The crappiest Australian cars ever made.

[B92 8NW]

What do you reckon is the crappiest Australian car that you have ever driven?

Personally for me its the 1992 VP Commodore that I have to drive at present (boy do I miss my Disco).

The headlights are rubbish, the automatic transmission seems to do what it likes and needs manual intervention to be normal... the engine is as rough as guts at idle... it rolls worse than a Disco on corners... kickdown is slow to work... arghh it goes on...:D

worst of all are the DIABOLICAL tail spins. Even on a light throttle with this wet Melbourne weather it loses traction at the drop of a hat.

I have no idea how I managed to, but I stalled it. Stalling an auto....! That is Taxi driver material!

The Kingswood with 202 and Trimatic was better than a VP:D

[twitchy]

P76

[dobbo]

Early Mitsubishi magna


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/11/384.jpg

[RonMcGr]

Joel,

You have sure opened a can of worms :)

How about Holden Sunbird, with starfire 4 cylinder motor, Leyland P76, soon to be out done by Mitsubishi with the Sigma, Magna and 380.

Lightburn Zeta, Vauxhall Viva, EA Falcon 3 speed, The later Chrysler Valiants, Datsun 120Y, Morris Marina, Austin Kimberley and not to forget the Ford Capri convertible that leaked like ...... :D

Cheers

[RonMcGr]

Early Mitsubishi magna


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/11/384.jpg

Yes mate,
That was a Tu*d :D

[rovercare]

What do you reckon is the crappiest Australian car that you have ever driven?

Personally for me its the 1992 VP Commodore that I have to drive at present (boy do I miss my Disco).

The headlights are rubbish, the automatic transmission seems to do what it likes and needs manual intervention to be normal... the engine is as rough as guts at idle... it rolls worse than a Disco on corners... kickdown is slow to work... arghh it goes on...:D

worst of all are the DIABOLICAL tail spins. Even on a light throttle with this wet Melbourne weather it loses traction at the drop of a hat.

I have no idea how I managed to, but I stalled it. Stalling an auto....! That is Taxi driver material!

The Kingswood with 202 and Trimatic was better than a VP:D

So you bought it new and maintained it accordingly??

Not always the cars fault;)

[B92 8NW]

Another one... Ford Lasers of this type
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

The auto's were crap!!! I totally ignored "D", around town just left it in "1":D:D (or "2" if it was lucky) just to keep the thing moving

[JDNSW]

I think it would be difficult to go past the Lightburn Zeta. Anything else is the acme of perfection compared to that.

There have been some rather strange ones though, such as the Southern Cross (mid engine with a wooden chassis and body) but it never really got into production whereas the Zeta did.

John

[CraigE]

AU Falcon easily, looks loke a prego hippo.

[B92 8NW]

So you bought it new and maintained it accordingly??

Not always the cars fault;)

Yep! Mum bought it in 1993 at the Lexcen Runout, Nunawading Toyota and had it serviced by Toyota until they no longer had Commodore parts about four years ago.

[JDNSW]

Another one... Ford Lasers of this type
http://www.tx3nz.com/img/picsbymodel/kb.jpg

The auto's were crap!!! I totally ignored "D", around town just left it in "1":D:D (or "2" if it was lucky) just to keep the thing moving


I had the preceding and following models as company cars - the earlier one was one of the best cars I have ever had - bought it from them when it was replaced, and eventually sold it to buy the County. Its successor - well, we nicknamed it Murphy - because if anything could go wrong, it did. (The second one was auto, the earlier one manual)

John

[rovercare]

Yep! Mum bought it in 1993 at the Lexcen Runout, Nunawading Toyota and had it serviced by Toyota until they no longer had Commodore parts about four years ago.

I'll eat my words:eek:

[landyfromanuthaland]

Fords made from 1979 to 1990 are all junk, rotten flimsy door handles, thin windscreens that break if u fart near one, flimsy hinges, thin body steel that causes doors to drop of cause the hinge mount on door cracked away or rusted away, toomuch plastic that goes brittle with age all sorts of little do dads that clap out, fall off, no not that well made,not to mention the silly mechanisms in the doors that open and close, plastic relays in doors that snap the list goes on.

[landyfromanuthaland]

The KA and Kb lasers are without doubt great little cars long as they arent autos, best first car for kids, very little goes wrong with the E5 motor, parts are cheap and they go like rockets and are reliable, the bubble lasers are different, crappy rear wiper motors that snap off, head gasket dramas etc, I specialised in these when I had my wrecking yard with dad, very popular.

[landyfromanuthaland]

All TM and TP magnas should have been included as ballast in the Titanic, Mitsy Colts with that silly split shift gear box, nissan bloody bluebirds were the biggest pile of rubbish ever and dont forget the Sigma another fine piece of engineering excellence, I heard with the lightburn Zeta if you turned the ignition key backwards the motor would run backwards giving you several reverse gears.

[B92 8NW]

I'll eat my words:eek:

Our old Land Cruiser though was a heap of ****e! Totally abused and neglected, Toyota refused to even service it until it was clean! I think dad once did 30,000 without an oil change after the odo stopped working:eek:

That was unequivocally "operator error":D

[googe]

Early Mitsubishi magna


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/11/384.jpgdont forget this piece of crud to :)

[B92 8NW]

dont forget this piece of crud to :)

Best review I read in the age on the Mitsu 380... quote "They should have named it the 180, showing that it was making a turnaround, but its still heading in the same direction as all of its flawed predecessors.

[rovercare]

Our old Land Cruiser though was a heap of ****e! Totally abused and neglected, Toyota refused to even service it until it was clean! I think dad once did 30,000 without an oil change after the odo stopped working:eek:

That was unequivocally "operator error":D

We have a HJ60 and a HJ45 at work for maintenance, with over 300k, glazed up like you wouldn't believe and abused by the fitters have been there for over 5 years now.................don't leak oil and seldom fail:eek:

I must say, its hard to beat toyota tough:angel:

[landyfromanuthaland]

Back in 1971 my dad had a lwb petrol cruiser ute with a cage on the back as his police wagon, not real quick and not real comfy but it never gave trouble, dad use to grease it everyday without fail, the road condition around Timber creek in the NT at that time were not great, dad loves the cruisers, he came home every friday nite with the cage full of drunks of various types he used to scrape out the pub, court in the morning and painting the rocks white up the drive way for punishment!

[harry]

:angel:
P76

obviously you didn't own one.

[Jamo]

HQ. It's reputation was pure fiction created by GMH spin.

THe P76 was a good car, let down by Leyland who released too soon.

[googe]

We have a HJ60 and a HJ45 at work for maintenance, with over 300k, glazed up like you wouldn't believe and abused by the fitters have been there for over 5 years now.................don't leak oil and seldom fail:eek:

I must say, its hard to beat toyota tough:angel:

Totaly agree :) me and my old man have a HJ47 we use to go minning out near winton every time we go out there its loaded to the eye balls 400ltrs desiel,300ltrs water and tools cloth's anything u can mention its on there and its never let us down.Its cruise's on 110 on the hiway no worries.We just cant seem to kill it :)

[solmanic]

Early model Holden Camira.

