09 PUMA... With water in fuel

[BilboBoggles]

MY brand new 09 model PUMA's gone in for a second round of repairs,and a service. Now they tell me the fuel system is wrecked with water in the fuel. I read about the PUMA issues with water and was very careful to purchase fueld locally, and from the same places I fill my TD5 from. TD5 has now done 170,000 and the filter's only be drained at service, and I've never had the light come on (And it does have a water in the fuel sensor).

So this looks to be a serious PUMA issue!

If they ask me to pay for this - I'm going to demand my money back. In fact I think I will anyway - the vehicle is not fit for use on Australian Fuel. Even if they fix it - whose to say it's not going to get wet at 101,300 k's... ie after the warranty.

Not happy.....

[Scallops]

Have you looked at where your fuel tank breather is located? I moved mine and now get no water in the sedimenter.

There is a thread dullbird wrote about this very issue - I understand she had LR back down from charging (and blaming) her. Good luck. :)

[solmanic]

Yes, the fuel breather location is what generally seems to be considered by all as the source of the problem. Someone here posted pics of where the 08MY onwards breathers were positioned and it was regarded by some as being worse than where it was originally.

Several 07MY owners have had theirs relocated to behind the LH rear wheel arch splash guard (with I think some even relocating it into the cabin). 08MY onwards have them up on top of the fuel tank.

[dullbird]

sorry to hear that mate.....Its not a nice thing to happen :(

Where are you located?

[spudfan]

Sorry to hear about your problem, I had thought all of the breathers had been relocated. Would the instalation of a glass sediment bowl-like on my series111- help to ease the problem? I know that the fuel filter on the Puma is very close to the tank (mine is a 110). Could a glass sediment bowl be fitted here and the filter relocated further along the chassis? At least with the glass bowl you could visually check the diesel regularly. Maybe there is some reason why this cannot be done.
I got my dealer to extend my breather pipe by running it up to the bulkhead at the back of the engine bay. The top of the extension is somewhere behind the brake servo.They were dismantling a Discovery which was down to the chassis.The gave me some tools and told me to take the fuel line from the Discovery which was added to the breather on the Puma and run along the chassis rail up to the bulkhead in the engine bay. This was fixed in place with cable ties. The fuel line from the Discovery was used as it was close to hand -after I had removed it-but you or they could use other piping.Can't see your dealer having a problem doing it.

[Yorkshire_Jon]

Id be sure in saying it not the Australian fuel thats the problem.

I know of at least 3 puma owners whose 110's have been back to the UK dealers more than twice - one I know has been back 5 times for the same problem!

[Grockle]

The factory fix is to move the breather behind the rear light plastic flap,the breather pipe was getting blocked with dirt and the water was being drawn into the system via the fuel cap lock as the tank couldn't vent,and could only do this by the cap.
.

[dullbird]

The factory fix is to move the breather behind the rear light plastic flap,the breather pipe was getting blocked with dirt and the water was being drawn into the system via the fuel cap lock as the tank couldn't vent,and could only do this by the cap.
.

Yes apparently.....I don't believe this was the case with ours too much water and to coincidental when it happened on the heaviest rainfall for feb in a number of years...our breather was hanging directly over the rear wheel

[Grockle]

Hi db,are you still having problems ?,this must have been going on nearly 12 months.

[dullbird]

:lol2: more like 18mths not having problems with water in the fuel but still having problems with the engine rattle which found the water in the fuel....

the engine rattle that started in Feb 08 ;)

[Grockle]

You would have thought by now they would have given it a new engine,but then 'The Boy' on Defender 2 site has only just got a new 110 but he had to put money to it, and his had every fault known to man.

[Declan]

Hi guys
I am considering buying a defender Puma 09 but after reading this tread i am definitely having second thoughts i cannot believe land rover are still having these types of problems on these 4WD they are suppose to be unbreakable.
And if the fix is only to run a pipe up from the fuel tank breather have they done a recall,any feedback would be relay appreciated.

