LR "reputation"

[Scallops]

After reading the comments in this thread below (and in particular "Potta's" comment) - It made me think about all the people who have informed me of my absolute stupidity in buying a new Land Rover. :(

My question is this - was there some particular models or time frame when Land Rovers were particularly unreliable? (Lets hope the answer isn't 1948-2008! :D)

Keep the Troopy or buy a Defender - Page 2 - Australian 4WD Action Online Forums (http://www.4wdmonthly.com.au/forum/showthread.php't=53596&page=2)

[Psimpson7]

Few of us have been defending the Landies!

Pete

[Tank]

After reading the comments in this thread below (and in particular "Potta's" comment) - It made me think about all the people who have informed me of my absolute stupidity in buying a new Land Rover. :(

My question is this - was there some particular models or time frame when Land Rovers were particularly unreliable? (Lets hope the answer isn't 1948-2008! :D)

Keep the Troopy or buy a Defender - Page 2 - Australian 4WD Action Online Forums (http://www.4wdmonthly.com.au/forum/showthread.php't=53596&page=2)
I think LRA's biggest problem is not Reliability, BUT the LACK of Dealers across this country, getting your service and warranty work done when the nearest dealer is maybe a 1000klms away will keep LRA at the bottom of the heap, till the problem is solved.
I live on the South coast of NSW in a small town, within a short drive (3 to 25klms) of my home there is a Ford, Holden, Nissan, Toyota, Kia, Mitsubishi dealerships and Service centres, the closest LRA Dealer is 2hrs West or 3 hours North and I live in the most densley populated area of Australia, Regards Frank.

[x-box]

ok, according to them troopy's have a reputation of being bullet-proof (that who started or you get where?) and landrovers have one of being unreliable???? also, where does that reputation come from or where did it start??? (i would say toyota owners) Mate, give me my fender any day above a troopy, not that i dislike toyota's or nissans - each to his own - but this unreliability stuff gets me going. As we all know each brand has it's problems, it's just that they (toyota and nissan) have to shout louder about our "problems" so they can sleep easier and keep the focus off their own failures.
Go the fenders Scollops - you got a weapon there, so sleep easy :cool: , and you're definately not stupid, you just know what you want and what will do the job for you the best way.

Now relax and go enjoy your trip!!!!! :D

[JamesH]

Purely on the "devil you know" criterion, I'd be telling that guy to keep the Troopy. Also, the guy who posted that he was considering getting rid of his troopy and buying a Defender becasue he has a baby on the way needs to be told that Deffies don't have babyseat brackets.

I love my Defender and would never advise anyone to get a Troopy but I'm honest enough to admit that none of my criteria for choosing LR are practical, rational or even socially acceptable


1: Have always likes Landies since a kid. Just like 'em. And i love it when people can't understand why.

2. Don't want a Japanese vehicle. Ever.

3. Don't want the same car everybody else has.

4. HM the Queen has Defenders and so did the Queen Mother.

Troopies are good vehicles. Luckily the new wagon doesn't have the second fuel tank or I'd be sorely sorely tempted (except for item 2 above). What you save on fuel in a Defender you spend on parts.

[Scallops]

ok, according to them troopy's have a reputation of being bullet-proof (that who started or you get where?) and landrovers have one of being unreliable???? also, where does that reputation come from or where did it start??? (i would say toyota owners) Mate, give me my fender any day above a troopy, not that i dislike toyota's or nissans - each to his own - but this unreliability stuff gets me going. As we all know each brand has it's problems, it's just that they (toyota and nissan) have to shout louder about our "problems" so they can sleep easier and keep the focus off their own failures.
Go the fenders Scollops - you got a weapon there, so sleep easy :cool: , and you're definately not stupid, you just know what you want and what will do the job for you the best way.

Now relax and go enjoy your trip!!!!! :D

Thanks Louis :) I will. I'll be looking forward to getting back out with the club on my return.

[RonMcGr]

In the 90's when I was in the Military, we had (in our unit) four Troop carriers and four 110 Land Rovers.

If I drove around Sydney I'd use the Troopie, when we went out in the bush, the 110, ALWAYS! The troop carrier was a rough b*stard of a thing!