...and mid & late model Holden Camiras for that matter.

In fact, I can't recall seeing any still on the road at all these days.

[scrambler]

Early model Holden Camira.

...and mid & late model Holden Camiras for that matter.

In fact, I can't recall seeing any still on the road at all these days.
A colleague of mine had one, and it got what it deserved: his cat lived in it. Mind you, it might have been the last functioning Camira in Australia. When he got rid of it he took a work Camry. It too became the cat's home ... well, they didn't make any money sending IT to auction either!

[spudboy]

Joel,

How about Holden Sunbird, with starfire 4 cylinder motor

I'm voting with RonMcRg on this one. It was a shocker!

[nobbydoldrums]

Can't say I agree with the OP...

I have a VN commodore which I (ab)use whilst the series III is off the road - which is all the time. Sure the auto trans takes a minute to switch into drive and the rear end spins out if you take corners too fast - but thats just part of the fun.

It's one of the quicker, and most economical cars I've driven, and it's been the cheapest car (maintenance wise) I've ever owned - but then again I have owned Fiats.....

[Lotz-A-Landies]

P76

Joel,
You have sure opened a can of worms :)
....., Leyland P76, ....Cheers
How many of you have actually driven a P76?

This is an urban myth about them being really crappy cars, yes there was some industrial espionage perpetrated by "employees" of Ford and Holden plants in Sydney. But the car itself was quite ahead of its time. How many Range Rovers have been running around with the P76 V8 and glad of it after the "crappy" underpowered Rover 3.5 litre.

The wedge shape design that was so laughed about has been used by both Holden and Ford in their own models to the current day.

The demise of the P76 was a political decision after back room meetings by the "Big two" car makers of the time.

Please strike the P76 off your list there are much more worthy candidates for crappy cars.

Diana

[JDNSW]

The problems with the P76 were -

1. Last Desperate bid for the Australian market by a company that was in deep trouble.

2. Marketing the largest family car on the market coinciding with the first major oil price shock (Most buyers failed to note that it used less fuel than its competitors, but the whole market sector stalled)

3. Appalling styling - and Diana is right about the competitors later copying the styling, although not to such an extreme - and theirs was equally appalling.


None of this had anything to do with the quality of the car, so it is hard to put it in the crappiest anything.

John

[weeds]

How bout the holden camira? My parents brought the very first model when it was car of the yeae

[Redback]

How bout the holden camira? My parents brought the very first model when it was car of the yeae

European

As with alot of the cars mentioned, some assembled here.

Holden, Falcon (from 72 on only) and P76 built here, don't know about the ZETA, Valiant was assembled here not built here.

Baz.

[JDNSW]

European

As with alot of the cars mentioned, some assembled here.

Holden, Falcon (from 72 on only) and P76 built here, don't know about the ZETA, Valiant was assembled here not built here.

Baz.

Valiant was built under the Australian manufacturing rules, and was required to have an Australian content of something like 95% from memory, so I don't see how you can say they are assembled not manufactured here.

Certainly they were not an Australian design - but then neither were the original Falcons nor the Holden 48/215 for example.

There is no black and white line between assembled and manufactured - the rules were always on $ content. It was easy to reach around 50% just by assembling the vehicle with a few local bits such as tyres and glass, and perhaps upholstery, as a large part of the cost of a vehicle is assembly. And fairly easy to get to about 60% by adding local springs, wheels, electrical gear etc. But around there you have to start making major mechanical components and pressings, and the capital expenditure gets quite high. And the last few % gets really hard as it means that you to make all the little detail bits locally that are usually bought in - and this means you have to adapt the overseas design to use parts in common with existing local designs.

Once the manufacturer has decided to tool up for Australian manufacturing, the design can be changed in quite major ways from the original overseas design, or you can use a completely original design (e.g. P76).

But this whole scheme has changed in recent years, with reduced import protection making local content less important, but also the change allowing exports to be credited against imports in determining whether duty free import of parts is allowed.

Just to summarise, there is no clearcut line between assembled and manufactured, but the Valiant was certainly manufactured. (to my knowledge anyway)

John

[RonMcGr]

European

As with alot of the cars mentioned, some assembled here.

Holden, Falcon (from 72 on only) and P76 built here, don't know about the ZETA, Valiant was assembled here not built here.

Baz.

As John has posted, Valiants were built at the Chrysler factory, in Adelaide. The first three models were the same as the Canadian version. After that, they were Australian design to suit our conditions.

The Chrysler Royals we made we totally Australian, based on the Canadian 56 Plymouth. :)

The Zeta was made by the Lightburn washing machine manufacturer in Adelaide. He built them around the same time the Morris Mini was released and subsequently had a lot of difficulty selling them.

[vnx205]

The problems with the P76 were -

1. Last Desperate bid for the Australian market by a company that was in deep trouble.

2. Marketing the largest family car on the market coinciding with the first major oil price shock (Most buyers failed to note that it used less fuel than its competitors, but the whole market sector stalled)

3. Appalling styling - and Diana is right about the competitors later copying the styling, although not to such an extreme - and theirs was equally appalling.


None of this had anything to do with the quality of the car, so it is hard to put it in the crappiest anything.

John
Just about everything I have ever read about the P76 confirms my long held belief that it was a car that deserved a much better fate.
Friends who bought them new loved them, especially the V8.
The information in the Powerhouse Museum in Sydney is worth a look.
I have forgotten some of the details, but I seem to recall that the V8 engine was about half the weight of US V8s at the time.
I also seem to recall that it introduced quite a few features like concealed wiper blades that we now take for granted.

I like to think that without the problems John mentions above it could have been a world beater.

[vnx205]

The Zeta was made by the Lightburn washing machine manufacturer in Adelaide. He built them around the same time the Morris Mini was released and subsequently had a lot of difficulty selling them.
That is about all I can remember about the Zeta.
Could someone with a better memory than mine add a few more details about the car?
If my hazy memory is correct then I believe that a detailed description will have people who have never heard of the vehicle wondering how anyone could have had the temerity to try to foist such a car on the Australian public.

[JDNSW]

That is about all I can remember about the Zeta.
Could someone with a better memory than mine add a few more details about the car?
If my hazy memory is correct then I believe that a detailed description will have people who have never heard of the vehicle wondering how anyone could have had the temerity to try to foist such a car on the Australian public.

"The vehicle was powered by the Villiers Ltd 324 cc two-stroke motor with drive to the front wheels. The motor's stated output was 12 kW, giving a performance reported as almost nil and drive was via a motorcycle gearbox and chain drive. The Viliers Sibastart engine was designed for an 'Invalid Carriage' (a motor-tricycle) and so had a 4 speed multiple wet-clutch sequential gearbox in unit with the engine. Reversing the car required stopping the engine, then restarting using the electramatic system which spun the engine in reverse.


