Help Needed with Tyre Choice

[simonl8353]

I have been searching this site and found heaps of good advice for new tyres for my Discovery II V8 Auto. But I still cannot decide, can anyone help?

Here's the facts:
Size 255/65/R16
1 x spare on back is an unused Michelin 4x4 (same tread as the XPC)
4 x shot Hankook Dynapro
I'd prefer about 60% on-road 40% off-road.

I'd like more grip on the gravel/dust and some occasional mud without too much compromise on the wet bitumen. I'd also prefer to rotate the 5th tyre to get some use out of it before the sun and age take it.

I'm considering getting 4 new Michelin XPC's (I have a current quote for $295 ea and another for $495ea!!) but hear they are getting rare. This may mean difficulties with replacements later.

I'm also considering the Pirelli Scorpion ATR (Not the STR as I reckon this may bias highway driving too much).

I've also heared good things about BF Goodrich A/T's

Coopers are off the list (a few issues relating to punctures and stories on the web).

M/T's a bit agressive for my need.

Can anyone help with the choice. I guess I'm bias toward the Michelin XPC 'cos of the spare I already have. :confused:

Mind you all this is a mute point if I cannot get the "3 amigos" to bugger off. Thats in work now and I'll brief seperately. :confused::confused::confused:

[Zute]

I voted for the BFG because you'll get more k' out of them. But they wont handle as well.

[loanrangie]

I vote 265/70/16, not in the poll but thats what i would get.

[Redback]

BFG A/T but in 245/75/16, which is basicly the same rolling diameter as the 255/65s, the higher 75 profile is better for offroad and a more popular tyre size if you ever need to buy another when in a small country town.

Baz.

[Lucy]

Goodyear Wrangler ATR in 245/75/16, better handling than the BFGs, and a popular size.

[agrojnr]

What about Cooper ST's or this

http://www.federaltyres.com.au/images/ms351.jpg
They are Federal MS351 All terrian


Adam

[njz]

What about the General Grabber AT2?

I used to be a die hard XPC fan but I won't be getting another set for my every day rims. I've found that once they are half worn they really don't grip very well in the wet.


http://www.simex4x4.com/files/QMPLA0PDXL/grabberAT2.jpg

[Kgee]

Hi
I have the Pirelli ATR 245x75x16 on my TD5 disco and they are great, so quiet, but good grip on gravel and rocks and excellent in the sand. They will get by in the mud but don't expect too much.

Ken

[simonl8353]

Thanks for all the good advice.

I have the 8" wide rims so really need the 255/65 size to fit the rim and comply with the rolling length being within 15mm of the OEM spec. (Damn legals!) :rulez:

Some bad news
- BFG do not make a 255/65/R16 A/T
- Pirelli do not make the ATR in that size either
- The quote for the Michelin XPC was incorrect, they now want $460 ea! not $295 ea) :2up:

Having 8" wide alloys has really limited my choice here.

I have a quote for Yokohama A/T GO12 at $279ea Anyone heard anything good or bad about that tyre?

I'll ring around for size and price on the General Grabber AT2 and the Wranglers.

Thanks guys

[Redback]

Thanks for all the good advice.

I have the 8" wide rims so really need the 255/65 size to fit the rim and comply with the rolling length being within 15mm of the OEM spec. (Damn legals!) :rulez:

Some bad news
- BFG do not make a 255/65/R16 A/T
- Pirelli do not make the ATR in that size either
- The quote for the Michelin XPC was incorrect, they now want $460 ea! not $295 ea) :2up:

Having 8" wide alloys has really limited my choice here.

I have a quote for Yokohama A/T GO12 at $279ea Anyone heard anything good or bad about that tyre?

I'll ring around for size and price on the General Grabber AT2 and the Wranglers.

Thanks guys

Well actually the legal limit of 15mm is for passenger vehicles, offroad vehicles are allowed 50mm over standard rolling diameter.