Thanks Declan:twisted::twisted::twisted:

[justinc]

Hi guys
I am considering buying a defender Puma 09 but after reading this tread i am definitely having second thoughts i cannot believe land rover are still having these types of problems on these 4WD they are suppose to be unbreakable.
And if the fix is only to run a pipe up from the fuel tank breather have they done a recall,any feedback would be relay appreciated.

Thanks Declan:twisted::twisted::twisted:

Don't know about a recall, but I have done all my customers ones for them and so far so good, 30,000km on one of them and it gets fuel from country servos and spends a lot of time on muddy roads, river crossings, snow etc etc. At his last service drained the sedimenter and got only about 10ml of water out, this is after about 20K, as LR did the service before and it hadn't been inspected then.
I'd be more concerned about noisy diffs, transfer case lash, loose suspension with bolts dropping out:o (Had 2 like that) and loose rear tailshaft bolts causing the park brake drum etc to flog out.(Had 2 like that) 1 even had the rear output flange nut come loose and leak trans oil into the park brake:mad: and yet another with the 130DC cab bracketry so loose that the rear doors would creak and clunk over even moderate bumps:mad:.
My advice is find a competent workshop and get a check/ tighten up of EVERY underbody and suspension fixing after 5000km, as the build quality seems to STILL be approximate.
Don't get me wrong, I love these vehicles I am just frustrated at the level of human error and inattention during construction and after.

JC

[scarry]

Don't get me wrong, I love these vehicles I am just frustrated at the level of human error and inattention during construction and after.

JC


X2...... Quality control what quality control:confused:

After giving juniors a good going over,i cant believe what they are like:(

As for getting to the air cleaner...what a joke:( what were they thinking....


Now if i compare the fit/finish,quality control to my new work Hiace,which is also a commercial vehicle,well...there is absolutely just no comparison:(;)

But dont get me wrong,i love the Landys

If LR keep up with this nonsence,to say the least,& are bringing all these new defender models into the country,they are only gonna get a worse name than they already have.More sales equates to more problems,unless they sort out the issues,which doesnt seem to be happening.:mad:

[BilboBoggles]

OK So Landrover have bounced the warranty on mine. They claim that dirt and water in the dule tank is not covered under warranty.

I've spoken to customer care and they will look into it.

BUT Anyone know the best way of getting my money back? Small Claims or a lawyer? Anyone know a good lawyer who handles this sort of case in Melbourne?

[lardy]

Hi guys
I am considering buying a defender Puma 09 but after reading this tread i am definitely having second thoughts i cannot believe land rover are still having these types of problems on these 4WD they are suppose to be unbreakable.
And if the fix is only to run a pipe up from the fuel tank breather have they done a recall,any feedback would be relay appreciated.

Thanks Declan:twisted::twisted::twisted:

Declan no 4x4 is unbreakable !

[Allan]

Sorry to hear this. Its the second time I've heard about trouble caused by aux tank being knocked back under warranty. Dealer told me of one in Perth that sucked up loads of dirt from a new aux. tank into injector pump etc. He had to pay for repair. Seems LR are all over modifications on these vehicles.

Allan

[sashadidi]

Is there any way of putting an extra water trap/fuel filter in the line?
like from a Tractor type filter(for example)'maybe someone can come up with one? I talked to an Ex Landrover dealership mechanic here in NZ he said all the espically Newer Range Rovers and discos did not have enough filters in their fuel systems to catch water etc
Some range rovers with the BMW6 cylinder diesel engines had one tiny filter and they has lots of problems with water etc He advised me to get another filter in the Puma fuel line as he has seen two cases of bad fuel and LR wanted to deny it here in NZ, his logic was when I said what about the warranty he said, well whats a $500 filtring system compared to a new common rail , fuel injection system and as he said LR should be happy you are preventing a claim!!! but we know they are not logical at all anyway!!!
As also mentioned new Toyota V8 diesels are having major problems here with water in diesel and not enough filtering

[Declan]

Has anybody got a puma and not had a problem with it ,if so how are they finding their defender is there any niggle points they want to pass onto someone that had there heart set on buying one but at the moment is in limbo on his decision.