The standard Zeta did not come with a rear hatch so access to the cargo area required removal of the front seats, the ease of which was advertised as a positive feature. The chassis was steel, with a fibreglass body enclosing a large but sparse interior. Car tyres were not available at that time of such a small size ; hence wheelbarrow tyres were used.

The dimunitive Sports model, which was similar to the also Australian Goggomobil, used a West German Sachs single cylinder 125cc engine."


See:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightburn_Zeta

I think most will agree that any shortcomings of other cars made here pale into insignificance in comparison.
John

[JohnE]

Its all academic,
i mean its what you personally find as crappy in a car.
personally I have liked all the aussie cars I have driven, some or most have had some sort of inherent problems, but we live with that, either not getting that brand again or getting a newer , fixed model.
having said all that and having been able to have a few work cars over the years,( dog transport)
the worst that I recall, thats from the factory was the EA falcon wagon, as mine were all dog box fitted.
from the day i picked it up at the vehicle section it had probs, all the nuts holding things on were loose, from the seats to the door hinges, the engine bits that had hoses on them were held on by those springy clips, to everything leaked, i used to carry a tool kit with me to tighten everything back up, the suspension, when you went around a corner hard, ( right hand) you could look at the road from the drivers seat. And power, well it didn;t have any, 40k later it was replaced with an EB11 now that was a nice car to drive.

[MacMan]

I've had hate/hate relationships with:

1987 TN Magna.
Hand me down from my dad who ran it without servicing for way too long, then put it in to have coolant changed by Mitsu dealers who forgot to do up bottom hose clamps. He half cooked it on the way to Bendigo. At 110,000km it got its second trans fluid change :eek:.

Believe it or not it was white, had no hubcaps and plenty of carpark dings. Someone still stole it. Was recovered minus bumpers and lights.

I had to get the auto rebuilt. If anyone wants to know who NOT to use in Dandenong for auto transmission rebuilds PM me.

Used more oil that petrol. Cam chain noise out of this world. Sold it at 140,000km and heard it did a head gasket very shortly after.

Even the ones that were serviced suffered from crap autos and standard rubbish Astron motors. I will NEVER buy a new Mitsubishi anything. Silly thing was it was actually a very easy car to drive fast.

VN (Lexcen) Commodore wagon.
Handled like a boat. Terrible ergonomics. Terrible auto. Terrible lights. Terrible build quality. Rough engine. Electric gremlins. Noisy ride. Good tow vehicle and was used to cart dirtbikes all over the shop.

Biggest blessing was it's theft and payout to agreed value of $5500 three years ago!

[Outback 1]

We have a HJ60 and a HJ45 at work for maintenance, with over 300k, glazed up like you wouldn't believe and abused by the fitters have been there for over 5 years now.................don't leak oil and seldom fail:eek:

I must say, its hard to beat toyota tough:angel:

go and wash your mouth out !you naughty boy ! :Dlol:D

[Quiggers]

A few Camiras still clog the roads around here.

Sounds like I must've had the only EA (a Fairmont Ghia) which worked, bought it when it was just 4 years old for about $11k, had it for years, cost not much to run...was okay...

GQ

[FenianEel]

The P76 is probably the BEST car EVER MADE in OZ.
It was a truly unique project, and miles ahead of anything available at the time.
First car in OZ with "executive" level and whole host of other groundbreaking firsts.
25 years after its demise GMH blow their own trumpet about an all alloy v8:rolleyes: and Volvo go on about their new side impact protection system (which is almost a direct copy of the P76s).
If Leyland wasn't run by tools, if their wasn't an oil crisis, if the big 3 didn't use industrial sabotage and if the Govt of the day was supportive of it, it would've left the others for dead.

Anyone who bags them, is normally a hearsay expert, and has never owned or even driven in one.

I have a photo of Peter Brock sitting in one. He said they were one the best cars ever made here.

We still own 5!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/11/382.jpg

[Bigbjorn]

The problems with the P76 were -

1. Last Desperate bid for the Australian market by a company that was in deep trouble.

2. Marketing the largest family car on the market coinciding with the first major oil price shock (Most buyers failed to note that it used less fuel than its competitors, but the whole market sector stalled)

3. Appalling styling - and Diana is right about the competitors later copying the styling, although not to such an extreme - and theirs was equally appalling.


None of this had anything to do with the quality of the car, so it is hard to put it in the crappiest anything.

John

We had P76's as company cars at Leyland Truck & Bus. They were a bloody awful car, particularly the next to useless six cylinder with auto. The only version with any performance was the rare V8 with 4 speed.

[JohnE]

The P76 is probably the BEST car EVER MADE in OZ.
It was a truly unique project, and miles ahead of anything available at the time.
First car in OZ with "executive" level and whole host of other groundbreaking firsts.
25 years after its demise GMH blow their own trumpet about an all alloy v8:rolleyes: and Volvo go on about their new side impact protection system (which is almost a direct copy of the P76s).
If Leyland wasn't run by tools, if their wasn't an oil crisis, if the big 3 didn't use industrial sabotage and if the Govt of the day was supportive of it, it would've left the others for dead.

Anyone who bags them, is normally a hearsay expert, and has never owned or even driven in one.

I have a photo of Peter Brock sitting in one. He said they were one the best cars ever made here.

We still own 5!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/11/382.jpg




'5' must have a big shed,
funny how suburban rumours take over from practical points on cars. I had a mate or two that had p76's and they swore by them ( not at them) reckoned they were a great car. alas I never drove one.



john

[Bigbjorn]

As John has posted, Valiants were built at the Chrysler factory, in Adelaide. The first three models were the same as the Canadian version. After that, they were Australian design to suit our conditions.

The Chrysler Royals we made we totally Australian, based on the Canadian 56 Plymouth. :)

The Zeta was made by the Lightburn washing machine manufacturer in Adelaide. He built them around the same time the Morris Mini was released and subsequently had a lot of difficulty selling them.

Valiants were Australian manufactured and complied with the Australian content rules. The local content rules were the reason the first Bathurst Chargers had three speed transmissions as Chrysler would have had to import a four speed and this would have put them under the required local content.

[FenianEel]

'5' must have a big shed,
funny how suburban rumours take over from practical points on cars. I had a mate or two that had p76's and they swore by them ( not at them) reckoned they were a great car. alas I never drove one.

john

I'll bring one down for a spin.
Have a huge shed, (and a couple of humpy/stand to's):D

[Rayngie]

this is easy, I don't think they were sold in Asutralia, but we had them in NZ.

VN Commodore with a 2.0l engine....would'nt pull the skin off a rice pudding, have no idea what the reasoning was for it, but they were truly pathetic.

[Jeff]

EA Falcon, my dad had one and it put him off Fords for life, everything that could go wrong did and at the worst time.

