D4 rims and second battery

[gghaggis]

Well, I had a new RRS 3.0 ltr for the day, and took the opportunity to see what issues there were with trying to fit smaller rims than the std 19".

Neither the LR or the Dynamic 17" rims fit (but I didn't expect them to).

There was some conjecture on a UK site that the Avanti Photon 18" rims might fit. Unfortunately, these are no longer in production, so I couldn't get any to try. However, the state distributor for GMAX was sure he had one that would fit, so he came down to the workshop with a couple of sample rims. They didn't fit :(

The 3 Ltr calipers have several protruding 'fins' that just scraped the inside of the GMAX rim. Apparently this is part of the 'top-down' design approach that reduces the requirement for a hoist - you can easily check the pad wear with the wheel on.

GMAX did say they make an 18" that is slightly larger internally, but it's load-rating wouldn't be suitable for either the D4 or the RRS. They are going to get me a price on a special-order rim, but I imagine that would be costly, and they'll require a minimum order of 15 sets.

A forged rim might fit (as the casing is thinner), so they're looking around for those as well.

Compomotive also got back to me in regard to their 18" rim. They apparently now no longer sell them direct, so they have to be ordered through Bowler in the UK. Another expensive option, and there is still no guarantee that they'd fit - although they should, as the 3 Ltr doesn't have the anti-vibration lug sticking out that the Supercharged RRS did. Bowler haven't yet replied to my email.

One option I didn't try was the BMW X5 18" rim. The dealer here has a second-hand one in his yard, so I'll try and pester him into trying it on one of his demo D4's.

As there's no room in the second battery compartment any more, I tried placing an Optima Yellowtop battery in front of the factory one - it just fits (and the terminals clear the bonnet), but will obviously need a custom mounting plate made.

Gotta love that engine though. What a rush, especially in 'sport' mode :twisted:

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

What apeared to be the purpose of the fins on the callipers (perhaps cooling?), and could they be physically reduced to avoid scraping?
TIA.

[gghaggis]

They don't seem to have any purpose other than aesthetics - maybe they allow easier access to the pads?

I'm sure you could grind them down 2 ~ 3 mm, but the warranty implications would scare me off that path. I should know more about the alternative rims next week.

Cheers,

Gordon

[sniegy]

The "Fins" are for cooling as the caliper is made from Aluminium or a mix of & as some have seen they are huge. So all the cooling will be required.
When u drive this 3.0Ltr & then see how it stops you will understand why.
As Gordon has said it is a rush..The term "Permagrin" just doesnt cut it anymore!;)

The transfer case ECU & Glow plug relay box are now situated in the Brake booster box in front of the driver. As Tim (Traxide) has suggested a tray will be required at some stage to bolt a battery to. The 2nd battery will have to sit in this position as there really is no other option for it to sit in the engine bay.


Graeme you will not be dissapointed, I promise.:D

[Graeme]

The "Fins" are for cooling as the caliper is made from Aluminium or a mix of & as some have seen they are huge. So all the cooling will be required.
When u drive this 3.0Ltr & then see how it stops you will understand why.

But, but, I still have at least a third of the pad material on the original front pads of my (albeit manual) D2 after 210k kms, and of course the original discs too. Those brakes might outlast the engine for country drivers like me!

[sniegy]

And the problem with that is;););););););););););)

[Bushwanderer]

SNIP
The transfer case ECU & Glow plug relay box are now situated in the Brake booster box in front of the driver. As Tim (Traxide) has suggested a tray will be required at some stage to bolt a battery to. The 2nd battery will have to sit in this position as there really is no other option for it to sit in the engine bay.
SNIP

And where would this tray be located (in place of the FBH on cold climate models?) ?

TIA,
Peter

[sniegy]

Peter,
That would be the place..Ooops, as our vehicles dont come with the FBH. There are a couple of pre-production vehicles here with this as seen on the launch & drive days.
But generally our vehicles will not come with the Fuel Burning Heater.
Our cold climate pack (On D4) only consists or Heated windscreen, Front seats & 2nd row outers, Steering wheel & Washer fluid. (Yes u did read correctly!):p
So i can see some people making trays for the battery to sit in this position.:D
Cheeers.

[drivesafe]

As Tim (Traxide) has suggested a tray will be required at some stage to bolt a battery to. The 2nd battery will have to sit in this position as there really is no other option for it to sit in the engine bay.

