Air suspension auto lower

[rmp]

What's your view....

[WhiteD3]

More control is what's needed. Another 10kph in off road height and the option to manually select extended and super extended.

[B2D3]

I would like auto-height control with another 20kph on off-road speed AND I would like ability to control manually as well.

[Tote]

another 10K and modify the lowering bing so that it only warns you once that you need to slow down.

[mcmanusd]

I agree that more control is what's needed.
I believe that somewhere from 60kph to 80kph in off road height.
DEFINITELY the option to manually select extended and super extended even if that is only for limited speeds of up to say 10 or 20kph.
Ideally all of these settings should be configurable in some way ie.
like the driver overspeed alert.
The (computer in the) car should be smart enough to adjust DSC to suit your settings.

[Timj]

I think that the speed they have set it to is way too Nanny State but I can understand that they want it to lower at some speed rather than allowing us to control it manually. So I would say give me up to 80kph and I would probably be happy. I believe it would still be quite safe at that speed.

And yes I would like to be able to manually select the extended modes. Makes sense to select them before you get stuck.

So that doesn't quite fit the poll does it so I will go for full manual control.

CaverD3 how is the manual control stuff coming along?

[rocmic]

I'm a bit like Timj - it probably does have to lower at some speed, but 50 km/h is too low. It would also be nice to manually select extended mode
Mike

[rmp]

What I want to know is who voted for it being perfect the way it is, and why.

I'm of the view it should be the same as the Touareg; complete manual control over all modes, auto-lower at 70kmph for offroad, auto-lower at 20 for Extended. If VW can get it right why not Land Rover.

[AnD3rew]

Agree with most others, lowers too early, there are plenty of tracks where you can easily do 60K if it is dry, but there is a hump in the middle and you want to make sure there are no nasty bumps if you come across abit with a rock or slightly deeper ruts unexpectedly.

I also agree that it should probably lower at some point in case you just forget when you get back on the road but probably around 60-65 would be good.

Also agree on the need to manually select extend and super extend, I would prefer not to ground my vehicle in teh first place thank you very much.

Also need to be able to use the remote to control access height without the stupidity of having to have the warning lights on first which makes the ability to do this useless. You want to be able to lower it as you approach the vehicle with the load.

[camel_landy]

Personally, I think that most of the modes are fine WRT suspension height. However, the ability to keep the suspension raised in sand mode while making a little bit more progress would be useful.

M

[rmp]

I think if LR extended the auto-lower in one mode, eg Sand, then everyone would be using that mode for the sort of terrain described by AnD3rew and that's not ideal. Making it 70 in all modes except General would be ok with me.
Good to see an opposing view.

The big misconception is that people need to drive at 50+ with the suspension raised in order to clear obstacles while at 50. That is not the case. It is for those common situations where the terrain varies from good enough to do 50 back to slow-right-down-rough that is the problem, and why be distracted with chimes and needing to re-raise it?

Probably the only time you'd need offroad height at speed is sand.

And I just don't follow why the driver can't be given the choice to move the car into Extended manually.

[AnD3rew]

I also note from the manual that the vehicle will automatically lower when you reach 160kph.

Now I will never do 160kph in my TDV6, I don't know about you, but if there are fuel consumption and or cornering/handling advantages to this at 160 (I presume there must be some advantage) then why would you not also have the option of manually selecting this for 100+ too?

[camel_landy]

WRT Extended... Let's face it, if there was the option, people would just blindly select it and then whinge when they kept on breaking things. (Remember that extended is pushing things outside of the comfort zone for the car).

As for the other settings. Well, the engineers spend a long time 'tuning' so there's usually a reason for most things.

M

[rmp]

When the vehicle is in a mode other than Normal the wheel alignment, particularly the camber, changes and with it the handling and tyre wear. At low speeds and for short durations it doesn't matter. At 160kmph for more than some time (check your manual) it lowers 20mm from Normal and will raise again to Normal as speed drops. I suspect this is due to wanting to lower the CoG at speed which would take precedence over tyre wear issues, but it may also be for aerodynamic reasons. Either way it's kind of a moot point for touring D3 owners. For Sport owners who do trackwork different story of course ;-)

The D3 would handle better if it was -20mm off Normal all the time, and was designed that way.....but then it'd be lower, of course! Would you like a Normal mode 20mm lower than what it is now? The wheel alignment can only be set properly for one height, until such time as Land Rover come out with really variable suspension.