Thanks for the replies Declan. :twisted::twisted::twisted:

[dullbird]

Declan you will always get problems with a new car....

there was a time when no one liked the unreliability of the td5 now they are considered reliable

there was even a time when no one would buy a 300tdi as there reliability issues were also really bad now everyone thinks there indestructible.
If you want trouble free motoring at this point in time I would say DON'T buy a Puma and get one in a couple of years time.

just my 2c worth

[perko]

Has anybody got a puma and not had a problem with it ,if so how are they finding their defender is there any niggle points they want to pass onto someone that had there heart set on buying one but at the moment is in limbo on his decision.

Thanks for the replies Declan. :twisted::twisted::twisted:


hello declan, I own a 2008 puma defender and love it. After reading some of these posts I must be the only one though, but I can not fault mine. I have flogged it to within a inch of it's life and it just performs. The only major faults have been with the drivers door window regulator which broke and the light behind the clock blew a globe other than that it is the best defender I have ever owned. As I find with most things you will either love it or hate it.

[one_iota]

Has anybody got a puma and not had a problem with it ,if so how are they finding their defender is there any niggle points they want to pass onto someone that had there heart set on buying one but at the moment is in limbo on his decision.

Thanks for the replies Declan. :twisted::twisted::twisted:

Mine is fine.

I won't pass on any niggle points because all of those can be read here.

Echoing Dullbird's thoughts: in 1997 I bought a nearly 3 year old 300 Tdi Disco. That was before AULRO existed. If AULRO had been around then I'd be using public transport because of the fear of major mechanical failure.

I had over ten years of largely trouble free motoring with the Disco.

I'm one year into the three year warranty and apart from the faulty clutch and a couple of sensors all replaced without quibble she's going strong.

[scarry]

Even though juniors had a few build quality issues... nothing has failed mechanically :).... only done 3700kms though :eek:

[one_iota]

Just one more thing with the Defender....if your heart is in it but you are not made of stern stuff then don't buy one. It's a gamble so you have to take responsibility for the decision you make. If not buy a push bike.

[TimNZ]

Just one more thing with the Defender....if your heart is in it but you are not made of stern stuff then don't buy one. It's a gamble so you have to take responsibility for the decision you make. If not buy a push bike.

Or make sure you have easy access to a sturdy brick wall to bang you head against as necessary, (i.e. often).

Tim

[slt]

Has anybody got a puma and not had a problem with it ,if so how are they finding their defender is there any niggle points they want to pass onto someone that had there heart set on buying one but at the moment is in limbo on his decision.

Thanks for the replies Declan. :twisted::twisted::twisted:

Most products covered in forums like AuLRO, whether they're cameras or computers or cars, will look like lemmons ... because you hear ALL the bad stories and only a sprinkling of the good ones. I'm heavily involved in photography, and if I went by the scary stories on the various forums I frequent, I would still not own a camera or lens.

So to add my success story here, I've had a trouble-free run (well mostly ... discounting some questions about the alarm) with my new Puma ... all 208km so far :D

[BilboBoggles]

Don't get me wrong, I love the puma. And I've already ridden a td5 through the roller coaster of a new land rover purchase. But I think the issue with this water dirt is a time bomb. The dealer has said that this is a poor design for the breather, it faces forwards and catches dust and dirt. I'm annoyed because they've refuse to cover this under warranty.

The problem for me is that without modification you will have no idea if your fuel tank has already sucked in an inch of sludge, and if the next corner you take will cause a dose of sludge to go through the engine and cause thousands of damage.

At least the td5 would self prime so you could do the filter yourself, but now you need a special tool for this.

[spudboy]

Has anybody got a puma and not had a problem with it ,if so how are they finding their defender is there any niggle points they want to pass onto someone that had there heart set on buying one but at the moment is in limbo on his decision.

Thanks for the replies Declan. :twisted::twisted::twisted:

Mine has been completely trouble free, but I have learned a lot from reading other's posts (esp. DullBird's) and I have re-routed my breather hose on the fuel tank. Down in SA we hardly get any rain, so whilst I spent the first year driving around with the unmodified breather, it was during a drought.