As for reliability, the only Land Rovers we every had that we trouble, thirsty with a terrible range, were those horrid SIII 6 cylinder petrol ones. Given a choice, back then, I'd find a SIIa instead!

[Scallops]

In the 90's when I was in the Military, we had (in our unit) four Troop carriers and four 110 Land Rovers.

If I drove around Sydney I'd use the Troopie, when we went out in the bush, the 110, ALWAYS! The troop carrier was a rough b*stard of a thing!

As for reliability, the only Land Rovers we every had that we trouble, thirsty with a terrible range, were those horrid SIII 6 cylinder petrol ones. Given a choice, back then, I'd find a SIIa instead!

OK, Thanks - that was the type of info I was after - so perhaps there were particular models which may have been somewhat more "problematic".

[ak]

Look I believe LR had question-able reliability issues right up until, 2005 until the D3 & RRS was released. The D3 and RRS are proving to be very reliable compared to the Jap trucks. However until now LR has never been seriously able to match the japs in the reliability stakes.

So it's a bit hard to change peoples view of LR reilability on their track record over the past 40 years compared to the last 3 years, 2005, 2006 & 2007.

A lot of people tried the product in the 70's, 80's & 90's and to be really honest they were let down by it. So that's why today you still have " LR are crap would never own one again". That monkey is going to take a long time to shake, but at least I reckon LR has turned the corner. Just my 2 cents worth.

[Fusion]

As the top gear footage says.... Over 70% of land rovers ever made are still on the road today ;).

And the best bit said is ....... A Land Rover won't be seen collecting an Oscar .Instead it will be far to busy doing something important . :cool:.

Can you feel the passion people :wub::wub::BigThumb:.

[cookiesa]

Let the flaming begin but the reality is the troopy will win hands down when not looked after. the low tech straight six 1hz and variants is like Nissans TD42 straight six. Will clock up immense Km's with abuse and without marking it's territory every time you pull in to someones drive. Having owned and sold all (except selling Landrover) Toyota and Nissan have it in reliability (not counting the Toyota V8 and Nissan 3L as these do have problems) They also don't leak anything like the Rovers.

So why do I drive a Rover? I love the Disco, 300tdi is great power for economy, mates in their Patrols always chew more fuel on every trip we do. The Disco is very capable (1 mate has a rear diff lock and the other is a ute with 4" of lift and 33" tyres) we all go over the same tracks and no problems (Disco is standard height with no extra traction aids) And comfort, The disco is also a great size around town not as big as the Patrol or Cruiser (unfortunately when we go away!) but still solid axle front and rear for off road articulation)

If you buy a Troopy you will have a huge interior and it will be very reliable. (without mods) You won't get as good off road abilities, forget highway performance, forget comfort and forget economy.

[solmanic]

As far as I am aware, the whole reliability issue stems from the bad old days of British Leyland. Pretty much the entire British car industry has been painted with the same brush since the 70s & 80s and Land Rover (as one of the few surviving marques) still suffers from that.

Regarding the Defender in particular, I am sure it is fair to say that the percentage of warranty repairs on these is still far higher than average but this is to be expected form a vehicle that is largely assembled by hand. But let's face it, the vehicle is supposed to be used in harsh conditions and usually suffers more than its fair share of user modifications to further complicate things.

[cookiesa]

Agree with most of that but things like the headlight switch burning out (common), rear power windows not functioning correctly (common) Oil in the Td5 wiring Harness, Oil leaks from the power steering system etc etc. These are fairly common issues that can't be excused by being hand built. They are components that weren't suitable for the job.

[The ho har's]

Now relax and go enjoy your trip!!!!! :D[/QUOTE]


yeh I don't want a grumpy scallops while we are away :angel:


Mrs ho har:D:D

[Scallops]

Few of us have been defending the Landies!

