What second batteries do people use ???

[brownrangie]

Hi all
I have searched the forum without much success in trying to solve my problem.

So here goes. Basically I am not happy with the second battery that I am using in the D2. I have a full ARB dual battery system with a Supercharge Allrounder 60ah battery as the second battery.

Was over at Moreton Island last week and the fridge stopped working around lunchtime on the second day (it was hot - 37 degrees but in the shade), basically 24 hours since we stopped to setup camp. The battery was fully charged when we left home and is about a year old. We then went for a 4 hour drive and it charged back up again. Ran the fridge overnight with no other accessories and it stopped working again the next morning. The fridge is a Waeco 50L set on the lowest voltage setting.

I am interested in what other people use and whether there are bigger capacity batteries that will fit in the small tray. I have the SLS model so placing another battery in the compressor cradle is not an option.

Any help would be appreciated as I feel that the power restrictions will not give me much comfort to attack the Aussie outback. Having a camper trailer would help (extra batteries), but we haven't got one of them yet.

Cheers
Pete :)

[discowhite]

im about to go down this route atmo, im going to use 2 delkor DC31 batteries. one is going in the trailer and the other im going to fit inside the rear load space where the 7th seat was. there is a fair bit of room between the opening in the well and the space behind it. i should be able to make a cradle and fit the lot in that space. i have to use the drivers side as i have rear air in the pass side.

this is where i will get my DC31's from, its the best price ive found so far.
Best Battery (http://bestbattery.com.au/shop/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=DC31&osCsid=35304729069dd18439d93b53f772b7b0)

cheers phil

[Slunnie]

I'm pretty sure this is the one that I run

Lifeline 100ah deep cycle. I also run it from one of the bins in the boot rather than under the bonnet.

Lifeline Batteries - Marine & RV Deep Cycle Batteries (http://www.lifelinebatteries.com/rvflyer.php?id=2)

[Bundalene]

Another option is one of these battery chargers - a little expensive first up but an investment for life - including charging batteries at home.

2.5hp specs (http://www.christieengineering.com.au/2.5hp.htm)

We have had one for about 10 years now and go away for at least 2 months every year. This allows you to spend a week at a remote location, without the need of solar panels.

Please note - I do have a vested interested in this product.

Erich

[Urban Panzer]

Got a yellow top as my second battery, but got no idea how long it will last coz I got nothing to try it with (yet), but I would hope it would power a fridge for atleast 1 night.

[Mundy]

You don't indicate if the allrounder is a deep cycle battery. I have a supercharge deepcycle 60Ah and have previously had a 60Ah AGM battery. I have found the problem is that I can't fit a larger battery under the bonnet and neither battery would run in plus 35deg heat in a closed car for more than 20 hours without voltage dropping below 11V. The AGM didn't like the heat under the bonnet so the supercharge is a liquid lead/acid which i've had now for 2 years without a problem.

My solution is to use a folding 60W solar panel to top up the battery for days when not driving. In hot weather, it usually means sunshine and summer, which also means around 10 hours of usable sunlight. In cooler weather, length and strength of sunlight is less but heat load is also correspondingly less.

I like Slunnie's idea of the battery in the panier boxes but I would have to sacrifice too much space used for other things.

I made my 60W solar panel from 2 30W panels and a piano hinge. Means you have to make a junction box to join the two cables, with diodes to stop back flow of current.

Mundy

[brownrangie]

Thanks Mundy. The allrounder is a combination of starting and deep cycle so it can charge up more quickly but then also run flat numerous times without damage. May have to look into the solar panel option

Cheers

[alien]

G'day Mundy,
I've got an Exide Extreme N50EX, Deep cycle/start.
550CCA,120RC,75AH. (Still can't work all the numbers out;))
Was recomended as not constantly being used for loads(I turn Waeco of when not in use).
Managed to fit it to a Piranha tray, with some modification:)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2009/12/651.jpg

More on http://www.aulro.com/afvb/members-rides/83171-aliens-d2.html?highlight=aliens+d2 if you want it.

[Bundalene]

As mentioned above,

You can fit a decent size battery under the bonnet but be mindfull of the exhaust temperatures. This was our auxilliary battery for about 5 years and it worked well, This is a bit dirty - the photo was taked during one of our trips.