Yep, working on both a tray where the FBH would normally be mounted. This location still means using a small battery ( Optima D34, 55 A/H battery ).

I’m also working on another option to allow for a much bigger battery.

[Graeme]

I’m also working on another option to allow for a much bigger battery.
This sounds promising. I've been pondering the fate of my D2's 80Ah AGM that was destined for the D3 aux spot.

[drivesafe]

This sounds promising. I've been pondering the fate of my D2's 80Ah AGM that was destined for the D3 aux spot.

Hi Graeme, with the assistance of the boys at Bruce Lyntons, I am finishing off a kit for both the D3 and D4 for those wanting to charge batteries in a camper trailer or caravan and are NOT putting an auxiliary battery in their D3/D4 and the control module still goes in the same place in both models.

And thanks to a heads up from sniegy, I should have the under bonnet dual battery kit, including the tray, ready before Christmas ( I hope ).

The other in car option for a bigger battery is going to take a little longer and this kit will again fit both the D3 and D4.

[CaverD3]

Drivesafe, are you going to make a harness extension and move the modules?
I thought one of them was the alarm.:confused: If it is the transmission module they have moved it from behind the main battery. It would get wet when used in water crossings, but those who do water crossings will want a second battery.:twisted:

[drivesafe]

Drivesafe, are you going to make a harness extension and move the modules?

No, those modules were renowned for getting wet and causing problems where they were in the D3 and is the reason they have been moved into the auxiliary battery box in the D4.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

just gotta ask---

Fuel Burning Heater.

what fuel?

what countries?

Whats the point?
does it keep people? vehicle? warm?
overnight?

[CaverD3]

No, those modules were renowned for getting wet and causing problems where they were in the D3 and is the reason they have been moved into the auxiliary battery box in the D4.

As I said :D that would be why they moved it. That will protect it from jet washing the engine bay.
Makes more sense than the Alarm.
Lazy thinking on LRs part reducing the usability for outback touring.:( As with the 19 inch wheel issue as well.

[Jamo]

Pedro, The FBH is for the cold markets where they need to heat the fuel for diesels when they get too cold.

Beats lighting a fire under the engine.

[CaverD3]

Uses diesel to heat the water and hence the block. AFIK Quicker heat up in cold climates of engne and then cabin heater.

[Bushwanderer]

Oh dear, it looks like Jamo has spent too much time in the sun!:D

Caver is correct in that it heats the engine coolant, rather than the fuel, but only in cold climate models.

[drivesafe]

Quicker heat up in cold climates of engne and then cabin heater.

Yep that’s how my RR FBH works.

Didn't even know I had it until I stayed in Melbourne for a week or so and did a short trip to the local shops on a cold morning ( how unusual for Melbourne ) and when I parked and got out, I could smell diesel and thought it was a fuel leak till it was explained to me by Sniegy.:confused:

[roamer]

Hi Graeme, with the assistance of the boys at Bruce Lyntons, I am finishing off a kit for both the D3 and D4 for those wanting to charge batteries in a camper trailer or caravan and are NOT putting an auxiliary battery in their D3/D4 and the control module still goes in the same place in both models.

And thanks to a heads up from sniegy, I should have the under bonnet dual battery kit, including the tray, ready before Christmas ( I hope ).

The other in car option for a bigger battery is going to take a little longer and this kit will again fit both the D3 and D4.

Hi , Want to put second battery in my D4, to charge van & outlet for car fridge,would be delighted if you could let me know when controller & tray avail.
Noticed on your site that you pick up off main charger cable for outlets, I have wired separate cables for each is this O.K. ( separate C|B for each ) Also is there a reason for not twin cable (+ & - ) between batteries
Cheers Ken

[drivesafe]

Hi , Want to put second battery in my D4, to charge van & outlet for car fridge,would be delighted if you could let me know when controller & tray avail.
Noticed on your site that you pick up off main charger cable for outlets, I have wired separate cables for each is this O.K. ( separate C|B for each ) Also is there a reason for not twin cable (+ & - ) between batteries
Cheers Ken

Hi roamer, the kit is still some time off ( and so is Christmas ) and the D3/D4 comes with a battery earth stud in both battery compartments, so no need for a negative return.

[gghaggis]

Well, I just went and ordered a new RRS 3.0 ltr, :o

Won't be here until end of Feb (as I want the rear eDiff), so I have until then to locate a suitable 18" rim. I'm now talking to 4 different suppliers who are telling me they can "probably" supply, but have yet to give me firm specs on the rims.

