Importing Series 3 to Australia

[flecxie]

Hi all,

We're moving to Australia next April and would like to bring our Landy with.
It is a RHD Series 3 109 safari from 1974. We have replaced the bulkhead and the chassis, are just finished with the sanding, and will bring it to the paintshop this month. So you understand that we cannot leave this beaty behind ;-).

I saw on Eligibility Criteria (http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roads/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/importing_vehicles/general/EligibilityCriteria_2.aspx#one) that importing should be relatively easy for "oldtimers". They mention though that "You might have to modify the vehicle to meet registration requirements. You should contact the Motor Vehicle Registration Authority in the State or Territory where you intend to register the vehicle for information on their requirements."

Does anyone know what kind of modification could be required?
I tried contacting the Motor Vehicle Registration Authority of WA, but didn't get much useful information.

Anyone on the forum who imported a Series from Europe?

Also I was wondering if the safety check for an oldtimer is the same as for a regular car? In Belgium an oldtimer should only be able to break and stear, in order to pass the yearly safety check.

Thanks a lot!

[kaa45]

It's not worth the expense to ship a series vehicle out here. We have nearly as many as Britain. Well, maybe not, but ours are better (more character). You can pick them up very cheap and parts are plentiful.

[V8Ian]

WA require an engine imobilizer, WA or NT would be the easiest places to get registered. Once it's been registered here it's not a major drama to transfer to another state.

[JDNSW]

Australian design rules for 1974 required very minor changes from UK specs. I am not certain what they were, but would probably include seat belt mounts (front only probably), seat belts to Australian specs, positive crankcase breathing (blinkers required, and possibly reversing lights). All parts would be readily available here.

One point to be wary of is that there will be quite severe restrictions on post manufacture modifications, but if it is in pretty much original condition, you should have little problem.

However, as kaa mentions, your Landrover is probably worth a lot more there than it is here. However, although there are plenty of Series Landrovers here (often pretty rust free), 109 station wagons are relatively rare.
John

[Pedro_The_Swift]

It must be clean.

no,, CLEAN!

inside outside underneath door cavitys, see your face in the chassis clean,
NO dirt/grass ANYWHERE clean,,,
steam clean for hours clean,,,

seriously.



Let us know when it gets here ;)

[muddymech]

like everyone says plenty here but its your car if you love it and can bear the expensne bring it over, plus clean clean clean, we had ours (90) steamed cleaned then under sealed before bringing it over, had no problems with getting though customs and quantine, of course they all want there bit of cash so it does add up.

[JDNSW]

It must be clean.

no,, CLEAN!

inside outside underneath door cavitys, see your face in the chassis clean,
NO dirt/grass ANYWHERE clean,,,
steam clean for hours clean,,,

seriously.



Let us know when it gets here ;)

A very good point! It must have no possibility of bringing in any soil, seeds or insects. If you have just replaced the chassis and bulkhead and are about to paint it, you should have little problem as long as you are not tempted to drive it offroad before coming here - preferably don't drive it on road either!

John

John

[Bigbjorn]

It will cost far more to get it here than it is worth. Depends how attached you are to this particular vehicle.

[dullbird]

It's not worth the expense to ship a series vehicle out here. We have nearly as many as Britain. Well, maybe not, but ours are better (more character). You can pick them up very cheap and parts are plentiful.

I dont understand why when anyone asks this.....people instantly say dont bother.

he is obviously very attached to the vehicle and already stated he doesn't want to leave it behind.

When we brought our 90 over Graeme coopers said the same thing "why would you bother" WTF! we realised that it was a heart over financial matter.

but I say if you love your vehicle, you have already spent a lot of time and money on it that your not going to recop and your prepared to pay despite people telling you how many are over here already bring it over!

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Wot she said!

And remember it has to be CLEAN tooth brush clean.

AQIS made the Australian Army remove and discard the seat cushions and wiring harnesses from their Land Rover Perenties when they returned from Iraq. Not that they'd do that with a civilian vehicle.

[V8Ian]

It must be clean.

no,, CLEAN!

inside outside underneath door cavitys, see your face in the chassis clean,
NO dirt/grass ANYWHERE clean,,,
steam clean for hours clean,,,

seriously.



Let us know when it gets here ;)
That's a quaranitine issue Pedro, not DoT.

[V8Ian]

I dont understand why when anyone asks this.....people instantly say dont bother.

he is obviously very attached to the vehicle and already stated he doesn't want to leave it behind.

