 term rule wasn't there.

And if we want to talk about freeing the masses - why isn't the US military in Zimbabwe and Palestine?

Not that the Westminster system, with an elected house of review doesn't have flaws, but it is sure better than rule by an "I govern at my pleasure" Bush, an un-elected Executive branch and an "I answer to no one" Cheney.

Diana
(No I'm not a democrat)

[mittadisco]

Anyone know yet what the APEC uniform will be?

Akubras & RM Williams Longhorn togs & boots perchance?

Khaki shirts & shorts?:D

predictable driazabone stuff (http://www.smh.com.au/multimedia/2007/national/apec-outfits/start.html) :eek: - scripted by makers of mcleods daughters

[p38arover]

The pic of Peter Garrett is superb, he's about my age, and makes me look so much younger...:D:D:D

He looks like a character from an alien invasion movie - he's the alien! :D

Ron

[Grizzly_Adams]

(No I'm not a democrat)

Nothing wrong with being a democrat, why is everyone so afraid of admitting the believe in a democracy? Sheesh.

Sure it slows things down because you gotta ask for the people's view on pretty much everything, but at least then the work carried out is as "the people" (well, the majority at least) wanted.

Alas it, like any other political system, can be influenced for your own personal gain :(

[Ralph1Malph]

we sure wouldn't be in Iraq if the 2 term rule wasn't there.

And if we want to talk about freeing the masses - why isn't the US military in Zimbabwe and Palestine?



Hi, been following this thread with interest and only just decided to add my two bobs worth.

Before I get razzed on it's fair to say that I am conservative leaning, and being a Soldier I am also pro interventionist.

Lotz-A-Landies,
Why would we not be in Iraq? It is a world problem, not just Americas. Yes I am biased I guess,;) having recently returned from there, but it is a seriously fugged up country! The strife was inevitable and they are killing themselves as is their time immemorial tradition, the coalition isn't.

Not sure why we aren't in Zim, but why we are not intervening in Palestine is simple....there is no such country:eek:. Many people flag the UN as needing to step up in many areas, well they did in the middle of last century by creating Israel and in the process consigning Palestine to history. For any country to advocate the return of Palestine is in disagreeance with the UN.
No member nation would do that. :angel:

On a side note for discussion, I am intrigued by the notion of Arabs. Where are they from? Arabia? Again, the academically accepted view is that you are an Arab if your lingua franca is Arabic. Therefore it is very possible (see Israel) for a blonde haired blue eyed 6' tall man born in Iceland of Icelandic parents to be classified as an Arab:o. Again, no such nationality exists.

To finish my rant, for that is what it is, we have a saying in the Military.....

:pNobody likes Americans, but they have to be on someones side. Best they be on ours for it is the Devil we know.
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
Ralph

[duff]

That's really funny what you say,, because what you have said about protesters is exactly what I think about the World Bleaders.

"IF YOU HAVE TO GATHER IN SYDNEY UNDER THE MEDIA SPOTLIGHT TO SAY SOMETHING IT CAN'T BE WORTH SAYING"
You say a week to get important crap sorted out.. these bludgers get elected on PR crap spend three years wofling about how useless the other side are and then just out of the next election they put in place a small portion of what they promised last election and then start cage rattling about the next election.
There isn't a farts chance in hell of these wallys sorting anything out in a week

For god sakes,,, with the modern technologies we have ,, if they where serious about life threatening security issues(and clever economic policies) they could hold their meeting over the fanciest big screen web conference call from their own bloody bedrooms. OR as others have said they could simply utilize an island or remote area, if they are desperate for face to face.

Its another tax payer funded feel good publicity stunt.!:twisted:

And the protesters,,,,,, give me a break will you... we have slaughtered 100's and thousand's (UN figures) of mothers and children over the last fifteen years in Iraq alone,,, so people have the freedom to protest. (as long as they are peaceful)

The pollies have spent over a billion dollars on the APECthetic meeting to get a point across, so good on the protesters for using the billion dollar spotlight to make their point.

The last thing I want is for Australians to become a country of flag kissin mindless sheep



Since when is hosting leaders from other nations sucking up? It's easy for me to say over here Perth but some people need to get over themselves. It's for a week and they are important decision makers discussing important topics.

There would not be the need for the fence or half the security if the protesters weren't such idiots. Resistance, Socialist Alliance with nothing better in their heads than a desire to smash the windows of McDonalds plus a few menopausal old biddies whining about whales and rock art who wouldn't have a clue what's going on. Give me a break. Water cannon is too good for them in time of drought.

