Harmonic Balancer pulley

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Originally Posted by Bohica

They move back and forth a bit when they need replacing. Look at post #22, follow the link to youtube

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RE: Movement in harmonic pulley.
Happy to replace, and I hope it is just the harmonic balancer making all the movement, but the extent of movement had me suprised.
With the pulley still very much attached to the crank it appears that pulley and crank bolt move backwards and forwards together, which sort of suggests the crank is moving, which I figure is absurd as vehicle has recently covered 5,000 k's towing and was running very well and nil issues, before being parked up to start sorting warped manifold, viscous bearing, radiator and a host of inherited maintenance issues which all landed at once.
If the crank had that much movement (5mm of travel) there wouldn't have been any oil pressure.
So happy to go with harmonic balancer as culprit, and hope that sorts it, as the alternatives are too scary to think about.

If its not the pulley its the thrust washers on the crankshaft.
Not necessarily fatal.
Is the car a manual? If so the constant pushing on the flywheel when you change gears could cause it at high Kms.

I had a RRC in Saudi which had quite a bit of play but went Ok.

AFAIR the problem with worn Thrust washers is that oversize ones come only with oversize bearings.

Regards PhilipA

I cannnot think that the thrust bearings/washers have gone. My manual TD5 has 345k It seems not doable. I'll check with a mechical engineer mate of mine.

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Originally Posted by Bohica

I cannnot think that the thrust bearings/washers have gone. My manual TD5 has 345k It seems not doable. I'll check with a mechical engineer mate of mine.

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That was what shocked me, that I could have so much movement (4-5mm travel), which would make it the worst thrust washer collapse I've ever come across. (Can't be possible, I hope.)
It is an Auto done 220k, and I would expect it would have plenty of life left in the thrust washers.
That much travel would have the oil running around the sides of the bearings.
Have a new pulley coming to do a changeover, and I also have another TD5 done 220k, so will undo fan and belt and see how much travel pulley has, just for a comparison.

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Originally Posted by vbrab

That was what shocked me, that I could have so much movement (4-5mm travel), which would make it the worst thrust washer collapse I've ever come across. (Can't be possible, I hope.)
It is an Auto done 220k, and I would expect it would have plenty of life left in the thrust washers.
That much travel would have the oil running around the sides of the bearings.
Have a new pulley coming to do a changeover, and I also have another TD5 done 220k, so will undo fan and belt and see how much travel pulley has, just for a comparison.

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Mech Eng mate also thinks the crank shaft doesn't mover like that. Maybe it's a slight optical illusion.

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Originally Posted by Bohica

Mech Eng mate also thinks the crank shaft doesn't mover like that. Maybe it's a slight optical illusion.

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I am happy to stay with the strong belief that it cannot be possible that the crank has suddenly developed so much movement, and banking on it being something to do with the pulley.

Have removed the harmonic balancer off crank and have found that the pulley is very good, nil issues there.
BUT. the crank still can be made to move backwards and forwards about 5mm, like the worst case of end float imaginable.
Ordinarily you would think that with that amount of movement, that crank failure immanent

Prior to being parked up to sort an exhaust manifold and fan bearing, the vehicle had covered about 8000ks of long runs and had nil issues or noises from engine, nil oil lights etc. Running fine.
Car also had oil change while having other repairs done, and oil pressure light went off immediatly as per normal.
I would expect oil pressure lights if crank was losing pressure around worn end float shims.

I figure that the ribbed serpentine belt might be keeping the crank aligned with other front pulleys, which may be why it hasn't signalled a problem.
Has anybody heard of any TD5's having that sort of movement in crank?

Have checked other TD5 auto with same K's, nil crank movement.
PS. Re-installed original pulley, fitted belt back on, left off viscous fan and fired it up.
No oil lights on, nil odd engine noises, runs smooth, ran up to 3000rpm, just seems to run like it usually does.
Soon as regional quarrantine is off, reckon I'll take it to the city and get sump off and crank dropped to check over. 5mm movement cannot be a good sign.

Keep us up to date on this. It does sound odd.

I would think that the pistons and rods and maybe the timing chain will keep the crank in an approximate position while running.

The main effect would maybe on oil pressure although if the bearing shells are Ok then I see no real effect.

On a manual it causes inconsistent clutch takeup but on an auto maybe not much as there is nothrust on the crank..
If you can live with the knowledge just live with it.
Regards PhilipA

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Originally Posted by PhilipA

I would think that the pistons and rods and maybe the timing chain will keep the crank in an approximate position while running.

The main effect would maybe on oil pressure although if the bearing shells are Ok then I see no real effect.

On a manual it causes inconsistent clutch takeup but on an auto maybe not much as there is nothrust on the crank..
If you can live with the knowledge just live with it.
Regards PhilipA

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Given the current restrictions on moving about (so I cannot head to serious workshop to investigate further), then I shall have to live with it.
I'm just amazed at how much movement/travel there is with the crank and still no oil lights or scary bottom end noises.