Help choosing a tyre please

[knp]

Gedday,

I know this is another tyre question but have spent ages going through as many posts as I can find and have come up with the following short list of tyres.

Have decided on 245/70R16 as this is a more common size and is available in LT construction and a lot of AULRO folk seem to be running this size in preference to the narrower 225/75R16.

I would very much appreciate some advice on which of the three below would be the most suitable for 90% town car and 10% family touring (loaded to the gunwales and towing the tardis). Something that is quiet, fuel efficient and hard wearing but that has a decent tread pattern with enough bite to handle the occasional mud. Most of our driving/camping is in the bush, not much beach work at all and zero hard core stuff.

So in order of preference (so far):
1. Pirelli Scorpion ATR - seems to be well recommended by others on this site. Best price so far is $1200 for 5 fitted, balanced and aligned.
2. Bridgestone D694 again seems a great choice. Best price is $1170 for 5, fitted, balanced and aligned. (Apparently on special during Sep).
3. BFG AT - Are these as quite or quieter than the others? The tread pattern seems to me to be an older perhaps more noisy style? Best price $1324 for 5, fitted, balanced and aligned.

I have looked at and discounted the following:
Cooper ATR - not available in required size
Goodyear Silent Armor - too expensive and more or less unkown to date.
Yokohama G012 - wears out too quick? Nice and cheap tho.
Maxxis 751 - nice and cheap and has good following but has more rounded shoulders and probably less puncture resistant.
GG AT - not interested in these.

So whadddaya reckon please?

Cheers and thanks
Peter

[V8Landy]

Have heard good reports on the scorpions(but have never used them)
BFG at 245/75r16 have been on mine sense i bought it 2.5yrs ago and are wearing well i find them good in wet and dry(On road)But have heard others bag them in the wet.Off road i find them good in the dry but lacking in the slippery stuff.
I will probably try scorpions next but still a long way off needing to change tyres.

[scarry]

1....seen good reports,but dont know anyone who has had them

2....wouldnt touch them...to many bad reports,have heard others say tread depth less than most

3...my choice....what i run now in 245....no puncturers,quiet,seem pretty robust,lots of grip,done 70k,still got around 20k to go at a guess,would get them again

hope this helps

[long stroke]

I've heard many good reports on the silverstone all-terains and they are very cheap i'll try find a link later.

CHEERS TIM.

[simonl8353]

Dont know why you knocked off the GG -AT's I got some GG-AT2's a few months back and would definately buy them again.
Very good on all surfaces, look a lot like the BFG's

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/691007-post25.html

[2 rocks]

So in order of preference (so far):
1. Pirelli Scorpion ATR - seems to be well recommended by others on this site. Best price so far is $1200 for 5 fitted, balanced and aligned. Yes, bought some for my Wrangler based on a test in 4WD Action mag that gave them the thumbs up. Great on the road and very quiet. Did a little sand work and they seemed fine, but I feel it is quite a highway biased tread pattern and could probably use squarer shoulders in the mucky stuff. Can't tell you much more as the Jeep got turned into a rock crawler on Pro Comps.
2. Bridgestone D694 again seems a great choice. Best price is $1170 for 5, fitted, balanced and aligned. (Apparently on special during Sep).Personally I prefer the pattern on the D693 as being less road oriented. Had a D1 and 2 Pajeros with them and I thought they were a nice compromise. Think you have to ask for the D693's now though? I found they wore well, were quiet, capable as an all terrain and good on the tar in wet weather. I would have them again.
3. BFG AT - Are these as quite or quieter than the others? The tread pattern seems to me to be an older perhaps more noisy style? Best price $1324 for 5, fitted, balanced and aligned.Don't know...but know what you mean.

I have looked at and discounted the following:
Cooper ATR - not available in required sizeMy D2 came with ATR's but again thought it was a highway tread pattern. I think the ST is a good compromise but I was going to a 31"


Peter
That seems a pretty good price for the Scorpions - I think I paid about that back in Feb for mine.
Happy hunting!
Cheers
Mike

[Treads]

I have a set of almost new 694LT's in 245/70R16 for sale. They had under 10,000 km use before I got my new M/T's. Still in brilliant condition, $600 for all 4.

PM me if you're interested :)

edit: just checked and they still have 9-10mm of tread left on them, are evenly worn and have never had a puncture
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/wheels-tyres-suspension/63601-sale-4x-bridgestone-694lt-245-70r16s.html

[knp]

Dont know why you knocked off the GG -AT's I got some GG-AT2's a few months back and would definately buy them again.
Very good on all surfaces, look a lot like the BFG's

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/691007-post25.html

Just not sure about the GG's. There are so many choices out there just narrowing it down to a few was hard enough.
I can get any of these three at the same place so it's also a matter of convenience. Just have to decide which one to get...