When we brought our 90 over Graeme coopers said the same thing "why would you bother" WTF! we realised that it was a heart over financial matter.

but I say if you love your vehicle, you have already spent a lot of time and money on it that your not going to recop and your prepared to pay despite people telling you how many are over here already bring it over!
Better the devil you know eh Lou?

[medic455]

Been there, done that.....got all the permits sorted before loading it, spent 2 Days with a high pressure steam cleaner removing every speck of dirt,on, in and underneath the Landy. Flushed out every hole on the chassis (untill the water ran clear) cleaned and degreased the engine bay and drive line, cleaned and dressed the tyres (both sides and the tread, including the spare) pushed it into the container, the rest of our stuff was loaded, around, under and inside the Landy and shipped it. When shipping by container you pay for the square meters of the container foot print, so fill it as full as you can to get the best value for your Euro's.
When the Landy was ready to be picked up, some petty, money grabbing Goverment beaurocrat decided that It was worth $5000.00 and as such I had to pay $500.00 GST on property I had owned for some years(inspite of the vehicle being almost 40 years old). That done, "The all knowing, all seeing Oricle of REMLR (Uncle Ho) helped me get it rego'ed here in QLD and the rest as they say "is history"

Peter

[frantic]

BINGO! The simplest solution is to take the S111 apart as you are doing the rebuild anyway, buy your new chassis , ship it all over here to australia as parts (this will be cheaper and it will take up less room in a container leaving more for your goods), go to a local wreckers/farmer get a VIN/chasis no. off a wrecked +rusted out series 3 and put it on your new chassis. Re-ASSEMBLE your wagon here and welcome to aus:D! Legally wise it may be much easier to get a blue+ pink slip for a "restored" landy than to import and rego.Remeber to be honest about the cost of the parts(or vehicle) as customs will confiscate/ hold items if they are false declarations.

[isuzurover]

WA require an engine imobilizer, WA or NT would be the easiest places to get registered. Once it's been registered here it's not a major drama to transfer to another state.

Only for vehicles <20 (or maybe <25) years old. So either way a 1974 landie is fine.

As mentioned - Immigration will want the vehicle completely clean - and from what I have heard will clean and fumigate the vehicle with bromide(or similar) - and charge you for it.

As JDNSW said, a few minor items may need changing - such as headlights and seat belts.

As a guide on prices here, a SIII station wagon that is in very good condition and completely rust free would probably sell for <$5000AUD in my experience. For that price you could also get the SIII Stage 1 model - which in Australia had a 3.9L diesel option as well as the 3.5L V8. As long as they haven't been near the beach, vehicles over here don't rust much compared to Europe.

[Yorkshire_Jon]

Firstly where are you going to be living? You say you contacted some authority in WA - is that where you'll end up or will you be in NSW / SA / QLD?

I can only speak about NSW with confidence... Having recently brought my 2006 110 Double Cab out here.

I can highly recommend a few people here in NSW to help you out on the import and complience side of things.

Also (again in NSW at least), if your landy is registered as manufactured before 1st Jan 1989 (clearly yours is) then under Regulation 17 it is exempt from needing to meet Australian design standards complience... For you this is a good thing!!

You will hear a LOT about cleanliness, this is not un-justified. It MUST be spotless inside and out, otherwise you will end up with a big quarentine bill for steam cleaning! Each steam clean is currently $275 (from memory) - My 110 was spotless and fortunately only needed to go through once!

Id also recommend using an agent to bring the car into the country for you - Take it from me you will have A LOT of other things to think about when you get here. Knowing that someone else is handling the Landy is a welcome relief!

Before you ship it you must have an IMPORT APPROVAL from DoTRAS (Australian equivelent of DVLA) - This will need to be done online when your still in the UK. Its a pain in the ass because they ask for proof of residency etc etc But persivere and the approval comes through... for $50.

If you really like the car then its worth every penny to get it here... Ive not one regret about bringing the 110 out...

Hope that helps,
Jon

[flecxie]

Hi all, thanks for all your replies!

Since we already need a container for shipping some of our other stuff, the cost of shipping is OK'ish (around 3000$ in total).

We're not pretty sure if we're going to live in Sydney or in Perth (depends on the job).

The only 2 modifications:
- the 2.25l diesel engine was replaced in the years with a 2.5l diesel (early defender)
- the leaf springs were replaced with the ones from rocky mountain

Do you think these might cause trouble?

Thanks!

[JDNSW]

Hi all, thanks for all your replies!

Since we already need a container for shipping some of our other stuff, the cost of shipping is OK'ish (around 3000$ in total).

