Choice of 4WD for Melbourne to London Trip

[waynep]

Jon Faine from ABC radio Melbourne is doing an overland trip to London
Interesting read on the choice of vehicle.

MelbourneToLondon.com Archive Our Car (http://melbournetolondon.com/2008/06/10/our-car/)

[5teve]

to quote...

Fuel capacity [2 x 90 litre tanks fitted as standard] and fuel economy were a major factor. I was surprised at how thirsty some of the competition was. Land Rovers in particular dropped out of contention here. The Land Rover was my sentimental favourite when I started looking - I had visions of ‘Born Free’ with Elsa the Lioness in Africa. But sadly they are now either too soft for this trip [Discovery and Rangie] or too harsh and uncomfortable [Defender]. All are too thirsty and lack power. The tank capacity is less than half the Prado and thus its range is less than half !

errm? something i missed? last time i looked the disco deefer deisels were about the most economical you could get? he must of been reading on the toymotor forums a little too much!

oh well i wish him luck.. especially with prado spares in remote locations..

Thanks

Steve

[pommie]

to quote...

Fuel capacity [2 x 90 litre tanks fitted as standard] and fuel economy were a major factor. I was surprised at how thirsty some of the competition was. Land Rovers in particular dropped out of contention here. The Land Rover was my sentimental favourite when I started looking - I had visions of ‘Born Free’ with Elsa the Lioness in Africa. But sadly they are now either too soft for this trip [Discovery and Rangie] or too harsh and uncomfortable [Defender]. All are too thirsty and lack power. The tank capacity is less than half the Prado and thus its range is less than half !

errm? something i missed? last time i looked the disco deefer deisels were about the most economical you could get? he must of been reading on the toymotor forums a little too much!

oh well i wish him luck.. especially with prado spares in remote locations..

Thanks

Steve

I am planning a Melbourne to UK trip too, although through the Trans-Siberian highway rather than through Asia. ( http://www.wrongwaydown.info (http://www.wrongwaydown.info) )

A major criteria on such a trip has to be how easy it is for a "local" basic mechanic to fix up in remote locations... you need a "basic" vechicle. So a diesel engine is important, plus no computer, reliable engine, and "simple" and obvious mechanicals, "fixable" electrics, plus easily fixed boltable body work, easily extendable accessory mounts. IMHO the choice is obvious - TDI Defender.

On the fuel economy - a 2007 Prado does 9.3l per 100km, and in a recent economy drive I was on - Tdi defenders were around 10.x litres per 100km. So the choice is really quite marginal.

OK - so a Prado is more comfy ! Nice.

On an amusing note - :D my mate (first hand contact not a friend of a friend!!) had a recent Prado, and blew up his petrol engine when water was ingested into it, via a large hole in the front wheel arch. The "hole" was factory fitted when they installed the "factory" Toyota bull bar. He went through hell with Toyota - but eventually his insurer wrote it off - despite it being only a couple of years old. Oh did I mention - this wasn't a river crossing - it was driving through a large puddle in Elwood - suburban Melbourne ! Oh what a feeling !!! :eek:

[stevo68]

Errrm did I miss something as well. The Prado he has bought was already reasonably modified, so compared to my current stock D2, it would look a little on the "soft" side. Put a stock Prado against my D2, different kettle of fish as would be a modified D2 against a modded Prado. Overall would seem quite clear that he doesn;t know much about 4WD's in general. Also my D2 is currently doing about 9.6L/100kms....nuffin to be sneezed at :),

Regards

Stevo

[Xavie]

I thought the 05 prado engine was quite heavy on the electrical side of things? I have heard of many of them dying for some pretty half hearted reasons. I wouldn't want one of those breaking down in the middle of some of the said countries.

Xav

[Xtreme]

Jon has obviously, as many people do, got fuel consumption confused with fuel range.

Roger

[spudboy]

I don't know much about Toyotas but I thought the Prado was the soft-roader option to the tougher proper Landcruiser and the 75 series.

Don't know a lot about travelling in Asia, as my experiance has been Africa and Middle East, but in both of those areas Landcruisers are pretty popular, so if Asia is the same he will be able to get it fixed along the way.

Excellent trip though.

[isuzurover]

I think his logic is seriously flawed. In most 3rd world countries they fix things with a hammer and screwdriver. EFI diesels are almost nonexistent. Is he going to fly in a toyota mechanic with the right software from another country???