Mine has mainly done beach and farm work. I got it in Dec 07, and the only issue has been a recall on the sump which was no dramas because I got to drive round in a V8 Range Rover Diesel for a day whilst they swapped mine over.

I'd say go for it. Fantastic car.

HTH
David

[spudfan]

If you are talking about priming after changing the diesel filter just fill the new one with diesel before putting it on. Pulls through no bother.


Don't get me wrong, I love the puma. And I've already ridden a td5 through the roller coaster of a new land rover purchase. But I think the issue with this water dirt is a time bomb. The dealer has said that this is a poor design for the breather, it faces forwards and catches dust and dirt. I'm annoyed because they've refuse to cover this under warranty.

The problem for me is that without modification you will have no idea if your fuel tank has already sucked in an inch of sludge, and if the next corner you take will cause a dose of sludge to go through the engine and cause thousands of damage.

At least the td5 would self prime so you could do the filter yourself, but now you need a special tool for this.

[BilboBoggles]

In case anyone is interested.

I've consulted many Diesel specialists, CRD are incredibly sensitive to water, their injectors run at 2 micron clearances. You can destroy an injector with as little as a few mls of water. The standard Land Rover filter on a PUMA can only cope with 40cc of water before it runs the risk of flooding the injector system. 40cc is not much water really! The Australian fuel standards say up to 0.05% water is within standard for diesel. This water might be in suspension and condense out as temps drop. 0.05% over 1000l of diesel is 500mls of water. That's the absolute worst case water load for diesel over the service interval for the fuel filter, and if you get two loads of this fuel you will overwhelm your factory filter. Most companies aim for 0 water - but only to the point of delivery - what happens in the tank is up to the operator.

According to all the filter experts Ive spoken to - the ideal diesel filtrration system has at least 2 stages - a 30 micron crud filter - and a 2 micron fine filter. Ideally there would be a 10 micron intermediate filter as well. The defender only has a single filter, and has no water warning light.

Also my advice is the make sure you buy your PUMA fuel from SHELL Coles Express service stations - they have a very good liabilty coverage. Many shell service stations are independent, even if they have company logos etc - you have very little come back on the independents. One bad load of fuel can be an immense drain on your wallet!

A soon as I get my PUMA back I'm fitting a RACOR 445R-2 diesel filter which filters down to 2 micron, and has a water impermiable membrane in the filter, which means that it will block up before it lets water through. It also has the ability to detect water in the drain system. The filter assembly includes a priming pump - so is ideally suited to the PUMA. Costs $318 from Perfect Filters in Dandenong. Filters should last 20,000 k's and should be installed before the factory fitler to retain your warranty. You'll never block your factory filter as I beleive that's 30 micron.

SO just a note to those out there with PUMA's - CRD's are incredibly sensitive to water. One dose of crap fuel and your engine is toast!. Repair bills from $1000 to $12,000 if all injectors need replacing. Be careful where you fuel up - and perhaps consider getting an aftermarket fuel filter installed.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

So, why don't td5's have these problems as they are essentially the same engine technology? Are the breathers in different positions?

[Scallops]

So, why don't td5's have these problems as they are essentially the same engine technology? Are the breathers in different positions?

Well - the fellow is saying it's a common rail engine problem - the TD5 isn't a common rail engine.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Well - the fellow is saying it's a common rail engine problem - the TD5 isn't a common rail engine.

Yes it is :eek:

It's a computer controlled common rail diesel just like the Puma :)

[Scallops]

Yes it is :eek:

It's a computer controlled common rail diesel just like the Puma :)

No it's not! :p :D This has been discussed before...

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-chatter/34757-td5-common-rail.html

[BilboBoggles]

The TD5 has unit injectors, the unit injectors are a self contained high pressure pump injector and solenoid. There is no common rail in a TD5. The PUMA on the otehr hand operates at twice the pressure than the TD5, and has a high pressure continuous duty pump - a rail to store the pressure, and piezo electric injectors. They are very different technologies. The TD5 can cope with much more water than a CRD.

Having said that - I'm sticking in a R445-2 into my TD5 as soon as I can!