We're not pretty sure if we're going to live in Sydney or in Perth (depends on the job).

The only 2 modifications:
- the 2.25l diesel engine was replaced in the years with a 2.5l diesel (early defender)
- the leaf springs were replaced with the ones from rocky mountain

Do you think these might cause trouble?

Thanks!

Springs won't be a problem. It is unlikely that the engine will be a problem, but you should be aware that this engine was never sold in Australia and there is a possibility that it may prompt questions - in light of the age I doubt there would be problems. Not to do with import, but you should be aware that the in general parts for this engine are not available in Australia except where they fit other engines, so you may have to import any you need in the future.

John

[isuzurover]

What JD said above. No issue with the springs, and they won't notice the engine is different unless you tell them - however if you do that, also don't tell them it is a 2.5 as they will only have the options 2.25P, 2.25D, 3.5V8 and 3.9D in the system.

However if you tell them you would technically need to get an engineers certificate in NSW or apply for modification approval in WA.

You can find the appropriate form here: Vehicle modifications (http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/licensing/1412.asp). Since it is a bolt-in conversion it would be a mere formality.

I have only ever seen a couple of 2.5(T)Ds in Australia, both were personal imports from the UK.

[EchiDna]

....go to a local wreckers/farmer get a VIN/chasis no. off a wrecked +rusted out series 3 and put it on your new chassis.....


good in theory, bad in practice - rebirthing is illegal.

[flecxie]

Great!
One more question: what kind of seat belts should be installed?
We need to replace the ones we had (didn't work anymore), so we can better immediately buy ones which will pass the aussie test.
Thanks!

[JDNSW]

Great!
One more question: what kind of seat belts should be installed?
We need to replace the ones we had (didn't work anymore), so we can better immediately buy ones which will pass the aussie test.
Thanks!

I think that seat belts have to be ones that have actual Australian approval. While this has been obtained routinely by importers for cars sold in Australia since seatbelts became compulsory, usually with the belts fitted for some overseas markets, the belts fitted to Series Landrovers were all sourced locally, so these would be the only ones approved. I think that an email to the relevant state authority may be useful.

From memory, seat belts were not compulsory in 1970, but I would certainly be fitting them to all seats.

Thinking of seats brings to mind a potential problem you may encounter. In NSW at least (other states may vary) ten or more seats makes the vehicle legally a bus - which means a six monthly roadworthiness inspection, carried out by the RTA not a garage. You probably do not want this, unless you really need the extra seats. If fitted with side seats in the back, this suggests a centre console in place of the middle seat is worth considering.

John

[isuzurover]

Great!
One more question: what kind of seat belts should be installed?
We need to replace the ones we had (didn't work anymore), so we can better immediately buy ones which will pass the aussie test.
Thanks!

As JD said - unless you can find some with Australian Standards compliance over there, they will likely be no good to you.

Seat belts cost will cost you around AU$70 each over here.

AFAIK seat belts were mandatory in Australia from 1969.

[V8Ian]

Seat belts, like blinkers, once retro-fitted are not allowed to be removed.

[Shonky]

ten or more seats makes the vehicle legally a bus

More than 12 actually John. ;)

An organisation I used to work for routinely buys Toyota Hiace busses (14 seats) and removes two seats prior to registering it as a 12 seater. This means that the vehicle doesn't have to go through all the HV hoops, and employees/volunteers can drive them on a car licence.

[JDNSW]

More than 12 actually John. ;)

An organisation I used to work for routinely buys Toyota Hiace busses (14 seats) and removes two seats prior to registering it as a 12 seater. This means that the vehicle doesn't have to go through all the HV hoops, and employees/volunteers can drive them on a car licence.

I based my remark on what I was told by an RTA inspector - they screwed up the paperwork on my County when I moved from Victoria and listed it as a five seater despite the fact that it had the side seats. I had to take it to an RTA inspection depot to have it checked after years of correspondence (actually charged them time and mileage for two trips to town - and they paid!). While he was inspecting it I was closely questioned as to whether it had originally had a centre front seat (it didn't) as this would have made it a bus. (The compliance plate does not have any seating capacity, describes it as an omnibus)

It is quite possible that the number of seats that make it a bus is different to the number of seats you can drive on a car licence - the answers to this are probably on the RTA website somewhere - but I always find it impossible to find anything on that website - it would have to be one of the worst ones I know of!
John

[Quarks]

I did some digging. ;)
According to the NSW RTA inspectors' bulletin:
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registration/downloads/vib56.pdf (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registration/downloads/vib56.pdf)
(WA requirements will most likely be different to these)