The load rating for the RRS is a little lower than that for the D4, but if possible I'll be chasing the D4 spec'd rim. If anyone is interested in joining a group buy , please PM me so I can bolster my argument with numbers!

If and when a suitable rim is found, I'll start an official group-buy thread.

Cheers,

Gordon

[CaverD3]

Make sure they do a higher rated, rim tell them they will sell a lot more of them.:D
Remember the issue of legality in some states where the nuts have to be the same and need to tighten by at least the same number of turns.
You cannot modify the wheels but if the manufacturer does it......:angel:

[Graeme]

Sniegy showed me today in what way the D3 18" rims don't fit, and they don't fit over the front nor the rear callipers. The rims have less inteference over the front than the rear, whereby on the front the rim sits on the centering lip on the side opposite the calliper but is 3-4mm off the hub at the calliper, whereas the rear studs cannot be centred in the holes at all.

On both callipers, the portion of the calliper that is outside the disc has a raised back. I can't see the logic in this as the thinest and thus the weakest point is that above the disc and making the outer back thicker doesn't appear to achieve anything. The raised section could possibly be ground down by several mm, but it would be blatently obvious to a LR techo thus not an option whilst the vehicle is in warranty, without regard to any roadworthy issues.

As its not just a matter of removing a few mm from the cooling fins at the rear of the front callipers, for me the only option is a different rim.

[gghaggis]

I've just heard back from Bowler in the UK, and they're happy to supply the Compomotive PD1880 rim, although they haven't actually tried one on the D4 or new RRS 3.0 ltr. They are however, confident it will fit (but not on the new supercharged petrol) and are going to try it out in the next week or two.

They only cast as many as they have orders for. The next casting is in three weeks, which is probably a bit too soon for me to gather much interest (although as soon as I get a positive response to the fitment, I'll place my order). I'll find out when the next casting is due.

Cost is £194.16 each wheel, which at the moment works out to something like $1800AU, plus freight.

Maybe I should ask them to attach a Bowler Nemesis to the order :twisted: - hmm, think the wife might notice .........

Still to hear back from the other manufacturers.

Cheers,

Gordon

[gghaggis]

An update ....

Dynamic 4x4 are designing a new 18" steel wheel early in the New Year. I've passed on the size requirements for the 3.0 ltr TDV6 models, and they're going to try to incorporate them.

I should get confirmation on fitment from Bowler early next week. So there are possibly two solutions to the 18" rim dilemma. :)

Cheers,

Gordon

[rmp]

Good work Gordon, please keep us posted.

[gghaggis]

Have just heard back from GMAX. They have designed a new 18" rim, will be from forged aluminium. It will clear the calipers on a D4 or RRS 3.0 ltr, and will be of the appropriate load rating.

It's a 7-spoke design - they've sent me a picture, so I'll ask if I can post it up here. Cost will be around $2000 for a set of 5 (a bit exxy as it's forged), and they need a minimum of 15 orders. Any takers?

Cheers,

Gordon

[CaverD3]

$2000 for five isn't bad....how much are OEM 18"?

Well done Gordon. :BigThumb:

[Graeme]

More than 2 years ago my son paid $400 a rim for some Performance forged 17x7 rims for his Saab, so around the same price for a special job seems very good.

[rmp]

$2k / 5 is good for a custom build, a little above par for off-the-shelf.

Like most manufacturers Land Rover's rim prices are insane, to gouge the insurance market.

First, sit down.

Then take the figure of $1000+, depending on the rim.

Per rim.

Now multiply by five.

Ouch.

I would commend this deal to any D4 TDV6 owners.

[gghaggis]

I've posted up a PDF of the GMAX rim design over at disco3.co.uk - link is:

http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/use...18_rim.pdf (http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/10634/GMAX_18_rim.pdf)

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

That's quite a tame design - not too showy. I'm a little surprised that the spokes don't need to be more solid to take the required load and posisble abuse.

Will it use the std D4 nuts or tapered nuts with enough threads to comply with regulations? The holes don't look large enough for LR ones but maybe that's only a minor design detail.

Could you confirm its width and offset please?

Edit: Saw 18x8 in your Disco3 post. Also, not that it's prohibitive if excl, but is that price incl or excl of GST?