If you have to say it in the main street of Sydney with a giant Bush puppet, then it's not worth saying. Certainly not worth listening to.

If you find yourself wanting to walk down the street with a dreadlocked feral smelling of patchouli and BO and a face like they fell into a tackle box then it's time to hop in your Landie and go out into the countyside for a camp and some serious solitary introspection.

[harro]

That's really funny what you say,, because what you have said about protesters is exactly what I think about the World Bleaders.

"IF YOU HAVE TO GATHER IN SYDNEY UNDER THE MEDIA SPOTLIGHT TO SAY SOMETHING IT CAN'T BE WORTH SAYING"
You say a week to get important crap sorted out.. these bludgers get elected on PR crap spend three years wofling about how useless the other side are and then just out of the next election they put in place a small portion of what they promised last election and then start cage rattling about the next election.
There isn't a farts chance in hell of these wallys sorting anything out in a week

For god sakes,,, with the modern technologies we have ,, if they where serious about life threatening security issues(and clever economic policies) they could hold their meeting over the fanciest big screen web conference call from their own bloody bedrooms. OR as others have said they could simply utilize an island or remote area, if they are desperate for face to face.

Its another tax payer funded feel good publicity stunt.!:twisted:

And the protesters,,,,,, give me a break will you... we have slaughtered 100's and thousand's (UN figures) of mothers and children over the last fifteen years in Iraq alone,,, so people have the freedom to protest. (as long as they are peaceful)

The pollies have spent over a billion dollars on the APECthetic meeting to get a point across, so good on the protesters for using the billion dollar spotlight to make their point.

The last thing I want is for Australians to become a country of flag kissin mindless sheep

Hear Hear!:thumbsup:

[landyfromanuthaland]

You gotta admit even though we follow the yanks around in there various little wars they create to keep the armaments factories in biz we as a small country have done quiet well, we havent lost very many diggers compared to the yanks and poms, look at East timor, we lost 2, one got skittled by a forklift, the other shot himself while cleaning his gun in the back of a APC, were still there all these years later, as for Afghanistan and Iraq again no big mobs of coffins coming home to parents, we are doing ok, if we are gonna suck up to somebody i would prefer we kiss the Yankees toes then the Chinese, if we get poked by some peed off country one day who we gonna call? wont be ghost busters thats for sure, yes the yanks run around carrying on thinking they are the policemen of the world but somebodys gotta do it, I certianly can feel for all the Sydney siders who are put out by the preparations to keep the Bush man safe, they could just as easily had the meeting in a submarine 2000 feet under water, with a slow leak of course!, the burden to the tax payer will be enormous and does ol Bushy crack out the cheque and say What do we owe ya?

[Disco300Tdi]

Below is part of the transcript tonight on 60 minutes

PETER HARVEY: While all of this street theatre was being played out, there was just as much drama down at the Opera House where world leaders were playing out the final act in the biggest economic show that's ever rolled into Sydney. Remember, APEC was an Australian idea, conceived back in 1989 by Bob Hawke. You're the father of the child - what's it grown into?
BOB HAWKE: Well, it's a pretty lusty 18-year-old now ...
PETER HARVEY: Now, nearing 80, the former PM keeps a watchful eye on his brainchild. You've got the leaders of Russia, China, the United States. I mean, they wouldn't bother coming here unless it was fair-dinkum, would they?
BOB HAWKE: No, you're right. The Putins and the Bushes of this world and the Hu Jintaos don't come unless they see significance in the opportunities provided by such a meeting.
PETER HARVEY: Do you think we appreciate it as much as we should? BOB HAWKE: Perhaps not. To have these leaders here, talking with our leaders, talking with one another, this doesn't come easily and it's something we should be proud of.

[Bigbjorn]

Why would we not be in Iraq? It is a world problem, not just Americas. Yes I am biased I guess,;) having recently returned from there, but it is a seriously fugged up country!
Ralph

It wasn't a fugged up country until America decided to invade on either a trumped up excuse or wrong intelligence. It may have had a complete asshole as a dictator, but there are no shortages of these around the world. I don't see the ones without oil fields being put in their place

[ak]

It wasn't a fugged up country until America decided to invade on either a trumped up excuse or wrong intelligence. It may have had a complete asshole as a dictator, but there are no shortages of these around the world. I don't see the ones without oil fields being put in their place

Correct, however my father fought the Japs in the second world war and he always use to say the same thing " if it had not been for America we would have been stuffed today". Before we blame America for every thing that goes wrong in the world we should remenber this.

And no I am not American.

