What to do, Defender or patrol

[aloa9061]

Hey Guys and girls,

Here's the dilema.

The defender s now my daily driver and i do a lot of driving around Sydney for work. My defender has had a lot of work done to it and is very capable. few toys, twin lockers, gearing, set up for camping etc.

Problems:
Wife not comfortable driving the car around town after seeing to rollovers in friends 4wds and a wheel coming off the defender with her driving.
Being a 300tdi its fairly slow on the freeway for holidays etc.
Tight squeeze to use around car parks etc.
Getting a bit over the wet foot issue in rain!

My biggest issue with selling my car is getting something even closely capable without spending a bucket load of cash.

A mate is heading overseas and he is keen to sell his twin locked and chipped 3ltr patrol. I think i can get the patrol with less kms on it for about a changeover of 3/4k?

Defender:
99 300tdi
low range gears
twin lockers
bullbar, side bars, winch. lights
drawers,
watertank
cargo barrier
long range tank
2 inch lift
33 inch muddies
duel batteries
175k

PAtrol
2003 3lt TD
two inch lift
crappy allterrain tires 31inch (would def change)
twin locked
rear kaymar twin wheel carrier
long range tank
bullbar
lights
duel batteries
140k

[dobbo]

Buying the Patrol will put you in the same situation as you are in with the Defender, too big for the city. If your wife is OK driving the Paj, leave her in it. Surely it would be more feasible to buy a small and reliable throw away car for work and keep the 110 for play.

Speaking of play when can you come out?

[p38arover]

Why not buy a car for city work? Then the Defender can be your off-road toy. (For those who haven't seen it, it is a great unit.)

[Slunnie]

D2 :cool:

You could even have kiddie seats in the back. :lol2:


Are you still looking to do the auto conversion and you could hit it with some silicon or put some seals in those gaps where the doors were meant to go. :D

[Slunnie]

Why not buy a car for city work? Then the Defender can be your off-road toy. (For those who haven't seen it, it is a great unit.)
and there are a few goodies left off that list too.

[weeds]

swap cars with your mate for a week or two and let the wife dive it around......you may not be gaining much

[It'sNotWorthComplaining!]

Keepo the fender and get the wife one of those zippy $13999(or what ever they are now) drive away no more to pay little shopping carts.
She gets a brand new car and can squeeze into any tight city spot

[loanrangie]

swap cars with your mate for a week or two and let the wife dive it around......you may not be gaining much

A ZD30 grenade :eek:.

[aloa9061]

Shopping cart?

Don't think so!
My wife wants me to keep the defender and can drive it better off road than most people. She also learnt to drive in v8's so there is no chance she will want a shopping cart!

She has her own car anyway, a 5 door pajero io.

I would love to keep the defender and just have a city car but I can't justify the expense of a third car.

As slunnie mentioned an auto could still be an option.

[samuelclarke]

The Patrol might be nice and all, but does it have the character of a Defender? It's a question only you can answer in relevance to your needs and how much the Defender means to you...

The problems you've listed can be addressed to an extent.


Wife not comfortable driving the car around town after seeing to rollovers in friends 4wds and a wheel coming off the defender with her driving.
Any 4wd (or car for that matter) isn't going to fare too well in a rollover! A rollcage is the answer - sure it adds weight, but what is safety worth? I'm planning on fitting one as soon as I'm able to my Defender.


Being a 300tdi its fairly slow on the freeway for holidays etc.
I have a 200Tdi, and while it's no sports car, it easily cruises at 110km/h - I'd consider some performance upgrades.


Tight squeeze to use around car parks etc.
Patrol is going to be similar - the only legal answer in Aus is offsetting the rims. Unless you're running really wide tyres it'll make a big difference! Will also reduce risk of rollover with a wider wheel track.


Getting a bit over the wet foot issue in rain!
Tell me about it!! But it can be fixed fairly cheaply. :)

As I said it really gets back to how much the Defender means to you. For me the issues are worth it for the smile my Defender puts on my face - once they get under your skin it's hard to have anything else.