Vehicles required to undergo an annual RTA Heavy Vehicle Inspection
The category of vehicles inspected under the RTA Heavy Vehicle Inspection Scheme (HVIS) has changed.
Inspections are based on the vehicles Gross Vehicle Mass (GVM) or Gross Trailer Mass (GTM) instead of tare weight.
The following vehicle types are required to undergo an annual inspection conducted by the RTA under the HVIS scheme:
...
• Passenger-carrying vehicles with body shapes of BUS, SBS, FCV, PVS and PVF, or seating 10 or more passengers including the driver or with a GVM of more than 4.5 tonne, (regardless of usage).
But contrast that with this page about the HVIS: Heavy Vehicle Inspection Scheme (HVIS) (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/heavyvehicles/registration/about_hvis.html):


Vehicle classes that must be inspected
Heavy vehicles that require an inspection include the following vehicle categories and registered usages:

...
* All vehicles carrying 10 or more seated passengers including the driver or more than 4.5T Gross Vehicle Mass (regardless of usage).


So the threshold is 10 seats.

But I suspect the latter is the case regarding SBS, etc. vehicles - as our County was an SBS, and now Defender, (both 9 seaters) and they've never been required to go to HVIS.

:rolleyes:
Geoff

[Bigbjorn]

The Series III Land rover station wagons were described on the Australian literature as ten seats, whereas in the UK they were described as twelve seats. The reasons being that in the UK a twelve bum vehicle is a commercial and attracted a much lower rate of sales tax. In Australia at that time, a twelve seater required a bus licence, hence the description as a ten bum vehicle.

A matter of interest, my County is complianced as a "motor omnibus" ten seats even though with the centre console it could only be a nine seater.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

The Series III Land rover station wagons were described on the Australian literature as ten seats, whereas in the UK they were described as twelve seats.Brian are you sure that's the definition?

The 12 seat 109 wagons had Deluxe (ribbed) seat trim, 3 individual seats for the second row and (I seem to remember) the rear side facing seats were slightly longer than the side facing seats in the 10 seat wagons.

Diana

[Bigbjorn]

Brian are you sure that's the definition?

The 12 seat 109 wagons had Deluxe (ribbed) seat trim, 3 individual seats for the second row and (I seem to remember) the rear side facing seats were slightly longer than the side facing seats in the 10 seat wagons.

Diana

We only assembled in Australia and sold ten seaters in my time at Leyland and precious few of them as most production went to the UN for some project/campaign of theirs. At one time we were taking customer orders with no idea whatsoever if or when the order would be filled.

My copy of the Salesman's Manual states "The 12 seater Station Wagon is exempt from Purchase Tax in the UK"

The version you describe with the tip up seats for access to the rearmost seats via the side doors was not sold here in my time. There may have been some private imports.

[JDNSW]

The Series Landrover station wagons were designed as ten seaters, but for the UK market, to quote John Smith's book "..in early 1962 a 12 seater version also became available. This was primarily intended for 'Home' consumption, as Rover had found a nice little loophole in the law" - it became a bus hence no purchase tax, making the price UKP950 not UKP1293. The side seats were about six inches longer.

I am certain these were never sold in Australia, although a few may have found their way here. Most if not all Counties were sold as nine seaters, possibly because of the NSW bus definition, or simply to provide more storage in line with the 'County" specification.

John

[EchiDna]

My 110 (1988) has an omnibus compliance plate with seating for 10 persons marked on it - yes it has the front centre seat and 2x2 side facing seats in the back with seat belts.

I'd love to make it a 5 seater, but recompliancing it is not something I really want to do....

[frantic]

good in theory, bad in practice - rebirthing is illegal.

Yes it is but REBUILDING/ RESTORING is perfectly legal and done by everyone. Most cars over 50 years that where actually driven are grandfathers axe cases(how many s2 and 2a have s3 front panels, county doors etc!?) with almost every part from the headlights to the rear bumper replaced , repainted or restored over time the only diff. being it's usually done 1 bit(a respray this year, a reco carby the next and last year reco'ed the gearbox,etc) at a time not the whole shebang. Rebirthing is what they do to stolen/ written off vehicles and is recorded at the RTA so just make sure it's not down (have a look here for $18 can check its history Vehicle history check (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/myrta/vehiclehistory.html)) as a write off and it can be your restoration project for as long as it takes.

