Any chefs on here or people that know their kitchens well

[dullbird]

I know this may seem like a strange question but Ian is wanting to buy some decent knives for the kitchen.

Knives that will last the test of time.......but we are not sure where to look or what brands to seek.

We are not after budget knives we are after knives that chef's would recommend. In the same instance we are not going to be silly about it and buy a couple of grands worth of knives


Any suggestions anyone

don't really know the names of the knives but at present we just have the standard block like most kitchens have with the bread knife the large general purpose knife and a couple of smaller ones.

We have hears that really all you need is three GOOD knives a large general purpose type one, a carving knife and a pairing knife (if that is the correct spelling?)
Is this true?

any help will be greatly received:)

Lou

[Xavie]

This may sound over the top but I probably have $1,000 worth of kitchen knives. Each one would be in excess of $80 bucks up to $250.

For an excellent blade a brand like sabatier or Fdick.

For a cheap-ish knife something like a carbon steel fdick (8 inch ;)) is a very good general pourpose knife and should be under $90

The prob with carbon steel is they rust if you don't keep them dry and after you cut acidic things you need to rinse it. BUT the blade on them are second to none.

NExt in my opinion is high carbon. Does not rust and holds a good blade but your up about $200 for a 10 inch blade....however..... they are a great feeling knife.

What's the budget though?

I mean I could say all the everyday brands but they are plain old steel and they just don't have the edge compared to the quality stuff.

Edit*
just a couple of websites... although you wouldn't get them from over seas I thought it could give you something to look at. I also have a big book on knives which has all the info if you'd like to borrow it sometime.

http://www.shop.sabatier.com/default.cfm

The other important thing to remember is to learn how to use a quality steel and quality stone... And I have often read for best knife care to use a steel every single time before the knife touches the board.

[dullbird]

I think at the moment he has a tad over 300 bucks but I suppose it just depends.....we want reasonably good knives and don't mind paying for quailty if they last and keep their sharpness and don't fall apart

[discowhite]

global.

cheers phil

[WildOne]

Henkel are a good brand, my personal choice though are Global Knives, nicely balanced, easy to clean, handle and blade are one piece and when sharpened correctly have an edge second to none.

[barney]

Lou,
if you go into a catering/chefs equipment wholesaler, you will have access to the best equipment.
they will not be priced upon appearance, they will be priced on quality as most chefs know what they are buying and wont be swayed by the look of something. having said that, some are as dumb as a post but that is how the world balances itself out.
but, as i work in the catering industry and frequent the kitchens of some of the best restaurants in sydney, if not the world, i can do some asking around for you.
i don't know whether you'll value their opinions, but I'm sure Tetsuya, Guillaume and Neil Perry all have formed opinoins of what makes a good knife! next time i see them, i'll ask for you.

[The ho har's]

have used Mundail for years.....I think they are good quality on a budget have never had any problems with them and are easy to sharpen...and have worked in many commercial kitchens before.....just my thoughts:D


Mrs ho har:angel:

[dobbo]

I have one piece of advice, take from it whatever you will.


"One is asking for trouble if they are trying to shave their own nuts with a Katana"

[EchiDna]

don't forget the myriad of sharpening techniques etc...probably more important than it's a horse for courses thing - I'm a fan of Japanese style damascus steel knives for vegies - good relatively commonly found ones are made by Tojiro. I also like my German made French style knives made by Giesser for meat - not sure why, it just feels right to me!

Giesser are cheap, high end Tojiro's are not (relatively) but this is another potential addiction area, potentially worse than Landies - you sure you want to go there? :)

buy em one at a time and slowly slowly replace the cheap knife block ones with good versions of those you use most - and don't forget a good sharpening/honing stone or two!!

[Xavie]

the other thing is which I did because I couldn't afford all at once was buying one or two at a time. It gives you a good feeling to of what your missing... I find most knife blocks don't have what I'm use to using.

And a magnetic rack due to no bench space.

[EchiDna]

..."One is asking for trouble if they are trying to shave their own nuts with a Katana"

lol!!

[Quinnyii]

Kasumi - Fantastic Knives but you will pay for it.

I think a good middle of the road knife would be the Wusthof, they start at around $80 for a pairing knife and work their way up to around the $250-$350 mark.

Many of the chefs at work use the Wusthof's, but a number also swear by Sabatiers.

cheers

Pat

[B92 8NW]

Speak to your butcher or a commercial kitchen.

In 1949 my Grandmother asked her butcher to order in few decent knives for cutting meats. I was using them this afternoon and wondered how many knives are used for six decades solid. They are stamped E A Berg Fabriks AB Eskilstuna Sweden, and have a picture of a shark on them. Worthwhile if you will them to the kids LOL.

[weeds]

F.Dick

i have managed to get on of my uncles retired knifes, he is a boner? at a meatworks, i use the one knife for everything as it the only one in the house that will hold an edge

an i believe your steel is just as important

[barney]

of course the higher quality stainless steel they are, the less likely they are to stick to a magnetic rack

[Blknight.aus]

we bought a set of unbranded knives from King of knives...

$200 for 6 in a wooden block with a wanna be sharpener in it.

had them for over 2 years now and once I sharpened them up the way I think a knife should be sharpened then convinced SWMBO to not cut on ceramics with them and to store them sharp side up in the block I havent had to resharpen them for general cooking duties.

the only things the set doesnt do as well as I like is filleting, deboning and carving soft "fall apart" meat. Since I Like a steak that people tend to mistake as a whole animal, dont generally eat fish or have "fall apart" meats all that often.

[B92 8NW]

Speak to your butcher or a commercial kitchen.

