3.9L V8 Oil Choice. Advice please

[simonl8353]

After multiple attempts at searching AULRO, I figured now I'd better just ask.

Whats the best type of engine oil for my petrol 1999 D2 3.95L V8 with 182,000 kms.

Have been told by mechanic to use a 15W-40 and other advice is Mobil 1 0W-40.
Something about synthetic uhhhh! wots that? :unsure:

I Dont have my RAVE CD with me but would you stick with what it reccommends when the engine is new?

I just want to top it up for now.

Cheers

[Slow Disco]

After multiple attempts at searching AULRO, I figured now I'd better just ask.

Whats the best type of engine oil for my petrol 1999 D2 3.95L V8 with 182,000 kms.

Have been told by mechanic to use a 15W-40 and other advice is Mobil 1 0W-40.
Something about synthetic uhhhh! wots that? :unsure:

I Dont have my RAVE CD with me but would you stick with what it reccommends when the engine is new?

I just want to top it up for now.

Cheers
I'm using synthetic 5/40, really good if motor is in good condition. Been using this in xr6T as well for last 3 years. Changing it every 7,500 but I do 1,000 per week so oil is always hot. Would use an oil flush such as Nulon every change, keeps lifters nice and quiet. The 0/40 is a very thin oil. The 5/40 will make the engine smoother on startup and also easier to start, especially during winter.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

new motors are diffferent---
my old D1 ran on HPR30 for 100,000 kays.
no smoke, no rattles, no top-ups between 5k servicing.

excellent.:cool:

[Pedro_The_Swift]

always worth a read,,
(I'm wearing this link out Rick!!:D)
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-chatter/47096-valvoline-synpower-5w-40-td5.html

[simonl8353]

Thanks Pedro,

the thread has Ricks table with all the viscosity intel, looks good.
However, being 9 parts stooopid :spudnikheadstand:, I cannot find a conclusive answer on it to my question, plus my D2 is petrol and this thread keeps mentioning diesel. There is likely to be a different oil for the two.

...so what engine oil to use in a V8 petrol with 180,000 kays?

[PhilipA]

The 3.9 is an old tech engine, even with its upgrades by BMW.

At 182 K I would expect it to use oil with a hot 40 weight oil.
The low number is the W for winter viscosity and is only applicable at start up, so unless you live in the cold mountains, a 5 or 10 or even 15 is fine for Australia . 40 is OK if the car doesn't use oil.

I have recently been using Mobil 1 5/50 in my 92 3.9 with 142 K km on it, and the bloody stuff finds its way out everywhere,. especially around the oil pump and filter.( yours has a different setup.)
My next change will be to Shell Helix Plus 15/50 which I find to be a good weight for a Rover V8 and I change it every 5K or so..
Many guys use Penrite HPR 10, 20 ,or 30 in theirs which are 50 or 60 weight oils when hot.
Regards Philip A

[p38arover]

The 3.9 is an old tech engine, even with its upgrades by BMW.

What upgrades did BMW do to the basic engine?

Oh, on topic, I use Penrite HPR Gas (SAE 20W-60) but might look at HPR Gas 10 (SAE 10W-50) in my 4.6 V8. The engine has less than 10,000km on it.

[DaveS3]

I'm using penrite 20w60 for gas vehicles.

Seems to do the job.

[PhilipA]

Well they put better gaskets on the rocker covers, a composite in the valley, different path for water to thermostat, alloy sump, Thor manifold, Motronic ECU.
I do not know if they tightened the bearing and piston tolerances but I doubt it.
LR also did several upgrades such as the new oil pump system, cross bolts, stretch to yield head bolts.
All of these seemed to cause problems and I doubt whether would cause me to use thinner oil..
Regards Philip A

[sclarke]

On Rover V8's i run GTX3, older ones i Run GTX2..... funny... thats what Rover called for back in the 70's

Volvo's GTX2 and my old Land Crabs.... GTX2.....