SWMBO has now said the BFG's look too rough so maybe now it'll be the scorpions.

[Yorkie]

knp,
i am running the bridgestones in that size and find them to be quite on road, useful offroad on rock and slop with good wear.
cheers
yorkie

[Blknight.aus]

the BFG ATs arent too bad, if youd like to come for a run in a deefer with them.

Im pretty sure I can get those tires at a better price than what youve been quoted (bfgAT)

and If you like (pm me) I can call up my tyre guy and get prices for you.

[barjop]

Mate 1 with Td5 defender locked front and rear has scorpions very happy with as a touring tyre but goes no where in the mud & clay, he is getting BFG AT's for his next tyre.

Mate 2 with classic rangie runs maxxis great tyre always impresses just how far it gets, got his 1st puncture through tread the other day but not LT tyre.

Mate 3 in pootrol just got rid of Yoko's as you said just wear to quickly and no good in slippery clay bought BFG AT's says he's very happy.

Me D1 with BFG's always impress the others how well they go and now with Trutrac even better. Only thing that kills me is 235/70/16 not enough clearnce under the axels, and with all these 33's and 35's digging up the tracks I really have to work to clear the centre hump.

You have a Td5 not as noisey as Tdi but still rattley so road noise shouldn't bother, although mate 4 D1 Tdi who had BFG's went back to Michies road tyre and was surprised at the handling difference.

It all depends on what your usage is going to be.
Note BFG (dicks) don't bring 245/75/16's AT's into the country anymore which was going to be my upgrade tyre, not sure about your tyre size. So now I will have a dilema with my next tyre.
Also currently at my work place we have a saftey warning on Cooper tyres Can't remember if AT or ATR whereby the side walls are splitting parrallel to the bead.

Hmmm didn't know I had so many mates will have to check that again.

regards
Barjop
98 Tdi Auto
Ridepro 2" lift
Rear Trutrac

[strangy]

I have just put the LT245/70r16 ATR Scorpions on the D2

So far they are great.
Better than the BFG......so far, (road, gravel and sand) Central oz country.
In that they are quieter on road and more positive on and off road.

I tried something new, because you never know without giving it a shot. Pirelli know rubber across all areas of industry and tyres across all types of motor sports etc, so figure they cannot be worse than any other quality tyre maker.

I dont think mud is something any ATR excels in so I have chains for those trips where I may encounter some serious issues.

But really, so long as your happy, who cares??:)

[knp]

<-kersnip->
You have a Td5 not as noisey as Tdi but still rattley so road noise shouldn't bother, although mate 4 D1 Tdi who had BFG's went back to Michies road tyre and was surprised at the handling difference.
We currently have the spare (a Cooper ATR 235/70R16) on the near side rear and it is noticeably more noisy in the wet than the nearly dead XPC's.
<-kersnip->
It all depends on what your usage is going to be.
Note BFG (dicks) don't bring 245/75/16's AT's into the country anymore which was going to be my upgrade tyre, not sure about your tyre size. So now I will have a dilema with my next tyre.
The BFG AT is still available in 245/70R16 (was in stock at Jax down the road today) but now I wonder for how long?
<-kersnip->
Rear Trutrac
What is Trutrac please?


Cheers
Peter [currently searching for truetrac]

[barjop]

Peter,
a trutrac is a stronger version of a LSD, it is made by detroit/eaton but rather than friction plates it uses helical gears to force drive from the spining wheel to the wheel on the other side of the vehicle that is not slipping. It is stronger than your standard diff, cheaper than a manual locker and more flexible than a detroit or Lokka style diff lock.
If you follow these links you will see a picture and some more info.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/introductions/63460-true-trac-info.html
Truetrac helical gear limited slip differential (http://www.locked-drive.com.au/tt.php)

Their are a couple of distributors on Aus but it's pretty dear to buy one here. There have been a couple of bulk orders organised by other members from this forum on a couple of occasions in the last 6 months. But it was inconvienient for me so I made some private enquiries to the US as mentioned in one of the links above and got one sent over from US.
Due to dollar falling not as beneficial at the moment but still a lot cheaper than buying in Aus.