Or as Slunnie said you could get a D2! :o :wasntme:

[It'sNotWorthComplaining!]

Am I the only one confused?

She has her own car but doesn't like driving yours? Tell her to drive her own then ;) or is it that she doesn't like being in the passenger seat while you drive? :D

your not the only one.

[BigJon]

I am with those two above!!

My other half doesn't like driving my car around town much, so she doesn't! She uses her Laser.

If it was a choice betwene my Rangie and my missus, I couldn't say for sure which one would get the flick... Although I have my suspicions :D.

[Turtle61]

I am a little bit confused too. Not sure what the issue is...

she has her own car, you haver the 'fender.

... although I can understand a little bit: my other half KNOWS we should replace the Flandie with a D2 but she LIKES the Flandie so I am left with "do whatever you like but I like the Flandie". That is coming from someone who does not even have a license...

Keep the 'fender.

[rick130]

3 litre Patrol =
A ZD30 grenade :eek:.

x2

and I like Patrol's, just not the ZD30 engine.

[Slunnie]

Am I the only one confused?

She has her own car but doesn't like driving yours? Tell her to drive her own then ;) or is it that she doesn't like being in the passenger seat while you drive? :D
Oooooh don't believe that she doesnt drive it, I've seen her drive the Defender through some pretty bloody crazy stuff! ---> :eek: <---

[barney]

Andy, stay away from the 3.0l patrol, the motors in these things have a bad habit of self destructing.
if you go patrol, go for the 4.2, but they are no race car either.
then you have the problem of rust, a gear box that rejects 5th gear, pressed on bearings which make it a bitch to do a temp fix on a broken axle in the bush.
put up with the defender's personality traits, you don't know how lucky you are!

[loanrangie]

3 litre Patrol =

x2

and I like Patrol's, just not the ZD30 engine.

If i was towing a large load regularly then 4.2 TD patrol would be my choice, they still ride like crap though compared to a landy.

[stevo68]

Well I'm absolutely confused ;):

Problems:

Wife not comfortable driving the car around town after seeing to rollovers in friends 4wds and a wheel coming off the defender with her driving. So the answer is to look at a Patrol :confused:...which is "ahem" a 4WD....difficult around town etc.

Being a 300tdi its fairly slow on the freeway for holidays etc. Define slow...I have a D2 TD5 and it isnt breaking any speed records when loaded with gear and 7 seats taken.

Tight squeeze to use around car parks etc. Again...so why be looking at a Patrol....out of the frying pan and into the fire..so to speak :)

Getting a bit over the wet foot issue in rain! But isnt that the joy of owning a Fender :p.

And as has been stated.....she has her own car :confused: and I believe the Paj IO is the widdle one. I can understand the missus not being keen on driving it ie the fender....mine isnt a fan of driving mine....so she doesn't...she drives her own car....no problems. I honestly fail to see where the issue lies. She has her own car....and yourrrrrrrr looking to sell your car.....cause she has issues with your car. Would be a short blunt argument in our house :twisted:,

Regards

Stevo

[isuzurover]

3 litre Patrol =

x2

and I like Patrol's, just not the ZD30 engine.

x3 (or 4...)

Keep the 110 and tweak it (more) if you want more go.

Invest your 3-4k in a cheap car (or two) for you both to commute in.

[rick130]

<snip>
if you go patrol, go for the 4.2, but they are no race car either.

Yep, just need a 3" dump pipe and exhaust, the pump timing adjusted and the fueling played with a little.
The exhaust is ridiculous, and IMO the pump timing is set to keep NOx levels low, not for fuel efficiency or go.



then you have the problem of rust, a gear box that rejects 5th gear, pressed on bearings which make it a bitch to do a temp fix on a broken axle in the bush.
put up with the defender's personality traits, you don't know how lucky you are!Rust ?? haven't seen too much (any) of that ??