Pete

Yes! :D I had another look at the original thread and I see a few familiar names chipping into the debate! :BigThumb:

[Scallops]

Now relax and go enjoy your trip!!!!! :D


yeh I don't want a grumpy scallops while we are away :angel:


Mrs ho har:D:D[/QUOTE]

OK - I'm happy! :D

[PAT303]

I have owned LR's and worked on toyota's,Nissans and the reliability thing is a lot of rubbish.I would not have had a job if jap vehicles were as good as they are supposed to be.Go to the toyota or Nissan site's and have a look in their Tech threads.They have lots and lots of drama's.I like the post''Defender parts are expensive and hard to get'' compared to what?.It doesn't matter what you drive you will have to wait for most parts overnight dealer or no dealer. Pat

[waynep]

i'd have a new Defender tomorrow if they sorted out the support problem

[Scallops]

i'd have a new Defender tomorrow if they sorted out the support problem

And the supply problem! :p

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Land Rovers had a reputation of continuous improvement right until the end of the series 2a when the British Automotive Industry was nationalised by the Government as British Leyland under the leadership Lord Stokes (a Triumph man). At the time the Rover Co Ltd had a number of good projects in the design phase, like the Llama forward control, the Road Rover and Range Rover. The only one of those that got off the ground was the Range Rover and then although having waiting lists of several years BLMC did not provide any capital improvement funding to expand the production facilities.

Regarding the Land Rover marque, instead of having a County style vehicle in the 1970s (which was possible after the launch of the Range Rover) we had to wait for 15 years for it. As an interim measure we were provided with the dud Series 3 and it's abysmal IOE 6 cylinder* which allowed Toyota and Nissan who continued their improvement to take market leadership. (Remember that both Toyota Land Cruiser and Nissan Patrols were still leaf sprung and had 3 speed gear boxes at the outset of the Series 3 Land Rover.)

When you talk about reliability, in a recent UK survey the current D3, RR Sports and Freelander 2s have come in top for buyer satisfaction, a significant jump from being near the bottom with the D2 and Freelander 1.

Diana

* Why did the British Leyland U.K believe that Australia could only have the de-tuned 2.6 litre IOE 6 cyl, when the North American market got the Westlake headed 3 litre engine - a far superior engine in it's Land Rovers. :mad:

[cookiesa]

And in the US Hyundai have led the customer satisfaction states for something like the last ten years!

[Tote]

I think that the dealer network (or the lack of it) have a lot to answer for in regard to Land Rover's reputation of being unreliable. I'm now on my third Disco all bought new and all the issues that I have had have started off as small items or have been caused by the poorly trained service staff. Once out of warranty the vehicles have been more reliable simply because independent service facilities don't break stuff.
Regards,
Tote

[Tote]

And in the US Hyundai have led the customer satisfaction states for something like the last ten years!

That's because US built vehicles are worse than Hyundai.
Regards,
Tote

[dobbo]

Lucas electrics never did the Land Rover or any other car companies that used them any favours.

[Shonky]

I love Landies - don't get me wrong... but our farm truck is a GQ Patrol TD42 and I wouldn't have anything else.

It's torquey and powerful, as efficient as a 4.2L N/A Diesel can be (!) can tow anything and best of all, it is tough as nails and never dies (despite the rough life it leads)

>>>puts on flame suit...<<<
IMHO, no modern Landy can do all of those things as well as the Patrol can. I looked at Defenders but at the end of the day I just couldn't let heart rule over head so the Patrol was bought and has proved a worthy investment.

If LR put a bigger engine in the Defender and fixed up the rampant quality issues then I would buy one, but they haven't and don't seem to want to so until they wake up and smell the roses, I will continue to buy Patrols as everyday working vehicles.

Sorry. :(

[mcrover]

It all started when Toyota started bringing the Landcruiser in to compete against the Land Rover.:o

To increase sales they would hint and suggest at the unreliable nature of Land Rovers due to them being under powered etc where as in real terms they were not any more unreliable but they were underpowered in comparison to the Toyota.

This instilled a Toyota vs Landrover attitude in the country towns and Toyota also went about buying out or getting the owners of LR dealers in small country towns to convert over and LR in their infinate wisdom didnt even try to fight back.

The dealer in my home town of Mansfield was basically made to go bust due to Toyota providing huge discounts to farmers who traded in their Landies when I was a kid on a new cruiser and what farmer in their right mind would knock back a $2k trade in on a car that would have been (at the time) worth $1k at the most as well as then getting a newer styled, more powerful, faster and more comfortable vehical.