8" rims on a D2, don't D2s come standard with 7" rims, P38a Rangies have 8" rims, if this is what you have then they are not standard Disco 2 rims, i'd be fitting 265/70/16s.

Baz.

[roverfj1200]

Check with your insurance company you may find that they will only allow 245mm wide..My D2 has 8" rims.
Cheers.



Well actually the legal limit of 15mm is for passenger vehicles, offroad vehicles are allowed 50mm over standard rolling diameter.

8" rims on a D2, don't D2s come standard with 7" rims, P38a Rangies have 8" rims, if this is what you have then they are not standard Disco 2 rims, i'd be fitting 265/70/16s.

Baz.

[BMKal]

Well actually the legal limit of 15mm is for passenger vehicles, offroad vehicles are allowed 50mm over standard rolling diameter.

8" rims on a D2, don't D2s come standard with 7" rims, P38a Rangies have 8" rims, if this is what you have then they are not standard Disco 2 rims, i'd be fitting 265/70/16s.

Baz.

Technical specs for D2 quotes four wheel options -

Steel 7J x 16
Alloy 7J x 16
Alloy 8J x 16
Alloy 8J x 18

Mine also has 8 x 16 alloys and I've seen at least one other D2 getting around Kalgoorlie with the same rims as mine, so they can't be all that uncommon.

[simonl8353]

Technical specs for D2 quotes four wheel options -

Steel 7J x 16
Alloy 7J x 16
Alloy 8J x 16
Alloy 8J x 18

Mine also has 8 x 16 alloys and I've seen at least one other D2 getting around Kalgoorlie with the same rims as mine, so they can't be all that uncommon.
BMKal is correct with the wheel sizes.
I'd like to know what tyres you are using.

More choice limiters. I have discovered there are no Cooper ATR's in that size, No Federal in that size and no Kumo in that size (255/65/R16).

Also, the tyre guy confirmed 15mm difference is max legal variation with both 2WD and 4WD.

.....Looking more like the Yokohamas every minute.

[Franz]

Well actually the legal limit of 15mm is for passenger vehicles, offroad vehicles are allowed 50mm over standard rolling diameter.

8" rims on a D2, don't D2s come standard with 7" rims, P38a Rangies have 8" rims, if this is what you have then they are not standard Disco 2 rims, i'd be fitting 265/70/16s.

Baz.
My D2a came with 16x8" rims as standard.

[del]

me and some of my mates have been using cooper st for over 20000 now and have not had a single prob with them on or off road ,but with any tyre you are gunna get people that say they love em or hate em ,it up to you to sort out the **** from the clay

[BMKal]

Simon,

I didn't tick any option in your poll because I have not gone for AT style tyres this time and have never had any experience with any of the options you have listed. On my last Disco, I had Kelly Safari AT's and was very impressed with them. Unfortunately, Kelly tyres for 4WD's are not currently available in Aus.

This time round, I have opted for a Highway (HT) style tyre, as most of my km's are on bitumen. Pretty much any off roading I do is on sand, and HT's are as good as, if not better than, other styles of tyres in sand in any case.

After looking around what was available in Kalgoorlie, I have recently fitted a set of GT Radial Savero HT's at 265/70/16. Early days yet, but so far, I'm very impressed. These tyres have made a huge difference to the ride of the Disco - much quieter than the Michelins that were on it, plus much better steering (at least on bitumen) - none of the "tram-lining" that was there with the Michelins.

From an appearance perspective, this size tyre looks much better on the Disco than the original Michelins - definitely fill out the wheel arches a bit better. IMO, the original tyres always looked too small for the Disco.