[gghaggis]

Hi Graeme,

I'm waiting for the offset information - the rim width is 8"

[edit] Oh - I already had the offset info - it's 45mm. Here's a picture of the real wheel (but the 20" version):

http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/10634/GMAX_forged_20.jpg

Cheers,

Gordon

[CaverD3]

Seem to leave a big gap between spokes for a rock to bend the rim?

I am sure being forged the load rating would e ok but impact resistance?

[gghaggis]

I've done that to an LR 17" rim, so yes, it would be possible. But being forged, the impact resistance will be higher too - the metal is less porous.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

What tyres that are sufficiently tougher or otherwise better than something in 19" like Pirelli ATR, or perhaps Continental Cross Contact AT if the sidewalls are any good, are going to make it worthwhile to get new 18" rims? Just going to the 18" version of a 19" tyre wont provide much justification for me, nor to a tyre that is renouned for weak sidewalls.

Currently my only real candidate is BFG-AT in 265/65-18, being medium agressiveness, not too wide, has tough sidewalls and the extra height would be useful for both ground clearance and longer footprint at lower pressures in sand. I understand that they can be noisy and some have found them slippery in the wet especially as they age, but I have no experience with them and they'd be worn out within 3 years anyway.

What will others use?

[Leo]

In 18" - the BFG AT, like you said, there's also the Cooper LTZ, Nitto Terra Grappler, various Bridgestones, Toyo, and Mickey Thompson and Kumho A/T and M/T tyres. The new Goodyear MTR with Kevlar is available in 18" as well.

You also get a taller sidewall and can lower the pressure a bit more than the stock 19" size.

[CaverD3]

And you get wheels which are less likely to get hit because they are an inch smaller (18") and if they do less likely to crack than the OEM 19" because they are forged.

[gghaggis]

In 18" - the BFG AT, like you said, there's also the Cooper LTZ, Nitto Terra Grappler, various Bridgestones, Toyo, and Mickey Thompson and Kumho A/T and M/T tyres. The new Goodyear MTR with Kevlar is available in 18" as well.

You also get a taller sidewall and can lower the pressure a bit more than the stock 19" size.

There's also AT's by Yokohama, Dunlop, ProComp and Hankook, and MT's by Maxxis, Hankook and Interco. The Continental CrossContact AT comes in both 18" and 19" versions.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

I would have MTRs with their Kevlar sidewalls as a winter/touring set if they were available in 255/60-18 or 265/60-18. I could decide to import them from the US in 265/65-18 although I'd rather run something all the time that's less aggressive but as strong and is available locally. However local availability often doesn't mean they're in stock and one could easily wait 3 months for the next shipment - been there several times.

I've had good success with GY Silent Armour in LT225/75-16 but their 265/60-18 only has a LI of 109 which I feel is too light for a loaded-up D3/4 on some of the very rocky outback tracks.

I haven't looked at the LR 19" rims but going by their other rims which I consider are forged, I would expect them to be forged too. This doesn't mean they wont crack given the appropriate treatment.

[Graeme]

Gordon,

It appears that the spokes of the proposed GMAX wheels protrude past the rim edge. If this is so, do you consider that the spokes could be susceptible to damage from rocks, either from scraping or the rear wheels from flying rocks? Spokes on LR rims don't protrude from what I can determine.

[gghaggis]

The photo is of the current forged 20", to show the spoke pattern 'in the flesh' - the diagrams are of the 18". I'll confirm with GMAX, but I don't think the 18" has protruding spokes.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

And thanks to a heads up from sniegy, I should have the under bonnet dual battery kit, including the tray, ready before Christmas ( I hope ).

The other in car option for a bigger battery is going to take a little longer and this kit will again fit both the D3 and D4.
Anything to report yet?
My 80AH AGM might be a bit tall at 9" to fit under the bonnet so I've been looking at the left rear guard where it could be stood on its end with appropriate brackets.

[Graeme]

After sucessfully mounting my 80ah AGM in front of the existing battery, I've decided it gets too hot and have removed it. Even though it was shielded from direct radiator and engine air, driving around in yestereday's 35C the battery became too hot to hold my hand against. I'll wait a little while to see if Drivesafe can devise a suitable bracket for the rear.

[CaverD3]

There is a blanking plate behind the 'air inlet' on the passenger side. I wonder if removing this would get some air flow?

