P38A 4.6 & LPG conversion info

[Disco Pom]

Hi All,

Been making some enquiries into getting the fuel drinking monster put on gas.

Found a place in Melbourne with experience on fitting systems to P38 Range Rover's and at just over $3k seems reasonable .

Apparently they fit a new Impco system and 70 litre donut tank in the spare wheel well..plus refit the spare wheel underneath with a new bracket.

Any P38 owners out there who have done this recently and fitted the Impco system ??

Any feedback appreciated..

cheers,
Richard

[procrastination inc]

is that price for LPG fumigation or sequential vapour injection?

[jhb_16010]

:)
I have converted my P38 and purchased the top of the range sequential vapour injection system, with a 72 usable litre donut tank in the wheel well. I considered that there was insufficient ground clearance to suspend the spare under the body, so it sits in the rear luggage space.
Cost was $6,700 less the $2,000 rebate and included a new high quality wiring loom. Fuel consumption is around 4.5 - 4.7 km/litre in freeway crawling at peak periods and I am still playing around with that to improve it slightly. Fuel consumption in normal free running and highway cruising is much better. Even allowing for 4.5 km/litre, my fuel cost per week has dropped by $80.00 so it is well worth the effort. Performance is outstanding except for high revs acceleration, when it automatically switches back to petrol for 10 - 20 seconds.
My conversion was done by Deacon Automotive in Bentleigh east. - Good guys to deal with and they have all of the right gear.

I consider that it was well worth the expense.

Jim Bellew
99 Vogue on gas - Love that air suspension.

[Frontier1]

Wow that's a lot of money!

I got a second-hand Impco system put in (the old style) for $400, 70liter tank, still have my petrol and I'm getting 4.5-4.7k's a liter although a slight loss in power.

I imagine though that the sequential vapour system has some other benefits that the older system doesn't have.

Cheers, Pete'

[jhb_16010]

pete,
Yes it is a lot compared to your S/H system, but my system uses the P38's computer to constantly analyse the mixture and adjust as necessary, plus there is no noticeable power loss. Based on your consumption figures, I will definitely be on to Deacon's to do something to improve my consumption!

Jim

[Disco Pom]

Thanks for your comments guys..

The $3200 quote is for :

Impco gas mixer system
70 litre donut tank
Gas filler fitted next to petrol filler
Mount spare wheel to a new bracket underneath
New spark plugs and air filter
3 year warrantyTake the $2k rebate off and suppose it's not too bad for $1200..:)

Takes them 2 days..it's AG Autogas in Melbourne and apparently the owner drives a Rangie with this Impco system and thinks it's the dogs bits..suppose he would say that anyway ..:p

I'm still waiting for a couple more quotes to come in and hopefully can get someone more local to do it for me..

If not..Melbourne here I come !

Will let you all know how I get on..

cheers,
Richard

[p38arover]

Try KLR Automotive in Kingswood (Penrith, Western Sydney 02 4721-3675). They've just put a sequential gas injection system on a P38A for a lot less than that.

They'll be doing mine in the next couple of weeks (I have my old venturi mixer system for sale - cheap.....)

If the mob in Melbourne put the spare wheel underneath, there'll be bugger all ground clearance.

[Disco Pom]

Thanks Ron...good to see you back ...

Good timing on your part...all of a sudden there are 4 threads on P38's needing your attention !

Will give KLR a call and see what they can do ..

The Impco gas mixer is a conventional system and I think the cost for a Impco sequential vapour install is about $5000 at AG Autogas.

Not found anyone in Canberra who carry out LPG installs on Rangies !

Have one more to try in Canberra , as I would like to keep it local in case of any future issues..

Will keep everyone updated on how I get on.

cheers,
Richard

[p38arover]

At least Sydney is a lot closer than Melbourne.

Oh, when I referred to price for the install, I mean a lot cheaper than the $6,700.

[tempestv8]

The P38A Rangie V8 motor, be it the 1995 common plenum chamber version or the 2000 Thor version, will definitely convert well on vapour sequential gas injection.