In 1949 my Grandmother asked her butcher to order in few decent knives for cutting meats. I was using them this afternoon and wondered how many knives are used for six decades solid. They are stamped E A Berg Fabriks AB Eskilstuna Sweden, and have a picture of a shark on them. Worthwhile if you will them to the kids LOL.

Whoops. appears the company folded in 1959.

[Quiggers]

dullbird, work out what you want to carve or cut, then find the type of knife for the job, then once you've ascertained such, do as the guys have said.

dont waste money on knives you wont need, or are useless for the intended purpose

Q

[DiscoTDI]

We have a set of FURI pro knives which we have had for approx 5 years, nicely balanced, easy to keep sharp and they are a one piece stainless steel knife which means cleaning is very easy and no food can get in the handle and harbour bacteria.

Füritechnics (http://www.furitechnics.com.au/products_aus.html)

The best thing to do though is go to a shop and have a feel of some different knives, because what I like may feel horrible to you.

btw, a set of useful knives should cost around $250 or you can buy them piece by piece

[lardy]

does that cover it as being a chef ???

dont touch carbon steel if you are not a pro good blade but you may bugger it go for a harder stainless steel FDICK/mundial knife, a smooth steel to harden the blade you put on it and a slightly courser one to actually make the blade, bit of a waste if you don't know how to use a steel but.

DO NOT TOUCH GLOBAL KNIVES THEY ARE RUBBISH they look very pretty i bought a set when i was in the u.k. and they cost over a grand - i gave them away as they were so appalling.

if you are not a pro dont think about buying a whole set you wont be boning out rump and loins so forget the boning knife.

my suggestion would be an 8 inch chopping knife, a paring knife (veg knife) and maybe a filleting knife if you catch and fillet your own fish,
for knife brands sabatier used to be excellent entry level knives but the name gets franchised out thus they are bad, dreizach wurstorf used to good to but i have had trouble with the handles crumbling.

have a look at mundial spanish make they are ideal for entry level knives and you won't have to re-mortgage the house to get them.
stay away from king of knives as they mark up substainially maybe have a butchers online see what you can get for your money

forgot if you cook a joint of meet you can get away with a pastry chefs carver i use these for all the wrong jobs it's my all rounder try victorinox 12 inch scallop edge serrated cheers

[justinc]

Lou and Ian,

When I was growing up and was being taught to cook while still at home etc, we had a set of Sabatier. At the time they were reasonably expensive but I believe now quite affordable. Even all that time ago I remember them being a joy to use and my ma was very impressed with their ability to keep an edge.

You ARE heading towards a kitchen knife addiction, rather like a landy addiction, I fear.
:p:p

JC

[lardy]

We have a set of FURI pro knives which we have had for approx 5 years, nicely balanced, easy to keep sharp and they are a one piece stainless steel knife which means cleaning is very easy and no food can get in the handle and harbour bacteria.

Füritechnics (http://www.furitechnics.com.au/products_aus.html)

The best thing to do though is go to a shop and have a feel of some different knives, because what I like may feel horrible to you.

btw, a set of useful knives should cost around $250 or you can buy them piece by piece

you having a laugh my knives each cost that much lol:D

[lardy]

Lou and Ian,

When I was growing up and was being taught to cook while still at home etc, we had a set of Sabatier. At the time they were reasonably expensive but I believe now quite affordable. Even all that time ago I remember them being a joy to use and my ma was very impressed with their ability to keep an edge.

You ARE heading towards a kitchen knife addiction, rather like a landy addiction, I fear.
:p:p

JC

they used to be fabulous knives classical french chefs would all have a set of carbons, but those days have gone sabatier are made in india china timbuctoo etc and are no good any more:(

[EchiDna]

way to open up a can of worms Dullbird!!!

:):):)

[dullbird]

:oops2:

[LandyAndy]

Hey Lou
Wait till I get back to work and after a few weeks you can select as many knives as you like,you just will need to pull them out of my back:cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:
Andrew

[DiscoTDI]

Hey Lou
Wait till I get back to work and after a few weeks you can select as many knives as you like,you just will need to pull them out of my back:cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:
Andrew


ROFLMAO:Rolling::Rolling::Rolling::Rolling::Rollin g:

[rick130]

Hey Lou
Wait till I get back to work and after a few weeks you can select as many knives as you like,you just will need to pull them out of my back:cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:
Andrew

:lol2:

[d@rk51d3]

In my 12 years in the kitchen, we used carbon steel cleavers for EVERYTHING.

Filleting fish, shelling prawns, boning ducks, slicing, dicing, chopping. Meat, veg - you name it.

At home, I still use it for most things, although I have a couple of Global knives too. Contrary to another post, I actually like the feel of them, but I still go for my cleaver as my first choice. Maybe just habit.


As has been suggested, try them all.

[rick130]

Here's some gorgeous Japanese blades, and I think they are all Damascus steel.

Products Japanese Knife,Japanese Kitchen Knife,Japanese Chef's Knives.Com (http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/products.html)

Tojiro Damascus knives Tojiro Knives (http://www.zenimports.com.au/toj_3.html)

and a knife forum In the Kitchen (Topic list) - Knifeforums.com - Intelligent Discussion for the Knife Enthusiast - Powered by FusionBB (http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/showforum.php?fid/26/)

[Xavie]

You ARE heading towards a kitchen knife addiction, rather like a landy addiction, I fear.
:p:p

JC

that's so true.... It's scary.... I recently did a 4 hour drive because a friend told me about a knife shop and I just wanted to see them... I came home a lot poorer.