The 5th gear thing was a bad batch in '01 and long since sorted. Ours has towed horses most of it's life, in 5th (yes, yes, I know, cantilevered gear, it shouldn't be loaded like that, etc) and never had an issue (well over 300,000km so far)
The semi-floating rear is a pain when you have to work on it, the full floater in the 1300kg payload (leaf rear) cab chassis, or a Defender is so much easier to service.
The paint is ridiculously thin on the cab chassis, but finish isn't a strong suit of the Defender, either. :D


<snip>
they still ride like crap though compared to a landy.

Easily sorted with springs and shocks, but the front end travel is crap stock compared to a Defender, and bottoms out far too readily.
Whoop de doo's (on bitumen) that I take without backing off in the Defender I have to slow down in the Patrol, and even just hitting a 'standard' Australian Goat Tra...err, Highway bump can catch the front end out badly, crashing through to the bump stops solidly.

The rear springs sag badly in use, but late model Defender fronts sag too, so the score's even there.

Everything hangs much lower in a standard Patrol, it's actually easier to ramp over earlier on a Patrol cab/chassis than a 130 :eek: and some bits weren't as well protected as a Defender, just can't recall ATM.

Oh, at least the fuel tank doesn't rust out in the Patrol like a Defender, there are ample holes to let the water away from the bash plate......and let gravel and rocks jam in between and rub through the tank instead....
They look high and mighty, but looks can be deceiving.

The castor and camber needs re-setting too (eccentric shim) for the damn things to steer straight on the highway, but it's a cheap and easy fix at the truck wheel aligners.

One thing the Patrol kills the Defender on is cabin noise (or the lack of) and in cab chassis form the A/C performs par excellence, but ventilation is crap, so it's swings and merry-go-rounds.

<edit> Oh and Patrol seats are rubbish The pathetic little/minimalist (take you pick of adjective :D) Defender seat has so much more support for your lower back it isn't funny.

[Landy Smurf]

i cant belive that you are even considering this:angel: but i agree with the others when they say get a cheap little runabout my dad did best thing ever he reckons and i do too because then i get to drive the defender around
but another thing is i dont realise how much i love it and how much i love driving it until i get in another car and drive it around for a while and then i sit back in the defender and it feels like home.weird i no

[crl]

Why not buy a car for city work? Then the Defender can be your off-road toy. (For those who haven't seen it, it is a great unit.)

I agree, how about a seperate car for city driving?

[dobbo]

i cant belive that you are even considering this:angel: but i agree with the others when they say get a cheap little runabout my dad did best thing ever he reckons and i do too because then i get to drive the defender around
but another thing is i dont realise how much i love it and how much i love driving it until i get in another car and drive it around for a while and then i sit back in the defender and it feels like home.weird i no



But

you are not in the same situation Andy is in.

[aloa9061]

Jeas you guys seem to be taking this personally.

For the record my wife recons I should keep the defender! Slunnie is not kidding she has taken the car some amazing place. She crossed nolans brook in cape york with my 2.5 inch lift and 34 inch tires and the water was half way up the wind screen. She can drive!

The issue is more along the lines of sharing the driving on longer trips, she is no that confident any more after the rollovers i mentioned before. We are also looking at a family and have seen first hadn the differences between a defender and a patorl in a rollover.

I've been driving land rovers since i was a little kid in Africa. I love my defender and would be very sad to leave it.

The third car is not an option, its at least another couple of grand in insurance and rego etc.

I understand compeltely how much more capable my defender in particular is than the patrol. In my case i was simply looking at a more comortable car with aircon, power windows and cabin noise than my defender but i still want capability and this is where this patrol seemed a compromise.

Its definitely an option to look at the power upgrades and I've been investigating better sound insulation etc.

For those that don't know i used to run 33 inch simex so yes i do know that sound can get worse!

Once again I'm just bouncing ideas around on what to do.

Rick I like the exhaust and power options. I spoke to Bruce Davis a while ago but he seemed to want my right kidney for the mods.