As far as reality goes, the Landrover is still probably one of the best engineered vehicals in the world (well most models anyway) and most have been nothing but reliable if looked after properly and thankfully they have nothing to do with the company that now brings us the Prius......:mad:

[Scallops]

I love Landies - don't get me wrong... but our farm truck is a GQ Patrol TD42 and I wouldn't have anything else.

It's torquey and powerful, as efficient as a 4.2L N/A Diesel can be (!) can tow anything and best of all, it is tough as nails and never dies (despite the rough life it leads)

>>>puts on flame suit...<<<
IMHO, no modern Landy can do all of those things as well as the Patrol can. I looked at Defenders but at the end of the day I just couldn't let heart rule over head so the Patrol was bought and has proved a worthy investment.

If LR put a bigger engine in the Defender and fixed up the rampant quality issues then I would buy one, but they haven't and don't seem to want to so until they wake up and smell the roses, I will continue to buy Patrols as everyday working vehicles.

Sorry. :(

A Patrol wagon has half the payload of my Defender - so I wouldn't be able to put all my gear for my trip in a Patrol - so it does "payload" better. ;)

[mcrover]

I love Landies - don't get me wrong... but our farm truck is a GQ Patrol TD42 and I wouldn't have anything else.

It's torquey and powerful, as efficient as a 4.2L N/A Diesel can be (!) can tow anything and best of all, it is tough as nails and never dies (despite the rough life it leads)

>>>puts on flame suit...<<<
IMHO, no modern Landy can do all of those things as well as the Patrol can. I looked at Defenders but at the end of the day I just couldn't let heart rule over head so the Patrol was bought and has proved a worthy investment.

If LR put a bigger engine in the Defender and fixed up the rampant quality issues then I would buy one, but they haven't and don't seem to want to so until they wake up and smell the roses, I will continue to buy Patrols as everyday working vehicles.

Sorry. :(

You dont have to be sorry, someone has to buy them :p

None of them are bad cars, hell Ive owned an 80 series an MQ Pootrol (for a very short while) and a Mitsub Trytoooooooon and other than the MQ (which had had a very ver hard life) have been great cars.

We had everything from Series Landies to a cruiser 40 series tray to Subaru's on the farm and all have been good, even the Isuzu KB40.

I dont think it is really worth bagging them out other than I will not buy a Toyota while they persist on building a car that cant work out weather it is electric or petrol powered :eek:

[Sleepy]

I’ve owned a few different fourbies:
· Subaru Brumby - soft? yes, but drove it up the telegraph track no problems (other than drowning in the Wenlock- but it dried out)
· BJ40 Cruiser - Gutless, Simple, Noisy, Simple, Gutless, Couldn't stop it.
· Lada Niva – Ok, we all make mistakes, fun car when it worked ;)
· Def 110 - Loved it, never let me down. And got me out of a couple of sticky situations!!

I still own 3 Landies - D90 my daily driver, Disco 1- wifes car, S2 ute - mid life crisis restoration project.

I like toyotas too- grew up in the back set of an FJ40 and have seen plenty of 60's, 70's and 80's that can "cut-the-mustard". The troopy is a good'n if that's what you want. They just don’t press my buttons.

Every car has its foibles. I just love my landies. No head involved, it's just a decision of the heart. Yeah they have "issues", yes not enough dealers; yes I don't want to get the electrickery wet; yes they give me the sh1ts….. sometimes. The thing for me is, every time I get behind the wheel I smile :D- and that's enough for me. :)

(P.S. Shonky, after that comment I'm sending up the paint - and you know what colour!!:p:p:p)

[Lotz-A-Landies]

It all started when Toyota started bringing the Landcruiser in to compete against the Land Rover.:o 1958 was a long time ago and Land Rover competed successfully against Toyota and Nissan right through the 1960s, the mjor selling points were the 4 speed gearbox and strength of the welded chassis.

How many people will admit that the riveted chassis of the Toyota's fell to bits on corrugated roads right up until they welded the chassis in the 1980's. How many Toyota people will admit that with the introduction of the 1Hz engines the Toyota transfer cases would blow the gear sets out the side of ther box?