[Graeme]

I thought about removing that plate initally but also thought it might draw out hot air past the battery. However, it can't be much worse so its probably worth a try in case it does the trick. Additionally if a suitable enclosure could be made for the battery, a small electric fan (ex computer?) could be placed over the hole which is right beside the battery to draw in cool air.
Maybe that position is not yet a lost cause.

[drivesafe]

After sucessfully mounting my 80ah AGM in front of the existing battery, I've decided it gets too hot and have removed it.

Hi Graeme, and thanks for the info, thats something I had not considered and I think this will pretty well end any ideas I had of developing a tray for that position.

The time needed to develop the tray was not going to be recouped as this tray would only be good for D4s sold in Oz.

D4s in most other countries, particularly cold climate countries have a fuel heater mounted in front of the cranking battery so they couldn't utilise the tray anyway. ( and most of my sales now are exports )

My wife’s D4 arrived this afternoon so tomorrow I will start looking at a number of options.

[CaverD3]

How about trying to move the module. If it came from behind the main battery there may be enough loom to move it back? It is now in box and it could be sprayed with plasticcoat if water is a concern. Or extra loom to move to to between the wing and the booster?

[Graeme]

I've made-up a cardboard box the size of my battery and it wont fit in the left rear guard cubby-hole. It will fit on its side on the floor wedged in behind the centre 2nd row seat without particularly inteferring with the footwells for the 3rd row seats if they ever get used. I'll have a proper look near the booster now that I have the box.

[drivesafe]

How about trying to move the module.

That was the first thing I looked at last night.

One of the dealers is also looking at this possibility, but from my point of view, it must be something that can be done easily and be straightforward or the customers will be scared off.

[Graeme]

I had a bit of a look today and think using the old D3 spot could be possible without any extension harnesses. The battery would need to be removed to access the brake m/c or the modules in their new positions.

1. The alarm horn can be remounted under the brake line bracket, discarding the oversized main bracket.
2. I think the larger module (transmission module?) could be moved to under the brake lines between the m/c and the mudguard. The brake lines from the abs modulator would need lifting a little.
3. The glow plug control box is only small and I think will mount under the brake lines close to the modulator in place of the horn bracket. Its bracket would be discarded.
4. My brake lines to the ABS modulator would need to be rotated up a little to clear the battery area.
5. My 80ah agm looks to just fit under the cover - about 8.5" clearance.

I haven't unbolted the larger module to see what's below it, but the base is plastic at the front. I have to wonder what LR might think of moving the modules although they would still be within the enclosure.

Edit: The base is flexible plastic not steel and I doubt there are any battery anchor points.

[CaverD3]

IF LR had thought when they first decided to find somewhere for the modules. :angel:

[Graeme]

Gordon,

Following is my question to Compomotive Wheels and their response, although I'm not convinced that they have actually tried the rims.

Do you know if the PD1880 rim wil fit the Land Rover Discovery 4
with its larger brakes & callipers?

We can manufacture our PD1880 to suit your car & we do manufacture the 8x18
PD1880 for Bowler for fitment to their Nemesis however unfortunately at this
time we do not have any spare castings. We are currently waiting for
Bowler to order some further wheels & when they do we will have spare
castings.

If Bowler have determined that they fit then it must be time to order some, although I understood that Bowler were going to get back to you when they got to try one so I assume they haven't tried yet. Perhaps Bowler haven't ordered any because they have tried and don't fit.

[gghaggis]

Graeme,

Already been down that road with Compomotive. I got a similar response until I actually tried to order some. They _cannot_ supply. You have to go through Bowler, as they're apparently made under licence.

I email Bowler at least once a week (generally making a pest of myself), but they have been busy (understandably) with the Dakar earlier this month. My last reply email was yesterday, and essentially they still haven't tried with the 3.0 ltr, only the Supercharged. They will contact me once they've tried.

I still have only 8 interested parties for the GMAX custom rim, which is not enough to place an order. We need a minimum of 15 sets. Obviously there are not that many people that see the 19" rim limit as enough of a hindrance to warrant spending extra money on 18" rims. Still, I'm seeing Land Rover Australia in two weeks, so I'll see if there's anything they can offer.

The Dynamic rim will be at prototype stage in a couple of weeks too, I'm going over there and will measure it up to confirm whether it will fit or not.

In the meantime ..... for D4 owners (won't work with the RRS unfortunately), try oversized tyres on the 19" or 20" rims.