This issue is apparently VERY common in the last few years - there have been many CRD little cars written off by a bad tank of fuel. For example a Volkswagen diesel's fuel system costs $10k to rebuild. On a car worth $20k it's not really economical to do!

[Captain_Rightfoot]

The TD5 has unit injectors, the unit injectors are a self contained high pressure pump injector and solenoid. There is no common rail in a TD5. The PUMA on the otehr hand operates at twice the pressure than the TD5, and has a high pressure continuous duty pump - a rail to store the pressure, and piezo electric injectors. They are very different technologies. The TD5 can cope with much more water than a CRD.

Having said that - I'm sticking in a R445-2 into my TD5 as soon as I can!

This issue is apparently VERY common in the last few years - there have been many CRD little cars written off by a bad tank of fuel. For example a Volkswagen diesel's fuel system costs $10k to rebuild. On a car worth $20k it's not really economical to do!
Well that's interesting because I've always known the td5 to be common rail. Interestingly the td5 is sited as an example of common rail on the wiki common rail page. I checked the LR documentation and they describe it as a "Direct Injection Diesel" so looks like I've learnt something today. As has been said it does contain a common rail with high pressure fuel but then the injectors themselves amplify the pressure.

It's interesting though that it handles water better.. that's a bonus. :)

[Scallops]

It's interesting though that it handles water better.. that's a bonus. :)

Come on, Captain :D - don't be scared by a little water - you now have yet another reason to trade up to the newer technology CRD Puma, with all it's fuel issues, vac pump issues, diff issues, prop shaft issues... :p

[BilboBoggles]

Problem with water is that if it sits in the TD5 injector - or the PUMA common rail for any length of time - the insides rust. The rust then flakes off into the fuel and acts as an abrasive to the injectors. On a TD5 - I assume because the only place it's pumped is in the fuel tank, and within the plunger of the injector there is much less chance for issues. But I have no doubt that water in a TD5 will cause the injectors to wear at a much faster rate. It's just that because a PUMA has incredibly close tolerances, and extreme pressure and there are more moving parts in a PUMA fuel system - it's destruction rate is near vertical.

[Chucaro]

Why are you going to invest $ 300 on the Racor filter when you can get the CAV-Delphi filters for $ 69.00 :confused:
I have experience with the CAV-Delphi and I can telling you that it is among the best.
Have a look HERE (http://www.oztion.com.au/vshops/item.aspx?itemid=7776192&shopid=453&tid=)

Cheers

[spudboy]

Chucaro - what extra fittings etc do you need to organise to fit that CAV filter? Do you just cut the line between the fuel pump and the existing filter, and crimp on some fittings?

I haven't crawled under to check on the Puma, but on the TD5 there were 2 lines going from the fuel pump to the filter (and back again?). Would you just be installing it on the line flowing from the pump to the filter? How do I work out which one to cut (if that's how you do it)?

Thanks
David

[Chucaro]

Chucaro - what extra fittings etc do you need to organise to fit that CAV filter? Do you just cut the line between the fuel pump and the existing filter, and crimp on some fittings?

I haven't crawled under to check on the Puma, but on the TD5 there were 2 lines going from the fuel pump to the filter (and back again?). Would you just be installing it on the line flowing from the pump to the filter? How do I work out which one to cut (if that's how you do it)?

Thanks
David

You can go both ways, fitting an extra filter between the tank and the original filter or you can fit a Hi-Flow fuel filter adapter which fits where is the factory filter is but with the advantage of having a cheap replacement filter and also a sediment glass bow.

If you are worried about the quality of the fuel then fit both options.

The info about the Hi-Flow and contact details is HERE (http://www.hiflo.com.au/docs/101008A%20filtration.pdf)

Cheers

[spudboy]

So, just to restate what I think you have said:

Start by replacing the std LR filter with a HiFlow fuel filter adaptor, so you can use the CAV filters with the glass sediment meter
If you have bad fuel in your area, add an extra pre-filter before the std filter using the $69 filter in your earlier post, cutting the fuel lines to do so.
If you have the dual filters, make the first one (say) 30 micron, and the second one (say) 6 micron.
Is that about it?

