Engine Idle Sound - Puma

[CapeLandy]

Do you guys have this rattle sound at idle once fully warmed.
Sounds like an intermittent combustion rattle but is not always there. It is less when I am running 200ml of two stroke oil in the diesel.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v427/Landy1973/th_MVI_3277.jpg

[Grockle]

Could be the piston jets sticking.

[CapeLandy]

sounds quite high up in the chamber. Are the jets near the top?

[dullbird]

I can't make the sound out as it sounds like you have wind noise in your camera when filming like your standing to close to the fan or something

[BilboBoggles]

Whatever you don't mention the 2 stroke oil to Land Rover! Only thing I can hear is a slight unevenness to the idle. Mine started doing this due to a contamination. If you raise the revs to 1000RPM does it surge?

[TimNZ]

Form the video its a bit hard to tell, but sounds ok. My 110 tends to differ in noise depending on where I buy fuel. Is it quieter if the clutch is depressed, (could be the clutch rattling)? Also after the engine reaches about 54degC the EGR valve starts to operate which could make it sound noiser.

Tim

[PAT303]

I think all of you should get used to common rail engines,the reason for alot of the noise in CM engines is because of the high injector pressure causes the fuel to burn rapidly,the advantage they have over other types,and that extra ''bang'' you get for a given amount of fuel is what makes the noise.All CM engines I have worked on have the distinctive rattle. Pat

[Huwmungus]

I agree with Pat- we have a variety of Common rail vehicles at work. Rangers, Colorados, Hilux's, land cruisers. They all "rattle" differently to old school diesels. It's just the way the newer motors are. I think a lot of "problems" with the Puma motor are just people unfamiliar with CR motors.

[dgardel]

Whatever you don't mention the 2 stroke oil to Land Rover! Only thing I can hear is a slight unevenness to the idle. Mine started doing this due to a contamination. If you raise the revs to 1000RPM does it surge?


Water Contaminetion? solution(s)?

Thanks

Daniele

[dullbird]

I agree with Pat- we have a variety of Common rail vehicles at work. Rangers, Colorados, Hilux's, land cruisers. They all "rattle" differently to old school diesels. It's just the way the newer motors are. I think a lot of "problems" with the Puma motor are just people unfamiliar with CR motors.


not my problems unless you would consider 3 limp modes in one week normal for a common rail diesel:D.....2 of them on the same day!

Still i have always thought the puma sounded different.........I have also always thought this is what they sound like.

Still this is the first post I have seen complaining about what they sound like, so what other problems are you referring to that are common to moden day diesels? bad clutch? failing vacuum pumps? failing diffs? turbo heat shield bolts falling out water contamination due to poorly placed components, faulty EGR........These are some of the most common faults and things I hear people complain about I wouldn't say that these are all due to people not knowing what a common rail diesel sounds like.:)

[PAT303]

Yeh,you should have bought a Toyota Dullbird,my hilux went back to the dealer 6 times in the 1 year I had it,it had two more sleepovers after they found more faults doing the first 6,and it rattle like it had no oil most mornings and my left arm is stronger than my right because like all tojo's it pulls to the left something terrible.I won't bore you with the trouble the two POS troopy's had or the Prado or the stupid bl*&dy coaster bus. Pat

[dullbird]

Yeh,you should have bought a Toyota Dullbird,my hilux went back to the dealer 6 times in the 1 year I had it,it had two more sleepovers after they found more faults doing the first 6,and it rattle like it had no oil most mornings and my left arm is stronger than my right because like all tojo's it pulls to the left something terrible.I won't bore you with the trouble the two POS troopy's had or the Prado or the stupid bl*&dy coaster bus. Pat

hey pat ours pulls hard to the left also perhaps this is also a common fault of a common rail diesel :D.......

Pat I dont deny other newer models have problems also.....but for it to be suggested that our "problems" are because we don't know common rail diesels I find to be honest a little insulting...

I some times feel the brand honour is just a little bit to much, to the point where I feel sometimes we are not even believed we have problems with our cars.......just because others have worked on them type of engines does not mean we don't have issues.

I'm afraid we DO have issues...not all but some. I wish sometimes people would just do us a favour and stop making it out that its our fault or our lack of knowledge and understanding of how common rails work as to why we have these issues.

It can sometimes get even more disheartening when you have troubles with the car and then feel you have to battle with your own fellow landy owners that we all come to for support just to prove we have issues because we are not believed. Makes those troubles we have just that little bit worse.

Oh and just so there is no confusion I'm not just talking about this thread but many many other where people have gone out of there way just to try and prove us wrong :no2:

so when I say our etc I'm meaning in a collective term not just me.

[CapeLandy]

I did have water contamination but only in the fuelk tank and a little in the filter but not enough to carry through I hope.

The wind sound I did not notice while recording but must have been caused by the fan draught.

It makes no difference clutch in or out but I also have I think another broken clutch but that is heared driving in gear at low idle revs.

This engine idle noise is only sometimes evident and varies as to when it occurs other than it must be a little warm before it hapens. Never when cold.

