Advice? TD5 Manual towing OB Jayco Swan

[mousie]

Hello


Its me again, the one trying to upgrade my 1991 D1 to a D2. I have been reading the threads auto vs manual and agree for towing around Aust the auto would be rather nice. But, I've now started looking at the few manuals around and know the difference for normal driving (although never driven a manual diesel) ie matching gears to get the best out of the girl. But when it comes to towing a loaded outback swan camper coming in at 1400-1600Kgs. It would be a different story. Twice in the D1 3.5 v8, I've been embarrasingly stuck on the 'normal' roadways with the disco (10.5R tyres does not help) and swan when a moderately challenging hill was in front. Nothing to worry a Datsun sunny hence the stall. low range initially to build up revs and then an up change to high range.

So, with the td5, I suspect that this is also a real possibility on the rare occassion? This was the area of interest I just wanted the advice in as for on the highway with 5 gears locked, thinks have gotta be good. Also, should I see much improvement on highway between manual and auto fuel consumption. If the auto locks 3 and 4 in I suspect not, but then again 4 and 5 are pretty tall.

Any advice in this area will also be appreciated. Thanks Guys

Geoff

[Pedro_The_Swift]

If you go with an Auto, I'd change the fluid to synthetic and look at getting another cooler.

The Td5 should handle it well.

[Blknight.aus]

call me pedantic but If I can haul 3+ tons around and do the ranges in vic with a manual pushed by the TD5 (pre tombraider insanity chipping) it cant be that hard and you dont have to worry about overheating the manual.

[mousie]

Thankyou for this info, if 3k on hills is okay then the camper better hang on, Geoff

[BradM]

But when it comes to towing a loaded outback swan camper coming in at 1400-1600Kgs. It would be a different story.

Is that all you are going to tow? Too easy for the TD5 auto. It will do it on it's head without chipping.

Try 2,500 kg loaded. No probs.


BradM

[LandyAndy]

DEFINATELEY GO THE AUTO!!!
I have a D2 TD5 manual.They are too overgeared for easy takeoff with a heavy trailer,yes I tow heavy loads!!!!
I do have taller tyres that make it worse!!!(makes the gearing taller)
The turbo doesnt spool up fast enough so the manual struggles.
Once underway an bloody good towing motor,pulls just as hard with a load as it does empty,VERY IMPRESSIVE for a 2.5lt motor!!!
Andrew

[sfako]

You will have no probs with an auto we tow 2.6T and have pulled from Townsville to currently Esperance with an auto 2.5 turbo.
Start out with the load in third and get up to 80k then drop into D and the converter locks in so crusing at 90k at 2300rpm just nice. When you hit hills etc just drop back to 3 and there is not a prob at 3000rpm
Currently for 6900ks we have averaged 17.1 ltrs per 100

seeya Steve

[mousie]

Thanks heaps folks and I know I new in posting messages to the fourm but the assistance is brilliant. I've been looking for a while and will just have to bite the bullet. This time I had my eye on the TD5 Maunal currently on e-bay at Port Macquarie with 66K's hence the question. Only one problem when I spoke over the phone for more information as looks a hoot. The seller wants cash, yep actual cash! Somehow I don't like the idea of approx 20plus cash on handover. And kep, it is there COD only!

When I do find the machine which I can tell you will be a TD5, Iwill be all over it. Maybe I should start a threat on my inspection travels but I suspect someone will call me anal after a while.
Oh and thanks for the fuel usage, this will give me good indications for the around the Aust travel. Broke the journey up into three parts, the first two completed with a third with grown kids (chevy chase sort of thing) when the new second hand unit arrives in the rover family

Geoff

[LandyAndy]

Hi Geoff
Best you steer away from COD ebay deals,you dont want to front for your new ride only to be robbed of your hard earnt $$$$.May be legit but a big risk if its not!!!
Andrew

[BradM]

Just for info, the ECU Remap (chipping) along with the EGR removal plus the vortex muffler averages me 15 litres a 100 klms towing my 2.5 t loaded van plus gives the TD5 a lot more power to use.

I use the same technique as sfako for the auto when towing. Next outing I am going to try a tip from Slunnie and tow in sports mode.