To increase sales they would hint and suggest at the unreliable nature of Land Rovers due to them being under powered etc where as in real terms they were not any more unreliable but they were underpowered in comparison to the Toyota. ...
Very true, and Toyota still have an inferiority complex, what about when they subsidised the Snowy Mountains Scheme Museum at Adaminaby, the agreement with the Muesum was that the word or any images of Land Rover were not to be shown, lest Toyota remove their support.

Once again, Land Rover were putting a 3 litre engine in 109" Land Rovers in the US, yet in Australia they expected Land Rovers in Oz to compete with the Toyota copy of the Chev 6 cylinder with the Rover 2.6 engine.


....As far as reality goes, the Landrover is still probably one of the best engineered vehicals in the world (well most models anyway) and most have been nothing but reliable if looked after properly and thankfully they have nothing to do with the company that now brings us the Prius......:mad:
It always made me laugh, right through the 1970s and early 1980s the Toyota and Nissan crowd would rant about all the problems of coil spring Rover suspension. Yet when they respective marque introduced coil sprung vehicles, these same people would now comment how much better their coil spring system was over the Rover type. They dammned well should have been they had nearly 20 years to reverse engineer the Rover product. They however always used the Rover as the benchmark!

Diana

[Shonky]

(P.S. Shonky, after that comment I'm sending up the paint - and you know what colour!!:p:p:p)

:bat::censored:


Should I use it on the Patrol or the Landy?

Or I could paint my Fairmont pink - the GF would like that I'm sure... :angel:

[RonMcGr]

Land Rovers had a reputation of continuous improvement right until the end of the series 2a when the British Automotive Industry was nationalised by the Government as British Leyland under the leadership Lord Stokes (a Triumph man). At the time the Rover Co Ltd had a number of good projects in the design phase, like the Llama forward control, the Road Rover and Range Rover. The only one of those that got off the ground was the Range Rover and then although having waiting lists of several years BLMC did not provide any capital improvement funding to expand the production facilities.

Regarding the Land Rover marque, instead of having a County style vehicle in the 1970s (which was possible after the launch of the Range Rover) we had to wait for 15 years for it. As an interim measure we were provided with the dud Series 3 and it's abysmal IOE 6 cylinder* which allowed Toyota and Nissan who continued their improvement to take market leadership. (Remember that both Toyota Land Cruiser and Nissan Patrols were still leaf sprung and had 3 speed gear boxes at the outset of the Series 3 Land Rover.)

When you talk about reliability, in a recent UK survey the current D3, RR Sports and Freelander 2s have come in top for buyer satisfaction, a significant jump from being near the bottom with the D2 and Freelander 1.

Diana

* Why did the British Leyland U.K believe that Australia could only have the de-tuned 2.6 litre IOE 6 cyl, when the North American market got the Westlake headed 3 litre engine - a far superior engine in it's Land Rovers. :mad:

Diana,

I wonder if the P4 2.6lt IOE six that was stuck in the Land Rover was the same motor that was in the 2.6 Humber Super Snipe. It certainly looked the same :D

[Davo]

I've never come across anything like the sheer hate for Land-Rovers that exists in Australia. I had mine with me when I lived in Canada for several years and people absolutely loved them. That was because there wasn't anything even close to a Landie available over there.

Over here, it's weird how much abuse you can cop just for owning one - even if it's not broken down!

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Diana,

I wonder if the P4 2.6lt IOE six that was stuck in the Land Rover was the same motor that was in the 2.6 Humber Super Snipe. It certainly looked the same :D
Ron

Having never seen the engine on a Humber I couldn't say, what I do know is the 2.6 litre 6 cyl configuration was a de-tuned version of the standard specification of the 1950's Rover 90, 100, 105 and 110 in the P4 model cars. The original Land Rover 6 cyl (the ones used in SIIA and SIIB forward controls) share many parts in common with the P4 cars and the MkI 3 litre P5 . The MkI 3 litre P5 production ended in 1962 about the same time as the launch of the SIIA forward control and about a year before the 6 cylinder was launched as an option in the SIIA Forward Control export models (1963).

