Possible to weld (or otherwise put) hi lift points around a D1 without bar work?

@ Ben! .. if you have a compressor, seriously have a look for a good exhaust jack. Kit should come complete, and if you don't already have a compressor .. would be handy to have too.

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Originally Posted by trout1105

The Government doesn't have to legislate as car manufacturers No longer supply them with their cars and very few people still actually use them anymore ....

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Cost!

it's far more profitable for manufacturers to supply a $2 scissor type jack, than a $20 hi lift type jack.

Having used both types .. personally I prefer the exhaust jack! [biggrin]
That's why I bought one [thumbsupbig] .. much easier than all other jack types.
Other than the fact that it's useless on my 300 Tdi via the exhaust, as the flexijoint just puffs the exhaust gasses out that way, rather than into the bag! ... I use my compressor, and have one of those cool, albeit lethal smokes, while it does it's thing.

Seriously tho, choice between bottle or hi lift: I'd choose a hi lift type over a bottle jack any day!

On a Caddy, I defy anyone to get under there to inset a bottle jack considering it's ground clearance and long rear end! .. and as for my P6's, I can't fathom where you'd safely place a bottle jack to lift one of it's wheels to change a tyre.
Both of those lift jacks were safely used many numbers of times without any deathly consequences to myself(or my dad) back in the day.

As for the comments re fixing/changing tyres with jack alone: not every motorist stores vehicle support devices in their cars, and shouldn't be expected too either.
Vehicles only come with the most rudimentary of tools to change a tyre.
You'll get a bottle or scissor jack, a wheel chock and the tools needed to remove wheel nuts, wheel and operate the jack. You don't get car stands or any other support devices of any type to support the car whilst you change a tyre.

I remember the one time I really needed my exhaust jack to work, when I got hung up in some deep muddy ruts on the Birdsville Track. The jack bag just kept slipping out the side like a big soap bubble, no use at all. Fortunately traffic was heavy that day and after an hour or so a friendly 4WD driver came by and pulled me out.

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Originally Posted by Young Angus

You have to admit they do look pretty cool haha they can kill you a lot faster than the smokes though!

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the camel man looked pretty cool too. i wonder where he is now? darn was looking for a tombstone smiley but there isn't one here.

certainly drove cool cars [bigrolf]

Attachment 136043

Haha sounds like there are serious pros and serious (sometimes dangerous) cons to all jacks. How much space does a good exhaust jack take up when stored away? They sound like the ticket but the disco boot doesn't exactly lend itself to storing lots of things haha

I've got a compressor and a bloody nice one too...Bob Jane had a deal not long ago where if you bought four BFG tyres you got a free ARB compressor. My work ute needed tyres and I needed a compressor so that one happened to work out very nicely.

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Originally Posted by Young Angus

H.... How much space does a good exhaust jack take up when stored away? They sound like the ticket but the disco boot doesn't exactly lend itself to storing lots of things haha

....

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BIG!

While I keep mine there most of the time, it is soft and large, so quite easy to mangle into a space somewhere, whilst you're stuffing items up to the roof! [biggrin]
Alternatively tho, as it's so light compared to a hi lift, strap it down onto the roof rack.
Better an exhaust jack up there than a 20-30kg hi lift!(as well as any other gear).

Actual size is(I'm measuring now for 'ya ... ) 600x400mm(about 100mm thickness) .. but not rectangular, it's semi circular on the 400mm side. Like a medium sized duffle bag, and a fair bit of air inside tho .. so squashable to fit into some strangely shaped spot to stop other things rattling about.

So far my biggest faux pas with it has been that I once used it to rotate the tyres one day in my drive, and lifted each side(both wheels) at a time. Had the handbrake on of course .. which is totally useless unless you lock the diff lock. [bigwhistle]
Massive DOH! moment for me.
But a semi safety side effect of doing it this way was that as the car got light on the one side, it gently .. ie. very gently rolled a mm or two whilst all wheels were still on the ground. [thumbsupbig]
That is, it gave me plenty of warning as to my brain faded moment of forgetting about the handbrake effect, so I stopped the compressor filling it, let some air out, chocked the other side's wheels and then continued on again once I reset the location of the air bag.

The kit I got came with protective fabric for top and bottom of bag, a few puncture patches just in case of a mishap, and hoses for exhaust and a compressor(schrader valve) fitting ..

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Originally Posted by AK83

BIG!

While I keep mine there most of the time, it is soft and large, so quite easy to mangle into a space somewhere, whilst you're stuffing items up to the roof! [biggrin]
Alternatively tho, as it's so light compared to a hi lift, strap it down onto the roof rack.
Better an exhaust jack up there than a 20-30kg hi lift!(as well as any other gear).