[Bigbjorn]

The Series Landrover station wagons were designed as ten seaters, but for the UK market, to quote John Smith's book "..in early 1962 a 12 seater version also became available. This was primarily intended for 'Home' consumption, as Rover had found a nice little loophole in the law" - it became a bus hence no purchase tax, making the price UKP950 not UKP1293. The side seats were about six inches longer.

I am certain these were never sold in Australia, although a few may have found their way here. Most if not all Counties were sold as nine seaters, possibly because of the NSW bus definition, or simply to provide more storage in line with the 'County" specification.

John

At GM-H we had a related problem with the first Isuzu small buses imported about 1972. I forget the actual number of seats they had but they were definitely a bus by legal definition and a driver required a bus licence. This was a bit of a marketing drawback as many potential buyers, clubs, schools, churches and so on did not have a licenced bus driver. If enough seats were removed to avoid this requirement then it became a passenger car and seat belts were required to be fitted to all seats. This would have required local engineering, compliance testing, and local modification to provide anchor points, and belt supply and fitting. This was all too much for my seniors and the Isuzu buses were dropped from the range.

[EchiDna]

Yes it is but REBUILDING/ RESTORING is perfectly legal and done by everyone. Most cars over 50 years that where actually driven are grandfathers axe cases(how many s2 and 2a have s3 front panels, county doors etc!?) with almost every part from the headlights to the rear bumper replaced , repainted or restored over time the only diff. being it's usually done 1 bit(a respray this year, a reco carby the next and last year reco'ed the gearbox,etc) at a time not the whole shebang. Rebirthing is what they do to stolen/ written off vehicles and is recorded at the RTA so just make sure it's not down (have a look here for $18 can check its history Vehicle history check (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/myrta/vehiclehistory.html)) as a write off and it can be your restoration project for as long as it takes.

rebirthing is moving a Vin from car A to Car B - aka removing the compliance plate and moving it to another vehicle. What you do is your business, but personally I would not recommend anyone to remove a compliance plate from a firewall and put it on another vehicle without getting approval from the authroities...

[V8Ian]

At GM-H we had a related problem with the first Isuzu small buses imported about 1972. I forget the actual number of seats they had but they were definitely a bus by legal definition and a driver required a bus licence. This was a bit of a marketing drawback as many potential buyers, clubs, schools, churches and so on did not have a licenced bus driver. If enough seats were removed to avoid this requirement then it became a passenger car and seat belts were required to be fitted to all seats. This would have required local engineering, compliance testing, and local modification to provide anchor points, and belt supply and fitting. This was all too much for my seniors and the Isuzu buses were dropped from the range.
IIRC 19 seats.

[JDNSW]

rebirthing is moving a Vin from car A to Car B - aka removing the compliance plate and moving it to another vehicle. What you do is your business, but personally I would not recommend anyone to remove a compliance plate from a firewall and put it on another vehicle without getting approval from the authroities...

Just to put this in context, I don't think that a 1970 2a will have a compliance plate! Certainly mine does not.

John

[Lotz-A-Landies]

At GM-H we had a related problem with the first Isuzu small buses imported about 1972. I forget the actual number of seats they had but they were definitely a bus by legal definition and a driver required a bus licence. ....<snip>Back in 1975 when I bought my first SIIa 109 10 seat wagon the rules in NSW were that a "class 1" (now "C") licence were permitted to carry no more than 8 passengers.

All I had to do was go the the motor registry tell them the issue about my privately registered 10 seat wagon and my licence was endorsed to drive a vehicle with the additional seats. From memory the number they endorsed the licence for was 16 seats, which came in really useful when the UNSW x-country ski team wanted to go on training weekends, we could get one of the Uni's mini-busses and I drove it. It was also a problem as being the only one so endorsed I had to drive both ways and also ski on the team. :( :( :Thump:

[Disco44]

My series 3 stage 1 3.9d was registered as a bus here in Queensland.The bloke I bought it from was a Clerk of Petty Sessions in a Queensland country town.He probably knew how to get it registered as such. It had the double rear seats.
It's long gone now.
Cheers,
John ( disco 44)

[Shonky]

It is quite possible that the number of seats that make it a bus is different to the number of seats you can drive on a car licence - the answers to this are probably on the RTA website somewhere - but I always find it impossible to find anything on that website - it would have to be one of the worst ones I know of!



I did some digging...

[snip]

...So the threshold is 10 seats.


Thanks Geoff - seems I am incorrect! :angel:

I'm not sure I want to know how my former employer has all these 12 seater vehicles registered as cars! :eek: Having experienced their methods of 'problem solving' I would put nothing past them... :o


My apologies John. :)