Two issues - the speedo is out a little bit because of the increased rolling diameter, but I can live with that and I'll find out exactly how far out soon when I do a test run with a mate's GPS. The bigger problem was that you can't shut the back door with one of these on the spare tyre carrier - the tyre tread rubs fairly heavily on the top of the bumper. This is easy to fix. Remove the spare tyre carrier (6 bolts), flatten the bottom corners of the mounting surfaces of the carrier (they curve outward slightly), use a centre punch and mark out new holes about an inch below the original mounting holes, drill and re-mount. I also took the opportunity while I had the carrier off to make up a work light pedestal on the back - whole job took me about an hour plus painting and running the wiring for the light.

No issues with tyres rubbing inside any of the guards, and I've taken it out through a few gullies and trenches to make sure they don't rub when suspension articulated.

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/2462/dscf1300qc2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Hope this helps.

[agrojnr]

Try Maxxis tyres they have the size your after but might not be the tread patten


Adam

[BradM]

Went through the same delima. Have a look at the

Yokohama 255/65 16 G012 (ATS)

I am currently running them and are really happy with them. The seem a really good all round AT tyre as well as keeping it leagle, put a fat footprint on the road, handle well in the wet, on sand, dirt and keep the gearing standard for low down pulling power.

Picked up 5 in Perth at Applecroos for $270 each fitted.

YOKOHAMA / OUR TYRES / Geolandar A/T G012 (http://www.yokohama.com.au/ourtyres/tyre.aspx'tyreid=204)

[waynep]

Don't discount the Cooper ATR no matter what you've heard on here.

I've had the ATRs on for 30,000km now still nowhere near half worn - been a good tyre.

I think mine were around $240 per.

I think the STT was the tyre having the issues.

[Scouse]

If you're interested, I've a set (4 of) of 255/65/16 Simex Stallions that I'm not using.
3 are less than 500km old, the other is around 2000km old.

See here for the details on the tyre:
Tyres4U - Simex Stallion (http://live.tyres4u.com.au/tyres4u/brands/simeprodstallion_img-sx.html)



I'm in Sydney though :(.

[CraigE]

Don't discount the Cooper ATR no matter what you've heard on here.

I've had the ATRs on for 30,000km now still nowhere near half worn - been a good tyre.

I think mine were around $240 per.

I think the STT was the tyre having the issues.

The ST had issue delaminating. The STT has had no real issues apart from some minor chipping and cracking of thr lugs. I am running STTs on mine and have not had any problems, noc cracking or chipping either.
Cheers
CraigE

[Batman]

I know everyone has different opinions. I fitted some BFG AT's to my TD5 Disco before Xmas and have been totally unhappy with them. They seem to cause the vehicle to wander a lot and the rear end squirms, (airbag model) especially when I hook up my van. I have tried everything to get rid of it and nothing seems to work. My wife is reluctant to drive it now, where as before with the Michelin's she loved it. I have been told that two identical cars can behave differently with the same tyre????? I'm now faced with either keeping these tyres for offroad only and buying another set for road use ( a pain) or trying a different brand.
Batman

[agrojnr]

I have never liked the BFG tyres but alot of people do

I prefer the Hankook or Kumho and Federal types


Adam

[BigJon]

Toyo OPAT in that size are pretty good too. I have them as steer tyres on my 88 Rangie and I think they are vastly superior to the Michelins.

[simonl8353]

I finally chose General Grabber AT2 255/65/R16 with Black Side Wall (BSW).

I had them fitted today by the excellent guys at "All Ranges" in Bayswater, Vic. At a very, very good price too.

The BFG's would have been my 1st choice due to the amount of support they seem to get, but cannot be bought in this size. As such I was forced to look at the alternatives. To my benefit I reckon.

Thanks to all the advice here, and to "njz" for the PM on the AT2's and the guys at "All Ranges".

Time will tell, so far I'm very smiley :D:);):cool::p

Also, what impressed me with "All Ranges" is they did'nt use a rattle gun, all done by hand. This is a massive bonus, it means no thread stripping, no broken studs and my wife could actually undo the nuts and change a wheel if needed (as was once necessary when collecting me from the airport).