[RonMcGr]

I was recommended by a Rover man to use, Valvoline Synpower.
Bit expensive, but then so are motors.
As my 97 V8 has done only 110,000km, it is worth it :D

Cheers,
Ron

[markd2]

hi
I always use penrite 30 in my old d1 v8 discos and penrite 5 diesel in my td5 check out the recommendations on penrite web site www.penrite.com.au
cheers mark

[MacMan]

Penrite HPR GAS 10 in our 3.9 which was on LPG from new. Comes out looking good at 10K, no oil consumption issues at 251,000km.

Bought in 20L drums it's not expensive.

[simonl8353]

hi
I always use penrite 30 in my old d1 v8 discos and penrite 5 diesel in my td5 check out the recommendations on penrite web site www.penrite.com.au
cheers mark
The Penrite web-site has a neat oil selection thingy, anyway the result states HPR 10.
The blurb says;
HPR 10
Semi-synthetic wide range viscosity engine oil developed to give the optimum balance between engine protection and fuel economy/power retention. Recommended for use in a wide range of vehicles built since 1996 including those that require 10W-xx grade oils.
Not recommended for motorcycles
SAE 10W-50, API SM/CF, ACEA A3/B4, M2C902/910, HN2100, VW 502, MB229.3

Any thoughts chaps ?

[matbor]

From : http://www.penrite.com.au/ (http://www.penrite.com.au/)

Recommendation for: LAND ROVER Discovery 3.5L/3.9L petrol (1991-1995)
Engine oil = HPR 30

Recommendation for: LAND ROVER Discovery Series I, 3.9L petrol (1995-1999)
Engine oil = HPR 15

Recommendation for: LAND ROVER Discovery Series II, 4.0L petrol (1999-2005)
Engine oil = HPR 10



I have always used HPR15 in my disco1 3.9, has nearly done 200,000kms the only oil loss is the drips :) do u think I should start using a different HPR now ? maybe HPR30

Matt.

[simonl8353]

I have always used HPR15 in my disco1 3.9, has nearly done 200,000kms the only oil loss is the drips :) do u think I should start using a different HPR now ? maybe HPR30

Matt.
I have less than no idea, but someone here might.

Thanks for the tip though

[D3Jon]

The 3.9 is an old tech engine, even with its upgrades by BMW.

At 182 K I would expect it to use oil with a hot 40 weight oil.
The low number is the W for winter viscosity and is only applicable at start up, so unless you live in the cold mountains, a 5 or 10 or even 15 is fine for Australia . 40 is OK if the car doesn't use oil.

I have recently been using Mobil 1 5/50 in my 92 3.9 with 142 K km on it, and the bloody stuff finds its way out everywhere,. especially around the oil pump and filter.( yours has a different setup.)
My next change will be to Shell Helix Plus 15/50 which I find to be a good weight for a Rover V8 and I change it every 5K or so..
Many guys use Penrite HPR 10, 20 ,or 30 in theirs which are 50 or 60 weight oils when hot.
Regards Philip A

What Philip said.

I've had a few Rover V8 motors over the years and would recommend 15W/40 or even good old 20W/50. Even in a race car application I used no less than 40 weight oil (when hot), the V8 Rover engine is an old design (Buick) that dates back to the 60's and is best used with the thicker oils.

Jon

[rick130]

Oil viscosity is governed IMO by a couple of factors, bearing clearance, ring material type and bore finish. Just because an engine was originally designed in the late fifties doesn't preclude it from using modern materials/technology. What is so different between the Rover V8 and say, the old Buick/Commodore V6 that is factory specced with a 10W-30 ?