[dullbird]

a very good friend of mine who cooks extremely well, up to chef standards and may of even done it at one stage I'm not entirely sure.

had some knives that he brought from somewhere in japan I believe....they were made in front of him while he waited for them and sharpened in such a way that he got me to hold up the knife.....(the knife was 15years old) and he got one section of tissue paper and parted the two pieces that make the section and dropped one piece above the blade it floated down and the knife just sliced it clean it was so graceful it was a pleasure to watch

that sounds really sad doesn't it :lol2:

[rick130]

I've done quite a lot of work for wholesale and retail butchers over the years and they use either Swibo (Wenger-Switzerland), Victorinox (Switzerland) or Frost (Sweden) knives and always F Dick steels.

Butchers knives aren't fancy, they are tools built to a price but they must also hold a reasonable edge (wholesale boners are very particular about this) and be easily kept clean.
These same companies also make kitchen knives so are probably worth a look at.
I always bought my steels, filleting and boning knives through the wholesale reps as I'm a tight **** :D and an ex abattoir worker gave me a new Swibo skinner twelve months ago.
Not sure what I'm going to use that on. :eek:

[Sprint]

Since I Like a steak that people tend to mistake as a whole animal.
large and still moo-ing?

[big guy]

May I suggest you go to a knife shop, try a couple and get a good fee.

kinfes are balanced and not all knifes suit everybody.

Chefs knife, pairing knife and a good steel is a great start.

Once again, you get only what you pay for.

Go and have a good feel.

[abaddonxi]

Thanks Lou, gives me a chance to post one of my favourite sites.

http://www.indistinct.co.uk/combat-online/cook.htm

He's very good on knives.

Knife forums are fun, by they've got more opinions than Land Rover owners, and we have a lot less options to choose from.

My favourite standard, at the moment, is a Wusthof -
WUSTHOF 4582 / 20 cm - CLASSIC Cook´s knife (http://www.wusthof.com.au/en/database2-classic.asp?id=753)

Heavy for an 8", heavy spine to a very fine narrow blade. Might be a bit heavier than you'd find comfortable.

Supermarket coloured plastic peeler.
Paring knife, I never use one.
Small cooks knife 8"
Big knife, 12" or so, for watermelons and pizzas and chopping up big piles of herbs or tall carrots.
Serrated knife.
Filleting knife.
Something to carve with.

Spend the money on the smaller cooks knife because that's the one you'll use all the time. For the rest, buy cheap until you know better what you want.

Simon

[slug_burner]

Knives such a personal thing, a bit like cars and cameras. They all do the job but what one likes and is prepared to pay can be so different to another.

Wusthof is on my counter, Swibo in my tackle box.

I have had great service from Wusthof reps (they are in WA). I have broken three knives all my own fault and they have replaced all three at no cost. I guess this is what they mean about word of mouth advertising.

[CraigE]

DB, I am a chef by trade. Depending on $'S you can build up a set. I swear by Victorinox (I have had my set for over 20 years) wooden handles and are still in good nick. Wursthoff -Trident (nid to high end, you can get both so beware) are also great knives plus many more. Go and talk to a professional supplier like Cut It Out, Hospital Supplies etc.The set I have currently retails for $2500 plus. Mundial are a good entry knife and will last.
Get a good French Chefs Knife (size depends on what you are comfortable with), a good filleting knife, a good boning knife, a good utility knife, a good paring knife and a good serated knife as well as a good steel and stone.
Also bear in mind what replacements are available in Australia.

[EchiDna]

right with all these chefs on board, I wanna know why the camp cooking section doesn't have a hell of a lot more posts in it!!

for what it's worth, here is a link to Giesser Messer cattle dog page: Johannes Giesser Messerfabrik GmbH | Downloads (http://www.giessermesser.com/cms/index.php?article_id=33&clang=1)

everything from serious pro stuff to cheapo consumer goods

[kenleyfred]

We have four Kyocera ceramic knives. Started with one and liked it. They have their drawbacks. ie when it needs sharpening I am not sure what we will do. However they are over two years old, 3 of them get a flogging in our home kitchen and are still as sharp as ever. The smaller blade has a few nicks in it. Still very sharp.
They have no flexibility so in some circumstances they are not the ideal knife for the task.

Who knew tomatoes could be cut so thinly.
Kenley

[bittersweet]

Best knife I ever had was a Gustav Emil Ern carbon steel one. Unfortunately it is no more :( . One day it will be replaced. Dunno if you can get them down your way but they are brill and Gordon Ramsay swears (lots) by them. :D

B

[Pedro_The_Swift]

ok,, how about a tech question in a knife post??

if a knife is easily sharpened, does that mean its easily blunted?

[Redback]

I have one piece of advice, take from it whatever you will.


"One is asking for trouble if they are trying to shave their own nuts with a Katana"

Is that the Bike or Sword:p

Lou have a look at this site.
http://www.kingofknives.com/

Baz.

[bittersweet]

I was always told that the surface you were chopping on had the greatest impact.

B

[ciapek]

Great thread, makes for some interesting and educated reading :)

I have used these guys in the past for my odds and ends.....

Buy Chef Knives Online in Australia and Save! (http://www.everten.com.au/category/chef-knives-by-brand/)

good luck,

at least the web store has posted prices makes it easier to make budget orientated decisions......

[Xavie]

ok,, how about a tech question in a knife post??

if a knife is easily sharpened, does that mean its easily blunted?

yes and no....... I sharpen all my knives at the same time ususally and they all equally need it. I use carbon steel, high carbon and stainless and because the stainless can't get as good an edge as the carbon steel or high carbon in the first place it seems to get blunter much quicker and not very useable.