Sorry realise you mentioned that for the patrol

[p38arover]

Ah well. You sound like a contender for a D2. My wife like driving them, hates my P38A.

[isuzurover]

The third car is not an option, its at least another couple of grand in insurance and rego etc.

Must be very expensive rego and insurance where you are... Sure that wouldn't be offset by fuel savings though?

[hoadie72]

Must be very expensive rego and insurance where you are... Sure that wouldn't be offset by fuel savings though?

It costs very roughly $700 annually just for rego and CTP (compulsory 3rd party liability insurance, which is/was included in WA rego fees). Then you may want to pay insurance on top of that.

To offset that in fuel savings, you'd need to be driving a Prius, but obviously you won't get change out of about $45,000..

[midal]

Ah well. You sound like a contender for a D2. My wife like driving them, hates my P38A.

Ron

Just thought I'd point this out to you (quietly, before anyone else notices your mistake and has a go at you)

"My wife [B]like(s) driving them...........":angel:

Cheers
Mick

[dobbo]

Ron

Just thought I'd point this out to you (quietly, before anyone else notices your mistake and has a go at you)

"My wife [B]like(s) driving them...........":angel:

Cheers
Mick


he could of meant wifelike, he was talking about a D2;)

[p38arover]

Ron

Just thought I'd point this out to you (quietly, before anyone else notices your mistake and has a go at you)

"My wife [B]like(s) driving them...........":angel:

Cheers
Mick

I'll accept the admonition. :( I was on my 3rd large red wine after work.

[Cap]

OK, so the main issue here for your wife is safety. I recon, if your gona shell out the money for the exchange, then the tyres, then anything else, you could easily, for the money, install a rollcage on the fender - and that would be MUCH safer than a non rollcaged patrol.

I agree that the Defers roof protection is carpola compared to other models, BUT the rollcage is the answer. If she likes the Fender, you like the Fender, then its a simpe answer. You still have the other car from what I read to drive around in.

Other things like performance upgrade etc is easily dooable too.

Best of luck with your decision ;)

[stevo68]

Jeas you guys seem to be taking this personally.

For the record my wife recons I should keep the defender! Slunnie is not kidding she has taken the car some amazing place. She crossed nolans brook in cape york with my 2.5 inch lift and 34 inch tires and the water was half way up the wind screen. She can drive!

The issue is more along the lines of sharing the driving on longer trips, she is no that confident any more after the rollovers i mentioned before. We are also looking at a family and have seen first hadn the differences between a defender and a patorl in a rollover.

I've been driving land rovers since i was a little kid in Africa. I love my defender and would be very sad to leave it.

The third car is not an option, its at least another couple of grand in insurance and rego etc.

I understand compeltely how much more capable my defender in particular is than the patrol. In my case i was simply looking at a more comortable car with aircon, power windows and cabin noise than my defender but i still want capability and this is where this patrol seemed a compromise.

Its definitely an option to look at the power upgrades and I've been investigating better sound insulation etc.

For those that don't know i used to run 33 inch simex so yes i do know that sound can get worse!

Once again I'm just bouncing ideas around on what to do.

Rick I like the exhaust and power options. I spoke to Bruce Davis a while ago but he seemed to want my right kidney for the mods.

Sorry realise you mentioned that for the patrol Hey mate, I don't think anyone is taking it personally or questioning the missus's capabilties of driving the fender...or anything else for that matter. More a case that the original post was confusing and the above post brings more clarity. If one person is confused....it could be that person....if more than one is confused...then its the "communicator" :p.

From what I now understand now.....its mainly about safety and comfort above all else as car parking/ city driving etc is going to be the same in a fender or patrol. I would have to agree...and could be accused for being a wee biased in saying a D2.

Comfort....tick...safety....tick.....ability to be modified and kick ass offroad....tick. Only issue as I have found this week working in the city is with mine being lifted.....carparks are an issue so have had to scoot around in SWMBO'ds XR6. Thankfully I have found 12hr outside parking..even though I have a car space in the building and Smokey will be coming to work with me from next week.