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/8756/landrover001.jpg (http://img94.imageshack.us/i/landrover001.jpg/)

Note the insullation material stuck on the left of the battery.

Erich

[Redback]

I have a Fullriver HDL60 as a spare after thinking it was dead, I replaced it with a DC55-12 Fullriver, the HDL60 is 5yrs old now and still going strong.
I have had the newer 55AH for 18mths.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/bazzar/DSC01948.jpg

Baz.

[Urban Panzer]

Baz,

Im interested to know what is the black cylindrical thing in your piccy by the power steering res ?

[discowhite]

search for PROVENT. dosnt look like its hooked up either:eek:

cheers phil

[adonuff]

Hi I have a large heavy duty starting battery, I think it's around 160/180 amp hour, It has been in use for 3 years in the work ute powering a work light and a pump for a 100 lt fuel tank to fill the excavator as well as the Waco and lighting on our trips away.

The ute is gone and the entire set up is now in the discovery and still going strong. I can run the waco for a weekend as well as led lighting and never had a prob! Longer stays I supplement the battery with solar panels (2x 15 watt). as well as short day trips.

My very old auto elec told me to go with the high amp hour heavy duty starting battery and not the deep cycle?? I took his advice and so far all has worked beyond my expectations.

I'm wondering about the wisdom behind this, I just went with his suggestion? I think one of his comments was the starting battery will recover quicker than the deep cycle once the engine/recharging is happening? I am sure the starting battery was considerably cheaper than the deep cycle? ($160.00 approx.)

This might be worth looking into deep cycle verses Starting verses cost? One obvious draw back is the size, had to fit mine in the rear. I can live with it so far has never got in the way and if it did just pull the anderson plug and take it out.

I realise a 7 seat set up would not work well but the rear batt set up has some advantages, easy to remove and carry to the tent short run of cable to the fridge & no overheating dramas.

Will await a response or 2 or 3

Andrew

[Redback]

Baz,

Im interested to know what is the black cylindrical thing in your piccy by the power steering res ?


search for PROVENT. dosnt look like its hooked up either:eek:

cheers phil

Yes Provent oil seperator, that was pre-install, I hooked it up eventually and have given Ben (isuzurover) the filter back for testing:)

Baz.

[clean32]

Hi I have a large heavy duty starting battery, I think it's around 160/180 amp hour, It has been in use for 3 years in the work ute powering a work light and a pump for a 100 lt fuel tank to fill the excavator as well as the Waco and lighting on our trips away.

The ute is gone and the entire set up is now in the discovery and still going strong. I can run the waco for a weekend as well as led lighting and never had a prob! Longer stays I supplement the battery with solar panels (2x 15 watt). as well as short day trips.

My very old auto elec told me to go with the high amp hour heavy duty starting battery and not the deep cycle?? I took his advice and so far all has worked beyond my expectations.

I'm wondering about the wisdom behind this, I just went with his suggestion? I think one of his comments was the starting battery will recover quicker than the deep cycle once the engine/recharging is happening? I am sure the starting battery was considerably cheaper than the deep cycle? ($160.00 approx.)

This might be worth looking into deep cycle verses Starting verses cost? One obvious draw back is the size, had to fit mine in the rear. I can live with it so far has never got in the way and if it did just pull the anderson plug and take it out.

I realise a 7 seat set up would not work well but the rear batt set up has some advantages, easy to remove and carry to the tent short run of cable to the fridge & no overheating dramas.

Will await a response or 2 or 3

Andrew


I am the same, I run 2 X 144 amp batteries with a marine switch that just changes from one battery to the other. This was the set up of the previous owner. And we can park up for the weekend run the fridge lights charge the camera for the weekend before the low current cutout turns every thing off. And as I only pay 100 bucks for factory cosmetic seconds.

Now I understand that the deep cycle batteries can be run down lower with out damage to the battery, so I always wondered if these deep cycle batteries actual got more power out of them because you could drain them lower???

I was considering changing to some fancy charger and deep cycle battery but my auto sparkly said the same not worth the extra money. But I still wonder.