Those running with mods such as lengthened rods should have their cars re-aligned at the new height so as not to compromise handling or tyre wear.

[rmp]

WRT Extended... Let's face it, if there was the option, people would just blindly select it and then whinge when they kept on breaking things. (Remember that extended is pushing things outside of the comfort zone for the car).

As for the other settings. Well, the engineers spend a long time 'tuning' so there's usually a reason for most things.

M

That is true, but things can be broken anyway and may be broken *because* there is no manual override.

Reasons for most things...agree of course. There are excellent reasons why the D3's suspension setup is the way it is, but there are other, equally excellent reasons to have it a different way. Each to their own, but the Land Rover engineers get the casting vote and they vote for the majority of owners, who aren't offroading Aussies.

Interestingly I noticed in that the how-to-drive-offroad info has been deleted from the D3 manual, probably after litigation fears. It was there in 2005 or thereabouts.

[camel_landy]

Each to their own, but the Land Rover engineers get the casting vote and they vote for the majority of owners, who aren't offroading Aussies.

Absolutely, in a commercial world, it makes sense to go with the majority vote. However... You can rest assured that the cars are tested at speed, on dirt.

M

[rob4play]

On recent trip to Birdsville from Gold Coast via Immaninka and Walkers Crossing had the following experience. ( relevant as all about suspension height)
Still on Walkers Crossing towing the camper trailer chimes, alarms and LCD message - special programmes fault, special programmes turned off, suspension lowered. Turn off start up and fine for around 2k then same again.
Did not realise really till I got on the straighter esctions but wheel alignment way out steering wheel at around 40 degrees off for straight ahead. Later on the hoist at Birdsville found the adjustment bolts etc took hardly any effort to turn so suspect not tightened sufficiantly after new tyres fitted. Anyway after all the palaver with roadside assist (covered to take the vehicle on truck back to nearest dealer etc etc) decided to have a play as did not want to take that option or drive mostly in low access height towing the trailer. Worked out that while it was still working raise to off road height or drive height and pull the 20A fuse for the compresser. At approx 2k the fault would come up but could not lower. Brilliant - I could still play over Big Red and continue the trip. Big Red was a doddle with no special programmes at all Cooper LTZs at 20psi and just hi range 3rd and 2nd locked at any speed in off road height. Couldn't hear the periodic chimes after a while. Next day for the trip back east performed the same routine with trailer hitched up let the suspension self level etc then pulled the fuse again.
As suspected a rough wheel alignment was all it needed in Roma to fix the problem. The steering angle sensor would have been indicating a constant right turn I guess and confusing the system. So - do I now just fit a toggle switch to simulate pulling the fuse for those odd occasions I want to lock in at off road height? Pretty tempting. Seems a lot simpler than the modified sensor arms etc for the odd time I would want to stay at that height at the higher speeds. Our dealer service manager had a good laugh when told of our temporary fix. Wear and tear on the front tyres a bit savage though.

[rmp]

Love the idea of pulling a fuse. Did it still chime though?

When a vehicle with stability control (ESC) -- such as the D3 -- hits a bump and ends up with misaligned front steering it causes a problem. This is because the ESC looks at where the steering wheel is turned, and what the car is doing. It then tries to help you turn the car and regain control by differential braking and/or cutting the throttle. Having the steering wheel permanently off centre will indeed confuse it. I don't know about the D3, but other cars will realise there is something amiss after a short while and entirely shut down the ESC.

[rob4play]

Sure did chime but after a while tuned that out. All special programmes were turned off and I guess that meant ESC but quite frankly mine in that condition handled Big Red much more easily than the other 2 TDV6s which were fully functional. Sure the bigger Cooper LTZs played a fair part in that but would be really interesting to be able to manually turn off the special programmes as it did with this fault (no lights showing for any mode at all on the terrain response rotary switch) and see just how well they still perform off road. Incidently even with the wheel alignment issue off road height at 100knh on the way back to Birdsville was just fine. Obviously it all comes down to common sense when cornering etc and it handled much more like your basic high set 4WD without all the interference. Still that was sand where really it is more a question of momentum and tyre pressure than very slippery conditions when the electronics come into their own. Still I have more confidence in the vehicle now given how well it went with none of that operating than I had before.
Incidently and a bit off topic but one of the other brand new TDV6s blew a heater hose as it was not secured back to a bracket on top of the engine as the others were and consistent rough ground saw it contacting the fan till it wore a big hole. Still we had all the spares, coolant etc so no drama.