Mitsubishi Colt, if it was assembled here. I worked for the Dept of Admin Services in the late 80s and early 90s and these almost spent more time on tilt trays than on the road. Most cars were sold at 40 000 km but these would barely reach 15 000 because people hated driving them as they might not come back. If you turned on the aircon they felt like they would stall and the steering was ridiculously heavy for a small car.

Jeff

:rocket:

[JohnE]

this is easy, I don't think they were sold in Asutralia, but we had them in NZ.

VN Commodore with a 2.0l engine....would'nt pull the skin off a rice pudding, have no idea what the reasoning was for it, but they were truly pathetic.


yup think they were here the 4 cylinder motor.

we recovered one years ago that had been stolen, took it back to the station,( easy to steal) to get fingerprinted. why, because the grubs who stole it wrote all over the vinyl seats and outside in texta, 'buy a bigger motor' ' my pushbike goes faster'

in the engine bay there was half a motor 4 cyl

john

[Bigbjorn]

The Morris Marina was another complete dog. The six cylinder version was bloody dangerous as well. The 1960 XK Falcon was another pile of puss. No local engineering input to enable it to withstand Australian conditions. Anyone who used them in the rough stuff, found they had bought a self-disintegrating motor car. The earliest ones were a lovely example of engineering down to a price. They even had a printed cardboard speedo face. The four cylinder Toranas with Opel and Starfire and the later Commodores with the Starfire were the result of a public perception that "four cylinder cars were cheaper to run" and thus the Marketing Dept's need for a four cylinder. The sixes were cheaper on both fuel and maintenance but the customers were fixated on four cylinders. I do notice that the Starfires fitted to Toyota Corollas outlasted both the Toyota engines and the rest of the car. Note that Holden never promoted the fours on economy, only on "four cylinders". Sigmas were another piece of junk, heavy on fuel, oil burners, atrocious dust entry, all of which was denied by Mitsubishi. So-called luxury cars fare no better. Jaguars rust, are electrically unreliable, high and expensive maintenance requirements and the V12's are an absolute money pit. BMW's and SAAB's are almost worthless after 7-8 years. The best vehicles I ever operated as a fleet manager were VC Valiants with Slant Six & Torqueflite. Almost totally reliable and the most maintenance free motor car I ever operated.

[Quiggers]

From http://www.southgate.com.au/history.htm

Holden Commodore VC

Year of Introduction: Mar 1980
Engine: 1.9 litre 4 cylinder ; 2.85 litre 6 cylinder ; 3.3 litre 6 cylinder ; 4.2 litre V8 & 5.0 litre V8
Transmission: 4 speed manual ; 3 speed Trimatic & 3 speed Turbohydramatic 350
Production: 121,807
First 'Brock' Commodore released October 1980

I recall a chick at work had one, which made some of us rev heads laugh,
also ran on 13" wheels, from the earlier Torana LC/LJ.
The starfire 4 was a cut down of the 2850 6 cyl donk.

GQ

[chazza]

Wearing my REMLR hat - what about these two; for build quality anyway?

Datsun 200B staff car; from brand new it used at least a litre of oil per week, on long trips we had to add oil more frequently than petrol. A RAEME mech. told me years later, that apparently the engines had been assembled without oil scraper rings. Came with an automatic box and had a top speed of about 110 km/h; forget about overtaking a truck doing 100 km/h:o

Land Rover S3 GS six-cylinder. Of the four we picked up from the supply battalion, 3 had coolant leaks, one of them blowing coolant from the head gasket. These were all brand-new cars with about 100km on the clock when I drove them. Loaded with six people, it was a struggle to surmount the most minor obstacle in first gear; I remember having to use low range to climb over a bank of graded dirt about a 300mm high at the edge of a track:eek: The engine was so de-tuned and torque-less, that it put me off Series 3's for life (probably unfairly), because I have heard that the civilian six-cylinder was a superb engine. Top speed 100 km/h on the flat:o

How we longed for the S2A's, even though they didn't have a heater:(

Cheers Charlie

[Bigbjorn]

25 years after its demise GMH blow their own trumpet about an all alloy v8:rolleyes:.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2007/11/382.jpg


Fenianeel- Where did the alloy V8 come from? Was it not a Buick/Oldsmobile engine from 1959? GM had this engine out to 5 litres by 1963 and also built turbo-charged versions. GM peddled it off to Rover as it no longer fitted in their marketing plans, it was slow and expensive to make, & with the foundry technology of the time large complex aluminium castings had a high reject rate making it really unsuitable for mass production. Rover then found they could not make ther engine as was, in their antiquated (1928) engine plant, and had to make numbers of alterations to be able to do so.

[UncleHo]

G'day Chazza:)

They sound like some of the ??hundred that were assembled with the Rover Sedan Cam :o which was OK for the High Comp Twin Carby Engine, but a few ;) slipped through the production line with the wrong cam,of thecililian one with that problem, when they were presented to dealers, it was off with the front change the cam:o then tell the customer that the vehicle had to stay overnightas there was nil stock of ??? Gasket and it was coming from Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane;) all done under warranty, sound a little like the TD-5 Oil pump bolt:(

cheers

[UncleHo]

G'day Folk :)

The only thing wrong with the P38 Eer P76 ;) was the body assembly quality control, there was None:o well Leyland paid peanuts and they got Monkeys:D particularly in the Assembly Plants, the vehicle was brilliant, all you had to do was to take it home, pull it apart then re-assemble with ALL the Door/Boot/Bonnet gaps the same, and fit the rubbers the right way around:eek:

My only regret was that I didn't buy one at Special Staff Prices when offered:(:mad: they were and still are a luxury vehicle to drive and for a family of 5/6 with boot space to cope.

cheers

[CraigE]

Fenianeel- Where did the alloy V8 come from? Was it not a Buick/Oldsmobile engine from 1959? GM had this engine out to 5 litres by 1963 and also built turbo-charged versions. GM peddled it off to Rover as it no longer fitted in their marketing plans, it was slow and expensive to make, & with the foundry technology of the time large complex aluminium castings had a high reject rate making it really unsuitable for mass production. Rover then found they could not make ther engine as was, in their antiquated (1928) engine plant, and had to make numbers of alterations to be able to do so.
Yep was originally a late 50s early 60s Buick motor. Buick could not get it to seal and stop oil leaks. Rover and Leyland have not done much better.
The 4.4 P76 motor is the same base and is really not much better than a modified 3.5 or 3.9. The one in my RRC was a stroked 4.2. Finally sealed all the oil leaks 4 weeks before selling it to my Dad and has not leaked oil since.
The Commodore V6 (not curent model) was basically the same engine with 2 cylinders lopped off. Put the 2 side by side and you will see the similarities.