While driving through Central America, we lost count of the number of ISUZU 4BD1 powered (GMC) trucks we saw. We could probably have bought an engine for $200USD - and had it fitted for less!!!

As far as I am concerned, the choice couldn't be simpler... no electrics, bulletproof, etc, etc...

[pommie]

I think his logic is seriously flawed. In most 3rd world countries they fix things with a hammer and screwdriver. EFI diesels are almost nonexistent. Is he going to fly in a toyota mechanic with the right software from another country???

While driving through Central America, we lost count of the number of ISUZU 4BD1 powered (GMC) trucks we saw. We could probably have bought an engine for $200USD - and had it fitted for less!!!

As far as I am concerned, the choice couldn't be simpler... no electrics, bulletproof, etc, etc...

Here here. On a recent trip through Tanzania (ok so it's not Asia) - we saw dozens of roadside mechanics - each one of them with a Land Rover series or Defender of some kind in various stage of deconstruction/reconstruction. No diagnostic computers all all - but plenty of basic tools (a lot of hammers!), some basic "shop" machinery and some very strong basic 3rd world practical know how. Body work was repaired by hand, mechanics electrics too. This is also why Defenders and Troopies are also the basic Safari vehicles - they are simple to fix.

Try bashing the insides of a Prado by hand - see how far you get.

[simonl8353]

Here here. On a recent trip through Tanzania (ok so it's not Asia) - we saw dozens of roadside mechanics - each one of them with a Land Rover series or Defender of some kind in various stage of deconstruction/reconstruction. No diagnostic computers all all - but plenty of basic tools (a lot of hammers!), some basic "shop" machinery and some very strong basic 3rd world practical know how. Body work was repaired by hand, mechanics electrics too. This is also why Defenders and Troopies are also the basic Safari vehicles - they are simple to fix.

Try bashing the insides of a Prado by hand - see how far you get.

DOZENS of mechanics, each with a landrover, geeee hope that comment doesnt find its way to the Landcruiser web sites. :p It reads like all the Landys fail while not a broken Prado anywhere...hmmmm could it be the Prado is the most reliable car ever!!! ;):wasntme: :oops2: only kidding, I know what you mean.

Ok fun over, I totally agree with the comments that a Prado is a strange choice, a deisel Defender or 75 series Landcruiser would be more appropriate.

[EchiDna]

you guys have left out a critical factor - the high likelyhood of poor fuel quality and modern common rail deisels...

I hope he knows how to work quickly on the side of a road in your choice of minus 30 degrees, plus 50 degrees, with a lion/cheetah/hippo/crocodile/sasquatch/insurgent army/bandits/robbers/irate border patrol paying him a visit :)

[loanrangie]

Here here. On a recent trip through Tanzania (ok so it's not Asia) - we saw dozens of roadside mechanics - each one of them with a Land Rover series or Defender of some kind in various stage of deconstruction/reconstruction. No diagnostic computers all all - but plenty of basic tools (a lot of hammers!), some basic "shop" machinery and some very strong basic 3rd world practical know how. Body work was repaired by hand, mechanics electrics too. This is also why Defenders and Troopies are also the basic Safari vehicles - they are simple to fix.

Try bashing the insides of a Prado by hand - see how far you get.

When i was in Kenya/ Tanzania i was amazed at the amount of shells on the side of the road that had been picked clean like a vulture on a buffalo carcass, and the mechanics are amazingly resourceful, they wer making suspension bushes out of old tyres ! In the Transkei in Sth Africa i saw numerous holden hq and valiant wrecks in paddocks picked clean with only a set of tyre marks on the bitumen showing where it came from.
We went to Ngoro goro crater in Tanzania in a V8 110 defender and the driver hammered it no matter what the road conditions, i felt sorry for the other guys in the FJ landlooser and series 3 wagon on leaf springs over those rough roads.

[pommie]

I think his logic is seriously flawed. In most 3rd world countries they fix things with a hammer and screwdriver. EFI diesels are almost nonexistent. Is he going to fly in a toyota mechanic with the right software from another country???

While driving through Central America, we lost count of the number of ISUZU 4BD1 powered (GMC) trucks we saw. We could probably have bought an engine for $200USD - and had it fitted for less!!!

As far as I am concerned, the choice couldn't be simpler... no electrics, bulletproof, etc, etc...