[rmp]

Terrain Response is always active, the TR settings are just special versions of it, presets if you like. Therefore, the car was still working. ESC is kind of seperate to TR, but TR settings do affect ESC. You can "disable" ESC and TR will still work, although most disable switches do not actually disable, just de-sensitise.

[Graeme]

rob4play,
I had wondered if removing the fuse would cause other problems perhaps such as an enforced 50kph speed limit. Not yet owing a D3/4 I couldn't test it (was going to) but if its only the chimes then that's a great solution for at least a faulty system but maybe more.

[rob4play]

As everything is back to normal now I will pull it and try today - other than leaving some fault codes etc in the system maybe, should not be a problem. Will let you know the result.

[rob4play]

Okay so turned on, raised to off road height, turned off and pulled the 20A compresser fuse.
Turned on and as expected suspension fault light lit and no special programmes available as they do control suspension height as well. Obviously still a bit of a mystery as to just what is still working and at what sensitivity.
Drive off and get the chime as you exceed 30kmh then periodically telling you to slow down to 30Kmh which altogether not such a bad thing as it reminds you especially at higher speeds that you wil not have the usual good handling performance etc.
Drove around 5km up steep hills down, tight corners through mud in the back yard bush section and all great.
Just need to try somewhere where wheel slip is a real problem to see what happens. Obviously Big Red and sand driving is not an issue. However I would suggest that you would only use this in an emergency and as others have said for higher speed sand/dune driving. On all the other rough driving to Immaninka, Walkers Crossing etc normal drive height even fully loaded with heavy camper trailer in tow was fine.
So for me where I would see myself wanting to stay at that height above the Landrover designed and allowed speed this solution works and if it becomes a regular requirement might just fit a toggle switch in the line somewhere to make it more accessible, hardly difficult. Obviously though when you take it in for a service it will be registering the suspension faults. When used only for sand driving the wheel alignment difference is really not going to incur excessive tyre wear in my opinion. The speed set by Landrover I would think is purely a safety and compromise issue to ensure the DSC etc operates at its maximum effectiveness for high speed driving where it is most needed and where the majority of these vehicles sold operate. However lets not forget we all used to drive quite happily, though of course more uncomfortably and less safely before it became almost standard on all vehicles. Takes you back to more though, right ratio, right gear selection etc. using the command shift is awesome allowing you to run at the higher gear and speed then when running out of torque simply change, sometimes trying to do this in a manual especially deep sand uphill etc is extremely difficult to get just right so no loss of momentum is experianced. Over Big Red another non landrover vehicle but manual 4WD experienced just that and really relied on right gear to start with to maintain sufficient torque and speed to get over without excessive wheel spin resulting in bogging.
Go the D3 just keeps getting better for me and for those moving to the more powerful again D4 - wow

[Graeme]

Thanks Rob.
I've certainly experienced the wrong gear scenario in my manual TD5 D2 on Hay River & Madigan trips.
I was getting a D3 but have since ordered a D4. I want to be able to continue to drive without being on the bump stops if a fault occurs, and I have a WIP for raised height at the flick of a switch that is waiting to be tested.

[drivesafe]

My old 03 Range Rover was set to warn to lower at 50 kph but it did not automatically lower if you drove faster.

On two occasions, both on the Lions Road, through the Border Range, I had been off road in a good train video location and had come back onto the black stuff and thumped the RR to get to the next location before the train did.

Twice I forgot to lower on the way out of the scrub and was at a pretty good speed when I got the warning bong just as I entered some tight turns.

The RR handles a lot safer than the D3 and it still scared the *****e out of me and I would NOT like to have tried the same thing with my D3.

For safety sake for those not so experienced, leave the settings as is.

[Graeme]

I can't imagine that a D3 lifted 50mm could be as nearly as changed as a D2 with its ACE bars unlocked, which is still much better than my RRC with no bars.