[harry]

well how many of you actually owned a leyland p76 from new?
from reading the posts i assume not many.
i did buy a v8 new and found it to be an excellent car.
i also was involved with the first one registered in victoria [which we took to a sunday picnic, and went bush in it and promptly got stuck on a blackboy [read grasstree for the politically correct due to lawyers]
my v8 was a ripper car and could eat the pants off most other cars, sure some didn't like the styling, and the boot, well what is wrong with a car that can hold 60 gallons of beer in the boot!
the critisms of build quality were all to do with a massive electrical strike in sydney and delivery shortages caused by that and our ever present 'free press' caning the car and probably being paid by holden and ford to 'knock' the car.
unfortunatly our unions killed it off, with help from journalists.
but the car was a brilliant bit of kit, the v8 took my tortorous abuse in its stride, 4 speed manual [boys car] change gear at valve bounce and rev! it was a real performer.
in hindsite i should have kept it, but when you get a company car, what do you do, i parked it and then we needed dosh for things like getting married and stuff, so of it went to a new owner.
so if you've been told a p76 was not a good car think again

[isuzurover]

Can't say I agree with the OP...

I have a VN commodore which I (ab)use whilst the series III is off the road - which is all the time. Sure the auto trans takes a minute to switch into drive and the rear end spins out if you take corners too fast - but thats just part of the fun.

It's one of the quicker, and most economical cars I've driven, and it's been the cheapest car (maintenance wise) I've ever owned - but then again I have owned Fiats.....

I agree. The VN had a bad rep but I don't think it was deserved.

My dad had a VN - bought ex-govt 2yo with 40k km. My dad is very hard on cars, but the VN had only minor/typical issues (fuel pump, harmonic balancer, crank angle sensor, plugpack) - in many years of ownership and an additional 300k km. Auto was VERY loose when he traded it though...

[Bigbjorn]

well how many of you actually owned a leyland p76 from new?
from reading the posts i assume not many.
i did buy a v8 new and found it to be an excellent car.
i also was involved with the first one registered in victoria [which we took to a sunday picnic, and went bush in it and promptly got stuck on a blackboy [read grasstree for the politically correct due to lawyers]
my v8 was a ripper car and could eat the pants off most other cars, sure some didn't like the styling, and the boot, well what is wrong with a car that can hold 60 gallons of beer in the boot!
the critisms of build quality were all to do with a massive electrical strike in sydney and delivery shortages caused by that and our ever present 'free press' caning the car and probably being paid by holden and ford to 'knock' the car.
unfortunatly our unions killed it off, with help from journalists.
but the car was a brilliant bit of kit, the v8 took my tortorous abuse in its stride, 4 speed manual [boys car] change gear at valve bounce and rev! it was a real performer.
in hindsite i should have kept it, but when you get a company car, what do you do, i parked it and then we needed dosh for things like getting married and stuff, so of it went to a new owner.
so if you've been told a p76 was not a good car think again


Had 'em as company cars. As I said earlier in this thread, the only one with performance was the V8 four speed and there were few of them. The body panel (mis)fit was horrendous and could NOT be corrected as either the panels were too small or the openings too big. They really were just another assembled from outside suppliers bits car, with little original thought. Same brakes as a HQ, auto trans & rear axle same as Valiant and Falcon, etc.

Ho, as too paying peanuts for monkeys, all assemblers then were paid little. The guys at GM-H at Pagewood, referred to by salaried staff as "the wogs", then had to work two nights overtime to take home $60. There were almost no Australians working on the line.

I have repowered two 6 cyl. P76's with Chrysler Hemi 6's. The Hemis are smaller and lighter and more than half as big again in swept capacity than the 2.6 BMC engine and make the car into a goer. You need a bell housing and a torque converter from a Valiant and MUST relocate the ignition coil from the inner mudwing to the engine. Otherwise a very easy swap.

[graceysdad]

The diesel powered gemini? the Galant? still millions around, the P76 could hold a 44 gallon drum in the boot with the lid closed I am led to believe.

[Bigbjorn]

The diesel powered gemini? the Galant? still millions around, the P76 could hold a 44 gallon drum in the boot with the lid closed I am led to believe.

I can introduce you to a guy who worked at Western Star trucks at Wacol, lived at Beaudesert, and bought a new diesel Gemini as a commuter. Did over 300,000k's, and reckoned on over 50mpg. The car lived outside 100% of its life and eventually rust beat it. I do not think it was ever washed and only cleaned out inside when the rubbish level was interfering with operation. He wishes he could buy another car today as cheap, simple, economical, and reliable.

[RonMcGr]

the P76 could hold a 44 gallon drum in the boot with the lid closed I am led to believe.

Yes it could, however if that drum was full, there is no way you would get it out :D

Media hype as usual.
Like some thing Krudd would say.:D
Although hopefully he would not stick his didgit in an ear and then lick it.. Gross:thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

[graceysdad]

Bet the mafia would have loved them, easy transport for there drums of cement,nudge wink.

[Bigbjorn]

Yes it could, however if that drum was full, there is no way you would get it out :D

Media hype as usual.
Like some thing Krudd would say.:D
Although hopefully he would not stick his didgit in an ear and then lick it.. Gross:thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

Yes, indeed, few strong men could lift a full 18 gallon kilderkin, let alone a 44 gallon drum, and, if the drum was full the P76 would have been dragging its a++e through the water mains without steering.

[JDNSW]

Yes, indeed, few strong men could lift a full 18 gallon kilderkin, .....

Many years ago I had a work colleague who was very proud of his strength - he showed off one day by lifting a full 44 onto the back of a truck. The rest of the crew were so admiring of the feat that with a little encouragement he loaded the other 19, much to the delight of the other three who were actually supposed to be doing it. Nearly killed him. (He got fired for refusing shut up about politics at the crew dinner table during a visit by company's general manager and the manager of the client company - he later rose to deputy leader of the Australian Nazi Party, and even later was reported as saying he got out of politics because the police wouldn't leave him alone. I haven't heard of him for 30 years, but I got regular comments about him as he went through just about every exploration company in the country)

John

[Captain_Rightfoot]

This has been a great fun thread and an interesting read. Fernian... I'd love to have a look at your collection one day. :) Are you north or south?

My crappiest car was my first car, a GJ Sigma. It probably wasn't nearly as bad as many of those mentioned here.

However it was mine, so it was personal :) I got it at 75k and at about 190k or something we had a argument with a pole that forced it's demise. I do remember that it put me off second hand cars as I spent more on it's maintenance than any car since. Today though I would have been able to do much of the work myself.

I remember doing a v-max run and seeing her top out at about 175, and looking in the mirror and just seeing a huge trail of smoke...