20" : The ProComp Xtreme AT is made in 275/55/20 (31.9" diameter, similar to the popular 265/70/17 that D3 owners use), and gives you ~ 6" of sidewall. This is comparable to sidewalls on a 255/60/18 (and will actually increase low-pressure footprint slightly due to the 20" having a lower radius-of-curvature). You can also fit the SecondAir 20" internal beadlocks to ensure safe running at pressures down to 6psi.

19" : No real At's in oversize, but the Pirelli Scorpion Zero and Michelin Diamantis come in 275/55/19 (so also provide a 6" sidewall) for touring and light ungraded road work. No internal beadlocks available in 19", although I'm still investigating this.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

Still, I'm seeing Land Rover Australia in two weeks, so I'll see if there's anything they can offer.
Just dreaming I'm sure but it would be a good start if LR were to offer/allow D3 V8 brakes to be retrofitted.

Thanks for the update.

[gghaggis]

Actually, as well as asking them about co-ordering with GMAX, I want to know what the effect of shaving the brake callipers would be - I've got a 'friendly' in LRA whose up on the technology.

If they're more for aesthetics than balance/heat transfer (and in all honesty I can't see them being particularly good at heat dissipation), then removing 5mm would allow the std GMAX Bonafide 18" rims to fit. I'm willing to use mine as the guinea pig. imagine there will be the same old caveats regarding warranty, but I'm fairly used to fighting them on that [bigwhistle]

Cheers,

Gordon

[Graeme]

I was thinking its about time I tried to find a damaged D3 18" rim to grind depressions to find out by how much and exactly where the calipers would need to be reduced, as it was hard to get a good estimate when doing a quick test to see if they fitted or not. Remember that the D3 18" don't fit the rear either.

For rims that use external clip-on weights rather than the internal stick-on ones, the clearance doesn't have to be as much.

[gghaggis]

The existing GMAX 18" rim has greater internal clearance than the D3 rim, so I imagine you'd have to do more than just grind down the calliper casing. More like retro-fit the V8 callipers .........

Cheers,

Gordon

[Disco4SE]

Hi Gordon, How are you going with the 18" rim fitting to the 3.0Lt D4? I am interested to know if and how it can be done.

[gghaggis]

I may have something to report late next week, but at this stage I don't know if it will be good or bad news :(

Cheers,

Gordon

[Disco4SE]

Thanks Gordon. Let me know when you know. Cheers, Craig

[Graeme]

After shuffling the transfer case and glowplug control modules out of the way today, I discovered my 80ah Remco AGM is too tall. Specs say 208mm high but even without any bolts in the terminals, its too tall by 12-15mm. I'm not prepared to leave the lid removed as I want to keep the heat away from the existing components and the AGM battery. I obtained this battery for my D2 with a D3 in mind, so don't know if my gathered D3 info was incorrect or the D4 box is slightly shorter, but the battery is now back in the 3rd row centre footwell where it will probably see out its days (hopefully years) unless folding the 3rd row centre seat flat becomes a priority, after which I will get a shorter battery that fits in the engine bay.

The xfer case module is mounted beneath the brake lines on the slightly modified horn bracket and the glowplug relay mounted on the other side of the box. If LR get stinky about the modules having been moved, I can move them back temporarily as I expect/hope my Remco battery will outlast the vehicle warranty.

[sniegy]

Didnt happen without pic's:rulez:

I expect Graeme a full documentary film on what was done.

:whistling:

[Graeme]

Didnt happen without pic's:rulez:
Fair enough! Job for tomorrow.


Edit: New thread shows what I did.

[Disco4SE]

Hi Gordon, just ordered a set of Pirelli Scorpian ATR's 255 x 55 x 19. Looks like I may have to wait a couple of months because of high demand. Still let me know how you go with the 18" rims. I don't want to alter my brakes in any way. Cheers, Craig

[gghaggis]

Well, tried the first fitting of the prototype 18" steel rim yesterday. Not the best :(

At the offset we chose, it just scrapes the caliper. Any greater offset and the rim would be illegal in most states. You could, of course, file the brake caliper fins down a little (even 2mm would allow clearance). But I'm not willing to go down that route yet.

There's the possibility of the GMAX rim given enough orders, but regardless, there really isn't much more choice of AT/MT tyres in 18" than there is in 19", so I don't really see the point.