I think the trick is to regularly hone the knife with a steel to keep it in good condition and this is what will stop the knives having to be sharpened so often which is what wears away at the blade anyway.

Having said that I think it is easier to actually do damage do a C.S. knife due to it being softer (more easily sharpened) but really it just means not using an 8 inch kitcehn knife as a meat cleaver or bone cutter.

[p38arover]

E A Berg Fabriks AB Eskilstuna Sweden, and have a picture of a shark on them. Worthwhile if you will them to the kids LOL.

I've been using EA Berg pliers and side-cutters (not knives) for over 45 years - they are good quality. I was given them by my employer as part of my tool box when I was a trainee technician.

[B92 8NW]

I've been using EA Berg pliers and side-cutters (not knives) for over 45 years - they are good quality. I was given them by my employer as part of my tool box when I was a trainee technician.

Well worth holding onto. It is alleged that they were sold to Bahco in 1959, then to Sandvik in 1992 and Snap-On in 2006. I guess the EA Berg quality would have died long ago:D

[abaddonxi]

ha ha...yeah it's very easy to blunt a knife. I'm an expert at it :D:D



I agree.
We could have another whole thread on cutting surfaces
Personally I like timber chopping boards...end grain...I hate glass and plastic and by now everyone should know my views on bacteria etc etc. I just give my boards a good wash off after cutting raw meat on them

<dnip>

Eww.

I used to be set against plastic boards and swore by wood. That was until blind father-in-law moved in and I had to clean up after his thrice daily cooking explosion.

Bought myself a huge number of small plastic boards. They all fit in the dishwasher. Never get that awful black mould that most plastic boards get, spotlessly clean every day, and just pull out another one after meat, garlic, etc.

Simon

[loanrangie]

As a chef of 25 years i have only ever used Fdick and Trident knives ,i still have my set of Fdicks i bought when i started my apprenticeship. Some of the Victorinox/Mundial etc knifes may be good when they are new and sharp but try and put a new edge on them and its near impossible, the steel used in some knives is too hard and therefore hard to keep sharp or too soft and are easy to sharpen but wear away quickly. A good doublesided stone and a good steel is best for sharpening knives - i used to have a nice oval diamond coated steel that was magic till my lil bro took it :mad:. I have never liked these 1 piece all metal knives,there is something to be said about a good handle especially if you are handling them day in day out.

[beforethevision]

Just out of interest, does anyone make their own kitchen knives?

There are many places to get blanks, ;

World Knives: Blade Blanks (http://www.worldknives.com/types/blade-blanks-8.html)

Knife Blanks for Customisers (http://www.knivesaustralia.com.au/blanks.html#hospitality)

Etc.

I have no idea about quality, and steels, but I have a few friends who swear by the benefits of your own handle.

cheers!

[p38arover]

My knife is a Swiss Army Knife - I don't cook.

[dobbo]

My knife is a Swiss Army Knife - I don't cook.

Is that womans work Ron?

[abaddonxi]

DB it's worthwhile checking out David Jones or Myer for the post Christmas sales, they often sell knives at 50% off.

They don't carry the really good stuff, but a $250 knife for $125 is irresistible.

Or get to the local markets early. I picked up two carving knives, one Felix and a good Mundial, $5 each.

Simon

[rick130]

custom ands semi-custom knives are lovely.

A neighbour who drives the big machines in the mines showed me the handiwork of one of his workmates recently.
A nice kitchen utility knife (can't remember what he used for the blade) and a nice wooden handle (can't remember the timber either, think it was spotty )

Our farrier and I were were tossing the idea around of using old chainsaw chains and reforging them into Damascus blades, just for a project. (he has a portable forge in the back of his trailer)
Of course nothing came of it :D

[dullbird]

custom ands semi-custom knives are lovely.

A neighbour who drives the big machines in the mines showed me the handiwork of one of his workmates recently.
A nice kitchen utility knife (can't remember what he used for the blade) and a nice wooden handle (can't remember the timber either, think it was spotty )

Our farrier and I were were tossing the idea around of using old chainsaw chains and reforging them into Damascus blades, just for a project.
(he has a portable forge in the back of his trailer)Of course nothing came of it :D

I was going to say don't all farriers and then remembered i'm not in the uk where farriers can't afford to drive around V8 utes:D...

[clean32]

I have one piece of advice, take from it whatever you will.


"One is asking for trouble if they are trying to shave their own nuts with a Katana"

why would you want

to try and shave your nuts with a motor bike?? silly idea. just be a real bloke and use a chain saw like every one else

[rick130]

I was going to say don't all farriers and then remembered i'm not in the uk where farriers can't afford to drive around V8 utes:D...

and the buggers are more expensive here than the big smoke...
Just cause a Sheik owns the stud next door doesn't mean we all have oil wells in the back yard... :rolleyes: (Ok, he's not really a Sheik, he's actually his cousin. He is Only 'His Excellency' :D)

A lot of cold shoeing gets done in these parts too.
Farriers are more common than Land Cruisers around here, but there are only one or two you'd let near a horses feet :o

How's that ?
Two posts and totally off topic !