[RonMcGr]

Many years ago I had a work colleague who was very proud of his strength - he showed off one day by lifting a full 44 onto the back of a truck. The rest of the crew were so admiring of the feat that with a little encouragement he loaded the other 19, much to the delight of the other three who were actually supposed to be doing it. Nearly killed him. (He got fired for refusing shut up about politics at the crew dinner table during a visit by company's general manager and the manager of the client company - he later rose to deputy leader of the Australian Nazi Party, and even later was reported as saying he got out of politics because the police wouldn't leave him alone. I haven't heard of him for 30 years, but I got regular comments about him as he went through just about every exploration company in the country)

John

He is probably laying around somewhere, unable to move with a buggered back;)

[muddydigger]

Based purley on personal experiance, any Sigma was piece of dung as was the Camira all models and varients. As for the P76 I thought it was a great car!

[Bigbjorn]

Many years ago I had a work colleague who was very proud of his strength - he showed off one day by lifting a full 44 onto the back of a truck. The rest of the crew were so admiring of the feat that with a little encouragement he loaded the other 19, much to the delight of the other three who were actually supposed to be doing it. Nearly killed him. (He got fired for refusing shut up about politics at the crew dinner table during a visit by company's general manager and the manager of the client company - he later rose to deputy leader of the Australian Nazi Party, and even later was reported as saying he got out of politics because the police wouldn't leave him alone. I haven't heard of him for 30 years, but I got regular comments about him as he went through just about every exploration company in the country)

John

We used to deliver to a German descent farm family near Clifton and the patriarch, in his early seventies, could still handle a full drum from the ground onto a truck. He was a huge man, and the older guys of the district said that in his twenties, he was truly formidable. Apparently he had a trick of picking up a moldboard plough by the handles and pointing with it. I saw him take an eighteen gallon keg on each shoulder and carry them from my truck into the local hall.

[JDNSW]

Ron - yes, if someone hasn't shot him.

Brian - the weird thing about this bloke was that he was only average size, and although he looked fit did not look particularly strong.

John

[Bigbjorn]

Ron - yes, if someone hasn't shot him.

Brian - the weird thing about this bloke was that he was only average size, and although he looked fit did not look particularly strong.

John
Yes, John, some people are really amazing. There was stocky guy who delivered parcels around inner Brisbane for TAA who used to show off by lifting the rear wheels of cars of FJ Holden and similar size off the ground by the bumper bar.

Karl Litzow was the Clifton fellow's name. He was said to, in his youth, have been "bigger than Mick Madsen", the famous Australian prop forward of the 20's-30's, and Mick was said to have been the only local who ever beat him in a fight. He was certainly still bloody big when in his seventies. He was a 1st. AIF veteran, Western Front. I reckon they would have had to deepen the trenches wherever his unit was sent.

[scanfor]

The worst I've had was a 1985 V8 Cherokee, made in Brisbane (well assembled here anyway). It was the most fragile piece of machinery I have ever driven. Two good days of ownership - the first and the last.

[mcrover]

Joel,

You have sure opened a can of worms :)

How about Holden Sunbird, with starfire 4 cylinder motor, Leyland P76, soon to be out done by Mitsubishi with the Sigma, Magna and 380.

Lightburn Zeta, Vauxhall Viva, EA Falcon 3 speed, The later Chrysler Valiants, Datsun 120Y, Morris Marina, Austin Kimberley and not to forget the Ford Capri convertible that leaked like ...... :D

Cheers

120Y was just ugly, not a bad car if well maintained.

Ive had 3 of them, cheap and easy to maintain.

Worst Aussie car has to be the P76 yet Ive had one of them and all the problems had already been solved and was a great car for the 6 months or so we had it.

The AU and EA falcons were shockers, VB Comode was terrible espesially the 4cyl miss fire ones and they didnt get any better until VL and even they had dramas.

Holden stuffed it all up again with the VN Series 1 but the series 2 and 3 were reasonable and the VP's were pretty good in their time.

The worst Aussie car ever would have to be the Purvis Eureka, which was a kit car that if you were over about 5' it was near impossible to fit into as the windscreen slid forward for access and was powered by a VW engine.

[duff]

Factually the BOP(buick, oldsmobile, pontiac) alloy V8, was originally made by BMW, as fitted into one of their gullwings as a 2.6lt V8. BOP just mass produced them.

The 4.4 version made in Australia was based on the pommie 3.5 but much improved webbing and reversed oil galleries etc etc. It was loosely(very) inspired by the REPCO innovated rover V8 that powered Jack Brabham's engine with which he won his world title)

The P76 was over 98% local content, the highest ever(before or since)

Roughly speaking

The P76 had the same power to weight as the 351 fords, 49/51 chassis balance, true monocoque, about the same size as the holdens, smaller than the fords (just used the space intelligently), rack and pinion steering, macpherson strut front end, coil rears. V8 fuel economy similar to the big three's sixes. out performed (rally) the Porsche Carrera on its home ground TARGA FLORIA ranges. Devotedly loved by most people who owned them. boot as big(in litres) as the holden ute, body weight that made the big threes V8's look truckish. And all in 1973/74. Just over half the sales where V8's, lots of them manual, many 4 speed.

I think anyone who has owned one would tell you that they were fantastic, and would probably confirm that they have read so many "facts" about them from hear say experts,, that they probably wondered did they really have a P76 at all,,, because most the horror stories didn't seem to be on their car.

YesHolden spent more on neg advertising against Leyland over the three years than they did on their own positive advertising.

Oh I did own several, and dad had his old exec from new and his Targa till he died. You could say I'm biased,, but I think I just know them, wish I had a good example now.

Ohh yeah, forgot to say... the worst car I have owned was a 89ish? magna wagon


Fenianeel- Where did the alloy V8 come from? Was it not a Buick/Oldsmobile engine from 1959? GM had this engine out to 5 litres by 1963 and also built turbo-charged versions. GM peddled it off to Rover as it no longer fitted in their marketing plans, it was slow and expensive to make, & with the foundry technology of the time large complex aluminium castings had a high reject rate making it really unsuitable for mass production. Rover then found they could not make ther engine as was, in their antiquated (1928) engine plant, and had to make numbers of alterations to be able to do so.

[vnx205]

Worst Aussie car has to be the P76 yet Ive had one of them and all the problems had already been solved and was a great car for the 6 months or so we had it.

That comment looks a lot like the quite well authenticated tendency for people to say things like "All policemen/ teachers/ nurses/ mechanics are hopeless/ corrupt/ incompetent but the one we have locally is pretty good."
People still believe the media beatups, even when their own experience contradicts it.

I think the people who have actually owned a P76 who have posted here show that quite a few people found them to be (potentially) a very good car.
The myth is not supported by the evidence.

[shorty943]

What do you reckon is the crappiest Australian car that you have ever driven?

Personally for me its the 1992 VP Commodore that I have to drive at present (boy do I miss my Disco).

The headlights are rubbish, the automatic transmission seems to do what it likes and needs manual intervention to be normal... the engine is as rough as guts at idle... it rolls worse than a Disco on corners... kickdown is slow to work... arghh it goes on...:D

worst of all are the DIABOLICAL tail spins. Even on a light throttle with this wet Melbourne weather it loses traction at the drop of a hat.