The best way to describe it is a rrrrrrr pause rrrrrrrrr pause rrrrrrrrrr at idle and dissapears when you rev up even slightly above idle.

Maybe I just have to live with it. Was never there from new which makes me think "problem brewing"

[PAT303]

hey pat ours pulls hard to the left also perhaps this is also a common fault of a common rail diesel :D.......

Pat I dont deny other newer models have problems also.....but for it to be suggested that our "problems" are because we don't know common rail diesels I find to be honest a little insulting...

I some times feel the brand honour is just a little bit to much, to the point where I feel sometimes we are not even believed we have problems with our cars.......just because others have worked on them type of engines does not mean we don't have issues.

I'm afraid we DO have issues...not all but some. I wish sometimes people would just do us a favour and stop making it out that its our fault or our lack of knowledge and understanding of how common rails work as to why we have these issues.

It can sometimes get even more disheartening when you have troubles with the car and then feel you have to battle with your own fellow landy owners that we all come to for support just to prove we have issues because we are not believed. Makes those troubles we have just that little bit worse.

Oh and just so there is no confusion I'm not just talking about this thread but many many other where people have gone out of there way just to try and prove us wrong :no2:

so when I say our etc I'm meaning in a collective term not just me.

No one is saying that haven't had your share of troubles but you are taking advice from dealers who I know for a fact tell BS to satisfy customers.All CM engines rattle,thats what they do and looking through other forums everyone is complaining about it but everyone has to get used to it.The biggest problem with dealers is they don't find the problem with vehicles they simply replace parts hopeing it fix's it.You fall into that area. Pat

[dullbird]

No one is saying that haven't had your share of troubles but
you are taking advice from dealers who I know for a fact tell BS to satisfy customers.
All CM engines rattle,thats what they do and looking through other forums everyone is complaining about it but everyone has to get used to it.The biggest problem with dealers is they don't find the problem with vehicles they simply replace parts hopeing it fix's it.You fall into that area. Pat

What advice is that then PAT?

as said above do they all go into limp home mode on a regular basis...????

I'm starting to think you only read what you want pat

[Huwmungus]

not my problems unless you would consider 3 limp modes in one week normal for a common rail diesel:D.....2 of them on the same day!

Still i have always thought the puma sounded different.........I have also always thought this is what they sound like.

Still this is the first post I have seen complaining about what they sound like, so what other problems are you referring to that are common to moden day diesels? bad clutch? failing vacuum pumps? failing diffs? turbo heat shield bolts falling out water contamination due to poorly placed components, faulty EGR........These are some of the most common faults and things I hear people complain about I wouldn't say that these are all due to people not knowing what a common rail diesel sounds like.:)

No, I was only refering to the "rattle" I've heard mentioned on here a few times. I'm aware that they have their other issues. I'm sorry if I offended anyone, just trying to help by saying that CR diesels do sound different to old school diesels (and seem to change their note from time to time - or at least my work Ranger does). Hopefully there are many more good stories about the pumas out there - its just you don't hear many. (Like Falcon XR6's - I've got one and can't fault it, but they all have bad diffs and gearbox's full of water apparently!)

[Grockle]

sounds quite high up in the chamber. Are the jets near the top?

Sticking cooling jets will cause premature bore wear and cause an audible knock.

[CapeLandy]

It's definately not a knock - but on advise from all here it seems to be ok for a commonrail. Thanks for putting my mind at rest.

I drive a D4D at work and I have a terible knocking when cold and on start up which lasts for about 8 minutes of driving.

[CapeLandy]

Another thought that crossed my mind. Reading the water related posts in DB's thread regarding engine knock etc.

I was wondering if I may have slight water errosion on the injectors as detailed in an article on the CR's. My filter had a lot of silt and a little water before relocating the breather after a long wet trip on dirt roads. The article stated that if the filter was blocked the suction could draw up some of the water sitting in the bottom.

How do I convince LR to buy that theory and can injectors be removed and tested for this cheaply?
If LR were not interested could I get an independent diesel injector shop to at least remove one injector, test it and then I could take it and a report to LR to get them to change all if it proved to be leaking.

Long shot maybe???

[dullbird]

If you had water contamination....and the garage was aware of it your fuel system should of been cleaned!! all the way to the injectors.

If you never made the garage aware I reckon you don't have a hope in hell. IMHO

[CapeLandy]

They were aware and removed the fuel tank and cleaned that and replaced the filter. Never went any further though because the sample had less than 40 cc acording to the TB.

[dullbird]

oh ok yeah that's right they followed the service bulletin then.

[CapeLandy]

and the water was not from the garage rather the breather in the wheel arch.
I have since relocated it and run a hose up into the cabin and coiled it round a few times. No fumes inside at all but safe in the knowledge that it won't happen again.

[dullbird]

and the water was not from the garage rather the breather in the wheel arch.
I have since relocated it and run a hose up into the cabin and coiled it round a few times. No fumes inside at all but safe in the knowledge that it won't happen again.

yep so was ours........it was only suggested by the garage this is where the water came from until we realised that the breather was hanging directly over the back wheel and the water and engine light actually occured in the highest rainfall for feb in something like 70years