Also another consideration is how often does a roll over happen? The patrol may have faired better but were the circumstances the same? Naturally one wants to have the best protection available.....but is a patrol a safer option than a fender.....this I cannot answer. I have seen some pictures of a fender ( on this site....may have even been a member) whose fender was nailed by a semi and all occupants came out alive and kicking. Another post where fender was crushed from front and occupants came out unscathed.....then ones where they haven't......but can that not be applied to most vehicles dependant on the circumstances. Someone else with better knowledge maybe able to answer that one,

Regards

Stevo

[rick130]

J
<snip>
Rick I like the exhaust and power options. I spoke to Bruce Davis a while ago but he seemed to want my right kidney for the mods.

Sorry realise you mentioned that for the patrol

Similar thing re the 300Tdi, but it doesn't really need the 3" pipe, although that's what i made for mine.

The pump mods are easy if you are half mechanically inclined, careful, write settings down and have an EGT gauge/pyro installed.
Ian Petersen of Thermogaurd EGT gauges fame wrote an excellent how to that is on here somewhere if you are interested, plus change the pump timing to what JC advocates and you are motoring.
Next step is either the MTQ TD04 turbo kit, or a VNT.

[V8Ian]

Ron

Just thought I'd point this out to you (quietly, before anyone else notices your mistake and has a go at you)

"My wife [B]like(s) driving them...........":angel:

Cheers
Mick
It was noticed and politely ignored, a bit like farting in a lift.:angel::wasntme:

[isuzurover]

It costs very roughly $700 annually just for rego and CTP (compulsory 3rd party liability insurance, which is/was included in WA rego fees). Then you may want to pay insurance on top of that.

To offset that in fuel savings, you'd need to be driving a Prius, but obviously you won't get change out of about $45,000..

You may want to redo your numbers.

The average car in AU does 15000km/year. Maybe more if you have a long daily commute.

A car like a 1.3L toyota echo uses ~6L/100km (city ~4.5 highway). Redbook lists the 1999 as low as $3700 (private sale).

So 15k km at 6L/100 gives an annual fuel consumption of 900L

Now I imagine a defender with all the fruit and mud tyres would be on around 12L/100 in the city. So 1800L.

If you factor in the higher cpl of diesel vs petrol, you are saving $1000-1200 per year in the above scenario. Which should easily cover rego and insurance - but possibly not servicing and depreciation - however that is offset by the fact that you are servicing the 110 less frequently, and the more expensive tyres and diffs are getting less wear and tear.

[midal]

I'll accept the admonition. :( I was on my 3rd large red wine after work.

S'oright Ron......it was late at night (here) and I was just funnin':p

Cheers
Mick

[hoadie72]

You may want to redo your numbers.

The average car in AU does 15000km/year. Maybe more if you have a long daily commute.

A car like a 1.3L toyota echo uses ~6L/100km (city ~4.5 highway). Redbook lists the 1999 as low as $3700 (private sale).

So 15k km at 6L/100 gives an annual fuel consumption of 900L

Now I imagine a defender with all the fruit and mud tyres would be on around 12L/100 in the city. So 1800L.

If you factor in the higher cpl of diesel vs petrol, you are saving $1000-1200 per year in the above scenario. Which should easily cover rego and insurance - but possibly not servicing and depreciation - however that is offset by the fact that you are servicing the 110 less frequently, and the more expensive tyres and diffs are getting less wear and tear.
As per my and other person's previous posts, it costs around $2k a year to keep a car on the road here, so the fuel savings wouldn't offset the rego and insurance costs.

[p38arover]

S'oright Ron......it was late at night (here) and I was just funnin':p

Cheers
Mick

Heck, I ain't upset, Matt. I have to leave the occasional error for youse blokes to find! :angel:

:D:D

[midal]

Heck, I ain't upset, Matt. I have to leave the occasional error for youse blokes to find! :angel:

:D:D

You're doing well......I'd suggest a change of refreshment perhaps:lol2::lol2::lol2:

Cheers
Mick

[100I]

There is simply no getting around the fact the land rover engines are small and underpowered, no matter how much you tweak them. If you re pulling loads or seeking highway speeds then there is no replacement for displacement. However, the 3l patrol is not ideal either. I would be searching for a 4.2 and giving it the treatment.