[BigJon]

Looking good. Let us know how they go, I have been considering those as my next tyres.

[agrojnr]

Nice choice and they look abit like the BFG anyway:cool:


Adam

[dhard]

Try Maxxis tyres they have the size your after but might not be the tread patten


Adam
751 is very similar to old cooper at tread pattern from memory.

[rdavies]

Just wondering how you are feeling about the General Grabber AT2 since you have had them on for a few months now. I am also (like plenty of others) about to put new tyres on my Disco II and am split between the BFG and General Grabber !!

The BFG has great feedback and much more widely used, but my mechanic has recommended the General Grabber and the investigation I have done these tyres look impressive, perhaps marginally better than the BFG.

Cheers
Richard

[scarry]

my 2oo1 d2 came with 235/70r16 xpc's did around 90000ks.i found them not to bad but got very noisey at the end of there life

replaced them with 245/70r16 bfg at's

they are now on the 04 d2 i have & have done around 70000ks still heaps of tread left.less noise and much better traction than the xpc's.....and not one puncture although seem badly chipped from gravel roads.i also rotate them every 10000ks.

cheers

paul

[rdavies]

Yep, I too have gone the General Grabber AT2 235/70 R16. Look great and feel good. I went the 235/70 as BFG have exact same size, very popular and readily available everywhere in the event I need a quick replacement....the GG would be much harder to source out side capital cities.

Cheers
Richard

[Pierre]

Prior to Delilah (03 Disco 2) heading to the northwest in late August, we've bought a set (5) of steel wheels and 235/70/16 General Grabber AT2. Sourced the wheels from local importer - look like silver Sunraysia - fully welded, tested and certified.

Wheel/tyre assembly was $320. Balanced well with very little runout - I was pleasantly surprised.

Now to source the steel wheel nuts and they'll get a run.

Why the change, you ask, from alloys? Well, changing tyres on alloys after a staking is a FLATOUT PITA especially in the scrub. Steel rims are so much simpler. And the alloys will go back on when we get back early Oct.

BTW, we have Saveros on the alloys and I agree that they are quiet and track straight with very little squirm.

I'll let you know how the newies go.

Pete

[Pierre]

REPORT CARD ON GENERAL GRABBER AT2

Well, back after 6 weeks and 16200 km on 235/70/16 GG AT2. About 4500 km in the dirt (Buchanan, Duncan, GRR, various other bits, much sand) and the report card is

VERY GOOD.

No evidence of chipping at all, very little obvious wear. And we weren't sparing the neddies, either, towing 1.1T of camper. No punctures (a plus for me).

A bit noisy on the highway, but no more the BFG ATs.

I'd recommend them. In hindsight, I may have opted for a slightly larger size, but I'm satisfied with the original choice.

Stuff it, got to go back to work!

Pete

[DiscoMick]

Interesting thread. I'm thinking of replacing the worn standard 235/70/16 BFG ATs on my D1 with 245/70/16 before we head for Cape York in September, since I'm told the 50mm lift means the larger size will fit OK and not rub.
Was thinking of BFG ATs again in the larger size. Have looked at Pirelli Scorpions but they look a bit more on road than off road compared with the BFG ATs. Also assume the BFGs might be easier to get in the bush.
The General Grabber AT2s look to have a very similar tread pattern to the BFG ATs. Is that right? How do you think they compare for strength and wear rates? I read the sidewalls of the Grabbers are 2 ply but the BFG ATs are 3 ply so that seems significant.

[Nicky]

The BFGs are very pressure sensitive, try a few different settings, up and down.

[DiscoMick]

How do you think Bridgestone ATs compare with the Pirelli Scorpions, BFG ATs and General Grabbers? I notice Bob Jane is doing some pretty sharp deals on Bridgestone ATs, which are some $60 cheaper each than the Pirellis. Apart fromn supporting local industry (the Bridgestones are made here), I wonder how they compare as tyres.