Hope this helps
Regards
Barjop
98 Tdi Auto
2" Ridepro lift
Rear trutrac

[knp]

Peter,
a trutrac is a stronger version of a LSD, it is made by detroit/eaton but rather than friction plates it uses helical gears to force drive from the spining wheel to the wheel on the other side of the vehicle that is not slipping. It is stronger than your standard diff, cheaper than a manual locker and more flexible than a detroit or Lokka style diff lock.
If you follow these links you will see a picture and some more info.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/introductions/63460-true-trac-info.html
Truetrac helical gear limited slip differential (http://www.locked-drive.com.au/tt.php)

Their are a couple of distributors on Aus but it's pretty dear to buy one here. There have been a couple of bulk orders organised by other members from this forum on a couple of occasions in the last 6 months. But it was inconvienient for me so I made some private enquiries to the US as mentioned in one of the links above and got one sent over from US.
Due to dollar falling not as beneficial at the moment but still a lot cheaper than buying in Aus.


Hope this helps
Regards
Barjop
98 Tdi Auto
2" Ridepro lift
Rear trutrac

That's simply an amazing piece of gear. I'd buy one just to pull it apart and see how it works :D Thanks for the info.

[DiscoStew]

I have the Pirelli scorpions and love them on-road. We used them on the trip to Darwin and back as well as daily driving for just over 12 months and I never felt they were an issue. I have only been off-road once (about 4 weeks ago) and I felt that once they filled up with clay/mud they never really cleared but it may have just been newbie nervs. I am planning on getting something more aggressive for off-roading.

[Slunnie]

I'm running the Pirelli ATR and can not speak highly enough of them. They have traction traction traction.

My ones are in 285/75-16 so may vary slightly to the 245/70-16 in some areas.

On the road, these tyres are almost as good as silent... I'm talking like wind down the window, stick your head out and listen to everything but the tyres. Something that strikes me while standing on the side of the road is the amount of noise that tyres make, even on road cars etc - they are about the noisest part of the car these days. The ATR is inaudible.

The traction is excellent in the dry and in the wet. Even when the tyres are new and skinned, they still have grip, which is in stark contrast to other tyres. The compound is silica based, something which not many other tyres are... the only other ones that come to mind are the Goodyear MTR and possibly the Silent Armour. This gives a nice soft rubber traction, but without the soft rubber wear rates that you would get with carbon black tyres. They are also well sipped for wet traction. Spin them up on rock and it's a different story though and they wear quickly. The carcass seems to be quite solid with a heavy load rating on them and this provides good lateral stability within the carcass, even at lower pressures.

The tread pattern in the marketting material appears to be quite mild, though in the flesh they are more aggressive than you may expect. The grooves are reasonably deep and wide, though the design of them allows the air to move through them quietly. I suspect they have designed the outer tread blocks for drive in soft terrain and the centre lugs to give lateral stability, though in practise I dont think that they will be much chop in greasy mud like clay etc. They just wont clear, much like any other all terrain. On dry surfaces though they provide a lot of traction, be it rock, dirt even down to damp sandstone clay which pushes the tyre a fair bit and ultimately clogs it. Definately on rock and dry dirt they provide better traction than muds in my opinion and are really impressive to drive on, not so in wet offroad conditions.

To be honest, I bought these as road tyres as they were as HT like as anything in this size came - and were not connected to Cooper Tyres. It just so happened that they really surprised me offroad. This said, they are not my touring or play tyres.

This is a comparison of a Pirelli AT which a lot of people talk about (left) and a Pirelli ATR (right)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2008/09/439.jpg

And my finger as an indicator of tread groove size.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/01/963.jpg

[ozscott]

Nice write up Slunnie.

I have Pirelli 265/70/16s on my D2 (the ATs on the left of your photo) and they are nice tyres - no suspension lift and no rubbing. They add usable heights under the diffs which for me beach driving is handy. I have the same tyre in 245/70/16s on my D1 but in the 245 size they come in a light truck configuration. In the 265 they dont. Interestingly the 245s are lasting longer and when towing my 2 tonn boat the D1 does not squirm as much on the road which may come from lower sidewall height but my bet is that its the stiffer LT sidewalls that are responsible for the better towing ride - and I have tried both sets at all different and extreme pressures!

I am glad to hear that the new ATR is better than it looks on their website. On their site it looks far more h'way oriented than the AT, but your pic shows a tyre that really looks every bit as good tread wise as the AT. A mate of mine just replaced his on his D2 with General Grabbers AT2 in the 265/70/16 and got those rather than the ATs because the fitter said the ATs were no longer available and the ATR was the only one...dealer didnt have them on the rack and from the web site they didnt look as off road as the AT so he went with the aggressive looking GG which my brother sells and is a pretty good tyre also.