[stevo68]

Hey mate...I use a Supercharge Gold battery... Supercharge Batteries - Car Batteries, Maintenance, Expanded Grid Technology (http://www.supercharge.com.au/product_detail.php'seq=62&return_url=battery_search.php) and it works fine. Have done 11 trips this year without fuss and it is reasonably priced. I went to Battery World and it was there recommendation...considering I am also unlikely to sit in one place for more than a day without driving. I run a 60 litre waeco and also a fluro light from it.

Regards

Stevo

[brownrangie]

Thanks Stevo. Had a look at the link and the length of your battery is 330mm whereas mine is only approx 230mm. I guess that is the difference between the Piranha and ARB battery trays. Next time I see you I will have to pop my head under the bonnet as I am intrigued to see how it fits.

Merry Xmas to you and Shari + the kids. See you in the new year.:)

Cheers
Pete

[stevo68]

Thanks Stevo. Had a look at the link and the length of your battery is 330mm whereas mine is only approx 230mm. I guess that is the difference between the Piranha and ARB battery trays. Next time I see you I will have to pop my head under the bonnet as I am intrigued to see how it fits.

Merry Xmas to you and Sharlea+ the kids. See you in the new year.:)

Cheers
Petehey mate....more than welcome to have a look...here is my u beaut thread on installing it all..... http://www.aulro.com/afvb/discovery-2/72653-dual-battery-d2-stevo-tutorial.html

Merry Xmas to you and yours as well.....will be getting another moo moo done in New Year....will let you know,

Regards

Stevo

P.S. Edited Sharlea's name for you :D....thought I was with someone chinese for a momento then :p

[Mundy]

Hi Adonuff,
Its been my experience here that ask 5 people for an opinion on batteries and you'll get 10 different ones. Here goes anyway.

Starting batteries do recharge faster. They are designed for quick discharge (high CCA) and recharge BUT only for no more than, say, 10% discharge. Deep cycles are designed for, or are more tolerant of, discharges of 70%. For all batteries there is a strong link between cycle life and the how much you discharge them, even for deep cycle batteries.

If my deepcycle battery is significantly discharged, it takes at least 4 hours running in the vehicle for it to be fully charged. One would think a 60Ah battery and 120A alternator should do it in 1/2 an hour but it doesn't work that way. Deep cycles are designed for slower and deeper dis/charging.

If you have a large starter batttery, 10% discharge can still give you ample Ah to run your fridge etc if you don't do so for too long and/or if its not too hot. If you can get a large starter battery cheap enough it may well be more cost effective to replace more often than getting a more expensive deep cycle even with its longer life.

Finally, not all deepcycle batteries are the same. Depending on their medium, some won't fully charge with alternators giving less than 14V output and you need to use an electronic charger to fully charge.

Mundy

[clean32]

Hi Adonuff,
Its been my experience here that ask 5 people for an opinion on batteries and you'll get 10 different ones. Here goes anyway.

Starting batteries do recharge faster. They are designed for quick discharge (high CCA) and recharge BUT only for no more than, say, 10% discharge. Deep cycles are designed for, or are more tolerant of, discharges of 70%. For all batteries there is a strong link between cycle life and the how much you discharge them, even for deep cycle batteries.

If my deepcycle battery is significantly discharged, it takes at least 4 hours running in the vehicle for it to be fully charged. One would think a 60Ah battery and 120A alternator should do it in 1/2 an hour but it doesn't work that way. Deep cycles are designed for slower and deeper dis/charging.

If you have a large starter batttery, 10% discharge can still give you ample Ah to run your fridge etc if you don't do so for too long and/or if its not too hot. If you can get a large starter battery cheap enough it may well be more cost effective to replace more often than getting a more expensive deep cycle even with its longer life.

Finally, not all deepcycle batteries are the same. Depending on their medium, some won't fully charge with alternators giving less than 14V output and you need to use an electronic charger to fully charge.

Mundy

thanks for that, if i have a 144 amp truck type battery what capasity would a deepcycle of the same size be?

[adonuff]

Thanks Mundy

The fridge has worked well so far and never hit the low volt cut out. But has never been really tried out on a really hot weekend ! Worst so far would be about 30 Deg C.