I have no idea how I managed to, but I stalled it. Stalling an auto....! That is Taxi driver material!

The Kingswood with 202 and Trimatic was better than a VP:D




Damn. Already taken.

I got a late night phone call.
Skilled Engineering, "can you get out to Holdens? They have a problem".

The "VP" would not bolt together on their production line.

Reason? The TRW made, rack and pinion steering, would not sit straight in the front-end mounts.

My team spent 18 1\2 hours there, got them going, just, every bloody VP of the first batch should be defected, and got off the road, the front end is a mess, and will never stay aligned.

Get rid off it, please mate, just get rid of the dangerous piece of crap now.

[mcrover]

That comment looks a lot like the quite well authenticated tendency for people to say things like "All policemen/ teachers/ nurses/ mechanics are hopeless/ corrupt/ incompetent but the one we have locally is pretty good."
People still believe the media beatups, even when their own experience contradicts it.

I think the people who have actually owned a P76 who have posted here show that quite a few people found them to be (potentially) a very good car.
The myth is not supported by the evidence.

I have bloody owned one that I stated in my post, I also had the books and a folder of reciepts to what the previous original owner had spent and near on the whole car had been changed at one stage or another.:mad:

Everything from front and rear windscreen rubbers which from the factory were the wrong shape to hold the screens in to a steering rack which locked up on him on the old Hume Hwy.:o

As I also said by the time I got it all the stuff had been fixed and I found it was great for towing but me and a mate bought it to tow a race car and when he sold his race car we sold the P76 which was about 6 months later.:(

I also know about 5 other people who had owned them and had nearly exactly the same problems and spent close to the same money on them to get them reliable so that says to me that from the factory they were pretty much all crap as you would be thinking that 1 out of 6 may have had less or different faults but they all had nearly exactly the same.:o

On paper they have the best specs for their time and after some sorting out they were a great car but I havnt heard anyone yet say that they have never had problems with window regs, head light wiring, wiper motor breaking away from it's bracket, the windscreen rubbers, boot lid leaking etc etc.:(

Does that pretty much cover it.:mad:

[duff]

All major problems I see :eek:.

I can say that I owned them and My dad owned them(dad for 23 years).. of course they had some problems, but I would argue that they had less than my 2001 disco, less than any of the Commodore models, less than a lot of cars. and little problems. And note. the screens are gooped in ,, so dont see how the rubbers could be the wrong size ? but anyway

I would argue with the devil himself over this one.. they had average to good build quality, and had the best specs in its market. the vehicle was only ever built for 2ish years. it was a completely new vehicle not a revamp, not a progress,,, To have had so little problems was amazing by today's standards let alone the early 70's. My dad owned one of the first exec's built and yes it had some teething problems,, all minor trim things some panel mismatch (think recent Landrover, think recent Ford). he later bought a Targa, one of the last numbers off the line. the vehicle was as tight and well sorted as any car could be.

The vehicles that where in the pipeline for production were impressive. the next model had already been designed. The supple changes pulled all the corners in a little, the lights had grown wrap around, picture a cross between the SD1 and a P76, very acceptable. the engine range had been expanded to include V4, V6, V8, V12, all alloy and all sharing common components. with the 4.4, the 4 and 6 had run in pre production form. The factory had already built the V8 race engine. Quad weber's Repco engineered engine that was to power the Force 7 push at Bathurst. What could have been!

keep in mind the demise was part of a global rationalisation from Leyland, nothing to do with P76 or sales. six month waiting list for V8's in first year and cancelled orders when the doors shut. ahh you could go on for ever with the positives, but the negatives are few. The most staunch nockers all ways fall back on, "but it is butt ugly".... even that had been fixed in the model update. The thing was only ever made so square cut (wedge) because the wallys at the top wanted it to fit the ford and Holden of the day, so they "yanked" it up from the original design which was much more European(sd1 ish) below is the P8 closely linked to original P76, I am still looking for the drawing by the Australian team of the model update scheduled for release in the fourth production year. it really was modern and neat version rejected by the poms( they knew the colloquials better than themselves) TIV.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

I still have met more owners that liked them than those that did'nt. Most people that got into mine in its day liked the thing. most nockers had little to say when they got into it. I was a little young to enjoy the days when the P76 must have humiliated the Holden/ford on offer, but i still got a kick out of commodore and XD drivers getting in and saying, "its alright mate, I thought these things where buckets,, or I didnt think it would have ....., or there comfy hey mate.

Yeah I like them.



I have bloody owned one that but I havnt heard anyone yet say that they have never had problems with window regs, head light wiring, wiper motor breaking away from it's bracket, the windscreen rubbers, boot lid leaking etc etc.:(

Does that pretty much cover it.:mad:

[graceysdad]

Noticed someone bagged a Cherokee, let me add to that bagging having owned 2 of them an 82 and an 83 one was a 258cu 5 spd, other a v8 auto, both drove well, handled well, towed well but they rust and they rust fast, the steering columns fall to bits and usually while driving them, the free wheel hubs chew out faster then you can fit them, badly assembled, bonnet release on left hand side sucked, blinkers on Left sideof column sucked too, typical of yank cars I guess. The T5 should never have been fitted behind such a torquey six, they dont last. What about Cortinas?

[googe]

I had a TE cortina when i was a young fella,it was the tuffest car i ever owned,250 crossflow 4 speed,it wasnt no race car but it pulled high 12's on the 1/4 mile,i used to freqent redcliffe QLD every friday and saturday night racing and carrying on like a mindless youth.Week after week month after month i drove that thing into the ground.I thrashed that car every time i got in it,i remeber me and a mate one day went for a drive to see what we could get out of our cars,i got 70kmh in first,135kmh in second and about 170 out of 3rd,top i never knew cuz the speedo stops at 200.When it was on its last legs after 180,000kms of total abuse,we went to a quiet back road around woodford with a few sets of tyres and just sat there full throttle first gear till we went through all the tyres,the motor didnt blow,:D the only prob i had was snaping the serclip on the clutch cable easy fixed with a washer and a house clamp.

[mcrover]

All major problems I see :eek:.

I can say that I owned them and My dad owned them(dad for 23 years).. of course they had some problems, but I would argue that they had less than my 2001 disco, less than any of the Commodore models, less than a lot of cars. and little problems. And note. the screens are gooped in ,, so dont see how the rubbers could be the wrong size ? but anyway

I would argue with the devil himself over this one.. they had average to good build quality, and had the best specs in its market. the vehicle was only ever built for 2ish years. it was a completely new vehicle not a revamp, not a progress,,, To have had so little problems was amazing by today's standards let alone the early 70's. My dad owned one of the first exec's built and yes it had some teething problems,, all minor trim things some panel mismatch (think recent Landrover, think recent Ford). he later bought a Targa, one of the last numbers off the line. the vehicle was as tight and well sorted as any car could be.