I havent driven his truck yet, but am keen to see what they are like because my Scorps 265 have only another 20k in them...total then of about 60k which isnt bad but is well less than the original XPCs which were very good for their size. I will probably go the ATR now.

Cheers

[ozscott]

Slunnie - is the AT on the left smaller size than the ATR on the right...if so that would effect how the groove size compares and make the AT's look about the same or smaller than the ATR groove size.

Cheers

PS. Looks like you still cannot get the 265/70/16 in the ATR in light truck - 112T as opposed to the 113T in the 245 - ie the 245 is smaller but in the LT can carry more weight. Pity.

[Slunnie]

Gday Ozscott,

They come in 265/75-16 though which will fit the D2 if it has a bull bar, and in that size they are in LT construction and have a load rating of 123 which is a bit over 1500kg each I think. If it were me, that would be the tyre I'd be looking at if going oversize. I'm really happy with them so far, although admittedly I do a lot of highway driving. BTW, although they make them, they don't necessarily import them in all sizes, and if they dont then I can give you a contact from the US who will send them over in 5 working days at your door (pending customs as usual). This is a very common sizing.

With the tyre pics, you are absolutely correct. The AT is a 245/75-16 and the ATR is a 285/75-16. I'm not sure how they do their tread designs between skinnies and fats. I notice that Goodyear MTRs have a different pattern (a lot tighter) between the two, though I'm not sure if Pirelli do the same.

[ozscott]

Thanks Slunnie matey. I appreciate that offer. I am keen to go and have a look at some in the flesh. The only problem I have with going 265/75 is that makes it a much bigger tyre in OD. While they would be magic off road, I tow a heavy boat and starting off with the manual on steep hills in high range is about at the comfortable limit now...I reckon I would have to look at lower diff ratios if I went to a 265/75. I also do a lot of town driving and the 31's knocked acceleration a little bit but going to about 33 (at a guess) would bugger me a bit in town.

Thanks again mate.

[knp]

Dear All,

Got the new tyres yesterday. 245/70R16 Pirelli Scoprion ATR's in LT construction and I have to say that they are a lot quieter than both the Cooper ATR and Michelin XPC. In fact the whole car seems to ride a lot better.

Anyway re the turning circle and with the shortened lock stops in there is also no scrubbing on the radius arms either - in fact quite a bit of clearance so real happy there too.

Thanks to everyone for all the info especially Slunnie for that excellent writeup.

Cheers
Peter

[Slunnie]

You'll love them knp.

Ozscott, the 265/70's are 30.6" and the 265/75 is 31.6" though what you're saying is still highly applicable.

[DiscoMick]

How do you think the Pirellis will compare with BFGs in a similar LT size re noise, grip on and off road and wear rates?
For historical reasons, I have one Pirelli Scorpion HT on a wheel in the back shed, which is nice on road but useless off it.
I'm planning to replace my BFG AT LT 235/70/16s with something a bit bigger, since there is room after the 50mm lift, but am undecided what size and make to go with. Like to get more diff height and tyre width without scraping.
They will spend most of their time on bitumen, but must be capable of handling Cape York later this year though, so I'm seeking a suitable compromise.
Friends say their Cooper STs last forever, but they sound rather noisy to me.

[Slunnie]

What I found at Cape York was that the track's were not necessarily that hard on tyres, but there were a couple of creek exits that were clay muddy where AT's etc were having problems, notably the first proper one at the bottom of the OTL. This said, we all ran Simex up there at 20psi and ignored the corrugations. The only place that I recall being really sketchy was in to Chilli Beach - that was a quagmire and we were certainly glad to be running open tyres.

[DiscoMick]

Thanks.
I'm not gonna buy MTs just for one trip so I think I'll compromise with ATs. But I do want more height and width than the current 235/70/16s give.
If you''re towing a trailer (a strong off road trailer), can you take the chicken tracks to avoid the worst bits? Nothing to prove. I'll be in a group so can get towed where necessary.
Would a decent set of ATs let down to low 20s be OK on the corrugations? We're going in September so it should be pretty dry by then?
I'm basically thinking either BFG ATs, Scorpion ATRs or Cooper STs in LT.

[Slunnie]

There's not really chicken tracks, but I wouldn't sweat it if you're in a group to be honest. People are towing through there all the time with AT's and trailers etc. A lot of the time the difficult parts are where the track is cut into the banks anyway, and most of it is single track. I really think that any of those tyres will be fine. My choice would be the ATR based on what it will do for the other 99% of its life, especially if its dry up there. If its wet then the ST's ***shudder*** (seriously consider the MTR instead) would be a better tyre, but the ST is noisy.