I'm going to close this off as 'possible but not worth it' until tyre importers in Australia bring in some of the other 18" tyre options. In the meantime, I'll look at tyre options in the 275/55/19 size from Europe. For a pure mud tyre, I'm investigating retreading as another option.

Cheers,

Gordon

[rmp]

Thanks Gordon. Retreading is an interesting idea but would require donor tyres and there wouldn't be that many around.

[mowog]

I would still like an 18" wheel solution. I am planning a Savannah Way trip for 2011 and I don't want to do it on my 20" wheels.

I am in for 6 rims when something gets going.

[Next_Door]

Disco 4 SE 3.0L
I'm doing the Savannah, Gibb River Road, Tanami, and Simpson this August.
I purchased 6 Good Year Wrangler MT/R 255/55R19's for the trip.
As there is no other real option, I will just have to be extra cautious and remember the limitations.

[mowog]

If no 18's turn up then I will get a set of 19's as well. I think the 20's would be a problem on a trip like that.

I would be interested to hear how you trip goes.

Are you towing a caravan or camper?

[gghaggis]

Disco 4 SE 3.0L
I'm doing the Savannah, Gibb River Road, Tanami, and Simpson this August.
I purchased 6 Good Year Wrangler MT/R 255/55R19's for the trip.
As there is no other real option, I will just have to be extra cautious and remember the limitations.

Find some second-hand 255/55/19 tyres (any pattern) and use them as spares. The size is used on LR and BMW, so there should be a few around.

Cheers,

Gordon

[gghaggis]

Thanks Gordon. Retreading is an interesting idea but would require donor tyres and there wouldn't be that many around.

The market's probably not overflowing with them, but the Mercedes 4x4 and some of the newer BMW 4x4's use this size (275/55/19), so there should be a few around ...... I hope!

Cheers,

Gordon

[Next_Door]

I'm not towing a camper trailer this trip. But later in the year I will be.
I purchased my MTR's from Land Rover Australia through my dealer. They have them as a spare part. I was told they are clearing them.
Price $370 each unfitted. I think the price is not too bad?

[Dorko]

Bargain!

Can they send me a set for spares...?

Dorko

[Graeme]

I purchased my MTR's from Land Rover Australia through my dealer. They have them as a spare part. I was told they are clearing them.
I wonder why they are clearing them - no longer supplying them as G4 accessories or is there a replacement on the way?

[rmp]

I wonder why they are clearing them - no longer supplying them as G4 accessories or is there a replacement on the way?

Obsolete part. Goodyear no longer make them in the new MTR range.

[Graeme]

Goodyear USA still list the size under MTR-P, just not MTR with Kevlar. It has never been made in the USA to my knowledge where the Kevlar ones are made. It seems they are still readily available in the UK. The Kevlar range are all LT construction.

[gghaggis]

Had one more try with the 18" rims today. With an offset of 41mm (just legal) there's 7mm clearance to the front of the caliper. A fitted 275/60/18 tyre just fits inside the wheel arch.

Might be doable after all ........


Cheers,

Gordon

[Disco4SE]

Hi Gordon, can you please keep me posted on this...........pretty keen
Cheers, Craig

[Steffo]

Gordon,

What rim are you referring to?
Are you using a spacer?
Please keep me posted too.

My D4 3.0 with 19's has arrived.

Regards,

Ken

[mowog]

Good news...

I am very keen to see the outcome.

[Disco4SE]

Hey Gordon, sounds like you have a few people interested in your 18" rim....275/60/18 experiment. Please let us know asap
Cheers, Craig

[gghaggis]

I appreciate that there is a lot of interest in this, but don't expect a rim to be available in the next few weeks or so! I'm only providing proof-of-concept, as none of the other two companies involved had the time to do it for what is perceived as such a small market. They're probably right, as we couldn't get more than 6 people willing to pay for a set of the GMAX alloy rims, which would have been a better solution (we needed 15 to commit).

I think I've proved the concept, now I have to persuade the manufacturers to make it - my business isn't large enough to be in the rim manufacturing game, although I'll probably make up a couple of sets here for testing.

If/when things progress to a manufacturing stage, I'll let the forum know.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Disco4SE]

Thanks Gordon, sets a few peoples minds at rest including mine.
Cheers, Craig

[Steffo]

Very promising Gordon-very grateful for your all your groundwork!

Regards,

Ken