The 6 cyl engine arrived in the normal control Land Rover in 1967 was the 1950's specification 2.6 litre 66 Kw, at the same time the Yanks got was the 91Kw Westlake Headed version of the 2.6 engine for their Land Rovers.

Diana

[RonMcGr]

Ron

Having never seen the engine on a Humber I couldn't say, what I do know is the 2.6 litre 6 cyl configuration was a de-tuned version of the standard specification of the 1950's Rover 90, 100, 105 and 110 in the P4 model cars. The original Land Rover 6 cyl (the ones used in SIIA and SIIB forward controls) share many parts in common with the P4 cars and the MkI 3 litre P5 . The MkI 3 litre P5 production ended in 1962 about the same time as the launch of the SIIA forward control and about a year before the 6 cylinder was launched as an option in the SIIA Forward Control export models (1963).

The 6 cyl engine arrived in the normal control Land Rover in 1967 was the 1950's specification 2.6 litre, at the same time the Yanks got was the 99Kw Westlake Headed MkIII 3 litre P5 engine (launched in 1965) for their Land Rovers.

Diana

Diana,

I have not been able to find other info on the similarities.
IOE engines were used by Humber, Rover, Triumph and Coventy Climax, Jeep and Hudson, to name a few.

[mrapocalypse]

I really like a lot of Nissan and Toyota 4x4 products..... But I love land rovers.

And if you surf those other threads, most of the time the "Experts" have a Pajero parked in the driveway, and to them a dirt car park at the Nursery is an off road trip. Especially on Overlander!

A lot of the people pay out on Landys because they think it's funny, and because Land Rover people really Love their cars and are thin skinned and react. Which I see as a psoitive! No other make has that kind of passionate following.

You just cannot explain it to someone who doesn't own one!

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Diana,

I have not been able to find other info on the similarities.
IOE engines were used by Humber, Rover, Triumph and Coventy Climax, Jeep and Hudson, to name a few.

Wouldn't know much about any of those specifics, while checking the patents listed on a replica "Car Number" ID plate sold by a well known rubber supply company for the Series 1, I came across a 1932 patent for the Rover IOE arrangement. Whether they are the same or used under licence I do not know. (After all the original JEEP was a Bantam design and Bantam was a US subsidiary of Austin of Cambridge UK).

Diana

P.S. Just for your info the ID plates, mentioned above, list the Rover patent for the front wishbone suspension on the Rover P3 and P4 cars, so I doubt that they are supposed to be used on the Series 1 Land Rover. In fact I know they are different.

[MajorNeb]

I guess with not owning a lot of 4wd's in my time I have been quite sheltered from the LR bashing. I dearly love them though, this is my dad's fault for doing a SIIa hardtop up in the 70's and going bush for six months of the year. Oh what a life at 7! :D

I guess I always knew after that just what a 'real' 4wd was. A Land Rover! Certainly rescued everything else up in god's country back then!

Most people I mention the LR to these days either don't have a clue, start talking about their Tojo or are aghast at what I got her for anyway. :D

LLL (Long Live LandRover)

Nathanial

[Jamo]

IMO the reliability thing still exists due to poor/indifferent marketing by LR in Australia. Not just advertising, but the whole overt and covert approach that toyota are so good at.

[Blknight.aus]

Ive always been a beliver in the fact that while a shed on wheels class landrover doesnt do anything with exclence it does do everything and does it with good economy and its a doddle to repair if youre interested enough in it to learn how... (you now know part of the story that lead to me becoming a mechanic) The discos and the rangies share the same blood stock.

Ive been around landrovers for the better part of 25 years that I can remember and a lot that I cant never in all that time have I ever had one fail me so badly that it couldnt get me to safety or the next town including busting the #3 con rod in a series.

Ive had let downs on the nissan holden and toyota front and the only other vehicle Ive owned and been involved in that can lay the same claim is the jeep but since it technically spawned the rover I cant say Im surprised.

[cookiesa]

That's because US built vehicles are worse than Hyundai.
Regards,
Tote
Actually that is against ALL brands sold there including European and after 5 years of ownership, (not just 1 week after when the novelty hasn't yet worn off!)

My BJ40, which was built in the 70's had a welded chassis.