Sounds like a pretty cheap insurance policy if the Puma engines are going to be so particular about the fuel that goes through.

[Chucaro]

In the Tdi and Td5 engine a 6 microns would be Ok
On the Puma or an engine with a common rail system the second filter or lastone on the line have to be 2 micron.
If you cannot get a Delphi in 2 micron in your area look for the Stanadyne 2 microns of equivelent size that it is very good as well.
Donaldson is anm excellent brand as well. We used their air filtration from them on the rice farms equipment and performed excellent.

Cheers

[BilboBoggles]

Just a word of warning - Before you touch the factory filter - confirm with Land Rover that they would allow you to do this on a PUMA. My understanding is that removing or altering the factory filter will cause you all sorts of grief with Warranty. However if you put extra filters inline BERFORE the factory filter - then they would have little ability to refuse warranty. So my recommendation will be to add a decent filter BEFORE the factory filter. Leave the factory filter alone, or you'll end up in endless arguments with LR if there is a warranty issue on your engine.

[BilboBoggles]

Based on some Goodle research the $300 Racor filter has a 2 micron element - but more importantly the filter element ($80) is treated to repell water. This means that even if you fill it up with water it won't let water through and will instead block. Other filter media could allow some water through if the filter is flooded. To be honest - $300 sounds awesomely cheap compared to the possible $10k bill I am being quoted.

[Psimpson7]

In the Tdi and Td5 engine a 6 microns would be Ok
Cheers

The standard TD5 fuel filter will stop particles in the 3-5 micron range so if you are just running a seperate filter I would want it to be in that range or better.

I agree with BB's comments about messing with the factory setup as with these issues I am sure they would only be too happy to have a way out!

[BilboBoggles]

If the TD5 filter is only 3-5 micron, then that's a big issue for the PUMA - it's the same filter!. CRD's need a 2 micron filter. So that is a significant worry!

[Chucaro]

Stanadyne have a good fuel manager system with the recommended filters for primary and final filters.

Info can be read HERE (http://www.btlrus.com/99889%20Fuel%20Manager%20Brochure.pdf)

Cheers

[Psimpson7]

Is it the same fuel filter on the Puma and TD5 then BB?

To my knowledge:

Puma fuel filer is WJI500040

TD5 is ESR4686

[Pedro_The_Swift]

can we do pics of the two elements?

[BilboBoggles]

Ok - I was told that it was the same filter by the dealer - thanks for clarifying - I guess the PUMA one is hopefully a better filter.

[Psimpson7]

BB,

Yes it is different.

The Puma one looks to be 2micron.

Rgds
Pete

[dullbird]

I was told by an independent garage to be very careful introducing EXTRA filters into the fuel line as you can in fact reduce fuel flow which is not good in the PUMA which is supposed to be a more precision fuel setup.

I'am how ever looking into changing the filter for the one with the glass bowl on the bottom.....but I will be putting my case forward to Land rover them selves and asking permission. there is NO WAY I'm touching anything on my fuel line without their permission I can't afford warranty to be void in that area. Not with the problems I have had:(

[solmanic]

I wasn't even game to relocate my fuel tank breather myself. I let the dealer do it despite the fact that it is a simple job.

[Chucaro]

I was told by an independent garage to be very careful introducing EXTRA filters into the fuel line as you can in fact reduce fuel flow which is not good in the PUMA which is supposed to be a more precision fuel setup.

I'am how ever looking into changing the filter for the one with the glass bowl on the bottom.....but I will be putting my case forward to Land rover them selves and asking permission. there is NO WAY I'm touching anything on my fuel line without their permission I can't afford warranty to be void in that area. Not with the problems I have had:(

What you are doing is correct and if LR say NO and your vehicle have water problems or other contamination which are as a result of bad filtration by a report of one or two diesel filtration specialist, then LR is in trouble.

My sugestions are for vehicles which are out of warranty.

Cheers

[dullbird]

What you are doing is correct and if LR say NO and your vehicle have water problems or other contamination which are as a result of bad filtration by a report of one or two diesel filtration specialist, then LR is in trouble.