According to the latest update on his site ... the Prado crusie control died an hour out of Melbourne (http://melbournetolondon.com/2008/07/01/things-do-not-always-go-to-plan/) with an "whiff of electrical smell".

[isuzurover]

According to the latest update on his site ... the Prado crusie control died an hour out of Melbourne (http://melbournetolondon.com/2008/07/01/things-do-not-always-go-to-plan/) with an "whiff of electrical smell".


:D:D:D:D:D:D:D While I don't like to laugh at the misfortune of others... I just can't help it in this case.

I wonder when the central locking will pack it in... (and I can't understand why that was such an essential item - how hard is it to make sure the doors are locked!)

[Yorkshire_Jon]

Got to laugh at the discussions here. The Land Rover / Toyota debate will never be solved - everyone has there own opinions... and here's mine!

Having driven many TDi's and TD5's all over Europe and Africa Id take a TD5 Defender - every time. I would also add that Id take a vehicle that Id lived with for a significant time before departure and had worked on myself. That way you know history, quality of workmanship and parts used.

Id also make sure that I had the laptop with me (would have that anyway), plus ECU diagnostics (Nanocom is very cheap and very good). My spares would include (over and above standard landrover "mechanical" bits, a used ecu already programmed and imobiliser disabled (again, cheap); a MAFF and crank sensor. All are small and easy to store away.

In reality though, its far more likely for the mechanical stuff (UJs, wheel bearings, oil seals) to fail - at which point the benefit of a Tdi is what???

[camel_landy]

My 2p worth...

Fuel & Range - Yep I'd agree that it's important to make sure you've got a vehicle capable of running on potentially poor grades of fuel. You also have to make sure you have enough capacity to get between fuel stops (with plenty of reserve capacity).

Toyo vs LR - To be honest, a lot of it comes down to what you know and are comfortable with. If you have a problem en-route, having a vehicle you're familiar with and are comfortable spannering will make a huge difference.

Modifications... Don't! A standard vehicle is easier to fix than a 'modified' one as parts will be easier to get hold of. Especially when the smelly stuff starts flying and you have to reach for the sat-phone, parts book and wait for DHL!

HTH

M

[Grimace]

prado is the best by far, all other 4wds are carp!
They are goin to have the best trip ever, albeit without cruise control :D

[martinozcmax]

What makes you say all other four wheel drives are fish ?

[Pedro_The_Swift]

prado is the best by far, all other 4wds are carp!
They are goin to have the best trip ever, albeit without cruise control :D


What makes you say all other four wheel drives are fish ?



:Rolling::Rolling:

[PhilipA]

What a lot of wusses.
I caught a brief glimpse on Channel 2 or SBS last night about a couple from OZ who drove a mid 80's Pajero from Vladivostok to Moscow and beyond.
No cruise control, central locking, or electronics there.
Regards Philip A

[Pedro_The_Swift]

nothing but happy endings in Mitsubshi Ads,,,,,
:p

[PhilipA]

You are correct, I now recall it was an ad.
I thought afterwards that at last some of the Japanese are starting to harness the power of the owner body. There are lots of old Pajeros out there doing good things
Land Rover has been living off past glories for decades.
I wouldn't like to try to take a RR3 or Disco 3 or Defender through there, or even a current Pajero.
As much as I hate to admit it , I think of all current cars a LC 4.5 diesel 78 or whatever the trucky ones are called would be the go. The miners are pretty astute when it comes to reliability.
Regards Philip A

[PAT303]

since when are LC reliable?.I've been working on them for 5 years and they only go because they are constantly getting parts thrown at them.They are worked on straight from Toyota,before they even go to work.The new model V8 are having injector pump and injector problems and are very heavy on fuel.No limp mode,any drama's and no go.They have a 4'' difference in front to rear track so the rear doesn't follow the front in ruts.Tdi thanks. Pat

[Rangier Rover]

since when are LC reliable?.I've been working on them for 5 years and they only go because they are constantly getting parts thrown at them.They are worked on straight from Toyota,before they even go to work.The new model V8 are having injector pump and injector problems and are very heavy on fuel.No limp mode,any drama's and no go.They have a 4'' difference in front to rear track so the rear doesn't follow the front in ruts.Tdi thanks. Pat
Yep all so true:eek: Also hear complaints on the lighter chassis and weak front diff.:o They do go hard though:D For a wile.;)