I've decided I don't need MTs since most of my time is spent on the bitumen and ATs should be adequate for most of my other driving. ATs are also considerably cheaper than MTs.

[Slunnie]

All of these tyres are a generation behind the Pirelli ATR. Its a bit like all of the series owners saying that the IIa was the best Landy produced.... less to go wrong, but have never experienced things like.... quiet, traction, smoothness, low rolling resistance. The rubber compound is called Silica. Its like comparing a Series Landy to a Disco2. The tread pattern is probably 25 years more advanced than the BFG and at least 10-15 years on the the others.

[CleanTD5]

I have often thought a good strategy would be to approach various D1 or D2 owners who have original Michelins as the spare, to buy the "tyre" from them for the cost of a tyre to suit the four on the ground, which is then put on your rim or their rim,,,,,,,that way they get rid of the useless spare and you get a michelin ?????? Would only work effectively if you found 'local' people in your area who were easy to catch up with again??????!!!!!!! Thoughts ??????

[Slunnie]

I have often thought a good strategy would be to approach various D1 or D2 owners who have original Michelins as the spare, to buy the "tyre" from them for the cost of a tyre to suit the four on the ground, which is then put on your rim or their rim,,,,,,,that way they get rid of the useless spare and you get a michelin ?????? Would only work effectively if you found 'local' people in your area who were easy to catch up with again??????!!!!!!! Thoughts ??????
Those tyres will be past their used by date by now... well, at least most of them.

[simonl8353]

I have often thought a good strategy would be to approach various D1 or D2 owners who have original Michelins as the spare, to buy the "tyre" from them for the cost of a tyre to suit the four on the ground, which is then put on your rim or their rim,,,,,,,that way they get rid of the useless spare and you get a michelin ?????? Would only work effectively if you found 'local' people in your area who were easy to catch up with again??????!!!!!!! Thoughts ??????

Not sure if its the same, but I tried this a while back, http://www.aulro.com/afvb/shopping-trolley/53564-coordinated-selling-michelin-xpcs.html

But ended up selling my XPC on ebay, to a well deserving Landy owner so I have no complaints.

[Red Baron]

Just my 2 cents, but before we sold the wifes Exploder, we were looking at putting a set of the Grabber AT2's on it. I noticed that the AT2's weren't a LT (Light Truck) tyre in the sizes we looked at....nearly put a couple on my D1 until I saw that!

[DiscoMick]

The Pirellis are about $60 more than the others. Are they worth it?

[Slunnie]

The Pirellis are about $60 more than the others. Are they worth it?
Probably not if you just want something to keep the rims off the ground.
Probably if you want traction, silence and appreciate good tyres.

[DiscoMick]

Sounds like they're worth it then.
Would they be OK for puncture resistence up Cape York and in other tougher conditions?

[simonl8353]

Just my 2 cents, but before we sold the wifes Exploder, we were looking at putting a set of the Grabber AT2's on it. I noticed that the AT2's weren't a LT (Light Truck) tyre in the sizes we looked at....nearly put a couple on my D1 until I saw that!

For info, on a 255/65/R16 the GG AT2 is rated at 109T (Im sure someone will advise what that means ;):angel:)

See attached for other information, note BSW=Black Side Wall, OWL=Outside White Lettering.

I rotate mine with the spare at around 5000k intervals, they have around 14,000 on them now and showing some even wear, all good and me a very happy chappy:D

[Slunnie]

Sounds like they're worth it then.
Would they be OK for puncture resistence up Cape York and in other tougher conditions?
I'm not sure what they are like for punctures. I've not heard of them being punctured..... Punctures at Cape York wouldn't worry me in the slightest, it didn't seem to me to be an area that was tough on tyres like that. The big thing I'd be looking for in that area is traction... we ran Simex up there, and the Simex are the tyres which I always puncture - but no probs up there.