[dullbird]

and the buggers are more expensive here than the big smoke...
Just cause a Sheik owns the stud next door doesn't mean we all have oil wells in the back yard... :rolleyes: (Ok, he's not really a Sheik, he's actually his cousin. He is Only 'His Excellency' :D)



A lot of cold shoeing gets done in these parts too.
Farriers are more common than Land Cruisers around here, but there are only one or two you'd let near a horses feet :o

How's that ?
Two posts and totally off topic !

yes have noticed that......I'm not a fan. only benefit of cold shoeing is you don't dry their feet out but thats about the only one!

but back on topic some of the stuff raised in this thread is really interesting I'm really surprised a topic could of generated 6 pages so quickly and 95% of it being on topic:D

[CraigE]

As a chef of 25 years i have only ever used Fdick and Trident knives ,i still have my set of Fdicks i bought when i started my apprenticeship. Some of the Victorinox/Mundial etc knifes may be good when they are new and sharp but try and put a new edge on them and its near impossible, the steel used in some knives is too hard and therefore hard to keep sharp or too soft and are easy to sharpen but wear away quickly. A good doublesided stone and a good steel is best for sharpening knives - i used to have a nice oval diamond coated steel that was magic till my lil bro took it :mad:. I have never liked these 1 piece all metal knives,there is something to be said about a good handle especially if you are handling them day in day out.

I have had absolutely no problems keeping my Victorinox knives razor sharp for the past 24 years. Have replaced 2 out of a dozen in this time frame due to one getting worn out from continuous use for 18 years and one broken when used inappropriatelly.

[samuelclarke]

We use GLOBAL knives (http://www.global-knife.com/) at the health retreat where I work. Great knives, stay sharp for a decent period, but take a while to re-sharpen properly.

[discowhite]

i also have no problems keeping my globals sharp, they keep their edge really well. i also have the ceramic steel for them. well balanced, nice and light, easy to clean because of the one piece design, no food to get stuck under the handle.

cheers phil

[bigdog]

Kasumi - Fantastic Knives but you will pay for it.

I think a good middle of the road knife would be the Wusthof, they start at around $80 for a pairing knife and work their way up to around the $250-$350 mark.
Many of the chefs at work use the Wusthof's, but a number also swear by Sabatiers.

Pat

Pat - Spot on in my opinion. Mundials are good enough for domestic use but I have had the handles de-laminate in the past.
As a chef I always used Sabatiers but that was years ago.

[loanrangie]

I have had absolutely no problems keeping my Victorinox knives razor sharp for the past 24 years. Have replaced 2 out of a dozen in this time frame due to one getting worn out from continuous use for 18 years and one broken when used inappropriatelly.

Didnt have a problem as such but take more than my Fdicks ever did, i bought a set when i went to the UK for 3 years and they did the job but i wouldnt buy them again.

[scarry]

No good having a good set of knives in our kitchin.

SWMBO went and got a set of FURI brand,whatever they are ,probably chinese stuff,came with a fork type sharpener,and do sharpen well.

Well,after two years or so,they all look serated,and the ends are turned over:(on most of them.


Thats life sometimes...............kids,cooks......:D

[lardy]

ok,, how about a tech question in a knife post??

if a knife is easily sharpened, does that mean its easily blunted?

depends on alot soft metal sharpens easy but blunts quickly!
this is true
but hard steel if fine enough can sharpen easily as well.
mainly it comes down to the steel you use to hone the blade the idea is not to remove metal or it would be an expensive hobby to have knives (er more expensive !) the idea is to shape the blade into desired shape at about 10% angle.
that is why i use two steels one to produce the edge and a smooth one to take the charge out of the blade and re harden the new edge

[lardy]

Eww.

I used to be set against plastic boards and swore by wood. That was until blind father-in-law moved in and I had to clean up after his thrice daily cooking explosion.

Bought myself a huge number of small plastic boards. They all fit in the dishwasher. Never get that awful black mould that most plastic boards get, spotlessly clean every day, and just pull out another one after meat, garlic, etc.

Simon

just to be the devilled avacado lol ...E.H.O. in the u.k pushed every chef into using colour coded plasi boards and after ten odd years of using them have discovered that they harbour bacteria more-so than wood reason being the grooves harbour a fabulous environment for bacteria to grow in the grooves nice!(the old boy chefs would bare me out on this ) we used to have the surfaced scrapped, so new week new surface and if you use quality wood you can steralise the stuff too, so you basically wash them as normal keep raw poultry , raw meat, veg , salad all seperate and just remove the surface every week same as the old butchers used to do to their blocks

[abaddonxi]

just to be the devilled avacado lol ...E.H.O. in the u.k pushed every chef into using colour coded plasi boards and after ten odd years of using them have discovered that they harbour bacteria more-so than wood reason being the grooves harbour a fabulous environment for bacteria to grow in the grooves nice!(the old boy chefs would bare me out on this ) we used to have the surfaced scrapped, so new week new surface and if you use quality wood you can steralise the stuff too, so you basically wash them as normal keep raw poultry , raw meat, veg , salad all seperate and just remove the surface every week same as the old butchers used to do to their blocks


Yeah, I remember the wonders of wood, but how many scrape or oil every week? I also used to use those white boards with the great black ring in the middle of the cutting surface, a few times a year I'd bleach them back to white.

I've been using the small coloured boards through the dishwasher for five or six years, still clean and bright, no black circles. I noticed that boards are either only wiped down, or put into the sink last and never lost that oily plastic-board stickiness. Seemed to me that those boards never got really clean.

Total convert to plastic boards. I gave a set for Christmas to a certain family member who makes garlic flavoured cakes every chance she gets. I think she cools the cakes on a cutting board.

Simon

[abaddonxi]

Victoria's Basement (http://victoriasbasement.com.au/Product_Detail.aspx?ParCatID=KN&SubCat1=KNZH&SubCat2=&ProductID=66356)

On sale $156


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/01/447.jpg

[Ace]

It all comes down to the quality of the steel, if the steel is crap they dont hold their edge and you are forever shapening them.