BradM

[5teve]

i tow a boat at the same weight as your load (1.5-1.7t) with a full load in the back of the car (about another 250-300kg) and i lose about 70-100k's per tank compared to normal...

towing a car transporter the other day (Landyandy saw some of my haul) with a stack of timber on probably getting up for 2.5 to 3t and it didnt feel any different to the boat... it is chipped mildly tho..

the auto at least allows the engine to get into its power range by allowing the engine to rev to about 2500 - 3000 rpm whereas a manual doing that would end up smelling of cooked clutch!

the sports mode thing works, cant remember where i read it but it basically reacts to gear changes a bit quicker... so changes down earlier and up later if im on a big hill starting with the boat on in heavy traffic i'll chuck it in sports mode and off we go... can always keep up with the flow of the traffic too..!

boss has a td5 manual and says its a bit lame for pulling boats out of the water due to the peak torque being quite high, he is comparing against a 75series 4.2td landcruiser tho.. which having driven one i'd say the peak torque is lots lower (they dont like being revv'd and back pain higher! :D )

Thanks

Steve

[B92 8NW]

The ultimate towing gearbox would be an Auto with a Compushift unit to manually control gear selection and lock ups at speed - Compushift Controller Kit | HGM Automotive Electronics (http://www.compushift.com/products/compushift) - works on ZF4HP24, dunno about 22EH.

I don't like the fact that in 4th lockup at 100 km/h it struggles - a bit more manual control here (like 4th unlocked) would help.

But when I've got the Kubo on board, its wonderful to just sink the foot rather than have to think about what I'm doing.

http://www.compushift.com/files/images/lcd%20display%209.preview.JPG

Very handy info!!

[sfako]

After reading Brad m I towed the last two pulls ,one 470k and the other 490k and put the girl into sports mode started off in 3erd and then into drive, put on the cruse and just let the computer do the job. Well it spent alot of time in 3erd and reving arround 3m but the fuel usage averaged 15.3 and 15.4 per 100k. A good saving, so over 10000 k thats 200ltrs of fuel.So when i drive back to Townsville from Perth i think this will be the driving option
Cheers Steve.

[StephenF10]

I tow a 1500kg pop-top with a TD5 auto. I have tried towing in sports mode 4th but found that the transmission spends too much time unlocked, which I think may lead to more heat being generated by the slipping torque converter. In normal 4th the trans seems to hang on too long before changing down, at which point the accelerator is almost flat to the floor. That's a lot of torque going through an overdrive gear. I now tow in 3rd at 85-90 km/hr and find it a lot less stressful for both me and the car. Under most conditions I can now click the CC on and sit back without having to constantly watch for and manually change down for every slight uphill gradient.

[feral]

I tow a 1500kg pop-top with a TD5 auto. I have tried towing in sports mode 4th but found that the transmission spends too much time unlocked, which I think may lead to more heat being generated by the slipping torque converter. In normal 4th the trans seems to hang on too long before changing down, at which point the accelerator is almost flat to the floor. That's a lot of torque going through an overdrive gear. I now tow in 3rd at 85-90 km/hr and find it a lot less stressful for both me and the car. Under most conditions I can now click the CC on and sit back without having to constantly watch for and manually change down for every slight uphill gradient.



I also tow a 1500 kg pop-top with a Td5 auto. I have tried towing in sports mode and found that it's all revs and nothing much else.

What most people seem to be missing is the 'momentum' theory. I do not understand why people sit on 85-90 km/hr labouring away when they can easily sit on 100-110 km/hr. This creates LESS stress on your vehicle and possibly uses less fuel as well. Not to mention the road block of your slow pace compared to other traffic.

If I do come to a uphill gradient I just pull it down into 3rd and take it from there.

As with most vehicles there is a little sweet spot that when everthing is cruising and effortless thats when you have it in the right position.

[storm boy]

Hi Geoff,
I haven't driven a td5 auto so can't compare but we went around oz last year in our 03 d2 td5 manual towing a jayco eagle and it towed brilliantly. Wife, 3 kids fully loaded car incl roof, and towing about 1200kg and was getting over 800km out of a tank ( 11-12 l/100km) sitting on 100km/h, 5th gear all the way. Its a pretty flat country and you can drive for hours without having to change gear.

[mousie]

Hi Folks, well its me again and I see some more info but the best news is I purchased a 2000 TD5 Auto today and its at home sitting next to my old D1. There was not much choosing in the second hand market in Brisbane and I managed to find a one owner with full log books and untouched road drive machine. First impression is a hoot. So this arvo was crawling all over it looking to place the brake controller, find the CDL bit, and searching for accessories. Given its my second I think I am allowed but the wife, well she just looks at me even more with that mature look. Anyway, can't wait to hook up the camper and given it a test run before a bigger trip later in the year.

This would have to be the best web site I have ever been part of as the information is everywhere.

I'll keep you all posted and follow up with pics of what I end up modifying.

Geoff