I wouldn't use anything heavier than a 15W-40 unless leakdowns or a compression test showed less than optimum. 25w-60 oils are crazy in an engine in good nick. It just costs you power and fuel economy and possible wear at start up. There is also the possibility of undue strain and breakage on oil pump drives. (and yes, I believed the thicker is better hype in years past too)
Being a flat tappet lifter engine, personally I'd go for a mixed fleet diesel oil. It'll give a little more protection in the cam/lifter area than most modern petrol engine oils yet having said that I ran a pretty warm 351C on Mobil 1 5W-50 and occasionally BP Visco 5000 5W-40 for years with no ill effects.

For a '99 DII V8

Caltex recommend Havolene synthetic 5w-40
Mobil recommend Mobil 1 0W-40 or one of their 10w-40's
Shell recommend Helix Ultra 5W-40 or Helix Plus 15W-50
Castrol recommend Magnatec 10W-40 or GTX3 15w-40
Valvolene recommend Durablend 10W-40 May also use XLD 20W-50, XLD PLUS 20W-50 or PROBLEND SYNTH-X 10W-40.
Pennzoil (made by Shell) recommend Premium 5W-40 or Syn blend 10w-40
Fuchs recommend Titan Supersyn or Titan Super GTO 10W-40
Redline recommend 10W-40
Amsoil recommend 5W-40 or 10W-40
BP recommend Visco 5000 5W-40

Haven't been able to find out yet what Motul, Total, Conoco and Agip recommend. I'm sure if you rang their offices their tech people would help.

[Hucksta]

Here's my 2 cents

I've got a 3.9 with 160,000 on the clock. My mechanic is a damn legend of a bloke and he swears by Castrol GTX3 15/40. Said it is fanastic for engines with a bit of wear, especialy 4 wheel drive engines that go 4 wheel driving but just as good around town.

Didn't ask him why, but I have been going to him for a thousand years along with all my family and friends and he is a guru so that's that .....

Hucksta

[PhilipA]

As I said in my post, a 40 hot weight oil is OK, if you are not using a lot of oil.
If using oil say more than 1-1.5 litres in 5K, then go to a 50.

Most oil is used in these engines is down the valve guides. The later engines (after about 96 or so ) have Teflon seals , which reduce oil consumption until they wear , so later engines may start to use oil once they get a few Ks up. 160K or so.
The most important thing I believe with these engines is to change the oil relatively often. I still change mine at 5-6 K intervals even using semi-synthetics, if just running around town. But 15K intervals may cause wear. I will do a 10 K interval on a long cruise trip.

Maybe the 2001s are better because they have the fancy quick warm up thermostats which also run much hotter ( and therefore have less unburned fuel and water in the oil), but from the problems on this forum , it appears to me that these cause more problems than they solve.
Its cheap insurance.
It really doesn't matter much EXACTLY what oil is used, as long as it is changed regularly.
Rover V8s LOOOOVE clean oil.
Regards Philip A

[4bee]

For mine, I use Castrol GTX Diesel. 15w - 40 & have done for years. It uses no oil in between 6 monthly oil changes, regardless of km travelled..

[James l322]

I think Penrite HPR30 is absolutely the best. These engines run high volume low oil pressure and the slightly thicker base oil on the Penrite works better. I found the Castrol and any of the thinner base oils end up with rattly lifters quickly. I have driven over 300,000km with Rover V8's and changed all my own oil.

I also found that the Ryco filters aren't the best. Their filtering efficiency is not defined. You're better off with a K&N or the best is the Amsoil EaO42 if you have a mate in the USA to get them for you. The filter efficiency in the Amsoil is published and accurate.