So far most of our trips have have been for a weekend and everything has worked really well, I might be cheating a bit as I freeze everything I can in the home freezer and have the waco on freeze the night before turning to normal keep the beer cold temp after adding the frozen stuff.

Fridge doesn't have to do anything for the first day. I think my point would be that the starting battery will be adequate for this style of camping or a long road trip where the vehicle is used daily, or even a starting point for anyone with limited funds.

I'm planning for solar panels and a few batterys in the van soon and the imfo on here is invaluable, the van will proberly get deep cycle (depending on funds).

Thanks again Andrew

[Mundy]

Clean32,
If you have a 144Ah starter battery, for 10% discharge you'd get 14Ah usable, for 20% discharge 28Ah. You need to look at the battery specs to see what a particular regular discharge pattern of use does to its recharge cycles. It might cut them down by half possibly (I have no idea; its battery dependent). For a deep cycle giving 28Ah usable based on 70% discharge you'd need a 40Ah battery (in theory).

What you need depends on what type of camping and motoring you do and how many things you connect to it. So, like Adonuff, if you are usually driving every day then a smaller battery will suffice and a large starter battery will probably be OK. An advantage of 2 starter batteries is that, if your main crank battery does cark it, you are likely to be able to start the vehicle with the second battery if its not too discharged. You usually can't do it with a standard deep cycle battery, even if its fully charged, because you can't get the amps out of it.

If you do a lot of camping for days at a time and don't start the car, then a large deep cycle is probably best. Either way, in my view, you need to get the biggest (in Ah) battery you can fit in and afford, which ever type suits your use and risk profile.

Just a technical note so we're all on the same page, an Amp is the rate at which the current flows (like water in litres per second) and AmpHours is the volume or amount of electrical energy used/needed (like 50 litres of water).

Cheers
Mundy

[richard4u2]

i have two starter batteries would not waste my money on a deep cycle one , when i am out in the caravan i put the second starter battery in the caravan and use a generator for charging etc

[clean32]

Clean32,
If you have a 144Ah starter battery, for 10% discharge you'd get 14Ah usable, for 20% discharge 28Ah. You need to look at the battery specs to see what a particular regular discharge pattern of use does to its recharge cycles. It might cut them down by half possibly (I have no idea; its battery dependent). For a deep cycle giving 28Ah usable based on 70% discharge you'd need a 40Ah battery (in theory).

What you need depends on what type of camping and motoring you do and how many things you connect to it. So, like Adonuff, if you are usually driving every day then a smaller battery will suffice and a large starter battery will probably be OK. An advantage of 2 starter batteries is that, if your main crank battery does cark it, you are likely to be able to start the vehicle with the second battery if its not too discharged. You usually can't do it with a standard deep cycle battery, even if its fully charged, because you can't get the amps out of it.

If you do a lot of camping for days at a time and don't start the car, then a large deep cycle is probably best. Either way, in my view, you need to get the biggest (in Ah) battery you can fit in and afford, which ever type suits your use and risk profile.

Mundy

thanks for that.

funny thing, we drove up charging the new battery say 1.5 hours, and that night only running the fridge ( which was on mains untill we left and every thing inside was frozen anyway). the next day no start, switched over started then switched back a couple of klms down the road. never had a problem after that.

we ussaly drive everyday eather on the move or doing the traps, we are not much for sitting around ( not with minime)

[adonuff]

thanks for that, if i have a 144 amp truck type battery what capasity would a deepcycle of the same size be?

Hi
Sorry I dont have enough experiance with deep cycle batterys to answer ? Some one out there might??

I am fairly sure ( Father was Vic. State manager for Lucas Batterys) that a badly discharged battery will not fully recover to a fully charged state using only the altenator, might at best get 90%. A good slow charge using a battery charger will help it to recover and aid it's lifespan.(I am only applying this to starting batterys).

Dont take my word for this however, but would suggest talking to a good auto elec.(If you can find one), Making sure you give all the details as to what you are going to do to the battery and your expectations?

I always use a hydrometer on my batterys and if they are not in the green after a week end away put them on a long slow trickle charge using a 240 V charger.(Never on the concrete floor, Bad for them).

So far so good, Works so far.

Andrew