My sugestions are for vehicles which are out of warranty.Cheers

Sure that fair enough....BUT you have had two PUMA owners reply about it in a PUMA thread (and you dont specify for out of warranty cars) one saying its a good insurance policy and the other saying dont touch the factory filter but put it in before!

IMHO I wouldn't touch anything on the fuel line or engine, I would say is a big no no....WHY because people have been refused warranty because accessories being fitted....they would have a field day if you started introducing things like filters.

Just my 2c:)

Not having a shot Chacaro:) Just don't want unsuspecting PUMA owner to come in thinking its sound advice for the PUMA without looking into it first, and getting them selves into strife with warranty

[87County]

Just one more thing with the Defender....if your heart is in it but you are not made of stern stuff then don't buy one. It's a gamble so you have to take responsibility for the decision you make. If not buy a push bike.

yes mate, it does help if you are an enthusiast, and there's plenty of pajeros and camrys around if you're not :)

[Chucaro]

If I am not wrong I have read in one of the threads that LR believe that the water contamination was not a problem of LR but of the owner to do not take care about the vehicle.
If it is proved that the design is wrong because water bypass the filtration system, what are the owners rights to avoid future problems?
Is the owner prepared to do further damage to the vehicle because LR take their time in come with a responce?
Can the owner of the vehicle afford to not use the vehicle until the problem is resolved.
I believe that if the filtration is well designed with a sensor on the water trap then there will be no problems with the vehicle.
Cheers

[roverrescue]

Filter away but be a little wary of the "glass" bowl filters like on the Delphi units... Ive had them break as in break into little pieces on the boat with no real impact. The RACOR bowls are some type of UV stabilised plastic and would probably be a better bet but if the unit is in the wheel arch (TD5 style) I would go with an aluminium bowl just for stone protection. Still easy to empty and clean and you can still use a water alarm on them.

Just my thoughts.

S

[sashadidi]

I asked what their attitude would be if I used an extra filter in the line as I have two years warranty left and this was the reply, Not sure if it means that as I have taken precautions and relocated the breather up high(to Windscreen height at the front) that they will admit a warranty problem? as i have take all precautions ?
:


Hi Simon,

Yes there has been some cases with water ingress into the fuel tank
because of the location of the breather and we have had to relocate the
position of the breather.
In regards to an additional fuel filter, it would not be recommended.
Land Rover would not be responsible for any repair or replacement caused
by any modification which is not authorised by Land Rover.

Kind regards
Tommy Olliver
Service Advisor

[sashadidi]

Maybe we should all use when filling up espically on out of town gas station sand farm fuel tanks etc
Racor Fuel Filter Funnel (http://www.maesco.com/products/racor/r_funnel/r_funnel.html) :)

[BilboBoggles]

...

[specwarop]

Any more news or info on this subject?

[BilboBoggles]

Any more news or info on this subject?

A blast from the past. Land rover eventually covered it under warranty, and also did a mod on the breather, did another 80,000 ks on it before trading it in on a new one...

[specwarop]

So are you going to install extra filters to the new one, does LR still good the warranty if you do?

[jimb]

Local land rover mechanic made me buy a defendoor thing - plastic cap over whole fuel cap area. He explained he'd seen so many pumas with water in tank, and his theory was the key locking cap is rooted. That water goes in through the lock quite easily.

I bought a new old school cap with no
Lock after losing 2 of the defendor plates

[BilboBoggles]

The only problem on mine was the location of the breather. Once that was fixed I had no more water in the fuel - I did have the filter checked every 5,000k's to be sure. I never bothered with the additional filter, as I was worried about it affecting my warranty. I've sold that MY09 now.

[RobnJane]

Does the relocation of the breather include anything more than simply extending the hose to a higher point. Our car came with the LRA sill tank and it transfers fuel to a point just above where the breather hose is fitted, so we see a little leakage when transferring.

I will extend the breather tube, but would like to know whether there is more to the breather 'fix'

Thanks.

Rob

[BilboBoggles]

The breather ran up behind the splash shield for the wiring. Personally if I were doing mine I would extend to the snorkel with an inline fuel filter or something like that.