One thing we did since buying our knives we get a magnetic knife block to put on the wall and stick the knives to, they stay much sharper than in the draw and a magnetic knife block doesnt hold bacteria like a wooden block can do. Matt

[barney]

Victoria's Basement (http://victoriasbasement.com.au/Product_Detail.aspx?ParCatID=KN&SubCat1=KNZH&SubCat2=&ProductID=66356)

On sale $156


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/01/447.jpg


victoria's secret!
http://www2.victoriassecret.com/images/landing/12-23-08/OSBRPZZZZZZ/sub1.jpg

[kenleyfred]

I prefer secret's to basements.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

though basements are good at removing secrets---:cool:



















ooops! did I say that out loud?:o

[B92 8NW]

I prefer secret's to basements.

I'd say Victoria's Basement (http://victoriasbasement.com.au/Product_Detail.aspx?ParCatID=KN&SubCat1=KNZH&SubCat2=&ProductID=66356) is the place to be.

[blitz]

Hi
My weapons of choice are Shun they are Japanese knives, not the absolute best there is, but very good knives. you can buy a three knife kit from King of knives, for about $250-00ish but to buy them individually they are about that and higher each. the biggest thing about knives is regardless of what sort you get if you cant sharpen them properly then no knife will stay sharp. All of my Shun knives are shaving sharp - litterally I can shave with them but to keep them that sharp I touch them up every time I use them. I use a 6000 grit stone to sharpen them and a steel which I use every time I use them - pull out the knive pull out the steel.

It is impossible to tell some one over the internet how to properly sharpen a knife, hopefully someone on here is close enough to you to be able to train you guys how to do it.

Hope I have helped Blythe

[JamesH]

Chef's Armoury - Buy Japanese Knives, Kitchen Knives & Pocket Knives (http://www.chefsarmoury.com/shop/index.php)

Try that site for some sex Japanese knives. I've never bought from there though i have drooled. I'm a left-hander and remember reading an article in a mag that interviewed an old Japanese knife maker who works in a suburb of Japan that has been a knife makers centre for eons, and he said he needs to know which hand the person uses and whether the knife is for vegies or meat before he finishes off the honing. One day I'd like to go to a maker like that and buy a couple of kitchen knives.

Back to real life, I have Wustof-Trident 26cm chefs knife, 20cm carving knife and 20cm serated knife from the upmarket series and they seem to do the job really well but....

go to an oriental supermarket and look for "Kiwi" brand knives. They are Thai. A kitchen knife will set you back about $5.95 and a small knive about $2.95. I kid you not they are awesome and I use them more often than my expensive knives. I have a set for the kitchen and a set for the camping box. i give them away as gifts and people just love them.

[cartm58]

Simple answer is go to catering supply place and buy yourself an apprentice cook knife set, probably middle of the road quality compared gto high end gourmet knifes but will give good service, have all the knives you'll probably ever nees and will have a sharpening steel as well and best of all with have a travel roll to keep them safe when not in use.

Once you got up to speed on knife work and found out what sort of handle best suits you then you can steadily upgrade your collection.

Don't ever wash your knives in the dish washer

[CowsGoMoo]

Wusthof Tridents here. Got a set of 4 in a block. Generally only use the 20cm and 12cm knives.

The block had horizontal slots to reduce wear on the blade, although putting them in blade up in a vertical block would work. I use a magnetic knife holder now for save saving reasons.

Very good at holding their sharpness.

[abaddonxi]

Lingerie model, knives, basement.

Some of youse blokes need to get out more.:D

[abaddonxi]

Sale on at Peter's of Kensington, much off knives.

Peter's of Kensington | Knives (http://www.petersofkensington.com.au/Product/CategoryInfo.aspx?cid=583&category=true)

Simon

[dullbird]

just wanted to say thanks to all those that gave advice

we have 2 Wustoff....knives to play with and get a good feel of. Should we get on well with these knives we will expand a little on the 2

I have to say first impressions are felt really really well built look very neat and stylish and they feel really nicely balanced in the hand and a nice working weight!

have to say we had the option of globals and i can honestly say I didn't like them! but that is just personal opinion

[isuzurover]

I bought some ceramic knives the other day (for work). They are VERY nice... A bit strange to get used to though, as the blade is so light tha balance feels wrong, but apart from that...

[abaddonxi]

Digging up an oldie. I think I've had a knife search running on ebay since it started.

Three Sabatier carbon steel knives, two 4" parers and an 8" chef's knife. One of the parers and the chef's look to be unused.


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2010/06/757.jpg

[RobHay]

Go the Fdick knives and get a good Fdick steel as well, your grand-kids will be using them long after you are gone.

[cartm58]

Ceramic knices can be sharpened using a ceramic dick bought one off eBay for $2.50 the otehr day and Kyocera actually make a knife sharpening machine you just pull knife through the machine to sharpen them will also do darbon metal knives as well.

If you live in Japan you can for the life of the knife return it to Kyocera factory who will re-sharpen the knife for you to original factory sharpness and that service is at no charge to you and they post the knives back at no cost as well.

Ceramic knife will retain its edge if you dont abuse it by cutting bone, cutting frozen food or cutting on glass or plates always use a plastic or wood cutting board.

Bought my kyocera ceramic knives in Japn in April for under $50 apiece a lot cheaper than in Australia

Bought a cermaic Chinese made oriental style chef knife oblong shape for $30 from eBay they other day happy with that.