I have heard lots of horror stories of the gas mixer technology with these engines and would avoid that sort of system with a 10 foot barge pole. The only system to use is the VSI system. There are just too many stories of back firing with the older gas mixer system to be worth doing the conversion. Each time there is a backfire through the intake system, the mass air flow sensor is destroyed and sometimes the air cleaner box too. All your savings on LPG are instantly reset back to "zero" and you would have been better off just running it on petrol.

With the new VSI systems that are fully closed loop, the backfiring just doesn't happen and because the gas metering is more precise, you get better performance and economy.

[Disco Steve]

There are quite a few guys in canberra. I'll ask the bloke who is doing mine tomorw.

[adm333]

My P38 had a gas conversion (vapour) done at Ezygas in Melbourne.

It is a SPRINT system if that means anything.

It works really well and I have never had a problem with it.

:: EZYGAS :: (http://www.ezygas.com.au)

Dave

[Disco Pom]

Dave,

Is the Ezygas Sprint system a 'mixer' or 'vapour injection' type ? ( sorry ..just read your reply again and you state it is a 'vapour' system...that'll teach me to read before engaging brain and writing !)

$$$$ ????

Any performance hit ?

From my research so far will probably go down the 'vapour injection' route...more $$$..but seem to be better with reliability, performance and economy over the 'mixer' systems...hearing horror stories about backfires using 'mixer' types !..:o

cheers,
Richard

[adm333]

Sorry probably my mistake actually. It is a mixer type, not direct injection.

I bought the car with the system already installed but it was still quite new. I had heard (completely unconfirmed rumour) that the direct injection cannot be fitted to the GEMS motor.

The performance is surprisingly good, and I find it actually runs a lot smoother on gas than on petrol.

The real grin from ear to ear happens at the servo when you fill up for $30 instead of $100+. Sure it doesn't go as far but you're still way out in front.

Dave

[adm333]

Oh and .....(grabs hold of something made entirely of wood) ......I have never had a backfire or a miss from the system.

It automatically starts the car on petrol and transfers to Gas when it is firing.

I was told it cost the guy around 4K.

[jwsmall]

Hi Richard

Where are you ? I am also getting quotes together in Perth. Sprintgas say that the P38A, 1999 4.6HSE is not good for the direct injection system. Their cost is approx $2600 completely fitted. Rebate of $1750. Others in Perth have told me that this model DOES NEED the injection method. Very confused???

Anyhow, looks like I shall go this route as they have some fancy EPROM that compensates for the injection. Pity they only have a 42L donut tank capacity. Autogas Perth have a 72L donut tank but hey charge $5600 and use the direct injection.

regards
John

[DeanoH]

Just tell em to get the bigger tank.

Deano

[Confishy]

How'd you go John? I'm looking convert my 2001, but definitely want the larger tank.

Have you sourced a wheel carrier as a result of the conversion yet?

_____________________
Thomas.

[bee utey]

Impco is fine on the early P38 (Sagem injection) but be prepared for a fair loss of low down grunt. Gas injection is far, far better but $1.5K or more on top. Always get new leads and suitable LPG plugs fitted at the time of the conversion.

Hanging the spare tyre underneath is not practical with a full size wheel, lose your air suspension pressure and you will lose the wheel. I don't know if anyone can confirm, but the stud pattern on a P38 looks suspiciously like a Commodore, you might get a suitable space saver wheel there.

I posted some "LPG pics" earlier last year for you to look at.

[Gullible]

The only advice I will give is do not go cheep.

Pay more than you want to for the set up that gives you the best tank size and the best tyre placement.

Check out

RPi Engineering - Specialized Rover Engines - faqs (http://www.v8engines.com/faq-lpg-Gems-twin-tanks.htm)

to see what they are doing in the UK.

[jazzaD1]

i had my 3.5 disco converted to vapour injection LPG in october 2008, it runs fantastically well on gas, and an upside is no chance of AFM destroying backfire! i had mine done for $4000 with a tank in the back storage area, i wish i had sprung for scuba tanks or similar as it eats up alot of my space, other than that no regrets at all

dont even consider an impco mixer system, heard some shocking stories

[PAT303]

I've had four LPG powered vehicles and would follow the advice about the amount spent,do not go cheap and do not go any lower in quality than vapour injection or you will regret it every day until you get fed up and sell it.I had a diesel gas technologies system on my disco and it was the kit!!. Pat