And never take the filter off when the sump is empty unless you want to rebleed the pump.:(

James

[AK83]

I've had a few Rover V8's over the years.
my predominant oil was Mobil 1. Back then there was really only 1 grade available, either 5 or 10 W 40.
Then I remember they brought out a 10W60 years back and I started using that. It may have been 10W50, but I'm sure it was 60!(can't remember what I was doing 10+ years ago).
Either way, I'd done over 500K klms in that Rangie, I finally retired it with over 600K klms on it, and really only due to cost of petrol wayyy back then(I remember $1.80/lt!!)
For about 2 years around mid way through it's life with me(early to mid '90s), I drove with the temp gauge on the red line all the time.
When the red lining started, of course I took it to the mechanic to change coolant stuff, coolant, water pumps, etc, etc. Problem was we couldn't really find anything wrong. After a few months of hair pulling, we settled on the problem being that there must have been some strange anomaly in the wiring between temp sender and gauge.
Not so. One day I touched the radiator and it fell to pieces.
We flushed the radiator and pressure tested it and it came up good.
But the fins were all very fragile on this day 2 years later.
... change radiator and gauge now read just below normal.
So for two years the most likely scenario was that the engine was in fact run very hot.
How hot no one could know, but the needle ran at the start of the red zone .. where most folks would pull over to sort it out.
Basically from the day I got it, I used to run Mobil 1. it was only in the last year or so that I started using cheaper oils, only due to cost and the presumption that the motor was worn down to it's last legs.
But it never failed in any way in those 500K klms.

[DiscoClax]

Whatever you use please check that the ZDDP content is around 1200ppm or more. This is one of the key reasons that RV8s munch camshafts.... At anything much less than this level you will chew out your camshaft in short order. "Modern" oils aren't designed for flat-tappet pushrod engines as none have been made in a couple of decades now and ZDDP poisons catalysts so the levels have been severely reduced. Any engine vaguely similar to ours is roller cam now and they just don't generate the extreme pressure and sliding friction that a flat tappet does. You can run them on almost anything.

Aussie-made Penrite and Nulon oils in the non-"eco/enviro" range generally have sufficient zinc/phos/moly content to protect the camshaft. Penrite are one of the few that list their ZDDP content publicly, Nulon will provide if you ask them nicely. Nulon use a moly-DTc fortifier along with the ZDDP so their ZDDP levels are generally lower than Penrite but with similar or better protection due to the extra additive.

From Nulon:
"The later API specifications do have restrictions on the concentration of ZDDP in engine oils, however they more stringent on the lighter viscosity grades such as SAE 5W-20 etc. Normally you can include more ZDDP in the heavier viscosity grades such as SAE 15W-50 and still meet later API specifications. Even though our FULL SYNTHETIC 15W-50 STREET & TRACK HIGH PERFORMANCE ENGINE OIL (SYN15W50) meets the current API SN performance specification we are able to increase the zinc level due to the heavier viscosity grade. "

Refer attached file from Penrite.

For reference:
Nulon full synth 0W40 (PAO ester) is around 1000ppm ZDDP (plus moly DTc), and
Nulon full synth 15W50 (Grp III synth) is 1100ppm (plus moly-DTc)

Valvoline and Mobil also publish some of their ZDDP levels if you hunt around. There are lots of good oils out there, but be informed of the ZDDP levels.

Many (most?) engine builders won't warrant their engines if you use engine oils with less than 1200ppm as the chewed up camshaft bits tend to embed in plain bearings and cause rapid wear. That's why the valve gear on ours tends to be problematic (camshaft iron swarf embeds in the rockers and then eats the rocker shaft).

[AK83]

Mobil also have a zinc/phosophorus content table for their Mobil 1 range.

Mobil 1 Oil product guide

Edit: Oops! that didn't work too well. It was supposed to be a link to the PDF, not to display the PDF.

[Traco]

Flat tappet engines need zinc if you want your cam and lifters to last. Modern oils don't have much if any of this now because cat converters don't like it.

I use Gulf Western classic 20w/50 in my RV8s and Minis. Cheap Aussie made and has got some zinc in it still. And it holds much better pressure at 8,000 rpm in my racing Mini than most other oils I've tried and it has to work much harder in a Mini as the transmission is in the sump.

I also add a bottle of ZDDPlus every oil change to boost the zinc content up even higher.
Navone Engineering Inc. ? ZDDP Oil Products (http://davidnavone.com/zddp-oil-products/)