[olbod]

Once upon a time I had high hopes and involved myself
in world affairs but I grew out of it !
These days, if the stupids around the world want to slaughter each other, so be it.
The reason they give for doing it, is usually not the line we are fed.
Pity about the poor innocents caught up in it all but I
dont concern myself about it anymore . I'm okay jack.
Take the gun happy Yank society. They have the God given right to bear arms. Good on them. They kill each other in large numbers because they can.
I say to myself : "Self, do I care ?" Answer is, no I dont, thats another one or more off the street.
God bless America, the home of the brave and free.
Do I care if the Mugslims are blowing each other
up over there ? No I dont. If they did it here that would be different, I'd kill em.
If some of the Palestinians weren't so bloody stupid
they would realise they are playing a mug's game.
If they want their own State, well then, stop blaming the Jews and the Americans and become peaceful
and show that they want to be peaceful good neighbours. If they do that we will all applaud and
the Yanks will pour in lots of money and aid to help
them become a Democracy, etc. Dont need the United
Nations or anyone else to achieve that.
Then when they have a state of Palistine and become
a Nation they can slowly build up a sizable defense force with all of the modern munitions ( with America's
help because they will be arming themselves to keep America safe in the fight for Democracy ).
Then when they do that, they can attack the Jews or anyone else to their hearts content on equal terms
and not feel inferior and downtrodden, eh.
I really dont give a crap about it all anymore.
I'll be right because I put a pess off sign on me gate.
If humanity is wiped out, that's okay with me.
If the planet is given back to the animals and wildlife thats fine with me.
Cheers, I think.

PS: IF ya drive a Landrover, ignore the pess off sign !

[mudmouse]

As for being 'suck ups' i think it's more a matter of recognising your limitations and working with people or organisations to better yourself - whether thats a country, business or individual. History shows, and will continue to show, how Oz cannot exist on it's own with stubborn idealism.

APEC was one week! Have a look around the house and count how many things are produced in Australia..we need bigger brothers, oil, uranium and ore sales....the WA boys will back that.

..and the appreciation of their support during the War years is getting too easily dismissed by those who have no f*cking clue how close it was. We're still very very lucky to have what we've got.

[olbod]

I forgot to say that I appreciate having the Yanks as allies but sometimes I wonder if they would really come
to our aid if we were seriously threatened ?
Or would economics play a part in their decision ?
Would our attackers have a larger consumer benifit to
American trade and big business ? What would be in it for the Yanks, would intervention help to keep America safe and prosperous. After all that's the only thing that
matters !
I would be happy to pay higher taxes to build up our
defense forces and capability to deter eyeballers !
I'd even buy the Army new rifles.
A lot of people protested when there was talk of having an American military base on our soil.
I dont want it either, we dont need it but there might
come a time when it would be in our interests to have
an American presence on our shores up north.
Gaum is being done over as a huge military base but
a Battle Group located up in the Gulf might come in handy. At least it would have the buggers committed
if they were here in a small capacity.
At least in future times that dickheaded Dubbya would
be a thing of the past, eh.
I also like the emerging Chinese, tho not their Commo doctrine. I have known many Chinese people and can
call some of them Mates.
America is trying hard to make them the next cold war
enemy but they are being stiffled by American big business interests who want to trade with them, like us.
When it comes down to it, China has only ever interfered with one other country and that was Tibet.
They have to be condembed for that.
Also, unlike those other revolting Bastards they dont have a whaling fleet !
The chinese dont go around killing lots of outsiders.
Themselves yes, but once again I couldn't care less.
Sad to say tho, that since WW11, the Yanks have killed far more allied men, women and children than they have killed the so called enemy.
They condone these deaths by saying that it needs to happen in the fight for Democracy and to keep America safe. The dead allies should be proud for playing their part. Thats how the condi ricebubble explained it.
I saw the interview. Got to be something wrong with that !
I am a supporter of the Yanks internal gun laws !
Cheers, I hope.

[olbod]

PS:
I supported the Korean and Vietnam wars, still do, even
tho more innocents than enemy died.
I supported the first Gulf war also. It was a great sight to see those mugslims getting their asses cooked while they were running away. That was about the only time when the innocents didn't die by our hands.
I do not support the present Gulf war because it came
about by lies and deceit and the three that brought it
on, ( bush, cheney and rumsfelt ), I consider the biggest threat to world peace and security.
But then I considerer just who it is thats getting killed
and think who cares !
I do support our presence there and in Afganistan
because we have to support our Allies when they need us.
I can remember the scenes when the taliban executed the women at the soccer stadium that the west built
them. When we protesed about the stadium being used
for such a purpose the taliban said its an ideal place
so why not just build us another soccer stadium for
sport.
They are the major drug producers, so I would be in favour of the yanks saturating the place with agent orange and have all of the inhabitants relocate to serbia.
Cheers.