I'm not sure if the AT's at 20psi would be suitable. They're a different construction to a bias tyre which is quite stiff. I'd definately drop the pressures though, maybe 25 or a little higher. I guess it just depends on how heavy the Disco is, but the corrugations are fast dirt.

[DiscoMick]

You would prefer the Scorpion ATR to the BFG AT? What size in an LT do you think would be best for a Disco1 with 50mm lift?
Looking at their size range I see:



LT265/75R16 109S
LT245/75R16
LT235/85R16 120R

I've highlighted the ones I think might be goers. Do you agree?

Maybe mid-20s for pressures, you might be right.

[Slunnie]

I guess preferring the ATR over the BFG AT is just a personal preference. I like the pattern, I like the carcass, I like the noise levels, I like the smoothness + ride, it has less "edge" which can be good and bad, and the compound is silica which gives a lot of traction but I dont expect a 100,000km life from them. I haven't driven on BFG AT, though I would expect it to be better in mud, but that'd be about it. Its just an old technology tyre these days.

Mick I'm really not sure re sizing.

[nzoliver]

Gedday,

I know this is another tyre question but have spent ages going through as many posts as I can find and have come up with the following short list of tyres.

Have decided on 245/70R16 as this is a more common size and is available in LT construction and a lot of AULRO folk seem to be running this size in preference to the narrower 225/75R16.

I would very much appreciate some advice on which of the three below would be the most suitable for 90% town car and 10% family touring (loaded to the gunwales and towing the tardis). Something that is quiet, fuel efficient and hard wearing but that has a decent tread pattern with enough bite to handle the occasional mud. Most of our driving/camping is in the bush, not much beach work at all and zero hard core stuff.

So in order of preference (so far):
1. Pirelli Scorpion ATR - seems to be well recommended by others on this site. Best price so far is $1200 for 5 fitted, balanced and aligned.
2. Bridgestone D694 again seems a great choice. Best price is $1170 for 5, fitted, balanced and aligned. (Apparently on special during Sep).
3. BFG AT - Are these as quite or quieter than the others? The tread pattern seems to me to be an older perhaps more noisy style? Best price $1324 for 5, fitted, balanced and aligned.

I have looked at and discounted the following:
Cooper ATR - not available in required size
Goodyear Silent Armor - too expensive and more or less unkown to date.
Yokohama G012 - wears out too quick? Nice and cheap tho.
Maxxis 751 - nice and cheap and has good following but has more rounded shoulders and probably less puncture resistant.
GG AT - not interested in these.

So whadddaya reckon please?

Cheers and thanks
Peter

Aloha from NZ!:D

I have the Scorpion ATRs and they are great 'ere. I have the 'standard' size of 235/70 16.;)

Coopers are good too... had 'em on a Jeep a few years back.

Oliver

[greg smith]

just been through the same process. Put the bridgestone on haven't been offroad yet ,made in aus though 220 fitted [in cairns] so far so good.

[Xavie]

I was talking to a ranger recently out at Jenolan and he was saying they go through BFG AT's on a weekly basis and that they were now changing all their vehicles over to different brands and were not getting even close to 50% of the probs they had with BFG's. He said once they had been on the road and warmed the tyre up and then off down dirt or rock/shale like tracks they were just constantly blowing out and getting holes in them. Since change over they had not experienced this any where near as bad and were now back to carrying just one spare where as at times staff had become stranded because they were doing more then one tyre at a time.

He said they were fine around most tracks but put them on rocky/shale type stuff and kiss 'em good bye.

[weeds]

I was talking to a ranger recently out at Jenolan and he was saying they go through BFG AT's on a weekly basis and that they were now changing all their vehicles over to different brands and were not getting even close to 50% of the probs they had with BFG's. He said once they had been on the road and warmed the tyre up and then off down dirt or rock/shale like tracks they were just constantly blowing out and getting holes in them. Since change over they had not experienced this any where near as bad and were now back to carrying just one spare where as at times staff had become stranded because they were doing more then one tyre at a time.