[one_iota]

Ive always been a beliver in the fact that while a shed on wheels class landrover doesnt do anything with exclence it does do everything and does it with good economy and its a doddle to repair if youre interested enough in it to learn how... (you now know part of the story that lead to me becoming a mechanic) The discos and the rangies share the same blood stock.


And to that I say "hear hear".:)

How many vehicle owners manage to open the bonnet to see what's happening or have crawled underneath to see what is connected to what.

Owning the disco has taught me a lot. Whilst I don't have the skill to delve too deeply it gives me the confidence to challenge the workshop that tells me otherwise. It also makes me feel sorry for the pradocruiserpatrol owners who rely on an umbilical chord connected to the dealer when the inevitable goes wrong.

I take responsibility for my choices and have no one else to blame...a bit like being an adult.

[Discopug]

I,ve only had my D2 TD5 for 18 months now and covered about 70k. It has been an expensive exercise with service catch ups and a few repairs and now a head gasket.
BUT! I can't think of another vehicle that will suit my needs better, and best of all I love driving it. It gves me a smile every time I drive it, and fortunately its nearly always out in the bush.
This is my first fourby but I learn't to drive in a S11a in the vic mountains.
I have always liked the landrovers and the Disco is the one I like the most.
I cop **** about owning a landy every where I go, but you get that when people are jealous of what you have.

[UncleHo]

G'day Folks :)

This is an interesting read, and here are a few little items that may help to keep the interest up. It is true that the Snowy Mountains Scheme used Landrovers in the formative years, then Toyota became the vehicle of choice, let's have a look at who were the major Contractors for the Snowy Construction, Thiess Bros. why, they had the most heavy equipment in private hands in Australia immediatly post WW11, (salvaged from the Pacific Islands, where it was abandoned by the US Forces at the end of the war), all other Ex-Military Quipt. left in Aust was property of the Commonwealth,(hence C.H.E.P) in the early 50's Cecil Theiss tested a new Toyota 4 Wheel Drive Utility in Aust that was being campained around Aust by the Japanese, he was impressed, and asked who was the Distributor for them?? when told that nobody had applied to be come the Distributor, Theiss Bros took on the Distributorship of Commercials, as Thiess Toyota, being the major contractor for Snowy Mountains, then started using Toyotas,part of the Distributorship agreement was that for every complete vehicle imported, 2 vehicles in parts had to be imported, so this started the "Sales & Service" marketing push which was copied by Nissan & Mitsubishi in this country, Rover/BMC and later Leyland was not able to produce vehicles suitable to the Australian Market,as the British regulations of the era for Commercial Vehicles still had the 30MPH max speed regulation, and all british vehicles were registered (taxed) by the horsepower, and developed horsepower, so most if not all British built cars,trucks and commercials were grossly underpowered for/by Australian Conditions:( The then management, also still under the control of UK management, were labouring under the misguided belief that "When you have made your decision to buy a Rover/BMC Vehicle, you would then come to a showroom and ask them to sell it to you" :(

The rest as the say, "Is History"

cheers

[one_iota]

I am employed by Thiess and Leslie's name is still revered. The stock company 4wd is a Toyota. But yet in WA Thiess also have Land Rover as a fleet vehicle.

[RonMcGr]

G'day Folks :)

This is an interesting read, and here are a few little items that may help to keep the interest up. It is true that the Snowy Mountains Scheme used Landrovers in the formative years, then Toyota became the vehicle of choice, let's have a look at who were the major Contractors for the Snowy Construction, Thiess Bros. why, they had the most heavy equipment in private hands in Australia immediatly post WW11, (salvaged from the Pacific Islands, where it was abandoned by the US Forces at the end of the war), all other Ex-Military Quipt. left in Aust was property of the Commonwealth,(hence C.H.E.P) in the early 50's Cecil Theiss tested a new Toyota 4 Wheel Drive Utility in Aust that was being campained around Aust by the Japanese, he was impressed, and asked who was the Distributor for them?? when told that nobody had applied to be come the Distributor, Theiss Bros took on the Distributorship of Commercials, as Thiess Toyota, being the major contractor for Snowy Mountains, then started using Toyotas,part of the Distributorship agreement was that for every complete vehicle imported, 2 vehicles in parts had to be imported, so this started the "Sales & Service" marketing push which was copied by Nissan & Mitsubishi in this country, Rover/BMC and later Leyland was not able to produce vehicles suitable to the Australian Market,as the British regulations of the era for Commercial Vehicles still had the 30MPH max speed regulation, and all british vehicles were registered (taxed) by the horsepower, and developed horsepower, so most if not all British built cars,trucks and commercials were grossly underpowered for/by Australian Conditions:( The then management, also still under the control of UK management, were labouring under the misguided belief that "When you have made your decision to buy a Rover/BMC Vehicle, you would then come to a showroom and ask them to sell it to you" :(

