Broken manifold studs, AGAIN

[Redback]

So as a result of my manifolds studs breaking again, i have done this modiification below, this was supplied by Tombraider.

Also the manifold has been machined by Peak rebore at Peakhurst and the stud holes are being drilled to fit M10 studs, and the head drilled and rethreaded to suit by Peter Davis of Roving mechanics workshop.





Guys... I mentioned the modifications to the TD5 manifold.

This tip was given to me from a guy Overseas... And it works well....

Here you go:

http://inlinethumb26.webshots.com/6297/2829714950101313710S425x425Q85.jpg
This is the original manifold warped after use....

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2008/02/306.jpg
You can see the webbing between the ports making it one rigid structure without the ability to expand/contract/flex...

This is what breaks the studs and/or warps the head...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2008/02/309.jpg
Heres a new manifold that has been modified.
The holes in the end ports are slotted (elongated) to allow movement better too...

Result...
No more leaking manifold...





hopefully Baz:angel:

[Redback]

All done, i had to have it done by a mechanic this time as i don't have the nessesary tools to drill and re-thread the new holes for the larger studs.

I did grind the webbing out on the new manifold, the mechanic did say it made sense that it will help in stopping the warping of the manifold which inturn breaks the studs.

He is also going to recommend this modification to the other D2 customers that have had this problem.

Baz.

[alpick]

Just to add information for your consideration.

After 9 years and 95000km my studs went, four of them and not being all that handy with such work went to Graham Coopers for the job.

They expressly advised not to use the modification suggested by redback as it weakens the manifold, so that instead of breaking studs you end up with a cracked manifold, which is way more expensive to replace than repairing studs,

choose wisely.

[discowhite]

ide like to see that;)

i as part of my apprenticeship ive welded up and modified alot of cast manifolds.. i wouldnt hesitate to preform this mod.

cheers phil

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Baz, the only thing I'd be still concerned about is movement,,,

as in,,

how can the nuts be tight?
if the manifold moves along the elongations?

or maybe put another way,,
if the removal of webbing works,
why the need to elongate the stud holes?


I do understand you're at the hair pulling out stage,,,
(joke please Phil--;))

[sclarke]

Great Mod, yes it will work as i did something very similar to a Volvo 6 i had a few decades back.... it would warp and break studs, so after eventually finding another exhaust manifold, we ground cut and modified... never caused another issue again... i later abused it to its limits by racing it and all that extra heat was never an issue on it failing...
They crack due to stresses off not being bolted FLAT....

[discowhite]

Baz, the only thing I'd be still concerned about is movement,,,

as in,,

how can the nuts be tight? you tighten them with a spanner? dont get what you mean?
if the manifold moves along the elongations?
the elongations are ther more so for a ''just in case'' because the majority of metal is in the center of the manifold thats where the bulk of the heat will gather, that is what causes the manifold to expand and contract at vastly differant rates to the extremities of the manifold. this in my oppionion is what causes the studs to break/come loose, not studs come loose then manifold warps(although both are highly plausable)

or maybe put another way,,
if the removal of webbing works,
why the need to elongate the stud holes?
from my point of view i think the webbings, while adding strength, are really just leftovers from the casting process. with them removed there will be alot less ''pulling'' of the ends of the manifold.


I do understand you're at the hair pulling out stage,,, this was a post from last year, baz hasnt done it again
(joke please Phil--;))


cheers phil

[Boxer]

Sorry to hijack ya thread Barry, just wondering, does anyone make an aftermarket turbo manifold for TDi Discos?

This is the manifold I have for my Falcon, surely it wouldn't be a big call for one to be made. Anyone keen on this, I could instigate if people are keen on a group buy situation.

Holds a pretty heavy turbo and will be taking some pretty decent temps too.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/04/630.jpg
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/04/631.jpg

[Slunnie]

Great Mod, yes it will work as i did something very similar to a Volvo 6 i had a few decades back.... it would warp and break studs, so after eventually finding another exhaust manifold, we ground cut and modified... never caused another issue again... i later abused it to its limits by racing it and all that extra heat was never an issue on it failing...
They crack due to stresses off not being bolted FLAT....
Absolutely!

Same when I was racing 2-strokes. Even though they were single cylinder the manifold would crack if the gasket was reused which didn't allow the flange to bolt down properly onto the head. Also had to make sure the manifold studs were torqued properly and tie wired in place (which was also a reg) This said EGT's were up to 1050F which probably also produces a lot more movement in the parts than what a TD5 gets.

[Redback]

Well I'm happy to report that it hasn't had the broken studs issue as yet, 15mths so far and all is good.

Oh yeah and the manifold is good too, NO CRACKS:rolleyes:




Just to add information for your consideration.

After 9 years and 95000km my studs went, four of them and not being all that handy with such work went to Graham Coopers for the job.

They expressly advised not to use the modification suggested by redback as it weakens the manifold, so that instead of breaking studs you end up with a cracked manifold, which is way more expensive to replace than repairing studs,

choose wisely.

I'll bet he charged you over double what I paid even with the extra work I had done, cheap is not a word associated with G Coopers;)

Baz.

[XSiV]

Just to add information for your consideration.

After 9 years and 95000km my studs went, four of them and not being all that handy with such work went to Graham Coopers for the job.

They expressly advised not to use the modification suggested by redback as it weakens the manifold, so that instead of breaking studs you end up with a cracked manifold, which is way more expensive to replace than repairing studs,

choose wisely.

After my experience with Coopers I wouldn't believe a word they said. Total incompetence is all I can say about their service! I had a perfectly serviceable Td5, albeit with a blown head gasket, and somehow ALL 5 injectors (yes you read right) mysteriously stopped working while it was in their hands. They have no idea what happened "it just happens sometimes" however after exhaustive research it only seems to happen at Coopers. I wouldn't take my vehicle back to Coopers if they were the last place on earth. Needless to say I had to foot the bill for 5 reconditioned injectors.

As for them trying to tell you that this mod would cause your manifold to crack well that seems to me that what they are really saying is, if you solve this problem we won't be able to charge you to replace your studs ever again!

I agree 100% with Phil, cast manifolds are easily repaired and would be done so much cheaper than paying Coopers to replace your studs every now and again! This mod would not effect the life of your manifold if done correctly.

[Slunnie]

After my experience with Coopers I wouldn't believe a word they said. Total incompetence is all I can say about their service! I had a perfectly serviceable Td5, albeit with a blown head gasket, and somehow ALL 5 injectors (yes you read right) mysteriously stopped working while it was in their hands. They have no idea what happened "it just happens sometimes" however after exhaustive research it only seems to happen at Coopers. I wouldn't take my vehicle back to Coopers if they were the last place on earth. Needless to say I had to foot the bill for 5 reconditioned injectors.


I'll put money on them having put the head on the bench and damaged the injectors that way.