[isuzurover]

As per my and other person's previous posts, it costs around $2k a year to keep a car on the road here, so the fuel savings wouldn't offset the rego and insurance costs.

WTF??? Can you do maths? You said it cost $700 for rego and CTP??? No way it can cost $1300/yr for comprehensive on an echo (or similar).

[aloa9061]

So, I've decided to put the defender up for sale and see how it goes. If I am able to get close to what I want for it I will sell it and buy this patrol. If not I will do the power upgrade and put in an internal rollbar.

So I've been compiling my accesory and mod list. I would be tempted to sell the car as an entire package due to the patrol having a number of accesories already installed.

[seano87]

Seriously, you clearly love the car and have put a hell of a lot of effort into making it suit your needs and purposes.




The sad reality when selling a car is that all the modifications count for little, if anything, in terms of adding value to a vehicle, yes, it's probably good value for money in your eyes, but to most other people its a car now over 10 years old, that cost $40,000 new, and for your asking price you can easily get a low km, well maintained 2003 Defender.

Most other 1998/9 Defenders are advertised mid-teens.

So, what do I think? I think you have got one hell of an awesome truck, that is only missing a roll cage and power upgrade. You'll hate yourself if you sell it.

Seano

[hoadie72]

WTF??? Can you do maths? You said it cost $700 for rego and CTP??? No way it can cost $1300/yr for comprehensive on an echo (or similar).
You'd be surprised. I pay about $1200 for a '98 Futura and I just ran through NRMAs quote generator for a '99 Echo and it came to $976. Sydney's expensive.

[MacFamily]

:rulez::) Pics It sounds like one tuff defender but would have to agree with Seano.But at the end of the day its up to you, just have to get the wright person who is willing to buy it at that price.But I would say $20k would be a relistic price considering the amount of extra gear and would be ashame to start parting it out to get what you want.

But I think if you did a power upgrade and roll cage it would have to be near complete there would not be anything else to add.I wish my old girl had half the stuff yours has :D

[PAT303]

There is simply no getting around the fact the land rover engines are small and underpowered, no matter how much you tweak them. If you re pulling loads or seeking highway speeds then there is no replacement for displacement. However, the 3l patrol is not ideal either. I would be searching for a 4.2 and giving it the treatment.

So you drive all these powerfull 4WD's then?,my TDI goes better than any 1HZ troopy I know,I had two myself at work,same for the Patrol NA 4.2 and they are only just behind the TD model,only the 1-FTE will see it off.The Td5 is more than equal to any of them and will cost less to run doing it. Pat

[aloa9061]

I know what you guys mean regarding the price.

I would be happy around the 20k mark but would be pulling things like the inverter fridge etc off at that price.

I'm lucky in that i do not have to sell but have the option of putting it out there for 3 months and trying my luck. I'm not going to firesale this and I'm happy to wait for the right person.

I've seen plain jane 97 ish defenders for around the 17k mark. This has a heap of extra's and low kms.

Sydney is expensive with insurance. The 1.8 paj is still around 1k a year.

I'm going to drive the patrol for a couple of days and then price up a rollcage and power upgrade.

The missus is also going to have a few more cracks at driving the defender around town to see how she feels.

Now I just need to get off my ass and put in the markets and on carsales.

[cewilson]

Hey mate,
one of the best things I ever did to my Defender was installing the cargo barrier and bullbar. The only other thing I could do is to install a roll cage - but if it was only for protection of the occupants then it would only be from the cargo barrier forward.

Wider wheels would certainly help the stability, but then so would removable sway bars (or spacers).

As an aside (or from left field), is it worth getting a small motorbike for work purposes?