He said they were fine around most tracks but put them on rocky/shale type stuff and kiss 'em good bye.

what did they change over to....i have never had any issues with my bfg at's

[nzoliver]

Hi,
We found the same thing here. The 'cheaper' tyres - Khumo etc don't seem to last on the Land Rovers. The heavier sidewalls of the Pirellis and Michelins seem to handle the weight of the LRs better and give no greif. 90000km is normal for a set of Michelins although they aint cheap!!:eek:

[McDisco]

You would prefer the Scorpion ATR to the BFG AT? What size in an LT do you think would be best for a Disco1 with 50mm lift?
Looking at their size range I see:



LT265/75R16 109S
LT245/75R16
LT235/85R16 120R

I've highlighted the ones I think might be goers. Do you agree?

Maybe mid-20s for pressures, you might be right.

I would get the ATRs in the 245/75 size. My brother in law has 245s and he hardly notices the gearing issues. 265/7s will fit easy enough and give better clearance, but if they are your daily drivers you will notice the impact on your gearing.

As for running them at low twenties, I think you should be ok. If you do the Oodnadata track, the Pink Roadhouse give out info sheets that say you should run as low as 22 or 24 on front and about 26-28 at the rear (depending on car). I run these pressures with my BFG muddies and didnt have a problem and the tyres didnt generate much heat.

Angus

[DiscoMick]

Thanks for that advice. I'll go have a look at them once the plastic recovers from Christmas and I get some more urgent things done.
The Disco currently has an oil leak from the head (head gasket?), I have to jump start it because the gearbox inhibitor has failed ( being fixed by dealer this week), the rear diff has an oil leak and I noticed a crack in a joint which I'm going to get looked at once my local LR guy returns from holidays. So I have a few other issues to consider.
I'm also planning to fit an oil cooler for the gearbox and a Detroit autolocker in the rear. Might also fit some tougher sidesteps. And I'm still considering cheap solutions for the rear storage issue (currently trialling a plastic box).
After that, when the tyres are worn down a bit more, on goes a new set.

A question: if I fit new 245/75/16s, will a 235/70/16 spare still be driveable? I have an almost unused Goodyear ATR LT spare it would be pointless to replace if I can still drive on it if I get a puncture in the new tyres. I'm a bit unsure about mixing tyre sizes. Three of the 4 B FG ATs are almost had it, but there is one plus the Goodyear I could keep for spares if that was safe to do.

[Slunnie]

I dont think it'll be good for the drivetrain but it will get you out. Def not if you fit a detroit locker.

[DiscoMick]

OK, looks like I'll be wearing them out more first and then buying 6 new ones.

[ozscott]

Discomick - it will be illegal in Qld - ie to have a different size spare compared to the road wheels.

I have the Pirelli Scorpian ATs - the ones pictured by Slunnie a few pages back next to the ATR. They have been a great tyre - in fact I run them in 265/70/16 on my D2 V8 and 245/70/16 on my D1 V8 - both very quiet tyres and give plenty of handling and feedback. The 245 are actually a better tyre - LT construction and have lasted much better than the larger passenger construction - but I like the extra height of the bigger ones off road. I have recently come back from Fraser with the D2 and it was unstoppable in the deep very soft sand of Indian Head etc.

I was considering the GG AT2 that my mate runs on his D2 - 265/70/16 and his did it easy at Fraser with me too. But ultimately I like the ATR's look, availability and reports here and will go that way soon with my D2 although its a shame that there is no LT in that size and I dont want to go bigger.

Cheers

[PhilipA]

SWMBO has now said the BFG's look too rough so maybe now it'll be the scorpions.
Now THAT seems a great way to choose tyres.
Why don't we all get our SWMBO's to form a judging panel.

Seriously, BFG AT KOs are a great tyre.
I have always had them since I started 4WD in 1977 with fabric ones and I have never had a puncture. I also have BFG Long Trails as a run around tyre in 205x16. Made in France and Michelin owns BFG. Hmmmm.
I have 245.75x16.
Well I had 2 slow leaks recently which were a loose plug from a nail in my driveway 5 years ago and a nail hidden in the tread.
Mine are unfortunately now 9 years old and have about 100KK on them with still 6MM of tread, but the sidewalls are starting to get some fine cracking, so I may have to buy new ones before the next trip.

They are noisier than highway tyres but you do not hear the noise unless you do an A/B comparison with a highway tyre. Of course as an LT tyre they have a rougher ride than a passenger construction tyre.

The tread design is similar to when they were first introduced in the 70s but has been changed subtly over time. this tells me that it is a GREAT design and it has been copied by many.

BTW I have seen criticism of Scorpions for having poor grip when worn.

