Donaldson dual filter

[rar110]

The donaldson filter meter indicated blocked air filters. Both filters are only 12 mths old and looked fine as have done mostly city driving. I decided to take out the inner filter.

Do most people run two filters or only the outer filter?

thanks

[Larns]

The inner filter is primary as a emergency back up, I run without this though as if your engine is turboed with mods then it won't allow enough air flow, an will pop the indicator.

:twobeers:

[1103.9TDI]

No way would I be without the inner!. The outer has a shelf life (two years from memory) and should have a date on it. I believe this only applies if the filter is not used. The original assembly purchased from Land Rover, which I installed after fitting the 4BD1T; was 4 years old!. I reckon it was the time-ex filter and the pre-cleaner that caused the sensor to show the filter element as being full. Replaced both, now she runs perfect.......any doubt, call them:

Donaldson Australasia Pty Ltd
P.O. Box 153
Wyong NSW 2259
Ph: 02 4350 2000
Fax: 02 4351 2036

Donaldson Filtration Solutions (http://www.donaldsonfilters.com.au)

Want more performance?, adjust your fuel, don't risk injesting matter into your engine........

[Blknight.aus]

if your going to run the engine do not do so without the inner... NEVER, under no circumstances... IF i hear of people doing it I will come and steal your suzie's and replace them with petrol engines probabley from nissans or even 2 stroke mopeds......

Bad people... how would you like it IF i stuck your mouth and nostrils into a bog hole of bulldust and held you there till you tried to breath....

ok rant over heres how your filter setup works and what the parts do


the outer is the secondary filter, to use my anology above thats the one that filters all the gravel out before it gets chance to clog the primary filter

The inner is the primary filter and its responsable for getting everything that slips past the secondary filter (including parts of the secondary filter) before it gets into your engine. in my anology that removes the dust.

and theres 2 stages of filtration before the air even gets that far the first is the intake grill which takes out leaves, bits of tree and lesser vehicles that get too close and the second is the "cyclonic" action of the air through the filter chamber and cather witch take out the heavy particals and most of the moisture from rain or light (and I mean light) splashing.

the second stage of "pre filtering" in theory at higher engine speeds is almost as effecient as the normal secondary filter but is let down slightly in the rover application by the orientation of the filter.

the primary filter has a usage life of 2 years, at the 5th clean out of the secondary filter or if cleaning/replacing the secondary filter does not allow operation without tripping the blocked filter sensor. whichever comes first. The filtering elements as supplied should be in a plastic bag when new and have no "shelf life" providing that the plastic is undamaged and the dessicating pack (if included) is still dry.

[Bigbjorn]

The inner filter has no more filtering capacity than the outer. What will pass through the outer will pass through the inner. The inner filter has two purposes. In the case of rough usage (logging, earth moving) where the filter housing is externally mounted and liable to damage that may pierce the outer filter then the engine will not be exposed to dust damage as long as the inner filter is intact. The other purpose is in the case of continuously running engines (gen. sets, pumps) the outer filter may be removed for service whilst the plant remains in operation with the inner filter in place. A dual element filter in the case of the LR county is somewhat of an overkill as the outer filter is most unlikely to be damaged tucked away as it is high up behind the engine and under the bonnet.

[rick130]

what Brian said.

[JDNSW]

To add to Brian's comments - I have had one case where a relative borrowed the County for a trip round Australia - and the nut holding the main element came loose (?vibration from the Isuzu), allowing dusty air through - to be trapped by the guard element. So I don't think the second element is overkill!

John

[Larns]

Just as Brian said. The only time I've seen the inner with any amount of dirt on it was when a similar thing happened as with johns. And even in that case it could be blamed on the muppet arms that tightened the outer filter up.

[Graeme]

The instructions for my tractors' filters state that the outer can be cleaned (by various methods) but the inner must not be cleaned.

[isuzurover]

pretty much what Brian said - EXCEPT - 2-stage filters like this are usually fitted to ALL off-highway diesels. Not so much because the element may be damaged, rather as an added security due to the very high dust loads the engine is likely to see.

The landie is the only time I have seen a 2-stage filter in a predominantly road going vehicle.

I always run both stages.

[Bigbjorn]

In all my years in the heavy truck business, I saw very few highway prime movers fitted with dual element air cleaners. Even though almost all air cleaners on these vehicles are externally mounted, there is little likelihood of damage thus rendering the inner element unecessary. Livestock haulers who went off road into the paddocks & scrub did usually have them. The inner element was usually referred to as the safety element.

[1103.9TDI]

I replaced the Donaldson filter (outer) on my 4BD1T last month. I could certainly see dust in concentrated areas on the inner!, it looked like three small, dry mud splatters. This would otherwise have gone into the engine via the turbo, not a pleasant thought!.

These engines may give the impression that they are bullet-proof, and will outlast most others in these types of applications, but one thing that will cause an early rebuild is dust injestion. Removing the inner may give a slight performance increase........

Why would you want to risk it????

[Larns]

Makes sense, I don't do a lot of dusty off road stuff, mostly towing boats and the ocasional dirt road. But if I was going to do an extended dirt road trip I'd throw the emergency element in for that very reason.

:twobeers::twobeers:

[Dougal]

These engines may give the impression that they are bullet-proof, and will outlast most others in these types of applications, but one thing that will cause an early rebuild is dust injestion.

I've been there and it's not pretty. As well as causing bore wear, it causes severe erosion of the turbo compressor wheel. The aluminium blown off the wheel also gets fed into your engine.

[rar110]

thanks for the replies everyone.

why would the meter suggest the filter is blocked when its had next to no dust conditions? The inner & outer filter still look new.

[Blknight.aus]

cause they will be blocked with road grime or something similar, I bet if you were to gently knock the outer filter element against the tyre crud would fall out.

have you reset the meter?

[rar110]

Thanks Dave will give it a go over the next couple of days.

I did blow them out with the compressor. Nothing seemed to come out.

[1103.9TDI]

rar110, mate, are you using a precleaner of any sort?, how new are the filters?, is there anything that may constrain the air going through the filter, do a thorough check of the inlet system prior to the filter, something is limiting the airflow to your engine.......

[rar110]

Gerry I also thought something was restricting air supply so checked the inlet hose as something might be nested in there. But all clear. No precleaner. Inlet hose only runs to engine bay. There is nothing that I can see.

I blew out both filters and put them back in and reset the meter. The meter immediately indicated a restriction. I removed the inner filter and the meter was fine.

I only got the 110 on the road Nov last year after 5 yrs. The filters are new off the shelf from 13 mths ago. Of course I don't know how long they were sitting around. They look ok.

[Dougal]

Does your restriction gauge have a scale on it?
Is it possible a hose is sucking flat?

[1103.9TDI]

Peter, check the little opening to the meter, could be somethings lodged in there?, also could be that the meter itself is faulty!....not sure whether it just screws out, maybe Dave can help on that one, you must be getting the jack of this???:D:D:D....hope it's all good soon........

[rar110]

thanks Dougal and Gerry.

the hose is definitely ok. Its a wire rimmed type.

I did take the meter off and gave it a blow out.

Its not worrying me too much. I am currently running on a single filter but only doing city driving.