Best of luck either way, as IMHO they are both very capable vehicles. It'd just be a shame to not see you around here as much.

Cheers
Chris

[aloa9061]

Yeah Chris,

Motorbike would be cheap but doesn't qualify for the safety aspect i'm looking for?

In terms of stability this defender is pretty up there.

Wheels are offset by at least an inch in addition to the 4 inches wider than std tires in total.

Custom shocks help with the cornering.

A 4.2 TD patrol would be my ideal vehicle but they are another 10k on top of the 3ltr. The 3l is generally cheaper thanks to bad press over the engine.

[cinders]

All i'm gunna say is landy has the crappest turning circle but you get very good at reversing into car parks. Also it is easier to see over the bonnet when 4wding or just generally driving around town! The nissan has a massive bonnet looming out in front of you and makes life quite interesting when you're going up a steep track plus I reckon it's harder too judge the distance in front of you but I've only had limited experience in driving these. plus have you seen the chassis on nissans?

[isuzurover]

You'd be surprised. I pay about $1200 for a '98 Futura and I just ran through NRMAs quote generator for a '99 Echo and it came to $976. Sydney's expensive.

Ouch - indeed - more expensive than I thought! Though with a <$4k car you could probably afford to just have TPP or TPP+F+T (Don't think NRMA do that but Suncorp and others do).

[BigJon]

. The 3l is generally cheaper thanks to bad press over the engine.

I think the 3 litre is cheaper because the engine has a history of dropping it guts all over the ground. Not much to do with bad press...

[100I]

So you drive all these powerfull 4WD's then?,my TDI goes better than any 1HZ troopy I know,I had two myself at work,same for the Patrol NA 4.2 and they are only just behind the TD model,only the 1-FTE will see it off.The Td5 is more than equal to any of them and will cost less to run doing it. Pat


Yes.
And I am not referring to NA 4.2 engines of either variety. I speak of the turbo version of either brand, and given the same treatment as people sink into LR engines the outputs are obviously worlds apart.

[aloa9061]

I def agree.

A mate had a naturally aspirated 4.2 GQ and then put an aftermarket turbo on it and it leaves my defender for dead. Granted it uses a lot more fuel but this isn't suprising!

The chipped 3 ltr patrol is the same, but uses minimal additional fuel.

And Bad press would include engines crapping themself!

In addition I will need baby restraints in the future and also factoring this cost into the equation.

[c.h.i.e.f]

cinders is dead right with the turning circle statement and has the best solution for it (reversing) i can reverse my deefer into spots were even small cars take ages to get in :D even hav a small crowd watching sometimes probably thinking "he has to be kidding if he thinks he can fit in there" lol:eek:

stevo68's statement was also correct and i also found the part about the discussion in his house amusing :D

but as for the deefer or patrol i would stay with the deefer
points:
1.the deefer might not hav as much power but when it is tuned up it will be much much better and still wont hav a weak engine;)
2.comfort is pretty good in the deefer compared to other brands even though it is crude
3.deefer will probably always use less fuel:angel:
4.deefers are more versatile with adding accessories hence rollcage etc etc
5.deefers look better :D
6.the 3ltr demolishes heads and that has been said by EVERY person i know that has one! (a fella from work has a 3ltr and a 4.2td and he is wanting to sell the 3ltr because funily enough he has spent thousands on getting a new head for it)
7.doesnt help my suggestions but i do hav a soft spot for patrols for some unknown reason :wasntme:
8.i know of a 4.2 aftermarket turboed on a property that is still ticking over everyday and the odometer was stoped years ago but it has done well over 1.2million on the same engine and is still going hard (a little bit of smoke coming out and a bit of a valve noise) but on that note isuzu's hav been known for the same attributes and probably some deefers as well
9.in the end it comes down to your gut feeling on what u think is best


cheers

[aloa9061]

The car is now in markets

[Redback]

140K 3.0l Patrol, most don't go past 160K, not a good choice, crappy driving position if your short too.