Ceramic knives ae cheaper than carbon knives and for cutting quality better

Deboning meat like chicken carcass l use my carbon butchers or cooks knife years ago l bought a SWIBO apprentice cook set of knives from commercial cookery supplier shop got a complete set of cook trade knives was a great buy and good investment in the kitchen

[Bigbjorn]

We have four Kyocera ceramic knives. Started with one and liked it. They have their drawbacks. ie when it needs sharpening I am not sure what we will do. However they are over two years old, 3 of them get a flogging in our home kitchen and are still as sharp as ever. The smaller blade has a few nicks in it. Still very sharp.
They have no flexibility so in some circumstances they are not the ideal knife for the task.

Who knew tomatoes could be cut so thinly.
Kenley

Use a diamond file for sharpening ceramic cutting tools. Cheapest places to buy them are woodworker's shops. you can buy file blades about 30mm x 50mm in fine, medium, and coarse grades. Araldite them onto a suitably sized piece of plastic. Also better for sharpening tungsten carbide tools than silicon carbide wheels or stones.

[Bigbjorn]

Just out of interest, does anyone make their own kitchen knives?

There are many places to get blanks, ;

World Knives: Blade Blanks (http://www.worldknives.com/types/blade-blanks-8.html)

Knife Blanks for Customisers (http://www.knivesaustralia.com.au/blanks.html#hospitality)

Etc.

I have no idea about quality, and steels, but I have a few friends who swear by the benefits of your own handle.

cheers!

About 2001 I was foolish enough to be talked into making a replica Viking sword and saxe-knife. Won't happen again. This was for a guy who was interested in historic renactment. He had a video and book on the subject from an English professional arms smith. Another friend had acquired a forge, so away we went. First problem was acquiring a suitable sized billet of wrought iron. Metal merchants don't have much call for this today. Most "wrought iron" work today is mild steel.

Eventually by following the video and instruction book, we ended up with two blades. The process involves heating, beating and stretching the billet out towards the shape of a blade and a handle in several stages. The blade becomes steel during the process. One cuts the blade end of the billet into three pieces and you plait and hammer weld the three "tails" together several times whilst stretching and shaping towards the desired shape and dimensions. The repeated heatings in the coke forge add carbon to the billet and with the aid of the hammering eventually makes steel. The plaiting gives the traditional "eye" or "ring" damascene pattern when finally buffed up. The Viking sagas "bright ring patterned blade".

I would not do this again without a power hammer. Bloody hard work and my arms and shoulders really felt it. Stiff for days after. Getting too old for this ****. Years laterI mentioned the escapade to a professional blacksmith who said he would not attempt the job without a power hammer, and intimated he does very little manual hammer work anymore. Like many older tradesmen, his shoulders, elbows, wrists are buggered from hammer work.

[blitz]

I have a variety of knifes, my fav's are ones that I can sharpen to the point of shaving with (they become mine no-one else touches) and are as follows

Shun, Japanese damascus style, bought as a 3 knife kit about $400-00 from memory but beautifully ballanced and I will aquire more as finances permit.

a Fdick scimitar shaped 10" carving knife, cost about $50-00 to $70-00 from memory

original Russell Green River boning and carving knifes (which I can sharpen sharper than a razor blade - magnificent carbon steel) priceless

an antique meat cleaver so hard that is rings when you tap it - priceless

and the most used a chinese vegtable knife which looks like a thin meat cleaver which cost about $5-00

so for me they range from stainless to carbon steel and fancy damascus twist, the Shun cost about $300 individually down to the chinese utility knife at $5-00. I probably havent helped at all but I guess what I am trying to say is that Beauty, function and form is in the eye of the beholder. for me a knife to be good must have good balance in the hand, be able to be sharpened to the point of shaving and hold it's edge

[adonuff]

Digging up an oldie. I think I've had a knife search running on ebay since it started.

Three Sabatier carbon steel knives, two 4" parers and an 8" chef's knife. One of the parers and the chef's look to be unused.



https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2010/06/757.jpg


I have two of them as well, great to use hold an edge for ages, Garage sale 50 cents each. Plus a larger version I found in the shed, once cleaned up and sharpened properly is the one used for all the carving. Often you will find the older steel holds a better edge than the modern stuff

[adonuff]

we bought a set of unbranded knives from King of knives...

$200 for 6 in a wooden block with a wanna be sharpener in it.

had them for over 2 years now and once I sharpened them up the way I think a knife should be sharpened then convinced SWMBO to not cut on ceramics with them and to store them sharp side up in the block I havent had to resharpen them for general cooking duties.

the only things the set doesnt do as well as I like is filleting, deboning and carving soft "fall apart" meat. Since I Like a steak that people tend to mistake as a whole animal, dont generally eat fish or have "fall apart" meats all that often.

How do you do that, I have to sit there and grate my teeth as my Girlfriend and her daughter slice stuff up on ceramic plates metal frying pans etc. Reducing my razor sharp knives too blunt objects in seconds?

[Ace]

What two knives did you pick Lou and what did they set you back if you dont mind me asking?

[dullbird]

you mean what type or what brand?

I got them from a forum member who sold them to me for half there ticket price which was still on the packets when we got them

[Ace]

you mean what type or what brand?

I got them from a forum member who sold them to me for half there ticket price which was still on the packets when we got them

no i got the brand from your original posting, which type of knifes did you get? Eg Paring or Carving etc

[dullbird]

not sure a long one thats thin and a sort of long one thats fat...

Does that help :D

[V8Ian]

not sure a long one thats thin and a sort of long one thats fat...

Does that help :D
We should rename you TB, Lou............Techno-Bird. :p

[loanrangie]

not sure a long one thats thin and a sort of long one thats fat...

Does that help :D

As clear as long ,skinny, fat mud :p.