BTTW BFGs are LT tyres and the others AFAIK are not (694s have an option. make sure that is what you were quoted). Be Sure that you fit LT tyres if you intend off road touring.
Regards Philip A

[Slunnie]

Phillip, better tyres have come out in the last 30 years. :lol2:

[PhilipA]

Phillip, better tyres have come out in the last 30 years. :lol2:

Slunnie do you think that I do not review what is available every time I buy new tyres? Or maybe you think an AT KO is the same as the old textile AT of 30 years ago. Trendy new is not always better .

I just completed about 25K touring around OZ including Lawn Hill, station tracks to Savannah Way. Savannah Way to Roper Bar, Then some bitumin, then the roads into the sights at Kakadu, then around Alice, Then Oodnadatta Track. In May went to the Flinders then up to Arkaroola , Strezlecki, Merty Merty, Tibooburra, White Cliffs all towing camper.
previous work included tracks like at Yalwal, Brindabellas,and numerous other rocky tracks.
Only problems in 9 years are 2 slow leaks from nails as described.

Compare that to reports on Goodyear Wranglers, Coopers, Bridgestone etc.
Last time I bought I compared Coopers, ( lucky I chickened) and Michelin ATX.
The tread pattern looking "old fashioned" because it hasn't changed substantially for several years just tells me it works.

To me reliability is an important (the most important?)attribute.
They work for me .
However the Pirellis look great on road tyres, like the Long Trails I run on the road, and from what you say they are nice and quiet as one would expect with a mild tread and round shoulders.:)

Regards Philip A

[Slunnie]

Gday Philip, I'm just stirring. I see what you write here and on other forums and know you're considered.

What does spin me out a bit though, is people (not you) that get fixed on a certain thing, product, method, design or whatever and the cant see beyond that. Although they have what they consider to be the best, sometimes they might miss out on what may be a better best for them.

I look at tyres and see the development of things such as silica compounds and in comparison to carbon black they have soooo much to offer such as better traction and wear rates.

I see evolution of tread designs that can give more of what we're looking for in a tyre such as dispersion, traction etc and less of what we;re not looking for eg noise and rolling resistance, and this something that has been particularly evident in the mud tyres that have spawned off the back of the MTR with angulated side lugs.

But its interesting, because as you say, not everything trendy is best (what is a "trendy" tyre?), and it has been interesting with carcass construction to see that there was an industry move from rags to radial, though hard core is still generally bias - but there is I suspect a trend for these to be moving now to radials with tyres such as the Krawler, and muds are now are starting to hybridise with bias technology such as in the STT, MTZ, Claw etc.

I can only image years ago the people that were riding horses, shunning the motor vehicle because the horse did everything that they needed. Horses for courses though as we all sat. I run the ATR on road, MTR for touring and Simex for play. Likewise my ute now runs Crawlers for outright offroad traction delivered in a usable manner.

[McDisco]

Phillip, better tyres have come out in the last 30 years. :lol2:

I agree with Simon, I used to be a big BFG AT fan and ran them for a long while. But I do think they are being out done and are losing there market dominance. A couple of years back everyone would go for BFG At as a first tyre. Now a days there are so many more options out there that are excellent and competitive on price.

That said, I now run BFG muddies and Yokohama HTs. The BFG muddies havent changed much in the last 20 years or so and IMHO are still an excellent tyre. They last, are chip resistancce, tough and surprisingly good on road.

Angus

[Slunnie]

Hi Angus, speaking of the BFG MT being around for 20 years, it is about to be replaced from this:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/01/277.jpg

to this:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/01/278.jpg

The new Km2 is only out in a small range of sizes which does include 315/75-15 (35")

[BigJon]

I recently fitted four 245/70 16 Scorpion ATRs. So far I have done about 2000 kms of highway driving on them. No problems so far!

In the next few weeks they will do a bit of dirt work and some Fraser Island touring. I am sure they will be fine for that.

I was considering BFG A/T or even the new pattern M/T, but neither were available at the time. Realistically the Scorpion ATR are probably a better tread pattern for the predominantly highway driving I do.

Perhaps I will get some M/Ts as play tyres when my guards are cut and flared (in a couple of weeks).

[McDisco]

Hi Angus, speaking of the BFG MT being around for 20 years, it is about to be replaced from this:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/01/277.jpg

to this:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/01/278.jpg

The new Km2 is only out in a small range of sizes which does include 315/75-15 (35")


Yeah I know!! I have been trying to wear mine down so I can justify buying a new set of KM2's in 265/75/r16! They arent available yet though... And I dont think Im ready to cut the guards and do a 3-4 inch lift to fit 35's!! I would really like to though...lol

I think the knew KM2 looks really good. Hope they perform.