The rest as the say, "Is History"

cheers

Very true!
Land Rovers were very instrumental in the area where I grew up in South Australia, in 1950.
No roads, just mallee scrub.

[noddy]

Couple of things.

Every day LRA are losing sales due to the 'perception' of reliability issues. Regardless of whether the D3/RRS are more reliable than previous models.

The perception of poor reliability preceded the contraction in the dealer network a few years back, but it has simply added to the image of 'fragility'.

I believe a well maintained Landy, driven compassionately will be as reliable as your Troopy or Patrol. But if you had a Landy, Troopy and Patrol and were not allowed to maintain any of them, I know which will be the last one running. It will not be the Landy.

The reason for this fragility is that Land Rover stopped listening to the Australian customer many years ago. The last time was when they put the 4BD1 into the County and they produced probably the best 4x4 still running around. IMHO the fact the new Defender has a 2.4 'hand me down' is an insult when LR had the TDV6 or TDV8. Toyota and Nissan Australia are renown for causing Head Office a misery when it comes to their preferred specs for the Cruisers and Patrols.

[ak]

Couple of things.

Every day LRA are losing sales due to the 'perception' of reliability issues. Regardless of whether the D3/RRS are more reliable than previous models.

The perception of poor reliability preceded the contraction in the dealer network a few years back, but it has simply added to the image of 'fragility'.

I believe a well maintained Landy, driven compassionately will be as reliable as your Troopy or Patrol. But if you had a Landy, Troopy and Patrol and were not allowed to maintain any of them, I know which will be the last one running. It will not be the Landy.

The reason for this fragility is that Land Rover stopped listening to the Australian customer many years ago. The last time was when they put the 4BD1 into the County and they produced probably the best 4x4 still running around. IMHO the fact the new Defender has a 2.4 'hand me down' is an insult when LR had the TDV6 or TDV8. Toyota and Nissan Australia are renown for causing Head Office a misery when it comes to their preferred specs for the Cruisers and Patrols.


This is a pretty fair post. I like to call a spade a spade and not look at things through rose coloured glasses, and I think Noddy you have sumed up LR reliability pretty well here.

[4wd4fun]

Have you also noticed how Toyota owners say how reliable there vehicles are in one sentence and then go on to Imply that when you do brake down in a toyota you can get parts every where. One could believe that they are not as reliable as thought and that you can just keep fixing them no mater were you are as toyota has parts every where to keep them going and say you went to the cap and bavk but not mention the parts purchased to keep going.
I have had three land rovers my father five and all have been reliable.:D

[scarry]

same as tote

i have had 3 discos all bought new,the first 2 as soon as i got them away from the dealers all the problems dissapearer.:):)
not good for landy image or reputation:mad::mad:

the 3rd one only went to dealer for warranty repairs.i also took out an extended warranty on this one through landrover for another 3 years.lra do this through autosure.
i have an oil leak at the moment & autosure at my request will allow the repair to be done by my nominated landrover specialist (not the dealer):):):):):):):):):):)

cheers paul

[scarry]

for got something .to get more dealers lr need more sales particularly in the bush.u cant have dealers siting around with nothing to do

i know we are going around in circles....to get more sales we need more dealers....to get more dealers we need more sales...but something needs to be done

part dealers with another manufacturer may be a good start,there are some of these at the moment

as i said in the lr engineer wants info thread,this problem should have been addressed 25 yrs or so ago

we dont need lra to have all the market just a larger portion than it currently has......they do have a dam good product

cheers paul