[duff]

In reply to quote below "Those who have No ****ing clue" ?? Pull your head in.

Even if America hadnt sat on the side lines during world war 2 selling arms to both sides until near the end and even if they hadn't starved Japan of Coal, forcing Japan into the War. Just lets for a minute, stick our collective heads up our arses and believe all ther PR crap written by Hollywood over the last fifty years. They have gone to far over the last twenty years..... Even the most loyal of dogs is shot if it goes mad.

I dont care if they saved the universe fifty bloody years ago......HISTORY can't hurt me ,, today and the future can.

And yeh all my forefathers have fought in all the wars on our side, and yes i am off very soon for the same, Doesn't mean you have to blindly follow lunatics.
We are big boys and have always been respected for our integrity internationally,, something that is quickly disappearing.
:twisted:



As for being 'suck ups' i think it's more a matter of recognising your limitations and working with people or organisations to better yourself - whether thats a country, business or individual. History shows, and will continue to show, how Oz cannot exist on it's own with stubborn idealism.

APEC was one week! Have a look around the house and count how many things are produced in Australia..we need bigger brothers, oil, uranium and ore sales....the WA boys will back that.

..and the appreciation of their support during the War years is getting too easily dismissed by those who have no f*cking clue how close it was. We're still very very lucky to have what we've got.

[Ace]

None of this crap has anything to do with the leaders of the other countries, it was all Bush, Bush has gone home, but howard is still meeting with the boss man of canada and china today and tomorrow. Is all the security still around? No of course its not, Bush isnt in the country anymore so no need. I bet Bush was the only leader to bring 650 staff and his own vehicles or the motorcade.

[JamesH]

"Those who have No ****ing clue" ?? Pull your head in.

forcing Japan into the War. :twisted:

Oh, forced, were they? I see. And meanwhile in Europe it was the US at the Treaty of Versailles that "forced" Hitler to take over all of Europe and butcher all those people. Those crazy muslims were "forced" to fly two jets into the WTC because Bush and Howard were the bigger terrorists.

I don't know what planet you people are living on. But you're living on it thanks to the US in particualr and western capitalist countries in general (no, I don't mean you, France).

One day I might meet an anti-US bleater who isn't a giant phoney. We saw a lot of anti-Bush protestors but not too many anti Ju or anti Putin protestors, we can deduce from this that the protestors don't give a rats about freedom of speech, workers rights, peace and a decent standard living. What do they give a rats about? Posing and bludging and fondling themselves for the benefit of nobody - that's my call.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Hi, been following this thread with interest and only just decided to add my two bobs worth. ...
Ralph

Your opinions are worth every bit as much as everyone else's - that is democracy working. (I love democracy just not necessarily the Democratic Party in the US or the essentially defunct Democrats over here, although I do have centre left leanings! )


... Before I get razzed on it's fair to say that I am conservative leaning, and being a Soldier I am also pro interventionist.

Lotz-A-Landies,
Why would we not be in Iraq? It is a world problem, not just Americas. Yes I am biased I guess,;) having recently returned from there, but it is a seriously fugged up country! ....
From the outset I was and maintained my stance against the war. Even wrote to John Howard prior to the war saying what has happened would happen and got his standard letter reply. This war was always about the oil, Donald Rumsfeld even stated it is about 1997 "That's our oil" he said.

I have no objection to the intervention in Afghanistan. HOWEVER there was never any evidence that Al Qaeda was in Iraq and they are there now only because of the the Invasion by the "coalition of the willing".

Saddam could not have lived forever and he was only as much a tyrant as Muggabe is in Zimbabwe.

Now that we have created the mess-O-ptamia the coalition of the not so willing is forced to remain.


The strife was inevitable and they are killing themselves as is their time immemorial tradition, the coalition isn't.
Since before biblical times there has been the same type of sectarian fighting. Why should we (the US and friends) have become the focus of it?


Not sure why we aren't in Zim, but why we are not intervening in Palestine is simple....there is no such country:eek:.
I seem to remember that our grandfathers (or great grandfathers) in the 1st, 2nd, 4th and 5th Divisions and the Australian Desert Corps fought in Palestine. I also seem to remember that there was a UN sanctioned division of the country into the Israeli territories and also somewhere for the Palestinians. If the bit where the Israelis live is Israel then surely the bit where the Palestinians live (and have lived for hundreds of years) should be called Palestine?