Actual size is(I'm measuring now for 'ya ... ) 600x400mm(about 100mm thickness) .. but not rectangular, it's semi circular on the 400mm side. Like a medium sized duffle bag, and a fair bit of air inside tho .. so squashable to fit into some strangely shaped spot to stop other things rattling about.

So far my biggest faux pas with it has been that I once used it to rotate the tyres one day in my drive, and lifted each side(both wheels) at a time. Had the handbrake on of course .. which is totally useless unless you lock the diff lock. [bigwhistle]
Massive DOH! moment for me.
But a semi safety side effect of doing it this way was that as the car got light on the one side, it gently .. ie. very gently rolled a mm or two whilst all wheels were still on the ground. [thumbsupbig]
That is, it gave me plenty of warning as to my brain faded moment of forgetting about the handbrake effect, so I stopped the compressor filling it, let some air out, chocked the other side's wheels and then continued on again once I reset the location of the air bag.

The kit I got came with protective fabric for top and bottom of bag, a few puncture patches just in case of a mishap, and hoses for exhaust and a compressor(schrader valve) fitting ..

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Hey thanks Arthur! [emoji106]

Haha I guess all jacks can be dangerous ;) Better in your driveway than out on a track when you're bogged and stressed though.

I got two sidewall punctures in the space of one week on the work Hilux a few weeks ago, brand new Goodyear All Terrains and both unrepairable...Luckily I was close to tyre shops each time, turns out a trolley jack is easier than all of the above and it helps to have a rattle gun too [emoji16]

I was taught that a high lift jack is a recovery tool nothing more. I was shown to use it's inherent instability, like jacking up the front bar and pushing the truck over to get out of ruts when beached or using a cradle to lift a tyre to get something under the tyre for more traction or clearance. It can also be used as a basic hand winch if you don't have better options. The thought of using it to change a tyre sends shivers up my spine.

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Originally Posted by chillman

I was taught that a high lift jack is a recovery tool nothing more. I was shown to use it's inherent instability, like jacking up the front bar and pushing the truck over to get out of ruts when beached or using a cradle to lift a tyre to get something under the tyre for more traction or clearance. It can also be used as a basic hand winch if you don't have better options. The thought of using it to change a tyre sends shivers up my spine.

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I think that's probably it in a nutshell...that's all I'll ever be using one for...and that's if the winch and the ramps don't work without it first!

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Originally Posted by chillman

.... I was shown to use it's inherent instability, like jacking up the front bar and pushing the truck over to get out of ruts ....

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That's just one of the methods a hi lift can be used.

I really don't think people realise all the many ways that a hi lift CAN be used.
When a hi lift is mentioned, they close their minds to the most common way it's used.

When used in a proper receiver(as Ben originally asked!) .. the hi lift jack is far more stable than a bottle jack placed under an axle.
Laws of physics can be argued with on that topic.

Bottle jack, or any spindly tower placed on an axle is place closer to the centre of gravity, and in doing so is inherently less stable.
Think about it in the sense that if you jack up a car with a trolley jack from the diff, the car will be unstable till 2 axle stands are also placed under the axles for proper lateral support.
Bottle jack is no different in it's stability. You jack the vehicle from within it's general mass.

With a proper hi lift setup .. as in this pic:

HI LIFT JACK IMAGE:

Having the jack take the the weight of the car outside it's mass, makes that leg more stable.

The old P6 Rovers used the same system, where the 'hi lift' jacks rod foot was inserted into a round slot in the sill.
There was no way once that corner was lifted with the jack that the car would budge .. no matter how muck leverage was used to move the car, and this is from experience having tried to use that old 'inherently unstable' hi lift jack theory to unbog one of my P6's.
In the end having used a large log as leverage under the old Rover, I successfully snapped the jack, and the car didn't budge(had to walk for miles to get assistance too!).

When a hi lift is used loosely, yes! .. they are unstable, and that method is used for recovery. But when used properly, hi lift jack is inherently far more stable than a bottle jack .. no question about it!

The problem with a hi lift is that it weighs a ton(comparatively) takes up a lot of room, is usually mounted in a location that places undue stress on the parts that it's mounted on, or adds unnecessary dead weight were it's best no added.. and they rattle like mad over rough roads.

Very low on the list of things my brothers D2 needs is a set of proper hi lift jacking points(ie. the receivers) if I ever get around to it one of these days ..
One day after it's done, I'll try to do a comparison of how much more stable a hi lift can be compared to a bottle jack under an axle.

But saying all that, the exhaust bag is still #1! [thumbsupbig]