The vehicles that where in the pipeline for production were impressive. the next model had already been designed. The supple changes pulled all the corners in a little, the lights had grown wrap around, picture a cross between the SD1 and a P76, very acceptable. the engine range had been expanded to include V4, V6, V8, V12, all alloy and all sharing common components. with the 4.4, the 4 and 6 had run in pre production form. The factory had already built the V8 race engine. Quad weber's Repco engineered engine that was to power the Force 7 push at Bathurst. What could have been!

keep in mind the demise was part of a global rationalisation from Leyland, nothing to do with P76 or sales. six month waiting list for V8's in first year and cancelled orders when the doors shut. ahh you could go on for ever with the positives, but the negatives are few. The most staunch nockers all ways fall back on, "but it is butt ugly".... even that had been fixed in the model update. The thing was only ever made so square cut (wedge) because the wallys at the top wanted it to fit the ford and Holden of the day, so they "yanked" it up from the original design which was much more European(sd1 ish) below is the P8 closely linked to original P76, I am still looking for the drawing by the Australian team of the model update scheduled for release in the fourth production year. it really was modern and neat version rejected by the poms( they knew the colloquials better than themselves) TIV.
http://www.austin-rover.co.uk/images/p8_16.jpg

http://www.austin-rover.co.uk/images/p8_04.jpg


http://www.austin-rover.co.uk/images/p8_01.jpg


http://www.austin-rover.co.uk/images/p8_09.jpg

I still have met more owners that liked them than those that did'nt. Most people that got into mine in its day liked the thing. most nockers had little to say when they got into it. I was a little young to enjoy the days when the P76 must have humiliated the Holden/ford on offer, but i still got a kick out of commodore and XD drivers getting in and saying, "its alright mate, I thought these things where buckets,, or I didnt think it would have ....., or there comfy hey mate.

Yeah I like them.


Right well if any one is interested, I said that I liked the P76 but FROM THE FACTORY IT HAD HEAPS OF PROBLEMS.

As far as the screens being gooped in, THAT WAS THE FIX TO THE PROBLEM OF WINDOWS FALLING OUT.

All the 5 other people that I have known and spoken to in depth about the P76 (1 being a neibour who had one for as long as I can remember and still does) spent the dollars to fix the problems and have had a great run out of them since and I thought I made that also completely clear.

READ POSTS BEFORE EDITING QUOTES TO MAKE OUT THAT SOME ONE IS SAYING SOMETHING THEY ARE NOT.

Simple:mad:

[duff]

McRover,,, :confused:

Wow big fella,, chill-ax, yes it is SIMPLE :eek:

I only edited that portion out because it was the only bit I was responding to. your entire post is still in the thread for all to see. :o

Whats with the defensive stance and the directives mate :mad:. its not life altering stuff here. But each to their own I guess.

I just have had a different experience with P76's than you. I was just letting people know about a different point of view, not in anyway suggesting you are wrong, except about the windscreens. They were always gooped in, they never had rubbers, and I only offer this fact to help. there were about 200 out of the nearly 20,000 built that had suffered a cold set and so the seal had not bonded, there were two that had there rear screens suck out at highway speed because of it,,, still not a major or common problem I believe.

I and I guess everyone took it from your post's that you enjoyed owning yours, that's great. but when you MADE IT COMPLETELY CLEAR that 5 people you have spoken to about the car have had to sort out heaps of problems before having good runs. I feel the need to balance your experience of HEAPS OF PROBLEMS FROM THE FACTORY and offer mine, which was that it had some minor problems no different than most new models and a lot less important than some new models. I only offer this experience or everyone might believe that the car had heaps of problems from the factory. Not to have a go at you.;)

olive branch offered

[mcrover]

McRover,,, :confused:

Wow big fella,, chill-ax, yes it is SIMPLE :eek:

I only edited that portion out because it was the only bit I was responding to. your entire post is still in the thread for all to see. :o

Whats with the defensive stance and the directives mate :mad:. its not life altering stuff here. But each to their own I guess.

I just have had a different experience with P76's than you. I was just letting people know about a different point of view, not in anyway suggesting you are wrong, except about the windscreens. They were always gooped in, they never had rubbers, and I only offer this fact to help. there were about 200 out of the nearly 20,000 built that had suffered a cold set and so the seal had not bonded, there were two that had there rear screens suck out at highway speed because of it,,, still not a major or common problem I believe.

I and I guess everyone took it from your post's that you enjoyed owning yours, that's great. but when you MADE IT COMPLETELY CLEAR that 5 people you have spoken to about the car have had to sort out heaps of problems before having good runs. I feel the need to balance your experience of HEAPS OF PROBLEMS FROM THE FACTORY and offer mine, which was that it had some minor problems no different than most new models and a lot less important than some new models. I only offer this experience or everyone might believe that the car had heaps of problems from the factory. Not to have a go at you.;)

olive branch offered

No stress Duff, I do get a bit shirty about some peoples edits as I have been stung on more than a few occasions of late with quotes out of context that then take on a life of their own thats all.:D

My P76 had a reciept from Benalla auto glass ( in 1975 some time I think it was or around then as I remember thinking that they didnt last long )for front and rear screens and modified seals and the others that I have spoken to recall they had the same or similar (either coming loose or leaking from memory).

I was sure that they had seals not bonding but then again I wasnt around at the time so I cant be sure 100% though one of the previous owners I was talking about worked on production at Leyland during that time (was my uncle at the time now devorced) and also recalled the seal problem but If you say it wasnt a problem then more than likely it wasnt.

Great info by the way, I loved the pics of the other models that should have come out, it would have deffinatly changed the way Aussie cars were built if they hadn't pulled the pin when they did as H or F couldnt have even come close if it had all come to fruition.:D

[mcrover]

Noticed someone bagged a Cherokee, let me add to that bagging having owned 2 of them an 82 and an 83 one was a 258cu 5 spd, other a v8 auto, both drove well, handled well, towed well but they rust and they rust fast, the steering columns fall to bits and usually while driving them, the free wheel hubs chew out faster then you can fit them, badly assembled, bonnet release on left hand side sucked, blinkers on Left sideof column sucked too, typical of yank cars I guess. The T5 should never have been fitted behind such a torquey six, they dont last. What about Cortinas?


I havnt had such early Cherokee's but Ive had a 97 XJ which is still a teriffic car, the inlaws have it now and they love it and we had a 96 ZG which was a wohfull heap of junk, cost me $10000 to buy, spent about $4k on it to keep it going for 6 months and then got $6k tradein on it just to get rid of it.

Ive also had 3 cortinas, a TD sedan with 302 4spd single rail, TC wagon 200 non X flow with 3spd, TD wagon 250 Xflow with single rail 4spd.

All 3 were good cars for how I treated them, the V8 in the TD was good for 215kmh and not that bad on fuel for a V8.

Of course being a P plater rev head I killed all 3.