Personally you cant go past at least a short paring , long paring, boning, carving, 25-30cm chefs , serrated and a good steel - I also like small cleavers . I still have most of the F Dick and Trident knifes i bought in 1985 when i started my apprenticeship .

[waynep]

We have a set of Mundial - quite dissapointed with them - hard to keep an edge. Look the part but not as good as the top ones.

Trying to convince the wife to get a set of Globals.

[loanrangie]

We have a set of Mundial - quite dissapointed with them - hard to keep an edge. Look the part but not as good as the top ones.

Trying to convince the wife to get a set of Globals.

Yep always been a problem with Mundials and Victorinox, i think the Global and other 1 piece knives are ideal for home use as they are dishwasher safe whereas wooden handled knives will split eventually if not taken care of.

[abaddonxi]

Yep always been a problem with Mundials and Victorinox, i think the Global and other 1 piece knives are ideal for home use as they are dishwasher safe whereas wooden handled knives will split eventually if not taken care of.

I've found it's not so much the handle in the dishwasher, as the rivets. Most knives have aluminium rivets which gets eaten away by the dishwasher powder.

[Ace]

not sure a long one thats thin and a sort of long one thats fat...

Does that help :D

im guessing a filleting knive and a general kitchen knife, but that helps a little Lou :D

[dullbird]

a filting knife has a slight curve to it doesn't it? if it does then I dont have a filiting knife...I think onr of them may just be refered to as a chefs knife?????

[windsock]

I don't recall reading any mention of the Opinel (http://www.opinel.com/#/accueil) range of knives on this thread. Surprised me.

Carbon steel, fold up for camping and general duties while travelling, unfold and work just as well in the kitchen. Huge range of steels and sizes.

I'ved used them for years fur trapping, kitchen, fishing, and camping. Very versatile.

Australian website (http://www.opinel.com.au/)

[cartm58]

Fillet knife is usually a straight blade very thin and flexible so it runs aong the bones taking the meat off in thin slices

A butchers boning knife usually has a small curve to it to enable you to work along the bone and vut the meat off Boning knives come is various sizes in blades.

Picked up another ceramic Chefs knife from eBay for $6 plus $9 postage $15 cheap buy.

[dullbird]

this one is not flexible..
perhaps I should just take pics hey :D

[flagg]

FWIW Victoria's Basement in the QVB have a sale on ATM: 6 Globals and a block for $299 (usually $650).

[cartm58]

knives should never go into the dishwasher

hot soapy water or rinse them under running tap

never into the dishwasher

[dullbird]

our good knives dont our stay sharps do because we dont care for them :D

[DEFENDERZOOK]

i think you got carving knives........

[dullbird]

both of them??? they are two completely different shapes

[yyeessno]

In all of my time as a chef, I keep coming back to one knife: a Henckles from the mid 80's. It's just under 30cm long, a bit of a weird length but it really works for me. I have ground the blade profile down with my friend's knife grinder so that it's quite narrow, and not so rounded.

Personally, I don't like the japanese style knifes as I find them too light to fling around, and the blades are too narrow for bigger jobs. I have a set of Shun knifes but I was forever chipping the blades and it was getting tiresome.

One thing to take into consideration is the blade profile, they're all different and some people have preferences. It really affects the technique you use.

Other than my main chef's knife, I have an enormous french chef's knife for big things, an F Dick butcher's knife and boning knife, a Cambrian steel (made for fishermen in NZ), a couple of Victrinox filleting knifes and many of their little paring knifes. They're useful and basically disposable.

[abaddonxi]

I think this thread really shouldn't have happened without pics.

[flagg]

I have globals and some other good knives.. but I have to say that my fav by far is a good Chinese cleaver. You can get them for less than $20 at the asian cooking places (there are a bunch of them in Hurstville) and they are brilliant.

They are sharp as hell and stay that way (when looked after) and have the weight to make them easier to use. I"m sure there are 10 000 brands and not all are good but it isn't too hard to tell when you have a look at them.

[CJT]

I just got a set of Global knives and am very happy with them, just got watch my fingers now, they are sharp.

Only comment is that they are very light, but do feel well balanced when I use them.

[rick130]

Bump :d

This is a great list of stainless/semi-stainless knife steel and their sharpening and edge holding properties.

How To Choose Kitchen Knives Kitchen Knife Steel FAQ Stainless Steels (http://zknives.com/knives/kitchen/misc/articles/kkchoser/kksteelp2.shtml)

Interestingly most all European pro cutlery makers (or at least the half dozen I've looked at so far) use either German sourced DIN 45CrMoV15 or X50CrMoV15 mid carbon stainless steels which aren't that high a carbon content (0.45% and 0.50% respectively) and not to a very high Rc number either.
In fact I saw that Sabatier-K only go to around 54-56 Rc on one of their ranges :o
Easy to sharpen but you'd be steeling them an awful lot.

A very few of the European cutlery makers like Scanpan with their Damastahl (Damascus) line are using Japanese sourced VG-10 which is a much better knife steel if they've done their job at the hardening/tempering stage.

Another overview of knife grinds and steels here (although this is strictly speaking about hunting knives) Hunting Australia : AUSHUNT - The Australian Hunting and Shooting Directory (http://www.aushunt.com.au/main/mainarticle2.php?articleid=7c243b26b9)

[abaddonxi]

Bump :d

<snip>

Curse you, Red Baron.:twisted::D

[greg smith]

20 years in the trade----VICTORINOX---- good quality ,not overpriced,and you can sharpen them with ease. They are not chemically sharpened and will hold their edge throughout their long useful life.