Angus

[DiscoMick]

I certainly have no complaint about the BFG ATs I have been running for five years, but as they're going to need replacing soon I'm considering my options.
One option is to stay with the current 235/70/16 size, which would mean I need only buy 2 new tyres, so that would be the cheapest option.
However, I'd like to go a little bigger since the 50mm lift, maybe to around 245/75/16 or similar.
Must be LT so it can handle rough roads as well as be OK for normal driving.
So, if I'm going to buy 5, or even 6 (for 2 spares), then I'm certainly going to look around and see if times have changed.
Both my son with his Four Runner and two other rellies with Mits swear by the Cooper STs, but I wonder if they're not a bit too aggressive and noisy for bitumen running around the city.
The Scorpion ATRs sound interesting, but I wonder about puncture resistence.
Goodyear MTRs also sound interesting, but I hear they wear pretty rapidly.
I think I'll just sniff around a bit and see.

[Slunnie]

I've been finding the opposite about MTR's. Mine have been my daily drivers for what seems like an eternity and they've still got a heap of tread on them. I put them on early 04, still going and I don't show them any particular mercy.

[dullbird]

I really like the look of the km2's I saw them in the flesh at the club meeting....and they are much much tougher than the normal m/t in the sidewall

[lloyds disco]

for an aggressive well priced tyre
have you considered the federal MT cougaria
had them on my cruiser for 20000klms before selling the cruiser for my d2.
handled wet bitumen better than all the cooper i have had, good on road generaly, a little noisy but very good compared too anything close too as aggressive. awsome in the ruff stuff, equally as good on wet rocks as mud. I cant fault them 8 ply rated, the size I had was 285 75 R16, about 33's ( yes I can, they had proved a little difficult to balance on alloy rims, but on steel would be no problem)

[DiscoMick]

Saw a set of Pirelli Scorpion ATRs on a Cruiser tonight and was not impressed by their appearance, although I'm not sure how much they were worn. Didn't look that tough. Might have a look at some new ones, but I think I'd prefer BFG ATs based on what I saw.

[grover7488]

The new Bf Muds are supposed to be coming out this year in a wider range of sizes. I have been pricing up some MTZ at the moment and if they are anything to go by i can buy 5 new ones, i will just have to sell my D2 to finance them :eek:.

BTW Pro Comp went up 15% today. that takes an Xtreme MT [265/75/16] to $430:confused:

[chuck]

I fitted a set of Mickey Thompson MTZ's in 265 x 75 x 16.

Very very happy with them.

Good in snow, mud, rocks & on bitumen both wet & dry.

Regards

Chuck

[DiscoMick]

What price Chuck?

[grover7488]

What price Chuck?

the best price i have found is $320 F&B:eek:

Still unsure what to buy:confused:

[Tombie]

Smile mate... At least youre not fitting the ones I just got!

275-70-18s Mickey Thompson MTZs

5 new tyres, fitted and balanced.....

Ready for the price?










Sitting down?








Grab something to hold onto....










$2680.00 :eek:

But they're a great tyre and I consider it worthwhile...


But out of your list.. Go the Pirelli..

[nice1guv]

$2680.00 :eek:



:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Whoa....must be a good tyre!

[grover7488]

$2680.00 :eek:

But they're a great tyre and I consider it worthwhile...


But out of your list.. Go the Pirelli..



:oWhat the?!!!!!!!:o

i think i might run some 20" HSV wheels and tyres instead:wasntme:

Any pics (I assume they are on the D2?) please, please
Must look the business:cool:

[DougLD]

Hi All
I have had Pirelli Scorpion ATs on for the last couple of years before that Michelin's i have found the Scorpions great. Still got another trip in them a quieter than the Michelin's.
Regards
Doug

[B_ROVER]

matey get a set of black sunraisers 16x8 and throw a set of mickey thompson MTZ's on them bout 285x75x16 bloody beautiful mate

[tip]

anyone have an opinion on the toyo opat???

[BigJon]

anyone have an opinion on the toyo opat???

I had a pair of them (255/65 16) on the front of my Rangie for about 3 years. Much better steer tyre than the Michelins I had, but they didn't last as long.

I now have 245/70 16 Pirelli Scorpion ATRs fitted. After a 5000km round trip including some hard offroad I am very happy with them. Quiet on bitumen and surprisingly good on the dirt.

[DiscoMick]

How is the wear rate comparing with the Toyos?

Has anyone tried the Continental Contact 4x4 AT I see adverttised in Overlander p 61 the current issue? Any good?