Many people flag the UN as needing to step up in many areas, well they did in the middle of last century by creating Israel and in the process consigning Palestine to history. For any country to advocate the return of Palestine is in disagreeance with the UN.
No member nation would do that. :angel:

It is only because of the US that Israel exists, and it is only the continued powers and monetary support of the US that Israel continues to exist. Also you will find that the 1993 Oslo Accord included as a criterion for peace signed by both Israel and the Palestinians a "future Palestinian State".

In regard to the rest of the rant: Arabs have as much right to be Arabs as jews have to be jewish. It is the Europeans who drew lines in the sand and gave them names, they were once all arab lands belonging to all the various sects and tribes. Just because the French and British decided where Mesopotamia was and which bit was Syria doesn't mean that they were correct. If they were where is Kurdistan?

End of Rant.
Diana

BTW. While I don't support the war, I do support the soldiers who are following the instructions of our elected government.

[duff]

Many discussions in this topic, too many for such a forum,, but basically I am just sick off people trying to justify invading counties and killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people by saying it is for the power of good over evil. CODS WALLOP. its about oil and resources in general. Even East Timor had huge oil implications for regional powers. (which is cool, the strong prevail) but we are no better than any other super power throughout time. we look after ourselves first
"if you aren't with us you are with the terrorists against us" GW Bush stated something along these lines, and then followed with "and we will hunt down and kill all terrorists". So don't **** me with we are hero's fighting evil terrorists. we are simply on one side of the conflict. For many of the worlds population we are the terrorists (embargoes or bombs,, they both kill innocent people)...

In Reply to quote-- OK so Forced was an emotive description. But the fact is Japan stayed out of the war and went through many world etiquettes to have their resources turned back on. They had as a matter of record, approached the world and highlighted that because of the world tensions and consumption of resources(coal and oil) their people were faced with devastation. They indicated clearly that if the resources that they had access to for years were not returned they would be faced with starvation as a nation or take desperate steps(Do or Die). The US and the rest of the Anglo Saxon world had the power to do this and didn't...... So like us in the western world faced with the desperate consequences of loss of oil control,,, the Japs chose to try and secure the needed resource via Military Mite.

SO maybe not FORCED but "Cause and effect" in play.
AND I'm sorry but none of this is new... since the days of the Romans a world super Power has tried to control the world in the fashion they see fit.. the Romans were wrong, the British were wrong, the Germans where wrong, the Japs were wrong, the Russians were wrong, and by trend I am afraid the Americans are wrong.... and like every single one of the dictators before them they will probably fail...They will expend all their resources until they are faced with humiliating shrinkage as a world power,, well I hope because the other option is a very nasty 'ALA Germany'.
But I do note that perhaps Australia is still savvy,, we are hedgeing our bets and getting cosy with CHINA, the one country(super power) that has existed in one form or another the whole time and morfed into what ever is needed at the time.

Very condensed rant here, but i believe people should look beyond the "big ticket" western written history and look at history as one long story, it is surprisingly common threaded (not-cause and effect again)
Not supporting Germany's actions in Europe.. But in their eyes they were attempting to re balance the world to their ideologies, the world had been changed by outsiders (JEWS) and other unrelated world events dramatically over the previous 80 years. They employed preemptive strikes on countries that they believed to threaten their own peoples way of life,, they attempted to secure world oil supplies. they financially propped up countries sympathetic to their own cause,, OHH hang on, largely what the yanks are doing now.... I am employed to support the machine securing our way of life,, and will unquestionably do so, but don't try and tell me its for the good of the people we slaughter.. its for us and only us.


Oh, forced, were they? I see. And meanwhile in Europe it was the US at the Treaty of Versailles that "forced" Hitler to take over all of Europe and butcher all those people. Those crazy muslims were "forced" to fly two jets into the WTC because Bush and Howard were the bigger terrorists.

I don't know what planet you people are living on. But you're living on it thanks to the US in particualr and western capitalist countries in general (no, I don't mean you, France).

One day I might meet an anti-US bleater who isn't a giant phoney. We saw a lot of anti-Bush protestors but not too many anti Ju or anti Putin protestors, we can deduce from this that the protestors don't give a rats about freedom of speech, workers rights, peace and a decent standard living. What do they give a rats about? Posing and bludging and fondling themselves for the benefit of nobody - that's my call.

We could go on for ever about this so reply if you like, I like to hear all peoples views,, but it is emotive so I am off topic now.. getting a bit beyond Land Rover stuff.