Baz.

[aloa9061]

that engine still worries me,

On the other note i'm 6'2

[Redback]

that engine still worries me,

On the other note i'm 6'2

And the missus is:confused:

[PAT303]

140K 3.0l Patrol, most don't go past 160K, not a good choice, crappy driving position if your short too.

Baz.

There is no way I would buy a ZD30 with 140k on the clock,it is in the ''zone''. Pat

[rovercare]

There is no way I would buy a ZD30 with 140k on the clock,it is in the ''zone''. Pat

In the zone is anywhere between 0 and blown up:D

One of the blokes I went across the Simpson with had done 275,000 on his ZD30, replaced it with a 6.5chev.........yea, he's not over the moon about it:o

I think if you fit a pyro or boost gauge and watch it, there is no reason you shouldn;t be able to get good kilometres from one

[aloa9061]

The missus is 6 foot so she won't have any dramas!

looking more and more like I will keep the defender as there don't seem to be many people keen at paying around 20k.

[stevo68]

The missus is 6 foot so she won't have any dramas!

looking more and more like I will keep the defender as there don't seem to be many people keen at paying around 20k.

Private Price Guide 9,300 - $11,700
$* Trade In Price Guide$5,600 - $8,000* Average Km180,000 - 300,000
I think the above is a pretty good reason as to why no one wants to pay over $20k....or as advertised $23k, mods or not. Also if you look at the original post it isn't exactly a ringing endorsement for a non fender owner to want to buy one. I always make light of fender owners :p selling their beloved as "dreamers" as they are always priced way above the threshold. Us Disco owners are always more realistic :D.

Oh and as Pete stated....the advertisement for it isn't much chop. For starters it looks like it is being recovered...again not a ringing endorsement......plus people want to see heaps of pics. A bird in the hand is worth more than 2 in the bush......if you want to sell it...be realistic. Get more pics up......give it a scrub and take some fresh pics....and drop the price.

As has been stated countless times......modifications do nothing in general to increase the value of the vehicle as that value is not perceived outside of the individuals own thinking...i.e an insurer will value it at current market value. So if we have a vehicle with CMV of...lets be nice....$12k and we want a purchase price of $23k.....and we want to insure it......speaks for itself.

Or scrap the whole thing and be happy with your beloved....hell would have to freeze over before SWMBO had a say about Smokey ;),

Regards

Stevo

[aloa9061]

I agree Stevo,

Add is a not the best as I've not had time to do a good scrub and get some decent photos.

Will be doing that in a couple of weeks.

Redbook is what dealers will offer you not what it actually sells for. if you look on carsales etc you can get def 110 utes for around the 17k (advertised price) with well of 200k on the clock.

This has 163k and is a 110 with a lot of extras, not a large jump in price i don't think.

You would be exceptionly lucky ot get a 110 with under 200k for around 12k!

Insurance value on this is 25 agreed.

Looking into the rollbar option at the moment. First quote looks around the 1.5-2k.

[scrambler]

The local Defenders (SEQ) in dealers are getting advertised below redbook therefore selling well below redbook prices (or Glass's, take your pick). The 50% tax rebate and new 110's at/below $50,000 (read $25,000 real cost to a small business owner) has cut the value of Defenders down to the quoted prices. The cars you see advertised are NOT SELLING - that's why they are still advertised ...

On the other hand, the value of yours is in the mods - to someone who wants them.

[aloa9061]

photos now updated to better ones!!!

Agreed re sale price, the entire value in my car over other defenders is the inclusions so i will never be able to sell it to soemone who just wants a defender to drive in the city and never take offroad. It will only be able to be sold to someone who will value the mods.

[dobbo]

It's a lot of car for the price, but renovations to the house are taking priority this year, put them off for the last 2yrs.

[dobbo]

Looking into the rollbar option at the moment. First quote looks around the 1.5-2k.


Is that steel or chrome molly?

Sounds a bit cheap, is it a basic 2 point bar?